Russia Vs. Ukraine Or Civil War In The West?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 24 เม.ย. 2024
- Read the full piece here: www.dailywire.com/news/russia...
Dr Jordan B Peterson lists the reasons why we're seeing an extended conflict in Ukraine, and explains why a culture war in the West has fueled the Russian fire.
0:00 Russia Vs. Ukraine Or Civil War In The West?
9:04 The Caspian Sea
20:12 Does qualification even matter?
38:30 The Consequences
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To live in a eastern european country and hear this, also to read comments which praise this speech is something... It feels that further to the west the less they understand russia..
Exactly how I feel
how I understand what you say... Unfortunately, there is even a worse thing in this speech: Peterson, who pretends to be some sort of moral teacher, proposed without scruple to buy peace by selling people fighting for their freedom. I believe he will be despised for this in the future despite all those cheers seen here today.
@@sergiystoyan5260 And this is the guy who talks about how you can't please people and that you should stand up for yourself. Now he says you should not resist and give it all away when the bad guy comes. Im confused...
@@c0mmented to me he himself is an illustration of the very same western degeneration he talks about. He is a hypocrite who does not stand for his teachings. "You have to be righteous like Abraham! What? Sell people we promised to help in their righteous fight? Sure!" When Peterson is talking about those bad people who enforce contradictions, let him look at a mirror.
It is not clear from you comment whether your feelings are positive or negative. I hope they are negative as my feelings are (I am from Ukraine).
Dear Dr. Peterson, I admire your wisdom in many fields. This is not one of them.
Okay lol
Completely agree
Yet so far, everything is going towards what he said will be...
@@honza3304Please tell me, where you can prove he is wrong
Guys, just a quick example: gas price. JP predicted it would rise to 300$ a barrel in a year. Many others examples like this if you make the effort to actually watch the video and draw conclusions based on the actual current situation.
Love JP for his speeches in others topics, but he's clearly waaay out of his expertise area on this one. Or maybe blinded by his hate for the woke culture idk
As a Ukrainian, this war has been on since 2014, way before Zelensky's term, who's, btw, supported both in the west and in the east.
True, Zelensky is a Russian-speaking guy. He never had a negative attitude towards the East
Которая началась с запрета русского языка, поездов дружбы и Ато, которую объявили задолго до появления Гиркина.
@@user-hx5gs5jt6u Поезд дружбы в другое измерение, верно? Его так и не нашли в нашем так то. PS: Пишу на русском, с Украины😂 Такие древние фейки на ютубе не проходят. Откопайте фейки свежее!
@@AlexaCWS конечно фейки. А вот кондиционер взорвался, сами себя сожгли, сами обстреляли это все конечно правда.
А еще на Украине никакой гражданской войны не было.
Правда почему на википедии в статье про войну на Донбассе указано, что 95% значимых лиц со стороны Украины - граждане Украине.
@@user-hx5gs5jt6u АТО началось после пересечение Гиркиным с оружием в руках границы. Не знал что он и его люди с паспортами РФ на 95%, украинцы, они сами хоть знают об этом? ))
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I find it repulsive when someone refers to post-soviet-block countries joining or willing to be tied to Western political structures (e.g. EU, NATO) as "Western expansionism". We, Polish, Ukrainians and all Russian neighbors, we experienced Russian dominance through centuries. We know how it feels, how it smells, how it hurts and how it kills - better then any reader of Солженицын novels. We may be stupid and shortsighted by escaping from one type of communism (USSR) to the other (EU), but it's our stupidity or wisdom, our shortsightedness or desperation. It's our choice. We are not a thing for which Russia can bargain with the West. Or are we?
So many western scholars are missunderstanding that point completely. It's disheartening.
I'm laughing, not because your post is funny, but because you just nailed how millions and millions of people around the world actually feel about the situation of not only themselves, but their country. Well said.
Westerners love this sort of "realist" drivel because it denies anybody but "superpowers" agency. Don't mind Ukraine, Baltics, Poland or anybody else Putin might want because he feels threatened without them (and has to lie awake at night, tugging on his wee wee and crying himself to sleep), it's Russia and the USA who should get to decide. Well, not really - it's the USA who should cave to a country with a spectacularly incompetent military that can't defeat a single post-Soviet army, let alone any of the NATO ones.
Even though i fully agree with your point regarding making the choice, i partially disagree with the part "who decides about that". I would like to remind you Jalta after WW2 and all other decisions that were made above heads of other countries.
Yes, the will of the people does count, but others have to agree to that. Regarding Ukraine: Russia and EU has to agree. Without agreement and support from EU, Ukraine would fall into Russians hands, without asking Ukrainians what they want. Currently, Russia disagrees with what Ukrainians want, thus there is a war. Does the will of Ukrainians count at all? Yes. Can they decide only by themselves? No.
It is sad but true.
I am a Pole, we share the history and we should learn from the history. History is teaching: your will counts, but you're not the one who decides, unless you are a global power (even if tou are, other global powers have to at least silently agree to what you're doing)
So what was it when Poland occupied western Ukraine and abolished Ukrainian being taught in schools? Selective history?
5:21 Who gives the right to a country to have "a broader sphere of interest"??? What about the people who live in "the spehere of interest" ?! Shall they bend their knee and behave as a slave, or stand up and fight for being independent??
Even as people whose homes are being invaded are standing up for personal freedom and liberty, it can be simultaneously true that all the big government economical stuff and background ideologies if government leaders are all still validly driving this. That is JPs point as he explains how Putin is popular and at least way "better " than the last 100 years of leaders. Ukrainian people will rise up to defend themselves from Russia and align with Zalinski even if his motivation is to increase the status quo of Western corruption.
Two things can be true at once. Fighting is always the worst solution to every problem. JP is arguing for the debate of ideas to take over where currently there are tanks and foot soldiers duking it out.
@@YibuYibu I don't buy your attempt to humanize Putin and demonize Zelensky. Russia is the aggressor, should lose this war and pay for what they destroyed and for every person killed. I see no point of intellectual conversation on a nice cosy sofa here.
You have to make tactical decisions. If a country is powerful enough, it will maintain a sphere of interest in direct relationship to the its capacity to project power. For Ukrainians being friendly with the Russians was the correct tactical decision. As it stands, the country is likely to be completely or at least largely disintegrated.
@@vladimirzaitsev5085 just swap Ukraine and Russia in your statement and it will remain true.
@@pydzio lmao sure 😂
At Munich, Chamberlain got an international agreement that Hitler should have the Sudetenland in exchange for Germany making no further demands for land in Europe. Chamberlain said it was 'Peace for our time'. Hitler said he had 'No more territorial demands to make in Europe. We all know how that ended. As much as enjoy your point of view on many subjects, I think you need to stick to what you know Jordan
"Don’t let bullies get away with it." Right, Mr.Peterson?
You were almost my second father.
And Putin is the bully number one.
Facts don't care about your feelings!
@@cooltorap the fact is that russia is constantly promoting nuclear strikes against the USA, Britain, France, etc., and there are "individuals" who are still promoting pro-russian narratives
?what
Yes but the deeper question in this is who is actually the bully here
I have the greatest respect for you, Dr Peterson. Your thinking has influenced me (and still is). What's more: there are a lot of lies about this statement in the internet. A lot of commentators just lie about it, adding remarks to it that you've never formulated. Nevertheless:
1) I'm Polish. You should talk more about this war with your polish friends. In Poland the government and opposition are united in this particular subject. People from left to right know this: Russia is an enemy, not a friend. By God, we know it from our history. Not only because the USSR era. Albo because the Tsars. I respect Dostoyevsky too, but in his political wievs he clearly was an imperialist and saw Poles as the lesser men.
We are not a superpower but we've already declared or donated $1.81bln military aid to our Ukrainian neighbours.
We stand firmly with them.
2) You should be very careful when describing Putin. It's good that you condemned his actions. But I can tell that in some sense you admire him. He is strong, Trudeau is weak: I won't argue with that. But that's not a good strength. He is not a just ruler. King Arthur, Louis the Saint or Casimir the Great (one of the greatest polish kings). He is not a Jungian father. He is a demon. He is a tyrant. And whether he is Hitler-like psychopath, or clever and intelligent Snake from the Garden of Eden it's not important. Evil must be oppose - yes, even with the leftists on our side.
3) You've brought up the Treaty of Versailles. Let me remind you of the Munich Peace (!) Conference. That's when the West nations sold the Czechs to Hitler, believing that they're avoiding war. They only postponed it for less than a year.
I think the point is that Ukraine is uniquely in the Russian sphere of influence. We assume too much thinking that Russia has ambitions beyond that, or that it would be willing to fight for such ambitions at the same level of risk as in Ukraine. Poland is safe.
@@nickdranias695 The Poles have a different view of the last few hundred years of their history. As do the Estonians, Latavians, Lithuanians, Moldovans, Georgians.
Bravo with the comment 👏 P
🇵🇱🤝🏻🇭🇷
@@nickdranias695 yes we are safe(r) because we are a member of NATO and we somehow believe that the West will answer as Rohan, when the time comes :>
Well said. I fear for Poland, Moldova, Latvia, Estonia, and so on. Putin has no plans on stopping.
It's never too late to make a fool of yourself, I guess.
simply beautifull)
He's a class A hypocrite, he may appear to be an intellectually free minded thinker on the surface, but the reality is that he's just another heavily indoctrinated statist whom ultimately believes that, those tiny groups of illegitimate establishment psychopath crooks across the world, which go around calling themselves "governments", sit higher than God, higher than (true..) Freedom and have a higher claim over everyone elses lifes, property, incomes than they the people themselves do(!)
... Ironically, I bumped into an old psychology student from my college teaching days this past weekend and he asked me what I thought about Mr Peterson,.. 'Well, for such an well read, well spoken, well schooled, astute and apparently intelligent man, he actually still has the statist indoctrinated mindset of a juveniled slave, I said, he wants the very 'demonstrable' psychopaths he openly criticises on a daily basis, to continue in their illegitimacy to live like gods amongst man ruling as masters over him and everyone else, because he believes the masses are dumb, weak and utterly incapable of existing without masters there to rule over them, he slights them with one hand and worships them with the other and hopes nobody notices (Just like Alex Jones!).. I've seriously had second year students with an higher degree of intellectual maturity, individuality and intellectual standards than he, but unfortunately many of the pre prepped minds of the droning masses with their own indoctrinated wilful slave statist mindsets, will sadly buy whatever he has to sell because, like him they won't/can't personally or publicly acknowledge that they actually worship the same masters, that he considers himself a Christian too.. I find very amusing in a not so funny kind of way(!) He'll tell people that their gov masters are destroying the whole world and then tell them, that the answer is to support them even more by participating in the illegitimate systems which were specifically designed, constructed and inplaced by the very groups he says are destroying the world(!)
.. My former student replied with a nervous voice, "Hmm, yeah.. I thought there was something off about him, but I couldn't quite put my finger on it(!?)". 'Hmm?', I said with a chuckle... I taught you in class many times over just how increadibly potent the establishments statist Indoctrination is and how it 'will' claw you back, entrap you and cloud the mind with pre seeded biases of submission if you don't keep your own mind truly free, self empowered and well exercised.. I think you must have let your mind get out of shape to have missed such a thing, because at college you wouldn't have missed such an obvious thing about Mr Peterson, none of my students would(!) He pulled a defeatist expression and nodded whilst looking down, if 'you' do not claim, train and own your own minds, then others 'will' always seek to own them for you(!)' I responded, this was always my opening statement at the beginning of my classes and you should have remembered that, I expressed.. And what else did I teach(?!) That all truly great minds are Anarcho-Volunteerist because, they see government/statism for what it really is (enslavement) and if self empowerment, honesty, freedom and morality matter to such great minds then Anarcho-Volunteerism is really their only recourse, and none of which can be applied to Mr Peterson, "you're not wrong(!)" he responded,.. 'statist Indoctrination is very potent isn't it(?), Though it's coming back to me as you speak, I can't believe I'd forgotten so many important things, that I'd once learned and had I remembered would have made life much easier at certain times looking back on it!'.
It's been nearly twenty five years since he finished my class but, in that moment of self realisation and honesty he was a FAR wiser intellectual & individual than Mr Peterson could (currently..) ever claim to be! And he isn't punting himself as a mighty intellect and voice of reason, he left college and became a ordinary joiner in the building trade.
But Mr Peterson is seriously bringing home the bacon now, so he'll say exactly what his masters have deemed okay for him to say and nothing else, he's just another Alex Jones false prophet type, he just doesn't sound like a crazy moron when he talks.
Apparently this entire comment section has been overtaken by Ukrainian nationalists or perhaps just brain washed Canadians with their Nazi deputy Prime Minister.
