Loved the 109 Pro! Sampled the entire Meze portfolio at this years Tampa Hifi expo. Flat out most comfortable headphones from every brand. Musically enjoyable. The build quality at its price point is a steal. Even comparing to Focal clear’s and Arya’s during the same listening sessions, those sound great - but the weight is noticeable after an hour of enjoyment. Meze are like wearing air.
Just got my 109 today. Very happy and impressed so far. Comfort is 9/10. I'm able to wear my glasses comfortably and not rest them on top of the ear pads. No noticable difference in the low end. Highly recommend!
Of course you did... IMO there's no point in an open back trying to have a V shaped, bass dominant sound signature.. Low end will never compete with a closed can, but mids, highs, detail and obviously soundstage will always be better in an open can. Moral of the story - 660S2 stuck in its appropriate lane..
Will you ever revisit the DT 1990 Pro ? It's still in your favourite list, but you never mention it anymore and your review is 4 years old. Just curious !
@@ixoye56 I own them for a couple of years now. But I don't own/order dozens of headphones like he does. I'm curious to see how they compare to newly released stuff. I also usually agree with Joshua's opinion and taste. Why the negativity ?
@@KopfKino901 Nah bro, just buy dozens of headphones and return them to Amazon. I'm sure Amazon would totally support 10 headphone returns with opened packages in a 3 month span (spoiler, they won't, that other guys advice is ridiculous)
I own the HD-600, it was the first high end headphone I ever purchased, back around 1999 I believe. The first pair somehow wound up in the bottom of the dishwasher while I was at work one night and that didn't work out well. It was actually my one year old son who dropped them in while his mother had her back turned and she didn't realize. I have since bought a 2nd pair. I also own the Meze 109 Pro. I love both headphones but if I were to choose just one I'd choose the Meze. It's a beautiful headphone. It sounds tremendous to my ears. The earpads are just so comfortable. Clamp force is perfect for my big melon. I think the 109 Pro pads beat those on the Elex or the HD-600 series. It's really a terrific headphone on all accounts in my opinion. I see no real cons here.
as soon as you said clamp force and big melon, you had me agreeing. I have a big head, and tried the early 109 at canjam london 2022. Also had the chance to try a pair of sennheiser HD600s and they clamped like nobodys buisness. I acctually could not wear them for more than about 10 minutes before my head started to ache. It's a shame, because I loved how they sound, but i just cant get over the CLAMP
Great comparison.... but curious about that you gave the 109 Headphone of the Year honors and that your dedicated S2 review seemed a lot more lukewarm about the S2. Yet in this video, the conclusion seemed to be "tom-ah-to or to-may-to". Overall, balance and low-hype is great but still a bit curious about why it shook out that way in this comparison. Are you pretty even about both phones or do you have a preference?
Hah, that's what these reviews do. They basically make up shit as they go and that creates all these funny contradictions because they forget their previous narratives. I doubt it has to be said but maybe not trust these salesmes...umm I mean..product reviewers.
@@gavin8489 Personally, Josh usually does a good job. But I hear ya. Like any review, it's relative, based on subjective experience, and at the end of the day, up to the consumer.
Tbh Josh seems like a nice guy, but he's more focused on putting out an entertaining, well-edited review than necessarily a very information dense and coherent one. The very fact this video is comparing 2 very popular and newer headphones rather than say a Focal Elex or a dt1990 or anything older says a lot about the limitations of how informative he really wants to be. He'd prefer a 10min, concise video with some information missing over a 25min, thorough comparison between a buncha headphones in the price tier
Nice video! Honestly I would like to own them both. Sennheiser for tube usage and Meze for the rest. These two kind seem to cover all the bases and I'd love to try out a pair of the Meze someday. Double the price is rough though! Gotta save up!
I went to check out the Caldera a week and a half ago, and the dealer had 109 Pro, was quite impressed for the VFM on the 109 Pro, definitely a good headphone.
Good to keep in mind that the HD660S2 will likely respond FAR better to tube amps than the Meze 109 will. That is the X factor with using such a high impedance set of cans. The side effect is of course you need way more power to drive them. The HD660S2 can never get concert level on my phone, only normal to low volume. I have to use a fairly powerful DAP, dongle or dac/amp to get them to them there. Pretty sure the Meze 109 Pro would get stupid loud on even the weakest MP3 player or phone as they claim only 40 ohms but also a sensitivity of 112 which is crazy high. Take the sensitivity number with a grain of salt of course as some companies use slightly different methods to test it, but it will never be off too much. The HD660S2 report 104 sensitivity for some cross reference. Cheers and happy listening!
in Romania , 109 Pro are 700$, and they change alot with the chain used. Im a fan of 600 series , and i will buy 660s2 , but the much better headphone is 109 Pro .
@@chrisk3127 Well yeah that's a different story when talking B Stock and Used HP prices. I'm talking brand new the Ananda StealthMagnet is $700. The HD660S2 is $600 and the 109 Pro is $800. Of course you can find all these HP's for lower prices used... but many don't want to go that route which can be risky.
Joshua, you are a fan of the Beyerdynamic DT1990 pro and I have them as well. How do the Meze compare to the 1990pro? Which do you prefer? Thanks in advance
It's also worth noting both of these headphones respond to different amp. They both can mellow the treble just a small amount on some amps bringing it to a range where i think most people would be very happy. On tubes or warmer amp like cavalli liquid spark , or the new fiio k11 R2R. They sound great, though i think the Sinn's respond slightly better on the tubes vs the 109, but they both benifit from them. On analytical and sterile amps like the THX, they can sound more resolving but the treble can be harsher and brittle . It removes some of the smoothness that makes the 109 attractive. The S2 might actually benifit from the THX to counter act some of the darkness from the more bassy tuning. I havent tested the 660s2 on my Rupeet Neve Headphone amp, but the 109 pro and 6XX just sound about as good as there going to get on that amp, unless you spend thousands on a amp /DAC. So amp wise if you want something balanced ,and has a great sound that should pair well with these 2 plus others like the Focal clears etc. Spend the $500 and get a Rupert Neve. The amp makes a difference with these 2 cans
I had the 109 pro for few weeks before returning them; the problem about the "little too sharp" Ss an Ts (therefore also Fs) you talked about is a huge flaw to me, that's not "on some vocalists", it's litteraly on every voice, no matter the era or style, I've burned them in for more than 200 hours and this flaw never went away, this permanent sibilance is unworthy of a 800 usd headphone. Instead I bought an Ananda Stealth, saved 200 usd and I don't regret my choice. I'd love to hear the 660S2, tho.
@@Nicolas38260 I've owned the Senn 660, the Ananda is miles ahead, better in all categories (soundstage, details, bass presence), period. I have the Focal Elegia (I know, it's a closed back) and once again the Ananda is the clear winner, even if the Elegia has a better slam in the lower range, it's not enough to compete. A friend of mine came last week with his Kennerton Thekk which costs 3000 usd and even him was amazed by the Ananda performance and recognized that the Ananda, mostly because of its big pads that envelop the entire ear, had a more credible soundstage and overall presence. And to be honest, when I heard his headphone a year ago I was very impressed by it but not so much since I've had the Ananda and to be honest, I wouldn't trade my gear for his. I'm not working for Hifiman and I gain nothing to say this, but the Ananda, at 600 usd is a freakin steal, if you didn't yet, go and try it.
@radinan i would have gone deeper into Hifiman but the risk of ChiFi is rough for anything above the Sundara. Sennheisers and Beyers can survive hell. So can Grados. Hifiman can't. Not that i plan on breaking them but its in the back of my mind
@@MrAhuraMazda Well, 8 months later the Ananda is still here and it's still working like a charm and I use it very often with my DAP,. But to be honest I've upgraded my desk system and also bought the Arya SE which is of course better, as you can see I'm now a big Hifiman fan and I hope you're not right about long term resistance, we'll see.
