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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 15 ธ.ค. 2021
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There's a great troubleshooting section on the samba for the FI. You had the injectors out, so you must replace the seals! Also those rubber S boots can have cracks and will cause a no run issue. Don't let anyone talk you into ripping it out for carbs, its an awesome system.
I would also take a good long at the voltage regulator
Mechanical problem that is where I would start. Injection working fine. My best guess.......Valve seat stuck and valve not closing all the way. Clicking noise from lifter loose because seat has moved a bit....If that is the issue dont run the engine at high rpm....you will loose a piston. This happened daily at the shop I worked at in the 80s.
It's the Flux capacitor for sure. And if not, check the Fetzer valve. It's all ball bearings!
Vacuum Leak - probably the injector seals and mostly the intake boot. The L-Jetronic system (L stands for Luft, Air in German) cannot tolerate any intake air leaks.
Here's another thing to check. And it's a quick one. It's possible that you're getting too much fuel and flooding within a few seconds after starting.
Temperature-sensor-2 is attached to one of your cylinder heads. (It's cylinder 4 on a Bug) Pull the spade connector for this sensor off the harness. The resistance from the connector to the crankcase should be about 2500 ohms.
If the TS-2 is defective and open circuit, the ECU commands FULL RICH and floods the engine after starting.
Ya'll struggled with that problem a lot longer than I would have, lol. Great Video.
Tell me about it
Judging by the looks of things, what I would suggest to you guys is get a bench testing fuel injector tool that feeds gas/12V to the injectors, you hook them in line of everything, and watch the spray pattern. If it isn't a consistent strong mist and appears sporadic, they're clogged or failing.
If there are 12V positive and ground connections on said injectors, take a 9V battery and quickly touch the connections back and forth to hear whether or not the injector solenoids are actuating. If they stick after you rip away the battery or don't articulate, you have a failed injector.
I'd also check resistance on your fuel pump if it's running a 12V fuel pump, as well as check fuel pressure, could be a failed fuel pump.
You guys obviously have spark since it runs, so converting from a pointless ignition to a points ignition won't necessarily solve your problem right away, wouldn't worry about that.
Keep us all posted on what you find! Type 4 fuel injected buses and vanagons are a very finicky anomaly!
Chrisfix on TH-cam here has an excellent video on testing fuel injectors that encompasses any brand, a fuel injector is pretty consistent for any design until you go to GDI technology, that's when complexity takes place.
I feel for you guys. It took me a while to figure mine out. But it came down to a vacuum leak. The little rubber elbow on the right side of the motor toward the middle had a tear in it. At first I just pulled it out and wrapped it with electrical tape and put it back on. It fired right up. It’s hard to see due to it being right under the air cleaner and the blower for the heater. It’s to the right of the enrichment injector. Unfortunately once I figured it out that’s when I was able to get it to stay running long enough to hear the number three valves rattling around in the head due to loose valve seats. Good luck guys.
My first thought is to replace the square fuel filter, check for broken vacuum lines and make sure they are hooked up correctly. I would then look at the fuel pressure regulator. I love my 76 fuel injected bus! When they are running good.. it’s hard to beat a fuel injected bus! So reliable and smooth. I learned one thing about them… fuel injected VW love to be all stock. I messed with so many aftermarket distributors and electronic ignitions and found out it runs best with the original points style distributor. Good luck!
I am hearing it crank fast than slow then fast then slow.....LOW COMPRESSON ON ONE CYLINDER? check compression. also if the injector is plugged they run on low voltage Like 1v to 3v....We used to snap them with a 9v battery then spray carb cleaner in them. DONT HOLD THE CONNECTION FOR VERY LONG WITH THE 9V battery you will FRY the injector. Remember these type 4 engines had issues with valve seats. could be low compression from compromised valve seat. Heads went bad most of the time. AA makes new ones but they are not cheap.
