Hera's envy is peeking through, let's not ignore it. To delve deeper: Aphrodite, in her complete form, finds no sanctuary among us. Why? It seems we humans are torn about beauty - we yearn for it yet resent it simultaneously. It's not Aphrodite's flaw in her purity; rather, it’s our struggle to rise above our insecurities, pushing her toward an unfortunate fate. But, for those cloaked in the archetype of Hera, proudly declaring, “I’m not like 'that' girl... I value intelligence over beauty😉,” yet secretly desiring what they denounce, it's challenging to acknowledge this reality. We find ourselves compelled to make Aphrodite a scapegoat because, at our core, we struggle with the very essence of life. It becomes evident that we, as human beings, are in a constant battle with life itself. We are in fact unworthy of Aphrodite and all she represents.
45:05 "that you have some of the qualities of the archetype rather than the archetype having you." That feels wise to me, but I'll probably still have to contemplate it more. Thanks for the episode guys. I always find your conversations interesting.
There were a few things that Arlene said that left me feeling slightly agitated and I wonder why. First there is this unsubstantiated statement, that Artemis types are tragic, but she can't explain why. Her following statements are simply remarks based on their appearance, 'man-like khaki outfits', 'not wearing sunblock', 'shorts that are about 100 years old'. Sorry, What??😂 Aphrodite's values certainly underlie these judgements that come out in Arlene's choice of words (another amusing one is the description 'large but pretty') but I wonder if the reason that I'm so triggered is that I have more of the Virgin goddess archetypes represented in me. And that all the things I mentioned above are really just innocuous statements.
I also heard a lot of unsubstantiated statements. I give her credit for saying I don't know rather than making something up. But there were a lot of I don't knows!
Is the archetype of the hermit possibly more easily at play in the artemis woman, as in introversion and self-reliance run amuck? That's what I interpreted. Also -- re: on comment à la woman "not wearing sunblock", I have some insight I think: As girl in fashion-world as my day-to-day job, modelling and design -- it's well known ( I presume!?) that rigerous and daily application of SPF 50, even on dark & cloudy days, days spend indoors, when going out even at night (as lights even from light bulbs, your phone etc contain UVA or something in small amounts, which build up) -- is one of the leading causes of photosensitive aging, aka skin damage, or exterior skin aging. So I, almost immediately did think that this what she was elluding to --- as a model it's been easier to access aphrodite archetype versus artemis, on an more immediate level, and I think she mentioned this for herself was a part of her own self-conception. Basically, (I often forget this isn't like, a part of everyone's daily ritual as it is in the fashion industry?! ) -- in the interest of maintenance of one's physical veneer. Or perhaps in this case, surface level beauty, skin health & aging as visibly and or slowly as possible, is a major component of this for anyone who's image is directly related to either their conception of their self, in the Aphrodite archetypal aspect is in play or possession where beauty and maintance of such through grooming rituals (often v time & financially labourous and expensive..) are a priority as directly related to imaged or real degrees of social capital on the world "stage", as such. Also, where one's job, like mine, perhaps in the media or fashion, performing, arts anything moreso "out there" or body-oriented & image-concious etc AKA. is forward facing / audience / camera facing. SPF and other grooming rituals are a (draining!) and annoying but accepted part of living within this frame of reference, that I think especially living in Los Angeles, as she mentioned I can only imagine how much time she does, or I would spend wearing sunscreen. Context: I live in London, and I wear SPF 50 and reapply, regularly, and it's *never* bloody sunny here, comparatively ( ! ) Best and I hope that helps? XXJJ Josephine Jones.
"Somewhat agitated" is an understatement... My goodness, the very idea that BEAUTY (which is A COSMIC ARCHETYPE, just like NUMBERS, as in: not invented by humans, but DISCOVERED as EXISTING IDENTITIES) is being connected here with "the fashion industry" or with "advertising" is hilarious.... especially when talking about something that is ETERNAL and TIMELESS. Well, I will just briefly conclude with the informative statement that there are some interesting archetypes in the Bible's 'Book of Revelation'. ;-)
A lot to ponder over! I see a lot of male celebs wearing skirts these days, Brad Pitt, Harry Styles. But mostly I was thinking of Britney Spears- oversexualized as a teenager, and now that she is an adult she can't stop posting naked selfies. She lost custody of her kids, and now they are teenagers and publicly pleading to her to stop posting naked photos of herself, it's embarrassing for them. And in response she posted more naked selfies because it's her right as a woman to express herself as she wants. Sounds out of balance to me!
