Velotric Summit: velotricebike.pxf.io/m5QO6a Discount Code: SCOTT60 Young Electric Sole Rack: tinyurl.com/bdhs97bv Save $$ with my Discount Code: SCOTT10
Thanks Larry! Someone has to do it. Also, Velotric didn't have an issue with me putting this out, so that also speaks volumes to their commitment to customer service and quality.
Firstly, the $1800 is the target price and I believe they should lock that price in as even in the backdrop of how expensive full sport eMTB's cost any eMTB above $1800 could not be considered budget. So, whoever is the buyer at Velotric sourcing the parts for the manufacture of this Summit model is just going have to contract out a workable price for any part Velotric might have to improve on in order to bring their BUDGET eMTB up to snuff. Now, that being said, the "All Mountain" classification includes every level of mountain biking! That means, XC, Enduro and DH. Of course, DH being the most radical of the three types of Mountain Bike riding and therefore the most demanding on any one particular All Mountain bike. For DH an All Mountain, Mountain Bike, bike is in most respects, the lower end as far as capability, yet many All Mountain bikes are high performance enough to shred even Double Black Diamond/Expert trails. I know this as I have done so myself and have also witnessed many many riders with All Mountain bikes ride aggressive DH at every trail level without a hitch both sending jumps drops at break neck speeds and all the associated terrain features on DH style trails. This is why the industry standard front fork travel on an All Mountain bike is at least 160mm. It is so for that very reason, because it's claim is "ALL MOUNTAIN" which designates its capable of well traversing all the established levels of Mountain Biking! 160mm of travel is not the best as even 160 can bottom out on high drops and sending large jumps. But, mostly this occurs when the fork is not adjusted properly, or the rider exceeds the max Payload for the All Mountain bike they are riding! A Full DH bike has mostly a minimum of 200mm of travel in order to provide more travel than a Mountain Bike will ever need in any terrain, but it is not good for XC or Enduro either. Velotric put a 120mm front fork shock on an eMTB that is actually quite a bit heavier than a standard MTB already, rated the max Payload at 440lbs and chose a substandard fork manufacturer to boot. Don't get me wrong I love what Velotric is trying to do here and at the $1800 price point they will draw a great many to eMTB'g but some things you just can't get away with and releasing the SUMMIT eMTB with a substandard fork that also has anything less than a 140mm of travel, was a BONEHEAD mistake by somebody at Velotric! If they expect anyone at any level really to take this bike seriously as an All Mountain bike, they need to resource an All Mountain class fork for this All Mountain bike and re-release it as a new and improved version! Other than that, then they definitely need to downgrade it removing the All Mountain classification! If someone gets hurt due to the failure of the forks on that bike it will be the responsibility of Velotric!!! In fact, those brakes are substandard too, as an eMTB is much heavier than an regular MTB and should definitely have a more robust brake setup to accommodate the much heavier bike with all the super demanding braking stress levels and braking requirements that are a part of Mountain Biking! The current brakes Velotric might be able to get away with which is definitely undesirable, but at the very least I am certain riders that actually Mountain Bike with the Summit will have to change out their pads 2 to 3x as often, still! You know upgrades are all fine and dandy and we all like to upgrade our bikes, but when we buy a bike we ought to know that we can enjoy using it at the money we just put into it without having to turn around and immediately or even almost immediately having to pour $600, $1000 or more into the bike just to get it to where it should have been in the first place! That defeats the whole benefit of buying a budget bike in the first place! And, $1000 bucks on top of $1800 bucks is $2800 bucks, and now we are into the price range of some other super capable eMTB's that have all one needs without spending extra money right out of the box at under $3000. So, for Velotric's budget bike to work for what they purport it will work, which is a workable entry-level budget based eMTB that will accomplish up to All Mountain riding they GOT TO DO BETTER!!!
Well... This is considered an entry level eMTB for those who want to go out on these trails and are beginners in this sport. This bike does serve more as a trekking bike in my opinion. I feel this bike is for those people who want to go out and explore these trails. In no way do I expect the people interested in this bike to go out and jump it, especially as many times as I did. My first eMTB is a Giant Trance X E+3. This is a 5k bike for someone who was just interested in the sport and wanted to try it. This bike can handle riders way above my skill level and I have had some people think I was crazy for spending that much not sure if I would like it. Luckily, I don't (well didn't) need to do any upgrades to it (although I did) but the price tag was much higher than what we are looking at here. In my opinion, This bike provides a much more budget friendly alternative to the route I took. I appreciate your input but I believe your opinion is that of a more experienced mtb rider and not who this bike is intended for.
I have a Aventon Aventure and QuietKat Ibex and one of the first things I did on both was swap out the front forks for a Wren Suspension Fork. So much better being able to tune the fork and change settings as needed. They cut corners on the front suspension to keep prices down.
Ok, please tell us more about "Flatout". Does it require tire coming off to apply it inside the tire between tire and tube, does it go through the air valve into the tube, etc.? It was impressive you did all you did on the trail and never had air leakage. Maybe you've discussed it in a prior video, but I missed it. I think I'll want that in my 4" Aventone tires. I may not always have an air pump with me.
I put FlatOut in all my tires on all my e-bikes. It is a liquid that goes into the tire valve (you have to remove the core) then you air the tire back up and it's done. Here is the link for it! FlatOut Tire Sealant Sportsman Formula: amzn.to/3HhtBRS
I currently ride a 2016 Giant Talon and most of the time have my 20 month old son in a two person Burley wagon. We ride several miles, but on the way home it's mostly uphill for about 5 miles. I enjoy the mountain bike aspect as I won't always have the wagon behind me. I enjoy urban riding with some off road. Do you think the Summit will be a nice bike for this?
They don't tell you the gearing on the website, for those trials you could probably get away with a 36 tooth chain ring and a 34t in the back, after that it's all about momentum and balance, and you have to get off the seat, probably also be better in pedal assist 2 or 3, instead of full power all the time. Trails like that I ride mostly in pedal assist one, and two for the real steep stuff.
