It's come to my attention that the title is a bit misleading so I'm changing it, this video isn't meant to actually explain BSP filling, it's just meant to answer the question presented in the beginning. Again, if you want more thorough and accurate information on BSPs, check out Matt's Ramblings P.s. yes the gate on my microphone is way too harsh. It's the middle of summer and I really didn't want people to hear my fan running in the background
@@common_cold People change titles and thumbnails all the time to tune the TH-cam algorithm. Nothing wrong with that. Check out Veritassium's ramblings on that
Really interesting stuff! 10:00 I caught myself thinking that the skybox light source would be considered a light point entity so this room wouldn't need a null entity to avoid being culled, but I guess the skybox lighting is a brush?
You really should put your (original) teleport_destination just above the floor, not on the floor It literally pops the player out, so you want to use that as a travel side effect for your map
I'm sorry to be that guy but I have to mention that vbsp doesn't technically fill a map out. It recursively chops up the map using planes where each plane has one side that's facing empty space and the other side facing solid space.
Was watching this on my phone and when he was covering the teleport bug, my phone did the source engine sound bug crash (repeating the r from room rapidly) and I had to restart my phone. Your video is cursed.
2:11 you hinted at an explanation on the filling algorithm, but in the end you only explained why the edge cases exist and how to mitigate them, no explanation on how the filling step works.
That's not correct. The BSP tree is not filled from the inside but from the outside. Let's consider the example with the four walls. Once we have these, a bounding box is created that encompasses all the walls and is slightly larger. From this box, a brush is generated whose sides point inward rather than outward and are given a specific attribute. Then, the BSP is created with the portals. Now, you look for the "end" leaves of the tree where the faces of the bounding box are located and start filling them using a fill algorithm.
I think you have your noise gate threshold set a bit too high. Meaning it's cutting your mic audio out completely in between words and vowels because of low volume. It's better to set the noise gate limit way down or even remove the noise gate and rely more on noise reduction filter, it makes it sound more natural.
I appreciate obscure info like this (was mapping for Half-Life a long time ago) but it's a bit difficult to listen to how you speak. You need to work more on the flow, and as well as proofreading the script to avoid some repetition. Editing a bit tighter would also help, for example cutting down the explanation of very basic concepts that most people would get a good idea about in 5 seconds shouldn't take longer in a video.
I feel like the video is done quite well, maybe I'm too used to technical videos but I don't think so. maybe yeah, this could be explained faster but there are still details that are interesting like the instant teleports.
Instead of picking up on any of his valid points u picked one and proceeded to defend urself... He even tried to soften it up and you still couldn't take it in. Facepalm
@@kvdrr fair enough, and that's why I point to Matt's Ramblings' video. It's not supposed to be an in depth technical explanation, just a way to picture it to help people understand. Chuma, the person who asked the question originally, doesn't speak English as their first language, so I tried to simplify things as much as possible while keeping it "technically" correct in order for the ideas to not be lost in translation, which happens very easily for things like this
@@common_cold well, he goes almost too much in-depth relative to topic of this video, but I very much appreciate that you mentioned it. IIRC there these segmented arrow lines (?) in the editor which point to where the leak is. visual representation of the algorithm by drawing each segment of the arrow iteratively, next to 2d view of space being partitioned wouldn't clutter your video too much and show precisely how it works without any words spoken. not that i would be bothered to do this if i were you, animations are hard
![[DOOM] John Romero's Level Design Rules](/img/n.gif)
It's come to my attention that the title is a bit misleading so I'm changing it, this video isn't meant to actually explain BSP filling, it's just meant to answer the question presented in the beginning. Again, if you want more thorough and accurate information on BSPs, check out Matt's Ramblings
P.s. yes the gate on my microphone is way too harsh. It's the middle of summer and I really didn't want people to hear my fan running in the background
@@common_cold People change titles and thumbnails all the time to tune the TH-cam algorithm. Nothing wrong with that. Check out Veritassium's ramblings on that
It's crazy how much of the terminology ended up basically unchanged in the source engine years later
if it ain't broke don't fix it
not just terminology, even code
Dude you were in pain at 6:04 and I felt that.
This is a very interesting video but lol it's ok to retake your lines occasionally when you choke on your drink in the middle of it
Simple, but very easy to understand. Thanks for your video! Hopefully you make more of these.
As a person who loves Quake mapping, this is a cool watch! ❤
I loved the explanation in this video :) thank you Common! i hope you do more of these videos!
Really interesting stuff!
