Alright doug I have only justwatch this video and it is absolutely brilliant it gives you a great understanding on how you build them and test them just loved it keep well.dan 🎸
Thanks Dan. The aim of the video was to illustrate that Tri-Sonic style pickups with traditional bobbinless tied coils can be wound to similar specifications to those on Brian May's Red Special without expensive or specialist pickup winding equipment so I'm pleased that you found it interesting and insightful. 👍🏻😀
I'm upgrading my BMG RS with Armstrong trisonics. Would it serve me to pot the neck and bridge pickups with epoxy, and remove the neck backplate, as described here? If so, is it standard epoxy resin glue that is applied, such as araldite?
Brian used standard two part epoxy resin but latterly, Ade Turner used black electronics encapsulant, also epoxy based to pot the neck pickup. Standard specification Tri-Sonic pickups will still sound authentic; my understanding is that the BM modifications will help access all the Red Special tonal variations. I would try your unmodified Kent Armstrong Tri-Sonics and see if you are satisfied with them before attempting any modifications which require disassembly. Early 1960s Tri-Sonics might have been more susceptible to noise and microphonic feedback than modern ones.
The most useful video I've seen on the topic of burns tri-sonic pickups, thank you so much for your help! There are only a couple of questions left. About epoxy resin, where can I get it and can I find modern analogues for it? I searched the entire Internet, but apart from the epoxy glue from araldit, I found nothing. I've heard that someone uses paraffin wax (for example, ferrari guitars), but in the end it's hard to say that it's him because of his transparency. The paraffin after solidification becomes mostly white, but does not remain transparent in any way (I may be mistaken and not understand this topic, I apologize) Thanks in advance for the answer!
Many two-part epoxy resin formulations, including the same type Brian used are readily available from major retailers such as Amazon. Araldite is a traditional brand who manufactures epoxy resin: www.go-araldite.com/en Any maker of a set of replica Burns Tri-Sonic pickups with the modifications Brian carried out should be potting the neck pickup coil with epoxy resin and wax potting the middle and bridge pickups to prevent rattling and reduce microphonic feedback. Read my article here: dsgb.net/faqs/trisonics/
@@dsgb Unfortunately, I did not find any information on your website about filling the coils of the bridge and medium pickup with wax. Do I need to fill only the coil with wax, then insert it into the case, or do I need to boil the pickup itself completely in wax? How long exactly should they be boiled in wax? In addition, it says on your website that Brian poured araldite not only on the neck, but also on the bridge pickup. Is it necessary to fill a bridge pickup with araldite, or is it necessary to fill only a neck one? What exactly do the creators of pickup replicas do today? I will be very grateful for the reply :)
If you're seeking detailed information on replicating Brian May specification Red Special pickups, it is best to ask people who make them commercially, not a hobbyist who has wound one or two coils to make a TH-cam video. Some of these people have worked out what to do for themselves through extensive research and development effort. I recommend that approach. You can learn a lot by making and testing coils on a DIY basis. When you have discovered all the required information for yourself, all Brian May enthusiasts would be very interested to learn all about it. 👍🏻😀
@@dsgb I'm sorry to bother you again, but if it's not difficult for you, could you name the thickness of the material that the steel baseplate is made of? Does the width of the material matter?
Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge. I think I missed if you mentioned the DC resistance and inductance of the BHK pickups? I wonder how similar they are to the Burns pickups, and ultimately what difference in sound they might have.
I didn't measure the pickups on this video, only my home made coil. The standard retail sets made by BHK do not have the Brian May modifications or have the specific DC resistance and inductance values that Adeson "original BM" pickups do. This makes the distinctive N+M out of phase 'scream' heard in Bohemian Rhapsody difficult to achieve. The tones from the other combinations are close to, but less distinctively Queen in my opinion. One of the BHK Tri-Sonic bridge pickups I tested coincidentally has a similar DC resistance and inductance to an Adeson "original BM" neck pickup. dsgb.net/faqs/trisonics/ Look out for a video later this year in which I will fully characterise several different types of pickup (PAF humbucker, Strat single coil, mini Tri-Sonic, BM Tri-Sonic) across the entire 10 Hz to 30 kHz audio spectrum using a PicoScope PC driven oscilloscope and exciter coil setup.