I don't think I had it at full power all the time. I have reviewed enough of these ebikes on trails like to agree with everything you said. I stand up on the downhill and sit down when pedaling. I
Scott, thank you for your honest reviews. I am looking for a bike that I can use in the city as well as light off-road going camping and I am torn between something like an Aventure level two or Velotric Discover 2 or something else. I’m not a huge fan of fat tires, I prefer the nimble feeling of a skinnier tire. If I was going to ride this on the road 70% of the time, what would you recommend? A summit with a rack or something else? Thanks!
The Summit has become my favorite bike for riding around. You could easily put on 2.4" tires and this bike would be even more nimble. I just received the fenders and rack and will do a video showing how to do that and what it looks like. From there I will decide if I want to keep those things on it. As of right now, I would choose the Summit over my Discover 2 or my Level 2.
@@scotthardesty I am debating between this, the Ramblas or the Euphree Stellar Falcon to ride around town but also single-track whenever I can (avoiding drops and jumps, as much as possible). If I got this one or the Ramblas, I'd probably add the PNW Coast Suspension Dropper Post (still get the dropper but also the quasi-suspension, too). I was ready to pull the trigger on a $4k bike (Giant, Bulls or Cannondale), but one of my buddies asked me whether I pictured myself pulling 3-4 hours on the trail. Honestly, that answer would mostly be no.
@@tonygiancoli9626 I think both the Ramblas and the Summit would need to have to their foks switched out and either would be good to go. There are no adjustments on the forks of my Ramblas.
Mine Arrived Broken! I received my Summit 1 this past Friday. I ordered the bike along with a tilting stem and a half twist throttle. While I was unpacking, it I noticed damage to the front wheel (rim) in the form of deep scratches/dent about the size of a quarter. I assembled anyways, without the aforementioned extras, anticipating that Velotric would stand behind their products, since the Discover 2 that I had purchased just 2 weeks earlier arrived intact and their customer service seemed good. I charged it and took it for a spin. I stopped for a break and when I went to use the throttle, I no longer had power from the motor although the battery was at 81%. I am pretty comfortable around bikes having worked at 3 different bike stores as a teenager in my early 20’s, as well as with electronics as an adult. After checking and rechecking all wires and connections I noticed that the brake light stayed on. I knew that the bike was not giving me power because the brakes override the motor. I adjusted the silver set screw located inside the rear brake lever and bingo, I had power back. My battery is also not reaching 100% capacity and the charger light stays red and won’t turn green no matter how long I leave the battery charging. I am talking overnight here and have put it through several charge cycles. So here are the problems I had so far: 1) Damaged rim. Solution: I contacted Velotric and they offered me a $40 refund. An insult! I contacted the again and they agreed to send a new replacement wheel. They should have done that from the start! 2) Motor suddenly lost power. Solution: I fixed it myself because Velotric cannot be contacted on weekends. 3) The stem that I purchased was missing the top screw and the head of the bike’s original top screw was too large in diameter and would not fit the stem’s hole. The stem’s vertical hole was drilled too small. Solution: Luckily, I had spare Allen bolts around or the stem would have been useless, so I kept it. I had to mechanically reduce the size of the bolt's head to get it to fit in the hole. Most people would have given up. 4) The half twist throttle’s wire plug does not fit into the bike’s existing wire (different diameter)- solution: Waiting for Velotric to respond after they requested pictures of the box, Fedex label and UPC code. Luckily, I kept them. Currently waiting for Velotric to respond again. 5) Battery not charging to 100%. Solution: I contacted Velotric and they asked for pictures of the battery, charger light showing red and the display screen showing the battery’s charge percentage. Still waiting for a response. 6) Motor shuts down when the headlight is turned on. Summary: I had a great experience with the first bike (Discover 2) that I ordered from Velotric, so I decided to buy as second. The second experience has not been anywhere near the first. Quality control seems to be an issue, as well as less than desirable customer service. I just can’t get over the $40 offer for the damaged rim. I am a repeat customer, I bought a brand-new bike and expect nothing less than a “fully functional and undamaged product” and don’t believe that it is reasonable, at least not for me, to receive such an offer and have to look/live with the damage for the life of the bike. I like Velotric and understand that “things happen”, but this involved "one too many" problems that would have been a real challenge for the average buyer without a mechanical and electronic background and a lot of patience, and they would likely be stuck with a non-functional bike at the moment. I really hope that Velotric improves their quality control and customer service. So far, I feel as if rectification of the problems has become an act of congress and has taken up a lot of my time, which I would prefer to spend having fun instead. I will update when all the issues are all hopefully resolved with more favorable comments and thank you for reading my “venting”. In the meantime, proceed with caution if you are considering a Summit 1. UPDATE: They offered to replace it, but I was afraid the replacement would have the same issues, so I opted to return it. I got a refund. Considering all the hassle I had to go through unpacking, assembling, disassembling, repacking and shipping it back, as well as all the back-and-forth emails, I would have purchased locally if I had to do it all over again. I have since converted one of my high-end bikes to an e bike and realized that this is the way to go because I've yet to find a high-end e bike with a mid-mounted motor and throttle. 'Way" lighter, faster, quieter and much better components. I will be converting a couple more of my bikes as well.
Thank you for your input! I also have the 1/2 twist throttle and was going to put it on the D2 but it is not made for it. I checked on the website and the 1/2 twist throttle says, its only for the D1, N1, Packer, and Go and did not say it was compatible with the D2 or the Summit. I was surprised to see it as an option for the Summit. Since I was one of the first guys to get the Summit, I also had that issue with my rim. It seems to be the way it is packed. I'm glad to hear that they are sending you a new rim. They should not have sold the adjustable stem or the 1/2 twist throttle with that bike.
@@mikepitts8470 They offered to replace it, but I was afraid the replacement would have the same issues. I sent it back and got a refund. Considering all the hassle I had to go through unpacking, assembling, disassembling, repacking and shipping it back, as well as all the back-and-forth emails, I would have purchased locally if I had to do it all over again. I have since converted one of my other bikes to an e bike and realized that this is the way to go because I've yet to find a high-end e bike with a mid-mounted motor and throttle. 'Way" lighter, faster, quieter and much better components. I will be converting a couple more of my bikes as well.