@@ass_eating_man Eh, idk about that. 109 Pro and XS I can see either sounds better than the other. Also for comfort it's not even close, which is a factor that reviewers will gloss over
@@PantsaBear it does not. Edition xs sounds better I have heard both and sent 109 pro back. But, yes 109 is significantly more comfortable and hifiman qc issues are well known. Other than that edition xs is my pick for the best headphone under 1000 dollars. Meze 109 pro is almost 300 dollars dearer than edition xs and a good step back in sound qualities
I own meze 109 pro ananda stealth focal clear mg Sundara 560s 58x & 6xx… I don’t know I am kind of over the HD 6 series these all seem like slight variations of the same headphone … all mids and no bass… I don’t know I feel like it’s watching a big 4K tv with the bottom 1/3 of the screen missing (everything you see and hear is good but there’s a lot missing meaning no bass )…I am not a bass head I just feel it’s a big part of the music … I always use subs with 2 channel listening so when I go to the hd6 series it just seems so lacking in bass of any kind …although the mids are very good….for me the meze 109 pro, clear mg, and ananda stealth are just so much more enjoyable all around and present the music so much better than the sennheisers … I have heard the 660s and didn’t like it … unless this is markedly different 600 bucks is way too much for a plasticky sennheiser build and sound…. Just my two cents
Beautiful set of headphones you got there. Can't agree more, except I didnt really missed the bass of them the most. For me its just total lack of clarity, resolution, depth and spacing in the music of these cans. Overhyped? For me 100%, but thats just my opinion.
You’ve described the Senn 600 series perfectly. They are overrated but people keep hyping them. Just like they used to with (and still do in some corners) the m50s lol
@@Nicolas38260 if you like the Sundara that’s great enjoy it … is the ananda stealth better .. I think it has a little more stage and airiness … however, is it spending another 700 dollars better … no….the Sundara is good… everything above it may sound a little better hear and there but I don’t think anything sounds 10 times better than Sundara …. Especially if you eq and add a bit of bass … you’re good … don’t go down the rabbit hole like the rest of us searching for perfection that ultimately may not be there … lol
I wish one of the reviews when covering genre had covered Classical as i mostly only listen to classical piano and orchestra and from the impression of the 109 it seems more rock and electro music which you addressed.
I own the 660S2 and while solo and small group works sound fantastic, larger orchestral music gets slightly messy due to the very small sound stage it presents: Larger soundstages generally mean better detail and separation of instrument, helpful for reproducing large ensemble works, assuming your source is engineered well of course. They do have a fantastic timbre and instruments sounds incredibly natural, specially in the midrange area. Voices and choir is also pretty rock solid. If the recording is great, the sound production will match. It can be hauntingly accurate when listening to solo mid range focused works. That small soundstage helps to make it sound like you are often playing the instruments yourself, making it feel about as intimate as you can get! Something my speakers, or no other headphone I've heard can do. I suspect for piano on Meze might sound better due to it's increased dynamic range and impact. Drums equally. Also all that extra detail that the Meze is giving you, combined with a much bigger soundstage as well as far better dynamics means the Meze will almost surely destroy the 660S2 when it comes to orchestral reproduction. It might even be the better choice overall but it does cost 2x as much. My bet is on the Meze being the better overall headphone by far for Classical. I don't mind personally as a classical lover because I save the complex works for when I get home and use my way more dynamic 2 channel speaker setup. I see many of these companies will let you try the Meze or Sennhesier risk free for 45-60 days. Pretty much how I bought all of my audio equipment. I've sent a ton of stuff back but I am a pretty big fan of what the HD6 series can do and they do it so well (midrange tube amp superstars, something the Meze has no ability in) that I have 2 in the series. Just take care of the product and packaging incase you don't like them and want to send them back.
They're both dynamic drivers and not Hifiman, so I'm sure the mids will not sound artificially smooth, contrived and lifeless.. which is what every Hifiman including my HE400 SE, Ananda Nano and HE500 all sound like to me...
I find this comparison really odd because you opinion was neutral. You didn't say I prefer this over that so I don't know which headphone is the better choice. Which one if you only had to buy one?
I found the review helpful. Josh's description of the type of music and the emphasis on accurate timbre makes my decision to listen to the 660S2, among other headphones, much easier. His choice of contrasts and comparisons resonates with what I look for in a headphone. I get full soundstage when listening through my 2-channel system, and am looking for a more intimate, in-my-head experience with headphones - with lush, realistic mid-range reproduction of "real" instruments recorded in small, intimate spaces. Small ensemble jazz, blues, alternate music, early music, string quartet, piano, esoteric culture-specific instruments, instrumental duets, vocals & vocal harmonies....with only the odd classic rock track thrown in. I'm looking to be swept up in the musicality of the headphone, and am not interested in analytic highs or emphasized bass response.
I listened to both at CanJam Dallas 2024 and purchased the 109 Pro and Alba from Meze at the show. The S2 didnt sound as good as my 6XX to me, i also listened to the HD600 and i think they sound better than the 660s2 AND my 6XX. I think the bass on the S2 sounded off to me, the balance on the HD600 was better across the range and i find the HD650/6XX splits the difference between the S2 and 600. I think the 109 pro sounds like a Focal Clear (lite). I had to A/B test back to back with my Focal Clear OG, then i could pick out the detail and difference. If you dont go back and forth or daily listen to Focal Clears you could mistake the sound of the 109 for that of the Clears. My focals cost x2 the price. So the meze are a deal at the current price, especially on sale. Id get the 650/6XX over the 660S2... But after hearing the HD 600 that is now my first choice of the Sinn's The end result is I own the 109 pro and an HD 6 series headphone, but listen to the 6 series first, if not go for a 650/6XX as it splits the difference between the S2 and HD 600
As always, another excellent review with all of the key attributes and details clearly discussed and explained. Having the Meze 109 Pro and the HD-6XX, I was debating about getting the HD660 S2, but I think I will wait. Although I appreciate your detailed assessment of the S2, I don't see the need at this point to get them, comparing them to the 6XX. Maybe once I hear them I would have a different perspective, but time will tell. Thanks for all your efforts, Josh! Great Channel.
@@reign2027 Right now, I'm leaning towards the 109 Pro, due to sound profile and comfort. But, then when I go back to the 6XX, I am not disappointed and do enjoy it. Overall, I just still find the 109 Pro to have the weight that I want with my sounds, and the 6XX is just a tad thin. So, sometimes, it comes down to the style of music and listening that I will be doing. Not to be wishy-washy, if the price difference wasn't a factor, 109 Pro all day, but the value of the 6XX makes them very, very desirable. Sound only...109 Pro.
I received the 600 S2 this last Monday. I am very surprised how much I like them over 650 which I have owned for 2 years. The 660 S2 just hits a sweat spot and I’m blown away as surprised. Lots of reviews and opinions out there.. based on my experience with them - highly recommend
@@bryansheridan6434 That's the tough, but also awesome thing about Audio. As Josh and other good reviewers do, they will try and compare the devices against other products so that we, the readers/viewers, can have something to judge and guide us towards. As you found out, the sound signature is something that works well for you. That's awesome!
The truth is that Sennheiser found a golden ratio with HD600 midrange, but instead of trying to improve the flaws of HD600s without losing its qualities they have chosen a different route. In particular, they probably thought, why create something which will compete with HD800s and bring its price down, when they could create different iterations of HD600 at roughly the same price (I think HD660s2 price will drop in a year or two, because it seems that it won't be able to compete with Hifiman XS and Ananda). I am criticizing Sennheiser, because it is a great brand and I have a feeling that Sennheiser is stalling, instead of innovating. Don't get me wrong, I really enjoy how HD600 and HD660s sound. but I feel Sennheiser could do better than creating HD660s version 2.
Great video Joshua! I would be interested to see your opinion on how much of an upgrade is in terms of technicality and flavour is an upgrade from the Edition XS to the 109 Pro.