So when he puts bridge and center in series in phase , one of the magnets is reversed . So it sounds different than 2 single coils in series in phase with both magnets in the same polarity?
Yes. They will act as a hum-cancelling/humbucking pair in this configuration but Tri-Sonic pickups sound different to Strat-style single coil pickups anyway. The output is considered to be between single coils and humbuckers.
@@dsgb hmmmm, I modified the wiring of my strat to have available middle + bridge in series , and sounds too thick , it cancels the hum , but even using a replica of Brian's treble booster sounds thicker than a regular humbucker through my treble booster. Anyway , I've seen you put trisonics and Brian's wiring on a strat , how does that work? sounds reasonably close a red special ?
The Tri-Sonic pickups on my Fender Stratocaster worked well. There are several videos on my channel where it is demonstrated so you can judge for yourself. In the shorter one, Shawn Leaver plays an excerpt of Brighton Rock through his Dave Petersen modified Vox AC30. A Brian May loaded Strat pickguard on a Mexican Strat is a good entry point to BM tones for regular guitar players who don't want to buy and/or adapt to a Red Special. They are a bit quirky.
I know this is meant to be a replica of an original Burns Trisonic, but I'm thinking of how it would be easier to secure the windings with the cotton thread. I'm thinking it might be easier to secure the ends of the thread together, not by knotting them, but by bringing the two ends together that have been dipped in CA glue. Come to think of it, would it not be a simple thing to do to just flood (carefully) the entire winding with thin CA glue???? In order to pot it? Or would the resultant catalysation heat (without activator of course) cause issues?
There are numerous valid methods for securing the wound coil and it's certainly worth trying your suggestion. The vintage coil I show looks like it has been immobilised using a similar method, possibly with lacquer due to its age, not a modern low viscosity cyanoacrylate adhesive. My aim in this video and several others was to discuss the characteristics of the item(s) I'm presenting then provide some 'bonus content' where I attempt to reproduce the item (pickups, treble booster, guitar components, etc.) I don't always aim to replicate items exactly or authentically because this philosophy is very labour intensive and I try to pitch my videos at general audiences, not knowledgeable Brian May enthusiasts. 👍🏻😀
I loved this video i have sawn maybe towsends of guitar macking videos and maybe a hundred about pickups but this one THIS IS A MOVIE A DOCUMENTARY OSCAR WINING HANDS DOWN. AMAZING !!!! SR. MY RESPECTS I MADE A VERY AFORABLE WINDING MACHINE AND MAYBE ONE DAY I UPLOAD THE VIDEO BUT NOW I HAVE TO PRESENTED LIKE THIS 🤣 you know just for love of art 🧐🧐
Thank you so much, I'm pleased that you found this video useful. You're correct in that I explored making a Tri-Sonic pickup primarily out of curiosity and to offer some insights into how you can wind satisfactory bobbinless single coil pickups yourself without a significant investment in tools and equipment. 💜😀🙏🏻
You can use any type of magnet you want; but it will affect the output. However, the magnets in Tri-Sonic pickups are vintage ferrite ceramic similar to Alnico 2.
I assume by "special" that you mean a "BMG Special"? The two digits at the start are the year of manufacture, the remainder an incremental build number.
Yes, hand-winding is possible. You will have to experiment by making and testing some prototype coils in the range 5,000-5,500 turns. dsgb.net/faqs/trisonics/
Hi!! As a Brian May fan, and watching your work for a long time, all I have to say is thank you very much and congrats for your work!! Now that I'm getting into modd adventures, my question is... Where can I get those 2 piece magnets. My pickups have only 1 bar magnet, but it's risky and difficult to cut the into 2 pieces. Thank you!
Hi. Thank you for the kind comments. 🙏🏻💜 You can buy the C1/Y10T grade ceramic ferrite bar magnets from Axes R Us in the U.K. www.axesrus.co.uk/TRIBARMAGNET-p/trimagbar.htm It might be possible to source them in other territories but I'm based in the U.K. and haven't looked to see if they are available elsewhere.