Evidently. Based on this comment at least.
Best assessment of this moronity.
This proves my assumption that JP is one of the so-called 'fashion-thinkers', a bit of a cult figure, but quite bereft of the capacity of in-depth thought. Similar to what Paulo Coelho is in literature.
The statement about revival of religion in Russia, and Putin a devout Christian... wow!
I love reading a negativr comment abouy coelho. His writing is utter trash
he is really not that clever, damn
Sorry, I need you to remind me what makes you expert on revival of religion in Russia and about Putin?
8 months later - aged like milk
How has it aged? He's precisely on point.
Are you even paying attention to what he is saying?
I paid attention to what he was saying. Not only is it aged like milk, but this milk was a hazardous day 1. Unfortunately a lot of people are still watching this. The thing that degrades lately is the definition of expertise. This guy should probably go back to clinical psychology.
I have great admiration and respect for Dr. Peterson. 12 rules and his podcast continue to open my eyes and change my life. Dr. Peterson called on people from Central Europe for testimony. I'm Polish, knowing and understanding history of my country and region. When i hear the tone and voice calling for peace at all cost, it always remembers me of Chamberlaine. UK PM, who brought peace to the West from Munich conference in 1938. Peace at all cost always means war. The threat of nuclear exchange over war in Ukrainie is real. Nuclear exchange, if the West abandons Ukraine and Central Europe again is certain. There is one thing about Putin and Russians, Dr. Peterson and western people don't seem to understand. Their system of government is based on fear, since always. They know it all about fear. If you show you fear them, you already lost. The only way to win with them is not to be afraid, or at least not show it. Just like Solzenicin did.
Postmoderinsm and the Cultural War are an invention of the West. You deal with that shit. Don't use our lives and lives of our children so you can keep your fucking status quo.
Well said…. It seems the old becomes new again. Is that Putin in the Kremlin or Stalin I can’t tell the difference.
You dont understand Russia. Not fear, but idea of great country with strong leader and idea of evil west fighting with Russia and wanting to destroy country and - its core ideas. When the leader is weak like Tzar Nicolas or Gorbachev and country is becoming weak or when west not enemy but friend and not necessary to unite for defending Motherland, the Russia can be destroyed like it was in 1917 or 1991. But not fear, fear not stopped Russians in 1917, in 1991 and in 1941-1945. When there is question of security of Motherland Russians forget about fear for their lives and unite under existing government till external enemy wont be eliminated. In 1941 year Stalins government with fighting Germany support most Russians abroad because question of Russia existance. So as more West talking about that Russia must lose in Ukraine, that there is only military solutions and Russians must fear, the more Russian people remember history about Napoleon and Gitler invasion from West and more support government, believe that itsnot war with Ukraine but as war with West who wants to destroy Motherland Russia. So Russians is very poor people and dont have much freedom but when they believe that its question of existence of Russia they do anything to defend its Motherland and unite under current Russian government. And when you say Slogenitsyn - he was Russian nationalist who hates Western values and Ukraine independence the same way as hates Soviet Union and communism and he supported Putin and his politics when Putin became president.
Do you honestly think we want that Woke Toxic Sludge??? I am horrified of the idiots running major companies and how focused they are on Woke Toxic Sludge. Calling Woke feces is an insult to feces. Feces can be soaked down and mixed with soil and used as fertilizer. Woke is not that useful. Woke is completely toxic sludge.
What is then the alternative to peace?
Lets go Russia!
4:15 If we are afraid of nuclear retaliation, then there is no point in having any dispute with Russia or China. We should just declare our unconditional surrender right now.
Bitter truth....
@@mari-annkelam5402 Rather a logical fallacy from somebody who elsewhere preaches manhood and responsibility.
As long as the dispute is justified.
The dispute with Russia is most definitely NOT justified.
@@JohnGeometresMaximos I personally know many Ukrainians who beg to differ.
@ Mikolaj Trzeciecki. NO. Except for Hiroshima and Nagasaki, the nuclear armament is used as a balancing element in relations between the big countries (Israel is an exception because they are surrounded by enemies who do not want peace, only total destruction of that country will satisfy them). It is very unlikely that theUS, Russia or China will bomb an adversary except in extreme cases. That has nothing to do with surrendering; your argument is the same as saying that because we are all destined to die, we should commit suicide now.
At 11:00. I never knew Ukraine bordered on the Caspian Sea.
...or that Russia is part of the West.
The people of Ukraine would rather die than live under corruption and authoritarian rule with all the nepotism and tyranny that accompanies such regimes. The west has been dealing with the loony left for years, but the people of Ukraine are facing a much more serious threat to their democracy and freedom. They have shown great courage and determination in their fight for a better future, and the international community must support them in their efforts to build a truly democratic and prosperous society.
Too bad that not a single country could ever achieve a trully democratic society, even if we were to be controll by a robot that would still be impossible. Wanna know why the human nature and the basics of our evolution do not allowe the "weak" to lead the "strong". So yeah keep dreaming.
Bryan 👏👏👏 agree
The same democratic and prosperous society that the USA has build in Afghanistan for the last 20 years I would assume?
So, you'll die then.
People need to wake up🙏🎉we need Ty wake up😢
I don't understand why is it so wrong to counter Russian imperial ambition? A sovereign nation cannot pick a side? Should Ukraine be damned to be in the "Russian sphere of influence", disregarding what actual Ukrainians want? Should we allow Russia to annex Ukraine just because they have nuclear weapons? As a Ukrainian, I have an obvious answer to all those questions and I don't understand how "Westerners" still seem to fumble even with such basic ones.
You mean when Ukraine groveled for the US and their imperialistic behaviour, in Iraq when your regime did the bidding of the US-occupation forces.
We OVERTHREW the democratically elected Ukrainian government and replaced them with pro American puppets. Also don’t you see the irony in calling the Russians “imperialist” while we have over 950 ACTIVE MILITARY BASES across the world? No?
his statement seems like 2months behind the present, at least compared to europe, the discussion on who is right and who is wrong is finished, no one questions the actions of the west against russia anymore, its all united.
my honest opinion about jordan on this topic? hes a scientist, not a strategist nor leader, hes the kind of guy debating and questioning things while russia is already moving through his neighbourhood, its also not his job either so credit where credit is due, right now his statements, knowledge and wisdom is rather lacking any benefit for europeans, we should focus on our strength and wisdom for now, because its our responsibility and also our consequences to live with.
No. We should allow Donbass region integrate with Russia since it is mostly ethnic and cultural russians, and keep Ukraine a neutral state. War will end today if this happened.
@@Tehz1359 have you ever been to Donetsk? Have you ever speak with those people? No! And I was there, I speak with those people each day. They went out from russian terror in 2014 and now are running again. There no one of so-called DNR government from Donetsk. They all with russian passports and were born in russia. Donetsk was occupied in 2014 and it was very simple to make a picture of "separatism" when russia controlled the city by armed forces. The same tactics had USSR when occupied Estonia, Poland, Latvia and other countries. In Prague they also told that all Chech wanted to live in USSR. The propaganda was the same.
I am from the Czech Republic, my country was part of the eastern bloc, and even though I haven't lived through any of the horrors of that period, I can still see the same, or at least similar, infectious ideas spread throughout the west, under everyone's nose. So, I fully agree that the west has become degenerate and unable to meaningfully respond to any real problem, like the Ukraine war.
However, as I am a Czech, I must disagree with you on one thing. There is one thing we shouldn't do, and it is to try to appease Russia. In 1938 in the Munich agreement, Great Britain and France decided, without inviting Czechoslovakia to the table, to give the Sudetenland, at that time a majority German part of Czechoslovakia on the borders of Germany and Austria, to the Nazi Germany, to prevent another bloody conflict like World War one. That part of our land also happened to host a significant number of the machinery of the Czechoslovak army and a defensive system meant to protect us against the aggressors. This obviously didn't prevent the war and only crippled a considerably strong anti-German military power and the only non-authoritarian country in that region, that would have helped defeat Germany. And for what, a useless piece of paper that Chamberlain could wave around.
All this to say, if you try to appease the aggressor, they will try to get more next time, ignoring the treaties and agreements. It started with Sudetenland, then Czechoslovakia, then Poland, then France. Yes, Russia is partly motivated by our moral degeneration, but mostly by the believe that the Russian empire has a special place in the world, and it will be the world's saviour. What we really should do is talk to Putin and establish, that even though it may not seem like it from Moscow, we are still sane, we are not all woke. But also, strongly oppose his imperialistic expansionism with force and resolve and if war is inevitable, honourably engage in it rather than cowardly run away from it.
I recommend that you listen to Col Douglas Magregor Retired
Sure, don't appease the aggressor; but first convince me that Russia is the aggressor with the following in mind:
Russia's diplomatic stance on Ukraine is that it should be neutral territory, and it has been that way for decades. How do you make (or perhaps frame) the argument that an insistence on neutrality is the aggressive stance? Also keep in mind that Ukraine has the 2nd largest military in Europe, and they've been consistently building up their military strength, and placing said military strength on the western border. One more thing to keep in mind is that the Russians were invited into the conflict by Ukrainians as well. Of course in regards to that civil war, who are the aggressors in that situation as well? Is it the government shelling their own civilians, or is the civilians on the receiving end of the shelling the aggressor?
Greets from Poland, thank you for that words.
I am from ex-Czechoslovakia too. I quite disagree with your analogy with Munchen betrayal. Why? Study more about Putin's statements he made over the past 8 years not just those selectively and intentionaly filtered by our local mainstream media outlets. Until you learn more also from independent sources (a. k. a. "russian shills" like ptof. Mearsheimer, Duran channel (Alexander Mercouris, Scott Ritter, Gonzalo Lira) you will not understand this approach and will keep on opposing appeasing Putin.
@@rahn45 Ukrainian army started to gain strength as a responce to the russian agression. Also Ukraine gave up nuclear weapon in exchange for it's safety from russian\western agression(Budapest memorandum). Plus 1991 Ukraine became an independent state that has all the rights to do what it wants to do inside the country without asking russian permission.
Russian was not invited in the conflict - it started one by invading Ukrainian sovereign state.
The things are much more simple, as an Eastern European I can say situation is black and white, our region suffers enough from russia's imperialism, we as a civilized world must end it, entire generations were doomed by the russians, if I have to pay higher prices, I'll do it. And you talk about NATO expansion, it was the best political decision of our government, if it wasn't for NATO, we would be already invaded or next in the list, same is for EU, which pushed us apart from russia'a slavery. It's obviosly he is a westerner who never suffered russia's brutality.
Exactly. Great to see someone sane in the comments
Yours is just an opinion,western imperialism proved wrong in Russia in the 90’s , you have no idea really
@@christinakiki75 "western imperialism" saved lots of russians from hunger by sending them food and free money in the 90s. Is that why they're so angry?
@@yuriy5376ni media idea tienes de cómo Estados Unidos ha intervenido en medio mundo sobre todo en Hispanoamérica. Entiendo que hayáis sufrido históricamente por culpa de Rusia. Pero comentes un gran error si piensas que a países como Estados Unidos, Reino Unido, Francia o Alemania les importais una mierda
hell yeah. you will pay. :D and Russia will live. That's simple.
You know the content is gonna be good when a Canadian psychologist improvises himself as a geopolitics expert and give his experienced opinion a faraway conflict
Pretty much the first thing he says is, that he consulted experts. 😑
@@UberTankred consulting with ‚experts‘ does not make you an expert. Expertise comes from years and years of studying and practical experience. On the matter of Russia, Ukraine and geopolitics, JP has zero expertise.
@@jsv8898 Sorry, but pretty much everyone claims to be an expert on the War in Ukraine and that they know it's all Russia's fault while actual experts like Mearsheimer - who has a more nunaced view on the matter - are ignored by MSM. Every "celebrity" who highlights expert opinons is a blessing!
@@UberTankred you are not sorry. And not everyone pretends to be an expert like you're saying. However with the following and influence JP has, he also has a moral obligation not to talk about matters he's clueless about 🤫 the West is only responsible of this conflict to the extent that we should have been tougher on Russia earlier. The leniency we've show them has allowed Russia to become greedy and aggressive in its' imperialistic ambitions. However westerns nor anyone else for that matter are responsible for what the Russians are doing. The ones who invaded Ukraine was Russia. All alone. No one else. And btw NATO dies not expand, but a country voluntarily joins the organization. No one is forced in it 🤗 somehow this seems difficult for certain people to understand that concept.