The humor makes it fabulous you guys are genuine steely eye VWbus men
You have ruled out the ignition system, AFM and ECU as when it runs on brake clean you have a consistent injector pulse and spark
but judging by the "dribbling" injectors I would suspect a fueling issue.
Place an inline fuel pressure gauge fitted somewhere before the pressure regulator.
Cycle the ignition a few times to prime the system and you should read around 35 psi.
If not then pinch the inlet pipe after the gauge but before the regulator and cycle the key once more.
If you see a reading lower than 35psi I would suspect the pump or a blockage up stream.
A reading higher than 35psi would indicate a failed regulator.
Assuming you see around 35psi leave it for a couple of minutes and if the pressure holds the regulator is good.
Start the engine and the psi should drop to around 30 psi at idle with the vacuum hose connected.
If the pressure immediately drops away you have a pump/blockage issue.
If the pressure is maintained stop the engine, pull the injectors and watch for any drips (No more than a couple a minute).
Replace any injectors that drip and try again.
If the injectors are good then Dellorto's are the answer.
The slammed bay!! I don't have as many projects as you but it would sure be nice to have a whole crew to work on things and might actually get something done lol Great video as usual VW life!!!
Need a fuel pressure gauge on it to see f it’s dropping. The fuel on the spark plug boots had me cringing and thinking 🤔 where are my fire extinguishers. Another great episode, Cheers!
Hard work, but thats a part of the game. And it is a realy good feeling when the engine starts. Nice Video guys, and greets from Germany to Texas.
Thanks for watching!
You lads are awesome. There’s no quitting till she runs like she’s supposed to, love the determination. Keep it up. Rock on and peace out!!
I have an adventurewagon from 81 stood still for 25 years, injectors cleaned, new filter and new pump and runs smoothly. the pump must supply enough fuel otherwise it will not continue to run.
all vacuum lines must also be well closed must not attract false air.
also look at the mass of ECU under the gas house greets from Holland 🇳🇱
Thank you my 76 T2 has been sitting since 2006. Was working. Did not pass smog.just sat. Now it turns, but no start. Any ideas?
Gunk in the tank clogging the fuel sock on tank outlet.
As it sits the gunk settles. But when trying to run it sucks the gunk back against the fuel sock clogging it again.
I had a similar issue on a 72 bay Westy plagued us forever.
This does seem like the ol' ping pong ball in the gas tank gag-- ball(debris) gets sucked against fuel line, engine dies. Sits a minute, ball floats away because of no suction, engine starts, sucks the ball and blocks fuel... dies.. repeat, again and again.
Also toward the end injector was squirting should spray. Check fuel pressure I dont remember the amount it should have. Bentley for that. Also use some spray in those injectors while someone is opening and closing them (Carb spray then brake spray)
The inlet screen/filter for the fuel pump is full of rust, when the pump comes on it sucks all the crud up and chokes itself off. After the van sits for a minute the rust settles to the bottom again and it will fire up and run momentarily until it sucks all the rust back up.
I like every video you guys do. I live vicariously thru you guys till I can get another bus love it, thank you guys
You guys are still my heroes! I know you'll figure it out! 🙏😊
Great to see that you guys struggle like most everyone else.
I can tell from your trees that you don’t live too far from me. 😆 If you ever need an extra set of hands on a project I’d love to come learn. I know a tiny bit but not enough. Never enough!!! Put me to work. 🙏🏻
Central Texas
@@VWLifeVW I was close! I was going to guess north east Texas.
Fuel injection is a pain in the rear end😁
Thank you so very much for sharing. Great show always love and enjoy watching VW Life. 👍❤️
I still believe in you guys - have a nice advent !
I’m just happy knowing that I’m not the only one who gets frustrated with my VW’s! You guys are the best!
Cool video…this video makes me happy that I bought a carbureted engine for my bug when it was originally a fuel injected engine
I’ve read most of the comments and can’t add anything. They all sound about right. Best of luck, and keep the faith. VW life baby!