I ride my Summit daily now. I find it quicker on take off, lighter and more nimble and the throttle will go full speed. I think I am going to use mostly as a commuter, I am going to trim down the handlebars some as I feel they might be too wide for commuting all the time. I do still plan on putting head to head with the Ramblas as well.
@@antonioiniguez1615 Sorry for the delay, the app wouldn't let me reply. The Nomad 1 uses a cadence sensor, the Summit has a torque sensor. When it comes to trails like this, the Summit is superior in control of power. Although cadence sensors are great in cities, nothing really beats a torque sensor when it comes to control during hard turns and off road trails.
When I did a first ride with the Ramblas, it was on harder trails in San Clemete, CA. Although, that might be a good idea to see if the forks can handle (6 jumps) as well.
You mentioned the tires could be smaller for street riding, but I'm confused how 4 inch fat tires are commonly used on other ebikes not meant for trails?
I think it's all about how the bike is configured. For this particular bike, I feel like thinner tires would make it more nimble. When riding those 26x4" fat tire bikes, they are what they are, I would not want to put thinner tires on those, but this bike feels like it might do better with slightly thinner tires. I will going down "slightly" 2.5" when I do the fork upgrade to see if it makes a difference.
I wonder how a bike like my Philodo H8 with it's dual motors, 21 speeds with a 28 to 28 tooth first gear, and a throttle that's limited to the PAS level cutoff for more control when you need the AWD would handle this trail
I’m surprised I’ve ridden the summit 1 very hard and jumps and advanced trails on video and the it’s held up great. I weigh 200lbs, I probably will replace my fork regardless at some point in the future though
Can this bike be ordered with a better fork? (say like ROCK SHOX or FOX forks) I ask because I've hit bigger jumps on my full suspension mountain bike with no problem (though I did JACK UP the original DROPPER POST on my Ibis MTB.) *note ~ being over 60 years of age, I'm now looking at E-MOUNTAIN BIKES because climbing hills just isn't the same as it was when I was in my youth.
Absolutely fantastic video my man! Glad to see the manufacturer take the bike back for investigation i honestly wouldn't be surprised if there was a recal to swith the dangerous forks out for something like the rock shox 35 that can handle the weight of the bike and rider these are cheap and nasty forks! Thry should not even have use for cross country all mountain They would still fail! Keep us posted on what they say its been very interesting that they were so quick to take the bike back thats what you want in a manufacturer!
I do love the fact that they wanted the bike back to see what the issue is. With that said, I have ordered new forks for my bike as I am pretty hard on these things and I want to experiment with other forks. I ordered Marzocchi Bomber Z2 27.5 E-Optimized. Let's see how those do on the same jump.
@@scotthardesty I know the Ramblas has a dropper post. To add a little suspension, would you switch out the dropper for the PNW dropper post w/ suspension? Would it make much difference? I'm getting older, my man. Bones & muscles hurt more often, so full suspension (or semi-full suspension is, probably, a necessity).
@@tonygiancoli9626 I am switching the forks and the dropper on the Ramblas. I already switched out the dropper lever to PNW. I feel my dropper is slow and really hard to use. To be fair, I did submerge it in Lake Michighan for 5 min and that could have affected it some. I have nevered used a dropper with suspension but that does sound nice.
Beg to differ on that statement from the manufacturer the fork does say Cross country All mountain you dropped what 1 n half foot tops I've went off taller kirbs! There just paints forks should not be used for Emtb full stop! Great review and hope more see this and are put off so the manufacturer gets that fork recalled or scrapped for a new Rock shox 35 atleast on one these! Any fork that has a preload adjustment instead of air shrader valve Do Not even attempt to jump them! This emtb need a recall for them forks! They wouldn't hold up to cross country all mountain either! This bike is dangerous elastomer shocks are only good in old RST like shocks
I don't know. Maybe it's just me, but if you call someothing a mountain bike, it should handle a 3 foot jump. If it can't, call it a trail bike. Agree?
Agreed. But I also don't think they had heavier people test it out like I did. Either way, I have ordered better shocks for it so I can do this kind of stuff if I want.
@@scotthardesty sounds sweet! Which bike do you like better? I'm of the belief that's some of these hubs are a lot better in the woods then people know. Once you add the human element I think the only advantage of a mid drive is weight displacement, they're great on full suspension bikes, but on a hardtail I don't think there's that much of a difference.
@@bassw1758 I have to say, the climbing abilities of my Ramblas surpass what a rear hub motor can do. Well, any rear hub motor that I have tested. My Summit has become my favorite daily bike but I still have to give it to Ramblas for the single track. Although, I do believe that once I switch out the forks (on both bikes) they will both do great on single track.
@@bassw1758 My $5800 Giant is very nice and it's full suspension. The Aventon Ramblas and the Velotric Summit are the first hardtail emtbs and I enjoy them both. Although, I am also upgrading both bikes with better forks and a few other upgrades for the Ramblas.
It’s fine as long as you don’t use it like a mtb on singletrack trails. It’s a pavement/bridle cruiser with entry level parts. Just have to avoid any hard hits like the rest of the sub-$2k e-bike category.
I enjoy your videos Scott. They’re informative, detailed and fun. I have to say I do not think you are being fair to Velotric keeping this video up. There are many people who will not purchase this bike now that this video is up. I know you have stated this could happen to any bike, which you are correct about. However, most will not take the time to think that through. It is a shame Velotric will have their brand tarnished due to improper use on your part . It doesn’t seem like the responsible thing to do, kind of disappointing.
Hi Edric. I do want to let you know that before I published this video, I sent it Velotric asking if it was okay to post this. Me knowing that it could hurt the sales of this bike. Velotric and I agreed that this video was a good video to post showing how the warning on the forks state to not jump the bike and this is what could happen if you do so. This video will help those who wish to do more extreme riding with this bike to know that they should upgrade the forks (I have new forks ordered) and I will be repeating that jump once they are installed. So, in my eyes (and Velotrics) this was a video warning people not to push the bike more than it is intended without upgrading parts of it to match your riding style. Then there is the fact that Velotric sent me an entirely new bike so they could research where the failure point was in the forks , should also show how Velotric was very aware of this video and approved it.
