For most people, it's enough, but this is where I hate such rules. Not everyone is normal and not every city is flat. I started of morbidly obese at beginning of 2020 and live in a very hilly city, when I started I needed all 750w to get up hills. Now lost 5 stone (only halfway) and get up the same hills using min setting which is around 80w and just placed an order for a new none ebike. Although diet has played a massive part, cycling to work every day has also been very important for the weight loss, and what I was doing was technically illegal. Same for disabled people, or people recovering from injury etc. Why limit power, they limit speed anyway(also to low, 20 or 25 would be more reasonable) and if they really wanted to limit acceleration. Let alone their aim for co2 reduction, they should be pushing bikes, bike lanes and anything to make commuting to work by alternatives to car as easy as possible. This country is far to over regulated on some things.
Not for most people . Most people don't know much about them and will just buy what they've been told . I can almost guarantee you if they rode something with a bit more power they would change their mind .
@@akbarramzan4159 Nobody cares anyhow. I've been riding my 500w M1 pro for thousands of miles now. So long as you arent tearing up the streets at 30 plus miles an hour on a noisy ebike scrambler or moped. The average person and police see a bike with pedals and a chain. And they dismiss it. They dont know the REAL power. If you are smart you manage it sensibly and at the right times. And you will never have a problem. It's actually SAFER. To be able to accelerate at certain points in my commute. Such as roundabouts. Forked roads. And traffic lights. Where being SLOW can actually be more dangerous. When you have traffic coming from several angles. Besides fit road bike users can break 20mph easily on their bikes. You either have a SPEED LIMIT for bikes in general or you dont. SPEED IS SPEED.
@@fender1000100 I agree with l that but if you have an accident on that bike(even if it's not your fault) you would get zero compensation for injury as you were driving an illegal bike. This is my issue. I'd love a 1000w bike but I don't want to be injured and get nothing. Getting stopped by the feds doesn't concern me as I would be sensible and not draw attention to myself.
I'd say no after experiencing double the power. A quick getaway from traffic lights is much safer than possibly getting tangled with big vehicles at the same speed. 15mph is too slow for road as well. At a minimum 20mph, as that at least matches most urban speed limits. I sometimes feel the rules have been engineered to piss everyone off against cyclists.
Here in Australia i went with a road legal 250w max assit speed 25kph. I was considering an 'off road' more powerful bike as more power couldn't be a bad thing. Using the 250w for the commute to work its 10k each way with a few hills and its more than I need. I get to work relatively sweat free and not out of breath, I'm 55 years old and do cycle non powered bikes too, up to 50k rides. The electric bike 250w gives a little work out, but not too much when your heading to work for the day.
I was in Paris on Monday and it was interesting.. There were lots of e-bikes and e-scooters.. The French laws are not as strict as the UK ones.. The new thing I noticed that there are more and more cycle lanes.. As a ball park figure I would say 40% of E users did not respect the traffic lights, the one way systems and many rode on the pavements.. Lots of machines were obviously doctored to go faster (not against that)... I would say that for the pedestrian, especially older persons and children the behaviour of E users was really depressing and frankly dangerous.. Born out of frustration no doubt but if the users don't make an effort it will lead to compulsory insurance and taxes, helmets, stop and checks etc.. So guys, everyone needs to think about this or the state will give us a hard time.. A bit of speed when you know its okay but keep it down in built up areas and try to follow the highway code.. Remember you are virtually silent and people can't hear you coming.. Do you really want to kill a child or smash up someone's gran?
The more videos I watch with e-bike content the more I realise it is rare for riders to properly follow the rules of the road. I'm less aware of how things are in the UK & Europe but in North America it seems most riders (bicycle riders too) ride like those rules don't apply to them. I can't honestly claim to always follow the rules but do feel I drive defensively and with respect for pedestrians & car drivers. Many riders seem to forget car drivers can't read your mind. I'm frequently seeing in videos behaviour from the e-bike riders that would scare the crap out of me if I was driving a car near them or walking/running on a path as they passed.
Just found you on TH-cam. Like the video. If you live in the city then the 250w motor e-bike limit is probably acceptable. However try riding/commuting in the hilly countryside with a 30kg cargo e-bike then the motor limit sucks. Rather than restrict the motor power the restriction should be based on speed. Fortunately the Rad Power bike we have is supplied ‘restricted’ to 250w via the controller and stock display. The hub motor is actually a 500w unit. By swapping out the display and reprogramming the controller the bike is so much more usable and can climb hills with relative ease.
