Finn played the Uno reverse card on all the black metal fans and started gatekeeping against them. Die a hero, or live long enough to become the villain.
Interesting fact, the artist behind Moevot actually made up his own entire language for the lyrics. That amount of dedication to your art, even knowing that hardly anyone is going to listen to it or like it, is pretty fucking inspiring. I think that's the purest form of being creative, having no motive other than to express yourself in a challenging or unorthodox way.
So did the vocalists from the band Öxxö Xööx, they've been in multiple bands and i think they mostly use their own language in all of them. There's a dictionary a few hundred words long on one of their websites, the dedication is insane
I remember the Varg/Euronymous/church burnings didn't really brought BM to the mainstream. There were two bands that truly "civilized" the genre and made it into some sort of pop culture phenomenon in the late 90's: Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir. All of a sudden there were hot goth chicks wearing Emperor t-shirts.
Black metal died in the 90s .. as soon as it reached other borders across the seas , the whole point was lost .. I know it sounds cheesy but it truly died with Dead and Euronymous.. it was never meant to reach so many ears ..just a small circle of outcasts .. and I feel darkthrone should have stuck with a more death metal sound like Soulside Journey .. I’m glad Fenriz moved away from the black metal sound and influence on later releases .. and I do like some stuff from Xasthur , Crebain , mutilation .. i take it as fun , and a tribute to a lost scene and window of time 🤘🏼
Black metal is super diverse. I'd say it's grown outward in style way more than other genres of the last 30ish years. I'm not saying it's all good, but there's still cool and unique stuff coming out all the time.
Damn man I could listen to you talk about weird ass avant garde dungeon synthy black metal all day just like I'd listen to you talk about new metal or modern rap. The analysis is great.
Finn's commentary throughout the whole thing is gold. Accurate and also, giving a perspective on how the most unsettling metal sub genre can actually be. To be appreciated as the art that truly is. On top of that, I used to like the most "predictable" black metal -- bands like Dark Funeral, Gorgoroth and Abigail Williams were my go-to music 12-13 years ago but what Finn showed was some next level weird underground sh!t that I never thought it could be a thing in the black metal scene. I'm surprised on how far the creativy of those individuals who make that music can go, it's over the top yet impressive.
I completely didn’t even know that black metal actually went that far down a rabbit hole. Basically what you played was drumless shoegaze with no chord structure. I didn’t know black metal was supposed to just be anti-music. I appreciate the education.
Your explanation of why black metal is no longer “dangerous” at the beginning I cite as the main reason you see some of these groups doing the NSBM thing. I think most of them don’t actually gaf about the shitty mentality behind it, they just realize that it’s one of the few remaining ways to still get people riled up.
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA So let's just not tell anybody about Summoning on this video, an actual anti-facist and very incredible bm band started in 1995. But no no no, they don't sound "bad" enough for you. Even tho none of their stuff was mainstream until after 2000, they have never played live and refuse to do so. Hell man one of the members doesn't even own a guitar, never has. Yes the'yre Tolkein but still nobody did anything like it in 1995. They could be ther only reason atmo black is where it is today.
@@Thomas-gv8zl you’re honestly butt-hurt because he didn’t mention ONE band that you’re a fan of? Clearly you are new here. Make your own video about them if you feel they deserve more credit
@@Thomas-gv8zl He’s said before that none of his videos were comprehensive lists, and that includes his scripted videos on his main channel. Do you really think he intentionally neglected to mention that one band that you like because he was secretly a fascist sympathizer, or do you think he just wanted to move on from the topic of Nazism and couldn’t find a way to connect them to the main topic, assuming he knows about them at all?
I agree that's why some of them do it. But it's such an easy, low-effort and unoriginal way to rile people up that it comes across as sad rather than genuinely edgy to me. Plus there are always the idiots who will read the lyrics and be like "Yeah, we need to genocide the [a group nazis hate] people, that'll help!" And it's just not good enough art to be worth causing that sort of society damage.
1. I absolutely love the abruptum love. They’re one of my all time favorite black metal bands. Sonically speaking, I think they’re the most pure black metal you can get. 2. Re: Zeal and Ardor, I agree that they are safe and accessible sonically speaking. But conceptually they’re pretty radical. The guy started the project because he asked 4chan for random music genres for him to try blending, and some of the first responses were “black metal” and “n*gger music” (which says everything you need to know about 4chan users). So he, as a black man, interpreted that to mean African spiritual music merged with black metal, and sought to explore the question “what if black slaves in America embraced satan instead of Jesus?” And, with those goals in mind, I think he nails it. It’s ultimate outsider music in concept, even if sonically it’s pretty approachable. And it kind of alienates everyone who enjoys African spiritual music, and everyone who enjoys black metal. And isn’t alienating most of your potential fan base kind of the spirit of black metal anyway?
This completely makes sense. Couldn’t say it better. Black Metal should not be safe and easily accessible. Drawing Down the Moon by Beherit is a wild BM album
Dude my dad said the same EXACT thing about Zeal & Ardor when I played them for him. I completely agree that it sounds like Imagine Dragons. They're definitely sanitized and often oversimplified but it's nice in small doses.
I agree with you, i just wanna say that nobody realizes zeal & ardor arent trying to be except the people who try and stretch it. They fuze soul and pop with black metal; so its gonna look weird when comparing it to actual black metal but they arent black metal. Theyre more like experiment pop metal; and sorry it bothers me people dont seem to realize that
@@bolt3354 I get what you're saying and mostly agree. Their stuff isn't lazily put together or anything. They're really laying into that soul and pop sound when it pops up. At the end of the day, metal nerds will love their subgenre buckets and outright refuse to believe their precious tremolo guitars could fit somewhere outside of their comfort zone. Speaking of metal nerds loving their subgenre buckets: I have a hard time agreeing with the "experimental" tag on them. To my understanding, that term generally connotes the art has that high-level detached/outsider aspect described in this video. If you don't mind me asking, how do you mean it?
Not sure why there are so many comments saying "Wait for the black metal nerds to show up" ect. There's nothing in this video he said that's controversial, he's right that atmosphere and feeling make a black metal song a lot better. If people are gonna get upset that he called Watain boring, they're probably entry level black metal fans that only discovered the genre because edgy church burnings lmao.
Funny how you dismiss the church burnings as ‘edgy’. Edgy would be wearing your CoF “Jesus is a C*nt” shirt to the mall. Burning down multiple 300 year old church’s and murdering multiple ppl is a bit past ‘edgy’ ffs... I like BM, have since I was a teen, and as a history buff, I think burning down historical monuments for some bullsh¡t ‘cause’ is idiotic and unforgivable. Like ¡s¡s bl0w¡ng up ancient Egyptian monuments, it’s f**king ridiculous and absurd. But it seems that as a “global community“, we have began to be desensitized to large scale violence and violent events. This isn’t a video game where ppl blink a few times and come back, no reset button. So I think dismissing The destruction of irreplaceable historical monuments as simply ‘edgy’ is taking it a bit too lightly
You can also turn that around and say that people who claim to only listen to weird ass underground stuff that's on the edge of not being music are also posers. Yes, atmosphere is what makes black metal so great but more popular stuff like dark funeral for example also has amazing atmosphere.
zeal & ardor is outsider imo bc of the subject matter & context - their last two albums were essentially “black metal” written from the perspective of black american slaves, tapping into the evil they saw & relating it to the evil classic black metal used to talk about in a real-world sense add that they started on 4chan & it’s fuckin terrifying if you ask me but also yeah tbh they kinda sound like imagine dragons sometimes lmao
Not quite "from" 4chan, the creator was getting people on /mu/ to give him genres to mash up and one person said black metal and someone else said "[redacted] music." He decided to take that and make it good as a fuck you to that guy
Subject matter of the lyrics is whiny and overdone from the perspective or a broader social context; pretty embarrassing, really. Also, the music itself is garbage in and of itself and there is nothing black metal about it.