It would be a side grade. Two different animals. The Edition XS, being a planar, would have faster transients, so a punchier, plucky quality to the sound. Being an Ananda owner, this characteristic is very pleasing to my ears! For instance, when I hear a deep subbass sound on the Ananda, the effect is a well defined, crisp rumble. The XS would perform similarly. While the 109 Pro, being a dynamic driver, would be a bit less punchy and rounder, more natural. It's a little bit difficult to explain, unless you have some experience with the different characteristics of planar magnetic drivers and dynamic drivers. But one would not be better or more improved than the other, it's just what I your preference would be for the sound texture.
@@PhoggHawk I am currently running a HD58X and demo'd a Sundara a while back. The planar characteristics were instantly apparent, the speed and pluckiness, the clarity and eveything was great - exepct for the tuning. To me the sundara had poor bass extention, the midrange felt incredibly scooped and highs felt tinny / artificial. I then did my research and the XS seems to fix those issues plenty and I was dead set on it - and then the 109 dropped. In my country it's almost double the price and I simply cannot decide which I want to add to my collection.
He just nailed it. Tuning might be another story, but technically there is no parth to upgrade from XS, at least below 1k. There is to mention, XS needs definitely more juice to sounds it's best (lows). Nothing crazy needed, but phone or mojo 2 by it's own is not enough.
My 109’s arrived six days ago and I attached them to my streamer and let them run in for 100 hours. Initially there was some brightness, but things were sounding wonderful when I had an extended listen last night. I’m very happy with them.
@@Sinsanatis That's just your ears getting used to the headphones lol. Burn in is just a silly myth. It doesn't make sense to buy a pair of headphones and then not use them for a few days.
i own stellia, sundara ,701s, had the ndh20s and walk with my extreeeeme loved Portas in the beginning i didnt like the 660s that much but after getting used 2 it they are my favs no weight ,no clamp nothing that is odd i guess i like it due to the familiarity with the portas which i hear 2 ours a day while comuting the portas and 660s have a grainy puffy smooth sound like a chillout lounge feel i use them with ZAN CAN xbass maybe i snare me a pair of 660s2 later on the used market
i much prefer the 109. they sound wider, more fun and the bass goes deeper and more controlled. the s2 is somewhat a little too laid back for being an open back
The way you describe the characteristics... Really Really nice... I own the 660S... Really like them and what they produce for my taste... What in your opinion would be a similar sounding headphone with a wider soundstage (something that the 660S is lacking)???
I havent heard the 660s before but the hd 700 use the same driver as the hd 660s (albeit with a completely different earcup and pad design) and they have a great soundstage.
While the tuning is different I'm pretty Shure, you will like Neumann ndh 30. It's super transparent and very spacious. I do own a HD 660s too and love it, but Neumann just delivers in EVERY aspect, even longterm listening. Btw it is developed by the same professional behind HD 600 and HD 800.
I managed to fall in love with the 109 Pro and contaminated my band friend too. He bought one after me right the same week. My warning that it's 800dollar did not bother him at all.
Hello, I am new to the Audiophile realm. I just purchased the Meze 109 Pro as my first pair of headphones. I would like some assistance from the community to decide which pair to get as my second. I am going to stick with 2 for the next few years. I am deciding between the Audeze LCD-X, LCD-XC, Hifiman Arya Stealth, Focal Clear MG. My budget is about 1400 plus tax. I was also thinking about getting the Audeze LCD-2 Classic and Hifiman Edition XS together for the price. Can anyone make any recommendations.
Another conclusion is that if you already have a 600 series there is no point in the S2. I have the 650, so if I was in the market for another headphone it would be the Meze. Depends on what you already have. Plus I like the 650 and wouldn't sell it for the S2.
I have a problem with headphones but I really like them - also I cannot use anything that goes in my ears. Headphones are great because they are detailed and accurate but I hate them with some music especially if is too enthusiastically stereophonic because it hurts my ears, I think this is because if I hear live music I move my head around and I can isolate the instrument or vocalist for a few seconds but with headphones I cannot modify how I track sound because it is inbuilt and I get no relief. I also like high quality speakers because the sound is all around me rather than the feeling of being isolated from my surroundings. Are there headphones in the sub 1000 dollar class that would suit me? I know it sounds crazy but sometimes I prefer to hear music drifting in from the next room rather than having it directed at me.
I know the feeling. I'm heavily invested into a 2 channel setup that stays on until everyone goes to bed. It makes you feel like you're there and the music is all around you. I'm extremely thankful to have really cool neighbors! 😀 That being said maybe look for a pair of headphones with a great soundstage. I was testing the HD599s from Sennheiser for a bit but the SQ wasn't quite there for me. It did however have a nice big sound stage that was very pleasing and made me feel like the music was all around me and not right at me. I know there are other options with even larger sound stages and decent SQ out there, so I'd research which ones have the best. I own the HD600 and HD660S2 and they are on the right-at-you side of the scale (small soundstage), with the S2 having a slightly bigger soundstage and better separation but they are among the worst headphones for stage size. . Tube amps and some solid state amps can extend it but not by much. I'm just addicted to the very realistic timbre and mid-range accuracy of these headphones (for the price). I use them to talk on the phone because it's so intimate and accurate/natural sounding that it feels like the person is in the room with me: assuming they have an iPhone or phone with a good mic.
Used to watch your videos but hesitant to trust your opinion ever since you changed your top IEM list to include an IEM that you get a percentage of sells from (IE300). Your review for them wasn’t as favorable and then you suddenly placed them at number one recently. Confused and disappointed.
I know "burn in" is a highly contentious topic, which I personally don't really believe in, but I have heard even from some folks that aren't huge proponents of burn in say that the 109 Pro does soften the treble at least a little after some break in. Did you find this to be true at all after extended listening or did the treble stay the same even after like 100+ hours of use?
I still wonder up to this date if that burn in rlly is a thing, especially on headphones. Making it more smooth/richer overall, like bringing the whole FR more harmonic together.. and cutting some of the weird high frequencies. But maybe its just a Placebo by getting used to them.
@@auro8649 well the difference is in decimals. AKG also mentioned that their headphones need burn in. The difference hasn't changed so it's considered a placebo effect. My ears is sensitive so I had a headphones that had a metalic sound to it, and it got brighter over time, treble was sibilant
I feel like burn in happens pretty quickly. Usually within 2-8 hours. I own the HD600s and when I got the HD660S2 in they sounded terrible for like 5 mins. Kind of tinny, veiled mid-range with a slight grain/distortion and muddiness on the bass. Got slightly worried but after 15 mins they started to sound pretty good and in 2 hours they sounded just like I expected them to sound: Just a little more bass and treble, more detail and slightly bigger soundstage than the almost identical HD600s that my ear were already very well tuned too. I also own a set of Polk L600 tower speakers. Same thing happened. I turned them on and they sounded terrible. Tinny with terrible bass and somewhat muffled mid-range. I had to go to work so right after I set it up I just let it play for 8 hours until I got home. When I returned the sound was refined, clear and the timbre almost lifelike. The bass had opened up with greater detail, speed and impact. My ears and brain didn't get a chance to get used to it. Being that I had to go to work, I was forced to worry about if I had made a bad purchase and would have to send another set of large tower speakers back, but as soon as I got home that worry went completely away. Next I have some Sony Xtra Bass headphones that I kept getting for free because I would warranty them out at a big box store super often. These headphones actually sounded really great for 50 bucks but for the first day or 2 they sounded just terrible, making you question your purchase. After 2-3 days they would start to "sweeten up" and just knock my socks off with their extremely decent SQ and clean bass. I went through 3 pairs because of a mic issue, and it was always the same. To me if feels like Amps have far less burn in time. Usually takes less than 1 hour and they all sound as intended, for better or worse. I've unboxed more than a few and they all react about the same way. As far as cables I seriously doubt it applies. You have a good cable and connections or you don't. Amps often have capacitors and a variety of other electrochemical and electrical parts that could in theory have some burn in need/time to get right. Speakers are mechanical so some tolerances are bound to change over a period of time.
