I remember seeing this film version in a World Films class, probably around 1966. To this day, the melody of the 'Kyrie' will come to mind, a melody that has no clear end.
Thank you for the brilliant interpretation. I read Lord of the Flies in the late 60's for my 'O' Level literature exam and it made a deep impression on me, although I did not fully appreciate the underlying message of the novel. I still have a copy of the book.
I appreciate the interpretation as given, but I feel it doesn’t go deeply enough. By using only the biblical view as its framework, there are broader possibilities that are ignored. These boys were from a world in flux, deliberately defined by Golding at the start. The only yardstick they have is what they learned from their British school education, and the often contradictory actions of the adults in their lives. From those basics, they needed to develop a plan for survival in a suddenly strange world where there are no adults to tell them what to do. Children are often cruel to each other, empathy and compassion are seen as weakness, and are hidden in times of insecurity. It takes time and experience to develop those feelings into strengths…time these boys have not yet had. Children live in a world of rules they did not create, and at some point every child tests or breaks rules they don’t understand the reason for. They also absorb the prejudices of the adults around them, often without even realizing that they do not have their own basis for the prejudice. The main division among the boys lies between thinking and acting, The initial leader is thinking of what they all need, and making plans by which each boy has a voice, and everyone contributes, as they are able, to the well-being of all. The choir, already a distinct group with its own leader, naturally defer to the boy they are familiar with. They can work together until the immediate needs are seen to because survival is instinctive, and they all need the same things. There is a certain comfort in the larger numbers and everyone’s inclusion. Once they have achieved a system, and are less traumatized by the events that brought them to the social isolation from adult supervision, the friction between differing personalities begin to reassert themselves. Human nature requires more than food and shelter, it seeks both purpose, and something greater than itself. The boy given less to thought, and more to action and reaction finds reason in hunting, and forms a separate society within the larger whole. That group experiences the hunt and the kill, and receives approval for it from the others. They see their role as more important than the others, and begin to segregate. They lose the essence of belief in the God they had really just begun to know about, and find that which is greater than themselves in the raw power of the hunt, and the kill. The ritual offering of the pig’s head to that power cements their difference and binds them into a tighter unit…with the exception of the one boy who questions, and is killed. For William Golding, with his experiences of War and the inhumanity of man, he is writing the eternal struggle of humanity. He sees time and again, the rise and fall of civilizations (both Christian and other) because we lose sight of our similarities in the face of our differences. He tells the same story through children, because he sees it as the inherent flaw, inescapable. The world these boys return to will not be the world they knew. Thank you for this thought provoking presentation.🖤🇨🇦
I had to do a presentation of the book at the age of 18 to pass an exam. I am a French speaker. I had no faith in humanity at that time and the story confirmed my ideas. By the time, I learned more about religions and found out that "Man was created noble", which restored my opinion about the future of humanity.
In analyzing the book, I interpret it from the perspective of human growth and development. It's evident that the boys brought to the island the influences of their prepubescent lives. Rather than being inherently evil, their actions can be attributed to the lack of adult guidance and experience. The absence of essential scaffolding in childhood is the true root of the issue. With no proper supervision, Ralph was left with no option but to succumb to Jack's barbarism.
as i child i hanged out with ghetto kids, and we had oir share of LOTF moments...One time a cat gave birth to baby kittens in the alley, one of my fellow neighbors grabbed the kittens by their tails and began slamming them on the ground until they stopped meowing, he did this to all 3 baby kittens, then we buried them in the back yard....we were around 7 or 8....once we buried them, an eerie silence overtook us...we began to believe the spirit of the kittens was coming back for revenge. We all ran and went crazy out of fear....Ever since i dont like cats or kittens because they remimd me of that day
I found strange that the book is taken to be an allegory of godly good vs devilish evil, when in context good and evil are presented as potentially human by nature, even the creation of a god figure in the lord of the flies even to the degree of hearing it's voice it's not portrait as spiritual but natural and part of the children's imagination running with the situation they are in
We also are shown a power struggle, between the two groups yes but really between two different leaders, one that lets the most basic human aggressiveness run wild and the lust for power and in the other hand order, democracy and solidarity.