@@durielcaine7762 Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm I wonder why you don't like it? 🤔🤔🤔 There must be some reason, but I can't really figure it out.... hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
This was an incredibly interesting and informational video! I’ve been aware of the LLN bands for awhile now and I definitely have an appreciation for bands that aren’t looking to make accessible music (check out an African band called Duma if you get a chance- definitely sounds like something you could appreciate), but hearing your philosophy on outsider art, regardless of the black metal label, was really cool. I loved your discussion on art philosophy too, which as a STEM person, is something that I really haven’t had much exposure to. I’m perfectly fine with listening to a lot of the more “pop” bands as you put it because a) they still evoke plenty of emotions for me and b) I don’t really care about whether or not something is outsider art. Again I think true outsider art can be very cool, but imo there’s still plenty of room for artists to make art that isn’t as extreme. You having such an extremist take on music is really interesting though The weirdest black metal that I regularly listen to is Silencer’s Death Pierce Me, which is one of the most abysmal, depressing pieces of music I’ve ever heard. Not sure if that’s something you’d consider outsider art, but it’s for sure fucking weird. I’ve tried showing it to some of my friends over the years and I’ve always gotten back the “why tf do you listen to this” type responses lol
So, Finn likes lofi blackmetal to study to... I was hoping for Fleurety's "a darker shade of evil" or the hi-fi crazyness of Dodheimsgard's "International 666" or the rest millenium Norway black trip hop scene of that time. Immortal and Darkthrone are crazily catchy though and somewhat oldschool.
@@jeanpierre5941 Ulver, Fleurety. Also a bit of Arcturus. Mayhem's Grand Declaration of War also goes there. Dodheimsgard get wildly electronic in International 666 and more conventional in Superhero Outcast. Thorns self titled album is great Industrial laced atmospheric black metal. These are albums from 20 years ago though
Nude Descending a Staircase was the inspiration for the song "Naked Girl Falling Downstairs" by The Cramps, who I think are worth mentioning because despite writing some great songs, they were also legit just REALLY weird - in a pretty different way to black metal though. First time I heard them I was like "the fuck is this jangly shit, this ain't punk!" and just really didn't get it. It sounded like my parents rock-n-roll/doowop stuff, but my parents had this visceral dislike of it which piqued my interest. 20 years later, I freaking love The Cramps. Really interesting to get a more personal take on black metal from you. Big thumbs up for this video!
Ive taken so much art history during my college years to become a photographer. It really informed my ideals as a photographer. The stuff you're playing is like J-Dilla's Donuts album that he made on his death bed. Dilla was so far ahead of the curve for hip hop and r&b tracks. And I could talk about graphic design and fonts for hours. I consume consumer media by trying to deconstruct where the it's come from.
I endlessly appreciate real, wrenching, volatile black metal and what it stands for and what it does, but I don’t like listening to it. I like to listen to music that’s nice to listen to. So I appreciate both sides. I’ll enjoy weird standoffish niches to garner a greater appreciation for the genre and fall more in love with it, but I’ll listen to the accessible, “dumb” shit because it’s enjoyable to me. My ears like it. It’s not much to think about, not much to analyze, but it can be fun and it can be a vibe.
Anaal Nathrakh- Between Shit and Piss We Are Born was a song that really blew the doors open for me. It was a whole new plateau of anger. Black metal guys seem to shit on them for some reason, but they know what they're doing. They're songs are completely raw abd angry verses balanced against catchy and melodic choruses and its great for a workout.
Anaal Nathrakh is one of the most original metal band I know and it's probably the most intense band too ! The first time I heard them I was directly in love with their music
Due to the loss of my eyesight it feels like I’ve missed out on a lot of integral parts of this video but I still enjoyed it very much… And I keep envisioning those invisible oranges. Thanks for the great content, Finn!
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA no need for apologies… No one’s fault, just bad luck of the draw in the genetics department. Also, I’m 51 years old and it didn’t start getting aggressive until I was about 43 so I had a good run. And I still got my ears, at least.
This was really fun to watch, insightful too. The relationship with art history was very cool. Your content is consistently good and thought provoking. Big love from Ireland 🇮🇪.
i love watching finn just gush about music and art he loves. so entertaining to watch. finn always makes me think differently about everything lol i kinda wish all of this was on spotify so finn could make a playlist cause the stuff he showed kinda slapped
I'm mainly a Hip-Hop head to the core but I was raised on metal. What I like about black metal is its SUPER melodic and its got some heavy ambience. I fuck with the vibes bruh
classic bathory, darkthrone, mayhem, emperor, mgla, profanatica, plaga, matwa aura, inquisition, tbh a lot of good stuff. didn't like it earlier, now kinda grown to like it more and more
took me a while to realize Havohej is Jehova spelled backwards lol. I also love Abruptum. Thanks for showcasing some band with a similar aesthetic. great stuff
That was an interesting discussion Finn! I like a lot of black metal and atmospheric dark ambient for pretty much your same reasons. There's just something oddly comforting about it all. It's not something I play everyday, but I appreciate it being there for when I need it most.
I would absolutely love to see more videos in this style. A series about your favorite outsider art for each genre would be so amazing. Loved this video. Thanks Finn! Edit: you should check out “Xasthur - Telepathic with the deceased”. Beautiful atmospheric depressive suicidal black metal. It creates a trance like listening experience like you mentioned in this video.
Also check out The Caretaker, Everything at the end of time. It's a musical art piece representing the stages of dementia and the final decent into death. It's quite the journey
Abruptum is one of my favorite bands of all time. I had to get Evil genius when I started listening to them since its litteraly the music I have been searching for a long time, and later I went to a metal show and people were selling vinyls, cd and cassettes and I found Orchestra of dark there. While the music in orchestra of dark is in evil genius it takes the sound quality from the original cassette and it also has a kickass 7 min noise outro.
The part about political ideologies not applying to them. Reminded me of the Cenobites from the Hellraiser franchise, just so fucked up that they're beyond concepts like good and evil.
Hey Finn - Great video. I always find it really interesting to watch people talk about things they're passionate about. Wanted to provide some feedback so you don't feel pressure to just give the nostalgia fans what they want. This is much much better than covering whatever is on Metal Injection.
Man, this is really taking me back... memories I haven't thought of for years. Trading tapes and underground 'zines through snail mail before the internet really took off. The American Noise metal scene in the mid 90s. Bands like The Meatshits. Analcunt. Dead To Earth. Raised in Meat. With this video, you sir have earned a like and subscribe.