Thank you for your thoughtful response Scott. Hearing it from your point of view and also knowing you consulted Velotric before posting does change my opinion. That is fair and absolutely shows responsibility on your part. Thank you for sharing. I apologize for jumping to conclusions. I look forward to seeing you test the Summit 1 with the new fork installed. Any chance we could get a redo on your review of the Summit 1 on the mountain bike trail with the stock fork? I am seriously considering purchasing this bike and have a similar riding style/usage as you. Planning to use it mostly as a commuter in NYC with the ability to take it on light to moderate mountain bike trails occasionally and cross country trekking. Which is where my interest in the performance of the bike with stock parts comes into play. Your content is pretty awesome. Thank you for making it! Edric
@@edrictorres7809 Hi Edic. Thanks for the response and understanding. I do NOT plan on redoing this test with the stock forks. Most of the time in my reviews, I might hit that jump once or twice. This bike is really fun to jump for me so I would want to do it again and again hence most likely breaking the fork again. I will not have any fears of that happening (no matter how I land) with the new fork I am installing. When it comes down to it, this is an entry level mountain bike and should be treated as such. There are not many people just getting into this sport that would continually do jumps on this bike like I did. Therefore, it is a great bike designed for just that, but the forks was the only weak spot I found on this bike and it was a $200 fix to upgrade. As mentioned in the video, I do not find this a win or a loss, I just look at it as finding where the weak spot is with this bike for someone who rides like me. Since you said you ride like I do, I would buy this bike, and upgrade the front forks. Even with that, you have a great bike for the money invested.
@@Frisher1 do they claim to be ready for the mountain though? Part of what I liked about this bike was that's it was designed to handle trails but also can commute on pavement. Now, to me, it's just a commuter with mtb tires
I did jump this more than any other bike I have reviewed. I am not sure if the stock fork on the new Aventon Ramblas would survive either. This is why I have ordered new forks for both. At this price point, it's easy to upgrade to right components depending on your riding style.
Warning or no warning, you broke a bike the very first time you used it on a trail. Not a great testament for its ability as a mountain bike. They should have went wtih a better stock fork. Think its worth saving up for the Ramblas for more than one reason if you want to really use it for trails. You know a big reason I don’t think a mountain bike has come as a hub drive from major players to this point is the impracticality of changing the rear wheel. I can’t imagine taking it in to the bike shop every time you had a rear flat.
The Ramblas forks aren't great either. I already ordered a new fork for my Ramblas as it doesn't have any compression or lockout with stock fork. I agree about the rear hub and flats. Since I use FlatOut, I have never had a flat on any bike that I have reviewed so I've been lucky so far as to not know what a rear flat tire feels like.
@@scotthardesty true but I've seen several reviews say the stock performance is at least fine and it's rated for trail things like jumps. Rockshox while a spring fork is also a good brand. I have a ramblas and maybe I'm lucky but I think the stock tune works really comfortably for me and don't feel the need for adjustment. A lockout function would have been nice though!
@@scotthardesty You say you ordered a Marzocchi Bomber Z2 27.5 E-Optimized fork and that it cost $200. Was there a misprint? I checked Amazon, and two variants of that fork are listed at $487 and $939.
Velotric Summit: velotricebike.pxf.io/m5QO6a
Discount Code: SCOTT60
Young Electric Sole Rack: tinyurl.com/bdhs97bv
Save $$ with my Discount Code: SCOTT10
The reason I love your reviews, you don't pussy foot around with these bikes! You ride like you ride and we appreciate the honesty 👍
Thanks Larry! Someone has to do it. Also, Velotric didn't have an issue with me putting this out, so that also speaks volumes to their commitment to customer service and quality.
Sounds like a good excuse for a fork upgrade!
Already ordered.
That looks like so much fun!
It was!
Firstly, the $1800 is the target price and I believe they should lock that price in as even in the backdrop of how expensive full sport eMTB's cost any eMTB above $1800 could not be considered budget. So, whoever is the buyer at Velotric sourcing the parts for the manufacture of this Summit model is just going have to contract out a workable price for any part Velotric might have to improve on in order to bring their BUDGET eMTB up to snuff.
Now, that being said, the "All Mountain" classification includes every level of mountain biking! That means, XC, Enduro and DH. Of course, DH being the most radical of the three types of Mountain Bike riding and therefore the most demanding on any one particular All Mountain bike. For DH an All Mountain, Mountain Bike, bike is in most respects, the lower end as far as capability, yet many All Mountain bikes are high performance enough to shred even Double Black Diamond/Expert trails. I know this as I have done so myself and have also witnessed many many riders with All Mountain bikes ride aggressive DH at every trail level without a hitch both sending jumps drops at break neck speeds and all the associated terrain features on DH style trails. This is why the industry standard front fork travel on an All Mountain bike is at least 160mm. It is so for that very reason, because it's claim is "ALL MOUNTAIN" which designates its capable of well traversing all the established levels of Mountain Biking! 160mm of travel is not the best as even 160 can bottom out on high drops and sending large jumps. But, mostly this occurs when the fork is not adjusted properly, or the rider exceeds the max Payload for the All Mountain bike they are riding! A Full DH bike has mostly a minimum of 200mm of travel in order to provide more travel than a Mountain Bike will ever need in any terrain, but it is not good for XC or Enduro either.
Velotric put a 120mm front fork shock on an eMTB that is actually quite a bit heavier than a standard MTB already, rated the max Payload at 440lbs and chose a substandard fork manufacturer to boot. Don't get me wrong I love what Velotric is trying to do here and at the $1800 price point they will draw a great many to eMTB'g but some things you just can't get away with and releasing the SUMMIT eMTB with a substandard fork that also has anything less than a 140mm of travel, was a BONEHEAD mistake by somebody at Velotric! If they expect anyone at any level really to take this bike seriously as an All Mountain bike, they need to resource an All Mountain class fork for this All Mountain bike and re-release it as a new and improved version! Other than that, then they definitely need to downgrade it removing the All Mountain classification! If someone gets hurt due to the failure of the forks on that bike it will be the responsibility of Velotric!!!