Evil, and brutality are shown not to be a property of the other but a possibility for every child and there for group in society specialty when faced with harsh conditions
I don't think has anything to do with Adam and Eve. It is simply a story that boys left to fend for their own, ironically will fight over who is to be the Lord of the situation.
Great overview, but I think it lacks a certain depth. Golding offers the Eden religious angle, I feel, as one of total failure rather than some lost paradise. Although it is a correct synopsis on some levels as cited in the piece. The mid century world of Golding is one of Armageddon, again, paralleling the biblical narrative. The failure of empire, the rise of fascism, the lust for power, the loss of free speech, and the deliberate abandonment of democratic values, and civilization, are all given as warnings against future decisions based on prior mistakes. Those mistakes being WW1, the destruction of Weimar, modern empire, totalitarianism, monarchic rule, wealth, Cold War, and capitalist greed - basically the old world impinging upon modern technological warfare. It is postmodern in the loss of God sense. And also in the Waiting for Godot sense. What I feel was missed in the piece, superseded by the old fixation on religion, specifically the death cult of Christianity, was parallels with dystopia fables such as Animal Farm, and perhaps 1984, along with Brave New World and Zamyatin's We. Lord of the Flies is the upside down Peter Pan. It describes the loss of innocence. Alice in Wonderland is also present in the wickedness and futility of the narrative. Even a reverse fortune Wizard of Oz could be compared to the unfolding horror. Nonetheless a great overview though.
The "religious" allusions are certainly something a religiously minded person might find. Typically ,religious types over-reach looking for allusions and meaning. I've read the book many times and seen the movies. Never read, saw or heard anything that in anyway referred to the Bible.
"Conch" is pronounced "conk". In it's natural found form it can't be blown into to make a sound.-The tip must be cut with some precision first. The boys have no tools or knowledge to do this. Even then, it is not at all easy to produce any sound at all. Just one of many examples of Golding's incurious ignorance of the natural world he is believed to be depicting. Yet, he is supposed to be deeply insightful as to "human nature." I submit the allegory reveals nothing beyond the effect of elitist Brit education. What it does reveal about that is indeed horrifying but hardly surprising.
"incurious ignorance of the natural world he is believed to be depicting" - well you missed the point spectacularly. Besides, is it speculated anywhere that the island had NEVER been occupied?
@@Alsatiagent Exactly. The tacit implication the island HAD been previously occupied fits perfectly with the idea that the boys were recreating some twisted Eden. But sure, let's throw away the work's value because the kids in the film didn't pronounce a word correctly as the OP opines.
For the record, Merriam Webster gives both pronunciations as acceptable. "I submit the allegory reveals nothing..." Your "submission" is bunkum and you ought to be embarrassed.
I saw this movie as a child it has to this day a tremendous impact on how I see things
We always got a kick out of "Sucks to your ass-mar!"
Movies okay, but try reading that novel. Who will save us adults?
@@jimsteele9559 we must rise to the occasion and free ourselves...
I can say the very same thing. I saw it in 1963 when I was 10. I've watched it many times over the years. It never ceases to touch me deeply.
My only claim to fame is that I lived in the room William Golding wrote LOTF in. Yay Salisbury.
Awesome
The spirit of Beelzebub.
Lord of the Flies is one of my favorite novels as well as one of my favorite movies.
@grokeffer6226 Great novel and movie. However, there was a miserably weak American remake of the movie that came out around 1990. What a disaster!
I remember seeing this film version in a World Films class, probably around 1966. To this day, the melody of the 'Kyrie' will come to mind, a melody that has no clear end.