@@dsgb ...by the way, I have a personal doubt, and would like you to clear: do you think there is any repercussion on the sound between bobbinless coils and plastic bobbins? Kind regards...
A plastic bobbin will have negligible measurable impact on the electromagnetic characteristics of the coil and magnet assembly (all other factors being equal, especially coil shape/physical form) and thus no detectable change in tone, especially when the signal is overdriven by a treble booster through loud amplifiers. The coil will be held slightly further away from the magnet surface on a bobbin and thus might see a marginally smaller magnetic field strength but this shouldn't affect tone.
@@dsgb Ok, it's clear for me now. I guessed the plastic has no influence over the magnetic field and thus on the sound, but I wanted to read your opinion, as a specialist on theses devices. Now it's clearer for me. Thank you very much!! You're very helpful and kind
I think they were on everything except for the Hank Marvin model back in the '60s. As I understand it, the pickups were tailored to suit the different models, though, so you couldn't necessarily use just any Trisonic and get the same pickup Brian May has.
It isn't necessary to make a bobbinless Tri-Sonic pickup; this is just how they were traditionally made but as you can see in the video, the modern, volume manufactured BHK variants have a plastic bobbin. Making a traditional bobbinless, tape bound and tied off coil obviously increases the manufacturing complexity.
Hey Doug, which mounting screws are used on the Burns Trisonic pickups? I got some Brian May Guitar pickups, however the mounting screws I currently have on my guitar are too big for them. Thanks!
I can't give definitive advice because you haven't stated any key dimensions such as the hole size in the mounting tabs on your specific set of pickups or even what your guitar is. 🤷🏻♂️
@@dsgb my guitar is a strat (dont worry, i modded it to fit normal sized Tri-Sonic pickups), and my pickups have the same hole size as regular Burns Tri-sonics. Im not sure what are the dimensions of both mounting holes though, all i know is that they are the same. I am pretty sure they are the same (the mounting screw type) as the one in most Red Special replicas.
I recommend buying an assortment of different size screws and seeing which ones fit best. I don't know in which territory you live but there are numerous sellers of small pack sizes of all common sizes of wood and machine screws on U.K. eBay. I have a tool chest drawer full of small bags of primarily stainless steel fasteners in common metric and imperial sizes left over from my projects. I'm afraid that I can't help with only non-specific statements like "regular Burns Tri-Sonics" and "most Red Special replicas".
Im a 14 year old boy that is building my own red special. I have limited money and I can't find where I can buy burns tri sonic pickups dose anyone know where I can buy them an they ship it to Sweden
If I recall correctly when I bought my Burns Mini Tri-Sonics and, subsequently, Burns vintage Tri-Sonics approximately ten years ago, there was no e-commerce interface so I had to send Burns London an e-mail to initiate the transaction.
While the construction of lipstick pickups is similar to Tri-Sonic pickups, a Red Special requires Tri-Sonic pickups and a treble booster to achieve the distinctive Brian May tones.
![[LIVE] : ONE ลุมพินี 79 | คู่เอก "ก้องชัย vs อาเมียร์"](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/WfPSA1A0NHc/mqdefault.jpg)
Alright doug I have only justwatch this video and it is absolutely brilliant it gives you a great understanding on how you build them and test them just loved it keep well.dan 🎸
Thanks Dan. The aim of the video was to illustrate that Tri-Sonic style pickups with traditional bobbinless tied coils can be wound to similar specifications to those on Brian May's Red Special without expensive or specialist pickup winding equipment so I'm pleased that you found it interesting and insightful. 👍🏻😀
Una pregunta el cable rojo y negro en que partes lo aderiste no entiendo eso?
Los cables se unen a cada extremo del cable de cobre delgado en la bobina.
I'm upgrading my BMG RS with Armstrong trisonics.
Would it serve me to pot the neck and bridge pickups with epoxy, and remove the neck backplate, as described here?
If so, is it standard epoxy resin glue that is applied, such as araldite?