Yes it is, my setup ifi Zen DAC 3 + Zen Can 3 with HD660S2 sounds awful, when everything was new. Couple of days later everything sounds much better. Even amplifier must going through “burn-in”, not just headphones itself. Speakers too, its simple physics.
The Meze 109 Pro is so beautiful. I wanted it to be more to my liking, but with my Lotoo Paw Gold Touch, the S2 just sounds much better to me. The 109 mids are too scooped for me. The 109 Pro treble is downright irritating to my ears. LPGT gives the S2 great delicacy and detail. All frequencies have the midas touch. Every frequency has a seat at the audio table.
Never heard any of them but when referring to reviews it seems that for the 500$ price range the hifiman edition xs is a no-brainer. Can you compare it to the XS? (or the Ananda). Great video btw.
Ie600 is out of this world especially when you paired them with good amp/dac like Questyle M15. I haven’t heard anything under 1500 usd that sounds better than ie600 no matter IEM or OTE.
ieams need no amp. When you compare and iem with a hp with the same price and you have a realy good amp the hp will smash the iem. If you have no amp the iem will smash the HP
@@sebanambrus9265 agree. There is almost no power needed in case to bring iEM's to life. But yes, im sure a great DAC does improve its qualities tremendously.
@@sebanambrus9265 you are talking about raw power I’m talking about sound quality and sound signature. You will always need a good dac (no matter IEM/HP), without good dac, you’re burning your money if you rely on phone/PC dac (most of them). And you need amp for IEM also, it is true that you can run them without, but it’s like in car if you put better quality fuel it will run the engine smoother and maybe bit faster ;) And believe me you will have to spend at least twice as much for better sounding HP and if you put the adequate amp/dac for HP in equation probably you will triple the price to better the sounding of IE600.
The Nectar Ambrosia is a way better headphone then both these 2! If it was sold on the market to everyone would easily be a contender for headphone of the year
I agree, sub bass extension was underwhelming, vocals not being as forward is a step back in why people enjoy the 600 series. The direction they went with them I would get a sundara at that point
@@JCDenton314 Well the thing is, I think alot of people would enjoy the 660s2 over the other 600 line up, but these shouldn't be priced more than the 650s, the 650s do some things better, and the 660s2 do other things better, but I think you are right, advertise this headphone as like a step up from the 650, If that was the case, personally I would buy them (knowing my price to performance is bad). That is not the case though. It's just a different flavor
I love the hd660s and the hd650 both sound similar but offer different takes on the same presentation. The hd660s2 is trying to change hd6 series sound a bit. I'm not a fan of the adjustments they made. I'll try them at canjam.
Just like the HD660S, the S2 seems to be a headphone for people who are either allergic to subbass, upper midrange or treble or to all of these at the same time.
sub bass and treble is like sugar in drink. Go sugar free for a while and when you get a regular drink one days it is extremely sweet and not as good as you remember. when you stop listening to V shape EQ for a long while and go back to those V shape EQ headphone you relized how unrelistic it sounds
Sennheiser resting on its laurels and making only incremental improvements to decades old design and tech and hoping the older-than-60 demographic will buy because they don’t know any better? What a shocker.
waitwhat? when did the 660 s2 become "one of th best"? did i miss something? and that said? Shouldnt you compare either of these more in their own price bracket? so for the 660s2 that might be the Dt1990 pro, Moondrop Venus, Avatone Planar, Neuman NDh30? something in THAT ballpark? Same goes for the 109pro - even though that segment is kinda scarcly populated (Ananda, LCD2 classic, Aeon2 , T1 for example) this seems like an odd comparison.
@@iNoYT when i wrote my comment, it was still in the thumbnail - go figure. And even though - how can a brand new version of a headphone be "most popular"? ( i doubt that the 660 even is one of the most popular in the 600-line) and my main point still stands (valid comparison).
Your close outs are way too fast. You need to drag it out a bit more to prepare us for that final goodbye. Stop treating us like that crazy girlfriend your breaking up w/.
![Electronic wave performance [2] @SheeRaZi](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/eMaKWh-BbD0/mqdefault.jpg)
Loved the 109 Pro! Sampled the entire Meze portfolio at this years Tampa Hifi expo.
Flat out most comfortable headphones from every brand. Musically enjoyable. The build quality at its price point is a steal. Even comparing to Focal clear’s and Arya’s during the same listening sessions, those sound great - but the weight is noticeable after an hour of enjoyment. Meze are like wearing air.
Just got my 109 today. Very happy and impressed so far. Comfort is 9/10. I'm able to wear my glasses comfortably and not rest them on top of the ear pads. No noticable difference in the low end. Highly recommend!
do you have an amp/dac?
@@taherjerjissi9853 yes. Hifiman EF400
I demo'ed the 660s2 and meze 109 in Tokyo. I enjoyed the 660s2 more.
May I ask where you wwnt to? I live in Tokyo but want to hear them before I make a decision!
@@Awkventurer e-earphone is Akihabara
@@Elm8n thank you!
Of course you did... IMO there's no point in an open back trying to have a V shaped, bass dominant sound signature.. Low end will never compete with a closed can, but mids, highs, detail and obviously soundstage will always be better in an open can. Moral of the story - 660S2 stuck in its appropriate lane..
Will you ever revisit the DT 1990 Pro ? It's still in your favourite list, but you never mention it anymore and your review is 4 years old. Just curious !
Has the headphone changed? Why would he re-review it?
@@chrisvanhorn Because he's a more experienced reviewer + has listened to many more headphones since then.
@@KopfKino901 Why don't you listen to them yourself instead of trusting a TH-camr? order them from Amazon and send them back if you don't like them.
@@ixoye56 I own them for a couple of years now. But I don't own/order dozens of headphones like he does. I'm curious to see how they compare to newly released stuff. I also usually agree with Joshua's opinion and taste. Why the negativity ?
@@KopfKino901 Nah bro, just buy dozens of headphones and return them to Amazon. I'm sure Amazon would totally support 10 headphone returns with opened packages in a 3 month span (spoiler, they won't, that other guys advice is ridiculous)
What a fantastic video!!! Really helpful on discovering the strength of each headphones
I own the HD-600, it was the first high end headphone I ever purchased, back around 1999 I believe. The first pair somehow wound up in the bottom of the dishwasher while I was at work one night and that didn't work out well. It was actually my one year old son who dropped them in while his mother had her back turned and she didn't realize. I have since bought a 2nd pair. I also own the Meze 109 Pro. I love both headphones but if I were to choose just one I'd choose the Meze. It's a beautiful headphone. It sounds tremendous to my ears. The earpads are just so comfortable. Clamp force is perfect for my big melon. I think the 109 Pro pads beat those on the Elex or the HD-600 series. It's really a terrific headphone on all accounts in my opinion. I see no real cons here.
as soon as you said clamp force and big melon, you had me agreeing. I have a big head, and tried the early 109 at canjam london 2022. Also had the chance to try a pair of sennheiser HD600s and they clamped like nobodys buisness. I acctually could not wear them for more than about 10 minutes before my head started to ache. It's a shame, because I loved how they sound, but i just cant get over the CLAMP
Great comparison.... but curious about that you gave the 109 Headphone of the Year honors and that your dedicated S2 review seemed a lot more lukewarm about the S2. Yet in this video, the conclusion seemed to be "tom-ah-to or to-may-to". Overall, balance and low-hype is great but still a bit curious about why it shook out that way in this comparison. Are you pretty even about both phones or do you have a preference?
Hah, that's what these reviews do. They basically make up shit as they go and that creates all these funny contradictions because they forget their previous narratives. I doubt it has to be said but maybe not trust these salesmes...umm I mean..product reviewers.
@@gavin8489 Personally, Josh usually does a good job. But I hear ya. Like any review, it's relative, based on subjective experience, and at the end of the day, up to the consumer.