Anyway it doesn't matter what you or me are saying because Ukraine will win this war and that's the right outcome. Deal with that
@@jsv8898 Of course I am sorry, it's terrible! The Istanbul Declaration establishes you can't increase your security at someone else's expense, which literally means you can't "voluntarily" (who decides if it's voluntary?) join a military alliance. Ukraine is losing, at least according to the Pentagon.
It always strikes me how people from big, free, democratic countries can so easily deny that freedom and democracy to smaller countires calling them "a sphere of influence".
You have peterson in mind or The west in general?
Ok let's make a thumbrule, if you have a war with another nation and you barely affected the world economy, you are a part of a sphere.
If you are big enough to send Jets, tanks, Humanitarian Aid, you are a sphere.
Ethopia have a genocide 2 weeks ago, nobody is talking about.
Ukraine have war with a Major country, everyone talks about it.
Taiwan go to war with China, everyone WILL TALK ABOUT espacially the gamers.
small countries are not subjects of global politics, all of them have to seek someone's protection - and become dependent. like Poland, for example.
If Ukraine would have joined Nato, they would have been in the USA "sphere of influence"....
Actually shit i remembered something.
Nato or UN, can't remember which, had a thumbrule.
If the big 5 didn't want to do it, it wouldn't be passble resolution.
Vicky2
Even though you mention Poland and Hungary as looking at the West with brows high and eyes wide open, I think it's good to underline that there is a big difference between how those countries are handling current situation in Ukraine. In Poland, where I am from, the general notion is that the Russia, even thou not officially a communist state any more, haven't changed much in terms of mentality of people and leaders since USSR times, and that they are the aggressor. If Ukraine wants to be in NATO and in EU, as an independent country, they should be. Neither they should be "allowed to" nor "disallowed", but they simply should be, if that's what they desire. They can decide for their own. Aside from that, the level of anti-polonism propaganda in Russia is very high, I've watched a couple of TH-cam videos of that propaganda, and to me personally it seems grotesque I'd say. Even though, like mentioned before, we detest the West's far-left ideas, so that seems to have nothing to do with the cultural war. In my humble opinion, I'd rather "fight" with ideas agains the Western far-leftists, even taking it to the streets if we have to, instead of being under Russia's shoe once more. And that also seems to be the government's way - we send tanks and weapons and whatever we can, we host millions of Ukrainians in our homes and try our best, which already is causing a dangerously high level of backlash from the poorest Poles (why can the government give money to them if we are in need as well, we live in Poland and not Ukraine after all) and from the far-right, that keep on bringing back the issue of Wołyń (Volhynia) Massacre of Poles in the late II WW and the rising cult of Stepan Bandera, that was mostly responsible for that massacre, in modern Ukraine. Yet still, with all that taken into an account, we persist on helping Ukraine, whilst opposing the West's far-left ridiculous ideas. Hungary on the other side seem reluctant to send any military help to Ukraine, which also brought tensions between our countries, and it is worth noting that Hungarians and Poles were there for each other throughout history, there's even a saying "Polak, Węgier, dwa bratanki, i do szabli, i do szklanki", which roughly translates to "Poles, Hungarians, two brothers, both for saber and for (drinking) glass". I think that's all I wanted to mention, not sure if it's coherent at all, but it's just my input - a food for thought. Love from Poland.
Thank you from Czecia for: , I'd rather "fight" with ideas agains the Western far-leftists, even taking it to the streets if we have to, instead of being under Russia's shoe once more.´
On the whole I agree with your position on sovereign nations indipendently running their own affairs. However, where your arguement falls down is the blatant lack of independence many of these territories of the USA actually have.
@@sibutterworth6542 Im from Czech Republic (it used to part of Soviet block and it's now in EU and NATO) and I think we are more independent and have much freedom now that we had under Russian.
@@sibutterworth6542 I'm not naive enough to believe that any countries other than the "biggest" (militarily and economically) ones are actually really independent. What I'm advocating for however is still running things their way. In Poland we have constant presence of US military bases - some may argue it's for safety, we are a NATO country after all, others might argue it's yet another step of us loosing our independence to US. I cannot say what is going on behind the curtains of politics and big business, but from what my parents and grandparents told me, living in Poland now is way better (not only because of technology, medicine etc. advancements) than it was under communism. And I'm pretty sure that if we, the people, will feel the shoe of the US on our necks - we will fight it, as we did with communism. It might take generations, but will happen, unless they will level the whole country to the ground and kill every Pole, but somehow I doubt that. Keep in mind that Poland was not present on the maps for 123 years, yet still we somehow prevailed. If your spirit is strong, there's not much an invader can do, other than killing everybody, to break it. And I get that some might think that the shift to the West in Ukraine is caused by US, it very well might be, and that pro-western propaganda influenced the people's backing that idea, but if they want to try it - they should. Again - if they dislike what they will get into - then they should leave. There will be consequences, like there are for every decision, but it's not up to us to decide for them. Best regards.
@@freedomfreedom6519 Lol. Ukraine did not exist for centuries dude. Also, your comment is shit.
Absolutely insane. Ridiculous.
I don't remember Hollomador, but I do remember Holodomor.
is a joke
"Carefully assessing it with a number of experts" Did those experts happen to mention that it's Holodomor not Holomodor and that Ukraine is not anywhere near Caspian Sea?
Lmfao the best part is him name dropping the Holodomor as a prerequisite for justifying an opposition to the Russian invasion, but he doesn’t even know how to fucking say or spell it. It wasn’t even just a lack of knowledge, it was a lack of knowledge while bemoaning others for a lack of knowledge
These are probably JP's 2 biggest problems: speaking on topics he has no idea about and forgetting his 12 (or 24 now) rules for life. I don't know if JP prepares himself 100% for these videos or if he has such poor associates, but the number of mistakes is laughable when you consider his moralistic tone and setting in this video. How can you consider yourself the right person to solve the world's biggest problems if neither you nor anyone on your team bothered to look at a map to check where the country you're talking about for almost an hour is located on?
I am also thinking he misspoke when he said Albania, he was probably meaning Armenia since it is between Turkey and Azerbaijan.
@@lilauhewfnvuhnefhvne Fight and die in your own fuggin wars you globalist a hole . My son's won't be shedding one drop of blood to save your sorry asses . FUG Europe and all you fuggin stiff necked money changers . You poked a startled bear and now he is fuggin you up.
Do you have anything to say about the points hes making?
Or do you think nitpicking is a sufficient attack on his position?
And another question. Do Ukrainians have any say in what they want for their country? As a Polish I am terrified to hear that once again Anglo Saxons think that can decide above our heads.
The problem is that east Europe doesn't have neither to power nor the influence to push away the influence of the West or Russia. It's similar to Latinoamérica who has to pick a side and obey or been force into a side (and obey).
Exactly. Macron trying to negotiate with Putin over our heads is disgusting. It is sad to see popular figure like Peterson repeating Putin's propaganda.
Well America can… but as for the rest of the Anglosphere… show some respect, my friend. Don’t forget, we’re all just floating through the sky on one ship and we should be good crew to one another. The events of ‘39 are long ago, Poland will never stand alone again. God bless Poland and the world.
There is a very simple principle for a small country - "don`t mess with big neigbour". Poland of 1939 would not happen if it would not have to much believe into France and UK promisses and guarantees of safety and would found reasonable peace with Soviets. But instead it tryed to play its game and had its consequences. Suddenly, You can found, that majority of states around Russia not have any treats from it. Problems starts when western powers starts to tug them. Ukraine COULD solve it peacefully in 2014. If US and EU would allow it to. For god sake, Poland played huge role in resent attemt to revolt Belorussia. How dare You to talk about freedom if You use it this way? What You would expect from a country You try to revolt? And of cource, people are not a political subject here. Politicians are. Common russians and Ukrainians pay for political games of their leaders, same as polish people payed terryfing price for it in WW2.
Anglo Saxons? I don't think that means what you think it means.
With all respect to You Jordan Peterson one question:
If russia cannot lose how much would you be happy to give to putin? Ukraine, Moldova, Bulgaria, Poland... enough? Where would you draw the new border?
I think he can be satisfied only with 'more'.
ending fascism and nacism would do
Listening to Mr. Petersons talks always motivates me to ask my car mechanic if he recommends my pregnant wife to avoid flights or ask my lawyer if i should i sign up my son for a dancing class or a football one. Such a broad expertise, trully amazing.
)
Outstanding comment.
I’m old enough to remember how you said “Don’t let bullies get away with it”
Who's the bully? NATO, Russia, WHO
The sjws are the bullys in the culture war.
@@kennyg1358 Putin
so true. Don't let NATO get away with training Nazis & stephan bandera worshipping fascists to kill ethnic russians in the Donbas.
@@kennyg1358 How is this even a question? Why can't people choose their alliances? The aggressor is clear here. The one that invades, kills and rapes, not the one that chooses their own destiny.
I deeply appreciate dr Peterson's insights about psychology, roots of totalitarianism and his interpretation of biblical stories. To put it short, I learned a lot from him and for that I am thankful. Unfortunatelly, he is wrong about so many things in this video, that it should be immediatelly removed. The scale of these errors are so appaling that I dare to put a statement, that dr Peterson have no idea what he's talking about. Here are some major issues.
1. Russia is NOT part of the West. As dr Peterson himself said many times, Western filosophy is based on the concept of individuality. Meanwhile, Russia's primary mode of thinking is colectivism. Don't let the fall of the Soviet Union fool you, because in reality, it changed nothing in both Russia's people and goverment mentality. Individual rights, so obvious for Americans or people in the UE, are stomped over any time goverment needs it. And it's was no different since pre-revolution Russian Empire, throught Soviet Union and as wee can see, up to this day.
2. Revival of the Christianity in Russia is just a pure nonsense. Goverment likes to show their alleged attachement to tradition and church, they sponsor building of new cathedrals and renovating old ones, but that's just a show for mob, just another piece of their propaganda. I advise to simply look at some statistics from independent from russian goverment Levada Center. Yes, the number of people, who identify themselves with Orthodoxy has risen since 90's, but that's all. There are only 6% of people who actually attend religious practise. But there's more: Russia has the highest number of abortions in the world. They are also "proudly" leading In statistics like suicide rates, deaths from alcohol and drugs abuse, divorce rates, the list goes on. They are ahead of even most "rotten" western countries.
3. Overall, dr Peterson knows much about soviet totalitarism, more than many, many people on the West, but he appears to be somewhat blind to the simple truth: Soviet mentality didn't end with the end of Soviet Union. Both in ruling elites and their subjects. People still worship this psychopath Stalin in Russia. What's worse, ratio of people thinking, that he was a good leader is raising, not declining. Even in younger generations. Next thing, Russia is not afraid of its safety or prosperity. They are only afraid of not being an empire. They cannot comprehend, that countries can cooperate with one another on equal terms. They understand only force and submission, and Russia is using such methods on both their citizens and other countries. It has been their way since centuries, and assumption, that it changed even a little in last 30 years, is so propable, as possibility of finding intelligent life among american's far left. Russia's interests are not to being respected, because their interests are to subdue anyone who's opposing them. People in the middle-eastern Europe knows it far too well. Pity, that many Americans, or even other european states like Germany and France are so blind and attached to their wallets.
Indeed. He has let us all down here. Peterson has always been quite useless when it comes geopolitical issues in general and in this case he has been totally lost to Russian propaganda, reducing himself to being a useful idiot for Putler and his ZZZombie bots.
100%.
100% agree. Also, as you hinted, the problems of genocidal authoritarianism in Russia didn't start with Lenin and Stalin. Before that they massacred all the most of the nations in the Caucasus, destroyed nomadic cultures in Siberia, and Central Asia, they fomented the worst Anti-Semitism that predated, and in many ways formed the Jewish hatred in the rest of Europe (think of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion), and imposed a cultural hegemony to their conquered nations to which the Great Russian literature that Peterson venerates as a gospel has been instrumental. Contrary to the self flagellating West, Russia has never introspected on any of their past crimes, they simple see it as how things are and should be. Also the ideology of Dugin (who is a fascist), and intellectuals surrounding Putin have no interest in the West but as a source of technology, this has been true since Peter the Great. They see themselves as their own civilization, an Eurasian civilization that rejects all the values of democracy, and liberalism, only a strong Czar can guide the diversity of populations into submission. Putin is not a break with any of it, but a reaffirmation of the worst currents of the Russian Empire since the time of the Czars. The lightning speed in which the Russian Federation are reestablishing a Stalinist legal code to suppress, and eradicate all dissenting thought, and the totalitarian elements impregnating everything from the education, to the mass media should be evident for anyone who has a bit of care of the truth of the situation. Unfortunately Mr. Peterson has failed abysmally in understanding some simple facts in this case.
