I'm not understanding why the pilot got the "Pilot Deviation" - 8168 was told to make a turn to 180 and they did with no altitude correction and the aircraft taking off 2627 was told to hold just below at 3000' while the other was ~3700'. What am I missing? Only after they crossed 8168 is told to go to 6000'.
I initially thought this was a repost. I understood how 100 was entered and flown 010 in the other incident - this one is going to need more explanation. Great early recognition and correction by local control kept this from getting ugly.
@@VASAviation At 0:13 ATC gives right turn 180 so the real issue is that 8168 didn't perform right 180 fast enough. Still, ATC didn't seem too concerned about the proximity when they met. I think this is ATC instruction issue and not a near-miss.
Cool as a cucumber those controllers in this event. Kept everyone separated, planned the resolution, got everyone going again, never changed pitch, cadence, or intensity.
Good to see she didn't get distracted into a "8168 what are you doing" or "I didn't tell you to do that" discussion that we've sometimes heard on the air.
The recording needs to be included in future ATC training as an example of how to handle conflicting traffic due to a mistake. The calm, collected, and perfected executed resolution cannot be commended enough.
The FAA sends safety reports to controllers nationwide that include incidents like this. The safety report includes a description of the event and a link to the FALCON recording of the event (FALCON is the STARS radar replay). It appears someone sent that FALCON replay to this TH-cam account 🤔
I don't think the clickbait title was even warranted, they asked the pilot to fly heading 180 on departure... the pilot didn't right away, so they changed the plan and the pilot did comply, just a little slowly, this kind of shit happens all day every day.
If I just heard this on frequency I'd have no idea there were multiple traffic conflicts due to a mistake. Those controllers handled that issue with precise, calculated instructions that seemed like a regular Tuesday for them.
I was confused and waiting for the incident. Only when I heard the instruction to turn to 180, I understood that the incident just happened. The communication was so balanced and professional, I wasn't triggered by the voice of the ATC.
Me too. These videos are great and the homemade radar probably consumes a lot of time during editing. Inserting a shot of the actual radar for comparison was my favorite part!
Those controllers sounded like this happens on literally every takeoff lol. that's the calmest, coolest collected ive ever heard. even while giving a phone number the *4th* take off after is already rolling. damn.
@@pistonburner6448 Both pilots are responsible for the mistake. As the pilot monitoring she is responsible to make sure the plane is being flown in the correct direction. Why else is she there?
@@pistonburner6448 Advise you look up CRM. Both pilots are responsible for their actions unless the CO is clearly acting as PIC which certainly wouldn't be the same in a routine takeoff lol..
Listen AND execute I'd say ...seems like a lot of these incidents follow after repeating instruction correctly ...then doing differently. Great job ATC!
I've NEVER heard ORD ground tear people apart. They'll make fun of stupidity all day long, but it takes a LOT to get them mad enough to take it out on frequency. Most of the time, it's done with humor and the pilots who screwed it up are so embarrassed they know they'll never do it again. Punishment served. ORD controllers are the best in the country, no, the world!
@@JasonPhipps It is a nice but tough and fair midwesterner attitude of expecting perfection but realizing humanity. We are nice, but if you cannot tell your ass from a hole in the ground we are going to point that out to everyone.
I'm not a pilot, but in my opinion it's a bit of common sense - you don't tear apart a pilot who's departing. You want them to make it to their destination safely instead of causing them stress while they're still in the air.
I think the biggest problem here isn't the failure to follow instructions but the failure to think. They should have been aware that there were aircraft taking off from the parallel runway on their left and, therefore, that under no circumstances should they be turning left and crossing in front of them. Whatever mistakes they may have made with the clearance or configuring the autopilot, they should have had front and centre in their minds the fact that there were planes to the left of them that they need to maintain separation from.
I agree that having the big picture is important to maintaining situational awareness, but to your "under no circumstances" point: it is not uncommon in ORD to have a turn on departure that crosses the entire airport complex. Although in my experience I've only done this taking off to the West.
United 8168 cleared for takeoff, right turn heading 180. Correct acknowledgement of the clearance on the read-back. Then an immediate left turn to N in front of other departing traffic at one of the busiest beehives on Earth. I'm at a loss to understand or explain other than they switched to autopilot immediately off the runway and had the heading set incorrectly, or had the fms programmed to go direct to their initial DP fix on AP engagement and that was possibly on the north side of the airport so the computer decided to go the shortest way. If either of those is true the pilot flying should have disengaged AP and started hand flying before the plane had turned more than a few degrees the wrong way. No excuse for this unless there was actually a technical problem with the airplane or avionics, which is also troubling. If this is the new norm it really feels like we're about to see a disastrous incident somewhere any day now. Good job by ATC to keep everyone safe and keep the traffic moving.
Most airlines actually forbid pilots from having their autopilot active during takeoff and landing for this very reason. It's follow the flight director and hand fly to the company determined altitude before switching on the AP.
Also puzzling that they must realize they're turning into the airfield side, no? Maybe they planned a 09 RWY and got switched last minute and then just had "left turn" in mind still?
@@tomhejda6450 this is a good theory, Chicago is almost always west flow. It could’ve just been assumed they were supposed to be turning left since we normally depart west and then turn left to go south. Still a big oopsie.
For some reason I've only noticed that with United Airbuses. That's it. Weird how it comes from the same airline that brought us Channel 9. I like it though.
It’s like these pilots are playing Russian Roulette… there’s a mindlessness to it that I just simply can’t understand coming from professional pilots flying commercial aircraft. It’s a good thing that the other pilots so far, have had the skills and situational awareness to fly out of these conflicts, but these are very basic mistakes that just should not be happening. So far these dumb pilots have been very lucky that other people have been on the ball to save their sorry arses, but every time it happens, that’s just one more hole in the Swiss Cheese falling into alignment. I’d be scared to fly commercial in the US atm… maybe just scared to fly period. It’s like c’mon guys, what are you doing?
By this point I'm certain it's just a new trend that's supposed to scare us europeans. Jokes aside, the amount of conflicts creates by having no situational awareness, especially of surrounding traffic, lately is crazy.
@@virginiaviola5097 - this is my view on American aviation. It’s great and safe because everyone is well trained and professional. However, when there is a hiccup things get dangerous really quickly.
@@virginiaviola5097 how about you try and be a bit more understanding, maybe educate yourself on how incidents happen rather than taking to the internet in a fit of nearly incoherent rage.
Ugh I can't even joke about this. It seriously feels like a disaster is waiting to happen. At least the controllers were on top of this and hit it out of the park.
It is never funny when a pilot is given a number, but I do find it a bit amusing when a newer pilot receives their first pilot deviation, versus a high hour pilot. New pilots typically sound contrite and a bit defeated if not embarrassed, but vet pilots are all yea I'm flying a plane right now so no you'll have to wait on the pen 😂. Kudos to ATC for keeping it cool and everyone safe 😊
I wonder if they activated the auto pilot as soon as they where in the air and the heading was set incorrectly which would cause the aircraft to turn north. I’ve seen that happen a few times. Some pilots are way too eager to click the AP on.
I remember speaking to a former 747 Captain who retired about 7 years ago. He was concerned about how they train system monitors and not pilots nowadays.
@@callumwinkler1943 I think that it’s a mix of all that. Complacency, training, ego, etc. I’ve meet pilots who have that mindset they are the best and can’t screw up, and that’s so dangerous.