@@srspower to drive a car you must be over age, get a license, pay fees... would you rather have that to ride a more powerful bike? I personally would take power restrictions any day.
250w hub motors suffer a bit on loaded up hill climbs - they aren't designed for it, for those you need a mid drive, they take advantage of the bike's gearing. There is no limit to the steepness you can then tackle, they pull like a tractor. Not 25km/hr but still far faster than pushing.
I have used a 250w mountain bike for grocery shopping trips for about five years now, it pulls well, even when loaded with a massive amount of shopping (large panniers, stuff strapped on top of panniers, and large rucksack), and it pulls up hills even when loaded like this. I have to run the tyres at a low pressure to avoid broken spokes but have had no other problems. So my opinion: 250w bike is more than adequate.
Nice to hear that @davidrobert2007 , I am thinking of buying the Radmission 1 which in EU it comes with 250w, instead of 500w due to the EU laws. I am thinking of buying it for grocery shopping as you stated too and ride to the beach, which is around 10km. I live on the top of a hill, but I think the distance to go to the top is like 30 to 70m, with variations between 3º~7º. So I think I will be doing okay with these kind of ebikes. Also, I don't mind pedaling, that's the purpose of the bike as well
@@itmm92 But EU law is about maximum nominal, not maximum peak. I wish I could upload images on TH-cam or else I would show you how many “250W” bikes with Bosch, Yamaha etc motors can pull well over 750W
@@akbarramzan4159 That would be nice, what kind of motors/ebikes do you recommend? could you suggest some? I am kinda lost with this, so many options and opinions. and most of the bikes are only online, it feels like it's just one shot..x)
got myself a d4s and the missus a d2s these 250w bikes are perfect for driving around town, my wife uses her one daily to do like 5 mile round trips for her shop. D4S is unlockable to 20 mphs
I'd say the 250watt, 15mph limit is adequate for most purposes, but there are so many variations. I've just returned from holiday would have liked a battery with a longer range because in Holland I could manage 15mph all day. Back in the UK in hilly terrain, the tax and insurance that would go with a more powerful bike might be worth it. Whatever your needs, there's probably something to match it.
I ride 250w folding bike for urban commuting and already put more than 2500 km on it. I’ll say 250w is good enough for commuting around town. If you can get more power, then don’t be shy to get it, but if you only can get 250w, you don’t need to worry about lacking power at all. Even 250w makes you feel almost twice as powerful compared to you in normal average bicycle especially if you’re pedaling from stop.
I have owned both the Fiido D2 and D3S which are both 250W electric bikes. I used to ride them to work everyday for around 20 miles. They can pull fine and no problems but 500W with stronger battery is always the better choice. Watts need to be together with a decent battery as you would have same problems.
I commute easily with 36v@ 350w. I can't imagine practically needing more unless climbing serious hills. I'm about 105kgs loaded and top out at over 30kph.
Here in Georgia we can have a 1000 watt but I build ebikes for a hobby and have used them all and a 250 watt is ok, but an up volted 250 watt is better. now if you are looking to use a front wheel hub motor the lower watt motor is safer and gets much better range in general. There are a lot of little things you want to think about when choosing an Ebike kit or purpose built. Power being the one thing that really depends. how will you use your bike in general? what will be the terrain you will be riding in for the most part, street and trail, commute...Your weight and possible cargo weight. I like a 250 watt Mid drive for the best performance for the watt and front wheel planetary geared hub, because it is light, and offers no resistance from the motor because it is ratcheted like a free wheel sprocket so you can pedal your bike without the motor on and other than the added battery weight ride as if it were a normal bike. In both cases you can get good range with a high amp battery 20 plus ah. now if you are in a real hilly area you want to find something with more Umph! 750 watt is about one horse power the old 2 stroke mopeds were about the same and are the standard for most of the 48 states But again God Bless Georgia we got 1000 watts and no hill is an issue to me.
You just can not beat that feeling of riding an ebike . I built a cube 29er with a 750watt bafang mid drive and it's awesome , I managed to build a 2440 watt 48v (50ah) pack that fits the triangle of the frame like a glove 👌 crazy range ....... Keep up the good work Andy 👍👍.
@@TimpBizkit just under 16kg, brilliant for long range easy riding but not great for general thrashing off road . my new setup is a 17.5ah just like you and I find it perfect.
