To Jake’s point about the cream always rising to the top…yes, yes, yes. It all comes back to craft. It can be debilitating, with social media, to see artists who are great at marketing themselves see so much success, while other incredible artists struggle to get traction…but I was recently given the advice to make your process work for you - if you’re not passionate about the social media game, then don’t factor it into your process or your measure for success. And don’t compare yourself to someone’s perceived success. Focus on making the best work you can, and find other inroads. Maybe it’s making real connections (gasp!) in person. Love this whole conversation. I’m all riled up now. lol
I started a youtube channel this last summer. It is a lot of work and hard to justify. I've never really put much effort into any social media platform though, so we'll see. However, the person with the smallest social media following who shares my agent is also the biggest name of the group. It tells me to focus far more on my stories rather than social media.
What a great podcast!! Nothing is really free. Even a "free TH-cam" video will cost you something, wasted time or energy if you follow bad advice/teaching. The best is to pay for education if you are serious about learning a skill. I love your stories at the end of the videos. Please keep sharing them. 👻✈🦷
I met Thomas Kinkade once at an airport, when he was on his way to LA for his memoir movie. He actually took the time to pitch me and my friend - which was very generous. He had his entourage with him and they could not believe he was talking to two non-Hollywood types. But he knew who bought his stuff and my friend was a huge fan. In the end - The memoir was way too saccharine, but his real life story is amazing. Really, something to look at for an artist to build a commercial empire.👻✈🦷
I am not the best illustrator but all my work is authentic and I have been able to connect to folks through my work. Im consistent in my creation, my content posting and my products. I think that if someone is super talented but they folks rarely see it I dont know how far they will get. I know over time my art will get better and I think my foundation in marketing and sharing now will only elevate it in the future.
🏐🛩👻 totally with Jake, i don't network, just friendships and genuinely being interested in what people do. And to answer the question... marketing vs art. I do believe you need both if you want to make business out of your art. How can you make money if no one knows about it? Of course it s a balance. But maybe the key is finding a way to use social media as part of your process. For me it's not about number of followers, but It's an actual tool I use to hold me accountable and meeting real connections virtually! For me and the way i work, it really is come from an authentic place and organically too. I am going to join svs learn for the foundation curriculum but I am also excited about the cohort! So should I wait or join?
My take on who will be more successful (the awesome youtuber or the awesome artist): the YTber will be more successful online, they'll have more followers etc. Because from my experience, these people have online followers who might not even be into art at all. They will have a lot of sales, simply because of the brand they created around themselves. However, the good artist will have smaller, but more loyal fan base. They will be selling consistently to their fans. To summarize: the YTber will be more successful moneywise, but the artist will have more loyal fans and might be more successful offline (selling books, prints etc.)
Years ago, when drawing caricatures at amusement parks, my lead said, "the general public's knowledge and taste in art is 30% of an artist's" So, I'd say the youtuber with the far reach will be more successful.
Hi guys, thanks for another great episode. A question for Will: on the cover art of your game Wicked Christmas, shouldn't it read "A Game Of Festive Chaos & Strategy" instead of "Game Of Festive Chaos & Strategy"? In other words, is it missing the 'A'. I'm a UK illustrator and fan of the show. Could this be a UK English versus US English thing?
It's also a title, versus body text issue. So part of it is a question of venue. If you were doing an elevator pitch, you probably would add the A. But think about movie titles and subtitles, and book titles and subtitles, there are things that "break convention." Star Wars Episode IV: Attack Of The Clones should be The Attack of the Clones. We remove articles from a lot of our titles. Imagine now if Will had decided to do a cover of his game, but used a lot of acronyms, jargon, and emojis reserved for text messages... Instead of Wicked Christmas, it would be 🤬🎄
@jimgleeson1695 Thanks for giving this some thought and taking the time to comment. Your Star Wars example is good. The convention within board and card games, however, would be to include an 'A' (at least historically). And by UK conventions.
I'm not smart enough to know the difference - that's why I left it to Anthony Benicki :) .... I'm good at coming up with disruptive titles and stories ...sometimes...and then I'm too impatient to massage the rest. :)
I think you guys are tripping over yourselves. I swear you've said this before in previous podcasts, marketing always wins. Marketing is what sells a product. We don't live in a meritocracy, where the world just immediately knows what's good or not. Bad products have been known to sell really well because of great marketing, we know this. TH-cam is marketing.