In fact, those brakes are substandard too, as an eMTB is much heavier than an regular MTB and should definitely have a more robust brake setup to accommodate the much heavier bike with all the super demanding braking stress levels and braking requirements that are a part of Mountain Biking! The current brakes Velotric might be able to get away with which is definitely undesirable, but at the very least I am certain riders that actually Mountain Bike with the Summit will have to change out their pads 2 to 3x as often, still!
You know upgrades are all fine and dandy and we all like to upgrade our bikes, but when we buy a bike we ought to know that we can enjoy using it at the money we just put into it without having to turn around and immediately or even almost immediately having to pour $600, $1000 or more into the bike just to get it to where it should have been in the first place! That defeats the whole benefit of buying a budget bike in the first place! And, $1000 bucks on top of $1800 bucks is $2800 bucks, and now we are into the price range of some other super capable eMTB's that have all one needs without spending extra money right out of the box at under $3000. So, for Velotric's budget bike to work for what they purport it will work, which is a workable entry-level budget based eMTB that will accomplish up to All Mountain riding they GOT TO DO BETTER!!!
Well... This is considered an entry level eMTB for those who want to go out on these trails and are beginners in this sport. This bike does serve more as a trekking bike in my opinion. I feel this bike is for those people who want to go out and explore these trails. In no way do I expect the people interested in this bike to go out and jump it, especially as many times as I did.
My first eMTB is a Giant Trance X E+3. This is a 5k bike for someone who was just interested in the sport and wanted to try it. This bike can handle riders way above my skill level and I have had some people think I was crazy for spending that much not sure if I would like it. Luckily, I don't (well didn't) need to do any upgrades to it (although I did) but the price tag was much higher than what we are looking at here.
In my opinion, This bike provides a much more budget friendly alternative to the route I took.
I appreciate your input but I believe your opinion is that of a more experienced mtb rider and not who this bike is intended for.
Why would you put a 160mm on a hardtail? 120mm is like the perfect geometry for a hardtail mtb…
I have a Aventon Aventure and QuietKat Ibex and one of the first things I did on both was swap out the front forks for a Wren Suspension Fork. So much better being able to tune the fork and change settings as needed. They cut corners on the front suspension to keep prices down.
I think for the price, it's easy to upgrade the forks to something more designed for the type of riding you want to do with it.
Ok, please tell us more about "Flatout".
Does it require tire coming off to apply it inside the tire between tire and tube, does it go through the air valve into the tube, etc.?
It was impressive you did all you did on the trail and never had air leakage.
Maybe you've discussed it in a prior video, but I missed it. I think I'll want that in my 4" Aventone tires. I may not always have an air pump with me.
I put FlatOut in all my tires on all my e-bikes. It is a liquid that goes into the tire valve (you have to remove the core) then you air the tire back up and it's done. Here is the link for it! FlatOut Tire Sealant Sportsman Formula: amzn.to/3HhtBRS
Always epic review 👍
Thanks! 👍
Good test!
Thank you!
I currently ride a 2016 Giant Talon and most of the time have my 20 month old son in a two person Burley wagon. We ride several miles, but on the way home it's mostly uphill for about 5 miles. I enjoy the mountain bike aspect as I won't always have the wagon behind me. I enjoy urban riding with some off road. Do you think the Summit will be a nice bike for this?
Actually, I do. It's pretty versatile.
Thanks for posting, Scott. Are you using Flat Out Sportsman?
Yes I am! amzn.to/3HhtBRS
They don't tell you the gearing on the website, for those trials you could probably get away with a 36 tooth chain ring and a 34t in the back, after that it's all about momentum and balance, and you have to get off the seat, probably also be better in pedal assist 2 or 3, instead of full power all the time. Trails like that I ride mostly in pedal assist one, and two for the real steep stuff.
I don't think I had it at full power all the time. I have reviewed enough of these ebikes on trails like to agree with everything you said. I stand up on the downhill and sit down when pedaling. I
Scott, thank you for your honest reviews. I am looking for a bike that I can use in the city as well as light off-road going camping and I am torn between something like an Aventure level two or Velotric Discover 2 or something else. I’m not a huge fan of fat tires, I prefer the nimble feeling of a skinnier tire. If I was going to ride this on the road 70% of the time, what would you recommend? A summit with a rack or something else? Thanks!
The Summit has become my favorite bike for riding around. You could easily put on 2.4" tires and this bike would be even more nimble. I just received the fenders and rack and will do a video showing how to do that and what it looks like. From there I will decide if I want to keep those things on it. As of right now, I would choose the Summit over my Discover 2 or my Level 2.
@@scotthardesty I am debating between this, the Ramblas or the Euphree Stellar Falcon to ride around town but also single-track whenever I can (avoiding drops and jumps, as much as possible). If I got this one or the Ramblas, I'd probably add the PNW Coast Suspension Dropper Post (still get the dropper but also the quasi-suspension, too). I was ready to pull the trigger on a $4k bike (Giant, Bulls or Cannondale), but one of my buddies asked me whether I pictured myself pulling 3-4 hours on the trail. Honestly, that answer would mostly be no.
@@tonygiancoli9626 I think both the Ramblas and the Summit would need to have to their foks switched out and either would be good to go. There are no adjustments on the forks of my Ramblas.
How does this compare to the Ramblas? The Ramblas seems to be more capable for both on and off road.
Summit for commuter and Ramblas for mtbing. To be fair tho, I have not jumped my Ramblas like I did the Summit. I have fork upgrades coming for both.
That bike still took a lot of punishment. I'm glad you were not hurt and you were able to finish the ride. Flat out is great stuff.
It took more punishment then what I have put any other bike thru.
Mine Arrived Broken! I received my Summit 1 this past Friday. I ordered the bike along with a tilting stem and a half twist throttle. While I was unpacking, it I noticed damage to the front wheel (rim) in the form of deep scratches/dent about the size of a quarter. I assembled anyways, without the aforementioned extras, anticipating that Velotric would stand behind their products, since the Discover 2 that I had purchased just 2 weeks earlier arrived intact and their customer service seemed good. I charged it and took it for a spin.
I stopped for a break and when I went to use the throttle, I no longer had power from the motor although the battery was at 81%. I am pretty comfortable around bikes having worked at 3 different bike stores as a teenager in my early 20’s, as well as with electronics as an adult.
