The Secret Truth Of The New Harbor Freight 224cc Predator 224 Engine Review
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 23 เม.ย. 2024
- The new Harbor Freight 224 Predator engine is a DUCAR 224cc Non-Hemi Head type clone engine! We will compare the new 224 Predator Max Performance engine to the old 212 Predator engine (224 vs 212) and discuss the big differences and a few similarities. Some features are shared between the 224 Predator engine and the 212 Predator Hemi engine as well.
Anbull 223cc Engine on Amazon: www.amazon.com/dp/B0989JSHJP?...
Chapters:
00:00 Unboxing
00:20 Jet Kits
01:10 First Look
01:45 Reinforced Block
02:50 Emissions System
03:15 Ducar Carburetor
03:40 Air Cleaner
04:34 Compare 224 With 212
08:15 Flywheel and Coil
08:50 Fishing for Drain Plugs
09:50 Side Cover Removal
11:35 Camshaft Reveal
14:22 Crankshaft Discussion
14:42 "DUCAR" Cast in Block
15:41 Start Up + Coil Rev Test
17:00 Not Rev Limited
After a close look the new 224 Predator engine is undoubtedly a DUCAR 225 engine. This makes high performance aftermarket parts easy to come by with no more special cam required. You can run any clone camshaft in the Predator 224 Max Performance engine now! (Although you may need to clearance the camshaft for that massive 58mm stroke crankshaft.) The 224 Predator block is reinforced and that one feature is worth $100 aftermarket. Now for some numbers and features:
1. The 224 Predator engine crankshaft is a 58mm (2.283") Stoker crank with a connecting rod journal diameter of 1.178"
2. The 224 Predator engine cylinder head is a non-hemi type and that's unfortunate but definitely not a deal breaker.
3. The 224 Predator engine camshaft has a shaft diameter of .549" on both ends and will interchange with other clone camshafts. That's right, the 224 Predator engine now accepts clone camshafts.
4. The valves in the 224 Predator engine will be advertised as 27mm Intake and 25mm Exhaust, but that's rounded up a few thousandths of an inch of course.
5. The cylinder block in the 224 Predator engine is a reinforced race type dual bearing block and it has "DUCAR" raised in the casting on the inside. It's not a Tillotson block and it's not a Wildcat 223 block. The 224 Predator Max Performance block is something new completely. The deck height on the 224 Predator engine block is almost .025 taller than the 223 Wildcat engine block.
So what does this mean for racers and engine builders? It means that the 224 Predator Max Performance engine is a DUCAR 225 engine with a non-Hemi type cylinder head and aftermarket performance parts are common and easy to acquire for the 224 Predator engine!
The new 224 Predator Max Performance engine is actually a DUCAR 225 (in disguise), a stroked version of the DUCAR 212. The reinforced block on the 224 Predator engine is a welcome feature. The 212 Predator engine has had some block issues when bored oversize. The new thicker 224 Predator engine block has now laid that issue to rest. Big bores on the 224 Predator engine are no longer as much of an issue as they were on the 212 Predator engine. The 224 Predator engine is a welcome engine build candidate over both the Predator 212 Hemi engine and Predator 212 non-hemi engine.
The 224 Predator engine 58mm stroke crankshaft, is $100+ alone.
This 224 Predator engine is also featured in a 3 part performance billet rod flat top piston 224 Predator build on the channel. I used a Wildcat flat top piston from the 223 Wildcat engine and a EC Pinnacle billet connecting rod with insert bearing. The cam is a Tennessee Thunderstix Banzai 265 kit with lifters and 26 LB valve springs. A Mikuni VM22 VM-22 clone carburetor and aftermarket Predator 212 aluminum intake manifold. As soon as we have some warmer weather I'll be installing the 224 Predator build engine on either a Coleman CT200U mini bike frame or a Baja frame minibike.
It's my opinion the 224 Predator engine is one of the best harbor freight engines of all time.
Upcoming engine builds soon! Stay tuned!
04-12-2022 Update:
The New 212 Predator Ghost 212cc engine arrived. The Ghost 212 Review and Disassembly video is now up as well as a brief parts comparison video of the Ghost 212 and the DUCAR 212 Hemi.
#212cc #predator224 #predator #ghost #kartracing #predator212 #predator224 #tillotson #billet #ringcompressor #wiseco #rings #besttools #bestgadgets #enginebuild #enginebuilding101 #KentuckyFriedFixes - แนวปฏิบัติและการใช้ชีวิต
I want to thank everyone for watching the Predator 224 engine and the 224 build video(s). New videos are up on the New Predator Ghost 212 engine. I've got parts on order for a performance build of the Predator Ghost 212 which will begin as soon as the remaining parts arrive. There are numerous engine builds upcoming from mild to wild. If you haven't already Subscribed, please take a moment to do so. It helps the channel get better search rankings so others can find it. I'm not sponsored nor monetized and I have no desire to be. If you see me using an engine, part or product in my videos it means I paid for it out of my pocket and I have the freedom to share an honest opinion whether it's any good or not. Thanks! Chris (Kentucky Fried Fixes)
That was very cool for you to take us through that engine. Thanks for doing that brother! Keep up the awesome work.
Thanks for watching!
