There are yank videos far inferior to this that have ten million views. TH-cam is strange, sometimes. This one is pure gold for me. Exactly what I want to see from a practical military history video.
Grendel, I fired a Bren from the shoulder on a walk through range in the late sixties and scored a good grouping and I only weighed under Ten stone in those days ,
@@terry9325 All Ten stone British Bulldog infantry man would be capable firing a GPMG from the shoulder but to get a good grouping you definitely need a Bren Gun - th-cam.com/video/o9kI-aUZrdE/w-d-xo.html
I was once told by an old squaddie that a really good Bren gunner could send messages to a squad in open order by firing prearranged burst of fire and intervals. Great video.
The British were and still are incredible warriors. I did some training with the Royal Marines while in the US Marine Corps and have to say I'm glad we are strong allies. The Royal Marines were incredibly sharp and clever and we developed a strong respect for each other. Cheers to a strong alliance between our countries, despite our differences and early history the world is a better place when we can work hand in hand.
@@jackduncan5311 The French and the British declared war on the same day in order to defend the independence of Poland. When French and British people fight alongside one another for other people's rights, you know its serious.
Indian army still uses the 1B Bren gun in pintle mounts of vehicles, as well as as an LMG. It's the 7.62 NATO version. Although it is being replaced by FN MAG, the troops had high praise for it during the Kargil conflict, specially it's reliability, magazines and relative light weight. It is usually the gun mounted in vehicles in yellow or green zones i.e where security needs to be high, although the chances of a conflict is pretty less.
Timor uses Brens as Australia gave them ( I think around 20 000? I forget exact number could be half no idea but substantial stock) in 7.62. Often see them being used in patrols along the border
I think it was a mistake to retire it, there was nothing wrong with it and then they had to introduce the SAW for Afghanistan which turned out to be inferior, lacking range and accuracy. What the Bren needed was a modern material upgrade.
@@SvenTviking Yes entirely agree. They could have mounted a scope on it for more accuracy too - i think the early mks had a bracket to mount a scope ( but never did) so it hsd potential there and was inherently accurate anyway. Opportunity lost i'd say.
My friend great grandfather was a lewis gun oporator with the Gloucestershire regiment during ww1 and when he came home and ww2 kicked off his son enlisted in the Gloucestershire regiment and became a bren bren gun oporator during africa and France during ww2
Cheers again. Really opened my eyes to how effective this gun is both in design, and the way it was used in the section. Mobile, quick to deploy, and ammo distribution amongst the section without impeding fighting effectiveness. This makes me conclude that at least up until late war, the British infantry section has been highly under-rated.
its worth noting that the USMC have introduced a weapon that is somewhat similar in concept, the M27 IAR, as a one for one replacement for one of the M249/FN Minimi in a fire team, for pretty much these reasons., The underlaying logic is still basically sound,
But-but weapons don't matter in warfare! It's all about the flag officers, haven't you ever read a history book!?!? Would General So-and-So beat General Smith? Now THAT'S a fascinating question. I used to be into military history until I realized that it was mostly flag officer-worshipping crap, as though they determine the outcome of battles/wars to the exclusion of absolutely everything else. Good weapons, good equipment, good tactics, the leadership/aptitude of junior officers, and frequent training in/with them wins wars, not some general pushing division markers around a map from his chatau command post. "Operational" success is nothing more than the aggregate success of "small", "insignificant" units.
@@xerxeskingofking yes and no. That was how they marketed it. In reality, they used it to replace their M4s and use the M27 IAR as the general issued rifle. Check out their latest squad organisation and equipment: 13 dudes, all have M27 IAR plus and one of then has a quad copter. Overall, the USMC now moved to long-range weapon platforms like rocket artillery, land-based anti-ship missiles instead of infantry and ground direct fire weapons. They even want to get rid of tube artillery and tanks.
Fascinating detail given here, fills in some blanks for me. My dad carried a Bren for the D-Day landing. Over the years he mentioned the practicality and deadly accuracy of the weapon and other stuff about his particular section that makes a lot more sense now. Thought he said the weapon weighed around 21lb, had not appreciated the weight of the individual magazines.Thank you so much for the detail of how a section functioned late WW2.
@@sergentcolon1 Thank you, my farther served in Burma though he died in the mid eighties I was only in my early teens. He didn't say much about his time there beyond putting across it was far from enjoyable. Though I feel most people who've seen war are happy never to see it again, cheers however and all the best.
I actually own a Bren magazine pouch that i bought from a surplus store (for the purpose of storing other things). I had no idea it was so associated with such an amazing weapon. Great upload!
Used one of these in the cadets, many moons ago. I remember the range sergeant saying the way to get ideal bursts was to think "fish and chips" as fast as possible while squeezing the trigger. Seem to remember it worked quite well....
What we used to call "double tapping". we were supposed to fire 2 or 3 round bursts on our personal weapons tests with the LMG, I still often managed to fire single shot in full automatic. As a Sapper who had the LMG as my personal weapon when we were dismounted I would have a mag on and 5 mags in my ammo pouches (the weapon was not made ready though due to the risk of releasing the bolt accidentally). My number 2 (usually the section 2 i/c would carry the other 6 mags (or split them around the section a bit). When mounted or in a defensive position with our vehicles we had a steel box which held all 12 magazines.
always love your vids, I trained on the bren a youngster in the cadets in the early 80's, one thing I can remember was being taught to rock back and fore taking note of how the foresight rose and fell - if it was vertical all was good- if it moved diagonally your position was wrong and needed adjusting, a quick remedy if your strong enough was to briefly lift the front end high enough for the bipod to clear the deck with your free hand keepng it shouldered with a hold of the pistol grip and plonk it back down and check again - this technique put me in good stead when i enlisted a few years later when using the gpmg
I also trained on the old .303 Bren as an army cadet in the 1970’s. My most vivid recollection of firing it on the MOD ranges at Gravesend was absolute agony as the hot spent cases ejected out of the underside of the gun, then rolled down the earth embankment of the firing point and collected inside the sleeve of my combat jacket. Hurt like hell 🤣
Something we were taught when firing the Bren was to use the first two spent cartridges and stake them into the ground through the holes in the feet of the bipod. That helped to limit movement. Probablt not practical in 'action' but handy on the ranges. Great video and thanks
@Alexander Challis that's not true. Lmg isn't for beaten zone, that's mmg. Lmg is for suppression which as testing has proven time and time again, it's best done by accurate fire. Which is exactly why the bren was so effective and despite the fearsome reputation of the mg 42 you had to have 8 guys constantly running ammo for it and only one for bren.
Yeah, that was pretty funny. What did the other guys have? A pellet gun? th-cam.com/video/4yQeyi2Fc40/w-d-xo.html th-cam.com/video/3FpO3_60GJo/w-d-xo.html .
I do wonder if there were to be a second series of ‘Project Lightening’ whether the Bren would come out on top. I suspect it would be down to the challenges selected for trial.
@@truckerallikatuk As an LMG yes, of course it's better. The BAR was not designed as an LMG; it's an automatic rifle. The comparison between Bren and BAR as LMGs is apples and oranges. Ian covered this with Othias and Mae in Project Lightening.
@@mannys9130 ...yes, we know; the whole 'walking fire' thing turned out to be every bit as optimistically dumb as it sounds, so they had to make up another reason to justify keeping these expensive ass, heavy, mediocre long guns...
My late dad's friend and comrade in the local militia pre- WW2, Jimmy Doohan who much later becme "Scotty" in the original Star Trek was hit by a burst from a Bren on D-Day. (from an over excited sentry ...friendly fire : (
As a Brit, I can appreciate the Garand, excellent rifle and would love to give one a go. But I can't for the life of me appreciate the WWII BAR. You had a great idea with the M1918, why couldn't you just simplify it? You had to give it a fast and slow automatic mode, what did you think it was, a car?
@@djwoody1649 In their defense, they were trying to solve some of the problems of the 1918 but went about it the wrong way. The bipod was a definite improvement even though it suck, but they screwed almost everything else up by trying to improve it. They should have basically just taken a Colt Monitor and try to figure out a to make the mags bigger like a half drum
@@djwoody1649 To my knowledge (mainly Forgotten Weapons and C&Rsenal, including Project Lightening): The bipod was better than no bipod, the full auto was too fast but semi isn't quite right, the sights were an attempt to make it more accurate, and the "wings" were an attempt make reloading a bit better. They were good reasons but not executed well.