It's really not... and the motor power is irrelevant if a low speed limit is implemented... 1000w restricted to 20mph for roads and speed unlocked offroad is cool
@@hasan_z Most 250w ebikes can unlock to at least 18mph. Which is a beautiful speed. I unlocked my HITWAY for that speed. And it's perfect. Climbs hills very easily. Steep ones with a little pedal assist. Speed never drops under 6 mph.
What about people with lots of weight, wind and hills.... and potentially an injury or disability? We just supposed to forget it? Cause 250w definitely isn't enough then.
My tencents worth; 250w is a good starting point for newbies to e-bikes. Gives you an initial feel for how something with more kick might behave and they do make good general purpose commuters. For me though, 250w is *PI55 ANT* power. I like my e-bikes to have a bit of grunt to them, just like my 1900w AWD commuter does... although I intend to go for more power than that with my next high power build ;)
Hi ya m8 have a look at a SAMEBIKE 500w .. I Bought a new one off EBAY for £746 ordered on a Thursday night from a seller in Lithuania and was on my door step on the Monday morning .. I was on a budget to and this is my first ebike and after using it for a few months cannit fault it for the money ..
Andy, that mini fat bike you were riding in this video has the same controller on the bars as my Petrigo commuter bike, is it programmable? I would like to have a play around with the settings, but I have not yet managed to trigger them.. Any info would be appreciated, it controls a rear hub 350w motor. Thanks in advance Karl
20 inch wheels are great for 250 watt hub motors I have a 200w one on a fold up bike and it is fine cruises at 12.5 mph on the PAS and 15mph on the thumb throttle. After a lot of use the front forks are starting to suffer rebounds almost non existent but the motor is still fine. Not a bike you would use in a hurry but the smaller wheels seem to help the hub motor a lot. As for range a 36v 15ah silverfish. Gives me a good 35 mile range. My bum usually gives up before the battery. 4000miles n counting. Thanks for all you have done for ebike builders you do inspire I have built 3 from kits and rebuilt one love the vids.
I have a 1kw kit and use it limited to 250 quite often. I rarely find the speed to be an issue but agree that 20mph would certainly be safer on road. I find myself at 11mph almost all the time. I do agree with others that the extra torque off the line is much safer for crossing roads & generally evading danger though. I don't see the problem with unlimited power if it's speed limited. 250w won't pull a big lad up a hill on it's own.
I have a 350w one. Not exactly street-legal where I live, but I decided for a little more grunt (some hilly areas around). And I can tell you with my 120kg weight, it can get up to 30-32kph on the flat, no problem, but the hills REALLY kill it. Any kind of moderately-steep incline, and it slows to a crawl. Which, with my delivery job, can be a pain, as I really need to pedal-up to get any kind of speed out of it. I'd say for a heavier person, 750w should be a minimum. Even 500 wouldn't really cut it, i think. That being said, for a 60-65kg person, I have no doubt 250W is plenty. And again, I can make do with 350W (have been for 2 years now), but up the hill, you'll get your leg day's worth of workout, whether you want it or not. So as far as electric ASSIST goes, I'd say 350 is perfect for a recreational e-bike. As far as a COMMUTE vehicle goes - no. Not even close. 750 minimum.
I’m going with ebike kit 250 watt Hilltopper and I still want to get a workout just sometimes it’s a matter of commute time and I’m just a little too tired to put in the max effort
I have a 250W as that is the legal max in my country, and it handles most hills at 20-25 with minimal effort. A bigger hill I prefer to go a bit slower in a lower gear but 95% of the time (outside of extreme gradients) it chugs up no problems
I want a 250w folding ebike with high torque, front and rear suspension, rear rack, 20" fat tyre wheels, hydraulic brakes, wide handlebar (or replaceable) can handle up to 300lbs and is not so short that it looks like a unicycle. I know its an impossible ask. Maybe I could modify a 250w base model.
I share your views, hopefully the scooters become legal soon, I live in Bristol and it’s perfectly legal to drive them everywhere when you RENT them. So what gives...🧐
If you purchase a scooter you pay tax once on the price ie the business selling it pays once. If you hire a bike tax is collected on each hire payment.