Tbh Josh seems like a nice guy, but he's more focused on putting out an entertaining, well-edited review than necessarily a very information dense and coherent one. The very fact this video is comparing 2 very popular and newer headphones rather than say a Focal Elex or a dt1990 or anything older says a lot about the limitations of how informative he really wants to be.
He'd prefer a 10min, concise video with some information missing over a 25min, thorough comparison between a buncha headphones in the price tier
Nice video! Honestly I would like to own them both. Sennheiser for tube usage and Meze for the rest.
These two kind seem to cover all the bases and I'd love to try out a pair of the Meze someday. Double the price is rough though! Gotta save up!
I went to check out the Caldera a week and a half ago, and the dealer had 109 Pro, was quite impressed for the VFM on the 109 Pro, definitely a good headphone.
Where on earth do you find these dealers :)
Good to keep in mind that the HD660S2 will likely respond FAR better to tube amps than the Meze 109 will. That is the X factor with using such a high impedance set of cans.
The side effect is of course you need way more power to drive them. The HD660S2 can never get concert level on my phone, only normal to low volume. I have to use a fairly powerful DAP, dongle or dac/amp to get them to them there.
Pretty sure the Meze 109 Pro would get stupid loud on even the weakest MP3 player or phone as they claim only 40 ohms but also a sensitivity of 112 which is crazy high. Take the sensitivity number with a grain of salt of course as some companies use slightly different methods to test it, but it will never be off too much. The HD660S2 report 104 sensitivity for some cross reference. Cheers and happy listening!
in Romania , 109 Pro are 700$, and they change alot with the chain used. Im a fan of 600 series , and i will buy 660s2 , but the much better headphone is 109 Pro .
Not a fair comparison Meze 109 Pro is twice the price of the HD660S2 here in Australia at least.
In that $600-$800 range the Ananda Stealth Magnet is now an option. I'd definitely get the Ananda SM over these two
Ananda costs less than $500 right now.
@@sergeyshorokhov2167 The Ananda Stealth Magnet is $700. The OG Ananda is cheaper
@@JTB-- I'm talking about SM version. The old Ananda is discontinued.
@@JTB-- B stock SM Ananda on Hifimans site $510
@@chrisk3127 Well yeah that's a different story when talking B Stock and Used HP prices. I'm talking brand new the Ananda StealthMagnet is $700. The HD660S2 is $600 and the 109 Pro is $800. Of course you can find all these HP's for lower prices used... but many don't want to go that route which can be risky.
Can you compare them directly to 660s?
Thanks!
Yeah, and do it in a blind test m8🙃
Joshua, you are a fan of the Beyerdynamic DT1990 pro and I have them as well. How do the Meze compare to the 1990pro?
Which do you prefer?
Thanks in advance
It's also worth noting both of these headphones respond to different amp. They both can mellow the treble just a small amount on some amps bringing it to a range where i think most people would be very happy.
On tubes or warmer amp like cavalli liquid spark , or the new fiio k11 R2R.
They sound great, though i think the Sinn's respond slightly better on the tubes vs the 109, but they both benifit from them.
On analytical and sterile amps like the THX, they can sound more resolving but the treble can be harsher and brittle . It removes some of the smoothness that makes the 109 attractive. The S2 might actually benifit from the THX to counter act some of the darkness from the more bassy tuning.
I havent tested the 660s2 on my Rupeet Neve Headphone amp, but the 109 pro and 6XX just sound about as good as there going to get on that amp, unless you spend thousands on a amp /DAC.
So amp wise if you want something balanced ,and has a great sound that should pair well with these 2 plus others like the Focal clears etc.
Spend the $500 and get a Rupert Neve. The amp makes a difference with these 2 cans
I had the 109 pro for few weeks before returning them; the problem about the "little too sharp" Ss an Ts (therefore also Fs) you talked about is a huge flaw to me, that's not "on some vocalists", it's litteraly on every voice, no matter the era or style, I've burned them in for more than 200 hours and this flaw never went away, this permanent sibilance is unworthy of a 800 usd headphone. Instead I bought an Ananda Stealth, saved 200 usd and I don't regret my choice.
I'd love to hear the 660S2, tho.
How is the Ananda Stealth compare to other heaphone you have/had?
@@Nicolas38260 I've owned the Senn 660, the Ananda is miles ahead, better in all categories (soundstage, details, bass presence), period. I have the Focal Elegia (I know, it's a closed back) and once again the Ananda is the clear winner, even if the Elegia has a better slam in the lower range, it's not enough to compete.
A friend of mine came last week with his Kennerton Thekk which costs 3000 usd and even him was amazed by the Ananda performance and recognized that the Ananda, mostly because of its big pads that envelop the entire ear, had a more credible soundstage and overall presence. And to be honest, when I heard his headphone a year ago I was very impressed by it but not so much since I've had the Ananda and to be honest, I wouldn't trade my gear for his.
I'm not working for Hifiman and I gain nothing to say this, but the Ananda, at 600 usd is a freakin steal, if you didn't yet, go and try it.
@radinan i would have gone deeper into Hifiman but the risk of ChiFi is rough for anything above the Sundara. Sennheisers and Beyers can survive hell. So can Grados. Hifiman can't. Not that i plan on breaking them but its in the back of my mind
@@MrAhuraMazda Well, 8 months later the Ananda is still here and it's still working like a charm and I use it very often with my DAP,. But to be honest I've upgraded my desk system and also bought the Arya SE which is of course better, as you can see I'm now a big Hifiman fan and I hope you're not right about long term resistance, we'll see.
I’d love to see a comparison the 660s2 and the Hifiman edition xs, for price they are closer together than the 109.
Edition xs has questionable build but better sound than 109 pro
I wanted to see the s2 vs elex
@@ass_eating_man Eh, idk about that. 109 Pro and XS I can see either sounds better than the other. Also for comfort it's not even close, which is a factor that reviewers will gloss over
@@PantsaBear it does not. Edition xs sounds better I have heard both and sent 109 pro back. But, yes 109 is significantly more comfortable and hifiman qc issues are well known. Other than that edition xs is my pick for the best headphone under 1000 dollars. Meze 109 pro is almost 300 dollars dearer than edition xs and a good step back in sound qualities
I own meze 109 pro ananda stealth focal clear mg Sundara 560s 58x & 6xx… I don’t know I am kind of over the HD 6 series these all seem like slight variations of the same headphone … all mids and no bass… I don’t know I feel like it’s watching a big 4K tv with the bottom 1/3 of the screen missing (everything you see and hear is good but there’s a lot missing meaning no bass )…I am not a bass head I just feel it’s a big part of the music … I always use subs with 2 channel listening so when I go to the hd6 series it just seems so lacking in bass of any kind …although the mids are very good….for me the meze 109 pro, clear mg, and ananda stealth are just so much more enjoyable all around and present the music so much better than the sennheisers … I have heard the 660s and didn’t like it … unless this is markedly different 600 bucks is way too much for a plasticky sennheiser build and sound…. Just my two cents
Beautiful set of headphones you got there. Can't agree more, except I didnt really missed the bass of them the most. For me its just total lack of clarity, resolution, depth and spacing in the music of these cans. Overhyped? For me 100%, but thats just my opinion.
You’ve described the Senn 600 series perfectly. They are overrated but people keep hyping them. Just like they used to with (and still do in some corners) the m50s lol
I have the Sundare and i really like it. How is it compare the Ananda Stealth?
@@Nicolas38260 if you like the Sundara that’s great enjoy it … is the ananda stealth better .. I think it has a little more stage and airiness … however, is it spending another 700 dollars better … no….the Sundara is good… everything above it may sound a little better hear and there but I don’t think anything sounds 10 times better than Sundara …. Especially if you eq and add a bit of bass … you’re good … don’t go down the rabbit hole like the rest of us searching for perfection that ultimately may not be there … lol
Thank you so much for this great review and comparison. Much appreciated.