@@djwoody1649 The Americans would have done well to listen to their Southern neighbours, and take a leaf out of the Mexicans' book. The Mendoza LMG was basically a BAR turned upside-down to feed from the top, like a Bren, with a proper bipod and a removable barrel. That could have given the Americans a gun in the ZB-26/Bren/V-B/Type 96 class in .30-06 with little trouble.
This was always my favourite weapon, used it as a cadet in 0.303" between 1980 and 83, then as a regular soldier (Sapper) in 7.62mm from 83 to 1991 when we got our SA80's (it was my personal weapon and I put serious amounts of rounds though them until I got my L86). We had steel boxes containing 12 magazines for each weapon and a monopod for AA use (which was next to useless).
@@erica3456 I first got my hands on the L86 when I was attached to the RS as Sapper support in 1985 (they were pretty much the first to get the SA80). As a direct comparison I liked LSW - more accurate than the LMG (tend to think of it more as what is now called the DMR, able to hit accurately out to a longer range than the rifle), much lighter (I could fire it standing from the shoulder), as a Sapper I also got a SUSAT sight while the rifles just had iron sights. It had that shiney new toy factor as well. By the time I got mine the initial bad faults had been fixed (at least the ones the RS told us about - no magazine release catch guard, plastic buttons breaking). For us is was a one for one swap for our LMG's, we kept our GPMG's on our Spartans, we never got a mount for our FV 432's or Sultans though for the L86. Us and the Infantry did not agree with replacing the GPMG in infantry dismounted sections with two L86 though (they kept the GPMG in their L37 turrets on the 432's, while others with Warrior had the Rarden and chaingun mounted).
@@andrewjohnston4127 I got issued SLR and LMG in Berlin 93 to 94 when I was there as a Sapper in the Military Works Force. The old gat's hung around for quite a while
I drove an FV432 in the Gulf War, 1991. We still had an L4A1 LMG mounted on the commander's cupola, although we also got a GPMG for use dismounted (we never had them beforehand). The LMG we had was originally manufactured in 1944 as a BREN, with that designation struck out (====) and the 7.62mm L4A1 details etched/stamped/engraved below. We deployed with SLR too. Up until about 1993/1994 the guardroom at Brompton Barracks had a mixed "fleet" of L85A1s (for those on courses from units with them) and SLRs for those who had yet to swap over. Mainly because the RSME didn't have time during trade courses to teach a whole new weapon system just to post Sappers on the guard shift for a week or two out of nine months or so. When I was posted out to 3 Field Squadron from 1RSME my SSM was horrified on my first APWT when I told him I had never even held an "SA80" before and I was hurriedly taken aside and put through a crash course on a range at Bulford while everyone else was put through their paces. No pressure when you're last up and everyone else just wants to pack up and get weapons cleaned and back into the armoury...
Those utility pouches were commonly seen at gun shows in the US during the 70s and 80s. I bought a couple for $1 a piece, used them for carrying extra gear strapped to the side of my Alice ruck. Long worn out - they are so useful that I am not surprised they have become rare. They wore out.
In the seventies and you were not in an infantry regiment, we received the L.M.G. which was a Bren gun converted to fire 7.62mm - I used to be in the Army Cadets before joining in 71 and was damn good with our non-firing 'proper' Bren guns as I could strip it quite quickly. When my turn came in my basic tests the Sgt Instructor (Permanent Staff) was really surprised at how quickly I could get it down to the basics and then do the same with my S.L.R. ..... I was a terrible shot at long range with the SLR but damned good with the L.M.G.
Nice video , thanks!!! Techn. notice: The Bren gun was a licensed version of the Czechoslovak ZGB 33 light machine gun which, in turn, was a modified version of the ZB vz. 26, which British Army officials had tested during a firearms service competition in the 1930s. The name Bren was derived from Brno, the Czechoslovak city in Moravia, where the Zb vz. 26 was designed (in the Zbrojovka Brno Factory) and Enfield, site of the British Royal Small Arms Factory. The designer was Václav Holek, a gun inventor and design engineer.
Thank You for this very detailed video! This is brilliant for my talks on the Bren Gun and rifles at WW2 shows especially when the school children come round.
Here here. Crawling through the Aussie bush with an F89 Minimi the belt would just draw grass and other crap right into the gun jamming it. Especially if you didn't have the magazine pouch.
@@HelloNurse678 At least there was nothing hanging from the other side of the gun, unlike in the vz.59 case that has non-disintegrating belt what makes it even worse. :-)
@@HelloNurse678 I can only speak of my experience with the C9A2 (Canadian Minimi) but our belts always came from the factory in plastic boxes that attached to the LMG held 200rds. There wasn't really any excuse to have a belt hanging loosely. The C6 (FN MAG) on the other hand didn't have that luxury so you had to be careful with the loose belts.
One tiny detail I just thought of is that if the Bren gunner carried it with a magazine in the gun, it means that they could have one more magazine (4 in pouches, plus 1 in the gun) on themselves than carrying by the handle and being all safety-conscious without a magazine (4 mags in pouches only). More ammo plus gun ready to fire equals better.
Only when you're shooting. Unfortunately you spend a lot more time being 'embuggered' with the gun and the things that make it go bang, than you do shooting it. Not a lot of fun, when you are trudging through the countryside.
I'm sure mags were carried anywhere, like GPMG belts were put down front of combat jackets,not safest but in combat,what is.Cowboy's carried them Bandolier style,where they got dirty.Very frowned upon.
It is hardly a surprise that this weapon remained in use for as long as it did with the British and commonwealth countries. A very beautiful weapon that might even hold its own today under certain circumstances.
Aistralia gave a heap to Timore in 7.62, sadly. No bemoan8ng Timor having them. Bemoaning Australia finaly getting rid of them. Interesting about 4 mag limit for one guy to carry. Back when we had SLR stil the standard was 4 but at point of signing out of aurmory for excercises 4 were offered often followed by do you want more. Same with 20rd SLR, 4, but on average I'd say guys who were serious carried 6 to 8 of each. Personaly I'd take 6 30s 2x 20 as I owned personaly 6x30 for my privately owned SLR at the time
@@CharlesvanDijk-ir6bl In the uk, cadets can shoot 7.62 target rifles still, as well as the 5.56 GP rifle. Most of the guys I knew liked the bigger stuff
I used to shoot .303 Lee Enfields in the rifle team at school as part of our CCF but never received any posture training, though slowly letting your breath out as you waited for the 'second pull' to fire the rifle was taught. After one shot with that powerful recoil one instinctively splays one's legs out for support without any instruction! Great video BOTR, thanks.
Being a Marksman(highest grade) in the Sproc(Public schoolboy speak for Corps) and in our shooting team, we shot at Bisley often, and at smaller ranges around Herts and Bucks, I got to command the Bren Gun section in our Platoon and Company manoeuvres on Sailsbury Plain with the regulars. One of the sixth formers actually got to fire it and, as stated in this vid, the rest of us carried ammo and a rifle sharing the same 303 cal. shells. Same Battle Dress, but we also had a Jungle Green smock and pants with the same webbing. I still remember the smell of Blanco and Duraglit and those Boots that we polished with a hot spoon and spit. Hated school, loved the Sproc. Actually it is all in the cult classic film "IF" which was shot at Aldenham and Cheltenham in which I appeared with all my school chums. Thanks for the vid. Very informative. PS why were there those strange spike bayonets as well as the more traditional long flat bladed ones? Anyone?
Hey Bloke on the Range, nice to see the 49th Polar Bears getting some love via your uniform choice! My granddad's unit replaced 6DWR in the line at the Caen sector after Epsom in 1944. Great video and love from Australia!
As an Army Cadet in Australia in the 1970s we were all taught to operate the LMG (Bren). The biggest or strongest bloke carried it but we could all field strip, reassemble (blindfolded) troubleshoot and operate the Bren. We LOVED it. We did NOT love 'The Pig' (M60 GPMG) which we got in the CMF. I have a soft spot for the L1A1 SLR not the select fire folly that came out just before I left.
In the 1970s i joined the Asia Gun Club and went to mainland china to shoot. One of the weapons i fired was a bren gun converted to 7.62x39. It was very interesting... Thanks for video!
One advantage of the Bren over the BAR is that the magazine was top loaded, much easier to change than the under loaded BAR. Rapid barrel change if overheating was another plus.
The only thing you need to get is a set of WWII frame glasses. Other than that, it was interesting how the uniform work as you were doing some shooting. In reading on the uniform, in there hast to get ready for the war, thee where some shortcoming in the way the pack and other equipment was mounted.