After checking and rechecking all wires and connections I noticed that the brake light stayed on. I knew that the bike was not giving me power because the brakes override the motor. I adjusted the silver set screw located inside the rear brake lever and bingo, I had power back. My battery is also not reaching 100% capacity and the charger light stays red and won’t turn green no matter how long I leave the battery charging. I am talking overnight here and have put it through several charge cycles. So here are the problems I had so far:
1) Damaged rim. Solution: I contacted Velotric and they offered me a $40 refund. An insult! I contacted the again and they agreed to send a new replacement wheel. They should have done that from the start!
2) Motor suddenly lost power. Solution: I fixed it myself because Velotric cannot be contacted on weekends.
3) The stem that I purchased was missing the top screw and the head of the bike’s original top screw was too large in diameter and would not fit the stem’s hole. The stem’s vertical hole was drilled too small. Solution: Luckily, I had spare Allen bolts around or the stem would have been useless, so I kept it. I had to mechanically reduce the size of the bolt's head to get it to fit in the hole. Most people would have given up.
4) The half twist throttle’s wire plug does not fit into the bike’s existing wire (different diameter)- solution: Waiting for Velotric to respond after they requested pictures of the box, Fedex label and UPC code. Luckily, I kept them. Currently waiting for Velotric to respond again.
5) Battery not charging to 100%. Solution: I contacted Velotric and they asked for pictures of the battery, charger light showing red and the display screen showing the battery’s charge percentage. Still waiting for a response.
6) Motor shuts down when the headlight is turned on.
Summary: I had a great experience with the first bike (Discover 2) that I ordered from Velotric, so I decided to buy as second. The second experience has not been anywhere near the first. Quality control seems to be an issue, as well as less than desirable customer service. I just can’t get over the $40 offer for the damaged rim. I am a repeat customer, I bought a brand-new bike and expect nothing less than a “fully functional and undamaged product” and don’t believe that it is reasonable, at least not for me, to receive such an offer and have to look/live with the damage for the life of the bike.
I like Velotric and understand that “things happen”, but this involved "one too many" problems that would have been a real challenge for the average buyer without a mechanical and electronic background and a lot of patience, and they would likely be stuck with a non-functional bike at the moment.
I really hope that Velotric improves their quality control and customer service. So far, I feel as if rectification of the problems has become an act of congress and has taken up a lot of my time, which I would prefer to spend having fun instead.
I will update when all the issues are all hopefully resolved with more favorable comments and thank you for reading my “venting”. In the meantime, proceed with caution if you are considering a Summit 1.
UPDATE: They offered to replace it, but I was afraid the replacement would have the same issues, so I opted to return it. I got a refund. Considering all the hassle I had to go through unpacking, assembling, disassembling, repacking and shipping it back, as well as all the back-and-forth emails, I would have purchased locally if I had to do it all over again.
I have since converted one of my high-end bikes to an e bike and realized that this is the way to go because I've yet to find a high-end e bike with a mid-mounted motor and throttle. 'Way" lighter, faster, quieter and much better components. I will be converting a couple more of my bikes as well.
Thank you for your input! I also have the 1/2 twist throttle and was going to put it on the D2 but it is not made for it. I checked on the website and the 1/2 twist throttle says, its only for the D1, N1, Packer, and Go and did not say it was compatible with the D2 or the Summit. I was surprised to see it as an option for the Summit.
Since I was one of the first guys to get the Summit, I also had that issue with my rim. It seems to be the way it is packed. I'm glad to hear that they are sending you a new rim.
They should not have sold the adjustable stem or the 1/2 twist throttle with that bike.
The adjustable riser is not compatible with the Summit 1, according the website.
Wow. That sucks. Velotric should send you a new bike
@@mikepitts8470 They offered to replace it, but I was afraid the replacement would have the same issues. I sent it back and got a refund. Considering all the hassle I had to go through unpacking, assembling, disassembling, repacking and shipping it back, as well as all the back-and-forth emails, I would have purchased locally if I had to do it all over again.
I have since converted one of my other bikes to an e bike and realized that this is the way to go because I've yet to find a high-end e bike with a mid-mounted motor and throttle. 'Way" lighter, faster, quieter and much better components. I will be converting a couple more of my bikes as well.
@@mikepitts8470 Sent it back and got a refund.
Thanks for the review! Do you like the Summit or the Adventure 2 more for every day riding, and why?
I ride my Summit daily now. I find it quicker on take off, lighter and more nimble and the throttle will go full speed. I think I am going to use mostly as a commuter, I am going to trim down the handlebars some as I feel they might be too wide for commuting all the time. I do still plan on putting head to head with the Ramblas as well.
@@scotthardesty Thanks for the in depth response! I Just got one more question. How does it compare to the Nomad 1?
@@antonioiniguez1615 Sorry for the delay, the app wouldn't let me reply. The Nomad 1 uses a cadence sensor, the Summit has a torque sensor. When it comes to trails like this, the Summit is superior in control of power. Although cadence sensors are great in cities, nothing really beats a torque sensor when it comes to control during hard turns and off road trails.
I'd like to see a video of the Rramblas (sp.?) on this trail.... Unless there is one??? But nice work with the reviews.
When I did a first ride with the Ramblas, it was on harder trails in San Clemete, CA. Although, that might be a good idea to see if the forks can handle (6 jumps) as well.
You mentioned the tires could be smaller for street riding, but I'm confused how 4 inch fat tires are commonly used on other ebikes not meant for trails?
I think it's all about how the bike is configured. For this particular bike, I feel like thinner tires would make it more nimble. When riding those 26x4" fat tire bikes, they are what they are, I would not want to put thinner tires on those, but this bike feels like it might do better with slightly thinner tires. I will going down "slightly" 2.5" when I do the fork upgrade to see if it makes a difference.
Great review.
Do you think this bike climbs better than the Aventon Aventure 1? I had an Aventure 1 and it seemed to lose power on steep hills.
Yes, absolutely. I have taken my Aventure 1 on this exact trail. The torque sensor of this bike is excellent.
@@scotthardesty Great.
I ordered a Summit 1 yesterday.