Fun fact: The 210903 on the sticker is the date it was manufactured, meaning it was built on September 3, 2021. They use a YYMMDD format so that the serial numbers are in chronological order when they count up. The 02805 is likely a time code for what time/shift/assembly line it was scanned on after testing.
EDIT: The carb has 210901 so it was manufactured on September 1, 2021. That factory was running VERY tight production on these units. No extra stock laying around. I think I saw 120502 on the old one so that was built May 2, 2012.
Awesome info! This is exactly the kind of thing that comes in handy when identifying these things! The old 212 is an engine I've had for several years. It's a new one in the box left over from a sale bulk purchase but it's not a recent manufacture "New" engine. I expect the QC on it was terrible! Thanks!
Have one of these on a wood chipper. No complaints so far, more power than I expected. Only issues with about 30hrs on it has been muffler cover screws vibrating off.
Scott that engine is probably trying to spit out the muffler hoping you'll replace it with a header! Thanks!
I’ve used predator engines on several tillers and a few zero turns for customers. They’re all still going and never had a single problem
The price keeps going up is the only complaint I've had with Predator engines. I miss the $99 sale priced engines. Now they seem to be at $149 regular price and sometimes go on sale at $129. I guess to be fair everything is going up in price these days.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes Damn , I haven’t bought one since the increase. Thanks for the heads up.
Great vid! Very informative. Which camshaft do you recommend?
Hi 333! It really depends on what you'll be building the engine for. These are being used for mild performance engines and non-race applications. My max rpm target is around 7,500, so I'm not going any higher than 26lbs on the spring tension. I've been using the 265 Banzai cams but recently I've been experimenting with the 252 Rattlesnake and 272 Mongoose camshafts. (all of these are in the $50 price range and are not welded lobe cams so not very friendly to anything more than 26lb valve springs) The Banzai 265 is a great cam but the compression release mechanism sticks out a bit and can rub the side of the crankshaft if the crank doesn't have much machine work done on the side of the counterweight. So far this has not been a problem on the 224 builds as my cranks have had a nice machined surface on the side, but it is something to consider. The 252 Rattlesnake and 274 Mongoose cams don't seem to have that issue. If I was building an all out race engine target max rpm 9,000+ I'd likely go with something from Dyno with welded lobes and some double valve springs. A lot of guys are having good luck with those but they are in the $100+ price range though.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes thanks a lot! I’m building a daily driver. I just bought a 212cc predator engine to slap on a Coleman ct200u-ex. So far I plan on upgrading the carburetor, exhaust pipe & camshaft.
I appreciate the content you’re producing…keep up the great work
Great vid, thanks for sharing!
Thanks Ken
Thanks for the comparison 👍
Thanks for stopping by!
Good review Chris, its nice they reinforced the crankcase. 👍
Thanks John. Looks like these should be good engines for the karters and minibikers.
They sure do bud and anytime.
Were weak crankcases a problem on the 212? You really seem impressed by the reinforcements, so I am just curious if this was a problem.
@@car2069 The older 212 engines had very thin blocks. It meant that you were kinda limited when you bored one. If you went too large of an oversize on the bore, the top of the block would pop off in a catastrophic failure. Great question! Thanks!
Says sleeved cylinders also
Great video.You explain things really good.
Thanks for watching Sam!
Great review, thanks
Thank you Mike, I appreciate you stopping by.
Nice engine. What's the length and width bolt pattern? I am debating on buying this engine to put on my vintage Montgomery Ward snow blower and wondering how much modifying I would have to do?
Hi Mike, the mount is a standard 6.28" x 3.07" (bolt hole pattern) center to center. Same specs as the 212 and many other small engines. Thanks!
Clone cam shaft. Clone flywheel. Stroker crank. Sounds pretty good to me. I've ordered 2 of them. Gotta see what I can build from one.
I should have my order in tomorrow for a new billet rod and performance cam!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes are you going to post a video with specs and such?
@@Chocolate_dragon Will do! I'm working on the new video now with the performance parts. It's cold in the shop.....
Just subbed, I have 8 of the small vertical engines in use for 2 years of grass cutting, haven't been able to find them for about 2 years in stock, I think I'll try to figure out HOW to mount one of these to my Snapper RER to use it to pull my pull behind cutter
I remember the vertical engines. They have been missing in action for a while now. Thanks!
Does the flywheel have the magnets in it that will work with the alternator/charging coil that you can add on? I had to get a different flywheel to use it on the 212.
Hi Edward! The stock flywheel that comes with the 224 Predator did not have any magnets on any of the 224 engines I have worked on. I purchased an electric start kit for one of the engines and it came with charging system and flywheel.
Where would I find parts to upgrade like plastic part for a metal one
I should have a new video coming out later this week if the parts arrive on time. Be sure to subscribe and hit the notifications bell for updates as I'll list all info in the next video! Thanks, Chris
Yes definitely need to clearnce top of block and the cam. Not much in the block not sure about the cam but rod don't clear that either
Thanks for the heads up Joseph. Yep this sounds like it's gonna be fun.
Would yu recommend getting this and upgrading it or getting the 212 Ghost
Hi Dominic! The 224 Predator engine is a much better value than the Ghost 212. The 224 has a race quality reinforced engine block and 58mm stroke crankshaft out of the box so it makes a far superior engine. Both engines will require a few aftermarket billet parts such as the connecting rod and flywheel, but with the 224 you start in the $189 price range and the Ghost 212 $299
Would a clutch from the 212cc work on this new 224cc for a go kart?