If you fit a correct sling then there is a way to use the sling as a shoot from the hip aid; makes it really easy to shoot and accurate. Can carry on patrol for hours that way. Same done for the GPMG which was heavier still. Sling goes: head through the middle and right arm, the weight carried on the left shoulder. Then wind right arm around and hand on the pistol grip. The upper right arm kind of semi wound on the sling. If the sling is the right length then the gun lying flat gets jammed at waste level; so very stable. Keeps the vids coming. From a fellow Anglo Swiss.
As a 1980s British Army soldier who trained on the updated version of this weapon extensively.13.01. FAIL! always cock the weapon before changing the magazine.
Used one of these in army cadets and carried it on exercise several times as i didn't mind the weight. I'd have no problem going into war with one. Superb bit of kit.
In the Canadian Army, I just missed out on the Bren as we had just converted to the FN C1 and C2. My Section Commander still called the C2 “the Bren” long after it was retired, guess old habits die hard. I never did get to fire the Bren, you’re one lucky bloke. Mind you, we still did have a few Lee Enfield No.4s until we got our full compliment of C1s.
In Canada in my regiments museum we’ve got a jacket made specifically for carrying Bren mags on D-Day and other amphibious landings. It’s really interesting and if want to make the trip across the pond I’d be more than willing to show it too you and other things that I think you’d find interesting in our museum
My Dad shot Lee Enfield alongside a Bren Gunner in Army target competition. He said it was one shot marker from the Lee and bursts of three from the Bren. He told of getting bollockings from the markers in the pits for shooting the marking circle as they raised it over the target during practice periods! He just missed out on shooting at Bisley because he was transferred to Carlisle.
Fired Bren in .303 in the Cadets in the 70s. Later in 7.62 when I was in the TA. I was always taught to load a .303 magazine with 28 rounds, not 30, as the magazine spring was not overly powerful and caused jamming problems, especially with older magazines. This from the Officers who had fought in WW2.
Thanks for a great video. This was something I thought of when I viewed "Project Lightening" by MaeOthIan (C&Rsenal and Forgotten Weapons). They had a modern firing position and complained that some guns bounced all over the place. I noted this because I have always been taught to lay in a straight line behind the GPMG (I have no experience with LMGs). Perhaps some of them would have performed or appeared a bit better if they had fired them like you shoot that BREN.
Indian army loves these machine guns so much that they still use it to this day... lot's of history with this gun and Indian armed forces..WW2, 47war, 63war, 65war, 68 skirmish, 72war, sri lanka operations, kashmir incursions, 99war, and so on.
I the seventies with the 7.62 version we were more parsimonious with fire rate at three round bursts to chant of one oh one. We were also encouraged to use a slightly splayed leg position because the weapon pushed back. The German Spandau you used with toes together dug in because that would tow you down the range. Most interesting to see how matters changed over time. No need to change the barrel so regularly either.
I remember in the late nineteen seventies we were issued with the 7.62 conversion they were re built world war 2 versions they were then taken back into storage as the first mag started to replace our old m60 the m60s were just about worn out having been used extensively in Vietnam.
So ... no mention of barrel changes? As a cadet in the early 80s (Bren .303 ... at school!!!) and OTC pleb in the late 80s/early 90s (LMG 7.62) we always had to replace the barrel after a few mags (too old to remember how many but it might have been 4)
And everyone else? Probably the most important pair in the Section. The First and Second Scouts. Unencumbered (without packs) soldiers who probed ahead of the Section while in movement to contact with the enemy. The Second Scout carried an SMLE and the First carried the Section's other SMG. When contact is established, they formed their own distinct maneuver element. Very often, these guys were used to put flanking fire on enemy positions.
You gotta be the most rare person to find in the UK right now you like guns your knowledgeable about firearms and history and your nether far left nor far right by us standards hats off to you
I was taught to handle this weapon a great many years ago. We were always taught to spread our legs and roll our heels inward to the ground. Small point, I know, but apparently important in reducing the profile of the gunner.
Love the Bren. My father used it once in Suez crisis in the Royal Marines. Said it fired like a sowing machine. (Not a type of stitching id like for myself to be honest!)
Thank you. When I first trained on the LMG version of this, the No. 2 replaced the magazines as you demonstrate. Around about 1976 the drill changed, and I was bawled at on the range because the No. 2 now had to fire his rifle while the No.1 reloaded (and lost his point of aim in the process). I felt really annoyed!
I am minded by a film -- A Hill in Korea --- c1956 (?) A scene with a battery of brens. (it also had a v. early Michael Cain performance. He actually was in Korea in real life, which perhaps helped him get the small part. (did a lot of people know that?)
Interesting detail with the later 7.62 NATO bren (the L4) they milled out the magazine well so it could accept SLR mags. Makes sense when you consider the compatibility with the rifleman’s SLR and the previous doctrine that everyone would carry some mags for the squad machine gun
58 PTN webbing large pack has two side pouches, for Bren Mags, per Rfn. Left side 58 Ammo Pouch for Bren, right side ammo pouch for .303 charger clips. Later x SLR Mags in both left & Right, whilst 2 Bren mags OR SLR mags in large pack side pouches.
Happened to fire the Bren. First thing when firing on the range, you use the shells of the the 303 rounds on the bi pod to keep it steady, put them into holes on bipod into the ground. Not very practical if moving in combat but always the trick used on the range. The other big thing they teach you is never put your hand under the gun. when firing a rifle typical thing to do but if you dont put your hand over the stock with the Bren, you are going to have a sore hand. It's unbelievable accurate. At 300 yards, you go from hitting magpies and outers with a rifle to hitting bulls or inners on every shot.
I'll need to take a look and see if the Australians made any changes to their tactical implementation of the Bren gun after they reorganised their sections for jungle fighting in 1943. The order of personal kit changed as well as two rifles in a section being switched to Owen Machine Carbines
Speaking of personal kit, The combined service museum in Maldon has a very good collection ofAustralian jungle fighting knives , mostly custom made , mean looking weapons!
My Dad always said that they would avoid automatic fire with the Bren, because that would get you mortared. Also, that if you need to dismantle something, always do it on the kitchen table when the family are out somewhere. Then you could get in trouble when they come back and not really know why.
(2:55) later during the war (after 1941), the Germans redistributed the ammo between all soldiers equally. They didn't have magazines though - canisters or 50-round 'drums' (actually smaller canisters), and even belts directly, if the latter were lost.
Although an American, I absolutely love the WW2 British uniform. It’s smart, fierce and friendly looking all at once. Like a nattily turned out Boy Scout with a Fairborn-Sykes knife.
I imagine that following their first contact the survivors carried their Brens ready to go from that point on and retrained new starts as such despite pamphlet doctrine... Shot both .303 and 7.62Nato versions. When army cadets were allowed such things. GOOD FUN!!!!
I recall reading somewhere a couple of years back, a memoire looking back at a battle fought in Normandy. British infantry and a number of Shermans were cut to shreds, with a huge loss of life, but the few dozen survivors were refused permission to withdraw (Needed as the infantry "screen" to protect the armour in the event of a counterattack - it was mainly a tank battle) The surviving Infantry scoured the battlefield, and picked up as many BRENS and Mags as they could recover. Which worked out as more than one functioning BREN for each of them, and vast amounts of full magazines. The subsequent German advance - by infantry - was held off by withering fire from several dozen BREN guns. All I recall about the battle/skirmish is that it took place on a hillside somewhere near Caen, and marked an attempt by Monty to break out. M4 Shermans against Panthers...
Hill 112 sounds very plausible, although I'm unable to find any supporting evidence. The more I think about it, the more I wonder if perhaps I'm remembering an episode from a TV documentary series about great tank battles.Whatever, I'm sure it was near Caen and sure that surviving troops (according to theor wn account) scoured the battlefield for discarded and abandoned Bren guns, equipping themselves with one Bren per soldier. Research suggests that perhaps it was Churchills against Tigers, rather than Shermans against Panthers...?
We're going to do a look at reloading 28rd mags vs 48rd belts (cos that's really the comparison in the light role - German belts often ended up downloaded by 2 rounds due to lost or damaged starter tabs). I suspect that mags might end up being faster overall in practice - basically more frequent but quicker reloads, being able to keep the gun up.