@@scotthines5834 I hope you used my code and saved yourself $60!
Should have come with aSR Suntour XCR Air LO-R Suspension Fork to begin with.
That would have been nice.
I wonder how a bike like my Philodo H8 with it's dual motors, 21 speeds with a 28 to 28 tooth first gear, and a throttle that's limited to the PAS level cutoff for more control when you need the AWD would handle this trail
I tested the Mooncool MC3 (AWD bike) on this trail and it was blast. I jumped that bike as well... just once though.
I would like to see this bike compared to the Ramblas, is that in the works?
It is.
@@scotthardesty I really like my Aventure2 but the Ram has me lusting a bit. Getting back on some more aggressive trials like back in the day!
@@Eli-pf5og I've retired my Aventure 2 on these kind of trails. If it's Aventon on the trails, it's the Ramblas. That is where the bike really shines.
Wait, your license plate says HTML? Now that's sweet! I'm a web guy myself. Awesome video btw!
I've have been building websites since 2003. I no longer do it because I have way more fun making these videos. Thanks for watching!
@@scotthardesty Nice! I’ve been a web developer since ‘99 and you are right, making ebike videos is so much more fun! 👍🏻⚡️
I’m surprised I’ve ridden the summit 1 very hard and jumps and advanced trails on video and the it’s held up great. I weigh 200lbs, I probably will replace my fork regardless at some point in the future though
That's why I am thinking I might have received one with a bad fork. It's also why Velotric wanted it back to inspect the fork as well.
@@scotthardesty Scott weighs 220. Maybe that is the difference.
@@Capronice Actually, 225lbs. lol
Can this bike be ordered with a better fork?
(say like ROCK SHOX or FOX forks)
I ask because I've hit bigger jumps on my full suspension mountain bike with no problem (though I did JACK UP the original DROPPER POST on my Ibis MTB.)
*note ~ being over 60 years of age, I'm now looking at E-MOUNTAIN BIKES because climbing hills just isn't the same as it was when I was in my youth.
It cannot, but I have already ordered a better shock for it for only $200.
Absolutely fantastic video my man! Glad to see the manufacturer take the bike back for investigation i honestly wouldn't be surprised if there was a recal to swith the dangerous forks out for something like the rock shox 35 that can handle the weight of the bike and rider these are cheap and nasty forks! Thry should not even have use for cross country all mountain They would still fail! Keep us posted on what they say its been very interesting that they were so quick to take the bike back thats what you want in a manufacturer!
I do love the fact that they wanted the bike back to see what the issue is. With that said, I have ordered new forks for my bike as I am pretty hard on these things and I want to experiment with other forks. I ordered Marzocchi Bomber Z2 27.5 E-Optimized. Let's see how those do on the same jump.
@@scotthardesty Can you post the exact one you bought? Seems like there are a lot of options and I'm confused! Im interested in upgrading!
@@davidiliyn I will do you one better. I will take you right there. www.jensonusa.com/Marzocchi-Bomber-Z2-275-E-Optimized
1:34 Is your rear wheel fully seated in the dropout?
Yes. The entire bike was safety checked by my local bike shop before I do my reviews.
What PSI do you run in the tires?
I think I was at 15psi
I can't find the link to the bike rack.
WHoops. I forgot to add it. Here it is. Young Electric Sole Rack: tinyurl.com/bdhs97bv
Save $$ with my Discount Code: SCOTT10
Which one is better for a beginner mountain biker? Summit or Ramblas?
Overall, the Ramblas would be my choice due to the SRAM components and the Mid drive.
@@scotthardesty Appreciate the insight! Love the review videos as well.
@@scotthardesty I know the Ramblas has a dropper post. To add a little suspension, would you switch out the dropper for the PNW dropper post w/ suspension? Would it make much difference? I'm getting older, my man. Bones & muscles hurt more often, so full suspension (or semi-full suspension is, probably, a necessity).
@@tonygiancoli9626 I am switching the forks and the dropper on the Ramblas. I already switched out the dropper lever to PNW. I feel my dropper is slow and really hard to use. To be fair, I did submerge it in Lake Michighan for 5 min and that could have affected it some. I have nevered used a dropper with suspension but that does sound nice.
Beg to differ on that statement from the manufacturer the fork does say Cross country All mountain you dropped what 1 n half foot tops I've went off taller kirbs! There just paints forks should not be used for Emtb full stop!
Great review and hope more see this and are put off so the manufacturer gets that fork recalled or scrapped for a new Rock shox 35 atleast on one these!
Any fork that has a preload adjustment instead of air shrader valve Do Not even attempt to jump them!
This emtb need a recall for them forks! They wouldn't hold up to cross country all mountain either! This bike is dangerous elastomer shocks are only good in old RST like shocks
I have ordered new forks for mine. Marzocchi Bomber Z2 27.5 E-Optimized. I will give those a shot and see how they do.
I don't know. Maybe it's just me, but if you call someothing a mountain bike, it should handle a 3 foot jump. If it can't, call it a trail bike. Agree?
Agreed. But I also don't think they had heavier people test it out like I did. Either way, I have ordered better shocks for it so I can do this kind of stuff if I want.
Looks good, up grade to a RockShox, up grade to 2.8in tires, and head to head on some real mountain bike trails think it would beat the new Aventon.
I have ordered new forks. Marzocchi Bomber Z2 27.5 E-Optimized. I also ordered new forks for the Ramblas, Fox 34 Float 29 FIT4 Factory Boost Fork
@@scotthardesty sounds sweet! Which bike do you like better? I'm of the belief that's some of these hubs are a lot better in the woods then people know. Once you add the human element I think the only advantage of a mid drive is weight displacement, they're great on full suspension bikes, but on a hardtail I don't think there's that much of a difference.
@@bassw1758 I have to say, the climbing abilities of my Ramblas surpass what a rear hub motor can do. Well, any rear hub motor that I have tested. My Summit has become my favorite daily bike but I still have to give it to Ramblas for the single track. Although, I do believe that once I switch out the forks (on both bikes) they will both do great on single track.