They both have the 3/4" output shaft. The clutch should fit exactly the same as long as it's 3/4".
It's a stroked and clearanced Ducar 212 with a non hemi head. Sweet.
Yes Sir! I really like the 224 engines!
Can I use the 224 crank in a tilly block and if so what upgrades would get me high rpms thanks
Hi Shane. The crank should fit any block that's compatible with Honda clone engine parts. I know EC had an engine build contest recently and one of the guys that entered used a 58mm crank in a Tilly block. If you're going for max RPM, it's mostly in the camshaft and valve springs. Of course you'll have to add some billet stuff like the billet rod and flywheel for it to stay together. Lots of mods will get you in the 9 to 10K range. I'm thinking about doing a little more advanced build on a 72mm block. But, while the long stroke crank is nice to have these are pretty soft, so I don't know how long they'll hold up at 10K. Thanks
Thank you for the time and information 🙏
@@shaneray5626 Thanks for being here Shane. I enjoy the engine talk.
Looks like the way to go with these is to get a hemi flat top piston, then dig into your parts for a stock clone rod to measure in the hole with the hemi piston. Then order the proper clone billet rod and head gasket choice.
I like the way you think. I've gotten in some performance parts to try out and some will work, some won't. I'll share what I have come up with and where to get the parts that work when I finish the next video. Thanks!
Can this motor be converted with a hemi kit?
@@RedDarealist Yes Sir DR RED! I have a video on a Hemi head 224 swap and DIY Willy just did one! Links are on the 224 Hemi video. Thanks!
Hi kff. What are the differences between 224 predator vs 224 ducar.ducar has no governer.224 plastic cam.anything else?
Hi Larry! I've not had a look inside the 224 Ducar engines yet but I'll bet you're right. The 224 should be a 212cc Ducar base engine with a 58mm stroke crank in place of the 55mm crank and a non-hemi head from what I've read. We may have to purchase a 224 Ducar and have a look inside. I'm curious to see if they went with the standard dished piston or a flat top. Right now I'm in the middle of a 6.2 GM diesel engine rebuild so when that's finished I'll see what I can do. Thanks Larry!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes hi KFF.thanks for your reply.enjoy the big engine build.happy thx giving.
SO, how is the cam gear attached to the cam? Can a metal one be fabricated and replace it easily"
It looks like it's molded to the shaft. I don't know if it would be worth the effort to put into a stock camshaft. Metal replacements are really inexpensive now. I've seen engine builders sell the stock metal 212 camshafts by the 10 pack for around $30. Thanks!
Picked one of these up yesterday to replace a blown Tillotson. Kid spun out my Juggernaut and sent a rod through kart 2's block.
How much was it?
I'm sorry to hear about the Tilly, but at least these are now a good alternative. Thanks for watching!
@@eltonnah6306 $189.95 on the Predator 224
@@KentuckyFriedFixes thanks👍
Great job!!!
Thanks for the encouragement Steve. I'm trying to get the hang of this video stuff and I'm finding out, it ain't easy!
Haha. It's good to keep your tools pulled, but I don't think a magnet needs oil! Very informative video! Interesting to see how these things are put together. I was also surprised to see that plastic cam gear. Wonder how it will hold up.
Next time I'll try not to drop anything in the oil container. I'll be replacing my plastic camshaft with something a little more metally. Thanks for watching!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes looking forward to the next one!
The plastic cam gear holds up great after ya chunk it in the trash can. 😝
Really, though. As long as you don’t mod the engine like removing the governor and such, it will do just fine.
Briggs and Stratton used an entire plastic cam with gear in their smaller mower engines for a while. I've never heard of them causing problems, but I prefer an old Tecumseh any day.
@@vanfrank1602 Van I don't think the cam is a deal breaker. I'm saving mine in case I need it later for something, definitely not throwing it out. I love them old Tecumsehs! I used to pull an old Wheel Horse with a hot HH100 that would turn crazy RPM. The Kohler guys were always mad at me so I ended up selling it to my buddy J.R. Problem solved, they stayed mad at him after that. Thanks!
Where can I get a double grooved pulley that will fit this shaft size? I was gonna put this on a ryan dethatcher I have that has a old dinosaur Briggs 7hp has almost 1” shaft tho this shaft looks to be 3/4” ?
The 224 Predator has a 3/4 output shaft. I have bought pullies at Tractor Supply Store (TSC) years ago but I can't remember if they have double pullies or not. Surplus Center online may have something.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes I think this in its stock form would be fine for that dethatcher. The new ones come w Honda Gx160. So I figured it should. . Thanks. KFF
What torque converter would you match with this engine on a black widow go kart?
Hi Kevin, Those are pretty heavy karts. I have an old dune buggy type Kart which is likely heavier than the black widow though. I have purchased one of the 30 series Comet clone torque converters for it ($63.99). I think it will work fine but I've not tried it yet. The original torque converter on my kart was a Comet brand 30 series and I have to say the clone unit I purchased looks pretty good as compared to the original. I looked into the 40 series but they seem to all be for the 1" bore shafts and I needed the 3/4" like on the 224 Predator. I did notice that the 40 series was also about triple the price of the 30 series too. I've not gotten mine installed so I can't tell you how it will hold up yet but it's getting close to Spring so I should know in a few weeks. At around $65, I'm gonna try it before shelling out $300-$400 on a name brand.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes thank you very much. I have been sitting on this for a while as I couldn’t find anything on this subject. My grandson will appreciate it.