@@BlokeontheRange Eh ... I would not exclude those 250 rd. cans of ammo from the test. You couldn't hook them onto the side of something like you could if it was mounted on a tripod but you really had some sustained fire power there and the A-Gunner would only have to load it once unless you moved. Might be worth including in the evaluation just to see how it worked out. Of course - to be a fair evaluation - you are actually going to have to train yourselves to a level of real competence. That's why most of these alleged "tests" on the web are bull shit. Someone in the military who is trained to operate a specific weapon is in fact a Trained Professional - and can be really good at what he does, something very hard to include in an amateur test. Of course ... IRL ... you start running into money problems actually firing machine guns if you're not in the military and have to pay for that ammo yourself ... I don't know what a 250 rd. can of ammo would cost. .
My father did national service after Korea 1950s was good on the bren won his battalion yep I flew 1985 with the mirage did my time loved every minute of it!! Lol Cathy & I spent alot of time relocating to places Malaysia got to home for her & our son! Lol things were better back @ Williamtown nsw all good at least I could get red rooster!!!
The weapon that won the battle for New Guinea. As an old Australian BREN gunner in 3RAR early 60s & later an armorer, probably the most reliable section machinegun to this day.Ok a bit heavy but the ruggedness beat the shit out of the shitbox US M60 that replaced it, that we were stuck with in Vietnam.Sorry I was not there.Nothing NOTHING sounds like a 303 BREN.Love it.
Each Bren was issued with two barrels, to be switched as the one in use became too hot. Many years ago, I knew someone who had served as a Bren gunner in the Korean War. He and his No. 2 had acquired (or to be more honest, stolen) a third barrel. They cursed the extra weight while lugging it around, but that third barrel saved their lives on a number of occasions, because the Chinese troops they often faced knew that a Bren had two barrels and they used tactics intended to cause the Bren team to fire until both barrels were too hot. The third barrel gave them an unpleasant surprise.
You can't get cook-offs on an open-bolt gun since a round is only in the chamber for a tiny fraction of a second before it is fired. Unless it jams, of course, which is a different matter.
What was the model I used in 1965ish with the ATC - it had a "drum" sight (easy to switch ranges) but was still .303 (with all the pain of loading rimmed rounds into the magazine)? Best, Pete.
@@Legitpenguins99 In general fully automatic weapons are illegal in Switzerland. However, with a special permit from your state (and not all states issue such permits) you can own fullauto weapons. There are quite a few requirements you have to fullfil that you are granted such a special permit plus of course strict rules for use and storage apply.
@@Legitpenguins99 yes, but owning full-auto weapons isn't really the issue - shooting them, or anything else, is. one thing I always envy the Americans is their ability to seemingly go out into the woods and shoot their heart out. if I did that here I'd be arrested or possibly even shot. AFAIK, there is only one range in Switzerland that allows full-auto weapons, and it's in the middle of nowhere in the German side.
I did basic training with the LMG whist in the REME 1973. I loved firing it almost as much as the SMG. Stripping and cleaning a piece of cake, barrel changes really quick. The only con I seem to remember being taught was that it was too accurate for suppression - shooting the same enemy more than once with a 7.62 was a waste of ammo, so in some instances the barrels were loosened to provide a greater spread of rounds, or worn barrels were preferred for the same reason. I don't know how true that is though; still a lightweight monster!
"too accurate for suppession" is such a dumb trope, particularly as the full auto spread on a BREN is wider than on a Vickers according to the pam anyway...
@@BlokeontheRange May well be but it's what was going around at the time when I was in the Army. I only ever fired the LMG on 3 -5 burst auto at Figure 11's and found it extremely accurate and a joy to fire so cannot really say through personal experience as to it's effectivity at suppressive fire. Plenty of interesting articles in the wild, some of which may be conjecture - www.quora.com/Is-it-true-that-the-British-Army-Bren-gun-was-too-accurate-to-be-effective-as-a-light-machine-gun www.historynet.com/the-bloody-accurate-bren.htm en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3ABren_light_machine_gun
@@BlokeontheRange This will be my last post on this channel. Bloke on the Range obviously doesn't like criticism and his replies don't invite friendly discussion, so goodbye and good luck with your channel and any chance of me supporting you on Patreon!
In the book the fighting 52nd there's a passage on a Bren gunner (sgt) being asked to take out a German officer crawling along a ditch the only part of said officer was his backside which the gunner obligingly put a single round through the German complimented the sergeant on his marksmanship.
After WW2 a scrap steel dealer was given the contract to deactivate BRENS. The workers in the scrap yard used torches to cut the guns. One fellow might cut the barrel and the other guy the breech. My Dad said " anyone who was overseas knew that any BREN could us any barrel," so a lot of BRENS were purchased by vets, one with the good bar the other with the good breech.
great video, thankyou for taking the time and energy to make it. as an aside, I'm amazed at the amount of trolls and stupid comments you have collected with it. for you next collaboration with Rob, maybe see if the Movie Armament Group, that ian mccollum has worked with, have a Lewis? :D
No.2 also carried the spare barrel, cos, as you can see the fired barrel gets hot very quickly and can cause a jam. You would load a tracer round third into the magazine to warn you of expired load.
That rug really tied the room together, did it not?
That is a nice rug
Mark it an 8
Dude....
@OggyAlso Dude, Chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature. Asian American please...
Oh Daniel
And here I thought that every infantry section carried a longbow.
Kidding. Nice video, Bloke.
Naw, that was just Jack
As late as the 1700s some 'scholars of the destructive arts' thought that the longbow should be issued to a part of the army.
There are yank videos far inferior to this that have ten million views. TH-cam is strange, sometimes. This one is pure gold for me. Exactly what I want to see from a practical military history video.
I once worked with an enormous Yorkshireman from the 13th/18th Royal Hussars whose party trick was to fire a Bren from the shoulder.
Grendel, I fired a Bren from the shoulder on a walk through range in the late sixties and scored a good grouping and I only weighed under Ten stone in those days ,
@@terry9325 All Ten stone British Bulldog infantry man would be capable firing a GPMG from the shoulder but to get a good grouping you definitely need a Bren Gun -
th-cam.com/video/o9kI-aUZrdE/w-d-xo.html
I was once told by an old squaddie that a really good Bren gunner could send messages to a squad in open order by firing prearranged burst of fire and intervals. Great video.
The British were and still are incredible warriors. I did some training with the Royal Marines while in the US Marine Corps and have to say I'm glad we are strong allies. The Royal Marines were incredibly sharp and clever and we developed a strong respect for each other. Cheers to a strong alliance between our countries, despite our differences and early history the world is a better place when we can work hand in hand.
Your very welcome in northern Australia as well.
Here here, the common wealth and the USA will always have a special place in my heart.
@@jackduncan5311 The French and the British declared war on the same day in order to defend the independence of Poland. When French and British people fight alongside one another for other people's rights, you know its serious.
Royal marines will take heads off if prompted tho 😂
Yes we all witnesed how you two made a World a better place from korea,Vietnam,Iraq,Afganistan,Yugoslavia etc.What an WASP imperialist bullshit!
Indian army still uses the 1B Bren gun in pintle mounts of vehicles, as well as as an LMG. It's the 7.62 NATO version. Although it is being replaced by FN MAG, the troops had high praise for it during the Kargil conflict, specially it's reliability, magazines and relative light weight. It is usually the gun mounted in vehicles in yellow or green zones i.e where security needs to be high, although the chances of a conflict is pretty less.
Timor uses Brens as Australia gave them ( I think around 20 000? I forget exact number could be half no idea but substantial stock) in 7.62. Often see them being used in patrols along the border
The Czechs still use a version of it as well. Makes a very strange noise
@@Ukraineaissance2014 because its czech gun!
I think it was a mistake to retire it, there was nothing wrong with it and then they had to introduce the SAW for Afghanistan which turned out to be inferior, lacking range and accuracy. What the Bren needed was a modern material upgrade.
@@SvenTviking Yes entirely agree. They could have mounted a scope on it for more accuracy too - i think the early mks had a bracket to mount a scope ( but never did) so it hsd potential there and was inherently accurate anyway. Opportunity lost i'd say.
My friend great grandfather was a lewis gun oporator with the Gloucestershire regiment during ww1 and when he came home and ww2 kicked off his son enlisted in the Gloucestershire regiment and became a bren bren gun oporator during africa and France during ww2
"That's my boy."
to be sure british yes, but no good i think, we here in our germany are liking our better mg42/mg3
@@Sabrina-jn7ts wat
@@britishmilitaria2947 wat?
That's interesting both my great grandfather and great uncle also served in ww1 with the Gloucestershire regiment.
12:29 "They really wanted people going, dakka-dakka-dakka dakka-dakka-dakka dakka-dakka-dakka"
More dakka please, we're British.
Dakka dakka won the war.