Why gender clothing looking ahead to a modern world? Liberation from prescriptive ornateness without the freedom of workwear, trousers and 'male-oriented' garments -- allowed for practicality and constellation of showing up in the world in a different, previously unthinkable manner. In a world where at present I see so much sadness and repression from men struggling to access their inner feminine. I think the rigidity of role as traditional, feels prescriptive in a way that attempts only to keep men in a box which I think they are, broadly realising is too small for the potential expression for a soul with any real edgy or in 2023 interest in clothing. Be it historical in the ancient world of the Greco-roman, Versailles' and Louis the 14th springs to mind -- modern day designers such as Charles Jeffery or Rick Owens and brands "edgier" to take on and champion the skirt as a silhouette with a developing archetype. Surely informed in recent years by the 1990s avant-garde of Commes des Garçons (translates literally 'Like the boys' in Japanese) and Yohji Yamamoto's influences. Bringing in the likes of designers such as Vivienne Westwood (R.I.P!)'s pirate collections and punk-y projections into modernity, it feels like a foreboding freedom in the unconscious to me. diaphanous stage-wear Fashion, clothing, textile is not art as such. However for me it is art and so much more. The numinous realm of fortune-telling using fabrics, embodying and being visible, showing up in the world and being the change you wish to see there. Ah... truly even to write of such things, makes my heart sing. in my experience fashion and clothing as always been about breaking boundaries, not enforcing them. conventionally discussionthese are simply 'clothes' in their simplest quintessences. aligned God you guys rock! Inspiring stuff. Josephine Jones XX
Amazing discussion. Thank you. Love to ALL WOMEN. Beauty is poisoned nowadays - big time. I find beautiful online natural real women not touched by needles or knifes.
It is difficult to tell whether a particular woman one is powerfully attracted to, is an "Aphrodite" or simply carries a powerful projection of my own anima. It may be impossible to tell. (I'm far from objective in such a matter.)
Hera's envy is peeking through, let's not ignore it.
To delve deeper: Aphrodite, in her complete form, finds no sanctuary among us. Why? It seems we humans are torn about beauty - we yearn for it yet resent it simultaneously. It's not Aphrodite's flaw in her purity; rather, it’s our struggle to rise above our insecurities, pushing her toward an unfortunate fate. But, for those cloaked in the archetype of Hera, proudly declaring, “I’m not like 'that' girl... I value intelligence over beauty😉,” yet secretly desiring what they denounce, it's challenging to acknowledge this reality. We find ourselves compelled to make Aphrodite a scapegoat because, at our core, we struggle with the very essence of life.
It becomes evident that we, as human beings, are in a constant battle with life itself. We are in fact unworthy of Aphrodite and all she represents.
so excited… I just signed up for dream school. I love this podcast and listen most nights. Thank you so much for providing this. 💛
45:05 "that you have some of the qualities of the archetype rather than the archetype having you." That feels wise to me, but I'll probably still have to contemplate it more. Thanks for the episode guys. I always find your conversations interesting.
There were a few things that Arlene said that left me feeling slightly agitated and I wonder why. First there is this unsubstantiated statement, that Artemis types are tragic, but she can't explain why. Her following statements are simply remarks based on their appearance, 'man-like khaki outfits', 'not wearing sunblock', 'shorts that are about 100 years old'. Sorry, What??😂 Aphrodite's values certainly underlie these judgements that come out in Arlene's choice of words (another amusing one is the description 'large but pretty') but I wonder if the reason that I'm so triggered is that I have more of the Virgin goddess archetypes represented in me. And that all the things I mentioned above are really just innocuous statements.
I also heard a lot of unsubstantiated statements. I give her credit for saying I don't know rather than making something up. But there were a lot of I don't knows!
Is the archetype of the hermit possibly more easily at play in the artemis woman, as in introversion and self-reliance run amuck? That's what I interpreted.
Also -- re: on comment à la woman "not wearing sunblock", I have some insight I think:
As girl in fashion-world as my day-to-day job, modelling and design -- it's well known ( I presume!?) that rigerous and daily application of SPF 50, even on dark & cloudy days, days spend indoors, when going out even at night (as lights even from light bulbs, your phone etc contain UVA or something in small amounts, which build up) -- is one of the leading causes of photosensitive aging, aka skin damage, or exterior skin aging.
So I, almost immediately did think that this what she was elluding to --- as a model it's been easier to access aphrodite archetype versus artemis, on an more immediate level, and I think she mentioned this for herself was a part of her own self-conception.