I have NO IDEA what the problem is, but I sure enjoy the videos. Thanks guys!
this is the best video for me so far i love you guys
good stuff, going along and trying to solve the mystery...txs for sharing(lunch was trouble free)
15:00 "it seems to squirt more then trickle down to nothing". Have you checked the prostate?
The fuel pump is not providing enough pressure. The fact that brake cleaner keeps it working, then you know it's fuel pump pressure. The injectors spray way too little fuel, as the spray pattern has to be like that on the brake clean can, and the little squirt you're getting after a couple of seconds is not enough. Just compare it when it works, the injectors spray like they should, then they go to a wee little spit of fuel.
Get anew fuel pump and that'll solve the issue. It's that or there's a vacuum leak that causes the fuel pressure regulator to bypass and send all the pressurized fuel back to the tank.
yea I second that. But I also hear a lot of clicking. and an uneven crank. sounds like one cylinder not doing very well....From past experience it probably has a valve seat coming loose. I would clean every injector with a 9v battery and check fuel pressure. also check compression. combination of a few things.
Thanks for keeping it honest.
We trying!
Double check timing it backfires on every fail...
I like this video because… it’s not me having to deal with a injected type 4…..
This 1978 Microbus or Rabbit bus fuel injection. Once you open the rear compartment door and upper small trunk and it exposed the engine. But It would be sent back to professional bondo body repair and metal bender fender quality fabricator and cut open up more between hole of the floor at atop the rear engine and Using saw saw grind down to the rear trunk hole and slice again so both cut of both side. Then remove the sheet metal between upper compartment hole and engine compartment rear hole. Then you got a rear hood which is bigger then two engine closing doors. But the metal hood will be special order from USA sheet worker and welder shop and a Western Wolfsburg dealership. Microbus is predecessor of Vanagon.
great work video i had one before and it was giving the same problem and all my friend do is clean the fuel system
Nice attempt legends, always entertaining. Keep up the good work.
Thanks, will do!
Watching the trials that you went through I kept thinking back to fuel issues. While the pump is running, is it supplying enough pressure. A pressure gauge might be a good thing to check with. In addition fuel filter / lines for flow in case there is an obstruction in either one. Just as a final check I'd see if you can get the injectors cleaned and then clean all the electrical connections on the airbox.
This is what i was thinking also
Hey even when you don't win you guys are winners!!
Stay after it. Somebody out there will jump in and help. I got faith in you guys. How much do you want for it????
i like thos because the "Slam Van" finally gets some love
Great step by step process of elimination effort. I really think you have something interrupting fuel delivery from tank to injectors, debris in tank or line that temporarily clogs the filter/line, then when pump is off for enough time, the non-suction allows it to drop away allowing a temporary restart. So glad I have carbs 😉
There’s a whole step by step test for the relay in the book if that’s ok then it’s probably something else. Vacuum or fuel pressure. I know that stuff gets expensive probably why all that gets ripped out now. I did one a couple years ago. Now they have let it sit and the pump went bad.
Very entertaining episode!
Don’t give up I remember a Volkswagen Rabbit we had that gave us a ton of problems back in the day when fuel injection began and it was horrible also we had the two door Volkswagen Station Wagon and we went nuts because of problems with the fuel injection system 👍
I would check compression and if thats fine check fuel pressure and if thats fine then you have a vacuum leak . but I would about bet you have a dropped,valve on #3 I had the same issue on my last type 4 and it did the exact same thing yours is doing
Check to make sure the white wire on the coil has a good connection! I believe that is the feed wire for the ECM
You don't want to be messing inside the AFM either. The way that flapper was swinging, there's probably an intake valve not sealing also. And you REALLY don't want to be Messing in the AFM. That needs to be sealed back up otherwise the moisture can affect it...and fingers
YES!!! Another VW fixing video!!!
Parv
And their are alot of those grounds on the 78 bus!!