@@kevinbrown2494 You're welcome Sir! Let's get those karts movin'! Thanks.
Great video, you didn’t happen to measure the Carb Venturi diameter?
Hi Grant, I'm working on it today so I'll get some measurements on the carb this evening.
Grant the venturi is beyond the reach of my dial caliper but I did measure the throttle bore at .745 the venturi looked quite a bit smaller. I'm thinking .650 to .680. I cover some of this in the new video but I did notice it looks like the carb venturi is removeable. I haven't verified that yet, but it sure looks like it will come out.
i wonder how the performance when taking off the govenor
First thing to go, the governor. Thanks!
Great video!
Thank you!
I’m looking to buy a 212 or 224 I just want something that I can do minor stuff to and reliability is the #1. What would you recommend?
Hi Orion Zzz! If you're looking into a Chinese 212 engine, I'd look at the DUCAR 212 Hemi engines. Those come with a nice performance flywheel included and a nice thick block. I'm looking at a new 223 engine design now as well. I'll have a video out on it as soon as I get caught up. I'll also have some new stuff out soon on the $49.95 179cc LCT engines. We'll be doing some budget builds and block swaps on a few of those. To me, none of the Chinese engines are reliable out of the box. The quality control on the parts is hit and miss at best. One engine will run fairly smooth and the next may shake, vibrate and rattle itself apart. If I was going to buy one without opening it up or modifying it, no matter what brand chosen, I'd make sure to get the longest extended warranty they have available. It'll likely come in handy.
Wow, looks very interesting!
Thank you Sir!
shout out at 7:38
@@KentuckyFriedFixes Ha ha! I do love my Acorn nuts! ❤❤
Got mine mounted on frame I still need to cut my tq plate so I don't have to run risers going to run mine stock for now
🤦🏽♂️we still don’t have them in stock in LA
@@RoyalJZ my local hf had 2 in stock said it would be at least a month before next shipment thought about buying them both just went for one if you have troubles getting one just hit me up sure I can get you hooked up bro
I think stock these will run just fine. There's lots of engines running those nylon gear camshafts. It's nice to know if it ever fails you can drop a clone camshaft right in place. Thanks for watching!
@@RoyalJZ Hang in there. I was told that each store would be receiving one or two engines for the release. If you don't have one locally, you may have to drive for an hour or two as I did. Just remember to ask up front if you don't see any on the shelf. The HF store I picked this one up didn't even know they had any until they looked in the back.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes mine will be going on a kart more then likely at some point going to try it on my warrior frame for while
Hey man how would I delete that emissions thing on the bottom?
I removed mine by disconnecting the hose from the air cleaner. I kept the hose from the tank vent, you'll want to keep the tank vent line. The charcoal canister just unbolts from the cylinder tin.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes thanks man. As a Kentuckian I don’t really need that emissions thing as it’s something that can go bad
Will it for on a ct200u-ex on stock frame? Please help trying to decide if 224 will fit
Hi Kyle! The bolt pattern is the same as the 196cc engine. The only difference is the pull start cover is wider than the 196cc that originally came on the CT200U series. So it may rub up against your right leg a bit more than the 196 did. And if you switch over to a torque converter you'll have to do the same mounting mods as you would for the 196cc. As long as you stick with the factory clutch and chain set up that came with the bike, the 224 will bolt up.
Kentucky fried fixes. How fast can it go on stage 3?
@@kylereeder807 Hi Kyle! Those stage kits are put together by the parts guys so it really depends on what you get in their particular kit.
I have this engine for my kids go cart I used a pulley to take the clutch off and it left the back of clutch on it and I noticed on the shaft of mine it don’t have that groove, so how do I get the rest of the clutch off any ideals?
Hi Charles! It sounds like part of the clutch is stuck on the output shaft. Your crankshaft should have a 3/16" keyed groove on the 3/4" output shaft. You may be looking at part of the old clutch that's still stuck on the crankshaft. Look for a set screw somewhere on the clutch housing, make sure the clutch bolt has been removed from the crankshaft. That's about all the advice I can offer without seeing it. Lots of penetrating oil may help break up some of the rust if that's what's sticking it to the shaft.
Thank you sir that’s a big help
@@user-en8xm1rc1p I hope everything works out Charles!
Got my 224 done up with the 212 stage 1 kit already not gonna run it till i build it with a arc rod and flywheel like i did my 212 and im probably gonna run the same parts as my 212 build but in the 224 the added stroke with my set up should make quite abit more power over the 212 with the same set up
Awesome Spencer! I think that billet rod will be a must have on these once a decent camshaft kit is installed. The flywheel is also a must have. I have ordered one of the racing cast aluminum flywheels rated at 8500 RPM. I'm probably not going higher than that on RPM. Thanks for commenting my friend!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes Did you get one of those low cost flywheels? I always wondered how they are timed?