Definitely recommend one of my favourite projects Jute Gyte (Adam Kalmbach) when it comes to weird, inaccessible and nerdy black metal, one man project from Missouri (currently lives in Washington) and uses a lot of microtonal scales and generated sequences when assembling his music. Very "atonal", alien and soulcrushing but imo very rewarding and definitely has its own beautiful quality that really shows once you get more and more into his stuff. There's quite a lot of people who have a hard time digesting his sound but he definitely has acquired a solid little fanbase over the many years. Very prolific as well, drops a new album quite regularly and he always explains his unique creative process for every project in the bandcamp descriptions. All his albums come in DVD cases. Philosophically a lot of it steers away from the typical BM-ethos (he has a track called "Your Blood And Soil Are Shit And Piss" and another one "Romanticism Is Ultimately Fatal" for example). Aside from his metal-oriented stuff he also drops projects that are entirely electronic and also usually based on some weird sequence he came up with, you could even say for that reason there's a sort of incidental quality to it. He's a pretty big nerd for philosophic literature and frequently draws from those when writing his lyrics, with lots of themes of existentialism. He frequently donates money made from his projects to a myriad of causes and relief funds as well. jutegyte.bandcamp.com/album/oviri jutegyte.bandcamp.com/album/birefringence
His stuff is usually waaaay too dense for me but occasionally he strikes pure euphoria through chaos and that's exactly the kind of payoff I need for being challenged at this level. Dissected Grace is one of my favorites of his and my favorite album of his is Senescence.
@@InfamousQwaQwaFruit I had to take his albums a few songs at a time in the very beginning but I became very obsessed with his discography to the point where I was basically constantly plowing myself through his albums every day for a little while. There is indeed an element of sonic beauty and euphoria underneath that pummeling chaos that I really connected with, which makes a lot of his output very rewarding to me. I would say for how bizarre a lot of the chords he uses are I think there's definitely a lush sort of quality to a lot of it as well. My favorite is Oviri I'd say but Young Eagle, Birefringence, Perdurance and Senescence are favorites as well.
I can be pretty critical of your videos but looking back at this one, is probably my favorite video you’ve done. I still think there is a lot of value in teaching people something outside of their “music I listened to in high school”. I enjoy this video quite a bit
If you think being dangerous and counterculture is all BM is I think you're glossing over the most important thing which is the music itself. Black metal was no longer dangerous after 95/96, when everyone had heard about it. So where do you go from there? A zillion records have come out since, of which i'm sure the majority is trash, but the recent wave of new bands like DSO, MGLA (and countless others) brings out incredibly atmospheric music that stays true to the original formula, yet still innovates musically. Are they the new darkthrone? No, ofcourse not. But some of the new music out there is still incredibly dark, yet listenable and fresh. It doesn't have to be a goddamn noise project that will end you in a mental asylum if you listen to it for more than an an hour, just because you wanna be counterculture. BM today is NOT what it was 25 years ago. I wouldn't even call it a movement, like it was back then. But that doesn't mean it doesn't have anything meaningful to say. One upping every previous band with increasingly harder to listen to, more experimental, more noisy music might push the limit in terms of what's extreme but doesn't do much musically.
Transylvanian Hunger pretty much opened it up to go even more primal within Blackmetal. Growing up some of my favorite BM bands were suicidal black metal and how unsettling it made you feel, bit relaxed at the same time
This is why as a black metal fan i respect you. Sure you pissed off a lot of black metal fans with your other black metal video, but the black metal you do like is black metal as fuck and you make all the haters look like posers.
Finn, I'm sure you'd like the Polish bm band Mgla, especially their 2015 album Exercises In Futility. It sounds good, got great lyrics, the music is masterfully composed, and the drumwork is just off the fucking charts.
Is burzum safe? is peste noire safe? And of course, the Les Légions Noires members being members of very good NS bands. They make great music, even though their moral compass isn't %100 up to snuff. I love black metal bands that are not aligned with my morals, but I still love them for their music. Do you still like them, even though as you said they are or are not "safe"?
This is by far the best video you’ve ever done. You should do more about the nexus of art and music. I’ve heard said of talk radio that a host can speak on any subject and if he is excited and interested in the topic regardless of the subject matter, his audience will be engaged. You’re clearly very passionate about art history and how it can enhance your understanding of music; you should do more videos like this. Have courage, your audience will find you.
At the end of the day people should just like what they like. I've been listening to black metal for 20 years and ultimatley the thing and that draws me to this music (the raw emphasis on atmosphere as oppose to a self felating relentless shred fest) I also find in other non metal music genres like post punk, dark wave, shoe gaze, etc. I honestly couldn't give 2 shits about corpse paint or the controversy surrounding black metal, even if the church burnings and Varg/Euronymus fued never happened I'd still listen to this music because I like it based on it's own merit sonically speaking. The whole "kult" concept was literally thought up by a bunch of bored 19 year olds residing in a relatively prosperous and homongenous region of the world, with too much time and money on their hands, desperatley trying to find a way to feel superior in an otherwise lackluster music scene. As far as calling Watain "hipster shit" because they're melodic and have good recording production behind then, maybe my definition of hipster is different than yours. Living in Chicago for 33 years I always observed hipsters as people who went out of their way to profess their supposed keen interest in obscure bullshit as an attempt to come off as cultured or something. Havohej and other bands like them in my humble opinion are literal toilet music (i'm playing that scene from King of the Hill in my head right now) that only prentious people trying to sound hip would pretend to actually like. But again like what you like, life is too short. Only death is real...
You got so much real great black metal bands and there's so much subgenres like melodic black metal, atmospheric black, Blackened death metal, black/doom ! I really love Batushka, Summoning, Agalloch, Satyricon, Darkthrone, Ildaruni, Human Serpent, Bathory !
I learned about all the underground through Magazines. Fanzines were the shit. 1990 we would trade tapes and get like 3inch records straight from the bands through post office !! Those were real scenes. And Gorgoroth, Burzum and Mayhem, Dark Throne, Marduk made this. It was the scene not the music really. Dudes were creating chaos between the music, living the scene. Anyone can make noise.
I think the bands that have made the most interesting "Black Metal" in the last ten years are the guys all the elitists hate. Deafheaven, Litrugy (especially Litrugy they've made some wild shit, look no further than their 2019 record H.A.Q.Q.) and Portrayl of Guilt's new album "CHRISTFUCKER." I guess Portrayl of Guilt is more screamo, but they count in my book. Really anyone whose trying to experiment in genre. I know two of those are critical darlings but they've genuinely tried to do something new. Edit: Ghost Bath too, especially their early work.
I’m glad y’all can see Finns extreme taste in music haha. A lot of people mistake that he doesn’t know a lot about underground extreme music. However he actually knows so much and is so far on the extreme end of it.
I'll never forget my friend, junior year of high school being super excited about Bile "Suckpump" and playing it in his mom's apartment with the most amazing 1997 sound system
Great video! I'm into weird outsider black metal as well, and always approached it from a similar angle to you. I went to art school in the 1990s and it was so weird to see metal dovetailing with something deeper, weirder. I was into a lot of noise at the time as well, and I had a friend who was into the same stuff who was in the film department, and we would listen to this stuff along with Japanese noise.
You have to understand that he is a critic and not a (black metal) musician. He has some interesting takes regarding the genres' original intent etc but If he COULD COMPOSE (and not rehearse or just play) the simplest "catchy" intermediate black metal riff he would enjoy Deathspell Omega for what they do. Sour grapes.