Nice try guys you did your best maybe on the next video you will get it 👍🏻👍🏻stay safe guys
Hope so!
Had a type 4 on beach Buggy. They either run or they don't! It's so difficult to fault find. Thanks anyway for another great video
My beetle did something similar and to fix we took an air line and blew out the gas lines and that did the trick for me
Plenty of folks know more about cars than I do, but aren't fuel injectors supposed to spray atomized fuel? Looked like those injectors were more of a stream, so it could be low fuel pressure, weak injectors, or partially clogged injectors. The fact that you could spray ATOMIZED starter fuel into the intake and the engine ran kinda sorta supports that idea, at least in my mind...
If it was the injectors not spraying properly you'll get an engine that runs bad or rich.
In their case, it looks like the injectors are spraying ok but for some reason the engine stops running after a bit.
It can be several reasons but my suspension will be on fuel delivery.
1. The fuel pump is not running when the engine is running after initial start.
2. Fuel pressure drops after initial start.
These systems will prime the fuel lines when you turn your key from off to run position. The double relay will power the pump for 2 seconds.
Once the engine is running, the flap in the air flow meter will close the circuit to run the pump.
A long shot but check the throttle valve switch on the throttle housing it's not idling so it could be sending a voltage signal to the control unit that it's not on idle or part load had a similar problem years ago when I was an apprentice with my technician when I was training we had a car come into our dealership a BMW E30 with an M40 engine and Bosch motronic system found out that a back Street garage screwed around with adjustment screws with the throttle housing had to order a complete throttle housing that's factory set only then we could properly diagnose that the idling issue was the idle control valve a long shot but worth a check
finally a video with a type 4 engine! I have been wanting to work on my 1972 bus all summer, but I haven't had the proper resources to learn from aside from the Bentley manual. I don't know where to start and hopefully this video will help!
Hopefully
Great show guys can you check fuel pressure and do a compression test ? Fuel pressure regulators and its vaccum line 👍😁
Don't pull it! Replace all vacuum lines. There is little "T" connecting under the alternator that may be where the leak is. Also the sweeper plate may need to be moved. Download the AFC pdf from the samba. You are going to need to check the resistor pack. Put a pressure gauge on the rail, drivers side permanently. I got a water pressure gauge from home depot and use a little piece of hose. Still cant rule out fuel pump. You will get it and be glad you did not replace it.
First I'll say that I'm a big fan of your channel and I love you guys. But as a VW FI guy, this was PAINFUL to watch! ;)
Carburetor guys always seem to forget everything they know and crack open the AFM first. Please don't do that. Diagnosing the AFM comes LAST.
Start out like it's a carbureted van: check valve gap, points, condenser, rotor, coil, spark, timing, and compression first. I hope you did these things.
Then go after fuel. You did that by spraying the throttle body and it started. OK let's go from there.
The Bosch L-Jet ECU and AFM do not perform a cold start alone. Cold starts involve three additional components: 1. Thermo Time Switch 2. Aux Air Regulator 3. Cold Start Valve (aka the fifth fuel injector on the throttle body). Read the Bentley Book and test those three things.
Fuel pressure, more injector testing, vacuum leaks, and the AFM can come later.
What time will you be here on Saturday 😜 we NEED some HELP! 🤣🤣
@@tommiesmith3369 That would be a great time for me! Work on VWs and grab a burger.
FYI - watch out spraying starter fluid, carb cleaner, or any kind of solvent when the cover is off the AFM. The resistive ink on the circuit can be damaged by many types of solvent. And don't grab the rotary arm inside the AFM to turn it. If you push down on the arm you might damage the resistive ink. Go to the intake air flap of the AFM, push on that to rotate the internal arm.
Are you a user on TheSamba? I'll connect you with the resident FI repair genius.