@@callumwinkler1943 To be fair, in the US the system monitors are flying small Cessna's and Pipers for their first 1,500 hours. There's years of muscle memory built in, and pilots who train in busy airspace like NY or LA will be veterans at this stuff by the time they get into an airplane with a 3 axis autopilot. What we see here is just a good old brain fart. 99.9% of the time the pilot monitoring catches it before the pilot flying deviates, but sometimes the pilot monitoring is stuck dealing with some other task and the mistake wins. As we get older the mistakes happen more and more often. I'm 7 years in and see it all the time. I'm not sure there's a way to fix these kinds of absent-minded errors, save for replacing us all with computers.
i’m betting they set heading mode on the FD while holding short or maybe even turning on to the rwy, which would have commanded a left turn since that was the closer heading before being lined up with the rwy. engage AP then commands the turn, if it hadn’t been stopped probably would have resulted in a left 270° turn from RH (010) to 180. a very subtle behavior of engaging heading mode - always set heading mode after being lined up!
here’s a video that describes the exact problem albeit on the g1000 (much less advanced compared to the airline FMS). but same idea. don’t engage HDG on the ground! th-cam.com/video/K-8vIa688zw/w-d-xo.htmlm42s
No it isn't. Just TH-cam is full of people scouring ATC recordings for incidents, so you actually hear about them. No more or less than 5 years ago (or 20), I'm betting.
You're believing the hype. Thousands and thousands of flights happen every single day without incident. One or two pilot deviations per month is a relatively low number. And the fact that they're not leading to accidents demonstrates the effectiveness of the safety measures built into commercial aviation. What should impress people isn't that these "incidents" are happening, but that they don't happen more often and that they haven't been leading to accidents.
There is a difference between dangerous (I don’t think warning systems went off) and not following the instructions due to pilot error. In this case all the accident prevention systems worked.
The dangerous bit is how they turned left toward another departure path from either 9C or 9R. ATC had to make sure departures from those runways didn't climb their initial clearance altitude to keep a midair collision from occurring.
Ugh this is getting really scary. Glad the controllers were on top of it though. Also is Channel 9 still a thing with United? I wonder if the passengers onboard were listening to their own flight deviation 😬
Controllers handled it well. But notice how operations were affected. She had aircraft lined up and taking off one after the other, but handling the situations put the take offs on hold. (ORD has six runways heading east - 9L 9C 9R 10L 10C 10R, each on its own frequency) (should be six runways)
Probably had one thing programmed in the FMC and then received the 180 heading they weren't expecting. Read it back correctly but didn't process it and followed the FD
@@VASAviation not at all atypical to go the opposite heading of your destination on takeoff. I can’t count how many times I’ve taken off north and turned east going to a westbound destination out of the east coast. 270° turns off takeoff are nothing notable in my experience.
@@qwerty112311 Agree with that but I can't see a departure procedure from ORD that makes a loop to go south. Maybe they had KORD or the runway as first waypoint and the aircraft tried to go back to overfly it?
@@VASAviation Due to the density of air traffic in the San Francisco Bay area, the airport at San Jose has a departure procedure that has you take off to the north, make a right turn to head back south while climbing, then at a certain waypoint turn right again and fly back to a waypoint north of the airport, then finally on course...
Hi @VASAviation, I’m an ord-based mechanic who has a recent rwy incursion. It was a serious incursion that could’ve been deadly. But fortunately nothing happened. Wondering if you’re able to find atc recording and radar data. Incursion occurred on JUL62023. Thanks for all you do!
KORD Tower has seen this movie before and you can tell from their response. What happens is that clearance delivery gives the initial IFR departure clearance with a SID procedure that the flight crew programs into the computer, but then Tower amends the clearance with an assigned heading while issuing the takeoff clearance. If the flight crew is in a rush to get rolling and get off the runway at a busy airport like KORD, they can neglect to change their lateral autoflight mode from NAV to HDG (in Airbus terms), and when they engage the autopilot or follow the flight director after takeoff, they fly the initial clearance rather than the amended clearance. It's important to double-check the armed modes before takeoff, which then feeds back into all the recent issues with Tower controllers underestimating the time it will take for airliners to start rolling after takeoff clearance. There have also been multiple close calls recently with Boeing aircraft taking off with their vertical mode armed to altitude hold at 0 feet, basically commanding the autopilot to crash the jet when it's engaged. Check Yo Modes!
Many are talking about recent mistakes by ATC or pilots.The question realy is are they above the average of mistakes in the past years relative to flights that took place daily?and if so,does it have anything to do with pilots and ATCs being out of work(therefore out of practice)during the covid?
Its called human error. It happens and has been happening in atc since its inception. The pilot fucked up the controller handled it. End of story. Thats what we get paid to do...
Someone said in previous comments there were over 1800 reported in 2022 and the first 3 months of this yr are already blowing that value out of the water. Its unfortunate you can’t put links in youtube so that it would be easier to see actual source data for what some are stating.
maybe it's that the COVID messed everyone up more than people realize, and it's like we're all getting dementia all at once at whatever age. Just a (fairly unsettling) thought....
Thank you to the commenters for looking up the stats. I was wondering the same as the question poster and it’s good to see the stats. Or rather it’s bad to see them.
Nice calm resolution by ATC. Their high experience is clearly seen. Also, Listening to how fast the controllers speak and me not easily understanding their instructions is a realization of how much of a rookie I really am. I'd cry if I wasn't a real man! (*wiping tears*)
When tower cleared 8168 for takeoff they were told turn 180, but on departure 8168 actually made a turn to the north so tower had to come up again and direct them to 180.
Go to the 3:00 mark where the track is visible. They initially turned north and crossed into the path of traffic taking off from 9R, then their U-turn to go south put them into conflict with the plane that took off right after them from the same runway.
@@tmriddle8 Oh ok that makes a lot more sense, I’m new to watching these videos and how the pilots and atc talk so fast I got confused. Thank you so much!
@VASAviation and another close call comes to light during a reported FAA Emergency Summit in McLean, VA last week - Jan 12th ambulance crossed without permission in front of SW taking off at BWI.
I can’t fathom this, you hear RIGHT TURN (with runways to the north) and the plane starts turning left, why arnt you checking what’s going on or even kicking off the autopilot and correcting the turn
Nah, you’re just being alerted to it way more. In the “gold ol’ days” you’d have some dead passengers. Commercial aviation in the last decade+ in the US is literally the safest it has ever been. FAR more dangerous to drive in a car, or even to attend elementary school, than to take a flight. If you want to live in fear all the time, be scared of Citizens United and PACs, or the global water and food crises.
@Frans Ny...Listen from the beginning, the aircraft is instructed to turn right heading 180 after departure. They departed and turned left (Northbound), conflicting with other departing traffic on Rwys 09L/R). After being corrected by the controller The aircraft turned turned to the right towards a 180 heading, and was separated vertically, from a following departure off Rwy 10L.
It's almost like they chased out a bunch of experienced pilots a couple years ago and scraped through the bottom of the barrel in a feeble attempt to replace them. Great job on the part of the controllers.
I think that is dishonest as to the bigger picture. Airlines for a long time knew they had a looming retirement problem. The pilots kept getting older and instead of building up the next generation they ran many of them off with beyond pathetic pay at the regionals and burning them out with crappy treatment. Is there a huge influx of new pilots and controllers, absolutely but this wasn’t a short term created problem this was many many many years problem they made worse. The airlines own FULL responsibility for refusing to address the problem in a proactive manner.
@@lijohnyoutube101 This. We have similar problems right across the entire greater transport and logistics industry from airlines to trucking, trains, marine vessels like ferries, and in both the private sector as well as state-run organizations. Politically motivated budget cuts, corporate greed, incompetent management and toxic working cultures have all contributed to this mess, and now its gonna cost all of us in the form of increased prices and taxes and likely in lives and other collateral damage, all because one generation of leadership/management got greedy and short sighted over the last couple decades. But yes, this is not a novel problem caused by COVID. COVID was merely the proverbial last straw. This goes back at least 20 years.