Jordan has truly changed the what I feel about the life and I am better because of that. Although I will have to agree here!
Hellvard why remove? Because he has different point of view and see things from different angle, than you? So I see you didn’t learn anything from dr Peterson’s lectures to remove this content is totalitarianism which seems you admire
I knew Jordan Peterson changed with every year and every million of additional subs, but to see this makes me sad. I tought his worst take would be something else and not as silly as his statements in this video are.
hmmm I thought he was smart and honest. I guess one of those two assumptions was wrong.
I have the problem with sentence "EU and NATO expansionism into Ukraine". Does anybody care, what Ukraine wants, and not EU or NATO? Desire to develop in west-minded direction is manifested in Ukrainian Constitution since it has been created. Ukrainian nation made a lot of sacrifices and come a long way to live the way they wanted to live, and not somebody else, Russia or USA alike
В конституции Украины с момента ее создания был прописан нейтральный статус.
@@verast10 It's not Russia to decide how Ukrainians are going to live.
Повторяю для особо одаренных зомби. В КОНСТИТУЦИИ Украины при создании независимой Украины были прописаны условия, на которых Украина создавалась как независимое государство. Если Украина не очет быть независимым и внеблоковым государством, а хочет быть врагом России, то так тому и быть. Дуракам закон не писан, но дураки редко доживают до старости
It seams like they wonna have a country that celebrates nazis and pure nationalistic population. Way to go Ukraina. Not!
Russia has shown Ukraine that neutrality is suicide. Ukraine *wants* to pivot westward, and it *needs* the help of NATO to do this.
7:05 Current president Zelensky is actually a Russian speaker from the east and win a majority of votes in both eastern and western regions of the country which was very unique case
You sayed it was a unique case, who sayed that the election was fair?
Ukraine is one of the corruptest countries on earth.
Unfortunately, it seems like in this case Mr Peterson has no clue what he is talking avout
@@dmytrovynokurov607 what makes you so sure about that?
@@borni8925 a number of factors:
1. Factual mistakes
- confusing east and west, Caspian and Black sea, Zelensky and Poroshenko, years of revolutions in Ukraine
- talking about Russian language being banned - absolute BS and Russian propaganda
- mentioning support for Yanukovich in the east who is these days hated by his voters more than by his enemies
2. Not mentioning what would happen if Russia wins (although they have been talking about it for years): invading other countries including members of NATO
3. Repeating Russian propaganda messages about cornered rats, Ukraine being their sphere of influence, nuklear bombing of the UK etc.
4. Not saying anything about what Ukrainian people want: European values. Private property and individual freedoms in the first place. Not being Russians as a prerequisite for that
@@borni8925 Look into who is Aleksandr Dugin. Early in the video JP touts him as some moral philosopher that guides Putin's thinking and contrasts that to western leaders who don't have such philosopher advisors. Therefore, implying Putin having some kind of higher standards while western leaders don't.
But Aleksandr Dugin is the last person who should be influencing leaders of any country, he's a warmonger.
This shows that the video is presenting JPs ideology rather than facts. All he read was that Putin is influenced by Dugin's work and that Dugin could be considered a philosopher without actually researching what Dugin has done and what works he's written.
Sir, you got it wrong
His “so smart and scientific” predictions about oil prices and famine did not happen, I am sure the same will happen to “russia simply cant lose” predictions. This is a very great example of the case when a seemingly well educated person makes statements in the area they don’t have enough of information and context trying to support it with its own reputation, some unrelated historical and scientific facts.
HAH, you know, that you eat food from earlier season? Wait for harvest... And what is your country? When rich countries doesn't have cakes, then poor doesn't have bread.
Idk where u live maybe USA, in the country where I live, these predictions have been coming into terrifying realities:
1. food prices went at least 25% because of this war since last year
2. unemployement soared in one of the highest in the last 20 years caused by the drop in export market (to western countries) forced many industries to lay off millions of workers.
3. fuel priced has rocketed up to 40% because USA excert their influence to keep my country to buy from Russia.
@@trenschan1650 first of all I would not trust those numbers until I see a precise statistics for a particular country. and even with those numbers - 25 percent food price is not a famine - it is called the inflation and it happens all over the world, export to western countries - it is not related to the war and the future trend is that western countries will do less import/export and produce/consume everything locally as the have materials and robotized workforce, as for the fuel - from what I know poor countries like China and India are still buying oil from Russia and oil price wen down from 120 to 80 during the recent year - and let me to do my own forecast - if russia wins there will be no "export to western countries"
@@xasm83 My guy all you have to do is compare prices in Europe From 5 years ago to now, you can keep on staying inside a bubble untill you see "real statistics" whatever that means, since you won't take other's comments into account. Even fucking snacks that use to cost 40c, now cost 1euro, hell i can send you images of shopping receipts from 2021 vs 2023, went to the butcher to buy some meat, the exact same items of 3kg of meat costed me almost a whopping 10eur more. Cost of living in general has increased exponentially post covid and since the war started
@@xasm83 "Food Inflation in Malta averaged 3.56 percent from 2011 until 2023, reaching an all time high of 14.30 percent in October of 2022 and a record low of -0.40 percent in September of 2014." In my country, food price inflation went up 14.30 % since the war started.....
I respect Dr Peterson and I think that he's doing an important job of opposing marxist ideas resurfacing in the West, but he clearly doesn't know what he's talking about when he's speaking of ideology that drives this war inside Russia. I've been living in Russia my whole life, and not in Moscow, inside a truly privileged echochamber, theorizing about "Russia's unique destiny" while sipping Starbucks coffee, but in Siberia, in coal mining towns. Russian people aren't religious in any way a Westerner would define that concept: very few people pray, they very rarely visit churches on some special occasions, there's no abortion dispute (there's no pro-life arguments whatsoever, just pure economic calculations whether a kid is affordable), abortions and divorces are ubiquitous, and despite harsh anti-LGBT laws, homosexuality is commonplace here, ingrained in the "prison culture" and its echos, still widespread beyond large cities. So no, it's not the opposition to the West's "decadence" that drives this war, Russia itself is infinitely more decadent than an outsider's perspective would suggest. The real reason, I think (granted, I have no means of verifying this claim, since open discussions on this topic are forbidden in Russia, and not "oh my God, they suspended me on Twitter, this is the end of free speech" type of restriction but rather "you find yourself in jail and out of work" type) is purely economic in its nature. The 90's have been a true nightmare for the Russian people, when incredible economic turmoil coinciding with previously unheard of levels of crime, resulted in a struggle for survival of such intensity that when Putin took office and restored an approximation of law and order, he truly became the champion of the people. That 90's turmoil became synonymous in the minds of many Russians with the West and the process of "democratization", hence when Putin started using "stability" in contrast with the Western influence as his main electoral promise, it resonated strongly. Surely, in the last 10 or so years our propaganda went absolutely ballistic, it criticized the West from every point of view, including the ones Jordan mentions, but very few people view this confrontation as fighting on ideological or moral front, it's the same Putin's "we have to do X in order to preserve our stability" rhetoric. Yes, he himself probably believes in some vaguely defined Dugin's "third way" notions, in his historical mission, but for the majority inside the country, it's simple "us vs them" blank form that can be filled with nationalist, imperialist, religious or any other ideological nonsense, but at the core lies the fear of losing what little we managed to acquire after the 90's.
You will own nothing - the great reset
I think your argument holds for the majority that has no intellectual, business, or administrative influence. The middle and upper middle class that is the core that drives country's history is more sophisticated. And the approach of Prof. Peterson applies to that group, in my opinion.
@@kseniafedotova8272 But what would you say to ukranians whose are daying now?
are you ready to pay for your choice?
This thought process is exactly what allowed Hitler to commit horrible atrocities in Europe.
@@DmitirySDS after decades of mass murders in soviets of intelectual people and the remnants fled to the west, i don't know about whom your are talking about or you define the kleptocrats as an intellectuals ....?
It can take you just a few quotes to understand that Peterson knows nothing about this topic:
"Zelensky was supported just in the Northeast". Dude, you can open the Ukraine 2019 election map, it's available for free.
"Ukraine found a gas near the Caspian sea". Agaaaaaain, did he even open a map of eastern Europe? Where is Ukraine, and where is the Caspian sea?
He can be a great mental health expert, but he is definitely not a history or political science expert.
pretty sure he made the mistake and mixed up the Caspian sea with the black sea, but then again, what do i know.
Zelensky had support at time of elections beacose he promised to end the war and come to solution with Russia..promise which he lied on big time...he misused trust of people of half of Ukraine specially pro russian population
It's not a big secret that westerners are not good with geography...
What did you expect from a junkie? Up your standards and stop taking life advice from internet warriors with a drug habit.
We can continue: he mentioned Dugin and said he's not ignoring it, but he did ignored the fact that Dugin was assigned the task to find new political "idea" during communism collapse. It proves that it's not the "disappointing west ideology" is challenged but it was planned waaay before. Yup, but it didn't fit his agenda: to blame left for everything 🤣
Also he ignored the fact that slavic nations within EU: Poland + Chech + Slovakia + Bulgaria + Chroatia + Slovenia - is almost the population size of Russia. Ukraine is essential for both sides. If Ukr would join EU - Russia can forget about beeing a major global player. Ukr is slavic and 1/3 of the size of Russia (by population). They would be doomed to be a satellite of either China or EU.
Also he ignores the fact that Russians have already deported about 2mln Ukrainians to faaaar east, Asian parts of Russia, to colonize those regions with slavs - exactly what they were also doing throughout the history incl. WW2 (my grandparents were accused of beeing rich, all their properies were confiscated and they were deported to Asia from where they had to travel back undercover to Poland).
Also, I'd like to remind everyone: Ukr+Poland is almost the size of Russia (population). Throughout the history, we were fighting together against Russia almost in every war.
I'm Ukrainian. It took me 4 months to get myself to listen to this, because I do want to listen to the other side of the story. I'm 7 minutes into this video and I just can't go further. I had great respect for Jordan Peterson but now I question his ability to analyze a problem.
Same here. He certainly has his merits in Psychology, Religion and in some sense History, but when it comes to Political Science, his sh* goes right into the toilet...
Your feelings and reaction is totally valid. It is psychologically painful to listen to opinions that you disagree with in your very core. I feel the same in such situations.
Could you elaborate more? All I heard within first 10 minutes was analysis of importance of Ukraine to different foreign countries. I fully agree with Peterson's analysis that Russia had much bigger stake for the future of Ukraine than other countries (Ukrainians obviously care about their future, too, but Peterson listed reasons about the situation purely from the perspective of other countries). He also explicitly mentioned around 12:33 that these were three *hypothetical reasons* for the war.
If you think that Peterson was siding Russia here, you just didn't follow his (granted, highly verbose) speech.
then you're weak you just want everybody to agree with you
Yes, I'm an American who fought in Ukraine and i'm ashamed of much of the American right wing. But don't let that steer you away from the underlining western values. I love what Ukrainian MP Maryan Zablotsky has been doing! With more people like him and President Saakashvili Ukraine will be the most free country in the world.
This is not a civil war. This is lending the flank to Putin mythology of a original Rus. Listen to Timothy Snyder or Steven Kotkin for correct answers. Not all political leaders are sociopaths, Putin for sure is.
Mythology of an original Rus? Are you insane?, So the mythology of an original anglophone country is a lie? Where the Americans always a separate tribe or something than the English?
Mr Peterson... I'm from Kazakhstan and support your ideas about culture war and liberal craziness in the West with stupid cancel culture, former drug dealer become Jusus when whole people bending knee etc BUT BUT BUT we Kazakhs, Ukrainians Georgians nations liberated after Russian Impire collapse HAVE FULL RIGHTS TO LIVE INDEPENDENTLY... We don't understand why we must live under Russian influence... we don't understand why do you mix culture war in the West with real war in Ukraine...
I really like this comment.
The answer is very simple, The strong beats the weak.
Liberated after Russian empire collapse…😂lol. Your Asian hordes were liberated and educated by Russians!
@@eahabeahab4367 Russia not looking so strong now...
@@austinhollopeter4206 Just like NATO
Mr. Peterson. I have watched many of your speeches and followed you for a very long time. I had great respect for you and admired you also. This stops now.
I happen to live in Europe. I grew up with neighbors and friends from Poland, Ukraine, Romania, Czech republic, etc. They remember what it was like to live under Russian rule. They remember what it was like to have Russian tanks drive into your neighborhood If you did something they didn't like.