Brian used standard two part epoxy resin but latterly, Ade Turner used black electronics encapsulant, also epoxy based to pot the neck pickup. Standard specification Tri-Sonic pickups will still sound authentic; my understanding is that the BM modifications will help access all the Red Special tonal variations. I would try your unmodified Kent Armstrong Tri-Sonics and see if you are satisfied with them before attempting any modifications which require disassembly. Early 1960s Tri-Sonics might have been more susceptible to noise and microphonic feedback than modern ones.
Ya no , ya entendí como era gracias me sirvió mucho todo esto ahora ya puedo hacer mi propia pickup
Buena suerte haciendo sus propias pastillas. Espero que funcionen bien. 👍🏻😀
The most useful video I've seen on the topic of burns tri-sonic pickups, thank you so much for your help!
There are only a couple of questions left. About epoxy resin, where can I get it and can I find modern analogues for it? I searched the entire Internet, but apart from the epoxy glue from araldit, I found nothing. I've heard that someone uses paraffin wax (for example, ferrari guitars), but in the end it's hard to say that it's him because of his transparency. The paraffin after solidification becomes mostly white, but does not remain transparent in any way (I may be mistaken and not understand this topic, I apologize)
Thanks in advance for the answer!
Many two-part epoxy resin formulations, including the same type Brian used are readily available from major retailers such as Amazon. Araldite is a traditional brand who manufactures epoxy resin:
www.go-araldite.com/en
Any maker of a set of replica Burns Tri-Sonic pickups with the modifications Brian carried out should be potting the neck pickup coil with epoxy resin and wax potting the middle and bridge pickups to prevent rattling and reduce microphonic feedback. Read my article here:
dsgb.net/faqs/trisonics/
@@dsgb Unfortunately, I did not find any information on your website about filling the coils of the bridge and medium pickup with wax. Do I need to fill only the coil with wax, then insert it into the case, or do I need to boil the pickup itself completely in wax? How long exactly should they be boiled in wax?
In addition, it says on your website that Brian poured araldite not only on the neck, but also on the bridge pickup. Is it necessary to fill a bridge pickup with araldite, or is it necessary to fill only a neck one? What exactly do the creators of pickup replicas do today?
I will be very grateful for the reply :)
If you're seeking detailed information on replicating Brian May specification Red Special pickups, it is best to ask people who make them commercially, not a hobbyist who has wound one or two coils to make a TH-cam video.
Some of these people have worked out what to do for themselves through extensive research and development effort. I recommend that approach. You can learn a lot by making and testing coils on a DIY basis. When you have discovered all the required information for yourself, all Brian May enthusiasts would be very interested to learn all about it. 👍🏻😀
@@dsgb Thank you very much, good luck in the development of the channel! 💪
@@dsgb I'm sorry to bother you again, but if it's not difficult for you, could you name the thickness of the material that the steel baseplate is made of? Does the width of the material matter?
Thanks so much for sharing your knowledge. I think I missed if you mentioned the DC resistance and inductance of the BHK pickups? I wonder how similar they are to the Burns pickups, and ultimately what difference in sound they might have.
I didn't measure the pickups on this video, only my home made coil. The standard retail sets made by BHK do not have the Brian May modifications or have the specific DC resistance and inductance values that Adeson "original BM" pickups do. This makes the distinctive N+M out of phase 'scream' heard in Bohemian Rhapsody difficult to achieve. The tones from the other combinations are close to, but less distinctively Queen in my opinion.
One of the BHK Tri-Sonic bridge pickups I tested coincidentally has a similar DC resistance and inductance to an Adeson "original BM" neck pickup.
dsgb.net/faqs/trisonics/
Look out for a video later this year in which I will fully characterise several different types of pickup (PAF humbucker, Strat single coil, mini Tri-Sonic, BM Tri-Sonic) across the entire 10 Hz to 30 kHz audio spectrum using a PicoScope PC driven oscilloscope and exciter coil setup.
@@dsgb Thanks for the reply and the info. Very interesting indeed!
So when he puts bridge and center in series in phase , one of the magnets is reversed . So it sounds different than 2 single coils in series in phase with both magnets in the same polarity?