@@Deucealive75 I've ordered the parts and if they arrive on time I should have a new video out later this week with the details on the install and where to source the parts. Don't forget to subscribe and smash the notifications bell for the performance engine updates video coming. Thanks, Chris
@@KentuckyFriedFixes oh sure thing cant wait to see how your build turns out im gonna shoot for the moon on this one as it has the better block and is stroked from factory so just a all around better starting point it seems like 9k-10k here i come lol
@@KentuckyFriedFixes oh i have a list here of parts for the 224 thats already up to 1500 bucks and thats not including balancing the crank
I just bought this engine to slap onto my coleman ct200u-ex, which parts would you recommend I swap out, just to have a more solid, better performing engine?
Hi Caleb. If you're going to leave the governor on, you can add some more power just by adding an exhaust header. Most like to add the aftermarket air cleaner as well but I'm not sure an aftermarket air cleaner would help in this case as the stock unit has a cartridge filter and will breath pretty good as it is. It's also easy to add some 1.2 or 1.3 rocker arms with the stock camshaft and springs for more valve lift and power too. The stamped 1.2 and 1.3 ratio rockers are around $8 each and will live with stock springs and stock lift camshafts. Of course if you want a high RPM build, I have a 3 part series I did with a billet rod build on the 224 Predator. It depends on where you want to take the engine of course.
@Kentucky Fried Fixes and if I take it out? How about adding that hemi also? I seen it online for a decent price
@Kentucky Fried Fixes Another question for you if you don't mind, the hemi swap you did, is that the same engine as the one you started up, with the header?
@@troy22nd Hi Caleb. There are 2 of the 224 Predator engines. One is the billet rod build and the other is the stock 224 that I swapped the Hemi head onto. I've not made any further modifications to the stock 224 Hemi engine yet. I used the same header for the run tests on both engines. I have since purchased a new header so i wouldn't have to swap it back and forth between them and wouldn't you know, it has the same crappy flange as the other one! Thanks
@@troy22nd If you're going to remove the governor you'll need to add in a billet rod and billet flywheel for sure. The stock rod won't handle sustained high RPM and the cast iron flywheel is already thinking about coming apart when it's sitting still.
My clutch from the 212 won't fit on the 224... What are the best options?
Hi Kyle. The Predator 212 and the 224 have the same output shaft size of 3/4" or .750 Some mini bike makers falsely labelled the 196cc engines as a 200cc, those engines have a 5/8 output shaft and will not interchange. I think that may be the situation you have. Best option would be to search Ebay or Amazon for a new replacement 3/4" clutch. You can find them for around $20 or less if you shop around. Remember you want a clutch for a 3/4" output shaft that has your correct sprocket according to your chain size, there are listings for lots of different sizes output shafts but the 3/4" is what you need for your Predator 224. The most common choices for sprocket chain size are # 35 and # 41, if your mini bike has a # 420 chain the # 41 will still fit. Hope this helps!
I also wanted to add that some Chinese clone engines will have a 20mm (.787) output shaft as well. The Predator 224 has a 3/4" or .750 output shaft.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes hey thanks so much... Yep thats what it was... The guy i bought it from said it was 212 i bought the 224 and wouldn't fit turns out you are right
@@kylearnett192 Good deal Kyle! I'm glad you got it worked out. Now let's ride!
Does it have a removable plate where a starter could go
You'll have to get an entire kit to convert it over. I've not done it, so I don't want to tell you wrong but it's my opinion that yes you could, I don't see any reason why you couldn't make this an electric start engine.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes I have a bunch of powerland electric start 212 engines I grabbed cheap off the ebay a few years back they have everything I need but I am looking to put one on a snowblower so I want 120volts flywheels are $25 starters are $75 12volt kits are $80 for everything including charging coil and new fan cover
@@craigchiddo2794 Go for it Craig! As far as i know you'd be the first to install an electric start on the new 224 Predator!
Would the cam/shaft from the 212 fit in the 224?
The 224 uses a clone type camshaft with a shaft diameter of .550" The stock 212 Predator camshaft has a larger diameter shaft and will not swap over, the Hemi Predator camshaft will work or any clone cam with the .550 journal.
Damn..I was kinda wondering that too since the cam in the 224 is plastic!!!!!
So a hemi cam will fit in it instwad of a non hemi cam im looking at gps hot265 cam will it fit if so wich one?
So bottom line, if you don’t care about the nylon cam get the predator because you’re basically getting a ducar for less than a stock ducar. Predators are cool if you need something for farm work etc or in a pinch but if you plan on racing or wanting performance get the ducar because they already have most of the internals you’d have to change out on the predator to safely hit those high rpm’s. The price difference between a 224 and a ducar 212 is minimal in my opinion so I’d get the ducar unless harbor freight put them on sale for 125 or something, at the moment they are right at 179, and the ducar 212 is roughly 250 and comes with gov removed, pvl flywheel, non nylon glow in the dark cam😂, amongst being marketed as something it truly is unlike the predator. Nice comparison, and great video
I do like that PVL flywheel on the Ducar 212, it makes the engine a great value considering there's no need to buy an upgraded flywheel. The Predator 224 is still worth the price IMO. Though the prices on the 58mm stroker cranks have dropped quite a bit. Now I'd probably go with the Ducar 212 and install the aftermarket 58mm crankshaft. (I think they're $39.95 or around that) Thanks!
You read too much into things, about the same price minus shipping actually.