Personally I have had one experience for 5 minutes of an ebike and I loved it. Don’t know the brand but it was a 250w motor and it was just ok. I say this because I live in Huddersfield, Yorkshire and we have hills here that our American cousins call mountains. I am in my late 50s and struggle to walk up the hills so an ebike would be brilliant for me. I am hoping to get a 1000w bike that can be derestricted to 250w’s for road use. Ezebikes UK have one that looks interesting and is reasonably priced. So basically my argument is if you live somewhere that’s relatively flat, like Andy Kirby, a 250w bike probably would be sufficient, but if you live somewhere like where I am, you need something with a bit more powerful. Peace x
@@Comewithmeifuwant2live No the op is full of shit. Mountains in england are barely over foothills. At age twelve I climbed mount Timpanogos 4 times higher than the highest "mountain" in England (by sea level) and three times the prominence. In reality he has it completely backwards England has "mountains"we would call hills. And the area he states he lives in looks more flat, even states we make fun of as flat as a pancake have hills bigger than I see on maps of his area. Not that I care but what did Johnny say?
Mine is 😄 I bought a 22amp 36/48 controller with the nice coloured "Julet" connectors, I run a 55v 13ah battery and it does me great and I'm 6'2" 17 stone solid brick wall 😄👍🙋That's over 1000w at full throttle and the motor loves it .
great to see you back and sounding positive. any chance of a video on the cheapest DIY e bike possible that just does the job and don't break the bank I had planned to build a bike like your monster last year but times are heard and I'm not spending anything on my self my kids come first Christmas was hard but the kids are happy
i live in southern Arizona ! i commuter 10 miles round trip daily.. headwinds here are up to 17-20 mph and lots of slight hills. i think a 500-750 watt electric bike would be perfect for me
My ebike motor is on the way (terrified about the import taxes) its a 5000w 3.5T 26" motor accompanied with 100A sabvoton controller and a 20s5p battery (manual balancing) using 25r 2500mah cells (5s x 4 setup) - I can't wait (I hope there's no fires lol)
i heard they barely go 25km/h...or are limited to that even in pedal assisted mode or something and honestly it feels too little seeing that people can cycle at 30-45km/h on regular cheap road bikes
I'm in the US in Northern Colorado and scooters have really caught on. So far it has been pretty good for the college kids. I'm all for them if everyone keeps safety in mind.
500w minimum lol. my ebay esc runs at 750w in limited mode which is how I usually go. It will choke going up very steep hills, I doubt it would be much useful in somewhere like Wales. I rarely use the full 1500w mode as it shortens range and only have a 20 ah battery ( still quite expensive though ).
Can someone advice me on a great off the shelf e-bike please? I don't have time for another 'hobby' just want something off the shelf which is good for both on / off road. Thanks in advance if anyone can help?
Can someone help me here please? I'm a fit 31 year old, only weigh about 75kg, and will usually cycle to the town centre rather than faff about woth parking since its only about 2 miles. Trouble I have is I live on a big hill, which is about 60m higher than town and a fairly steep elevation. I'll cycle up it when I can be bothered but am usually blowing by the time I get to the top and hava decent sweat on, so I usually just push the bike. So my question is, is it likely that with peddle assist I could get up that hill, without sweating, with a 250W motor, or do i at least want 500W?
Hi, Yes 250W will be fine, try and go for a mid drive motor as they have more torque becuase you can use the gears as its effectively adding power to the pedals and then driving the rear wheel throught the chain, these are a bit more expensive than hub motor bikes where the motor is in the rear wheel. Both will make a massive difference to you though. 😁👍🏼 I have a nice 250W bike for sale if you are anywhere near Hertfordshire 😁 you can email me at andy@cloudsto.com
I want to make my bike with 1000 w or 1500 W. I can go with my bike 30 km/h , I want to fell the speed like on the motorcycle. And like this I can go between city 30 km distance. If I build one with 1500 W I could get a speed of 75km / h?! Am I right? I already try an e-motorcycle that goes 65 km/h and feels so good.
They are shite . I live in a hilly area and they are just not enough and are too heavy . 500W plus is where it's at . I still get tailgated and exiting a roundabout is slow af .
Good video, good tunes, look forward to your review of the car because my father has recently got the Seat Leon Sport FR I believe it's virtually the same as the Audi but without the electric.
Buy a motorbike. It would be cheaper and will go better. A learner legal 125 has 7500 watts and can ride at 55 / 60 mph. Granted it will last a lot longer at 50mph all day, but you would only pay less than a thousand quid for an older one with about 8000 miles on it. I have a 15000 watt (20 hp) 250 cc Honda that I bought for £650. It is immaculate, twenty years old and had only 10500 miles on it when I bought it. It does 80 miles to the gallon. I'm looking at not that great ebikes online and they cost £2k and £3k!!!