You probably need a bit of experience to understand these (which I don't have). What did she do wrong? Does "right turn heading 180" mean to do an 180 while turning right? Anyone care to explain in brief?
The error was pretty significant, but tower did a great job here. From what we see in the video, all aircraft remained more than 1,000 feet apart vertically, which is the standard separation requirement. So, could have been bad, but because the tower controllers and other pilots on frequency worked quickly and effectively it was actually just as safe as normal operations.
Yeah, also winds are at 12, not 10 at the 0:17 mark. However, I'd rather have captions with non-consequential typos than having to figure out what they are saying on my own. ;-)
Yes. It means ATC is submitting it to the FAA for investigation. The pilots are given a phone number so that they can be informed of the investigation and tell their side of the story.
Took me a minute to work out what had happened.... it wasn't until I saw the runways on the background that I realised 8168 had executed a pretty hard left turn before they'd even appeared on ATC radar, despite being instructed to turn 180? I thought the freakout was the potential LOS between 2627 and 8168 and was like "... but she turned right to 180 as instructed". Ooof.
FYI, the female pilot was working the radios which means she was most likely not at the flight controls. If anything she might have selected the heading for the autopilot prior to departure.
Uhhh, wrong. Listen closer. The captain acknowledged the call to switch to departure frequency. She acknowledged the cleared for takeoff call. She was the pilot flying.
FO probably programmed the navicomputer with the wrong Mos O’Hare departure settings. I don’t blame him, busy spaceport, Chewy’s done it in the Falcon a couple times. Yea, yea, I’ll call the regional Empire authority after I dump cargo.
I am not in the aviation. I just got kicked in to this VASAviation for some reason. and I cannot understand a word the tower is transmitting. Pilots seem to be doing fairly well in communicating. How the heck do you guys do this on a daily basis?
There may be more of these deviations lately, but network news is also reporting more of them. The airports have become busier, and maybe we have more recently-retrained pilots flying now, but I don't think there's any one factor that we can point to for the increase.
Agreed, things like this are interesting to hear, but not news worthy. With the traffic volume, people are bound to mess up, but with safety, redundancies, the possibility of an accident is still very low.
Only a matter of time before what? Do you honestly think that a complex method of transportation relying heavily on human capabilities should operate without error 100% of the time? Do yourself a favor. Go sit at the end of the runways at O'Hare and watch the number of takeoffs and landings that happen every single day without any drama whatsoever. Hint: it's a lot of them. Aviation will never be completely safe, but it's impressive just how safe it is. Stop buying the media hype.
@@jaredhageman4986 Well said. As I’ve seen a few other folks that clearly work within the air transport and navigation system say in these comments sections : When you know, you know.
A bit of a clickbait title. Just a small mistake or something happening with UAL8168, but all was handled calm and cool by ATC to deconflict everything.
@@VASAviation mistakes happen every day on every flight. TEM tries to trap them. Not all mistakes get trapped and some get through like this. The outcome was very minor and had little effect on any operations. Could it have become something more? Absolutely. But there are systems and procedures in place to lessen the impact, in this case ATC providing altitude restrictions to the following departures until the subject aircraft could un-F their situation.
@@griffith211 look up Envoy ORD 2019. Both pilots were fired because the RA with AA made national news. The union got the CA’s job back, the FO was on probation and did not.
I think someone in the past has said that they explain the mess up to the pilot and get some information for ATC to make a report. Theres a video with harrison ford flying his personal plane and he makes an error, iirc the phone call was recorded also and available in the video
The phone call is actually voluntary. It's a chance for the tower to get your side of the story prior to submitting a report with the FAA. Often times, at least in General Aviation, the phone call can result in the FAA not being notified if the incident is minor and didn't involve other aircrafts.
Pilot deviation, yes. But it looks like 8168 would have been out of the way of both planes until ATC turned it back in front of 1774. Safer to let them continue their course?
Are all of these situations due to an over worked pilot & controler? I know the airlines refuse to pay and staff properly so are all these instances a result of that?
For a non pilot, this is interesting and kind of weird. I know comparisons usually don't work, but it would be like, in my car, I turn right into the guard rail or something. If I had an autopilot, then it would be possible, but if I'm driving, no way. Aren't pilots too quick on turning on the AP? (Not saying it is what happened, just thinking) Shouldn't they just... drive.....and then, when all danger is out of sight, then engange the AP and ask for a cup a coffee. Wouldn't this improve situation awarness and simple.....driving? Fly the plane? With your hands? Just asking as a total leyman. I see videos where the AP is egaged right after take off.
AP or hand flying, the result is likely to be the same here. We have guidance on our screens called a Flight Director that tells us which direction to turn, to point the nose up or down, and when to be level. In hand flying, we follow its guidance; in autoflight, the computer follows it for us. It gets its information from what route we have programmed into the airplane. That could be a planned route such as a flight plan, or it could be a heading such as 180 degrees. A simple misunderstanding or misremembered clearance could cause the pilot to input 000 degrees of heading and the flight director would command a turn in that (wrong in this case) direction to a hand flying pilot as well as the autopilot. It would take a vigilant, situationally aware crew to notice the error and correct it in time to prevent a conflict. Ideally we are vigilant whether hand flying or not. Who knows what happened here - I’m sure the reports will have more.
Is it possible the pilot flying heard "runway 10L" and got wires crossed for a moment? Their actions make sense if you look at "10 left" as an instruction to turn left, heading 10 degrees.
@@prorobo that's beside the point; I'm saying the pilot got their wires crossed, and that they *weren't thinking*. A pilot thinking about what they were hearing and saying wouldn't have gotten into this situation in the first place.
@@HexagonalMan6 again, no. We can be given “10 left” in the air since we’re already on a heading. That’s not even a remote possibility for takeoff. United doesn’t hire low time pilots.
I’m sorry but can someone point out the CLOSE CALL to me. Yeah, 8168 turned the wrong direction, but thanks to the work of the atc at no point did they get any closer than 2000 feet vertical separation. No reported tcas traffic avisories let alone a resolution advisory. Yes it created a little havoc in the pattern, but calling it a “close call” implies danger to the aircraft that simply doesn’t exist here.
Interesting, ATC realized the mistake of the pilot, but never sounded agitated and didn't put additional pressure on the offenders. Saw the problem and executed a solution immediately and then when the load decreased, they made the announcement. Other ATC gets agitated, even ask like "what are you doing, you were supposed to do this, not that" instead of fixing the issue immediately
It doesn't. There are thousands and thousands of flights every single day. Having one or two pilot mistakes every month is an incredibly low percentage. Obviously, pilots strive to be perfect and eliminate mistakes, but this hype about "near misses" happening all the time is a lot of fake news.
great job by the controllers saving the situation, but its baffling to me how US controllers mumble a heading with the takeoff clearance and thats all the pilots get...standard departure routes prevent this sort of mixup by allowing pilots to prepare and brief before even leaving the stand
To be honest, I’ve seen so many of these lately that I am not surprised. Just look at the number of flights that ATC is handling and at the speed she talks with so many United flights. If you lose focus there for just a second to attend something else you can easily make a mistake. And that is true for both pilots and ATCs. I don’t know what the solution is; but this system is definitely obsolete. We are pushing humans to a point where they simply cannot be correct close to 100% of the time, and in this case they need to be correct very close to 100%
Well this is going to piss people off but almost all of the close calls had a fill in the blank on the radio doing a correct read back but going the wrong way.