Yeah they know this, i think they were just trying to get the point across that you can’t just rely on one or the other you have play both sides of the fence, because even with great marketing you won’t be able to retain your clientele if you're not giving them enough bang for their buck
The best artist would win this dispute for sure. I for one follow a lot of artists for their charisma and for seen myself in their experiences, but from whom I would never buy anything.
Wild stories! 🦷✈👻 (BTW, unrelated to this episode but want to throw out there I need a recap from Lee when he returns from Japan. It doesn't have to be on this channel, he can post it on his own, but inquiring minds need to know!)
youtuber, because of compound effect, unless the project the youtuber made is junk. if its ok, or works well enough, marketing at the start is better so better finances. If the art is amazing but no better marketing, if its not picked up on the rador for a long while, you might miss out on compound effect. This is assume that the youtuber with great marketing just never gets better, or has enough money to hire and commission great artists.
Kincaid paintings? No comparison with Rockwell!! I bought a large and elaborate frame in a thrift store that cost me about $40. There was a Kincaid print that was valued (with frame) on the internet at $350. I took out the print and kept the valuable frame
Along with the familiar is more comfortable than the unusual...we also deal with scammers and spammers now on a daily basis...so we don't know who is real and who might be a bad actor. We're also dealing with people we think we know on Facebook with cloned accounts. The list goes on and on.
From my experience the TH-camr will always beat out the artist, even if the TH-camr 's product is lacking or downright terrible. The constant I see in the success of a TH-camr's project is less about the product and more about building a brand around it.
To Jake’s point about the cream always rising to the top…yes, yes, yes. It all comes back to craft. It can be debilitating, with social media, to see artists who are great at marketing themselves see so much success, while other incredible artists struggle to get traction…but I was recently given the advice to make your process work for you - if you’re not passionate about the social media game, then don’t factor it into your process or your measure for success. And don’t compare yourself to someone’s perceived success. Focus on making the best work you can, and find other inroads. Maybe it’s making real connections (gasp!) in person. Love this whole conversation. I’m all riled up now. lol
I started a youtube channel this last summer. It is a lot of work and hard to justify. I've never really put much effort into any social media platform though, so we'll see. However, the person with the smallest social media following who shares my agent is also the biggest name of the group. It tells me to focus far more on my stories rather than social media.
What a great podcast!!
Nothing is really free. Even a "free TH-cam" video will cost you something, wasted time or energy if you follow bad advice/teaching.
The best is to pay for education if you are serious about learning a skill.
I love your stories at the end of the videos. Please keep sharing them.
👻✈🦷
I met Thomas Kinkade once at an airport, when he was on his way to LA for his memoir movie. He actually took the time to pitch me and my friend - which was very generous. He had his entourage with him and they could not believe he was talking to two non-Hollywood types. But he knew who bought his stuff and my friend was a huge fan.
In the end - The memoir was way too saccharine, but his real life story is amazing. Really, something to look at for an artist to build a commercial empire.👻✈🦷
I am not the best illustrator but all my work is authentic and I have been able to connect to folks through my work. Im consistent in my creation, my content posting and my products. I think that if someone is super talented but they folks rarely see it I dont know how far they will get. I know over time my art will get better and I think my foundation in marketing and sharing now will only elevate it in the future.
I think the phenomenal TH-camr has the most success
🏐🛩👻 totally with Jake, i don't network, just friendships and genuinely being interested in what people do. And to answer the question... marketing vs art. I do believe you need both if you want to make business out of your art. How can you make money if no one knows about it? Of course it s a balance. But maybe the key is finding a way to use social media as part of your process. For me it's not about number of followers, but It's an actual tool I use to hold me accountable and meeting real connections virtually! For me and the way i work, it really is come from an authentic place and organically too.
I am going to join svs learn for the foundation curriculum but I am also excited about the cohort! So should I wait or join?
🦷✈️👻 lol home alone. My kids will ask me if I heard any new stories from Jake and comp. 😂
My take on who will be more successful (the awesome youtuber or the awesome artist): the YTber will be more successful online, they'll have more followers etc. Because from my experience, these people have online followers who might not even be into art at all. They will have a lot of sales, simply because of the brand they created around themselves.
However, the good artist will have smaller, but more loyal fan base. They will be selling consistently to their fans.
