For a whole podcast on Ligotti you could get someone from "Thomas Ligotti circle" on Thomas Ligotti Online forum, Matt Cardin or Jon Padgett or someone of the people who know him in real life through this one could dig some biographical details and stuff about "Prince of Darkness".
This is the corner of fiction that I've fallen most in love with and still has a lot of room to grow. Butler, Le Guin, Dick, Kafka, Ligotti, Vandermeer, and Mieville all have stories that go to these unsettling but also alien areas that make the reader feel intrigued but also tense.
The new weird doesn't count, in my book. It's a different genre. It's got marxist tendencies. It doesn't have the critical element of romanticism characteristic of "old" weird fiction.
Just in case anyones wondering, the comments dunking on ligotti aren't objective. I love Ligotti. I dont think any writer has influenced my own fiction more, aside from a few descriptive and dialogue tricks i learned from McCarthy... Ligottis later works are by far his best. But i suggest starting with his shorts, "Gas Station Carnivals" and "Severini."
I only found him because I happened to click on John Padgett's excellent narration of "The Bungalow House" on You Tube, still my favourite Ligotti story.
I have a great love for Clark Ashton Smith. There’s a pretty good collection of his stories published by Penguin; “ The Dark Eidolon and other Fantasies”. Highly recommended
i know he's got many imitators and influenced a whole generation of writers, yet there's something so OFF -i dont have the words to describe them, I haven't the skill, apart from off-kilter, dimensionally altered, sometimes literally, think of the shape of the protagonist's bedroom in "Dreams in the Witch House " about HPL's stories that he can be parodied/satirised but he WAS a one - off.Thats's why I constantly return to him,he fulfills a need I have for something no-one else provides, even though I know every story almost by heart..rather like the M.R. James stories I know by heart.... Ligottis' work ,for me, is hit or miss. However- I had never heard of him and simply stumbled across Padgett's SUPERB reading of "The Bungalow House" on You Tube, Thats my favourite Ligotti story- also like the Red Tower. Also worth reading is Mark Samuels- "Glyphotec (sic) and other Macabre Processes " , he is a very natural successor to HPL. Machen- for me, "N" is my favourite, on obvious predecessor to one of HPL's stories. Hey- Lord Dunsany is great for a mental journey too! I have to mention Borges otherwise I'd be missing a huge strange fiction influence, wow..theres so many , "House of Sounds" blew me away ,no pun , by M.P. Shiels for its' sheer boldness. Even W.G Sebald who is great for tying many threads of mental journeys orbiting a comforting central grounding... Thanks for the Chat !!! Ah I hear you mention Machens' "The Lost Club" , that is brilliant !! check out " Manfred Arcane " , a channel no longer updated for years that contains many good stories. BTW- The Ligotti story about the guy who works at a Secure Hospital is called "The Frolic", it is very good, if a rather telegraphed ending. hahah, i dont know why a line has gone through my remarks on Lovecraft, some kind of Eldritch influence ! sorry. P.S. you mentioned "The Red Book" and "The Shining", when Jack is having the job interview, a copy of it is placed on the desk, why ??
Wonderful episode! I'm in the same boat, I started out with Lovecraft (then Dunsany, Blackwood, Machen, Bloch, Smith etc.) and ended up with Ligotti, who I now consider the more interesting author, or at least one that speaks to me more. Like you say, Lovecraft is a pessimist, and yet his writing often engages with the fantastical, "awesome", almost adventure-like elements (especially his Dream Cycle). Ligotti's writing doesn't suggest any escape (being itself escape as written story), fantasies are occasions for nightmares and unholy transformations. As a side note, I feel no difference reading Ligotti's fiction or his interviews, the same voice comes through. I'm really enjoying the new weird authors as well. Barron, John Langan, Mieville are all great. Koja's The Cipher was an interesting read, funny, absurd and weird. Would love to hear Jon Padgett or Matt Cardin on the pod some day, considering some of their work would be a perfect fit for Hermitix.
Copernicus, Darwin, Freud... and of course, don't forget the great Deleuze and Guattari, who clearly belong in the same sentence as the first three giants lol!
I finally caved and got around to reading Ligotti's first two short story collections (the Penguin edition), and I just have to say - I'm waiting for his writing to become substantial in some way. It seems totally contrived and artificial (in a non-deliberate and unmasterful way). There's quite a bit of name-dropping in relation to certain trends in western esotericism (rosicrucianism, alchemy, etc.), but it isn't really justified. Just seems like a bit of lurid tinsel. He also explicitly uses the word "horror" far too often. And the way in which he overuses the word "eidolon" is just obscene and completely without valid motivation. I recognize that this is his first set of stories, but it was simply underwhelming to me. There's nothing profound about evoking the "black abyss of stars" in one's dreams. Hopefully Grimscribe is better than Songs of a Dead Dreamer.
there is no hope for escape from this dream that was never yours the very words you speak are only its very words and you talk like a traitor under its incessant torture
For a whole podcast on Ligotti you could get someone from "Thomas Ligotti circle" on Thomas Ligotti Online forum, Matt Cardin or Jon Padgett or someone of the people who know him in real life through this one could dig some biographical details and stuff about "Prince of Darkness".