And ironically his favorite genre is pop punk which is literally the most predictable and bland genre of all time in my opinion. Pop punk like 99.9% of the time uses the same chords, and very similar rhythms, riffs and very generic lyrics and etc. Deathspell songs are extremely experimental with hard to play riffs, unique chord progression and have esoteric smart lyrics about various different occult philosophies. He doesn’t know what he is talking about.
@@Madverick He's not into that, he's too worried about being in the simulation & he will never like black metal he came across as forcing himself to like the music in the video to appeal to the community
This is honestly a great video and discussion on the whole idea of what Black Metal was supposed to be and should be. And, I have to point out that you provided some really great recommendations to check out, thank you.
You actually have a great taste in black metal! Not sure why any "black metal nerds" would be angry at this video as you described the ethos behind black metal very well...
I was right behind you it was like 97 or 98 when I was getting into all the swedish and Norwegian metal that I'm into. Also got huge into cryptopsy at the same time period , And started playing guitar, so of course I fell in love with all the heaviest most brutal music on the planet immediately
I'm not into black metal, so I'd never listened to any of this. So I checked out Zeal and Ardor. The "Imagine Dragons" shade is a little unfair, but i can see where it's coming from. I wouldn't necessarily call the style black metal and since I'm not into black metal anyway, i don't care. But as music it was fine.
Somehow listening to Dillinger Escape Plan and earl sweatshirts last few albums prepared me for this video and honestly this doesn't sound bad. I really don't understand how this is "metal". I completely understand how this is seen as music and art. There is an odd sense of peace and beauty in this.
Emperor was my first dip into black metal too! I was so young at the time, I had to hide the cds from my folks, I had some of the peaceville digi packs, there was an At the Gates one (not BM I know) with a satyr and a pentagram and the whole thing felt super explicit, scary and like I was doing something forbidden to my young teenage mind. I didn’t even have a particularly religious upbringing.
Well this actually is a good video, also showing a huge problem within the black metal scene. Black metal started as the outsider music and idealized this inaccessibility. Well they might not wanted to be commercial, but still promoted their music... So the promotion worked and they became more and more popular, resulting in their level of inaccessibility becoming normal. Now to be "real" black metal people feel like they have to become even more inaccessible... To the level, that it being music is questionable. I like black metal, because of it sound, but not because of it being made by weird as people that try to be the weirdest of them all. I respect musicians that do creative art, and that definitely is the difference between Ariana grande and zeal and ardor. I hate most black metal fans, because them trying to be the hardest, most true, most elite, weirdest outsider or whatever is actually just being a poser. Because being a poser means not being yourself to me. And their actions actually depend on others than themselves...
Come hang out on Twitch! www.twitch.tv/finnmckenty
Burzum is good
@@jwalksk Probably the type of stuff he wouldn't be into. ;)
You are a nazi white supremacist proud boy for making a video that endorses these horrible people
@@CoomerGremlinDGGfan he dosent lisent to nazi black metal
@@nemanjamarkovic2444 yes he does. All those bands he talked about were either Nazi's or nazi sympathizers
Finn played the Uno reverse card on all the black metal fans and started gatekeeping against them. Die a hero, or live long enough to become the villain.
YOOOOO!!!!!! 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
the abyss stares back
Lol, how do you defeat black metal fans: you gatekeep them.
This comment fucking sums it up
yeah, I unironically asked him during the stream if he is trolling lol
Interesting fact, the artist behind Moevot actually made up his own entire language for the lyrics. That amount of dedication to your art, even knowing that hardly anyone is going to listen to it or like it, is pretty fucking inspiring. I think that's the purest form of being creative, having no motive other than to express yourself in a challenging or unorthodox way.
I believe the singer in a band called Sigor Ros did the same thing.
It's called Gloatre.
So did the vocalists from the band Öxxö Xööx, they've been in multiple bands and i think they mostly use their own language in all of them. There's a dictionary a few hundred words long on one of their websites, the dedication is insane
Not only Möevöt, most BL / LLN circle used that invented language.
As a black metal nerd, Finn, I fucking love this video. Unapologetic, honest, certain to piss people off… sounds like black metal ethos to me!
Exactly
Pure Cope
@@cthuludreams1 no
Pretty much my exact thoughts on BM as well, though I do enjoy the occasional ”mainstream” bm like Bathory and Darkthrone
I remember the Varg/Euronymous/church burnings didn't really brought BM to the mainstream. There were two bands that truly "civilized" the genre and made it into some sort of pop culture phenomenon in the late 90's: Cradle of Filth and Dimmu Borgir. All of a sudden there were hot goth chicks wearing Emperor t-shirts.
Listening to Finn gate keeping over a dudes gargling over PS1 survival horror game music is the unintentionally comedy I needed today. 👌
It was so epic felt like a movie scene
Black metal died in the 90s .. as soon as it reached other borders across the seas , the whole point was lost .. I know it sounds cheesy but it truly died with Dead and Euronymous.. it was never meant to reach so many ears ..just a small circle of outcasts .. and I feel darkthrone should have stuck with a more death metal sound like Soulside Journey .. I’m glad Fenriz moved away from the black metal sound and influence on later releases .. and I do like some stuff from Xasthur , Crebain , mutilation .. i take it as fun , and a tribute to a lost scene and window of time 🤘🏼
@@clstileWas it ever alive? The whole genre is a joke to me.
@@clstile black metal never existed. It's just shitty Death metal with makeup and screaming rather than growling.
@@ChristopherJames1993Yeah terrible take, you look like you’re not allowed within 50 ft of schools.
You almost broke at purple cloak "It makes you think of a Purple Cloak and why there would be a Purple Cloak?" Gotta be one of your best lines.
Black metal is super diverse. I'd say it's grown outward in style way more than other genres of the last 30ish years. I'm not saying it's all good, but there's still cool and unique stuff coming out all the time.
This is Finn truly stating what he enjoys deeply about art and that's awesome.
yeah, and people probably clicked this video hoping it would be about music. 😂
finn needs to listen to death industrial
Finn just went full black metal hipster on all the mainstream black metal fans.
Damn man I could listen to you talk about weird ass avant garde dungeon synthy black metal all day just like I'd listen to you talk about new metal or modern rap. The analysis is great.
inhukyeo
This is amazing. Imagine riding round with Finn and he grabs the AUX cord to play this. 🤣🤣🤣
"Purple cloak, what a great song title, makes you think about a purple cloak"
😂
And like… why would there be a Purple Cloak?
Finn's commentary throughout the whole thing is gold. Accurate and also, giving a perspective on how the most unsettling metal sub genre can actually be. To be appreciated as the art that truly is.
On top of that, I used to like the most "predictable" black metal -- bands like Dark Funeral, Gorgoroth and Abigail Williams were my go-to music 12-13 years ago but what Finn showed was some next level weird underground sh!t that I never thought it could be a thing in the black metal scene.
I'm surprised on how far the creativy of those individuals who make that music can go, it's over the top yet impressive.