I couldn't imagine having only 250 watts of power on my bike. I live in a very bustling city, and the ebike I ride around with has 500 watts, and I barely feel like that's enough to hang with the cars. Sometimes being too slow is a safety issue, so depending on where you live, more speed and power is definitely appreciated.
Its illegal in the UK to go more that 25km an hour on an ebike. So theres no hanging with cars. You go at your own pace. Although I get 18mph out of my HITWAY. And that's enough in the city. Which is all stop and start.
*The form factor of that eScooter is awesome but it's too slow to be practical.* Ridiculously high price fpr it. Still a huge positive as a concept. If they make it a bit faster and get the price down a bit, it is the future, so portable.
It is supposed to be you have to register the Scooter/bike with DVLA you then have to get a Sort of MOT and Public Liability insurance and the Most important part you Must have a Current CBT Certificate and you can only use them on road no Cycling lanes or parks.
I've got a 500W fat bike on order. Think it'll do about 20mph with pedal assist. Getting it more for trails than roads but I'll still do some road riding.
I have two e-bikes one is 250 w front wheel drive Voilmart tied up to a 36 10ah battery the other is a 200 w rear wheel drive un named just 200w 36 volt both bikes have 36v 10 ah batteries . both home built . the only problem I have is soft ground or soggy grass both perform good on roads and hard pack and get me quite away with no problems .
I have the m1 myself having moved from motorcycles and I can honestly say its enough power for me . the difference between this and say a non ebike is night and day. don't have to worry about hill wind or sweat what's not to love just hope it proves reliable because no electric know how lol.
Love the little Speech at the end as I am a scooter rider and I have had to put a hold on the scooter riding they definitely need to change the law on them good video keep it up
I have a heated shirt similar to those gloves. On the default mode it starts on red (high), after a few minute it goes to white (medium) and then blue (low) when it's low battery. You can also cycle through the modes manually if you want it to stay on high but it shortens battery life considerably.
It’s not enough power at all! 1000 watts is the minimum you need for hills. I have the same gloves and you need to leave them pulsing for 5 mins to warm up until a solid white light appears. That is the low setting, press again for blue (medium) then again for red (high). I hope that helps.
Watched the whole thing and couldn’t figure out what this video was about exactly. So chaotic! Electric cars, gloves, scooters, bikes, road rules but no clear focus
For most people, it's enough, but this is where I hate such rules. Not everyone is normal and not every city is flat. I started of morbidly obese at beginning of 2020 and live in a very hilly city, when I started I needed all 750w to get up hills. Now lost 5 stone (only halfway) and get up the same hills using min setting which is around 80w and just placed an order for a new none ebike. Although diet has played a massive part, cycling to work every day has also been very important for the weight loss, and what I was doing was technically illegal. Same for disabled people, or people recovering from injury etc. Why limit power, they limit speed anyway(also to low, 20 or 25 would be more reasonable) and if they really wanted to limit acceleration.
Let alone their aim for co2 reduction, they should be pushing bikes, bike lanes and anything to make commuting to work by alternatives to car as easy as possible. This country is far to over regulated on some things.
Not for most people . Most people don't know much about them and will just buy what they've been told . I can almost guarantee you if they rode something with a bit more power they would change their mind .
Offz ك
The legal limit is 250W continuous, there is no peak limit not peak duration limit. 750W for hills is not illegal
@@akbarramzan4159
Nobody cares anyhow. I've been riding my 500w M1 pro for thousands of miles now. So long as you arent tearing up the streets at 30 plus miles an hour on a noisy ebike scrambler or moped.
The average person and police see a bike with pedals and a chain. And they dismiss it. They dont know the REAL power. If you are smart you manage it sensibly and at the right times. And you will never have a problem. It's actually SAFER. To be able to accelerate at certain points in my commute.
Such as roundabouts. Forked roads. And traffic lights. Where being SLOW can actually be more dangerous. When you have traffic coming from several angles.
Besides fit road bike users can break 20mph easily on their bikes. You either have a SPEED LIMIT for bikes in general or you dont. SPEED IS SPEED.
@@fender1000100 I agree with l that but if you have an accident on that bike(even if it's not your fault) you would get zero compensation for injury as you were driving an illegal bike. This is my issue. I'd love a 1000w bike but I don't want to be injured and get nothing. Getting stopped by the feds doesn't concern me as I would be sensible and not draw attention to myself.