This is the corner of fiction that I've fallen most in love with and still has a lot of room to grow. Butler, Le Guin, Dick, Kafka, Ligotti, Vandermeer, and Mieville all have stories that go to these unsettling but also alien areas that make the reader feel intrigued but also tense.
The new weird doesn't count, in my book. It's a different genre. It's got marxist tendencies. It doesn't have the critical element of romanticism characteristic of "old" weird fiction.
Utterly based
Thank you for these amazing podcasts
Just in case anyones wondering, the comments dunking on ligotti aren't objective. I love Ligotti. I dont think any writer has influenced my own fiction more, aside from a few descriptive and dialogue tricks i learned from McCarthy...
Ligottis later works are by far his best. But i suggest starting with his shorts, "Gas Station Carnivals" and "Severini."
I only found him because I happened to click on John Padgett's excellent narration of "The Bungalow House" on You Tube, still my favourite Ligotti story.
I have a great love for Clark Ashton Smith.
There’s a pretty good collection of his stories published by Penguin; “ The Dark Eidolon and other Fantasies”.
Highly recommended
I like his "Azhredac" (?) and sorcery stories for someone who liked AD&D in the 80s and of course his Mars Cycle.
i know he's got many imitators and influenced a whole generation of writers, yet there's something so OFF -i dont have the words to describe them, I haven't the skill, apart from off-kilter, dimensionally altered, sometimes literally, think of the shape of the protagonist's bedroom in "Dreams in the Witch House " about HPL's stories that he can be parodied/satirised but he WAS a one - off.Thats's why I constantly return to him,he fulfills a need I have for something no-one else provides, even though I know every story almost by heart..rather like the M.R. James stories I know by heart.... Ligottis' work ,for me, is hit or miss. However- I had never heard of him and simply stumbled across Padgett's SUPERB reading of "The Bungalow House" on You Tube, Thats my favourite Ligotti story- also like the Red Tower. Also worth reading is Mark Samuels- "Glyphotec (sic) and other Macabre Processes " , he is a very natural successor to HPL. Machen- for me, "N" is my favourite, on obvious predecessor to one of HPL's stories. Hey- Lord Dunsany is great for a mental journey too! I have to mention Borges otherwise I'd be missing a huge strange fiction influence, wow..theres so many , "House of Sounds" blew me away ,no pun , by M.P. Shiels for its' sheer boldness. Even W.G Sebald who is great for tying many threads of mental journeys orbiting a comforting central grounding... Thanks for the Chat !!! Ah I hear you mention Machens' "The Lost Club" , that is brilliant !! check out " Manfred Arcane " , a channel no longer updated for years that contains many good stories. BTW- The Ligotti story about the guy who works at a Secure Hospital is called "The Frolic", it is very good, if a rather telegraphed ending. hahah, i dont know why a line has gone through my remarks on Lovecraft, some kind of Eldritch influence ! sorry. P.S. you mentioned "The Red Book" and "The Shining", when Jack is having the job interview, a copy of it is placed on the desk, why ??
Wonderful episode! I'm in the same boat, I started out with Lovecraft (then Dunsany, Blackwood, Machen, Bloch, Smith etc.) and ended up with Ligotti, who I now consider the more interesting author, or at least one that speaks to me more. Like you say, Lovecraft is a pessimist, and yet his writing often engages with the fantastical, "awesome", almost adventure-like elements (especially his Dream Cycle). Ligotti's writing doesn't suggest any escape (being itself escape as written story), fantasies are occasions for nightmares and unholy transformations. As a side note, I feel no difference reading Ligotti's fiction or his interviews, the same voice comes through.
I'm really enjoying the new weird authors as well. Barron, John Langan, Mieville are all great. Koja's The Cipher was an interesting read, funny, absurd and weird.
Would love to hear Jon Padgett or Matt Cardin on the pod some day, considering some of their work would be a perfect fit for Hermitix.
This will be great
Copernicus, Darwin, Freud... and of course, don't forget the great Deleuze and Guattari, who clearly belong in the same sentence as the first three giants lol!
I think he mentioned them very quickly in passing.
You would like Lyotard
I finally caved and got around to reading Ligotti's first two short story collections (the Penguin edition), and I just have to say - I'm waiting for his writing to become substantial in some way. It seems totally contrived and artificial (in a non-deliberate and unmasterful way). There's quite a bit of name-dropping in relation to certain trends in western esotericism (rosicrucianism, alchemy, etc.), but it isn't really justified. Just seems like a bit of lurid tinsel. He also explicitly uses the word "horror" far too often. And the way in which he overuses the word "eidolon" is just obscene and completely without valid motivation. I recognize that this is his first set of stories, but it was simply underwhelming to me. There's nothing profound about evoking the "black abyss of stars" in one's dreams. Hopefully Grimscribe is better than Songs of a Dead Dreamer.
You dislike urban novelists.
Ligotti’s writing is really fascinating. But he’s a fake.
I'm listening?
@@melissajohnson3361 A puppet.
What do you mean by a fake? He's a charlatan?
@@DeadMemories5354 sorry, it was a joke. He’s great.
there is no hope for escape from this dream
that was never yours
the very words you speak are only its very words
and you talk like a traitor
under its incessant torture