*Bad Moon intensifies*
No such thing as to much dakka
Let Jerry feel the dakka-dakka!
Dakka dakka for the win boys. And girls maybe
"Embuggered" what a lovely "Britishism"
Nice play on 'encumbered'. :)
I think it might be a Terry P reference
Swear words are one of the few things the English can still manufacture better than anyone else.
Sigh...
@@beetooex may well be😂
Cheers again. Really opened my eyes to how effective this gun is both in design, and the way it was used in the section. Mobile, quick to deploy, and ammo distribution amongst the section without impeding fighting effectiveness. This makes me conclude that at least up until late war, the British infantry section has been highly under-rated.
its worth noting that the USMC have introduced a weapon that is somewhat similar in concept, the M27 IAR, as a one for one replacement for one of the M249/FN Minimi in a fire team, for pretty much these reasons., The underlaying logic is still basically sound,
But-but weapons don't matter in warfare! It's all about the flag officers, haven't you ever read a history book!?!? Would General So-and-So beat General Smith? Now THAT'S a fascinating question.
I used to be into military history until I realized that it was mostly flag officer-worshipping crap, as though they determine the outcome of battles/wars to the exclusion of absolutely everything else. Good weapons, good equipment, good tactics, the leadership/aptitude of junior officers, and frequent training in/with them wins wars, not some general pushing division markers around a map from his chatau command post. "Operational" success is nothing more than the aggregate success of "small", "insignificant" units.
@@xerxeskingofking yes and no. That was how they marketed it. In reality, they used it to replace their M4s and use the M27 IAR as the general issued rifle. Check out their latest squad organisation and equipment: 13 dudes, all have M27 IAR plus and one of then has a quad copter.
Overall, the USMC now moved to long-range weapon platforms like rocket artillery, land-based anti-ship missiles instead of infantry and ground direct fire weapons. They even want to get rid of tube artillery and tanks.
Fascinating detail given here, fills in some blanks for me. My dad carried a Bren for the D-Day landing. Over the years he mentioned the practicality and deadly accuracy of the weapon and other stuff about his particular section that makes a lot more sense now. Thought he said the weapon weighed around 21lb, had not appreciated the weight of the individual magazines.Thank you so much for the detail of how a section functioned late WW2.
My father was a Bren gunner in Burma in WW2
the forgotten 14th?
Daniel Marshall 2nd Welch , 19th Dagger Division, 14th Indian Army
@@sergentcolon1 Thank you, my farther served in Burma though he died in the mid eighties I was only in my early teens. He didn't say much about his time there beyond putting across it was far from enjoyable. Though I feel most people who've seen war are happy never to see it again, cheers however and all the best.
I actually own a Bren magazine pouch that i bought from a surplus store (for the purpose of storing other things). I had no idea it was so associated with such an amazing weapon. Great upload!
Used one of these in the cadets, many moons ago. I remember the range sergeant saying the way to get ideal bursts was to think "fish and chips" as fast as possible while squeezing the trigger. Seem to remember it worked quite well....
What we used to call "double tapping". we were supposed to fire 2 or 3 round bursts on our personal weapons tests with the LMG, I still often managed to fire single shot in full automatic.
As a Sapper who had the LMG as my personal weapon when we were dismounted I would have a mag on and 5 mags in my ammo pouches (the weapon was not made ready though due to the risk of releasing the bolt accidentally).
My number 2 (usually the section 2 i/c would carry the other 6 mags (or split them around the section a bit).
When mounted or in a defensive position with our vehicles we had a steel box which held all 12 magazines.
I don't know,. I can think pretty fast.
In the Camerons, we were taught to use the phrase "son of a bitch"
@@markdesjardins3153 the exact phrase I was taught in the Australian army 😊
@@markdesjardins3153 Same here in the Canadian Army
always love your vids, I trained on the bren a youngster in the cadets in the early 80's, one thing I can remember was being taught to rock back and fore taking note of how the foresight rose and fell - if it was vertical all was good- if it moved diagonally your position was wrong and needed adjusting, a quick remedy if your strong enough was to briefly lift the front end high enough for the bipod to clear the deck with your free hand keepng it shouldered with a hold of the pistol grip and plonk it back down and check again - this technique put me in good stead when i enlisted a few years later when using the gpmg
Thanks - yeah, that's a really good way to make sure the bipod is vertical and isn't tending in one direction or another.
I also trained on the old .303 Bren as an army cadet in the 1970’s. My most vivid recollection of firing it on the MOD ranges at Gravesend was absolute agony as the hot spent cases ejected out of the underside of the gun, then rolled down the earth embankment of the firing point and collected inside the sleeve of my combat jacket. Hurt like hell 🤣
Something we were taught when firing the Bren was to use the first two spent cartridges and stake them into the ground through the holes in the feet of the bipod. That helped to limit movement. Probablt not practical in 'action' but handy on the ranges. Great video and thanks
The Bren is so accurate it managed to remove your beard briefly !
@Alexander Challis that's not true. Lmg isn't for beaten zone, that's mmg.
Lmg is for suppression which as testing has proven time and time again, it's best done by accurate fire.
Which is exactly why the bren was so effective and despite the fearsome reputation of the mg 42 you had to have 8 guys constantly running ammo for it and only one for bren.
“It’s me bren gun”
“You should that thing again in here, I’ll kill ya!!”
Brilliant movie 😂
Yeah, that was pretty funny. What did the other guys have? A pellet gun?
th-cam.com/video/4yQeyi2Fc40/w-d-xo.html
th-cam.com/video/3FpO3_60GJo/w-d-xo.html
.
"Couldn't you have used smokeless cartridges, Plank?"
I love that film
Matsimus is the stalker on youtube that you both love and hate XD
I do wonder if there were to be a second series of ‘Project Lightening’ whether the Bren would come out on top. I suspect it would be down to the challenges selected for trial.
The real question is who would have the better butt shots. Bloke or Ian.
Even R.L. Ermey said the Bren was better than the BAR.
@@truckerallikatuk As an LMG yes, of course it's better. The BAR was not designed as an LMG; it's an automatic rifle. The comparison between Bren and BAR as LMGs is apples and oranges. Ian covered this with Othias and Mae in Project Lightening.
I think Lewis gun will be better. It's just sooo smooth and shoots like a laser
@@mannys9130 ...yes, we know; the whole 'walking fire' thing turned out to be every bit as optimistically dumb as it sounds, so they had to make up another reason to justify keeping these expensive ass, heavy, mediocre long guns...
My late dad's friend and comrade in the local militia pre- WW2, Jimmy Doohan who much later becme "Scotty" in the original Star Trek was hit by a burst from a Bren on D-Day. (from an over excited sentry ...friendly fire : (
Even as a Yank, I appreiciate a BREN. It was very useful in WWII. Thanks, Bloke.
As a Brit, I can appreciate the Garand, excellent rifle and would love to give one a go. But I can't for the life of me appreciate the WWII BAR. You had a great idea with the M1918, why couldn't you just simplify it? You had to give it a fast and slow automatic mode, what did you think it was, a car?
@@djwoody1649 In their defense, they were trying to solve some of the problems of the 1918 but went about it the wrong way. The bipod was a definite improvement even though it suck, but they screwed almost everything else up by trying to improve it. They should have basically just taken a Colt Monitor and try to figure out a to make the mags bigger like a half drum
@@shanesizemore3654 That would have been a good idea.
@@djwoody1649 To my knowledge (mainly Forgotten Weapons and C&Rsenal, including Project Lightening): The bipod was better than no bipod, the full auto was too fast but semi isn't quite right, the sights were an attempt to make it more accurate, and the "wings" were an attempt make reloading a bit better.
They were good reasons but not executed well.
@@djwoody1649 The Americans would have done well to listen to their Southern neighbours, and take a leaf out of the Mexicans' book. The Mendoza LMG was basically a BAR turned upside-down to feed from the top, like a Bren, with a proper bipod and a removable barrel. That could have given the Americans a gun in the ZB-26/Bren/V-B/Type 96 class in .30-06 with little trouble.
This was always my favourite weapon, used it as a cadet in 0.303" between 1980 and 83, then as a regular soldier (Sapper) in 7.62mm from 83 to 1991 when we got our SA80's (it was my personal weapon and I put serious amounts of rounds though them until I got my L86).
We had steel boxes containing 12 magazines for each weapon and a monopod for AA use (which was next to useless).
Interesting. What was your opinion of the L86?
@@erica3456 I first got my hands on the L86 when I was attached to the RS as Sapper support in 1985 (they were pretty much the first to get the SA80).