@@jaredhageman4986 He’s just another sexiest incel who thinks that women don’t belong in cockpits. Also, he’s an idiot who has no clue there’s a difference between PF and PM.
@@airgus76 I have edited this to reflect source so its not potentially spreading false information. I put this in another comment after looking it up but will paste here as well. The FAA stats page says that Runway Incursion Totals for FY 2023 as of the beginning of march are 657. That period for 2022 had 400. The ‘fiscal yr cycle’ starts in Oct. Fiscal yr 2022 ( so Oct 2021 to Sept 2022) total of 1732 reported incidents. Numbers in 2018, 2019 excursions reported were for fiscal year of 1753 and and 1832. Everything to this point is from the FAA stats area of the website. The below is conjecture/conclusions from google hits of numbers and a projected amount of flights from a business finance site. Number of flights in 2022 were still significantly significantly down from historical although increased over 2021. Number of flights in 2021 roughly 22 million. Number of flights in 2020 roughly 41 million. Approximate number expected in 2023 is 11 million based on current schedule. ( This number is suspect given its so low) So very very roughly there are 75 percent (a fourth of the historical flying volume) less flights ( based on the 11 million projected) and the numbers reported for this greatly reduced flight period is at same very huge ballpark error rate and that’s not accounting for it the trend continues to increase month over month. Those numbers should alarm anyone if the 11 million flights is accurate, if the flight amount is inaccurate its still a concerning amount in month to month increases but not alarming.
There was another close call at KSRQ last month where a plane was cleared for take off and another was given permission to land and the interval was too close. The landing plane did a go around after seeing the other plane was still on the runway.
@@mattr3889 That is what I thought as well but I didn't have the tapes to see when the clearance was issued to the landing airplane so I have no idea of the interval.
The new generation of pilots are so polite and “thankful” when given the dreaded phone number and yet are clueless of how close they came to an accident.
Very similiar incident at KORD: th-cam.com/video/Jm6uEfzae0s/w-d-xo.html
I'm not understanding why the pilot got the "Pilot Deviation" - 8168 was told to make a turn to 180 and they did with no altitude correction and the aircraft taking off 2627 was told to hold just below at 3000' while the other was ~3700'. What am I missing? Only after they crossed 8168 is told to go to 6000'.
@@atubebuff 8168 turn left after departure, not right as instructed.
What time did this happen? I wanna start investigating air crashes lol
I initially thought this was a repost. I understood how 100 was entered and flown 010 in the other incident - this one is going to need more explanation. Great early recognition and correction by local control kept this from getting ugly.
@@VASAviation At 0:13 ATC gives right turn 180 so the real issue is that 8168 didn't perform right 180 fast enough. Still, ATC didn't seem too concerned about the proximity when they met. I think this is ATC instruction issue and not a near-miss.
Cool as a cucumber those controllers in this event. Kept everyone separated, planned the resolution, got everyone going again, never changed pitch, cadence, or intensity.
Indeed. Both controllers acted professional and quick
The best
Series you can tell these controllers deal with this kind of crap all the time. That was another day for them.
Good to see she didn't get distracted into a "8168 what are you doing" or "I didn't tell you to do that" discussion that we've sometimes heard on the air.
yes, because ORD controllers are some of the best in the world
The recording needs to be included in future ATC training as an example of how to handle conflicting traffic due to a mistake. The calm, collected, and perfected executed resolution cannot be commended enough.
Every controller deals with this many times though in the course of training. No need to listen to this example.
Don’t be a douche.
The FAA sends safety reports to controllers nationwide that include incidents like this. The safety report includes a description of the event and a link to the FALCON recording of the event (FALCON is the STARS radar replay). It appears someone sent that FALCON replay to this TH-cam account 🤔
I don't think the clickbait title was even warranted, they asked the pilot to fly heading 180 on departure... the pilot didn't right away, so they changed the plan and the pilot did comply, just a little slowly, this kind of shit happens all day every day.
@@kewkabe but most don't handle it this way. They should definitely listen to this.
If I just heard this on frequency I'd have no idea there were multiple traffic conflicts due to a mistake. Those controllers handled that issue with precise, calculated instructions that seemed like a regular Tuesday for them.
Yea cause this happens every day at Ohare
I was confused and waiting for the incident. Only when I heard the instruction to turn to 180, I understood that the incident just happened. The communication was so balanced and professional, I wasn't triggered by the voice of the ATC.
The tone of voice throughout all the transmissions was so calm that you would think there wasn't a mistake at all.
i love the inclusion of the actual scope replay
Me too. These videos are great and the homemade radar probably consumes a lot of time during editing. Inserting a shot of the actual radar for comparison was my favorite part!
someone took a big risk on that, but well worth it.
@@CapStar362 yep!
Those controllers sounded like this happens on literally every takeoff lol. that's the calmest, coolest collected ive ever heard. even while giving a phone number the *4th* take off after is already rolling. damn.
Just when the pilot of the UAL 8168 thought they were getting away with it....
@@steven2145lol😂
2:43. Cracks me up. 8168 knew that little diddy was coming. She’s just like: “Go ‘head!” 😂
She knew she was gonna get some writing!!
@@withvinayak ...or she was fine with it since she wasn't the one in the cockpit who made the mistake
@@pistonburner6448 Both pilots are responsible for the mistake. As the pilot monitoring she is responsible to make sure the plane is being flown in the correct direction. Why else is she there?
@@pistonburner6448 Advise you look up CRM. Both pilots are responsible for their actions unless the CO is clearly acting as PIC which certainly wouldn't be the same in a routine takeoff lol..
She already had the death row mindset.
No call from the governor expected
Nothing wrong with that ATC performance. Pilot error 100%. Listen out people!
so somen no fault
armchair pilot
Listen AND execute I'd say ...seems like a lot of these incidents follow after repeating instruction correctly ...then doing differently. Great job ATC!
@@danielcgomez Worse is that there are (at least) 2 people in that cockpit and neither caught it.
@@airgus76 We’re all armchair pilots when we’re not flying
I’ve heard ORD ground tear people apart, but these tower controllers handled that so well.
They’ll tear you apart if you’re an annoyance on the ground. Absolute professionals if you’re about to kill a bunch of people in the air
It's the same people. ORD ground and tower are different positions in the same facility, O'Hare ATCT.
Impressive work though. Very nicely resolved.
I've NEVER heard ORD ground tear people apart. They'll make fun of stupidity all day long, but it takes a LOT to get them mad enough to take it out on frequency. Most of the time, it's done with humor and the pilots who screwed it up are so embarrassed they know they'll never do it again. Punishment served.
ORD controllers are the best in the country, no, the world!
@@JasonPhipps It is a nice but tough and fair midwesterner attitude of expecting perfection but realizing humanity. We are nice, but if you cannot tell your ass from a hole in the ground we are going to point that out to everyone.
I'm not a pilot, but in my opinion it's a bit of common sense - you don't tear apart a pilot who's departing. You want them to make it to their destination safely instead of causing them stress while they're still in the air.
Outstanding control by ATC 👏🏼
@Tech I think you need to get out more. Lol
I think the biggest problem here isn't the failure to follow instructions but the failure to think. They should have been aware that there were aircraft taking off from the parallel runway on their left and, therefore, that under no circumstances should they be turning left and crossing in front of them. Whatever mistakes they may have made with the clearance or configuring the autopilot, they should have had front and centre in their minds the fact that there were planes to the left of them that they need to maintain separation from.
Yes, a lack of situational awareness for whatever reason. Following the incorrectly programmed magenta line??