“It’s this dude standing here in a field... black-metaling?” 🤣🤘
“Real” black metal sounds like stage 5 of everywhere at the end of time with vocals
Haha...and the really interesting stuff sounds like Stage One
🤣🤣🤣
I completely didn’t even know that black metal actually went that far down a rabbit hole. Basically what you played was drumless shoegaze with no chord structure.
I didn’t know black metal was supposed to just be anti-music. I appreciate the education.
nah that's the noise genre
Lantlos would be a good band for you to check.
Your explanation of why black metal is no longer “dangerous” at the beginning I cite as the main reason you see some of these groups doing the NSBM thing. I think most of them don’t actually gaf about the shitty mentality behind it, they just realize that it’s one of the few remaining ways to still get people riled up.
Yep I think that’s the case
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA So let's just not tell anybody about Summoning on this video, an actual anti-facist and very incredible bm band started in 1995. But no no no, they don't sound "bad" enough for you. Even tho none of their stuff was mainstream until after 2000, they have never played live and refuse to do so. Hell man one of the members doesn't even own a guitar, never has. Yes the'yre Tolkein but still nobody did anything like it in 1995. They could be ther only reason atmo black is where it is today.
@@Thomas-gv8zl you’re honestly butt-hurt because he didn’t mention ONE band that you’re a fan of? Clearly you are new here. Make your own video about them if you feel they deserve more credit
@@Thomas-gv8zl He’s said before that none of his videos were comprehensive lists, and that includes his scripted videos on his main channel. Do you really think he intentionally neglected to mention that one band that you like because he was secretly a fascist sympathizer, or do you think he just wanted to move on from the topic of Nazism and couldn’t find a way to connect them to the main topic, assuming he knows about them at all?
I agree that's why some of them do it. But it's such an easy, low-effort and unoriginal way to rile people up that it comes across as sad rather than genuinely edgy to me.
Plus there are always the idiots who will read the lyrics and be like "Yeah, we need to genocide the [a group nazis hate] people, that'll help!" And it's just not good enough art to be worth causing that sort of society damage.
1. I absolutely love the abruptum love. They’re one of my all time favorite black metal bands. Sonically speaking, I think they’re the most pure black metal you can get.
2. Re: Zeal and Ardor, I agree that they are safe and accessible sonically speaking. But conceptually they’re pretty radical. The guy started the project because he asked 4chan for random music genres for him to try blending, and some of the first responses were “black metal” and “n*gger music” (which says everything you need to know about 4chan users). So he, as a black man, interpreted that to mean African spiritual music merged with black metal, and sought to explore the question “what if black slaves in America embraced satan instead of Jesus?” And, with those goals in mind, I think he nails it. It’s ultimate outsider music in concept, even if sonically it’s pretty approachable. And it kind of alienates everyone who enjoys African spiritual music, and everyone who enjoys black metal. And isn’t alienating most of your potential fan base kind of the spirit of black metal anyway?
Didn’t know that about their origin, really interesting!
Did not expect an art lesson, but I'm here for it. Art history was one of my favorite classes in college
This completely makes sense. Couldn’t say it better. Black Metal should not be safe and easily accessible. Drawing Down the Moon by Beherit is a wild BM album
Dude my dad said the same EXACT thing about Zeal & Ardor when I played them for him. I completely agree that it sounds like Imagine Dragons. They're definitely sanitized and often oversimplified but it's nice in small doses.
I agree with you, i just wanna say that nobody realizes zeal & ardor arent trying to be except the people who try and stretch it. They fuze soul and pop with black metal; so its gonna look weird when comparing it to actual black metal but they arent black metal. Theyre more like experiment pop metal; and sorry it bothers me people dont seem to realize that
@@bolt3354 I get what you're saying and mostly agree. Their stuff isn't lazily put together or anything. They're really laying into that soul and pop sound when it pops up. At the end of the day, metal nerds will love their subgenre buckets and outright refuse to believe their precious tremolo guitars could fit somewhere outside of their comfort zone.
Speaking of metal nerds loving their subgenre buckets: I have a hard time agreeing with the "experimental" tag on them. To my understanding, that term generally connotes the art has that high-level detached/outsider aspect described in this video. If you don't mind me asking, how do you mean it?
I love Zeal and Ardor, I think they did something original and unique. I’d agree they aren’t traditional black metal. I say so what
Thank you Finn for introducing me to the absolute God Tier band that is Havohej along with all of the other greatness in this video
God Tier cringe.
@@Adamchinae tell us you a poser without telling us you a poser, Son
Not sure why there are so many comments saying "Wait for the black metal nerds to show up" ect. There's nothing in this video he said that's controversial, he's right that atmosphere and feeling make a black metal song a lot better. If people are gonna get upset that he called Watain boring, they're probably entry level black metal fans that only discovered the genre because edgy church burnings lmao.
Exactly. The only people who will get butthurt are posers.
Exactly
Funny how you dismiss the church burnings as ‘edgy’. Edgy would be wearing your CoF “Jesus is a C*nt” shirt to the mall. Burning down multiple 300 year old church’s and murdering multiple ppl is a bit past ‘edgy’ ffs... I like BM, have since I was a teen, and as a history buff, I think burning down historical monuments for some bullsh¡t ‘cause’ is idiotic and unforgivable. Like ¡s¡s bl0w¡ng up ancient Egyptian monuments, it’s f**king ridiculous and absurd. But it seems that as a “global community“, we have began to be desensitized to large scale violence and violent events. This isn’t a video game where ppl blink a few times and come back, no reset button. So I think dismissing The destruction of irreplaceable historical monuments as simply ‘edgy’ is taking it a bit too lightly
Exactly! LLN bands, for example, have way more credibility in the black metal scene than a band like Watain.
You can also turn that around and say that people who claim to only listen to weird ass underground stuff that's on the edge of not being music are also posers.
Yes, atmosphere is what makes black metal so great but more popular stuff like dark funeral for example also has amazing atmosphere.
Finn can we please have a hour long video of you talking about art, with weird experimental black metal in the background. I would honestly love that
Yes especially with how all these old demos from the 90s keep getting erased from TH-cam unfortunately
*grabs popcorn knowing that black metal nerds will eventually show up and get uncontrollably angry and upset*
Suck for them, that the dislike button got nuked, lol
@@BJSepuku Did it? I can still see it myself.
@@BJSepuku dislikes ist krieg
In fairness, I'm not sure why they would. The bands listed in this video are ones that are well respected in the black metal underground...
@@themetalmeltdownofficial TH-cam seems to be rolling the changes out in waves, not for everyone at once
How you mentioned Duchamp in a video about black metal is just genious. Never made the link myself but it is so damn accurate.
zeal & ardor is outsider imo bc of the subject matter & context - their last two albums were essentially “black metal” written from the perspective of black american slaves, tapping into the evil they saw & relating it to the evil classic black metal used to talk about in a real-world sense
add that they started on 4chan & it’s fuckin terrifying if you ask me
but also yeah tbh they kinda sound like imagine dragons sometimes lmao
Didn’t know theyre from 4chan, that is interesting!
Not quite "from" 4chan, the creator was getting people on /mu/ to give him genres to mash up and one person said black metal and someone else said "[redacted] music." He decided to take that and make it good as a fuck you to that guy
@@empyreanmax Oh, wow. That's pretty insane.
Subject matter of the lyrics is whiny and overdone from the perspective or a broader social context; pretty embarrassing, really.