As a direct comparison I liked LSW - more accurate than the LMG (tend to think of it more as what is now called the DMR, able to hit accurately out to a longer range than the rifle), much lighter (I could fire it standing from the shoulder), as a Sapper I also got a SUSAT sight while the rifles just had iron sights.
It had that shiney new toy factor as well.
By the time I got mine the initial bad faults had been fixed (at least the ones the RS told us about - no magazine release catch guard, plastic buttons breaking).
For us is was a one for one swap for our LMG's, we kept our GPMG's on our Spartans, we never got a mount for our FV 432's or Sultans though for the L86.
Us and the Infantry did not agree with replacing the GPMG in infantry dismounted sections with two L86 though (they kept the GPMG in their L37 turrets on the 432's, while others with Warrior had the Rarden and chaingun mounted).
We didn't get ours replaced until 1993 in my regiment, ubique ☺
@@andrewjohnston4127 I got issued SLR and LMG in Berlin 93 to 94 when I was there as a Sapper in the Military Works Force. The old gat's hung around for quite a while
I drove an FV432 in the Gulf War, 1991. We still had an L4A1 LMG mounted on the commander's cupola, although we also got a GPMG for use dismounted (we never had them beforehand). The LMG we had was originally manufactured in 1944 as a BREN, with that designation struck out (====) and the 7.62mm L4A1 details etched/stamped/engraved below. We deployed with SLR too. Up until about 1993/1994 the guardroom at Brompton Barracks had a mixed "fleet" of L85A1s (for those on courses from units with them) and SLRs for those who had yet to swap over. Mainly because the RSME didn't have time during trade courses to teach a whole new weapon system just to post Sappers on the guard shift for a week or two out of nine months or so. When I was posted out to 3 Field Squadron from 1RSME my SSM was horrified on my first APWT when I told him I had never even held an "SA80" before and I was hurriedly taken aside and put through a crash course on a range at Bulford while everyone else was put through their paces. No pressure when you're last up and everyone else just wants to pack up and get weapons cleaned and back into the armoury...
Those utility pouches were commonly seen at gun shows in the US during the 70s and 80s. I bought a couple for $1 a piece, used them for carrying extra gear strapped to the side of my Alice ruck. Long worn out - they are so useful that I am not surprised they have become rare. They wore out.
In the seventies and you were not in an infantry regiment, we received the L.M.G. which was a Bren gun converted to fire 7.62mm - I used to be in the Army Cadets before joining in 71 and was damn good with our non-firing 'proper' Bren guns as I could strip it quite quickly. When my turn came in my basic tests the Sgt Instructor (Permanent Staff) was really surprised at how quickly I could get it down to the basics and then do the same with my S.L.R. ..... I was a terrible shot at long range with the SLR but damned good with the L.M.G.
You sure you're not Bob Monkhouse in "Carry on, Sergeant"!
Nice video , thanks!!! Techn. notice: The Bren gun was a licensed version of the Czechoslovak ZGB 33 light machine gun which, in turn, was a modified version of the ZB vz. 26, which British Army officials had tested during a firearms service competition in the 1930s. The name Bren was derived from Brno, the Czechoslovak city in Moravia, where the Zb vz. 26 was designed (in the Zbrojovka Brno Factory) and Enfield, site of the British Royal Small Arms Factory. The designer was Václav Holek, a gun inventor and design engineer.
Thank You for this very detailed video! This is brilliant for my talks on the Bren Gun and rifles at WW2 shows especially when the school children come round.
Whoever messed with belts in the field has to appreciate mag fed gun
Spot on great for fixed firing positions, muddy ditch def no.
Here here. Crawling through the Aussie bush with an F89 Minimi the belt would just draw grass and other crap right into the gun jamming it. Especially if you didn't have the magazine pouch.
@@HelloNurse678 At least there was nothing hanging from the other side of the gun, unlike in the vz.59 case that has non-disintegrating belt what makes it even worse. :-)
@@HelloNurse678
We always had 2x 100 and 2 x200 round drums. No loose belts
@@HelloNurse678 I can only speak of my experience with the C9A2 (Canadian Minimi) but our belts always came from the factory in plastic boxes that attached to the LMG held 200rds. There wasn't really any excuse to have a belt hanging loosely. The C6 (FN MAG) on the other hand didn't have that luxury so you had to be careful with the loose belts.
I love the sound of the brun gun. I used the brun when it was with the Canadian Armed Forces in Canada. I carried it around a lot.
One tiny detail I just thought of is that if the Bren gunner carried it with a magazine in the gun, it means that they could have one more magazine (4 in pouches, plus 1 in the gun) on themselves than carrying by the handle and being all safety-conscious without a magazine (4 mags in pouches only).
More ammo plus gun ready to fire equals better.
Only when you're shooting. Unfortunately you spend a lot more time being 'embuggered' with the gun and the things that make it go bang, than you do shooting it.
Not a lot of fun, when you are trudging through the countryside.
I'm sure mags were carried anywhere, like GPMG belts were put down front of combat jackets,not safest but in combat,what is.Cowboy's carried them Bandolier style,where they got dirty.Very frowned upon.
It is hardly a surprise that this weapon remained in use for as long as it did with the British and commonwealth countries. A very beautiful weapon that might even hold its own today under certain circumstances.
it does in most circumstances. The problem is .303 or equivalent is not introduced to teens anymore. Most 19 year old's are gun-shy..
@@CharlesvanDijk-ir6bl So true. I was introduced to .303 at the age of 16 as a cadet.. I used 5.25 for shooting sparrows in my back yard.
Aistralia gave a heap to Timore in 7.62, sadly. No bemoan8ng Timor having them. Bemoaning Australia finaly getting rid of them. Interesting about 4 mag limit for one guy to carry. Back when we had SLR stil the standard was 4 but at point of signing out of aurmory for excercises 4 were offered often followed by do you want more. Same with 20rd SLR, 4, but on average I'd say guys who were serious carried 6 to 8 of each. Personaly I'd take 6 30s 2x 20 as I owned personaly 6x30 for my privately owned SLR at the time
@@CharlesvanDijk-ir6bl In the uk, cadets can shoot 7.62 target rifles still, as well as the 5.56 GP rifle. Most of the guys I knew liked the bigger stuff
Probably have been a better weapon in Afghanistan than the Minimi.
I used to shoot .303 Lee Enfields in the rifle team at school as part of our CCF but never received any posture training, though slowly letting your breath out as you waited for the 'second pull' to fire the rifle was taught. After one shot with that powerful recoil one instinctively splays one's legs out for support without any instruction! Great video BOTR, thanks.
Remember firing one of those in basic during the '70s when they were still in service in 7.62mm.
Being a Marksman(highest grade) in the Sproc(Public schoolboy speak for Corps) and in our shooting team, we shot at Bisley often, and at smaller ranges around Herts and Bucks, I got to command the Bren Gun section in our Platoon and Company manoeuvres on Sailsbury Plain with the regulars. One of the sixth formers actually got to fire it and, as stated in this vid, the rest of us carried ammo and a rifle sharing the same 303 cal. shells. Same Battle Dress, but we also had a Jungle Green smock and pants with the same webbing. I still remember the smell of Blanco and Duraglit and those Boots that we polished with a hot spoon and spit. Hated school, loved the Sproc. Actually it is all in the cult classic film "IF" which was shot at Aldenham and Cheltenham in which I appeared with all my school chums. Thanks for the vid. Very informative. PS why were there those strange spike bayonets as well as the more traditional long flat bladed ones? Anyone?
Putting green plants in bin bags is a terrible idea, but how about the Bren scenes from the movie "lock stock and two loaded barrels" ?
Hey Bloke on the Range,
nice to see the 49th Polar Bears getting some love via your uniform choice! My granddad's unit replaced 6DWR in the line at the Caen sector after Epsom in 1944.
Great video and love from Australia!
Obtained my Marksman badge on the 7.62 Bren. Loved it 3 round burst and real close grouping.
I learnt this reading George McDonald Fraser. Quartered Safe Out Here. One of the best insights into an average infantryman in British Army in WWII
As an Army Cadet in Australia in the 1970s we were all taught to operate the LMG (Bren). The biggest or strongest bloke carried it but we could all field strip, reassemble (blindfolded) troubleshoot and operate the Bren. We LOVED it. We did NOT love 'The Pig' (M60 GPMG) which we got in the CMF. I have a soft spot for the L1A1 SLR not the select fire folly that came out just before I left.