Thank you for the brilliant interpretation. I read Lord of the Flies in the late 60's for my 'O' Level literature exam and it made a deep impression on me, although I did not fully appreciate the underlying message of the novel. I still have a copy of the book.
Love this channel so much. The best or one of the best top art/ art history channels.all art forms,etc.
I appreciate the interpretation as given, but I feel it doesn’t go deeply enough. By using only the biblical view as its framework, there are broader possibilities that are ignored. These boys were from a world in flux, deliberately defined by Golding at the start.
The only yardstick they have is what they learned from their British school education, and the often contradictory actions of the adults in their lives. From those basics, they needed to develop a plan for survival in a suddenly strange world where there are no adults to tell them what to do.
Children are often cruel to each other, empathy and compassion are seen as weakness, and are hidden in times of insecurity. It takes time and experience to develop those feelings into strengths…time these boys have not yet had.
Children live in a world of rules they did not create, and at some point every child tests or breaks rules they don’t understand the reason for. They also absorb the prejudices of the adults around them, often without even realizing that they do not have their own basis for the prejudice.
The main division among the boys lies between thinking and acting, The initial leader is thinking of what they all need, and making plans by which each boy has a voice, and everyone contributes, as they are able, to the well-being of all.
The choir, already a distinct group with its own leader, naturally defer to the boy they are familiar with. They can work together until the immediate needs are seen to because survival is instinctive, and they all need the same things. There is a certain comfort in the larger numbers and everyone’s inclusion.
Once they have achieved a system, and are less traumatized by the events that brought them to the social isolation from adult supervision, the friction between differing personalities begin to reassert themselves. Human nature requires more than food and shelter, it seeks both purpose, and something greater than itself.
The boy given less to thought, and more to action and reaction finds reason in hunting, and forms a separate society within the larger whole. That group experiences the hunt and the kill, and receives approval for it from the others. They see their role as more important than the others, and begin to segregate.
They lose the essence of belief in the God they had really just begun to know about, and find that which is greater than themselves in the raw power of the hunt, and the kill. The ritual offering of the pig’s head to that power cements their difference and binds them into a tighter unit…with the exception of the one boy who questions, and is killed.
For William Golding, with his experiences of War and the inhumanity of man, he is writing the eternal struggle of humanity. He sees time and again, the rise and fall of civilizations (both Christian and other) because we lose sight of our similarities in the face of our differences. He tells the same story through children, because he sees it as the inherent flaw, inescapable.
The world these boys return to will not be the world they knew. Thank you for this thought provoking presentation.🖤🇨🇦
well done, laddy
oh, mean, lassie
@@brianwolle2509 Thank you.🖤🇨🇦
I had to do a presentation of the book at the age of 18 to pass an exam. I am a French speaker. I had no faith in humanity at that time and the story confirmed my ideas. By the time, I learned more about religions and found out that "Man was created noble", which restored my opinion about the future of humanity.
Man was never created. Man evolved.
why is this so underated?
None of those experts commented on the real psychopath of them all: Roger.
Roger slips by even today
can you explain? i will rewatch again today
@@CertifiedShovelOperator there are many Rogers nowadays, in fields like politics.
The spirit of Beelzebub.
Piggy rules! So does Simon.
Amazingly few comments understand the meaning to todays world of power and greed
A dark evil barbaric human.
In analyzing the book, I interpret it from the perspective of human growth and development. It's evident that the boys brought to the island the influences of their prepubescent lives. Rather than being inherently evil, their actions can be attributed to the lack of adult guidance and experience. The absence of essential scaffolding in childhood is the true root of the issue. With no proper supervision, Ralph was left with no option but to succumb to Jack's barbarism.