I wish one of the reviews when covering genre had covered Classical as i mostly only listen to classical piano and orchestra and from the impression of the 109 it seems more rock and electro music which you addressed.
I own the 660S2 and while solo and small group works sound fantastic, larger orchestral music gets slightly messy due to the very small sound stage it presents: Larger soundstages generally mean better detail and separation of instrument, helpful for reproducing large ensemble works, assuming your source is engineered well of course.
They do have a fantastic timbre and instruments sounds incredibly natural, specially in the midrange area. Voices and choir is also pretty rock solid. If the recording is great, the sound production will match. It can be hauntingly accurate when listening to solo mid range focused works. That small soundstage helps to make it sound like you are often playing the instruments yourself, making it feel about as intimate as you can get! Something my speakers, or no other headphone I've heard can do.
I suspect for piano on Meze might sound better due to it's increased dynamic range and impact. Drums equally.
Also all that extra detail that the Meze is giving you, combined with a much bigger soundstage as well as far better dynamics means the Meze will almost surely destroy the 660S2 when it comes to orchestral reproduction. It might even be the better choice overall but it does cost 2x as much. My bet is on the Meze being the better overall headphone by far for Classical. I don't mind personally as a classical lover because I save the complex works for when I get home and use my way more dynamic 2 channel speaker setup.
I see many of these companies will let you try the Meze or Sennhesier risk free for 45-60 days. Pretty much how I bought all of my audio equipment. I've sent a ton of stuff back but I am a pretty big fan of what the HD6 series can do and they do it so well (midrange tube amp superstars, something the Meze has no ability in) that I have 2 in the series. Just take care of the product and packaging incase you don't like them and want to send them back.
This comparison really lessened my curiosity over the 109, though (haven't tried them yet).
same.. I don't usually care for an open back that tries to sound like a V. That's the job of a closed can TBH...
Hi Joshua, can you do a comparison between the Focal Clear MG Pro and Meze 109 Pro?
How do these two compare to the HifiMan Edition XS?
They're both dynamic drivers and not Hifiman, so I'm sure the mids will not sound artificially smooth, contrived and lifeless.. which is what every Hifiman including my HE400 SE, Ananda Nano and HE500 all sound like to me...
Just got my 109 pros. Amazing headphones. Strongly recommend
Lovely review. What is the background track you play?
I like to try the 660 S2 because I liked the S1 a lot more than the original 600 / 650.
I've heard good things on the ibasso sr3. Would be nice if you could review it in the future an throw it in the mix.
I find this comparison really odd because you opinion was neutral. You didn't say I prefer this over that so I don't know which headphone is the better choice. Which one if you only had to buy one?
I found the review helpful. Josh's description of the type of music and the emphasis on accurate timbre makes my decision to listen to the 660S2, among other headphones, much easier. His choice of contrasts and comparisons resonates with what I look for in a headphone. I get full soundstage when listening through my 2-channel system, and am looking for a more intimate, in-my-head experience with headphones - with lush, realistic mid-range reproduction of "real" instruments recorded in small, intimate spaces. Small ensemble jazz, blues, alternate music, early music, string quartet, piano, esoteric culture-specific instruments, instrumental duets, vocals & vocal harmonies....with only the odd classic rock track thrown in. I'm looking to be swept up in the musicality of the headphone, and am not interested in analytic highs or emphasized bass response.
I listened to both at CanJam Dallas 2024 and purchased the 109 Pro and Alba from Meze at the show. The S2 didnt sound as good as my 6XX to me, i also listened to the HD600 and i think they sound better than the 660s2 AND my 6XX.
I think the bass on the S2 sounded off to me, the balance on the HD600 was better across the range and i find the HD650/6XX splits the difference between the S2 and 600.
I think the 109 pro sounds like a Focal Clear (lite).
I had to A/B test back to back with my Focal Clear OG, then i could pick out the detail and difference.
If you dont go back and forth or daily listen to Focal Clears you could mistake the sound of the 109 for that of the Clears. My focals cost x2 the price. So the meze are a deal at the current price, especially on sale. Id get the 650/6XX over the 660S2... But after hearing the HD 600 that is now my first choice of the Sinn's
The end result is I own the 109 pro and an HD 6 series headphone, but listen to the 6 series first, if not go for a 650/6XX as it splits the difference between the S2 and HD 600
The Meze looks beautiful.
Nice review 👍 one of the best audio reviewers in youtube along with Golden Should and Wave Theory.
As always, another excellent review with all of the key attributes and details clearly discussed and explained. Having the Meze 109 Pro and the HD-6XX, I was debating about getting the HD660 S2, but I think I will wait. Although I appreciate your detailed assessment of the S2, I don't see the need at this point to get them, comparing them to the 6XX. Maybe once I hear them I would have a different perspective, but time will tell. Thanks for all your efforts, Josh! Great Channel.
meze 109 or 6xx?
@@reign2027 Right now, I'm leaning towards the 109 Pro, due to sound profile and comfort. But, then when I go back to the 6XX, I am not disappointed and do enjoy it. Overall, I just still find the 109 Pro to have the weight that I want with my sounds, and the 6XX is just a tad thin. So, sometimes, it comes down to the style of music and listening that I will be doing. Not to be wishy-washy, if the price difference wasn't a factor, 109 Pro all day, but the value of the 6XX makes them very, very desirable. Sound only...109 Pro.
I received the 600 S2 this last Monday. I am very surprised how much I like them over 650 which I have owned for 2 years. The 660 S2 just hits a sweat spot and I’m blown away as surprised. Lots of reviews and opinions out there.. based on my experience with them - highly recommend
@@bryansheridan6434 That's the tough, but also awesome thing about Audio. As Josh and other good reviewers do, they will try and compare the devices against other products so that we, the readers/viewers, can have something to judge and guide us towards. As you found out, the sound signature is something that works well for you. That's awesome!
@@bryansheridan6434 how it compares to Focal Clear and HD800 ? S2 got good techincals ?
The truth is that Sennheiser found a golden ratio with HD600 midrange, but instead of trying to improve the flaws of HD600s without losing its qualities they have chosen a different route. In particular, they probably thought, why create something which will compete with HD800s and bring its price down, when they could create different iterations of HD600 at roughly the same price (I think HD660s2 price will drop in a year or two, because it seems that it won't be able to compete with Hifiman XS and Ananda). I am criticizing Sennheiser, because it is a great brand and I have a feeling that Sennheiser is stalling, instead of innovating. Don't get me wrong, I really enjoy how HD600 and HD660s sound. but I feel Sennheiser could do better than creating HD660s version 2.
I also feel the same way.
Have you personally heard the 660S2?
It would be interesting to see a comparison to the Audeze LCD-2C
Great video Joshua! I would be interested to see your opinion on how much of an upgrade is in terms of technicality and flavour is an upgrade from the Edition XS to the 109 Pro.
It would be a side grade. Two different animals. The Edition XS, being a planar, would have faster transients, so a punchier, plucky quality to the sound. Being an Ananda owner, this characteristic is very pleasing to my ears! For instance, when I hear a deep subbass sound on the Ananda, the effect is a well defined, crisp rumble. The XS would perform similarly. While the 109 Pro, being a dynamic driver, would be a bit less punchy and rounder, more natural. It's a little bit difficult to explain, unless you have some experience with the different characteristics of planar magnetic drivers and dynamic drivers. But one would not be better or more improved than the other, it's just what I your preference would be for the sound texture.
@@PhoggHawk I am currently running a HD58X and demo'd a Sundara a while back. The planar characteristics were instantly apparent, the speed and pluckiness, the clarity and eveything was great - exepct for the tuning. To me the sundara had poor bass extention, the midrange felt incredibly scooped and highs felt tinny / artificial.
I then did my research and the XS seems to fix those issues plenty and I was dead set on it - and then the 109 dropped.