Brilliant video brought back a lot of memories, fired one as a 15-year-old army cadet back in 79.
I like the “Gun Jesus” prayer rug.
It really ties the room together
My Dad carried the Bren in the Royal Regina Rifles, he had nothing but praise for its reliability in the mud of Holland during WW2.
That set up also naturally instills teamwork and maneuvering. After everything every one in the unit contributes to keeping that gun happy.
I'm loving the back catalog!
In the 1970s i joined the Asia Gun Club and went to mainland china to shoot. One of the weapons i fired was a bren gun converted to 7.62x39. It was very interesting... Thanks for video!
One advantage of the Bren over the BAR is that the magazine was top loaded, much easier to change than the under loaded BAR. Rapid barrel change if overheating was another plus.
In addition the top loading means you can stay much closer to the ground, even with a larger magazine.
The only thing you need to get is a set of WWII frame glasses. Other than that, it was interesting how the uniform work as you were doing some shooting. In reading on the uniform, in there hast to get ready for the war, thee where some shortcoming in the way the pack and other equipment was mounted.
"it was recognized that it was acurate, the training was we.. want ot exploit this" and shoot the enemy, jolly good. Cheers great vid.
16:43 oh yes please just like that brawd in Lock stock and Two Smoking Barrels.
My uncle was a Bren gunner in the TA with my dad (Anti-Tank unit). Both of them loved shooting the Bren.
If you fit a correct sling then there is a way to use the sling as a shoot from the hip aid; makes it really easy to shoot and accurate. Can carry on patrol for hours that way.
Same done for the GPMG which was heavier still.
Sling goes: head through the middle and right arm, the weight carried on the left shoulder. Then wind right arm around and hand on the pistol grip. The upper right arm kind of semi wound on the sling. If the sling is the right length then the gun lying flat gets jammed at waste level; so very stable.
Keeps the vids coming.
From a fellow Anglo Swiss.
As a 1980s British Army soldier who trained on the updated version of this weapon extensively.13.01. FAIL! always cock the weapon before changing the magazine.
Plenty of archive footage of soldiers NOT doing that though :)
yeah I know but still not best practice.
Used one of these in army cadets and carried it on exercise several times as i didn't mind the weight. I'd have no problem going into war with one. Superb bit of kit.
In the Canadian Army, I just missed out on the Bren as we had just converted to the FN C1 and C2. My Section Commander still called the C2 “the Bren” long after it was retired, guess old habits die hard. I never did get to fire the Bren, you’re one lucky bloke. Mind you, we still did have a few Lee Enfield No.4s until we got our full compliment of C1s.
In Canada in my regiments museum we’ve got a jacket made specifically for carrying Bren mags on D-Day and other amphibious landings. It’s really interesting and if want to make the trip across the pond I’d be more than willing to show it too you and other things that I think you’d find interesting in our museum
My Dad shot Lee Enfield alongside a Bren Gunner in Army target competition. He said it was one shot marker from the Lee and bursts of three from the Bren. He told of getting bollockings from the markers in the pits for shooting the marking circle as they raised it over the target during practice periods! He just missed out on shooting at Bisley because he was transferred to Carlisle.
Fired Bren in .303 in the Cadets in the 70s. Later in 7.62 when I was in the TA. I was always taught to load a .303 magazine with 28 rounds, not 30, as the magazine spring was not overly powerful and caused jamming problems, especially with older magazines. This from the Officers who had fought in WW2.
It's also in the pamphlets ;)
My grandad was a bren gunner in the 59th division at Caen in 1944. Apparently he doesn't remember ever having a number 2 gunner with him
Which company? Some massive division doesn't tell me much
@@reidparker1848 B Coy. 2/5 Lancashire Fusiliers, 197 Brigade
Thanks for a great video. This was something I thought of when I viewed "Project Lightening" by MaeOthIan (C&Rsenal and Forgotten Weapons). They had a modern firing position and complained that some guns bounced all over the place. I noted this because I have always been taught to lay in a straight line behind the GPMG (I have no experience with LMGs). Perhaps some of them would have performed or appeared a bit better if they had fired them like you shoot that BREN.
Definitely - it makes a massive difference. Future video idea, thanks!
Indian army loves these machine guns so much that they still use it to this day... lot's of history with this gun and Indian armed forces..WW2, 47war, 63war, 65war, 68 skirmish, 72war, sri lanka operations, kashmir incursions, 99war, and so on.
I the seventies with the 7.62 version we were more parsimonious with fire rate at three round bursts to chant of one oh one. We were also encouraged to use a slightly splayed leg position because the weapon pushed back. The German Spandau you used with toes together dug in because that would tow you down the range. Most interesting to see how matters changed over time. No need to change the barrel so regularly either.
I remember in the late nineteen seventies we were issued with the 7.62 conversion they were re built world war 2 versions they were then taken back into storage as the first mag started to replace our old m60 the m60s were just about worn out having been used extensively in Vietnam.
So ... no mention of barrel changes? As a cadet in the early 80s (Bren .303 ... at school!!!) and OTC pleb in the late 80s/early 90s (LMG 7.62) we always had to replace the barrel after a few mags (too old to remember how many but it might have been 4)
Barrel changes is a whole topic all on its own, and we didn't have a second barrel. Patience! (It was after 10 mags in continuous fire btw.)
Excellent demonstration of the bren gun. Spectacular as always.
Great job on this Bren gun series.
Nice to hear about the distribution of the ammunition you're right not a lot of people mention it.
Love the layout. Full-on historical gear.
And everyone else?
Probably the most important pair in the Section.
The First and Second Scouts.
Unencumbered (without packs) soldiers who probed ahead of the Section while in movement to contact with the enemy. The Second Scout carried an SMLE and the First carried the Section's other SMG.
When contact is established, they formed their own distinct maneuver element. Very often, these guys were used to put flanking fire on enemy positions.
You gotta be the most rare person to find in the UK right now you like guns your knowledgeable about firearms and history and your nether far left nor far right by us standards hats off to you
I'm so rare to find in the UK since I'm not in the UK...
Bloke on the Range Canada 🇨🇦?
A friend has a semi auto Bren in .303. Really nice shooting, very fun to to blast away.
I was taught to handle this weapon a great many years ago. We were always taught to spread our legs and roll our heels inward to the ground. Small point, I know, but apparently important in reducing the profile of the gunner.
Love the Bren.
My father used it once in Suez crisis in the Royal Marines. Said it fired like a sowing machine. (Not a type of stitching id like for myself to be honest!)
Thank you. When I first trained on the LMG version of this, the No. 2 replaced the magazines as you demonstrate. Around about 1976 the drill changed, and I was bawled at on the range because the No. 2 now had to fire his rifle while the No.1 reloaded (and lost his point of aim in the process). I felt really annoyed!
I am minded by a film -- A Hill in Korea --- c1956 (?) A scene with a battery of brens.
(it also had a v. early Michael Cain performance. He actually was in Korea in real life, which perhaps helped him get the small part.
(did a lot of people know that?)
Interesting detail with the later 7.62 NATO bren (the L4) they milled out the magazine well so it could accept SLR mags. Makes sense when you consider the compatibility with the rifleman’s SLR and the previous doctrine that everyone would carry some mags for the squad machine gun
58 PTN webbing large pack has two side pouches, for Bren Mags, per Rfn. Left side 58 Ammo Pouch for Bren, right side ammo pouch for .303 charger clips. Later x SLR Mags in both left & Right, whilst 2 Bren mags OR SLR mags in large pack side pouches.
Sorry, but practically everything you've said there is wrong...
great weapons....we got them in 7.62 with 30 round SLR mags on them
Those were Bren mags. Nicking them to use on your SLR, while immensely cool, was frowned upon.
Yeah literally got my arse kicked for that...Good old days....
Happened to fire the Bren. First thing when firing on the range, you use the shells of the the 303 rounds on the bi pod to keep it steady, put them into holes on bipod into the ground. Not very practical if moving in combat but always the trick used on the range. The other big thing they teach you is never put your hand under the gun. when firing a rifle typical thing to do but if you dont put your hand over the stock with the Bren, you are going to have a sore hand. It's unbelievable accurate. At 300 yards, you go from hitting magpies and outers with a rifle to hitting bulls or inners on every shot.
I'll need to take a look and see if the Australians made any changes to their tactical implementation of the Bren gun after they reorganised their sections for jungle fighting in 1943. The order of personal kit changed as well as two rifles in a section being switched to Owen Machine Carbines
Speaking of personal kit, The combined service museum in Maldon has a very good collection ofAustralian jungle fighting knives , mostly custom made , mean looking weapons!