" if you plan on racing or wanting performance get the ducar because they already have most of the internals you’d have to change out on the predator to safely hit those high rpm’s"
Go ahead and not do that on the Ducar and please do a video of it for us. ROFL
Other than the governor holes not being there, no advatnage like you thought, sorry if this hurts your exhaust pipe.
Any idea what the idle rpm's are on the 224?
Hi Karl! I didn't put a tach on this one. The idle speed is probably somewhere between 650 and 800 RPM though.
@@KentuckyFriedFixesNo LOL
Aren't you missing the 1 in of those haha?
@@NubsWithGuns LOL! It actually idles pretty decent when stock. The built version (What this one became in later videos) does require a bit more idle speed.
Bought one to swap out a 196 clone on a minibike. After tuning the carb, it did have a bit more torque, but doesn’t run nearly as smooth as the 196 did. Probably not worth it for just tooling around. Honda knew what they were doing when they designed the 196!
Those 224 engines have a balance issue with the crankshaft. The flywheels were loose on some from the factory too. (Good thing to check) The crank throw casting is too heavy on top. You can help the balance by switching to a lighter piston and rod combo but that's more $ too. If you're building one for racing, it's a good idea to add some weight to the crank counterweights and do a proper engine balance (drag out the scales, drill bit and heavy metal slugs).
Is that a RH or LH threaded shaft? thanks
Hi Paul! All the threads on this one are standard Right Hand Thread including the flywheel nut. I think I know what you're getting at, they should have adapted a LH thread for the flywheel nut as is commonly found on chainsaws. Engineers! You gotta love 'em!
Thanks for the info 👍
Is the 224 louder than the 212 at low rpm? By any chance do you kniw what is the lowest rpm these eniginea can run at? I do mobile auto detailing and the 224 would look perfect in my van.
Hi David, the noise level seems to be about the same thru the muffler. They're pretty quiet. I don't know what rpm minimum they'd run at, the stock flywheel is pretty heavy though so that should allow a sustained low rpm run. They are air cooled though, so there's that to consider. Too low on rpm for long periods may cause the engine to overheat.
Looks very similar to a Honda. Looking to purchase one of these for my craftsman snow blower.
The 224 is a pretty good buy. That Anbull 223cc is a better engine but costs a little more too. If you just want a snowblower engine you can't beat the $49.95 LCT engines. I have a few videos on the channel for those. They were removed from Husqvarna snowblowers but they have the standard bolt pattern. Thanks!
Does the 212 cam fit the 224 ?
Hi Randy, the 212 hemi predator will fit but the non hemi 212 has the larger diameter camshaft bearing journals and will not fit. The clone engines have the Honda .550 cam journal, like the new 224 predator. Hope this helps, Chris
But how does it compare to the tiliton 224??
The Tilly 225? I think that one is a 72mm bore with a 55 or 56mm stroke. The Tilly would be a much better option! Big bore + short stroke is better IMO.
Cool!
Thanks for watching/ commenting!
Yeah I’d go with the ducar better flywheel and made for racing. Exactly what I need it for
You're going to buy that flywheel extra either way, so.......
Do performance cams from the predator 212 fit these engines?
The 224 Predator and the 212 Hemi have a .549 to .550 bearing journal diameter on the cam. It's the same as the Honda and clone engines. The standard Predator 212 non-hemi engines have a larger journal on the camshaft of .557 and will not interchange. Weird how they thought this was a good idea...
Is it me or is the header tubing thicker?
Chase I haven't measured the difference. I'll put a mic on the muffle tubing in the next video. I should have a new one out Friday if the parts arrive on time. Be sure to subscribe and hit the notifications bell, more info coming. Thanks, Chris
I don't think arc billit rod will clear the block. I'll try it when I get home later today
Hi Joseph, the block is definitely thicker than the 212 block. The thicker block and the increased stroke on the crank is probably gonna be fun fitting rods and cams.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes yep I believe so
A little grinding should do the trick. Only a tiny bit on my black mamba cam and very little on the block
기계 소개하는 내용의 컨텐츠 video 구경잘하고 가요 good 시청함🌺👍
Welcome and thank you. 👍
The Ford A and B engines used nylon cam gears. So did a Mustang I once owned.
Lots of engines running nylon gears. Briggs has had some trouble with the nylon cams and gears though as has Kawasaki on some of their twins. If I wasn't replacing it with a performance camshaft, I'd leave it in unless or until it failed for sure. Thanks!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes going to fail eventually, my 79cc also has nylon cam which boggled my mind how manufacturers could put that in there with longevity in mind, clearly they didn't make it to last too long but I'm glady 420 doesn't have nylon cam😂
@@str8xrippin At least the lobe portion of the cam is steel, only the gear is nylon. I'm not throwing mine out, it will find another use in something less performance oriented. Thanks
@@KentuckyFriedFixes the lobe on my 79 is also nylon, the whole thing is plastic so I find that disappointing but there's not much stress a small displacement engine will put on that cam. Also the nylon only gear is dangerous but what the heck these are only a $100 right
@@str8xrippin Oh man, I've seen those cams with the plastic lobes. Yikes!
🤘🏽🔥
So which one is better?
The 224 is much better than the 212 IMO.
Thanks for showing the air filter.
Thanks Brown
16:35 running an engine indoors?