In my country it's almost double the price and I simply cannot decide which I want to add to my collection.
Well, the lower price and the fact that I love the planar sound would sell me on the Edition XS. It's a matter of personal preference, of course.
Lol. Zero. Edition xs is better sounding has more details but meze as always looks prettier so there is your extra 300 bucks
He just nailed it.
Tuning might be another story, but technically there is no parth to upgrade from XS, at least below 1k.
There is to mention, XS needs definitely more juice to sounds it's best (lows). Nothing crazy needed, but phone or mojo 2 by it's own is not enough.
Excellent video. Very informative and very well done 👍
HD660s2 Is amazing Headphone for 400 euros MAX ... After some months would be nice VFM
Yep. Don't pay more. In fact wait until it gets even cheaper if you aren't in a hurry!
If it its possible please review the neumann NDH 30 and ollo s5x 🙏
Ananda Nano or this Meze 109 Pro. I cannot decide....
Thank You. Great Comparison
My 109’s arrived six days ago and I attached them to my streamer and let them run in for 100 hours. Initially there was some brightness, but things were sounding wonderful when I had an extended listen last night. I’m very happy with them.
is that how that works? u essentially "break them in" and that reduces the sharpness of the treble?
@@Sinsanatis meze said it themselves
@@cyb huh. i didnt know it worked like that. i guess maybe i do remember my headphones being a bit sharp when i got them
@@Sinsanatis Its a myth. Same with "burn-in". They say it so you would miss the refund deadline while "burning in"
@@Sinsanatis That's just your ears getting used to the headphones lol. Burn in is just a silly myth. It doesn't make sense to buy a pair of headphones and then not use them for a few days.
i own stellia, sundara ,701s, had the ndh20s and walk with my extreeeeme loved Portas
in the beginning i didnt like the 660s that much but after getting used 2 it they are my favs
no weight ,no clamp nothing that is odd
i guess i like it due to the familiarity with the portas which i hear 2 ours a day while comuting
the portas and 660s have a grainy puffy smooth sound like a chillout lounge feel
i use them with ZAN CAN xbass
maybe i snare me a pair of 660s2 later on the used market
i much prefer the 109. they sound wider, more fun and the bass goes deeper and more controlled. the s2 is somewhat a little too laid back for being an open back
So basically, the S2 combined with the iFi Audio X-Bass and X-Space amp features would be the equalizer?
Great video as always 👍
Anyone compared only on subbass quality, level and extension ? between EDITION XS -VS- HD660S2
I applaud you for your integrity I want an unbiased review.
The way you describe the characteristics... Really Really nice...
I own the 660S... Really like them and what they produce for my taste... What in your opinion would be a similar sounding headphone with a wider soundstage (something that the 660S is lacking)???
I havent heard the 660s before but the hd 700 use the same driver as the hd 660s (albeit with a completely different earcup and pad design) and they have a great soundstage.
@@trevor245 thank you very much…
While the tuning is different I'm pretty Shure, you will like Neumann ndh 30.
It's super transparent and very spacious.
I do own a HD 660s too and love it, but Neumann just delivers in EVERY aspect, even longterm listening.
Btw it is developed by the same professional behind HD 600 and HD 800.
@@danielzweipunktnull2670 thanks a million...
Is there a way to listen to a pair before I buy them???
@@mzeeshanch It's simple to do in Germany, thanks to return policys. Think you have to figure out, how it works out in your region, buddy.
Good luck.
Would love to hear your thoughts on the DCA Aeon Noire as well. Been debating between those and the 109 Pro's.
I really hesitate to get the 109 with its elastic headband system and limited 2 year warranty.
I wouldn’t be. Meze’s are extremely well built and user serviceable. Plus their customer service is top notch.
Can you do a comparison between the focal clear and the meze 109
I managed to fall in love with the 109 Pro and contaminated my band friend too. He bought one after me right the same week.
My warning that it's 800dollar did not bother him at all.
109 PRO vs Edition XS when
Hello, I am new to the Audiophile realm. I just purchased the Meze 109 Pro as my first pair of headphones. I would like some assistance from the community to decide which pair to get as my second. I am going to stick with 2 for the next few years. I am deciding between the Audeze LCD-X, LCD-XC, Hifiman Arya Stealth, Focal Clear MG. My budget is about 1400 plus tax. I was also thinking about getting the Audeze LCD-2 Classic and Hifiman Edition XS together for the price. Can anyone make any recommendations.
I'd pick the 660S2 any day if I have the money.
now a days you could buy ananda stealth for 350$ that destroy them both in price and performance
@@soulfulfool I don't know, their products are known to have Build Quality issues.
Hifiman Edition XS or Meze 109 pro?
I use an HD580 and would appreciate a comparison with those
Another conclusion is that if you already have a 600 series there is no point in the S2. I have the 650, so if I was in the market for another headphone it would be the Meze. Depends on what you already have. Plus I like the 650 and wouldn't sell it for the S2.
Hello my friend, did you reply to the message? Is this official or a fraud?
Josh could you plz do a video on little bear fu32 amp seems like a fun little amp thanks 😉
I have a problem with headphones but I really like them - also I cannot use anything that goes in my ears. Headphones are great because they are detailed and accurate but I hate them with some music especially if is too enthusiastically stereophonic because it hurts my ears, I think this is because if I hear live music I move my head around and I can isolate the instrument or vocalist for a few seconds but with headphones I cannot modify how I track sound because it is inbuilt and I get no relief. I also like high quality speakers because the sound is all around me rather than the feeling of being isolated from my surroundings. Are there headphones in the sub 1000 dollar class that would suit me? I know it sounds crazy but sometimes I prefer to hear music drifting in from the next room rather than having it directed at me.
I know the feeling. I'm heavily invested into a 2 channel setup that stays on until everyone goes to bed. It makes you feel like you're there and the music is all around you. I'm extremely thankful to have really cool neighbors! 😀
That being said maybe look for a pair of headphones with a great soundstage. I was testing the HD599s from Sennheiser for a bit but the SQ wasn't quite there for me. It did however have a nice big sound stage that was very pleasing and made me feel like the music was all around me and not right at me. I know there are other options with even larger sound stages and decent SQ out there, so I'd research which ones have the best.
I own the HD600 and HD660S2 and they are on the right-at-you side of the scale (small soundstage), with the S2 having a slightly bigger soundstage and better separation but they are among the worst headphones for stage size. . Tube amps and some solid state amps can extend it but not by much. I'm just addicted to the very realistic timbre and mid-range accuracy of these headphones (for the price). I use them to talk on the phone because it's so intimate and accurate/natural sounding that it feels like the person is in the room with me: assuming they have an iPhone or phone with a good mic.
Used to watch your videos but hesitant to trust your opinion ever since you changed your top IEM list to include an IEM that you get a percentage of sells from (IE300). Your review for them wasn’t as favorable and then you suddenly placed them at number one recently. Confused and disappointed.
I know "burn in" is a highly contentious topic, which I personally don't really believe in, but I have heard even from some folks that aren't huge proponents of burn in say that the 109 Pro does soften the treble at least a little after some break in.
Did you find this to be true at all after extended listening or did the treble stay the same even after like 100+ hours of use?
I still wonder up to this date if that burn in rlly is a thing, especially on headphones. Making it more smooth/richer overall, like bringing the whole FR more harmonic together.. and cutting some of the weird high frequencies. But maybe its just a Placebo by getting used to them.
@@auro8649 well the difference is in decimals. AKG also mentioned that their headphones need burn in. The difference hasn't changed so it's considered a placebo effect. My ears is sensitive so I had a headphones that had a metalic sound to it, and it got brighter over time, treble was sibilant
It is real very easy to spot the differences.
I feel like burn in happens pretty quickly. Usually within 2-8 hours. I own the HD600s and when I got the HD660S2 in they sounded terrible for like 5 mins. Kind of tinny, veiled mid-range with a slight grain/distortion and muddiness on the bass. Got slightly worried but after 15 mins they started to sound pretty good and in 2 hours they sounded just like I expected them to sound: Just a little more bass and treble, more detail and slightly bigger soundstage than the almost identical HD600s that my ear were already very well tuned too.