Basically, (I often forget this isn't like, a part of everyone's daily ritual as it is in the fashion industry?! ) -- in the interest of maintenance of one's physical veneer. Or perhaps in this case, surface level beauty, skin health & aging as visibly and or slowly as possible, is a major component of this for anyone who's image is directly related to either their conception of their self, in the Aphrodite archetypal aspect is in play or possession where beauty and maintance of such through grooming rituals (often v time & financially labourous and expensive..) are a priority as directly related to imaged or real degrees of social capital on the world "stage", as such.
Also, where one's job, like mine, perhaps in the media or fashion, performing, arts anything moreso "out there" or body-oriented & image-concious etc AKA. is forward facing / audience / camera facing.
SPF and other grooming rituals are a (draining!) and annoying but accepted part of living within this frame of reference, that I think especially living in Los Angeles, as she mentioned I can only imagine how much time she does, or I would spend wearing sunscreen.
Context: I live in London, and I wear SPF 50 and reapply, regularly, and it's *never* bloody sunny here, comparatively ( ! )
Best and I hope that helps?
XXJJ
Josephine Jones.
"Somewhat agitated" is an understatement... My goodness, the very idea that BEAUTY (which is A COSMIC ARCHETYPE, just like NUMBERS, as in: not invented by humans, but DISCOVERED as EXISTING IDENTITIES) is being connected here with "the fashion industry" or with "advertising" is hilarious.... especially when talking about something that is ETERNAL and TIMELESS. Well, I will just briefly conclude with the informative statement that there are some interesting archetypes in the Bible's 'Book of Revelation'. ;-)
I could imagine an Artemis type viewing the life of an Aphrodite as pathetic or tragic. It sounded rather defensive to me...
@@riveranalyse that’s the word, defensive. Indeed.
A lot to ponder over! I see a lot of male celebs wearing skirts these days, Brad Pitt, Harry Styles. But mostly I was thinking of Britney Spears- oversexualized as a teenager, and now that she is an adult she can't stop posting naked selfies. She lost custody of her kids, and now they are teenagers and publicly pleading to her to stop posting naked photos of herself, it's embarrassing for them. And in response she posted more naked selfies because it's her right as a woman to express herself as she wants. Sounds out of balance to me!
Why gender clothing looking ahead to a modern world? Liberation from prescriptive ornateness without the freedom of workwear, trousers and 'male-oriented' garments -- allowed for practicality and constellation of showing up in the world in a different, previously unthinkable manner.
In a world where at present I see so much sadness and repression from men struggling to access their inner feminine. I think the rigidity of role as traditional, feels prescriptive in a way that attempts only to keep men in a box which I think they are, broadly realising is too small for the potential expression for a soul with any real edgy or in 2023 interest in clothing.
Be it historical in the ancient world of the Greco-roman, Versailles' and Louis the 14th springs to mind -- modern day designers such as Charles Jeffery or Rick Owens and brands "edgier" to take on and champion the skirt as a silhouette with a developing archetype. Surely informed in recent years by the 1990s avant-garde of Commes des Garçons (translates literally 'Like the boys' in Japanese) and Yohji Yamamoto's influences. Bringing in the likes of designers such as Vivienne Westwood (R.I.P!)'s pirate collections and punk-y projections into modernity, it feels like a foreboding freedom in the unconscious to me.
diaphanous
stage-wear
Fashion, clothing, textile is not art as such. However for me it is art and so much more. The numinous realm of fortune-telling using fabrics, embodying and being visible, showing up in the world and being the change you wish to see there. Ah... truly even to write of such things, makes my heart sing.
in my experience fashion and clothing as always been about breaking boundaries, not enforcing them.
conventionally
discussionthese are simply 'clothes' in their simplest quintessences.
aligned
God you guys rock! Inspiring stuff.
Josephine Jones
XX
@@josephinejones9392 lol whut?
@@user-fm9jx1kl2e :(
Amazing discussion. Thank you. Love to ALL WOMEN. Beauty is poisoned nowadays - big time. I find beautiful online natural real women not touched by needles or knifes.
It is difficult to tell whether a particular woman one is powerfully attracted to, is an "Aphrodite" or simply carries a powerful projection of my own anima. It may be impossible to tell. (I'm far from objective in such a matter.)
✨️💖✨️
Everything was going perfect until Michelle Obama or H.Clinton were portrayed as Hera archetypes... *maybe a shadow archetype