What you understand Mr. Peterson is that Putin is very clear about what he wants. He has been saying it for years. He wants Ukraine to not exist. He wants Moldova to not exist. He wants Lithuania, Latvia and Estonia to not exist. And i understand what this means. The last time there was a dictator in Europe who wanted to redraw the map, that was Hitler and Stalin. I know what this is, we have seen it before here. No matter how many intelligent words you use doesn't change the facts. There is a new revanchist dictator in town. This guy has nukes, yes. But If you want to sacrifice me and all my friends just so you can feel safe. Then NATO is gone. it's pathetic. It's not even a thing, and we should just give up to everyone who threatens us. We should not even have a military! Let's just stop having a military and just have a radio that says "we surrender" in Russian and Chinese. Is that your plan for us Europeans Mr. Peterson? In that case I don't think you are very welcome here anymore
Can't agree more with your words!
personally i can totally understand you from an emotional position. but all the countries you mentioned are adopting european beliefs which are not there own. im living in germany and if the shit goes down, the western people will dont give a damm about the european union and your illusion of good and evil will fade.
@@dajosaurus7688 According to you what is European beliefs??? Because I see that European beliefs are pure emotions that are nothing short of communism.
@@dajosaurus7688 How are they adopting identity politics when they were in identity politics??? It would be like communists are adopting socialism!
Well said!
"Russia has concerns about the language, etc. situation in Ukraine" Russia (read Putin) - yes; Russians - did not give a fvck until propaganda asked them to do. That is also an absolute fact. I'm not even talking about the fact that Ukraine is a sovereign state and whatever happens there should not be a case of anyone's foreign policy. All this 'deep conversations' about the conflict with quotes from 2015 are not applicable. Ukraine is now very different. This is the birth of a State with a geopolitical influence (yes, you read it right; Google more on this, friend). Also, to everyone who's watching this: please, find more sources to understand the situation. Timothy Snyder, professor from Yale, covering this pretty extensively. Allow plurality of opinions, don't buy what one says.
Honestly expected better from Jordan Peterson. I know the guy has a once in a lifetime type opportunity to speak to multitudes of people, but I prefer the videos where he actually knows what he's talking about inside and out. Not sure why he's seemed so much more aggressive lately instead of calm and objective.
Marketing to his new and now chief audience of conservative American grifters.
I enjoy most of Dr. Peterson's lectures and interviews (of himself and of others) and I usually find them intellectually stimulating and insightful. However, in his analysis of the Russo-Ukrainian War, I believe most of his analysis was off target. The density of topics covered forces me to be brief in any rebuttal. The meta critiques of Dr. Peterson's analysis are 1) the lack of reciprocity of analysis, 2) a cavalier dismissal of any investment by democratically committed nations in the outcome of this invasion, 3) the focus on threats to Russia while excluding threats to other nations, 4) the neglect of the sovereign rights of nations that Russia chooses to dominate, 5) the failure to project beyond the current conflict other than doomsday predictions for the West should Russia be thwarted in its objectives, 6) an overemphasis on ancillary causes, and 7) the shifting of moral responsibility onto the West to extricate Putin from a catastrophe of his own making.
I will comment on a few of these points. These comments are only illustrative. Space does not allow anything more exhaustive.
1) Reciprocity of analysis is lacking, among other examples, on the significance of a nuclear arsenal. As I understand the argument, nuclear weapons are extremely dangerous and confronting Russia risks the annihilation of Western civilization. However, the West also has a huge nuclear arsenal that is every bit as dangerous to Russia. That is the problem with trying to use nuclear weapons to intimidate other nuclear powers. You have to convince them that you are willing to act irrationally to destroy the very nation you are trying to preserve. This is one example among many on the issue of reciprocity.
2) The statement that the West or at least the U.S. and Canada don't care about Ukraine. That buries a larger truth under a partial reality. Beyond specific concern for Ukraine per se, a much larger issue that is critical to the West is the defense of a rules based world order. There is a chance to turn the corner on 19th Century realpolitik and 20th Century wars of conquest, ideological hegemony, and ethnic expansion. Much of the world is committed to turning this corner, but more than gentle persuasion will be required to convince autocratic leaders that international bullying will have costs beyond their expected gains.
3) The point that Russia feels threatened by Ukraine's turn to the West (presumably justifying, to some extent, the invasion and terror campaign in Ukraine. It doesn't take much awareness of international news to know that Poland feels threatened by the invasion, as does Lithuania, Latvia, Estonia, Moldova, and Georgia. Most people are aware of the huge pivot to NATO membership by Finland and Sweden as a result of the invasion of Ukraine. These reactions make it quite obvious that many countries now part of the Western community of free and democratic forms of government are quite concerned about Russia either absorbing Ukraine or turning it into a satellite state and the implications with respect to future, hegemonic adventurism. Much of the West feels real existential angst over a Russian victory in Ukraine. That point is left out of Dr. Peterson's analysis.
To wrap things up, I'll jump to point 6) for a last example. The titular theme of Dr. Peterson's analysis is the argument that a significant motivating factor for the invasion might be Putin's quest to reverse the moral decline of the West. This may be a theme that is convenient to sell to a captive audience in Russia. Every national group wishes to perceive itself as holding the moral high ground. This is especially true in times of significant national sacrifice and conflict where the horrors of war need a counterbalancing justification. I have no idea how much of a threat to Russia Putin perceives from a more socially liberal society in Ukraine. Was he really fearful that tolerance of homosexual relationships might infest Russia from across the Ukraine border? That seems like a remote fear considering the control he wields over Russian society and his successful persecution of homosexuals in Russia. What seems more likely is that the more significant threat to Putin's autocracy is the possibility of an economically and socially thriving democracy on his border. Especially if individual rights are honored and protected by a legal system committed to the rule of law. It is difficult for me to argue that we should discourage democracies (or fail to support them) to prevent the exposure of the Russian populace to democratic prosperity. It is in our national interest to promote a world order that respects internationally established borders. That is nowhere more true than in the heart of Europe among new democracies trying to adopt the best ideas that the West has ever championed.
Very good analysis. I am from Russia and you have better understanding of the events than some proffessors have. I am sick of western intellectuals who put an agenda on Russia in order to justify their theories. We do not need this war. It is not russian interests JP is talking about but Putin's. Unfortunately most of Russian people are just indifferent or scared because they are brainwashed by propaganda
Or it may just be that Putin will save the West from destroying themselves.
Hope Jordan notices your comment.
@@williammartin2842 No, Putin does not care about your silly woke wars. He is only concerned with his power at home. He will face another ellection in 2024. He thought that he would easily win over Ukraine and put there a puppet regime loyal to him. The same he did in 2014 with Crimea which skyrocceted his ratings among elder population who have nostalgia about Soviet times. But now the situation is very different.
@@user-rp5yz1gj2y Don't lose hope. Sometimes history moves very slowly. Stay safe and stay informed. The world needs people of good will.
Dr. Peterson, while you are an experienced and intelligent specialist in multiple fields, unfortunately, this video has been woefully under-prepared. It shows a significant lack of knowledge about the current situation and history of the countries in Eastern Europe, including internal affairs of Russia, Ukraine, Poland and the Baltic states. The facts have not been checked, on the stats of industrial importance of Ukraine, the election trends, the human rights situation in Russia. As Woodrow Wilson when creating the League of Nations, you underestimate the local cultural and historical pitfalls involved.
Also, when speaking of the consequences, you should also think of the alternatives. Ukraine would gladly be neutral, but within it's own borders and territory, something that Russian leadership had tried to destroy since the 18th century. Giving the current Russian leadership any chance right now to peace at their terms would only delay the inevitable restart of the war and send a very specific signal to all authoritarians in the world, left or right, that the West is ready to trade "a pound of flesh" for their way of life. The name "Chamberlain" comes to mind.
When you focus on China, do not forget that it is not uni-cultural, that it historically more than once collapsed under the weight of its own internal struggles. And when worrying about the radical left and the misguided US Democrats, do not forget the radical right, as well. Oh, and by the way, Russian spirituality is very much for show, the Orthodox church there having failed to cleanse themselves of their KGB infiltration. When Putin came to power, the old "alliance" was willingly renewed. One of the few things gotten right in this video was the failed opportunity by NATO, but due to the worldview differences that also was very, very unlikely.
Since you are normally better prepared than this, I would love to see a second video on this important topic, in which you would check your facts and conclusions more properly.
Excellent comment
I would love to see Peterson to redeem himself on this topic, but I don't have much hope.
Peterson the pathetic Putin appeaser has always been a more or less closet Vladolf Putler fan boy. But he has now officially outed himself, lol.
You are absolutely right. Some parts if this vid are very naive. Couldn’t stop rolling my eyes.
"Ukraine would gladly be neutral, but within it's own borders and territory"
This is 100% false. Ukraine has not shown itself willing to be neutral in any manner but has become rabidly anti-Russian and hostile to minorities. No matter how it's packaged, that's not neutrality.
This video is in fact a perfect example of why the scientists/professors turned media persons should rather stick to their initial field of expertise (if any). It's a very appealing paradigm to think of yourself as a jack-of-all-trades analyst once you became dizzy from all the praise and acclaim from millions of followers. Here JP shows nothing but a shallow and prejudiced analysis of the events he in fact has a very little understanding of. All the presumptions and conclusions given are grounded solely on JPs personal attitude and beliefs regarding the Russians and their culture. Anyway, how can one be negative towards the culture that gave the world the greatest writer of all, right? The problem with JPs analysis is that he thinks that Dostoyevsky helps him understanding what Russia is, while in fact it helps us all see what Russia is not. And what it never will be.
The misguided conclusions here were in fact predetermined by the initial mistake of the approach taken for analyses of this kind of events. Rather than focusing on subjects where JPs has a little to nothing expertise (like the history of geopolitical relationships of the post-soviet countries and a centuries-old history of the territories where Ukraine and Russia are located), he should have concentrated on something where he’s indeed and acknowledged expert - clinical psychology. And maybe, he would be persistent enough to take off the blinders and to see with whom by the psychological definition Ukraine and the rest of the world are dealing in this conflict: a psychopath with megalomania and morbid thanatophobia. A person that once stated openly (in 2005) that Dissolution of the Soviet Union was the greatest geopolitical catastrophe of the 20th century (sure, worth than WWI and WWII combined). Do you, Mr. Peterson, really need to seek further for any reasonable explanation of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine after such a statement? Isn’t the action self-explanatory and isn’t the goal self-evident? Would love to see JPs follow up to this video after VPs speech on September the 30th, where he literally accused West of its perpetual ambition to annihilate Russia and its cultural identity basically for its (Russia’s) refusal to become a part of the western world. And, getting back to JPs field of expertise, this seems like a classical projective identification, where all these actions are driven by the appetite for revenge for simply being rejected by the western world. Just like a deeply unsecured yet aggressive man is unable to cope with rejection from a woman he admires.
The only true goal perceived here is resurrection of once great empire, that once ruled half the world, the Soviet empire. It is the past that fights the future in a desperate attempt to stop the time. As if bringing past back to life may somehow bring back our own youth and grace along with it, and maybe even bring such a coveted immortality. Which is of course a complete self-delusion.
There’s a saying they have in Russia " zri v korjen' ” which means get to the root of the matter. But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear, says the Bible.
Thus, will JP be finally able to see and to hear without prejudice and finally get to the root of the matter? But then again, Dostoevsky and stuff...
P.S. Was just about to read JPs “12 Rules”, but not quite sure now..
There’re some blatant lies in this video (possibly taken form Russian's propaganda narratives), thus, may there be similar lies in 12 Rules?
The problem with your analysis is you are under the impression you are more intellectual than you really are. Your "comprehensive breakdown" shows your lack of comprehensive ability. I got about half way through before I realized you are LOONY TUNES lol
This is absurd beyond belief. Do you REALLY think a leader of a country with nuclear power would just attack another country because of his "appetite" and you base it on his quotes from almost 20 years ago?
@@user-hh2ge5hz5b LOL, by referring to a "nuclear power" you only immediately proved my point) Yes, that's exactly what authoritarian dictators do once they go unpunished for their misdeeds for decades. That is the primitive yet efficient racketeer's tactics, that putin learned really well during the early Saint Petersburg’s years of his career: you better give me what I want or you'll get into much bigger trouble.
And yes, I'm citing the 20 year old words of a man, who usurapted ultimate power over his country for 20+ years.
@@User-bu6tuand what makes you such an expert on Putin? Also, I will ask again. Do you really think, that a leader of a country with nuclear power can just do the fuck he wants?) Without serious consequences for himself as a country leader, left alone his nation? This is childish to think wars start with someone waking up in the morning and thinking "Why don't I just conquer a country nearby?". Not a single war in the history of humanity has started for that reason.