I don't mind running an engine briefly inside the work shop. Of course my shop has a large sliding door and windows that open.
Why is Ducar printed into the engine?
The 224 Predator engine is manufactured by "Ducar"
@@KentuckyFriedFixes Hmm, lol.
Wow HF seems as though they got a Winner with thesePredator ngines I’m 58 years old and i never thought i would see the day that the Old Faithful Briggs and Stratton and the small Honda morsel would wind up getting fphased out of course i know the Predators are basically a Clone of the Hondas but in reality they are fairly well done for the cost savings and that’s honestly coming from a guy that has owned many genuine Honda products. during my lifetime
Craig I'll always have a soft spot in my heart for the Briggs flat head engines, but these overhead valve engines have come a long way. Thanks!
As I understand it the 224 is a 212 with a stroker crank. Shorter stroke spools up faster but lowers overall power.
It's a completely different engine than the 212. Though designed on the same specs there's lots of improvements like the thicker block and longer stroke crankshaft. It's a trade off on the strokers. Lots of guys like the short stroke big bore engines and others like the small bore with long stroke crank. I think the shorter stroke is probably more comfortable at high rpm. Thanks for commenting!
It’s actually rated .1HP higher and almost 2lbs of torque higher
@@anthony1113 A lot of guys have been saying the 224 pulls much harder than the 212 at lower RPM. Just a mild cam seems to wake them up a bit more but even stock that extra torque is noticeable.
You must understand wrong. The 224 has a lot of the same measurements but the stroke is longer in the 224. It's a totally different motor though. Parts are different and stronger but a lot can be changed over into the 212
@@KentuckyFriedFixes me and my brother just got mini bikes..they both have the same gear ratio running a clutch..I have a 224 and he has a 212 hemi and both are new..mine smokes his on acceleration.
It seams to be just a better version of the 212 with more stroke
I agree Aaron, it's got more clone features but exactly the same bore as the 212. I like the 58mm Stroke crank, that's about $100 by itself.
This (224) or 212 ghost ??
Hi Dominic! This is the review for the 224. I have a different review on the channel for the Ghost 212.
Huge quality improvement over the 212s. I might start buying Predator engines on occasion. Before I bought strictly Tillotson R stuff. Much nicer it takes all clone parts. Cheaper, and more prolific.
It looks like these new Predator 224 engines are going to be a game changer.
With a plastic cam gear think again
@@David-gf6hr We throw those away quickly. In a stock application, those should live a long time.
@@David-gf6hr It would have been nice if it was an all steel camshaft so at least we could have something for a core to regrind though for sure. The block and the 58mm stroke crankshaft would cost more to buy separately than the entire 224 engine. That's the main game changer, more performance parts out of the box. Camshaft aside, it's a pretty good deal.
@@David-gf6hr yeah, because exactly no one keeps the factory cam
Everybody talks about the flywheel and that it comes apart I've never seen it happen. I beat the hell out of my motors and I've never had it happen.
Hi SKATE1776, the cast iron flywheel has a magnet held in place by glue and a screw. The most common issue is the magnet comes off and shoots thru the pull start housing. They can also break in the middle. I used to say the same thing about the stock 5HP Briggs flywheels until one came apart on me.
Everyone makes fun of them but they power my 180 tiller just fine when the engine gave up in the old girl.
149.00 and we are back and running
Hi Mad Max! I agree, the Predator engines have brought back to life a lot of power equipment that would have otherwise been junked. A low cost repower means a lot especially these days.
y this motor ain't at my harbor freight
Hi Farris, if they don't have them on display at your local store remember to ask for the engine at the front. (That's what I had to do) They may not know they have them until they go look in the back. Or I believe the engines are available online now at the Harbor Freight website.
Less weight more power thats a plus
True!
That plastic cam gear gets the boot as soon as the engine hits the bench! 🤣. I ran into a few other clones with that trash
True John, mine was replaced with the 265 Banzai cam. I think most guys will replace the camshaft anyway so it is unfortunate but it's not a deal breaker. It is new so I guess I'll save it as a spare for my tiller. LOL Thanks!
What cam fits in it and clears?
If this cost me more than the 212 model, and is *NOT* a hemi, then I don't want it.
If you leave it box stock about the only benefits over the 212 are the longer stroke crank and the thicker block. These features are really aimed at builders that want to increase performance. I'm thinking about changing mine over to a hemi head design for a later build, but it does mean buying the hemi head. Thanks for commenting Sandas.
@@KentuckyFriedFixes I have a 212 hemi, are you saying my 212 hemi head would bolt on to the 224?
@@RandomFPVlive I've not tried to install a hemi head on the 224 block yet but yes it should work just fine. Looking at doing this BTW as soon as I get the billet rod/piston combo worked out. There's no reason it shouldn't fit the Ducar 225 block used in the 224 Predator.