I agree that having the big picture is important to maintaining situational awareness, but to your "under no circumstances" point: it is not uncommon in ORD to have a turn on departure that crosses the entire airport complex. Although in my experience I've only done this taking off to the West.
@@arturo468 No "magenta line" departures in ORD. Probably just the wrong heading in the heading select window.
@@SAber_Pilot In which case, you would be extremely aware that you are doing that and would be double and triple checking where the traffic is.
@@thomasdalton1508 Oh absolutely. Clearly a big mistake here and good on ATC for seeing it and handling it quickly.
Not as close of a call as others, but not good. Good job ATC at a busy airport
Thing is, it would have been as close as the others or closer, or worse, had the controller not stopped the climb of the aircraft departing 10L.
United 8168 cleared for takeoff, right turn heading 180. Correct acknowledgement of the clearance on the read-back. Then an immediate left turn to N in front of other departing traffic at one of the busiest beehives on Earth. I'm at a loss to understand or explain other than they switched to autopilot immediately off the runway and had the heading set incorrectly, or had the fms programmed to go direct to their initial DP fix on AP engagement and that was possibly on the north side of the airport so the computer decided to go the shortest way. If either of those is true the pilot flying should have disengaged AP and started hand flying before the plane had turned more than a few degrees the wrong way. No excuse for this unless there was actually a technical problem with the airplane or avionics, which is also troubling. If this is the new norm it really feels like we're about to see a disastrous incident somewhere any day now. Good job by ATC to keep everyone safe and keep the traffic moving.
Most airlines actually forbid pilots from having their autopilot active during takeoff and landing for this very reason. It's follow the flight director and hand fly to the company determined altitude before switching on the AP.
Oof, turning left from 10L puts you right into traffic departing 9R. Huge mistake at O'Hare.
Also puzzling that they must realize they're turning into the airfield side, no? Maybe they planned a 09 RWY and got switched last minute and then just had "left turn" in mind still?
Very busy airport! I live in Chicago
@@tomhejda6450 probably not...pilot error for sure
@@tomhejda6450 this is a good theory, Chicago is almost always west flow. It could’ve just been assumed they were supposed to be turning left since we normally depart west and then turn left to go south. Still a big oopsie.
Good thing they’re departing 9C cause 9R is closed
In my 25 years of flying I’ve learned that if your about to do something nobody else is doing it’s time to question it.
Wow. Stay safe out there
Amazing how loud the engines are over the radio.
Have you heard a Metroliner over the radio before?
@@ecnivo Not knowingly I haven't.
Sitting at door 1L the A319 is deafening on climb. Often see row 1 plugging their ears.
321s = quiet
320s = quiet-ish
319s = “CHAINSAAAAAAAAAAAWWWWWWWWWW!!!!!”
For some reason I've only noticed that with United Airbuses. That's it. Weird how it comes from the same airline that brought us Channel 9. I like it though.
Can't wait for tomorrow's close call
It’s like these pilots are playing Russian Roulette… there’s a mindlessness to it that I just simply can’t understand coming from professional pilots flying commercial aircraft. It’s a good thing that the other pilots so far, have had the skills and situational awareness to fly out of these conflicts, but these are very basic mistakes that just should not be happening. So far these dumb pilots have been very lucky that other people have been on the ball to save their sorry arses, but every time it happens, that’s just one more hole in the Swiss Cheese falling into alignment. I’d be scared to fly commercial in the US atm… maybe just scared to fly period. It’s like c’mon guys, what are you doing?
By this point I'm certain it's just a new trend that's supposed to scare us europeans.
Jokes aside, the amount of conflicts creates by having no situational awareness, especially of surrounding traffic, lately is crazy.
@@virginiaviola5097 - this is my view on American aviation. It’s great and safe because everyone is well trained and professional. However, when there is a hiccup things get dangerous really quickly.
@@virginiaviola5097 how about you try and be a bit more understanding, maybe educate yourself on how incidents happen rather than taking to the internet in a fit of nearly incoherent rage.
Ugh I can't even joke about this. It seriously feels like a disaster is waiting to happen. At least the controllers were on top of this and hit it out of the park.
Concerning that two UA pilots did not follow a very common departure clearance, especially with them probably being very familiar with ORD procedures.
The way the pilot says “go ahead” at 2:43 makes me wonder if this isn’t her first phone number to copy.
Is that possibly an 18deg heading they started flying at first? Can you see what I'm thinking?
Nah flying a heading of 018 would be super random
ATC just handled that like the pros that they are! Great job from everyone
Chicago controllers I’m thinking best in the industry. Right up with New York. Nice work.
It is never funny when a pilot is given a number, but I do find it a bit amusing when a newer pilot receives their first pilot deviation, versus a high hour pilot. New pilots typically sound contrite and a bit defeated if not embarrassed, but vet pilots are all yea I'm flying a plane right now so no you'll have to wait on the pen 😂. Kudos to ATC for keeping it cool and everyone safe 😊
You could hear it in her voice.. that was a f*ck up that is going to be hard to explain and keep flying with United.
Fantastic job by the two controllers
I wonder if they activated the auto pilot as soon as they where in the air and the heading was set incorrectly which would cause the aircraft to turn north. I’ve seen that happen a few times. Some pilots are way too eager to click the AP on.
I remember speaking to a former 747 Captain who retired about 7 years ago. He was concerned about how they train system monitors and not pilots nowadays.
@@callumwinkler1943 I think that it’s a mix of all that. Complacency, training, ego, etc. I’ve meet pilots who have that mindset they are the best and can’t screw up, and that’s so dangerous.
@@callumwinkler1943 To be fair, in the US the system monitors are flying small Cessna's and Pipers for their first 1,500 hours. There's years of muscle memory built in, and pilots who train in busy airspace like NY or LA will be veterans at this stuff by the time they get into an airplane with a 3 axis autopilot. What we see here is just a good old brain fart. 99.9% of the time the pilot monitoring catches it before the pilot flying deviates, but sometimes the pilot monitoring is stuck dealing with some other task and the mistake wins.
As we get older the mistakes happen more and more often. I'm 7 years in and see it all the time. I'm not sure there's a way to fix these kinds of absent-minded errors, save for replacing us all with computers.
i’m betting they set heading mode on the FD while holding short or maybe even turning on to the rwy, which would have commanded a left turn since that was the closer heading before being lined up with the rwy. engage AP then commands the turn, if it hadn’t been stopped probably would have resulted in a left 270° turn from RH (010) to 180. a very subtle behavior of engaging heading mode - always set heading mode after being lined up!
here’s a video that describes the exact problem albeit on the g1000 (much less advanced compared to the airline FMS). but same idea. don’t engage HDG on the ground! th-cam.com/video/K-8vIa688zw/w-d-xo.htmlm42s
Nailed it
So many incidents occurring in the US at the moment...It's getting scary
No it isn't. Just TH-cam is full of people scouring ATC recordings for incidents, so you actually hear about them. No more or less than 5 years ago (or 20), I'm betting.
It’s all your fault
You're believing the hype. Thousands and thousands of flights happen every single day without incident. One or two pilot deviations per month is a relatively low number. And the fact that they're not leading to accidents demonstrates the effectiveness of the safety measures built into commercial aviation. What should impress people isn't that these "incidents" are happening, but that they don't happen more often and that they haven't been leading to accidents.
Smooth as silk. I can't believe TCAS wasn't screaming..
There is a difference between dangerous (I don’t think warning systems went off) and not following the instructions due to pilot error. In this case all the accident prevention systems worked.
Which planes were closest to an alert you think?
The dangerous bit is how they turned left toward another departure path from either 9C or 9R. ATC had to make sure departures from those runways didn't climb their initial clearance altitude to keep a midair collision from occurring.