Also, the music itself is garbage in and of itself and there is nothing black metal about it.
@@durielcaine7762 Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm I wonder why you don't like it? 🤔🤔🤔 There must be some reason, but I can't really figure it out.... hmmmmmmmmmmmmm
This was an incredibly interesting and informational video! I’ve been aware of the LLN bands for awhile now and I definitely have an appreciation for bands that aren’t looking to make accessible music (check out an African band called Duma if you get a chance- definitely sounds like something you could appreciate), but hearing your philosophy on outsider art, regardless of the black metal label, was really cool. I loved your discussion on art philosophy too, which as a STEM person, is something that I really haven’t had much exposure to. I’m perfectly fine with listening to a lot of the more “pop” bands as you put it because a) they still evoke plenty of emotions for me and b) I don’t really care about whether or not something is outsider art. Again I think true outsider art can be very cool, but imo there’s still plenty of room for artists to make art that isn’t as extreme. You having such an extremist take on music is really interesting though
The weirdest black metal that I regularly listen to is Silencer’s Death Pierce Me, which is one of the most abysmal, depressing pieces of music I’ve ever heard. Not sure if that’s something you’d consider outsider art, but it’s for sure fucking weird. I’ve tried showing it to some of my friends over the years and I’ve always gotten back the “why tf do you listen to this” type responses lol
Thank you!
That French depressive suicidal black metal shit sounds like something Bones would sample and make a banger from them
Blut aus Nord of France and Drudkh of Ukrain are pretty solid black metal bands
blut aus nord is fuckin haunted. have you heard MoRT? shit sounds crazy
@@mirrorface637 fucking Mort on mushrooms. Blew my brain to pieces. Only time i felt true terror in my life. Cheers!!!
@@EMK666 LMAO!!! fuuuuuuuck THAT!!
You’re really painting a target on your back with this one.
He knows. That's why he titled it that way. Love it.
Big black metal fan and I thought this was a great video!
Corpse painting a target lol
He is only targeting himself for the posers.
Corpse painted target
This is one of my favorite videos from you. Thank you for all the great music recommendations as always.
Never thought Vapor Memory would listen to Black Metal instead of Vaporwave, cool.
So, Finn likes lofi blackmetal to study to...
I was hoping for Fleurety's "a darker shade of evil" or the hi-fi crazyness of Dodheimsgard's "International 666" or the rest millenium Norway black trip hop scene of that time.
Immortal and Darkthrone are crazily catchy though and somewhat oldschool.
Norwegian black trip hop??? I’m so lost, what are you talking about.
@@brensherlock ulver and arcturus
@@brensherlock Manes as well
Can you give more band name of black metal trip hop?
@@jeanpierre5941 Ulver, Fleurety. Also a bit of Arcturus.
Mayhem's Grand Declaration of War also goes there.
Dodheimsgard get wildly electronic in International 666 and more conventional in Superhero Outcast.
Thorns self titled album is great Industrial laced atmospheric black metal. These are albums from 20 years ago though
Nude Descending a Staircase was the inspiration for the song "Naked Girl Falling Downstairs" by The Cramps, who I think are worth mentioning because despite writing some great songs, they were also legit just REALLY weird - in a pretty different way to black metal though.
First time I heard them I was like "the fuck is this jangly shit, this ain't punk!" and just really didn't get it. It sounded like my parents rock-n-roll/doowop stuff, but my parents had this visceral dislike of it which piqued my interest.
20 years later, I freaking love The Cramps.
Really interesting to get a more personal take on black metal from you. Big thumbs up for this video!
You know what would make my year?
If Punk Rock MBA does a Cramps segment!
Ive taken so much art history during my college years to become a photographer. It really informed my ideals as a photographer. The stuff you're playing is like J-Dilla's Donuts album that he made on his death bed. Dilla was so far ahead of the curve for hip hop and r&b tracks. And I could talk about graphic design and fonts for hours. I consume consumer media by trying to deconstruct where the it's come from.
I endlessly appreciate real, wrenching, volatile black metal and what it stands for and what it does, but I don’t like listening to it. I like to listen to music that’s nice to listen to. So I appreciate both sides. I’ll enjoy weird standoffish niches to garner a greater appreciation for the genre and fall more in love with it, but I’ll listen to the accessible, “dumb” shit because it’s enjoyable to me. My ears like it. It’s not much to think about, not much to analyze, but it can be fun and it can be a vibe.
i'm gonna listen to Havohej when i design a wedding venue website today; this is fire
😂hell ya
Anaal Nathrakh- Between Shit and Piss We Are Born was a song that really blew the doors open for me. It was a whole new plateau of anger. Black metal guys seem to shit on them for some reason, but they know what they're doing. They're songs are completely raw abd angry verses balanced against catchy and melodic choruses and its great for a workout.
Anaal Nathrakh is one of the most original metal band I know and it's probably the most intense band too ! The first time I heard them I was directly in love with their music
Due to the loss of my eyesight it feels like I’ve missed out on a lot of integral parts of this video but I still enjoyed it very much… And I keep envisioning those invisible oranges. Thanks for the great content, Finn!
Thanks man! Sorry about your sight my friend, that must be really difficult
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA no need for apologies… No one’s fault, just bad luck of the draw in the genetics department.
Also, I’m 51 years old and it didn’t start getting aggressive until I was about 43 so I had a good run. And I still got my ears, at least.
This was really fun to watch, insightful too. The relationship with art history was very cool. Your content is consistently good and thought provoking. Big love from Ireland 🇮🇪.
i love watching finn just gush about music and art he loves. so entertaining to watch. finn always makes me think differently about everything lol i kinda wish all of this was on spotify so finn could make a playlist cause the stuff he showed kinda slapped
Most of it isnt on spotify sadly
@@FinnMckentyPRMBA welp. Time for a TH-cam playlist. So barbaric haha
I'm mainly a Hip-Hop head to the core but I was raised on metal. What I like about black metal is its SUPER melodic and its got some heavy ambience. I fuck with the vibes bruh
30 mins of Finn gatekeeping black metal
I AM THE BLACK WIZARDS
I worked with Paul Ledney’s (Havohej, Profanatica) wife at a retail clothing store, she was such a sweetheart, even gave me a signed CD from him.
Amazing lol
classic bathory, darkthrone, mayhem, emperor, mgla, profanatica, plaga, matwa aura, inquisition, tbh a lot of good stuff. didn't like it earlier, now kinda grown to like it more and more
took me a while to realize Havohej is Jehova spelled backwards lol. I also love Abruptum. Thanks for showcasing some band with a similar aesthetic. great stuff
Wtf. I've heard it for years and my wife's family is full of witnesses but I never thought to read it backwards.
That was an interesting discussion Finn! I like a lot of black metal and atmospheric dark ambient for pretty much your same reasons. There's just something oddly comforting about it all. It's not something I play everyday, but I appreciate it being there for when I need it most.
Listening to Moevot while Finn McKenty talks about Braque, it doesn't get much weirder than this
I would absolutely love to see more videos in this style. A series about your favorite outsider art for each genre would be so amazing. Loved this video. Thanks Finn!
Edit: you should check out “Xasthur - Telepathic with the deceased”. Beautiful atmospheric depressive suicidal black metal. It creates a trance like listening experience like you mentioned in this video.