My Dad always said that they would avoid automatic fire with the Bren, because that would get you mortared. Also, that if you need to dismantle something, always do it on the kitchen table when the family are out somewhere. Then you could get in trouble when they come back and not really know why.
(2:55) later during the war (after 1941), the Germans redistributed the ammo between all soldiers equally. They didn't have magazines though - canisters or 50-round 'drums' (actually smaller canisters), and even belts directly, if the latter were lost.
Although an American, I absolutely love the WW2 British uniform. It’s smart, fierce and friendly looking all at once. Like a nattily turned out Boy Scout with a Fairborn-Sykes knife.
I imagine that following their first contact the survivors carried their Brens ready to go from that point on and retrained new starts as such despite pamphlet doctrine... Shot both .303 and 7.62Nato versions. When army cadets were allowed such things. GOOD FUN!!!!
I recall reading somewhere a couple of years back, a memoire looking back at a battle fought in Normandy. British infantry and a number of Shermans were cut to shreds, with a huge loss of life, but the few dozen survivors were refused permission to withdraw (Needed as the infantry "screen" to protect the armour in the event of a counterattack - it was mainly a tank battle) The surviving Infantry scoured the battlefield, and picked up as many BRENS and Mags as they could recover. Which worked out as more than one functioning BREN for each of them, and vast amounts of full magazines. The subsequent German advance - by infantry - was held off by withering fire from several dozen BREN guns. All I recall about the battle/skirmish is that it took place on a hillside somewhere near Caen, and marked an attempt by Monty to break out. M4 Shermans against Panthers...
Hill 112?
Hill 112 sounds very plausible, although I'm unable to find any supporting evidence. The more I think about it, the more I wonder if perhaps I'm remembering an episode from a TV documentary series about great tank battles.Whatever, I'm sure it was near Caen and sure that surviving troops (according to theor wn account) scoured the battlefield for discarded and abandoned Bren guns, equipping themselves with one Bren per soldier. Research suggests that perhaps it was Churchills against Tigers, rather than Shermans against Panthers...?
My father was a Bren Gunner. He was an Irish UN peacekeeper in the Congo in 61.
This video makes the BREN look excellent in practice. Those tiny reload times make the magazines look just as capable as a belt feed for infantry.
We're going to do a look at reloading 28rd mags vs 48rd belts (cos that's really the comparison in the light role - German belts often ended up downloaded by 2 rounds due to lost or damaged starter tabs). I suspect that mags might end up being faster overall in practice - basically more frequent but quicker reloads, being able to keep the gun up.
@@BlokeontheRange Eh ... I would not exclude those 250 rd. cans of ammo from the test. You couldn't hook them onto the side of something like you could if it was mounted on a tripod but you really had some sustained fire power there and the A-Gunner would only have to load it once unless you moved. Might be worth including in the evaluation just to see how it worked out. Of course - to be a fair evaluation - you are actually going to have to train yourselves to a level of real competence. That's why most of these alleged "tests" on the web are bull shit. Someone in the military who is trained to operate a specific weapon is in fact a Trained Professional - and can be really good at what he does, something very hard to include in an amateur test.
Of course ... IRL ... you start running into money problems actually firing machine guns if you're not in the military and have to pay for that ammo yourself ... I don't know what a 250 rd. can of ammo would cost.
.
My father did national service after Korea 1950s was good on the bren won his battalion yep I flew 1985 with the mirage did my time loved every minute of it!! Lol Cathy & I spent alot of time relocating to places Malaysia got to home for her & our son! Lol things were better back @ Williamtown nsw all good at least I could get red rooster!!!
The weapon that won the battle for New Guinea. As an old Australian BREN gunner in 3RAR early 60s & later an armorer, probably the most reliable section machinegun to this day.Ok a bit heavy but the ruggedness beat the shit out of the shitbox US M60 that replaced it, that we were stuck with in Vietnam.Sorry I was not there.Nothing NOTHING sounds like a 303 BREN.Love it.
Never really knew much about the bren before definitely a fan of it and it’s tactics now!
I was taught that the main reason for three-second bursts on all LMGs is to stop the barrel overheating and cook-offs.
Each Bren was issued with two barrels, to be switched as the one in use became too hot.
Many years ago, I knew someone who had served as a Bren gunner in the Korean War. He and his No. 2 had acquired (or to be more honest, stolen) a third barrel. They cursed the extra weight while lugging it around, but that third barrel saved their lives on a number of occasions, because the Chinese troops they often faced knew that a Bren had two barrels and they used tactics intended to cause the Bren team to fire until both barrels were too hot. The third barrel gave them an unpleasant surprise.
You can't get cook-offs on an open-bolt gun since a round is only in the chamber for a tiny fraction of a second before it is fired. Unless it jams, of course, which is a different matter.
@@BlokeontheRange Thanks.
@@Kevin-mx1vi Thanks. Great story.
What was the model I used in 1965ish with the ATC - it had a "drum" sight (easy to switch ranges) but was still .303 (with all the pain of loading rimmed rounds into the magazine)? Best, Pete.
How many Patreons do you need for a Bren Gun?
A fair number :D
Sam Coupland for a magazine it takes c. 2 Patreons @ .50BMG to purchase 1, empty.....
Is it possible to legally buy a full auto Bren in Switzerland?
@@Legitpenguins99 In general fully automatic weapons are illegal in Switzerland. However, with a special permit from your state (and not all states issue such permits) you can own fullauto weapons. There are quite a few requirements you have to fullfil that you are granted such a special permit plus of course strict rules for use and storage apply.
@@Legitpenguins99 yes, but owning full-auto weapons isn't really the issue - shooting them, or anything else, is. one thing I always envy the Americans is their ability to seemingly go out into the woods and shoot their heart out. if I did that here I'd be arrested or possibly even shot.
AFAIK, there is only one range in Switzerland that allows full-auto weapons, and it's in the middle of nowhere in the German side.
I did basic training with the LMG whist in the REME 1973. I loved firing it almost as much as the SMG. Stripping and cleaning a piece of cake, barrel changes really quick. The only con I seem to remember being taught was that it was too accurate for suppression - shooting the same enemy more than once with a 7.62 was a waste of ammo, so in some instances the barrels were loosened to provide a greater spread of rounds, or worn barrels were preferred for the same reason. I don't know how true that is though; still a lightweight monster!
"too accurate for suppession" is such a dumb trope, particularly as the full auto spread on a BREN is wider than on a Vickers according to the pam anyway...
@@BlokeontheRange May well be but it's what was going around at the time when I was in the Army. I only ever fired the LMG on 3 -5 burst auto at Figure 11's and found it extremely accurate and a joy to fire so cannot really say through personal experience as to it's effectivity at suppressive fire. Plenty of interesting articles in the wild, some of which may be conjecture - www.quora.com/Is-it-true-that-the-British-Army-Bren-gun-was-too-accurate-to-be-effective-as-a-light-machine-gun
www.historynet.com/the-bloody-accurate-bren.htm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk%3ABren_light_machine_gun
@@BlokeontheRange This will be my last post on this channel. Bloke on the Range obviously doesn't like criticism and his replies don't invite friendly discussion, so goodbye and good luck with your channel and any chance of me supporting you on Patreon!
"Chappie dear, wot in 'ell have you done to me Persian rug!"
In the book the fighting 52nd there's a passage on a Bren gunner (sgt) being asked to take out a German officer crawling along a ditch the only part of said officer was his backside which the gunner obligingly put a single round through the German complimented the sergeant on his marksmanship.
Here, takes some of these ,,,,,,,,,,, If you need any more, let me know, I have plenty.
I found it quite informative, and I also learned the delightful term "enbuggered."
After WW2 a scrap steel dealer was given the contract to deactivate BRENS. The workers in the scrap yard used torches to cut the guns. One fellow might cut the barrel and the other guy the breech. My Dad said " anyone who was overseas knew that any BREN could us any barrel," so a lot of BRENS were purchased by vets, one with the good bar the other with the good breech.
Beautiful gun , great video
great video, thankyou for taking the time and energy to make it.
as an aside, I'm amazed at the amount of trolls and stupid comments you have collected with it.
for you next collaboration with Rob, maybe see if the Movie Armament Group, that ian mccollum has worked with, have a Lewis? :D
No.2 also carried the spare barrel, cos, as you can see the fired barrel gets hot very quickly and can cause a jam. You would load a tracer round third into the magazine to warn you of expired load.
the rug really makes that room
Good to see Ben Elton still being funny