Ugh this is getting really scary. Glad the controllers were on top of it though. Also is Channel 9 still a thing with United? I wonder if the passengers onboard were listening to their own flight deviation 😬
Controllers handled it well. But notice how operations were affected. She had aircraft lined up and taking off one after the other, but handling the situations put the take offs on hold.
(ORD has six runways heading east - 9L 9C 9R 10L 10C 10R, each on its own frequency) (should be six runways)
Isn't 9C also used for eastbound departures?
@@mikemilner8080yes, missed it. Six runways.
Jesus dude, ORD uses TWO runways for departures depending on east/west flow. Please don’t comment on something that you have zero knowledge of.
Probably had one thing programmed in the FMC and then received the 180 heading they weren't expecting. Read it back correctly but didn't process it and followed the FD
They were destination southbound so I don't see why their FMC would load something to the north
@@VASAviation not at all atypical to go the opposite heading of your destination on takeoff. I can’t count how many times I’ve taken off north and turned east going to a westbound destination out of the east coast. 270° turns off takeoff are nothing notable in my experience.
@@qwerty112311 Agree with that but I can't see a departure procedure from ORD that makes a loop to go south. Maybe they had KORD or the runway as first waypoint and the aircraft tried to go back to overfly it?
All O'Hare departures use the ohare7. It will always be radar vectors to first wp.
@@VASAviation Due to the density of air traffic in the San Francisco Bay area, the airport at San Jose has a departure procedure that has you take off to the north, make a right turn to head back south while climbing, then at a certain waypoint turn right again and fly back to a waypoint north of the airport, then finally on course...
Great controllers there!
Hi @VASAviation, I’m an ord-based mechanic who has a recent rwy incursion. It was a serious incursion that could’ve been deadly. But fortunately nothing happened. Wondering if you’re able to find atc recording and radar data. Incursion occurred on JUL62023. Thanks for all you do!
Thanks detailed info to email. Especially date and time
Sent!
Great job by that ATCS
KORD Tower has seen this movie before and you can tell from their response. What happens is that clearance delivery gives the initial IFR departure clearance with a SID procedure that the flight crew programs into the computer, but then Tower amends the clearance with an assigned heading while issuing the takeoff clearance. If the flight crew is in a rush to get rolling and get off the runway at a busy airport like KORD, they can neglect to change their lateral autoflight mode from NAV to HDG (in Airbus terms), and when they engage the autopilot or follow the flight director after takeoff, they fly the initial clearance rather than the amended clearance. It's important to double-check the armed modes before takeoff, which then feeds back into all the recent issues with Tower controllers underestimating the time it will take for airliners to start rolling after takeoff clearance. There have also been multiple close calls recently with Boeing aircraft taking off with their vertical mode armed to altitude hold at 0 feet, basically commanding the autopilot to crash the jet when it's engaged. Check Yo Modes!
All of ORD departures are assigned headings. There’s no RNAV departures out of there. So they should have been in heading mode to begin with anyway.
this never happens at KORD
@@saxmanb777 It's radar vectors to a fix, so they might have programmed Direct to the first fix.
should not there be a automatic sanity-check against navigation-computer inputs of a flight level less than one?
Has happened few times
Many are talking about recent mistakes by ATC or pilots.The question realy is are they above the average of mistakes in the past years relative to flights that took place daily?and if so,does it have anything to do with pilots and ATCs being out of work(therefore out of practice)during the covid?
Its called human error. It happens and has been happening in atc since its inception. The pilot fucked up the controller handled it. End of story. Thats what we get paid to do...
Someone said in previous comments there were over 1800 reported in 2022 and the first 3 months of this yr are already blowing that value out of the water.
Its unfortunate you can’t put links in youtube so that it would be easier to see actual source data for what some are stating.
maybe it's that the COVID messed everyone up more than people realize, and it's like we're all getting dementia all at once at whatever age. Just a (fairly unsettling) thought....
if you know you know.
Thank you to the commenters for looking up the stats. I was wondering the same as the question poster and it’s good to see the stats. Or rather it’s bad to see them.
I’ve lost track what incident number this is since January
Very cool to have that real footage but TH-cam covers it with the end card thumbnails
Nice calm resolution by ATC. Their high experience is clearly seen.
Also, Listening to how fast the controllers speak and me not easily understanding their instructions is a realization of how much of a rookie I really am. I'd cry if I wasn't a real man! (*wiping tears*)
Could someone explain I’m confused. Atc said heading 180 and I thought that’s what 8168 did or am I wrong?
When tower cleared 8168 for takeoff they were told turn 180, but on departure 8168 actually made a turn to the north so tower had to come up again and direct them to 180.
Right turn 180 was issued in the original takeoff clearance at 0:08. They turned the wrong way and had to be told again at 1:05
Go to the 3:00 mark where the track is visible. They initially turned north and crossed into the path of traffic taking off from 9R, then their U-turn to go south put them into conflict with the plane that took off right after them from the same runway.
180 is south. They were heading to 360 (north).
@@tmriddle8 Oh ok that makes a lot more sense, I’m new to watching these videos and how the pilots and atc talk so fast I got confused. Thank you so much!
@VASAviation and another close call comes to light during a reported FAA Emergency Summit in McLean, VA last week - Jan 12th ambulance crossed without permission in front of SW taking off at BWI.
What are the "G" or "W" on each aircraft? I haven't noticed those before.
I can’t fathom this, you hear RIGHT TURN (with runways to the north) and the plane starts turning left, why arnt you checking what’s going on or even kicking off the autopilot and correcting the turn
Thanks for the real scope!
With the trend we’re seeing I think we can just about hold our breath until we see a catastrophe.
Nah, you’re just being alerted to it way more. In the “gold ol’ days” you’d have some dead passengers. Commercial aviation in the last decade+ in the US is literally the safest it has ever been. FAR more dangerous to drive in a car, or even to attend elementary school, than to take a flight. If you want to live in fear all the time, be scared of Citizens United and PACs, or the global water and food crises.
I feel stupid for not understanding this. To me the display shows it making a clockwise turn..isn't that a right turn? What am i not getting here?
@Frans Ny...Listen from the beginning, the aircraft is instructed to turn right heading 180 after departure.
They departed and turned left (Northbound), conflicting with other departing traffic on Rwys 09L/R). After being corrected by the controller The aircraft turned turned to the right towards a 180 heading, and was separated vertically, from a following departure off Rwy 10L.
@@rubenvillanueva8635 Ah ok, thx for the explaination!
Look at the track at the 3:00 minute mark, that may offer a better visual explanation.
@@radon360 Thx!
Love how you can hear the engines at power on the reply 1:05
Always can hear the buzz on the old airbus
Only with United Airbus aircraft it seems. I don't know why.
@@svscared the type of engine option they chose on order
It's almost like they chased out a bunch of experienced pilots a couple years ago and scraped through the bottom of the barrel in a feeble attempt to replace them. Great job on the part of the controllers.
I think that is dishonest as to the bigger picture. Airlines for a long time knew they had a looming retirement problem. The pilots kept getting older and instead of building up the next generation they ran many of them off with beyond pathetic pay at the regionals and burning them out with crappy treatment.
Is there a huge influx of new pilots and controllers, absolutely but this wasn’t a short term created problem this was many many many years problem they made worse.
The airlines own FULL responsibility for refusing to address the problem in a proactive manner.
I was a UH-60 Blackhawk crew chief for 9 years. This stuff happens quite a bit,. but there was no you tube oe social media.
@@lijohnyoutube101 Spot on, and the replacements have no experience.