Also check out The Caretaker, Everything at the end of time. It's a musical art piece representing the stages of dementia and the final decent into death. It's quite the journey
Immortal was an amazing band. Super good output and consistency
Black metal in principle should always strive to be an original art piece in every aspect of the sense
Black Metal along with Thrash Metal are the most versatile metal subgenres
yep super vast in terms of what's been done.
Abruptum is one of my favorite bands of all time. I had to get Evil genius when I started listening to them since its litteraly the music I have been searching for a long time, and later I went to a metal show and people were selling vinyls, cd and cassettes and I found Orchestra of dark there. While the music in orchestra of dark is in evil genius it takes the sound quality from the original cassette and it also has a kickass 7 min noise outro.
Thanks for mentioning Zeal and Ardor.
Never heard of them, and while you hate it, I looked them up and kinda like it : )
The part about political ideologies not applying to them. Reminded me of the Cenobites from the Hellraiser franchise, just so fucked up that they're beyond concepts like good and evil.
If you ever wondered what the elevator music between the 7 levels of hell sounds like. Here it is
Hey Finn - Great video. I always find it really interesting to watch people talk about things they're passionate about. Wanted to provide some feedback so you don't feel pressure to just give the nostalgia fans what they want. This is much much better than covering whatever is on Metal Injection.
Gotta give people their nu metal and ska videos!
Finn: Bands need to write good songs!
Also Finn: Unreleased black metal is the best.
Man, this is really taking me back... memories I haven't thought of for years. Trading tapes and underground 'zines through snail mail before the internet really took off. The American Noise metal scene in the mid 90s. Bands like The Meatshits. Analcunt. Dead To Earth. Raised in Meat.
With this video, you sir have earned a like and subscribe.
Definitely recommend one of my favourite projects Jute Gyte (Adam Kalmbach) when it comes to weird, inaccessible and nerdy black metal, one man project from Missouri (currently lives in Washington) and uses a lot of microtonal scales and generated sequences when assembling his music. Very "atonal", alien and soulcrushing but imo very rewarding and definitely has its own beautiful quality that really shows once you get more and more into his stuff. There's quite a lot of people who have a hard time digesting his sound but he definitely has acquired a solid little fanbase over the many years. Very prolific as well, drops a new album quite regularly and he always explains his unique creative process for every project in the bandcamp descriptions. All his albums come in DVD cases. Philosophically a lot of it steers away from the typical BM-ethos (he has a track called "Your Blood And Soil Are Shit And Piss" and another one "Romanticism Is Ultimately Fatal" for example). Aside from his metal-oriented stuff he also drops projects that are entirely electronic and also usually based on some weird sequence he came up with, you could even say for that reason there's a sort of incidental quality to it. He's a pretty big nerd for philosophic literature and frequently draws from those when writing his lyrics, with lots of themes of existentialism. He frequently donates money made from his projects to a myriad of causes and relief funds as well.
jutegyte.bandcamp.com/album/oviri
jutegyte.bandcamp.com/album/birefringence
His stuff is usually waaaay too dense for me but occasionally he strikes pure euphoria through chaos and that's exactly the kind of payoff I need for being challenged at this level.
Dissected Grace is one of my favorites of his and my favorite album of his is Senescence.
he'd find a way to say Jute Gyte is accessible
@@InfamousQwaQwaFruit I had to take his albums a few songs at a time in the very beginning but I became very obsessed with his discography to the point where I was basically constantly plowing myself through his albums every day for a little while. There is indeed an element of sonic beauty and euphoria underneath that pummeling chaos that I really connected with, which makes a lot of his output very rewarding to me. I would say for how bizarre a lot of the chords he uses are I think there's definitely a lush sort of quality to a lot of it as well. My favorite is Oviri I'd say but Young Eagle, Birefringence, Perdurance and Senescence are favorites as well.
Sounds interesting!
I can be pretty critical of your videos but looking back at this one, is probably my favorite video you’ve done. I still think there is a lot of value in teaching people something outside of their “music I listened to in high school”. I enjoy this video quite a bit
If you think being dangerous and counterculture is all BM is I think you're glossing over the most important thing which is the music itself.
Black metal was no longer dangerous after 95/96, when everyone had heard about it. So where do you go from there? A zillion records have come out since, of which i'm sure the majority is trash, but the recent wave of new bands like DSO, MGLA (and countless others) brings out incredibly atmospheric music that stays true to the original formula, yet still innovates musically.
Are they the new darkthrone? No, ofcourse not. But some of the new music out there is still incredibly dark, yet listenable and fresh. It doesn't have to be a goddamn noise project that will end you in a mental asylum if you listen to it for more than an an hour, just because you wanna be counterculture. BM today is NOT what it was 25 years ago. I wouldn't even call it a movement, like it was back then. But that doesn't mean it doesn't have anything meaningful to say. One upping every previous band with increasingly harder to listen to, more experimental, more noisy music might push the limit in terms of what's extreme but doesn't do much musically.
Transylvanian Hunger pretty much opened it up to go even more primal within Blackmetal. Growing up some of my favorite BM bands were suicidal black metal and how unsettling it made you feel, bit relaxed at the same time
Some of these bands remind me of the stuff Wyattxhim likes. Big fan of stuff like Gnaw Their Tongues thanks to him. This also was nice
This is why as a black metal fan i respect you. Sure you pissed off a lot of black metal fans with your other black metal video, but the black metal you do like is black metal as fuck and you make all the haters look like posers.
The Torture record sounds like the samples that *didn't* make a Spazz record.
Agree
dont understand why its so important for him to claim he hates the genre and its followers when he shows his love for it here. Hes weirdly confused.
If you're not pissing off black metal fans, you're not really black metal
Pissed me off. Pretty sure you are a poser. Do just listen to metal. BE METAL. Not one of you has been covered in blood I bet.
This is like ambient black metal, very unpredictable I love this.I have this kind of songs too.
Never enjoyed black metal much so hopefully you can get me into some good shit Finn
I started with what is popular and went into more of the ambient side.
"it's this dude just standing there in a field like... whatever, blackmetaling" JJJAJAJAJJAJAJA
Finn, I'm sure you'd like the Polish bm band Mgla, especially their 2015 album Exercises In Futility. It sounds good, got great lyrics, the music is masterfully composed, and the drumwork is just off the fucking charts.
They’re kind of boring to me but i get it
Aye - Mgła are decent but very much in the vein of traditional/non-experimental black metal, so can see why Finn wouldn't like them.
Mgla is amazing! The drums especially, speechless.
This is why I follow you. Intelligent conversation . You are able to play these incredible musical art and show art pieces. Love this
I think the point of black metal is to be as evil as possible, not necessarily weird
the point is making music.
I love the analogy you make between the black metal and the avant garde art...
Is burzum safe? is peste noire safe? And of course, the Les Légions Noires members being members of very good NS bands. They make great music, even though their moral compass isn't %100 up to snuff. I love black metal bands that are not aligned with my morals, but I still love them for their music. Do you still like them, even though as you said they are or are not "safe"?
Separate the art and the artist always.
Imagine listening to BlackMetal but checking if the artists are "safe" to not lower your "good boy points" in your social circle lel
21:40 "compare that to this!" Made me laugh out loud haha
The content we crave. Thank you Finn.