To summarize: the YTber will be more successful moneywise, but the artist will have more loyal fans and might be more successful offline (selling books, prints etc.)
Thanks for sharing a new money tip, Lee 👍🏻
Of course Jake tried to drive home with a concussion after making a cartoon dent in the floor 😅 sheesh
Years ago, when drawing caricatures at amusement parks, my lead said, "the general public's knowledge and taste in art is 30% of an artist's" So, I'd say the youtuber with the far reach will be more successful.
Hi guys, thanks for another great episode. A question for Will: on the cover art of your game Wicked Christmas, shouldn't it read "A Game Of Festive Chaos & Strategy" instead of "Game Of Festive Chaos & Strategy"? In other words, is it missing the 'A'. I'm a UK illustrator and fan of the show. Could this be a UK English versus US English thing?
It's also a title, versus body text issue. So part of it is a question of venue. If you were doing an elevator pitch, you probably would add the A. But think about movie titles and subtitles, and book titles and subtitles, there are things that "break convention." Star Wars Episode IV: Attack Of The Clones should be The Attack of the Clones. We remove articles from a lot of our titles. Imagine now if Will had decided to do a cover of his game, but used a lot of acronyms, jargon, and emojis reserved for text messages... Instead of Wicked Christmas, it would be 🤬🎄
@jimgleeson1695 Thanks for giving this some thought and taking the time to comment. Your Star Wars example is good. The convention within board and card games, however, would be to include an 'A' (at least historically). And by UK conventions.
I'm not smart enough to know the difference - that's why I left it to Anthony Benicki :) .... I'm good at coming up with disruptive titles and stories ...sometimes...and then I'm too impatient to massage the rest. :)
I think Will should have a ketchup emoji! Fun banter as always. 👻🦷✈️
I think you guys are tripping over yourselves. I swear you've said this before in previous podcasts, marketing always wins. Marketing is what sells a product. We don't live in a meritocracy, where the world just immediately knows what's good or not. Bad products have been known to sell really well because of great marketing, we know this. TH-cam is marketing.
Yeah they know this, i think they were just trying to get the point across that you can’t just rely on one or the other you have play both sides of the fence, because even with great marketing you won’t be able to retain your clientele if you're not giving them enough bang for their buck
I would love to see a list of illustrator biographies that Jake recommends.
Dang Lee how many lives you got left? No wonder you paint a lot of cats lol
The best artist would win this dispute for sure. I for one follow a lot of artists for their charisma and for seen myself in their experiences, but from whom I would never buy anything.
Wild stories! 🦷✈👻 (BTW, unrelated to this episode but want to throw out there I need a recap from Lee when he returns from Japan. It doesn't have to be on this channel, he can post it on his own, but inquiring minds need to know!)
youtuber, because of compound effect, unless the project the youtuber made is junk. if its ok, or works well enough, marketing at the start is better so better finances. If the art is amazing but no better marketing, if its not picked up on the rador for a long while, you might miss out on compound effect. This is assume that the youtuber with great marketing just never gets better, or has enough money to hire and commission great artists.
Kincaid paintings? No comparison with Rockwell!! I bought a large and elaborate frame in a thrift store that cost me about $40. There was a Kincaid print that was valued (with frame) on the internet at $350. I took out the print and kept the valuable frame
I think the TH-camr wins. Probably why I’m trying to make my TH-cam better.
You talk about posting in forums to make connections, can you share some examples of types of forums appropriate for this?
Along with the familiar is more comfortable than the unusual...we also deal with scammers and spammers now on a daily basis...so we don't know who is real and who might be a bad actor. We're also dealing with people we think we know on Facebook with cloned accounts. The list goes on and on.
🦷
From my experience the TH-camr will always beat out the artist, even if the TH-camr 's product is lacking or downright terrible. The constant I see in the success of a TH-camr's project is less about the product and more about building a brand around it.
👻🦷✈ Great stories!
👻 ✈️ 🏐 lol
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👻✈️🦷🤣
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😖🦷 😴✈️ 👻🗃️
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🏐✈👻 Great show as always!! nice to see you all together, although I also like all your guest hosts too!
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👻 🏐 ✈️
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LOL 🦷🛩️👻
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👻✈️🦷😊
So Kinkade used the KISS comic blood in ink approach…🤘😜🤘
🏐✈️🦷👻
👻🛬 🦷
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