I'd say no after experiencing double the power. A quick getaway from traffic lights is much safer than possibly getting tangled with big vehicles at the same speed. 15mph is too slow for road as well. At a minimum 20mph, as that at least matches most urban speed limits. I sometimes feel the rules have been engineered to piss everyone off against cyclists.
May the force be with you
Beyond 20mph is basically a motorbike at that point meaning 52volt 750watt can easily do 30 to 40mph and maybe more
@Harrison Mayson all we care about here is hacking ebike speed limits not Instagram accounts
I agree with you if driving in a roadway.. For me i I would be driving in bike paths and parking lots when I go shopping
@@jonathanoxlade4252 than my road bike is a motorbike? Because I can cruise 30+ on the flats you fucking muppet
Here in Australia i went with a road legal 250w max assit speed 25kph. I was considering an 'off road' more powerful bike as more power couldn't be a bad thing. Using the 250w for the commute to work its 10k each way with a few hills and its more than I need. I get to work relatively sweat free and not out of breath, I'm 55 years old and do cycle non powered bikes too, up to 50k rides. The electric bike 250w gives a little work out, but not too much when your heading to work for the day.
25 kph? I am seriously considering buying on here in WA but want a bit faster than that ha ha
I am also. In WA, mates, thinking of a conversion kit for exactly the same purpose. I am going 64
What sort of ebike if I may?
How steep are those hills? I’m in QLD and I have 2 hills that might be a b..
@@borisgurevich5504 wait, on a 250w hub wheel ? 64? km ?
Thanks, Andy love the music.
i see you made a typo yes 2500w is ok in the city lol
What do U mean 2500w ?
Yes 2500w is fitting for my emtb
Idk 2500 seems kinda low, not really going anywhere with that might as well walk
I think we should have the same ebikes the states and Canada have minimum 500W and 20mph and bought with a throttle straight from the shop.
100%, maybe an easy licensing system for the models over 20mph... like a three day course or something. Much more sensible option.
I was in Paris on Monday and it was interesting.. There were lots of e-bikes and e-scooters.. The French laws are not as strict as the UK ones.. The new thing I noticed that there are more and more cycle lanes.. As a ball park figure I would say 40% of E users did not respect the traffic lights, the one way systems and many rode on the pavements.. Lots of machines were obviously doctored to go faster (not against that)... I would say that for the pedestrian, especially older persons and children the behaviour of E users was really depressing and frankly dangerous..
Born out of frustration no doubt but if the users don't make an effort it will lead to compulsory insurance and taxes, helmets, stop and checks etc..
So guys, everyone needs to think about this or the state will give us a hard time.. A bit of speed when you know its okay but keep it down in built up areas and try to follow the highway code..
Remember you are virtually silent and people can't hear you coming.. Do you really want to kill a child or smash up someone's gran?
The more videos I watch with e-bike content the more I realise it is rare for riders to properly follow the rules of the road. I'm less aware of how things are in the UK & Europe but in North America it seems most riders (bicycle riders too) ride like those rules don't apply to them. I can't honestly claim to always follow the rules but do feel I drive defensively and with respect for pedestrians & car drivers. Many riders seem to forget car drivers can't read your mind. I'm frequently seeing in videos behaviour from the e-bike riders that would scare the crap out of me if I was driving a car near them or walking/running on a path as they passed.
Just found you on TH-cam. Like the video. If you live in the city then the 250w motor e-bike limit is probably acceptable. However try riding/commuting in the hilly countryside with a 30kg cargo e-bike then the motor limit sucks. Rather than restrict the motor power the restriction should be based on speed. Fortunately the Rad Power bike we have is supplied ‘restricted’ to 250w via the controller and stock display. The hub motor is actually a 500w unit. By swapping out the display and reprogramming the controller the bike is so much more usable and can climb hills with relative ease.
The city is where i need the most power actually as the roads are too narrow for cars to pass.
It's a double standard. We don't see cars restricted to engines that can only produce enough power for up to 70mph do we?
@@srspower to drive a car you must be over age, get a license, pay fees... would you rather have that to ride a more powerful bike? I personally would take power restrictions any day.
@@srspower lol. Double standards mentioned by poster after you are not bothering you i am guessing?😂
250w hub motors suffer a bit on loaded up hill climbs - they aren't designed for it, for those you need a mid drive, they take advantage of the bike's gearing. There is no limit to the steepness you can then tackle, they pull like a tractor. Not 25km/hr but still far faster than pushing.