Vwlifevw@gmail.com
That's what I call a systematic approach to the problem. Point gap could be off, etc.
you must have control that you have constant fuel pressure and the nozzles should provide a nice shower mist
Almost looks like a vacuum issue. Check all the vacuum hoses for connections and leaks.
VW LIFE BABYYYYYY
I think your fuel pressure regulator might be bad. It's really important to have the proper fuel pressure. When you tested the injector, while they worked, there wasn't very much fuel coming out.
Part of the reason I think that is that having built Type 1 engines with CB Performance Gen 4 fuel injection, I can tell you when the fuel pressure is off it changes the air fuel ratio a lot. I think the fuel pressure regulator on this old Bosch fuel injection system is vacuum based, and you may have a vacuum leak keeping the fuel pressure low at idle, but getting enough as the RPM goes up, but not enough as it goes down.
The stream of fuel has to consistent, uniform.
With the LJetronic system you can't have ANY vacuum leaks. This includes intake hoses disconnected to get the air filters housing out of the way (seen this many times). Injector seals are often ignored and can be a huge leak. Also the original pintle style injectors love to stick closed if they sit for over a year. Haven't watched the video yet guys...just trying to offer advice. Been working on FI VWs since the 80s
Is there a diagnostic tool I can use for my 1976 T2 transporter?
@@jaimecueva121 Not specifically, no. An ohm meter/voltage tester and a fuel pressure tester are really all you need. As far as vacuum leaks, a smoke tester is the best.
5 minutes into the TH-cam I thought this is GREAT. They have the same problem like I have, running for a few seconds after it was of for a while. So I was quite disappointed when you finally gave up. BUT it pushed me to get going and I FINALLY found the problem. I went through many checks, a few twice or three times and found other issues. Finally I checked Ohm readings at the 35 pin ECU connector and measured the pin 13 to ground which is the head temperature sensor it was open. One side of the connector was 0 Ohm (pin 13 to that point) and the other infinity. The connector came easily apart, must have been all the wiggling of the nearby injectors. Connected it back and measured 5700 Ohm (it was colder than 68°F). Started up and it just ran like usual. I did one test drive and all fine. On a second test drive it died again and the problem was back. Since it was up the hill I first thought I might let the bus roll home, but then I thought that the connection was not good. I opened it from the top wiggled und pulled the two sides of the connector, and it ran again. At home I found the crimp connection to the harness not soldered (the other side I did some years earlier) so I tried to solder this side too. Very tricky, so I gave up and pressed that crimp hard with pliers. I hope the connection is now good. [There are still some little problems I can fix later like a vacuum leak at the break booster, but it runs good now.] Thanks again, you four guys giving up inspired me to look very systematic.
I have the utmost respect and admiration for you guys and your problem solving skills where it relates to " old time " V-dubs, but it appears you have met your match. Time to eat some humble pie and put in a call to Clyde's Buggies and inquire how to swap out that " ' ole time " foolie and fork out the pesos for one of their fancy fool injection harnesses and control module. We all know you are on teacher's pensions but Clyde is a good guy at makin the old FI pancakes run like a V2 rocket. . . . . . ' nuff said ! Just 1 question, Which one of you guys will be 1st to be buried in a Bug ?
Switched my 78 bay to carb. It was the best thing I ever did.
Well if we can't get this thing fixed we're definitely going that route
At least Cabo Bob's works!
You know, a set of Empi Carbs would look great on that bus.......
Do what Jake said… go with dual carburetors! I did on my 79 Westy, Weber 40s. I know carbs, I have no patience for vintage FI
Check the fuel retirn line. on FI vehicles is a thing, maybe its clogged
My 1975 westfalia camper never gave me a problem for a whole decade I owned it. I know very little about that engine because of that. The fuel injection was really well made. Did you check the fuel pump pressure?