10:00 I caught myself thinking that the skybox light source would be considered a light point entity so this room wouldn't need a null entity to avoid being culled, but I guess the skybox lighting is a brush?
would make sense since the sky is just a texture
Five thousand years of game development and some engines still use bsp
if it ain't broke don't fix it
@@fretzil I'm just salty since bsp maps are compiled and its much harder to reverse engineer than alot of other file types >.>
@@ignorethwhat's wrong with favoring performance?
@@scarm_rune favoring preformance is awesome, it only becomes a problem when the engine isnt open source and your trying to mod it :
@@ignorethBut for mappers, creating level geometry with BSP Brushes is faster than the conventional static meshes workflow, no? At least for me tho..
finally, a quake desync/decino guy
You really should put your (original) teleport_destination just above the floor, not on the floor
It literally pops the player out, so you want to use that as a travel side effect for your map
I'd love to see more stuff like this, this was a really neat video.
I'm sorry to be that guy but I have to mention that vbsp doesn't technically fill a map out. It recursively chops up the map using planes where each plane has one side that's facing empty space and the other side facing solid space.
You should be sorry.
@@common_cold someone didn't do their research on binary space partitioning
Literally needed this explanation. Thank you 😂
Cool. Very interesting video!
Just a question: Does Trenchbroom support Xonotic, Neverball, DarkPlaces and other games that use a modified version of the Quake engine yet?
I'm afraid what type of quirks quake 1 actually haves.
if you map is not sealed and fall into the void you fall into a never ending copys of the level but without collision
By the way, how to set up trechboom like yours? I've tried the soft and it looked a lot worse and broke my quake for some reason too
great video!
Awesome video. If you're running a gate on your audio you need to reduce how aggressive it is.
Was watching this on my phone and when he was covering the teleport bug, my phone did the source engine sound bug crash (repeating the r from room rapidly) and I had to restart my phone.
Your video is cursed.
2:11 you hinted at an explanation on the filling algorithm, but in the end you only explained why the edge cases exist and how to mitigate them, no explanation on how the filling step works.
Door exceptions of -1 and -2 are pretty damned common.
More like this please
That's not correct. The BSP tree is not filled from the inside but from the outside. Let's consider the example with the four walls. Once we have these, a bounding box is created that encompasses all the walls and is slightly larger. From this box, a brush is generated whose sides point inward rather than outward and are given a specific attribute. Then, the BSP is created with the portals. Now, you look for the "end" leaves of the tree where the faces of the bounding box are located and start filling them using a fill algorithm.
I think you have your noise gate threshold set a bit too high. Meaning it's cutting your mic audio out completely in between words and vowels because of low volume. It's better to set the noise gate limit way down or even remove the noise gate and rely more on noise reduction filter, it makes it sound more natural.
I appreciate obscure info like this (was mapping for Half-Life a long time ago) but it's a bit difficult to listen to how you speak. You need to work more on the flow, and as well as proofreading the script to avoid some repetition. Editing a bit tighter would also help, for example cutting down the explanation of very basic concepts that most people would get a good idea about in 5 seconds shouldn't take longer in a video.
There was no script, this was entirely adlibbed.
I feel like the video is done quite well, maybe I'm too used to technical videos but I don't think so.
maybe yeah, this could be explained faster but there are still details that are interesting like the instant teleports.
@@somnvm37 Yeah, I think this video was good. Good pacing overall.
Instead of picking up on any of his valid points u picked one and proceeded to defend urself...
He even tried to soften it up and you still couldn't take it in. Facepalm
Comment for the algorithm
1:38 no offense, but this oversimplification is borderline insulting. i wish you'd go into more detail here
@@kvdrr fair enough, and that's why I point to Matt's Ramblings' video. It's not supposed to be an in depth technical explanation, just a way to picture it to help people understand. Chuma, the person who asked the question originally, doesn't speak English as their first language, so I tried to simplify things as much as possible while keeping it "technically" correct in order for the ideas to not be lost in translation, which happens very easily for things like this
@@common_cold well, he goes almost too much in-depth relative to topic of this video, but I very much appreciate that you mentioned it. IIRC there these segmented arrow lines (?) in the editor which point to where the leak is. visual representation of the algorithm by drawing each segment of the arrow iteratively, next to 2d view of space being partitioned wouldn't clutter your video too much and show precisely how it works without any words spoken. not that i would be bothered to do this if i were you, animations are hard
This whole video could just be one sentence: "Make sure your entities aren't clipping through the brushes or it won't compile correctly"