I have used a 250w mountain bike for grocery shopping trips for about five years now, it pulls well, even when loaded with a massive amount of shopping (large panniers, stuff strapped on top of panniers, and large rucksack), and it pulls up hills even when loaded like this. I have to run the tyres at a low pressure to avoid broken spokes but have had no other problems. So my opinion: 250w bike is more than adequate.
At what distance?
If you buy a prebuilt bike, it will be peaking at much higher than 250W anyway
Nice to hear that @davidrobert2007 , I am thinking of buying the Radmission 1 which in EU it comes with 250w, instead of 500w due to the EU laws. I am thinking of buying it for grocery shopping as you stated too and ride to the beach, which is around 10km. I live on the top of a hill, but I think the distance to go to the top is like 30 to 70m, with variations between 3º~7º. So I think I will be doing okay with these kind of ebikes. Also, I don't mind pedaling, that's the purpose of the bike as well
@@itmm92 But EU law is about maximum nominal, not maximum peak. I wish I could upload images on TH-cam or else I would show you how many “250W” bikes with Bosch, Yamaha etc motors can pull well over 750W
@@akbarramzan4159 That would be nice, what kind of motors/ebikes do you recommend? could you suggest some? I am kinda lost with this, so many options and opinions. and most of the bikes are only online, it feels like it's just one shot..x)
After watching your vids built my first ebike 1500w 52 v plenty for my first one great fun..
got myself a d4s and the missus a d2s these 250w bikes are perfect for driving around town, my wife uses her one daily to do like 5 mile round trips for her shop. D4S is unlockable to 20 mphs
I'd say the 250watt, 15mph limit is adequate for most purposes, but there are so many variations. I've just returned from holiday would have liked a battery with a longer range because in Holland I could manage 15mph all day. Back in the UK in hilly terrain, the tax and insurance that would go with a more powerful bike might be worth it. Whatever your needs, there's probably something to match it.
I ride 250w folding bike for urban commuting and already put more than 2500 km on it. I’ll say 250w is good enough for commuting around town. If you can get more power, then don’t be shy to get it, but if you only can get 250w, you don’t need to worry about lacking power at all. Even 250w makes you feel almost twice as powerful compared to you in normal average bicycle especially if you’re pedaling from stop.
7:53 I have a generic BMS on my ebike, is that why my sw900 screen shows voltage rather than actual battery %?
I have owned both the Fiido D2 and D3S which are both 250W electric bikes. I used to ride them to work everyday for around 20 miles. They can pull fine and no problems but 500W with stronger battery is always the better choice. Watts need to be together with a decent battery as you would have same problems.
I commute easily with 36v@ 350w. I can't imagine practically needing more unless climbing serious hills. I'm about 105kgs loaded and top out at over 30kph.
What kind of bike was the other one in the shed next to the scooter??
Here in Georgia we can have a 1000 watt but I build ebikes for a hobby and have used them all and a 250 watt is ok, but an up volted 250 watt is better. now if you are looking to use a front wheel hub motor the lower watt motor is safer and gets much better range in general. There are a lot of little things you want to think about when choosing an Ebike kit or purpose built. Power being the one thing that really depends. how will you use your bike in general? what will be the terrain you will be riding in for the most part, street and trail, commute...Your weight and possible cargo weight. I like a 250 watt Mid drive for the best performance for the watt and front wheel planetary geared hub, because it is light, and offers no resistance from the motor because it is ratcheted like a free wheel sprocket so you can pedal your bike without the motor on and other than the added battery weight ride as if it were a normal bike. In both cases you can get good range with a high amp battery 20 plus ah. now if you are in a real hilly area you want to find something with more Umph! 750 watt is about one horse power the old 2 stroke mopeds were about the same and are the standard for most of the 48 states But again God Bless Georgia we got 1000 watts and no hill is an issue to me.
Andy, have you done any testing with Active or passive battery cooling to improve performance or range?
No but interested in that
@@andykirby I wonder if it might help battery logevity as well, great channel btw
You just can not beat that feeling of riding an ebike . I built a cube 29er with a 750watt bafang mid drive and it's awesome , I managed to build a 2440 watt 48v (50ah) pack that fits the triangle of the frame like a glove 👌 crazy range ....... Keep up the good work Andy 👍👍.
Makes my 17.5 Amp hour seem positively modest. Is that a heavy battery, like 12-15 kg?