Thank you very much for this wonderful novel,i have to learn more and more english,oh yes, i know it😂
as i child i hanged out with ghetto kids, and we had oir share of LOTF moments...One time a cat gave birth to baby kittens in the alley, one of my fellow neighbors grabbed the kittens by their tails and began slamming them on the ground until they stopped meowing, he did this to all 3 baby kittens, then we buried them in the back yard....we were around 7 or 8....once we buried them, an eerie silence overtook us...we began to believe the spirit of the kittens was coming back for revenge. We all ran and went crazy out of fear....Ever since i dont like cats or kittens because they remimd me of that day
The spirit of Beelzebub.
I found strange that the book is taken to be an allegory of godly good vs devilish evil, when in context good and evil are presented as potentially human by nature, even the creation of a god figure in the lord of the flies even to the degree of hearing it's voice it's not portrait as spiritual but natural and part of the children's imagination running with the situation they are in
We also are shown a power struggle, between the two groups yes but really between two different leaders, one that lets the most basic human aggressiveness run wild and the lust for power and in the other hand order, democracy and solidarity.
Evil, and brutality are shown not to be a property of the other but a possibility for every child and there for group in society specialty when faced with harsh conditions
Konnte nicht zur besseren Zeitpunkt hochgeladen werden.
I don't think has anything to do with Adam and Eve.
It is simply a story that boys left to fend for their own,
ironically will fight over who is to be the Lord of the situation.
Who put the boys in underwear? 😫
Roger and Jack are the bad specimens.
Great overview, but I think it lacks a certain depth. Golding offers the Eden religious angle, I feel, as one of total failure rather than some lost paradise. Although it is a correct synopsis on some levels as cited in the piece. The mid century world of Golding is one of Armageddon, again, paralleling the biblical narrative. The failure of empire, the rise of fascism, the lust for power, the loss of free speech, and the deliberate abandonment of democratic values, and civilization, are all given as warnings against future decisions based on prior mistakes. Those mistakes being WW1, the destruction of Weimar, modern empire, totalitarianism, monarchic rule, wealth, Cold War, and capitalist greed - basically the old world impinging upon modern technological warfare. It is postmodern in the loss of God sense. And also in the Waiting for Godot sense.
What I feel was missed in the piece, superseded by the old fixation on religion, specifically the death cult of Christianity, was parallels with dystopia fables such as Animal Farm, and perhaps 1984, along with Brave New World and Zamyatin's We. Lord of the Flies is the upside down Peter Pan. It describes the loss of innocence. Alice in Wonderland is also present in the wickedness and futility of the narrative. Even a reverse fortune Wizard of Oz could be compared to the unfolding horror.
Nonetheless a great overview though.
The "religious" allusions are certainly something a religiously minded person might find. Typically ,religious types over-reach looking for allusions and meaning. I've read the book many times and seen the movies. Never read, saw or heard anything that in anyway referred to the Bible.
I completely agree.
"Conch" is pronounced "conk". In it's natural found form it can't be blown into to make a sound.-The tip must be cut with some precision first. The boys have no tools or knowledge to do this. Even then, it is not at all easy to produce any sound at all. Just one of many examples of Golding's incurious ignorance of the natural world he is believed to be depicting. Yet, he is supposed to be deeply insightful as to "human nature." I submit the allegory reveals nothing beyond the effect of elitist Brit education. What it does reveal about that is indeed horrifying but hardly surprising.
"incurious ignorance of the natural world he is believed to be depicting" - well you missed the point spectacularly. Besides, is it speculated anywhere that the island had NEVER been occupied?
The presence of wild pigs suggests that it probably was. @@thedivinemrm5832
@@Alsatiagent Exactly. The tacit implication the island HAD been previously occupied fits perfectly with the idea that the boys were recreating some twisted Eden. But sure, let's throw away the work's value because the kids in the film didn't pronounce a word correctly as the OP opines.
For the record, Merriam Webster gives both pronunciations as acceptable.
"I submit the allegory reveals nothing..."
Your "submission" is bunkum and you ought to be embarrassed.
And no literary license for the lads not prepping their conch properly? Someone was being a bit too picky. @@thedivinemrm5832