@@lijohnyoutube101 This. We have similar problems right across the entire greater transport and logistics industry from airlines to trucking, trains, marine vessels like ferries, and in both the private sector as well as state-run organizations. Politically motivated budget cuts, corporate greed, incompetent management and toxic working cultures have all contributed to this mess, and now its gonna cost all of us in the form of increased prices and taxes and likely in lives and other collateral damage, all because one generation of leadership/management got greedy and short sighted over the last couple decades.
But yes, this is not a novel problem caused by COVID. COVID was merely the proverbial last straw. This goes back at least 20 years.
@@drn13355 true but the numbers the last approximately 18 months are a significant increase.
ORD Controllers are true professionals of the business!
This sounds like a heading bug that wasn't properly set. Maybe wait for the ASAP/ASRS report to come out?
You probably need a bit of experience to understand these (which I don't have).
What did she do wrong? Does "right turn heading 180" mean to do an 180 while turning right? Anyone care to explain in brief?
Turn right until ending up on a heading of 180 (heading south).
Please anyone, excuse my ignorance but how 'close' was that for all clarity?
The error was pretty significant, but tower did a great job here. From what we see in the video, all aircraft remained more than 1,000 feet apart vertically, which is the standard separation requirement.
So, could have been bad, but because the tower controllers and other pilots on frequency worked quickly and effectively it was actually just as safe as normal operations.
Safety was not compromised due to the 2 outstanding local controllers. Nice job guys!
-18 year and counting controller
Caption correction. Number was 601 not 301
I noticed that too.
Yeah, also winds are at 12, not 10 at the 0:17 mark. However, I'd rather have captions with non-consequential typos than having to figure out what they are saying on my own. ;-)
What they are going to discuss on the Phone? Will investigation be contucted?
Yes. It means ATC is submitting it to the FAA for investigation. The pilots are given a phone number so that they can be informed of the investigation and tell their side of the story.
Took me a minute to work out what had happened.... it wasn't until I saw the runways on the background that I realised 8168 had executed a pretty hard left turn before they'd even appeared on ATC radar, despite being instructed to turn 180? I thought the freakout was the potential LOS between 2627 and 8168 and was like "... but she turned right to 180 as instructed". Ooof.
FYI, the female pilot was working the radios which means she was most likely not at the flight controls. If anything she might have selected the heading for the autopilot prior to departure.
women = usa problem
Uhhh, wrong.
Listen closer.
The captain acknowledged the call to switch to departure frequency.
She acknowledged the cleared for takeoff call.
She was the pilot flying.
if you know you know
@@kaypie3112 How could you possibly know which of them was the captain? You can't hear what seat they are sitting in...
@@kaypie3112 sounded like the lady was answering all the calls so she was most likely pilot monitoring.
What airline has “brickyard” call sign?
Republic
Republic Airways. They are headquartered in Indianapolis, hence 'Brickyard'.
@@ptrinch Got it ! Thanks.
I also get my left and right mixed up every now and then. But I'm not a pilot so...
Put your hands out in front of you so you are looking at the backs of your hands with your thumbs out. The hand making an L is left. 😉👍
@@commerce-usa That assumes people know which side is the back of their hands 😆
As they say, two wrongs don't make a right. But three lefts do.
@@ptrinch I think that's what UA8168's pilot flying was thinking
Oh no, Airplanes and Coffee is going to have a field day with this one
Probably set the 180 heading but after 400' forgot to select it... '400' 'pull heading'. Standard Airbus mistake
Someone (FO) forgot to set the heading (or HDG mode) on the FCU on their lineup...
Why FO? Do you know the roles?
Ok did I miss something. Didn't the controller tell her to turn right into traffic.
UAL8168 went left (north first), that little excursion put them into conflict with the next aircraft taking off from 10L when they came back south.
@@radon360 ohhh yesss I see. Thank you
I don't see a left turn here, can someone explain?
The aircraft turned left (northbound) after departure
FO probably programmed the navicomputer with the wrong Mos O’Hare departure settings. I don’t blame him, busy spaceport, Chewy’s done it in the Falcon a couple times. Yea, yea, I’ll call the regional Empire authority after I dump cargo.
There is nothing to program for the O’Hare 7 departure. It is literally impossible to program anything.
ATC: NO.....your other RIGHT UAL 8168 !
I am not in the aviation. I just got kicked in to this VASAviation for some reason. and I cannot understand a word the tower is transmitting. Pilots seem to be doing fairly well in communicating. How the heck do you guys do this on a daily basis?
Not a pilot and happy to be corrected, but I wonder if this recording is from the ground and if transmissions in-air sound a little better.
so what exactly happens to the pilot in this instance?
We’re these two planes not 2000 feet apart (vertically). Maybe ATC was calm cause this is nothing?
There may be more of these deviations lately, but network news is also reporting more of them. The airports have become busier, and maybe we have more recently-retrained pilots flying now, but I don't think there's any one factor that we can point to for the increase.
Agreed, things like this are interesting to hear, but not news worthy.
With the traffic volume, people are bound to mess up, but with safety, redundancies, the possibility of an accident is still very low.
I'm not understanding of what happened. Werent they told to head south towards 180? Why was this the pilots fault?
Nevermind, got it. Directly after take off they headed north instead of south
Hi. Can you explain to me what happened? Airplane made right turn to 180 heading. Exactly how ATC told them. So whats the problem?
@Askar Mukhanov at take off they headed north rather than south. They were told to head south after take off but went north instead
...and here we go again..JESUS..it's only a matter of time 😔
Only a matter of time before what? Do you honestly think that a complex method of transportation relying heavily on human capabilities should operate without error 100% of the time? Do yourself a favor. Go sit at the end of the runways at O'Hare and watch the number of takeoffs and landings that happen every single day without any drama whatsoever. Hint: it's a lot of them. Aviation will never be completely safe, but it's impressive just how safe it is. Stop buying the media hype.
@@jaredhageman4986 Well said. As I’ve seen a few other folks that clearly work within the air transport and navigation system say in these comments sections : When you know, you know.
Great job tower 👍
A bit of a clickbait title. Just a small mistake or something happening with UAL8168, but all was handled calm and cool by ATC to deconflict everything.
Small mistake? Pilots have been fired for causing RAs out of ORD. 🤦🏼♀️
Not small at all
@@prorobo no, as a 121 crew member, we would not get fired for something like this.
@@VASAviation mistakes happen every day on every flight. TEM tries to trap them. Not all mistakes get trapped and some get through like this. The outcome was very minor and had little effect on any operations. Could it have become something more? Absolutely. But there are systems and procedures in place to lessen the impact, in this case ATC providing altitude restrictions to the following departures until the subject aircraft could un-F their situation.
@@griffith211 look up Envoy ORD 2019. Both pilots were fired because the RA with AA made national news. The union got the CA’s job back, the FO was on probation and did not.
Left or right normally doesn't require any rocket science to understand
@@greggoog7559 cool your jets there buddy, there’s 2 pilots in the cockpit, both share equal blame for the mistake
So what are the actual repercussions of making that phone call?
I think someone in the past has said that they explain the mess up to the pilot and get some information for ATC to make a report.
Theres a video with harrison ford flying his personal plane and he makes an error, iirc the phone call was recorded also and available in the video
@Leeroy Jeankins Thanks...I'll check that out.
The phone call is actually voluntary. It's a chance for the tower to get your side of the story prior to submitting a report with the FAA. Often times, at least in General Aviation, the phone call can result in the FAA not being notified if the incident is minor and didn't involve other aircrafts.
Pilot deviation, yes. But it looks like 8168 would have been out of the way of both planes until ATC turned it back in front of 1774. Safer to let them continue their course?