@@user-hh2ge5hz5b Yes, a tyrannical leader would do such a thing because the lack of confidence displayed by the democratic leaders and their willingness to bargain and appease makes him think they would not act when one of their allies gets attacked or even when they themselves get attacked. From historical archives, we know one of the reasons the Japanese attacked the Americans at Pearl Harbor was because they thought that if the Americans did not enter the war when Britain was bombed by Hitler, then they would not have the guts to go to war when one of their islands gets attacked and they would rather sacrifice an island in the Pacific than start a war.
And yes, tyrants really follow through with the plans they put in writing years ahead; Hitler did from 1938 onward exactly what he had written in Mein Kampf in 1925.
I suggest you read/watch Victor Davis Hanson, Timothy Snyder and Steven Kotkin on these subjects.
Ukraine does not want to be part of Russia, thought Putin doesn't seem to care - why doesn't he offer a better deal?
How about a referendum on whether Ukraine wants to be part of Russia?
You have had two deals so far:
First back in 2014 was to allow russian people in eastern ukraine a degree of autonomy.
Second in march 2022 was to recognise independence of two self proclaimed republics and restrain from joining NATO.
Wonder what the next one will be
For the first time I actually feel smarter than Jordan Peterson!
I guess being born and raised in the USSR gives me unfair advantage, but it still feels good. Lol
Facts don't care about your feelings. Keep trying.
Stand with you!
Raul del Villar@we’ll hurt you as Americans say as you have no personal knowledge and experience as well as Dr. Peterson. Everybody can be wrong once in a while, so were he and you…
Im also born and raised in ussr Ukraine and in full agreement with JP like some other Ukrainians who actually are still in Ukraine commented here.
@@marinagrabowska6759 russian troll detected.
You weren't born in USSR. No one from USSR speak any English. And those who do probably aren't too familiar with TH-cam and how comments sections work. And even if you did (which I really really doubt) English speaking Ukrainians can't be so dumb to agree with JP on this because nothing he said is true.
Holomodor is not a word.
Ukraine has no access to Caspian sea.
Ukraine is a sovereign state and not some Russian oblast. It's not "a sphere of influence".
There can't be a civil war between Russia and Ukraine because they're two different nations.
Literally everything he said in this video about Russia or Ukraine is dum b as s bs. EVERYTHING!
1. Russia speaking people are not under ‘draconian repressive language laws’. I’m a Russian speaking Ukrainian, all my family members are. That statement is simply not true.
2. Zelensky was very popular amongst Russian speaking, he ran on the promise of uniting Ukraine, both east and west.
3. There were 4 years of Porashenko before Zelensky took office, which for some reasons everyone forgets.
4. Your ‘Legit philosopher’ Alexander Dugin literally said Ukrainians are insects and should be exterminated.
I like your stuff JP, but more and more I get the feeling that you’re rushing to produce content, oftentimes without the necessary research.
He has fully gone off the wagon.
I think he is being payed to say such things. What kind of self respecting philosopher would say Dugin is legit and what kind of anti authoritarian would sacrifice all of Ukraine because "it doesn't matter" or to appease Russia.
He is a shill
👏👏👏
As a Russian speaker from Ukraine who voted for Zelensky I’m very disappointed in JP 😞
I think he misread what he'd written: "...are NOW under draconian repressive language laws."
Your 2nd statement is false, when I was in Ukraine and Zelensky got elected, everyone knew that Ukraine was a few years away from a Russian invasion. Zelensky was never going to unite Ukraine, but he played a role in starting this war.
Don’t tell Jordan P to find “ necessary research” when you don’t know what you’re talking about.
JP is right here. Search for the Movie "Ukraine on Fire " here in YT. It explains you the details.
20:20 you nailed it..
I'm а Serb and very well know what this honest Western man is talking about. Blessed he be!
Blessed be to @Serbia!! Stay strong!! 👍👍👃✌️🥰🇨🇦
@@galeparker1067 thanks a lot
yes he's spreading russian propaganda
Do not be like Neville Chamberlain, who did indeed know very little about one country in Central Europe. Please, get to know more.
If you want to see a free country, come and visit Poland or some of our neighbours East, North or South of us.
There are no free countries. Only countries under varying forms of statist tyranny. The only war is the one between states and private individuals. And that will not be won until the last public body is gone from this Earth
Visit Poland to see a free country? How about people just visit America… cause that’s a real free country
@@Dodbanna BRUH
Yes, the parallel with Chamberlain also occured to me while listening. Greeting from Czechia.
I love Poland! A nation of immense courage, compassion, and national spirit, which helped Jews during the Holocaust just as it is helping Ukrainian refugees today, even though they have their own problems to work through. Poland should be very skeptical about the way the EU is trying to override their independence and national sovereignty, but the crisis with Russia is more urgent at the moment. God bless Poland.
This view of yours won't be appreciated much where I come from (Czech republic). Selling out Ukraine for peace sounds a bit familiar - remember Czechoslovakia and Munich agreement? Have you not learned the lesson? Russians talk about invading Poland and taking "back" Baltic states (what you call, a sphere of influence). So once you get occupied by Russians, you suddenly belong to them? What a miserable idea. The tragedy of the "new ideology" from the west is an excuse and a good food for Russian propaganda, but not the cause of any war. Especially when the countries of central/eastern/southern Europe are mostly free of that nonsense, but are the primary target of Russian aggression or threats. That doesn't add up at all.
Amen! I feel especially bad for all the courageous Ukrainians who are defending our values of freedom and democracy for us with their lives. Peterson has always been quite useless when it comes geopolitical issues in general and in this case he has been totally lost to Russian propaganda, reducing himself to being a useful idiot for Putler and his ZZZombie bots.
Exactly :) Very well said
Man, good to hear voices like this. Most people here seem out of mind.
He does not realize how brave we are and how well we know Russia and its intentions. He has no idea about our history. Russia only understands strength, and now we brothers in Central Europe are uniting to oppose the tyrant. Greetings from Poland.
Dr peterson everthing you said is realy true but the westrean leaders knows too but they dont have to say no to the neo nasis u.s.a who think only one think only think that control all wide world if you said no youre death or you wilbe detroying becouse of not agree with then and thats what is going in europian today
How can I believe a man, who doesn’t know basics of geography??!
Moscow was founded in 1147. It’s 875 years old. Kyiv was establishment is 482 ce, and in 1982 the city celebrated its 1,500th anniversary. How come Putin claims Ukraine belongs to Russia?
Your date of Kiev founding is just legendary, unproved year. In fact, Kiev was founded in the first quarter of the 9th century. From 882 starts its history as the capital of the Kievan Rus´.
Russia is a successor of Kievan Rus.
For Westerners it may look like a cultural war, but for Ukrainians and Eastern Europeans it is a matter of physical survival... I'm from Poland and here sadly we know - either you bow your head to the russian or you get a bullet (like in Katyn massacre). The only deterrence to Russian is bare force - the only argument that guarantees Eastern Europeans survival. That is why Poles and others were BEGGING to get admitted to the NATO.
Sad to hear what you say JP :(
Exactly, he has no damn clue and repeats damn Russian propaganda.
well looks like it is just us, who do really understands that. Cheers from Ukraine.
@@krzysztofsaa2997 All of these contrarians have lost their minds since COVID. Essentially take the opposite view of government just for the sake of it. Peterson has a great mind but like most of these guys he's been swallowed by ego.
I’m part Ukrainian. You’re looking at this wrong. If NATO wasn’t at Russia’s doorstep, none of this would’ve happened. No one wants to formally integrate Russia into Europe either, everyone’s so afraid of the “big bad bear”, not realizing that there’s a progressive liberal eagle that’s sweeping away all your rights in the name of “democracy”. Open your narrow mind, Russia isn’t perfect, but it’s arguably better than the latter
@@krzysztofsaa2997 The top one spreading propaganda during this conflict is Poland, and the eastern European, they are Russophobic as hell, just because they think they are kinda better. It is a shame of what those countries are doing now, just humiliating themselves constantly.
Oh, Mr. Peterson, am I understood right that Ukraine has recently discovered "its own gas resources arround Caspian Sea"…? May be my English is poor enough to understand, but if not you're so hugely mistaken, because Ukraine doesn't have a geographical access to Caspian sea.
I have also heard that there are oil resource, but in the Black Sea, near Crimea. Ukrainians even blew up a civilian Russian company's oil platform closer to Odessa recently.
@@charlesstrouss those were Ukrainian gas stations prior to Crimea occupation.
During the war Russian SAMs were deployed there making them a liable target.
He should have said Donbas, Crimea and the Black and Azov seas. This is why Ukraine has infinite credit line with the West. If Ukraine loses these (and it will) it will return to backwater status and the West will become disinterested in its fate or prosperity.
@@Roxana-gu5zt Hopefully!!!!
he misspoke on that one the reserves were discovered in what is now russian controlled territories previously held by Ukraine.
11:09 Look at the map. What can Ukraine who's border is 700 kilometers from Caspian sea discover there? What ukrinian resources are you talking about?
11:10 Ukraine can not discover gas and oil reserves near the Caspian Sea, as Ukraine does not adjoin the Caspian Sea. This inland sea is fenced by Russia, Kazakhstan, Turkmenistan, Iran and Azerbaijan only.
Exactly, this alone shows that the mere factual background is manifestly erroneous. (Let alone the conclusions driven from them.)
Also, 7:02 Zelenskyy never stood against Yanukovych. Nor was Zelenskyy a favourite of the Ukrainian-speaking West. There is a 5 year gap between the two of them. And Zelenskyy (being a Russian speaking person from the Southeast himself) barely spoke any Ukrainian when elected, and was more popular in the South and the East.
So, checking the map of the world and/or Wikipedia before spreading “wisdoms” would be useful next time.
11:17 Ukraine is nowhere near the Kaspian sea. It's reserves are around black sea.
Obviously a slip
He joked. Like in the rest of his self-talk
Rule 37: Don't let bullies get away with it. Unless they kick someone "irrelevant", than it's a culture thing.
I guess it’s not always easy to identify the real bully on the geopolitical stage.
Indeed, this is the cynicism JP has now stooped to. So sad. Not even following his own rules of life anymore.
@@marshuswp3325 who is the bully?
When authoritarian dictator invades democratic country, bombing children on purpose, rapeing, executing civilians (Bucha is just an exaple) you can have problems spotting the bully only if you don't see Ukrainians as people (as JP 37:40).
If someone stats from "I don't care" point than any help or sacrifice is too much. This is the core of this video, rest is just distraction, fear and some appaling lies. Can't describe how dissapointed I am, as someone who respects his work.
@@DrDingus Russia invaded the independent country explaining it with fake reasons (Finland also just joined NATO by making NATO's border with Russia 500 miles longer. No reaction From Russia). So who is the bully?..
I'm from Ukraine, and I'm sorry Dr. Peterson but I don't think you fully understand the situation here
Look "out" of Ukraine, and you will understand everything like Jordan
Tough to keep focus on the core of the message with so many out flyers. There is a very talented guitar player on TH-cam I used to enjoy listening to. As his playing ability progressed, he stuffed more on more notes per second into the musical pieces he performed causing the melody to be buried into an indiscernible noise.
Poland has been a huge supporter of western Ukraine the whole time. I don't think they have been thinking about woke people in Canada under these circumstances.
Yeah, as many times in the past Poland supported Western Ukraine in same way as Russia supports Eastern Ukraine 😉
Well, they'll be thinking about it eventually if things go their way.
@@MU.200 True degeneration of the West reveals it self as a cynicism not as transgenederism.
Western Ukrainians are ethnically Poles.
pretty sure Poland says fuck both.
At least one thing incorrect here that I would like to point out:
Zelensky was supported by most of Ukraine and campaigned as a president who would bring togehter the Russian-speaking East and the Ukrainian-speaking West. He was even mainly a Russian speaker before and did his comedy show predominantly in Russian.
You can look up voting maps of Ukraine and specifically the one of 2019 election to see for yourself.
Careful examination of our involvement in the 2014 war helped lay the groundwork for this. Zelenskis dumbest mistake was taking the job because he inherited a situation that cannot be resolved
Joe Biden received the most votes in American history and is the Most Popular President of all Time. Americans overwhelmingly supported him, more so than even Obama!
Nonsense. Do you believe that 81 million different people voted for Biden? I get the impression that washing _your_ brain would not take very long and would require very little 'liquid'.
Good point, Peterson has missed the fact that Ze was well supported because he promised to end the persecution of the Donbas people. But he'll learn more about that and other facts: he is an honest man.
He'll also learn that Putin waited patiently for his Western "colleagues" to help implement the Minsk accord. When he learns more about this, he'll stop using the term :"thug" in relation to Putin.