Have you checked the aux air regulator, vacuum hoses?. There maybe crap stock in the lines that only throttling it can pull through?. Does this bus have an idle control resistor?, if it does, this maybe worth checking. The AFM must be fine seeing as you replaced it. Is there any corrosion on any earthing points?. Sorry I’m not much help. I just wish I was there. I don’t give up and would be there until 5AM if need be to get it running, I don’t let things beat me 😂😂😂
View #338 at 1:40 PM on 12/16/21 - NJ.....Check where the wiring harness connects to the computer and check board inside computer.
That L tronic injection is VERY sensitive to dirty grounds.
There is a fuel injector ground on the top middle of the motor.
What condition are your six vacuum hoses in? If any of these are perished then they will give you poor running issues. There are some good threads on thesamba in the baywindow section.
Too bad Carlos Jobe left the VW scene, he was a fuel injection guru. Another person I could contact is Andrew Hollaway, if you want me to, I can call him, see if he would be interested in dropping some info. Tommie: "again, I'm not a professional, but, I play one on TH-cam". BTW, my one attempt with FI, I had a Fastback and I ended up finding out that the FI computers can go bad just from sitting in our hot Texas sun! You guys RAWK!! #VWLIFE !!!
get a progressive kit for it, Now there is performance parts to hop it up .I think that on has a CW forged crank from factory????
Have you thought about the little electronic brain chip that controls the injectors?
Put some baby weber on!!
Do they run fuel filters? That may be blocked. Also soak the injectors for a few days immersed in injector cleaner if they can take it. Get rid of decades worth of sludge! Good luck guys
I watched your video to find out how to change the pressure regulator for the fuel system and you guys didn't even do it I got the same problem you got I went through all those things and that's what I'm doing
Yea- we never play with Fuel Injection so we are just winging it .. really a bunch of knuckle heads with a camera ..HAHA... Thanks, Tommie
Okay the problem with the fuel injectors of the 1978 Microbus. It is bad from Bostch injection maker. We need to create the 75 to 80 pound per sq. inch of gas pressure. So get special order from Holley and Accel design to recreate from Racing Volkswagen motorsport Probably from Racing Crew Daytona Nascar Volkswagen and Alfa Romeo in Daytona into the plain simple concept called fuel injection system for 4 cylinders engine of 1978 Mexicano 4 banger for Vanagon. Then your old injector was flooded the engine so it is why it not running right. Then make sure it is finely mist from each injector to stop the flood up and cause it to turn off engine performance. Once you get new prototype of your special order the fuel injection system of electronic ECM and plain home made wiring up and fuse box has to be reroute and you get it back to running the finest make engine 1978 Westfalia without the camper top.
It's squirting but it's not spraying should be a fine mist coming out of those in my humble opinion
Cold start solenoid?
Wow seriously failed nah just
Stumbled along the way.....
So it is back to the drawing
board & step by step until you
figure it out , don't be quitters
don't give up.& go boldly where
no v dub has gone before guys😀
There are a lot of things on the L-Jet system that can affect how it is running. Fuel pressure, vacuum leaks, throttle not adjusted properly, idle not adjusted properly, throttle position switch.
Get the L-Jet manual. It will help a lot.
Where do you get them?
@@jaimecueva121 look up the Bentley manual for your year and model.
Given the way you’re dressed, I’m assuming temperatures in Texas have dropped into the 70’s? 😅
Bazinga.. crazy the next day was shorts and swimming weather .. gotta love Austin weather!
I know you Texans are not cold weather people but I dress less than Jake when it's 30 degrees out. LOL
Temp sensor 2.......grounds under throttle body
Vacuum leak perhaps?
Idle speed and fuel mixture?
Gary just have been very unhappy by the way he said “let’s go eat” 😠
You guys tried alot of things to get it going. But it is a old system, Did you try replacing the computer, or the ignition switch? I tried to read up on the fi chapter in How to keep your VW alive. Three pages in made my brain hurt, and I went with a single progressive weber. Good luck guys. ✌
did you check the vacuum hose or you may have bad fuel injectors
Clogged UP fuelfilter or Lines