1774 had the climb stopped and passed below 8168, no problems on that front.
No. Because they went the wrong way. 🤦🏼♀️
Legal separation required is 1000 feet. When did they get any closer than that? Did I miss something? There's no close call here.
Are all of these situations due to an over worked pilot & controler? I know the airlines refuse to pay and staff properly so are all these instances a result of that?
No, this is just sloppy work by the crew, you check your inputs into the system.
You joking? The pilots union just got new contracts with huge post-covid raises.
For a non pilot, this is interesting and kind of weird. I know comparisons usually don't work, but it would be like, in my car, I turn right into the guard rail or something. If I had an autopilot, then it would be possible, but if I'm driving, no way. Aren't pilots too quick on turning on the AP? (Not saying it is what happened, just thinking) Shouldn't they just... drive.....and then, when all danger is out of sight, then engange the AP and ask for a cup a coffee. Wouldn't this improve situation awarness and simple.....driving? Fly the plane? With your hands? Just asking as a total leyman. I see videos where the AP is egaged right after take off.
AP or hand flying, the result is likely to be the same here. We have guidance on our screens called a Flight Director that tells us which direction to turn, to point the nose up or down, and when to be level. In hand flying, we follow its guidance; in autoflight, the computer follows it for us. It gets its information from what route we have programmed into the airplane. That could be a planned route such as a flight plan, or it could be a heading such as 180 degrees. A simple misunderstanding or misremembered clearance could cause the pilot to input 000 degrees of heading and the flight director would command a turn in that (wrong in this case) direction to a hand flying pilot as well as the autopilot. It would take a vigilant, situationally aware crew to notice the error and correct it in time to prevent a conflict. Ideally we are vigilant whether hand flying or not. Who knows what happened here - I’m sure the reports will have more.
@@lukegerst2382 I see. Thank you for the explanation.
Shocking!
Is it possible the pilot flying heard "runway 10L" and got wires crossed for a moment? Their actions make sense if you look at "10 left" as an instruction to turn left, heading 10 degrees.
No. That’s not even a possible ATC instruction.
@@atcdude067 no, it is not.
Extremely unlikely.
@@prorobo that's beside the point; I'm saying the pilot got their wires crossed, and that they *weren't thinking*. A pilot thinking about what they were hearing and saying wouldn't have gotten into this situation in the first place.
@@HexagonalMan6 again, no. We can be given “10 left” in the air since we’re already on a heading. That’s not even a remote possibility for takeoff. United doesn’t hire low time pilots.
I believe that is coded as a niner niner no no.
O'Hare (ORD) can be hornets nest when taxing or flying throught their airspace
I’m sorry but can someone point out the CLOSE CALL to me. Yeah, 8168 turned the wrong direction, but thanks to the work of the atc at no point did they get any closer than 2000 feet vertical separation. No reported tcas traffic avisories let alone a resolution advisory. Yes it created a little havoc in the pattern, but calling it a “close call” implies danger to the aircraft that simply doesn’t exist here.
Interesting, ATC realized the mistake of the pilot, but never sounded agitated and didn't put additional pressure on the offenders. Saw the problem and executed a solution immediately and then when the load decreased, they made the announcement.
Other ATC gets agitated, even ask like "what are you doing, you were supposed to do this, not that" instead of fixing the issue immediately
I wonder if vasair has contract with the Tower to get video of the actual scope lol.
He got it from an ATC at C90 (Chicago TRACON) who is a subscriber of the cannel. So probably didnt ask for it but got it sent lol.
@@Nardur12321 as long as they don't get in trouble, I'm ok with that. ATC tower are sensitive places when it comes to security
Why does this happen so often?
It doesn't. There are thousands and thousands of flights every single day. Having one or two pilot mistakes every month is an incredibly low percentage. Obviously, pilots strive to be perfect and eliminate mistakes, but this hype about "near misses" happening all the time is a lot of fake news.
@@jaredhageman4986 Agreed now that I think about it
It's the UFO's over O'Hare!!!
She sounded very tired. Pilot fatigue plus bad crew resource management on the part of the pilots
great job by the controllers saving the situation, but its baffling to me how US controllers mumble a heading with the takeoff clearance and thats all the pilots get...standard departure routes prevent this sort of mixup by allowing pilots to prepare and brief before even leaving the stand
Oh great I’ve got a flight on that airline coming up. Hope she is not the PIC
To be honest, I’ve seen so many of these lately that I am not surprised. Just look at the number of flights that ATC is handling and at the speed she talks with so many United flights. If you lose focus there for just a second to attend something else you can easily make a mistake. And that is true for both pilots and ATCs. I don’t know what the solution is; but this system is definitely obsolete. We are pushing humans to a point where they simply cannot be correct close to 100% of the time, and in this case they need to be correct very close to 100%
It wasn't that close really... They have 1,700ft vertical separation.
all you need is a few inches
Well this is going to piss people off but almost all of the close calls had a fill in the blank on the radio doing a correct read back but going the wrong way.
I don't get what you're trying to say here.
@@jaredhageman4986 He’s just another sexiest incel who thinks that women don’t belong in cockpits. Also, he’s an idiot who has no clue there’s a difference between PF and PM.
@@jaredhageman4986 I think he meant people with blue eyes. Or maybe green.
What the hell is going on?? Every other day now, one of these is happening!!
Pilot fucked up and the controller kept them vertically separated the entire time... relax
It's not more than usual. We are just getting more videos from youtube channels like this one which makes it seem like it's happening more often...
@@airgus76 fun fact - if you do some research you'll see that your "not more than usual" is just wishful thinking.
@@airgus76
I have edited this to reflect source so its not potentially spreading false information.
I put this in another comment after looking it up but will paste here as well.
The FAA stats page says that Runway Incursion Totals for FY 2023 as of the beginning of march are 657.
That period for 2022 had 400.
The ‘fiscal yr cycle’ starts in Oct.
Fiscal yr 2022 ( so Oct 2021 to Sept 2022) total of 1732 reported incidents.
Numbers in 2018, 2019 excursions reported were for fiscal year of 1753 and and 1832.
Everything to this point is from the FAA stats area of the website.
The below is conjecture/conclusions from google hits of numbers and a projected amount of flights from a business finance site.
Number of flights in 2022 were still significantly significantly down from historical although increased over 2021.
Number of flights in 2021 roughly 22 million.
Number of flights in 2020 roughly 41 million.
Approximate number expected in 2023 is 11 million based on current schedule. ( This number is suspect given its so low)
So very very roughly there are 75 percent (a fourth of the historical flying volume) less flights ( based on the 11 million projected) and the numbers reported for this greatly reduced flight period is at same very huge ballpark error rate and that’s not accounting for it the trend continues to increase month over month.
Those numbers should alarm anyone if the 11 million flights is accurate, if the flight amount is inaccurate its still a concerning amount in month to month increases but not alarming.
There was another close call at KSRQ last month where a plane was cleared for take off and another was given permission to land and the interval was too close. The landing plane did a go around after seeing the other plane was still on the runway.
That was such a minor incident it shouldn’t even have made the news
@@mattr3889 That is what I thought as well but I didn't have the tapes to see when the clearance was issued to the landing airplane so I have no idea of the interval.
Similar event happened here a while back.
At this rate, ATC should make their 'numbers to call' 1-900 numbers. Then they can cover their operating expenses without any taxpayer funding.
and accidently call a porn site, instead the FAA.
The new generation of pilots are so polite and “thankful” when given the dreaded phone number and yet are clueless of how close they came to an accident.
Unqualified hires based on “equity”