@UCUtwvXFJmyPGNa_1A39baIg which is still not an argument for anything, because in the east and south, Zelensky still got the majority in these areas. Hell, he's from the south himself.
brilliant as always/
How will this affect fish oil prices?
I used to think that JP is very knowledgeable and principled academic. This *tirade* upends these observations completely.
Nothing but shallow, surprisingly uninformed or deeply cynical attempts to defend a brutal autocratic state at war of expansion and ethnic cleansing... no words.
I totally understand why Russia doesn’t want nato on its border what comes next is the western banking system funneling money into things that lead to more gluttony greed and irreligion. Glory to all Russian heroes may you not be consumed by the liberal world order. 🇷🇺 🇷🇸
What ethnic cleansing? Like the 2-3million Vietnamese we killed in the Vietnam war? Or the over 1million we killed in Iraq? Sit down and stop shilling for the global elites son.
Yes. I also noticed the same thing, very nerrow minded and angry attemp to jastify brutal autocratic state of war expantion.
@@Falcon_Serbia Good sir, have you ever been to Russia?
Portraying it as some kind of pious state of religious virtues and moral clarity is... brave.
The years of hate towards him changed him. Not for the good.
Zelenskyy wasn't western representative, Poroshenko was to some extend, but Zelenskyy never was. Completely wrong statement
Zelenskiy IS pro western puppet at this right moment of time.
@@games4us132 i would say that he is a member of very broad antiputin coalition which is going to choke new incarnation of natsis in the world so cold russists.
Zelensky and Ukraine are a puppets of the USA who want to get closer and closer to russia. If Ukraine would be become a Nato member they could technically fire missiles which would hit Moscow in about 10 minutes.
@@TheCrazyCatHouse so yhey can now, from Finland. Even closer. This has to be justification of Russian agression and genocide of ukrainians. But it doesn't work, sorry.
He also was against corruption... well...
& humbled by your KNOWLEDGE
bruh is he seriously using cold war rhetoric for his arguments? Ukraine is not a buffer. It's an independant nation.
Zelenskiy got a majority vote with 75 percent for him, Russian speaking east was voting for Zelenkiy..
I'm afraid you don't know the topic well
Also it was funny to hear how Ukraine find oil in Caspian sea ;)
@@user-jg3hp3ey3f I wonder if he will put down the video, since the mistakes.
you don't know topic eather. People believed that Zelenskiy will stop war in eastern part of ukraine, but it turns out that he did even worse.
@@games4us132 how exactly he did it? by tying to negotiate with putin? ridiculous
He promised peace and stoping the civil war no matter the cost. He lied. That is also the fact that most in the west dont know about Zelenski.
Mr. Peterson. I have tremendous respect for you and your work. When the war started, I was glad you sat down with mr. Kagan to try to understand what was really going on. That's just the reason I didn't want to watch this video based on its title, criticism, your opening and criticism in comments. Yet, as you say, one has to listen carefully because the other person might know something you don't. Well. I watched your video carefully. I must say I was surprised I didn't know many things:
1. That my country has access to Caspian Sea
2. That my country has no say in Russia-West 'spheres of influence' argument, nor has it any say in whatever cultural and identity struggle Russians experience with regard to Ukraine being independent nation (i.e. NOT Russian).
3. That my country historically and naturally belongs to Russian sphere of influence (usual argument of most Russian liberals btw, from which the next thesis is usually derived that is Ukrainians are an invented nation)
4. That language issue is a divisive factor in Ukraine (it might shock you but many fierce Ukrainian patriots have never spoken a word in Ukrainian in their lives, only Russian)
5. Geography and social demographics of 2019 presidential elections and 2005-2014 revolutions. You might want to check with your sources on that.
6.Role of EU and NATO (in fact, we were constantly denied a prospect of joining either to appease Russia)
7. That in order to understand modern Russia one has to read Dostoyevsky or Solzhenytsyn and not Pelevin and Sorokin
8. That instead of adhering to international law and each sovereign nation's right to defend itself against aggression one must consider some fake historic grievances and presence of nukes in an aggressor.
9. Russia is a Christian nation because they build a lot of churches. Putin is a practicing Christian..well... Ok.
The list goes on and on. Thank you for enlightening me and my family - with insight and confidence, as always!
I'll go re-read 'Gulag Archipelago' once again while me and my family are hiding in the basement from those orthodox-Christian-culture&identity-crisis cruise missiles they are launching at Odesa the Caspian Sea port city. Maybe it will comfort me poor Ukrainian rube and remind me of importance of historic ties with those who are shelling us right now.
and why can't this man be an ordinary charlatan, or at the mercy of some Putin fund? and then it is an ordinary propagandist, like Kiselyov and Skabeeva
Also Sołżenicyl was Russian radical imperialist, so I don't think that it is hard to say from whom Peterson gained this notion of Russia as Christian empire that should be applauded.
@@prkp7248 Oddly enough in Volume 3 of the Gulag Archipelago, the hard line nationalist, Solzhenitsyn, is actually sympathetic to Ukrainian aspirations.
It was written when Solzhenytsyn was in his prime as a writer and when memories of him being in a camp were still vivid. Toward the end of hus life Solzhenytsyn became a hard-line Russian imperialist who denied Ukraine's right for independence
He didn't say you're neighbouring Caspian sea
Something to ponder.!
This is one of the issues I adamantly disagree with Peterson on, or as so far as I can understand his argument or line of thinking. As much as he uses Eastern Europe as part of his basis of absolute resistance to communism, he seems perfectly willing to sacrifice all of Eastern Europe to a modern version of the communist Russian state in fear of nuclear war; while simultaneously holding the position that he fears rule of of communist principles ruling in his home country and other Western democracies and such must be resisted no matter his own personal sacrifice before the shifting laws.
I have enough respect for Dr Peterson that I’m willing to accept I may not perfectly understand his argument, but I’m pretty sure he’s simply being hypocritical here. Conservatives have utterly confused me with their rapid pivot towards friendly Russian relations as the expense of our traditional European allies, and the traditional goal of Russian containment.
Edit: ahhh, maybe this is the point; “ we can’t defeat Russia in any real sense”. No sir, you are 100% correct. You should watch more Perun. We can’t defeat Russia because our strategic goals are entirely misaligned. Ukraine will be sacrificed to the monster on behalf of the world, and it is yet to be seen if the West will rebuild it, or if we will let it stand a wasteland. The point is “we do not negotiate with terrorists”. You can’t let a nuclear power take anything it wants by force. Once you do, you set the precedent that they (and others who will develop nuclear weapons for the same reason) can now do anything they want, because you can’t challenge them on their actions. We will take the world to the brink again, and that’s likely for the best. Worst thing that can happen is a total reset. You believe in God, Dr Peterson. It must be his plan. He’s wiped the world a few times already, if memory serves.
I agree with your statement but here's the thing mr jordan peterson is trying to make the case between culture and socialism he is portraying the west who are increasingly accepting Socialist ideals and pushing those ideals on other countries such as Iran and India he is portraying Russia as a country which wants to protect their culture and do not want to be preached by western countries which they do I see nothing wrong with this statement but this does justify war or expansion what putin did is wrong and will be punished by karma and yes there should be an example made out of this war to any nuclear power.
But here the issue the west is wasting money on a war which it knows will not end well it's leaders are lying to its people about their own money and how it's being spent those leaders are the ones benefiting from this war as many of them have investments in weapons companies not only that ukraine is not a beacon of democracy matter of fact it Is as corruption as Russia giving it money will only result in Ukrainian oligarchs to benefit while the people give blood the west should focus on negotiations instead of focusing on increasing the fire
Edit I am not a leftist or a communist I just think commie flags look noice um thanks for your time ad ciao
How could Ukraine discover petroleum resources near the Caspian Sea in 2010? They are on the Black Sea.
hahaha
He also mixes up East and West a few times. Painful to listen to.
@@claudespiese3575 assumed due to his IQ that I was somehow wrong when I heard him mix them up
I think you'll find this is in reference to a JV with Azerbaijan to transport Caspian sea oil via ukraine. The exploration is likely a partnership between the 2 nations. Mixing east and west up a few times in a 50 minute monologue? I reckon I'd fuck up more than that
It was discovered in the Poltava region in Eastern Ukraine. Nowhere near the Caspian but people from the N American continent have never been strong on geography!
In 2019 elections Zelenskyi lost only 5 regions in the first round (3 in the West and 2 in the East) from total of 24 regions (this number doesn’t include occupied Crimea) and only 1 region (in the West) in the second round. And he also is from Russian-speaking city. So the theory that “he is supported only by Ukrainian-speaking regions” is utter nonsense. He was and he is supported by the most of the people in whole country
Do you think that the people in the eastern region of the country support Zelenski? You know, the people that his military has been waging war against for nearly 8 years? Something like 14,000 resulting deaths during that time as reported by the United Nations. I'm not so sure those Ukrainians like Zelenski very much.
He got supported because his slogan was about stopping the civil war in Eastern territories of Ukraine that lasted for 5 years at that time. He said that he will talk to Putin and they will find a solution. After 3 long years of his presidency we can say that he never spoke with Putin one by one publicly (maybe he did privately, who knows). The most recent thing that I remember was the time when he was laughing when Putin was talking about the conflict (it was before the war in Minsk, I suppose).
That's not real. First, much of the Donbas and Crimea (which made up a significant portion of the East) were not part of the elections. Imagine an American election without NY and half of California. Second, the political parties that the east preferred were demonized and suppressed. Even then, the opposition party with the most seats was pro-Russian. Since then 15 political parties are banned in Ukraine (including that opposition party). Local press in the east is banned. Language rights have been rescinded. Free speech is curtailed. You can go to jail if you say the wrong thing online - the SBU is conducting nightly raids. This is not democracy. It's a sham and a flimsy one at that.
@@daniiarzhaguparov1390 he did met once at the beginning of presidency, and probably insulted Putin by daring to negotiate something and not giving all away. And he for months now tell how he is open for discussion - but somehow so many people fail to understand that it is Putin who not talks and who plays with wars, they choose to blame victim because it is so "great"
@@volodyadykun6490 so you’re saying that Zelensky got elected to stop the war and over 3 years of presidency he met Putin only once? And he is open for discussion now, after the war started? It’s better to know nothing than this fact about Zelensky’s diplomacy.
Thank you so much!!!
your convictions inspirational
North-West and North-East got mixed up, it's the other way around, Russian speakers live in the East, Ukranian speakers in the West.
Always convenient to date the beginning of Russia’s involvement in WW2 to 1941, and not 1939.
or WWI - 1910
and not many know that USSR was supplying germany up to 1941 and that Stalin was actually preparing assault on germany and what about Finland war? And what about internal gulags and famine that mr. Jordan himself talked about. Maybe Biden and Trudeau are bad people but give Putin everything he wants? Insane. Maybe putin is not stalin or hitler, but he is still very brutal . Blowing up his own people to secure power and starting Chechen war. List goes on and on and on. I believe Mr. Jordan is very smart person but somehow got corrupted, maybe relatives, maybe trip to russia..
So let's make it clear for everyone: Russia had a pact with Hitler in 1939 (Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact) and they both invaded Poland in September 1939 AS ALLIES.
@@nameq Yes - but none of those powers actually JOINED Germany in their initial attacks. We called the Molotov-Von Ribbentrop Treaty a “non-aggression pact,” but we all know it was an active military alliance.
And Stalin pressured Hitler to make the alliance official. Stalin wanted to join the Axis powers.
@@ivanlozowy When a liar is disappointed. You know you've done well.
brilliant. as usual.
XXX
I would love to hear your comments. it helps me a lot. You are a leader, a great inspiration that I have ever met
I read that, after the fall of the USSR, Russia signed an agreement to respect Ukraine's borders, in exchange for Ukraine sending to Russia the nuclear missiles stationed on Ukrainian soil. So it appears that Russia violated an international treaty in force for 30 years. Nobody seems to mention this.
They broke 3 treaties when they invaded Ukraine.
Perhaps if CIA had not engineered the coup and natos aggressive expansion and us state department hand picking of ukranian leadership as per leaked call ...
Yes. This was called Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances and Russia broke it just as it constantly breaks all other agreements it made with Ukraine (like Minsk Agreement for instance).
That is why one more point why it is nonsense to negotiate or sign anything with Russia, even though "negotiation" sounds like something good people do. We tried. It didn't work.
They will simply continue the invasion the next day after it.
Yes, since an international treaty violation should result in war with everyone else who took a part in the treaty. Like US as far as I know.
Like Peterson said here, they got nukes. US will not cause a global nuclear war because of "some Ukraine" (that sounds horrible as I write it, ugh). That's also why he said that they do not care about Ukraine.