Yes. They will act as a hum-cancelling/humbucking pair in this configuration but Tri-Sonic pickups sound different to Strat-style single coil pickups anyway. The output is considered to be between single coils and humbuckers.
@@dsgb hmmmm, I modified the wiring of my strat to have available middle + bridge in series , and sounds too thick , it cancels the hum , but even using a replica of Brian's treble booster sounds thicker than a regular humbucker through my treble booster.
Anyway , I've seen you put trisonics and Brian's wiring on a strat , how does that work? sounds reasonably close a red special ?
The Tri-Sonic pickups on my Fender Stratocaster worked well. There are several videos on my channel where it is demonstrated so you can judge for yourself. In the shorter one, Shawn Leaver plays an excerpt of Brighton Rock through his Dave Petersen modified Vox AC30. A Brian May loaded Strat pickguard on a Mexican Strat is a good entry point to BM tones for regular guitar players who don't want to buy and/or adapt to a Red Special. They are a bit quirky.
@@dsgb I think I just need to put my hands on a Red Special and see for myself. Thank you !
I know this is meant to be a replica of an original Burns Trisonic, but I'm thinking of how it would be easier to secure the windings with the cotton thread. I'm thinking it might be easier to secure the ends of the thread together, not by knotting them, but by bringing the two ends together that have been dipped in CA glue. Come to think of it, would it not be a simple thing to do to just flood (carefully) the entire winding with thin CA glue???? In order to pot it? Or would the resultant catalysation heat (without activator of course) cause issues?
There are numerous valid methods for securing the wound coil and it's certainly worth trying your suggestion. The vintage coil I show looks like it has been immobilised using a similar method, possibly with lacquer due to its age, not a modern low viscosity cyanoacrylate adhesive.
My aim in this video and several others was to discuss the characteristics of the item(s) I'm presenting then provide some 'bonus content' where I attempt to reproduce the item (pickups, treble booster, guitar components, etc.)
I don't always aim to replicate items exactly or authentically because this philosophy is very labour intensive and I try to pitch my videos at general audiences, not knowledgeable Brian May enthusiasts. 👍🏻😀
Very informative and interesting! So are Brian’s pick ups the smaller pot magnet version that he has modified?
www.theredspecial.com/2019/01/tri-sonic-history-by-adrian-turner/
I loved this video i have sawn maybe towsends of guitar macking videos and maybe a hundred about pickups but this one THIS IS A MOVIE A DOCUMENTARY OSCAR WINING HANDS DOWN. AMAZING !!!! SR. MY RESPECTS
I MADE A VERY AFORABLE WINDING MACHINE AND MAYBE ONE DAY I UPLOAD THE VIDEO BUT NOW I HAVE TO PRESENTED LIKE THIS 🤣 you know just for love of art 🧐🧐
Thank you so much, I'm pleased that you found this video useful. You're correct in that I explored making a Tri-Sonic pickup primarily out of curiosity and to offer some insights into how you can wind satisfactory bobbinless single coil pickups yourself without a significant investment in tools and equipment. 💜😀🙏🏻
This is fascinating. Like a single coil ceramic blade pickup. A p90 without steel poles. I wonder why you couldn't use an Alnico.
You can use any type of magnet you want; but it will affect the output. However, the magnets in Tri-Sonic pickups are vintage ferrite ceramic similar to Alnico 2.
Hey Man, Nice Video ! Just one question, where did you buy your Burns Blank Pickup Covers ?
www.axesrus.co.uk/Covers-Burns-Trisonics-p/buc001.htm
@dsgb Thanks a lot, Have a nice day
How do you date the special from the serial number
I assume by "special" that you mean a "BMG Special"? The two digits at the start are the year of manufacture, the remainder an incremental build number.
una pregunta, se puede enrollar a mano el cobre para hacer las pastillas ? y cuantas enrrolladas le tengo que dar ? me encanta su canal
Yes, hand-winding is possible. You will have to experiment by making and testing some prototype coils in the range 5,000-5,500 turns.
dsgb.net/faqs/trisonics/
Hi!! As a Brian May fan, and watching your work for a long time, all I have to say is thank you very much and congrats for your work!!