This is by far the best video you’ve ever done. You should do more about the nexus of art and music. I’ve heard said of talk radio that a host can speak on any subject and if he is excited and interested in the topic regardless of the subject matter, his audience will be engaged. You’re clearly very passionate about art history and how it can enhance your understanding of music; you should do more videos like this. Have courage, your audience will find you.
My man here should stop denying it and just embrace the fact that he's a gatekeeper 😂
I don't know why but the line "why would there be a purple cloak" really made me laugh.
At the end of the day people should just like what they like. I've been listening to black metal for 20 years and ultimatley the thing and that draws me to this music (the raw emphasis on atmosphere as oppose to a self felating relentless shred fest) I also find in other non metal music genres like post punk, dark wave, shoe gaze, etc. I honestly couldn't give 2 shits about corpse paint or the controversy surrounding black metal, even if the church burnings and Varg/Euronymus fued never happened I'd still listen to this music because I like it based on it's own merit sonically speaking. The whole "kult" concept was literally thought up by a bunch of bored 19 year olds residing in a relatively prosperous and homongenous region of the world, with too much time and money on their hands, desperatley trying to find a way to feel superior in an otherwise lackluster music scene. As far as calling Watain "hipster shit" because they're melodic and have good recording production behind then, maybe my definition of hipster is different than yours. Living in Chicago for 33 years I always observed hipsters as people who went out of their way to profess their supposed keen interest in obscure bullshit as an attempt to come off as cultured or something. Havohej and other bands like them in my humble opinion are literal toilet music (i'm playing that scene from King of the Hill in my head right now) that only prentious people trying to sound hip would pretend to actually like. But again like what you like, life is too short. Only death is real...
You got so much real great black metal bands and there's so much subgenres like melodic black metal, atmospheric black, Blackened death metal, black/doom ! I really love Batushka, Summoning, Agalloch, Satyricon, Darkthrone, Ildaruni, Human Serpent, Bathory !
I learned about all the underground through Magazines. Fanzines were the shit. 1990 we would trade tapes and get like 3inch records straight from the bands through post office !! Those were real scenes. And Gorgoroth, Burzum and Mayhem, Dark Throne, Marduk made this. It was the scene not the music really. Dudes were creating chaos between the music, living the scene. Anyone can make noise.
I think the bands that have made the most interesting "Black Metal" in the last ten years are the guys all the elitists hate. Deafheaven, Litrugy (especially Litrugy they've made some wild shit, look no further than their 2019 record H.A.Q.Q.) and Portrayl of Guilt's new album "CHRISTFUCKER." I guess Portrayl of Guilt is more screamo, but they count in my book. Really anyone whose trying to experiment in genre. I know two of those are critical darlings but they've genuinely tried to do something new.
Edit: Ghost Bath too, especially their early work.
Portrayal of Guilt are legit, I've been following them since I discovered them on Spotify.
@@ogvelociraptor205 same, they fill the void Circle takes the Square left in my heart.
Litugy is the worst music ever.
Finn ranting at 15:00 with screams of suffering in the background has powerful energy
I’m glad y’all can see Finns extreme taste in music haha. A lot of people mistake that he doesn’t know a lot about underground extreme music. However he actually knows so much and is so far on the extreme end of it.
I'll never forget my friend, junior year of high school being super excited about Bile "Suckpump" and playing it in his mom's apartment with the most amazing 1997 sound system
pretending to like some niche underground stuff protects you from most elitist. Clever move but sus.
Great video! I'm into weird outsider black metal as well, and always approached it from a similar angle to you. I went to art school in the 1990s and it was so weird to see metal dovetailing with something deeper, weirder. I was into a lot of noise at the time as well, and I had a friend who was into the same stuff who was in the film department, and we would listen to this stuff along with Japanese noise.
as a black metalhead ill say this is easily my favorite video from you.
As far as this outsider music, any time that experiencing something can make you feel different than you’ve ever felt in your life, there is a win.
bro how in the hell is deathspell omega bland and predictable
You have to understand that he is a critic and not a (black metal) musician. He has some interesting takes regarding the genres' original intent etc but If he COULD COMPOSE (and not rehearse or just play) the simplest "catchy" intermediate black metal riff he would enjoy Deathspell Omega for what they do. Sour grapes.
hes a poser
And ironically his favorite genre is pop punk which is literally the most predictable and bland genre of all time in my opinion.
Pop punk like 99.9% of the time uses the same chords, and very similar rhythms, riffs and very generic lyrics and etc.
Deathspell songs are extremely experimental with hard to play riffs, unique chord progression and have esoteric smart lyrics about various different occult philosophies. He doesn’t know what he is talking about.
@@Madverick He's not into that, he's too worried about being in the simulation & he will never like black metal he came across as forcing himself to like the music in the video to appeal to the community
@@ares8553 he has made music before. He plays multiple instruments too I think, definetly the guitar though.
This is honestly a great video and discussion on the whole idea of what Black Metal was supposed to be and should be. And, I have to point out that you provided some really great recommendations to check out, thank you.
You actually have a great taste in black metal! Not sure why any "black metal nerds" would be angry at this video as you described the ethos behind black metal very well...
I was right behind you it was like 97 or 98 when I was getting into all the swedish and Norwegian metal that I'm into. Also got huge into cryptopsy at the same time period , And started playing guitar, so of course I fell in love with all the heaviest most brutal music on the planet immediately
I'm not into black metal, so I'd never listened to any of this. So I checked out Zeal and Ardor. The "Imagine Dragons" shade is a little unfair, but i can see where it's coming from. I wouldn't necessarily call the style black metal and since I'm not into black metal anyway, i don't care. But as music it was fine.
Somehow listening to Dillinger Escape Plan and earl sweatshirts last few albums prepared me for this video and honestly this doesn't sound bad. I really don't understand how this is "metal". I completely understand how this is seen as music and art. There is an odd sense of peace and beauty in this.
Really looked forward to seeing how many elitists this one pisses off this time
Why would this piss off elitists? The bands mentioned here are more 'elite' than the other black metal bands he mocked in this video.
Why would a satire video piss me off?
Emperor was my first dip into black metal too! I was so young at the time, I had to hide the cds from my folks, I had some of the peaceville digi packs, there was an At the Gates one (not BM I know) with a satyr and a pentagram and the whole thing felt super explicit, scary and like I was doing something forbidden to my young teenage mind. I didn’t even have a particularly religious upbringing.
Posting this after TH-cam disables dislike counts, very clever.
Well this actually is a good video, also showing a huge problem within the black metal scene. Black metal started as the outsider music and idealized this inaccessibility. Well they might not wanted to be commercial, but still promoted their music... So the promotion worked and they became more and more popular, resulting in their level of inaccessibility becoming normal. Now to be "real" black metal people feel like they have to become even more inaccessible... To the level, that it being music is questionable. I like black metal, because of it sound, but not because of it being made by weird as people that try to be the weirdest of them all. I respect musicians that do creative art, and that definitely is the difference between Ariana grande and zeal and ardor. I hate most black metal fans, because them trying to be the hardest, most true, most elite, weirdest outsider or whatever is actually just being a poser. Because being a poser means not being yourself to me. And their actions actually depend on others than themselves...