So ignoring the elephant in the room is the best choice . Politics are heartbreaking.
This all ignores that NATO and Ukraine broke all the treaties first.
Lol
Never thought dr.Peterson is so naive
He completley misunderstands situation
He is overwhelmed with russian propaganda and his personal pleasant attitude to russian “culture”
and you understand situation fully? Enlighten us. lol.
@@games4us132 i mean i’m just live in this environment, thats why from Petersons speech i understand he is totally deluded about situation. Listen, you can just read comments of eastern europeans here. Peterson is definitely familiar with situation, but he is not deeply into it. It’s just like myself is superficially familiar with candian history and problems, so its ok for the foreigners . Peterson just sees all this from outer perspective. He even makes a lot of geographical and statistical mistakes, which are markers of his superficial knowledge about Ukraine and russia.
@@orest7230 and it is possible that Putin's blood money went to some charity account of the disrespected Peterson, the Kremlin corrupts everyone and everywhere, Germany, France, Italy...
Spoken like a true Neville Chamberlain of our time.
I feel like chamberlain got a bad rep, he was crucial in preparing the UK for the war and was more than an apeaser
@@DutchTDK chamberlain shouldn’t of declared war on Germany tho
He should have made peace
My god dude I’ve been like basically yelling to the world everyone I talk is so blind and blissfully unaware walking around like nothing is happening it’s frustrating
In 1938, after Munich conference at which the West agreed Hitler to take Czechoslovakia, British Prime Minister Neville Chamberlain returned to London and said to the people:
“My good friends, this is the second time there has come back from Germany to Downing Street peace with honour. I believe it is peace for our time.”
But Winston Churchill replied to him:
“Britain had the choice between war and shame. She choose shame. She will get the war too.”
It is said that history repeats itself. Please, let us not repeat this situation again.
Well said XD. Though I fear it will be repeated.
Yes, opportunities for diplomacy really exist....sometimes. Imagining that you are taking advantage of such an opportunity when you are dealing with an implacable opponent is a classic mistake in diplomacy.
there is nothing similar in the two situations. True Britons want no part in this grotesque war.
History repeats itself, but I wouldn't say that Ukraine was sold to Russia as Czechoslovakia had been to Germany.
Do u realize that back in Churchill's time english were still a nation with balls and faith and knowledge while now its more like LGBTQ cripple in retirement? When i read British media i always feel shocked by the amount of idiots and clowns rulling u lads.
12:47 again, restating my previous point, the people of the central and eastern Europe want that expansion, we want to be a part of governments that are accountable to their citizens. And as with the Ukrainian example, neutrality does not work. I'd love for my country of Poland to form an alliance of the central nations, that would be independent of the rotten influence of the west and the barbaric influence of the east, but as of now it is impossible. And out of the 2, we would all rather be forced to fly a rainbow flag next to our national flag once a year, than to be forced to fly a Russian one year round.
Well said!
+1 The great comment
The Baltic-Black Sea Union is the way to go.
This comment needs to go UP UP UP.
as a Ukrainian I totally agree with this comment. This must be top voted comment. But, I don't understand why you choose exactly this timestamp
Would aurhor unerstand if European counries would re imperia Africa? All the rest of Impires collapesd in WW I except Russian Empire partially, but gained nearly all back in WW II. Only Finland has escaped Russian Empire. Would Author understand Russians returing back Finnish?
Very clearly put!!!
Professor Peterson, I am following you for a while as I endorsed your moral approach towards morality which I must admit, had some positive impact on my outlook on certain aspects of my life. I normally agree with most of your views on many subjects however, this video is a whirlpool of value contradictions when compare it to your previous lectures. Your representation of the Ukraine war is very complex yet very narrow-minded which favours audience that hold luxury of living on the other side of hemisphere. You made some valid points however in overall, your initial two sided representation of the conflict tilts towards absurdism of biased, hermeticly stanced, over-politicised and morally absent statements which are unlike you. Yes, it seems to be a conflict that has become West vs East and became a global problem but a Civil War?. As an Eastern European, I am deeply dismayed by your portrayal of not only Ukraine but whole Eastern Europe which mainly holds conservative, free nation preserverance stance which are far from "Woke” ideology which is one of your arguments for Russia's agression. Yet again, Eastern democracy goals has to face atrocities of Russian dominance.
Your opinion seems to be very collective based, not factual and landing towards misinterpreting Russian’s desires and their objectives."Moral stance of Put ins against Woke West" In my opinion it's more realistic to say that Putin is more than happy that West soaked the ideologies that are surely dividing and weakening the them from inside. Why would he oppose that militarywise? Even rotten West understood the dangers and potential outcomes therefore agreed upon some actions which indeed, can be inconsistent because this war is hard to forecast. In addition to that, I agree West could do more before the war and they were absent when needed and they share some faults as well. What stroke me is your shallow collective based assessment ignoring the sovereignty of individuals which suffers the most and which you have totally ignored. “Who cares about Ukraine?” Well, whole eastern Europe which population is not far away from USA and x6 greater than Canada’s and which value healthier version of western democracy. Not every democratic country is consumed by culture war yet. Whole block is shaking before possible outcomes of this war and Russia’s imperial outbursts and this time, your historical and philosophical arguments are out of touch from the reality that occured. This video is unfortunate because its biased intention even though both sides of conflict were discussed. It has totally confused people especially your followers from outside of North America.
In the past, you have reminded and injected moral values and positive outlook on life despite the life difficulties. This video somehow, shakes the fundaments of what you have built in the last few years in my opinion. I might be trashed in the comments although my intention is not to undermine or challenge your beliefs. For the first time, I am very confused with your arguments, and I feel conflicted in my head but I know one thing. No matter what the history is, list of faults from both sides, animosities between different parties, If you in favour of Zelensky or not, no matter how deeply we'll dismantle the intepths of possible causes, there is no argument that can beat the ultimate fact that Russia decided to roll over Ukraine with its warmachine to erase a counry which holds the same moral and sovereignty values as you, in a invasion scale compareable to 1st or 2nd World War.
In addition to all of that, I have an opinion about new format of your videos. In the old lectures and interviews, your geniuity, truthfulness and moral guidenances where pouring from the screen in very spontainous manner which stroke me positively and many other people and helped you to build a solid follower base "I'm one of them and intend to be despite this video". People were hungry for honesty and moral directions in which they can improve their lifes. The new format of videos looks visually more professional but on the other hand more intentional, cold-blooded and over-politicised. I hope this format won't divide your fan base and despite the fact It's hard to swallow the content of this video, I'm looking forward for the upcoming ones.
Whatever you just typed now, it's an opinion, not a fact. And whatever i just typed now it's opinion and fact.
I fully support your position. I am sad JP has fallen victim to russia’s influence operation.
Bravo ! Excellent and well articulated, Mr. Peterson in one of the few occasions has a completely wrong outcome. And additionally expressed Russian propaganda talking points. Either he doesn't value what democratic East Europe brings to the table or doesn't fully understand. Lest not forget autocrats negotiate differently, we have to strike a balance of signaling strength yet not surrounding.
It is messy. The whole thing is really, really messy.
Thank you.
Also, he was wrong on Zelensky. The majority of his voters were from Eastern Southern Ukraine, predominantly Russian speaking region while people in Western Ukraine supported former president Poroshenko.
Zelensky was viewed as more Russia neutral.
"The majority of his voters were from Eastern Southern Ukraine"
The exact opposite was true. Look at the voting map
@@vxhwpwpekfjfldod3761 well 75% of voters in Ukraine voted Zelenskyi. He was indeed russia neutral and thought he can stop ATO by saying dont shoot or what, other were sceptical about this and voted Poroshenko to farther invest in Ukrainian indentity (3 words of Poroshenko`s campain are "Language, Relidion, Army").
@@morserte That was after Poroshenko won in 2014 and got overthrown by the US. It's like saying Biden got more votes than Obama. Everyone knows it's a lie
@@vxhwpwpekfjfldod3761 oh, i didnt notice foil cap, sorry sir. Have a great day.
@@vxhwpwpekfjfldod3761 have you taken a look at that map? I mean was a secretary of one poling station in Eastern Ukraine, I definitely know results better than a silly bot. Moreover, I've also taken a look at the voting map in 2019. And yes, western Ukraine was more tend to elect the former president, while the Central and Eastern parts preferred Zelensky
"Zelenskiy is supported by Ukrainian speakers only" that is an absolute nonsense. Zel is supported by both. That is an absolute fact. For those who still believe in on-language Ukrainian state: he is a Jewish guy with Russian as his mother tongue now leading the state to victory.
He is supported by both now, but ironically he used to be more popular among Russian-speaking Ukrainians and that was who voted for him in the first place. Some of the Ukrainian speakers were actually pissed at his attempts to appease everyone and be as neutral as possible in certain questions, including those concerning the language. I think many actually worried he'd turn out to be pro-Russian and won't do anything about the situation in Donbass. It's truly ironic that now he's painted as this radical nationalist by Russian and pro-Russian propaganda, and that he actually starts forgetting Russian words. I suspect you know all of this though, it's more for others.
@@sweatyarmpits5200 100%
You seriously believe that? He was hated by hardcore "Ukraine above all" crowd before the war. He is still hated by anyone who voted him into office hoping he will do as he promised to end the war in Donbas. Now he's riding the wave of shit right into oblivion, since in any case he will be dismissed at the first opportunity. He can only pray to get out of it alive
The concept of Theosis is so fascinating.
At the end, everything will be transformed. The entire Cosmos itself.
So sad to be in complete disagreement with this whole speech of Mr. Peterson, for the first time...at least concerning who are the true instigators of this war.
why do you disagree? I mean, where did you get the facts and arguments you use to disagree? Media and social influencers? Personal experience being in Ukraine? Those are truly not good sources, as media and social media will say anything to make more clicks, and suffering caused by war will make Ukraine people (normally) subjective (and I understand, because I went trough same war 20 years ago, literary the same, only this time NATO was attacking us, as part of our country decided to separate, and we, as nation, said no, NATO said "they have a right to choose" and attacked when we said no.
The sad truth, just like today in this war, in my war it was just political influence and profit - NATO didn;t care about people, they wanted a military base on our teritory, we said "no", they foudn a way for it to happen - and today, they have military on that part of land that separate dby force - totally what happened and is happening in Ukraine. One could say, double standards, but it is more political play - say and do not what is right, but what makes more political influence and profit
Btw, Jordan being so much smarter, educated and experienced then you (and me:), shouldn;t you gime more thought to hat he said - and ask questions, if you don;t understand, not dismissing?
@@ivanangeli You're a lying serbian nationalist. NATO didn't bomb serbia to put bases (just look at a map, they didn't need it) or to make Kosovo independent (Spain bombed Serbia 1st and still didn't recognize Kosovo as an independent country). Serbia was trying to expell albanians and when the bombing started it accelerated the proces with more killings and destruction. WHy don't you ask yourself why ALL countries who could voted to separate from Belgrade as soon as they got the opportunity to? Maybe the problem is with the totalitarian, aggressive mindset of Serbia.
So you think giving sex changes to children is not a society gone out of its mind. You are in which case a degenerate
Peterson's analysis looks more like a Lavrov speech,
Indeed, he has let us all down this time. I feel especially bad for all the courageous Ukrainians who are defending our values of freedom and democracy for us with their lives. Peterson has always been quite useless when it comes geopolitical issues in general and in this case he has been totally lost to Russian propaganda, reducing himself to being a useful idiot for Putler and his ZZZombie bots.
If they can make you believe absurdities, they can make you commit atrocities.
If you spout rhetoric, you are a puppet.
@Stiff Upper Lip or like Russia that bombed itself for 8 years:-D
Keep fighting and don't give in to their warped way of thinking!
@Stiff Upper Lip Yeah I bet you or your friend was there and saw everything.
@Stiff Upper Lip Show me where did Russians touch you.
With all due respect Dr Peterson, geopolitics is not your area of expertise. You made a few factual mistakes (surprisingly). You're a clinician psychologist....so please, keep doing what you do best.
Edit: Debating the subject with Scott Ritter or Col. MacGregor would definitely be interesting :-)
Not to mention quite eye-opening, and perhaps humbling to dr Peterson himself. :) Plus, his data on the Russian economy are quite obsolete.
Well link your insightful video if you have something better to say. Which I doubt you will
Wouldn't debating with someone NOT kowtowing the Kremlin line be more interesting? Since when has debate become preaching to the choir of the like minded ?
@@petr7694 And since when has not subscribing to the point of view presented here become kowtowing to the Kremlin?
@@kosecuvaiboggacuva7522 What are you trying to say?
Awesome speaker🙏