Now that I'm getting into modd adventures, my question is... Where can I get those 2 piece magnets. My pickups have only 1 bar magnet, but it's risky and difficult to cut the into 2 pieces. Thank you!
Hi. Thank you for the kind comments. 🙏🏻💜 You can buy the C1/Y10T grade ceramic ferrite bar magnets from Axes R Us in the U.K.
www.axesrus.co.uk/TRIBARMAGNET-p/trimagbar.htm
It might be possible to source them in other territories but I'm based in the U.K. and haven't looked to see if they are available elsewhere.
@@dsgb thanks for your answer, and keep on going!! 💫
@@dsgb ...by the way, I have a personal doubt, and would like you to clear: do you think there is any repercussion on the sound between bobbinless coils and plastic bobbins?
Kind regards...
A plastic bobbin will have negligible measurable impact on the electromagnetic characteristics of the coil and magnet assembly (all other factors being equal, especially coil shape/physical form) and thus no detectable change in tone, especially when the signal is overdriven by a treble booster through loud amplifiers.
The coil will be held slightly further away from the magnet surface on a bobbin and thus might see a marginally smaller magnetic field strength but this shouldn't affect tone.
@@dsgb Ok, it's clear for me now. I guessed the plastic has no influence over the magnetic field and thus on the sound, but I wanted to read your opinion, as a specialist on theses devices. Now it's clearer for me. Thank you very much!! You're very helpful and kind
So, do we know what models of Burns guitar the differing pickups were initially intended for?
I don't know personally but I'm sure that there are Burns enthusiasts on special interest social media groups who will know.
I think they were on everything except for the Hank Marvin model back in the '60s. As I understand it, the pickups were tailored to suit the different models, though, so you couldn't necessarily use just any Trisonic and get the same pickup Brian May has.
Wow strat pickups are much easier to make !
It isn't necessary to make a bobbinless Tri-Sonic pickup; this is just how they were traditionally made but as you can see in the video, the modern, volume manufactured BHK variants have a plastic bobbin. Making a traditional bobbinless, tape bound and tied off coil obviously increases the manufacturing complexity.
Hey Doug, which mounting screws are used on the Burns Trisonic pickups? I got some Brian May Guitar pickups, however the mounting screws I currently have on my guitar are too big for them. Thanks!
(The pickups i got dont come with mounting screws)
I can't give definitive advice because you haven't stated any key dimensions such as the hole size in the mounting tabs on your specific set of pickups or even what your guitar is. 🤷🏻♂️
@@dsgb my guitar is a strat (dont worry, i modded it to fit normal sized Tri-Sonic pickups), and my pickups have the same hole size as regular Burns Tri-sonics. Im not sure what are the dimensions of both mounting holes though, all i know is that they are the same. I am pretty sure they are the same (the mounting screw type) as the one in most Red Special replicas.
I recommend buying an assortment of different size screws and seeing which ones fit best. I don't know in which territory you live but there are numerous sellers of small pack sizes of all common sizes of wood and machine screws on U.K. eBay.
I have a tool chest drawer full of small bags of primarily stainless steel fasteners in common metric and imperial sizes left over from my projects.
I'm afraid that I can't help with only non-specific statements like "regular Burns Tri-Sonics" and "most Red Special replicas".
@@dsgb I found they are BHK trisonic version. Hopefully that narrows it down.
Im a 14 year old boy that is building my own red special. I have limited money and I can't find where I can buy burns tri sonic pickups dose anyone know where I can buy them an they ship it to Sweden
www.burnsguitars.com/accessories.php
@@dsgb how do I buy them there is just "more info"
If I recall correctly when I bought my Burns Mini Tri-Sonics and, subsequently, Burns vintage Tri-Sonics approximately ten years ago, there was no e-commerce interface so I had to send Burns London an e-mail to initiate the transaction.
If you can't find any just get a set of lipstick pickups they sound great.
While the construction of lipstick pickups is similar to Tri-Sonic pickups, a Red Special requires Tri-Sonic pickups and a treble booster to achieve the distinctive Brian May tones.