@@scotthardesty if I had an extra 6g's burning a hole in my pocket, I would probably get one of the new GT' full suspension electric bikes,
@@bassw1758 My $5800 Giant is very nice and it's full suspension. The Aventon Ramblas and the Velotric Summit are the first hardtail emtbs and I enjoy them both. Although, I am also upgrading both bikes with better forks and a few other upgrades for the Ramblas.
Enjoy your reviews. I was going to buy one of these, but now I'm concerned about durability.
It’s fine as long as you don’t use it like a mtb on singletrack trails. It’s a pavement/bridle cruiser with entry level parts. Just have to avoid any hard hits like the rest of the sub-$2k e-bike category.
It's durable. Just because I hit the landing wrong and broke the forks, that could have happened with any bike.
I agree, this would be an excellent trekking bike!
Mooncool,, for the Win.. love mine
I don't think my MC3 would survive as many times as I jumped the Summit. I do not plan to find out either. hahaha.
@@scotthardesty fork wise? Yeah, those have been replaced. Killed them in 2 days. Their sending replacements though,, great warranty
@@Timritchieblue12 hahahaha... you ride like me.
Seems like it rides very quiet.
It does.
I enjoy your videos Scott. They’re informative, detailed and fun. I have to say I do not think you are being fair to Velotric keeping this video up. There are many people who will not purchase this bike now that this video is up. I know you have stated this could happen to any bike, which you are correct about. However, most will not take the time to think that through. It is a shame Velotric will have their brand tarnished due to improper use on your part . It doesn’t seem like the responsible thing to do, kind of disappointing.
Hi Edric. I do want to let you know that before I published this video, I sent it Velotric asking if it was okay to post this. Me knowing that it could hurt the sales of this bike. Velotric and I agreed that this video was a good video to post showing how the warning on the forks state to not jump the bike and this is what could happen if you do so. This video will help those who wish to do more extreme riding with this bike to know that they should upgrade the forks (I have new forks ordered) and I will be repeating that jump once they are installed. So, in my eyes (and Velotrics) this was a video warning people not to push the bike more than it is intended without upgrading parts of it to match your riding style.
Then there is the fact that Velotric sent me an entirely new bike so they could research where the failure point was in the forks , should also show how Velotric was very aware of this video and approved it.
Thank you for your thoughtful response Scott. Hearing it from your point of view and also knowing you consulted Velotric before posting does change my opinion. That is fair and absolutely shows responsibility on your part. Thank you for sharing. I apologize for jumping to conclusions.
I look forward to seeing you test the Summit 1 with the new fork installed. Any chance we could get a redo on your review of the Summit 1 on the mountain bike trail with the stock fork? I am seriously considering purchasing this bike and have a similar riding style/usage as you. Planning to use it mostly as a commuter in NYC with the ability to take it on light to moderate mountain bike trails occasionally and cross country trekking. Which is where my interest in the performance of the bike with stock parts comes into play.
Your content is pretty awesome. Thank you for making it!
Edric
@@edrictorres7809 Hi Edic. Thanks for the response and understanding. I do NOT plan on redoing this test with the stock forks. Most of the time in my reviews, I might hit that jump once or twice. This bike is really fun to jump for me so I would want to do it again and again hence most likely breaking the fork again. I will not have any fears of that happening (no matter how I land) with the new fork I am installing. When it comes down to it, this is an entry level mountain bike and should be treated as such. There are not many people just getting into this sport that would continually do jumps on this bike like I did. Therefore, it is a great bike designed for just that, but the forks was the only weak spot I found on this bike and it was a $200 fix to upgrade. As mentioned in the video, I do not find this a win or a loss, I just look at it as finding where the weak spot is with this bike for someone who rides like me. Since you said you ride like I do, I would buy this bike, and upgrade the front forks. Even with that, you have a great bike for the money invested.
Sounds like they should put a better fork on it. If it's "made for the mountain" it should able to handle these trails
To be honest most of the time these Ebikes don't even come with decent pieces, the fact that it's even close to decent quality is pretty surprising
@@Frisher1 do they claim to be ready for the mountain though? Part of what I liked about this bike was that's it was designed to handle trails but also can commute on pavement. Now, to me, it's just a commuter with mtb tires
@@CH-xn9rb Might have been a faulty unit or maybe a bit too extreme for the mountains it claims to be ready, for
they have many models for you to choose one that meets the type of riding you do, they can't have everything on a bike at this price point.
I did jump this more than any other bike I have reviewed. I am not sure if the stock fork on the new Aventon Ramblas would survive either. This is why I have ordered new forks for both. At this price point, it's easy to upgrade to right components depending on your riding style.
As of 6/01/24. New price $1999.
Yup. All e-bike prices raise on the June 10th. :(
@@scotthardesty
Agreed (sad face)
This company needs to put a jumper fork on that trail bike. Are these people that clueless?
I think at the pricepoint they are selling it, you can afford to upgrade to the fork you want. Which I have on order.
Warning or no warning, you broke a bike the very first time you used it on a trail. Not a great testament for its ability as a mountain bike. They should have went wtih a better stock fork. Think its worth saving up for the Ramblas for more than one reason if you want to really use it for trails.
You know a big reason I don’t think a mountain bike has come as a hub drive from major players to this point is the impracticality of changing the rear wheel. I can’t imagine taking it in to the bike shop every time you had a rear flat.
The Ramblas forks aren't great either. I already ordered a new fork for my Ramblas as it doesn't have any compression or lockout with stock fork.
I agree about the rear hub and flats. Since I use FlatOut, I have never had a flat on any bike that I have reviewed so I've been lucky so far as to not know what a rear flat tire feels like.
@@scotthardesty true but I've seen several reviews say the stock performance is at least fine and it's rated for trail things like jumps. Rockshox while a spring fork is also a good brand. I have a ramblas and maybe I'm lucky but I think the stock tune works really comfortably for me and don't feel the need for adjustment. A lockout function would have been nice though!
@@jermboat44 I just received new forks for both the Ramblas and Summit. Then I won’t have any concerns.
@@scotthardesty cool! What fork did you go with?
@@scotthardesty You say you ordered a Marzocchi Bomber Z2 27.5 E-Optimized fork and that it cost $200. Was there a misprint? I checked Amazon, and two variants of that fork are listed at $487 and $939.