Woooo
My thoughts exactly. lol!
it’s the same engine and everything like Ryubi 2900
my ducar carb says predator wtf is goin on are we being pranked with goodness
LOL I was kinda shocked to see "DUCAR" lasered on the 224 Predator carb, it would be funny if they switched it. The 212 DUCAR hemi I'm working on now has a "Ruixing" adjustable. It's not staying on there though. Thanks!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes its a cool lil freedom perk we get with these lil motors glad they still allow us to buy them gas guzlers
@@KentuckyFriedFixes mine says that too the screw thats gold with the spring is that making my bike pop and backfire all silly like lol which way do i turn it too stop the backfires
@@KentuckyFriedFixes what do u mean staying on mine backfired and i had to clean the manifold because i have a high flow air filter and header pipe there was all this dust in there from the backfire i guess but i cleaned it out
@@angrycruizer2o3 I used a Mikuni clone carb in place of the Predator 224 carb on the 224 build. I like those much better than the carbs that come with these engines. Thanks! .
These small engines are supposed to maintain California Air Resources Board's (CARB) emissions compliance for 300 hours. This is the NAZI state agency responsible for banning small internal combustion engines from residential use. The charcoal canister is part of the emissions package, but I doubt the charcoal can last 300 hours.
Hi Steve! Great point! I'll bet the first time the tank is overfilled, the charcoal canister is history! I do agree with emissions on non-race applications though for sure.
F the epa when I throw it in the junk box with the other 3 ROFL.
@@NubsWithGuns Luckily, since Kentucky law does not recognize California emission standards, we are exempt.
@@KentuckyFriedFixesWhat does California have to do with the EPA?
you're thinking CARB.
@@NubsWithGuns I don't remember saying anything about the EPA? My only point is/was the charcoal canister on the 224 is there because they sell the same 224 Predator engine in California so it must comply with whatever CA calls their emission standards. Kentucky law does not require a charcoal canister on small engines, so we're within our legal right to remove it. Nothing political implied or intended, we don't do politics here my friend, only engines and the like. Thanks!
Im gonna be completely here the 224 isnt worth the extra money that reinforced block is nice but the 212s didnt have a problem with a weak block as for the the power increase its so minimal that most of us arent going to notice it at all we have to keep in mind that this thing is still a budget engine that isnt going to last very long
The plastic parts are still manufactured from the same garbage base plastic so they will fail within two years of normal use yall can buy the 224 at its inflated price if you want but i wont be buying it unless it drops to 100 dollars out the door
The 58mm stroke crank and the thicker block are worth the extra $40 to me. The rest is just spare tiller parts. The problem is Harbor Freight prices keep creeping up. I used to buy the 212's on sale at $99 but now the "sale" price is $129 and regular $149. These 224 engines are $40 more but you get a block and a 58mm stroke crank. The quality of the parts stinks. My new crank is already .001 out of round and that's brand new out of the box numbers. LOL Thanks!
@@KentuckyFriedFixes wow im surprised about the crank is this ftom use or loose manufacturing tolerances
I own several several hinda clone engines
And ive noticed all of them vibrate more than a new engine should have
Harbor freight prices are going up unforunately quality is not ive honestly been shopping elsewhere
When possible but sometimes have to buy harbor freight items
As they do sell items that you cant get at lowes or home depot
@@GeorgiaRidgerunner It's a brand new engine so wear has nothing to do with this one being out of spec. The crank was ground out of spec. It's funny most billet rod makers say that if your crank is .0005 out then you should have it turned.. My brand new crank started out life at twice that .001. LOL I wouldn't use this one for anything exotic for sure anyway, these cranks are soft. Thanks GA Ridge Runner!
The power difference is noticeable..very noticeable.
The non hemi s are better
A lot of guys like the non-hemi better. It is easier to install a larger lift cam with more clearance at the piston top. I prefer the hemi design head for the better flow though. If everyone liked building the same engine the World would be a boring place! Thanks Brandon.
Agree. Like my 196 build, Champion rockers is the very first thing I ordered for the 224.
My negative is not against the commentary or person,, it just don't make any d-m sense to run a nylon gear... perhaps they should have taken not on Zebco 33's when they brain stormed collapsed due to NYLON...it's NYLON People...your fault my mistake to buy.
I understand concept to quite the whine of the metal cam,, but trust us I'm sure I speak for all the Real Deal Pred shakers ..Trust me we like whine...brkfst ,lunch, and Dinner☆
I agree Terry that a nylon cam is a disappointment. I know you get it, but there are a lot of guys that don't understand that it's really not a big thing to most builders to get rid of some of the stock internals when doing a upgrade to a performance engine specs. So far I've replaced the camshaft, lifters, springs, connecting rod, piston, pin and rings. The stock flywheel is also on the "things to replace" list LOL. Thanks for watching!
Your fast erratic rock and roll camera movements almost made me motion sick and caused me to stop watching. You need to steady your camera and move a LOT slower. A whole lot slower.
Thanks Fitch! I've tried to improve the camera work since then. I knew when I pulled it off the stand to show the detail on the engine it was a mistake. I appreciate the input. Thanks again!
Weird much.
Often.
Plastic cam gear? Great, now the cam will fail prematurely! What a joke! And this is the engine they want nearly $200 for? Color me not impressed. If this is what will be the new predator engine, I'll go to Northern Tool and get an Ironton!
Anthony that plastic cam gear is unfortunate but not a deal breaker for me. New performance camshaft came in today!
Right
That's expensive. I can get a genuine Honda GP200 here in Thailand for $165. Many different clones for $60.
The cam at max rpm of crank is only rotating just over 800 rpm. It's an extremely durable plastic and it's light. Don't embarrass yourself by talking about something you don't know about.