I also own a set of Polk L600 tower speakers. Same thing happened. I turned them on and they sounded terrible. Tinny with terrible bass and somewhat muffled mid-range. I had to go to work so right after I set it up I just let it play for 8 hours until I got home. When I returned the sound was refined, clear and the timbre almost lifelike. The bass had opened up with greater detail, speed and impact. My ears and brain didn't get a chance to get used to it. Being that I had to go to work, I was forced to worry about if I had made a bad purchase and would have to send another set of large tower speakers back, but as soon as I got home that worry went completely away.
Next I have some Sony Xtra Bass headphones that I kept getting for free because I would warranty them out at a big box store super often. These headphones actually sounded really great for 50 bucks but for the first day or 2 they sounded just terrible, making you question your purchase. After 2-3 days they would start to "sweeten up" and just knock my socks off with their extremely decent SQ and clean bass. I went through 3 pairs because of a mic issue, and it was always the same.
To me if feels like Amps have far less burn in time. Usually takes less than 1 hour and they all sound as intended, for better or worse. I've unboxed more than a few and they all react about the same way.
As far as cables I seriously doubt it applies. You have a good cable and connections or you don't. Amps often have capacitors and a variety of other electrochemical and electrical parts that could in theory have some burn in need/time to get right. Speakers are mechanical so some tolerances are bound to change over a period of time.
Yes it is, my setup ifi Zen DAC 3 + Zen Can 3 with HD660S2 sounds awful, when everything was new. Couple of days later everything sounds much better. Even amplifier must going through “burn-in”, not just headphones itself. Speakers too, its simple physics.
Damn, this review is crazy helpful :)
The Meze 109 Pro is so beautiful. I wanted it to be more to my liking, but with my Lotoo Paw Gold Touch, the S2 just sounds much better to me. The 109 mids are too scooped for me. The 109 Pro treble is downright irritating to my ears. LPGT gives the S2 great delicacy and detail. All frequencies have the midas touch. Every frequency has a seat at the audio table.
a comparison I wanted thanks
I really enjoy my Hifiman Ananda - But I wonder how they would compare to these two new contenders.
Never heard any of them but when referring to reviews it seems that for the 500$ price range the hifiman edition xs is a no-brainer.
Can you compare it to the XS? (or the Ananda).
Great video btw.
How can anything with elastic bands can last 10 years?
Ok, but HD660S2 is for 450 euros and Meze 109 Pro for 780 euros in middle Europe, so…
That settles it. I need both of them.
Funny, I did a head to head with these two cans AND the 109 won!!!
Another comparison with the Edition XS would be great!
think the ie600 would be a better buy than the 660s2
Ie600 is out of this world especially when you paired them with good amp/dac like Questyle M15.
I haven’t heard anything under 1500 usd that sounds better than ie600 no matter IEM or OTE.
ieams need no amp. When you compare and iem with a hp with the same price and you have a realy good amp the hp will smash the iem. If you have no amp the iem will smash the HP
@@sebanambrus9265 agree. There is almost no power needed in case to bring iEM's to life. But yes, im sure a great DAC does improve its qualities tremendously.
@@sebanambrus9265 you are talking about raw power I’m talking about sound quality and sound signature. You will always need a good dac (no matter IEM/HP), without good dac, you’re burning your money if you rely on phone/PC dac (most of them). And you need amp for IEM also, it is true that you can run them without, but it’s like in car if you put better quality fuel it will run the engine smoother and maybe bit faster ;)
And believe me you will have to spend at least twice as much for better sounding HP and if you put the adequate amp/dac for HP in equation probably you will triple the price to better the sounding of IE600.
IE 600 was $480 on Drop exactly 1 week ago (as of this post) for about 6 hours until Drop stopped the 20% code from working lol.
The Nectar Ambrosia is a way better headphone then both these 2! If it was sold on the market to everyone would easily be a contender for headphone of the year
660S2 is an overpriced disappointment , doubt it would sell very well at all.
I agree, sub bass extension was underwhelming, vocals not being as forward is a step back in why people enjoy the 600 series. The direction they went with them I would get a sundara at that point
Straight facts.
I suspect this might be Sennheisers new ownership either being greedy, or testing the waters to see how much they can get away with
Have you heard it already?
@@JCDenton314 Well the thing is, I think alot of people would enjoy the 660s2 over the other 600 line up, but these shouldn't be priced more than the 650s, the 650s do some things better, and the 660s2 do other things better, but I think you are right, advertise this headphone as like a step up from the 650, If that was the case, personally I would buy them (knowing my price to performance is bad). That is not the case though. It's just a different flavor
You pay for the bronze on the S2
I love the hd660s and the hd650 both sound similar but offer different takes on the same presentation.
The hd660s2 is trying to change hd6 series sound a bit.
I'm not a fan of the adjustments they made.
I'll try them at canjam.
Hi Josh!!!! Call it telepathy 😁 I’ve been waiting for you to do this comparison, and here we go … Bingo!👍🏼
No chance I’ll pay 600+ in a hd600/650
Funny how people forget the big price difference.
Can they work cordless?
Nope
Josh, if you're looking for a good rock album, check out Greta Van Fleet's, Battle at Gardens Gate.
the HD660S2 doesn't even play in the same league and i've had every 6X0 headphone.
this is a good thing right?
Just like the HD660S, the S2 seems to be a headphone for people who are either allergic to subbass, upper midrange or treble or to all of these at the same time.
sub bass and treble is like sugar in drink. Go sugar free for a while and when you get a regular drink one days it is extremely sweet and not as good as you remember. when you stop listening to V shape EQ for a long while and go back to those V shape EQ headphone you relized how unrelistic it sounds
@@GG-zv9ku Having audible treble and subbass is neither linked to a v-shaped sound signature nor unrealistic.
the 660 S2 is worse for bass than the 600? uhh ok
like bro your videos are too perfect, like in a clean room sterile kind of way.
Magical video.
I cant trust anyone that rates Topping junk they get free 😂
Mick Gordon's Doom soundtrack is best on DT 1990 by far. It's transcending.
Sennheiser resting on its laurels and making only incremental improvements to decades old design and tech and hoping the older-than-60 demographic will buy because they don’t know any better? What a shocker.
Way too expensive for what they do. $300-400 should be their price, not $600-800.
Sounds like I made the right choice.
Can you review the hifiman ananda Stealth magnet edition
waitwhat? when did the 660 s2 become "one of th best"? did i miss something?
and that said? Shouldnt you compare either of these more in their own price bracket? so for the 660s2 that might be the Dt1990 pro, Moondrop Venus, Avatone Planar, Neuman NDh30? something in THAT ballpark?
Same goes for the 109pro - even though that segment is kinda scarcly populated (Ananda, LCD2 classic, Aeon2 , T1 for example)
this seems like an odd comparison.
he didn't say one of the best, he said one of the most popular. don't put it in quotes if youre not gunna actually quote it correctly
@@iNoYT when i wrote my comment, it was still in the thumbnail - go figure.
And even though - how can a brand new version of a headphone be "most popular"? ( i doubt that the 660 even is one of the most popular in the 600-line) and my main point still stands (valid comparison).
Do u want to have that on your Head 8:00 or that 8:05 ... :) LoL it looks like its from 80s Heavy Big headphone.
Ferii feri goot kawan👉👍👍👍👌🤗💖💟🇮🇩
109 is my favorite but fit sucks for my head
Maybe Sennheiser got a box of smell from Nvidia be like: Just increase the prices, ppl will buy anyway.
Your close outs are way too fast. You need to drag it out a bit more to prepare us for that final goodbye. Stop treating us like that crazy girlfriend your breaking up w/.
There's no way this S2 will be that popular lol