@@TimpBizkit just under 16kg, brilliant for long range easy riding but not great for general thrashing off road . my new setup is a 17.5ah just like you and I find it perfect.
are you in America or the UK? I'm looking at decent conversion kits in the UK n I've got the same kind of bike, a 29er cube
Do you live in uk?....hope not😢....
@@CjDon02 sorry mate 6months late lol yeh UK
250w is enough power for sure but the 15mph restriction needs to go up to 20mph.
It's not asking too much.
It's really not... and the motor power is irrelevant if a low speed limit is implemented... 1000w restricted to 20mph for roads and speed unlocked offroad is cool
@@hasan_z
Most 250w ebikes can unlock to at least 18mph. Which is a beautiful speed. I unlocked my HITWAY for that speed. And it's perfect. Climbs hills very easily. Steep ones with a little pedal assist. Speed never drops under 6 mph.
What about people with lots of weight, wind and hills.... and potentially an injury or disability? We just supposed to forget it? Cause 250w definitely isn't enough then.
My tencents worth; 250w is a good starting point for newbies to e-bikes. Gives you an initial feel for how something with more kick might behave and they do make good general purpose commuters.
For me though, 250w is *PI55 ANT* power. I like my e-bikes to have a bit of grunt to them, just like my 1900w AWD commuter does... although I intend to go for more power than that with my next high power build ;)
buy a motorbike then :)
@@JPVNG67 motorbikes are boring
I remember that bike, good to see its still in yours hands mate.
What’s the best ebike you could recommend
For someone on a budget
the one hes riding
Hi ya m8 have a look at a SAMEBIKE 500w .. I Bought a new one off EBAY for £746 ordered on a Thursday night from a seller in Lithuania and was on my door step on the Monday morning .. I was on a budget to and this is my first ebike and after using it for a few months cannit fault it for the money ..
my first e-bike was a fiido D2 that's what got me into e-bikes plus watching your creations can't wait for your next video.
Hi which bike did you go around town on please
Details please of that slim scooter that you were shown and the shop that is selling them. I'm interested in buying one.
I have 2 wheel drive bike 2 x 250 watt motors, and 60v batteries pulls away from lights etc great and does around 25mph I'm 19 stone.
Here in UK, which do you prefer riding, pedal assist electric bike or scooter for a 30 miles every. day move around?
What type of ebike is it please?
Another great video, hopefully when the weather gets better,I'm out on my ebike,that I built from your kit,most excellent.
Another great video Andy. Thanks and love the music!
Can you ride a bike with a 1000w battery and just have it set to peddle assist on the display only
Andy, that mini fat bike you were riding in this video has the same controller on the bars as my Petrigo commuter bike, is it programmable? I would like to have a play around with the settings, but I have not yet managed to trigger them.. Any info would be appreciated, it controls a rear hub 350w motor.
Thanks in advance
Karl
Hi what are these like for heavier riders I'm thinking of getting my first ebike but I'm a big chap
Is the bike 16inch?
Do those heated gloves warm the fingers?
20 inch wheels are great for 250 watt hub motors I have a 200w one on a fold up bike and it is fine cruises at 12.5 mph on the PAS and 15mph on the thumb throttle. After a lot of use the front forks are starting to suffer rebounds almost non existent but the motor is still fine. Not a bike you would use in a hurry but the smaller wheels seem to help the hub motor a lot. As for range a 36v 15ah silverfish. Gives me a good 35 mile range. My bum usually gives up before the battery. 4000miles n counting. Thanks for all you have done for ebike builders you do inspire I have built 3 from kits and rebuilt one love the vids.
I have a 1kw kit and use it limited to 250 quite often. I rarely find the speed to be an issue but agree that 20mph would certainly be safer on road. I find myself at 11mph almost all the time.
I do agree with others that the extra torque off the line is much safer for crossing roads & generally evading danger though.
I don't see the problem with unlimited power if it's speed limited. 250w won't pull a big lad up a hill on it's own.
Funny thing is the big lad can go down the hill at 50mph
I have a littlefolding bike too that put a Bafang 250w hub kit on. Surprisingly nippy👍
How far unassisted on a full charge on the bike? I like ebikes but want to know the range. Do they make them solar panel rechargeable?
I have a 350w one. Not exactly street-legal where I live, but I decided for a little more grunt (some hilly areas around). And I can tell you with my 120kg weight, it can get up to 30-32kph on the flat, no problem, but the hills REALLY kill it. Any kind of moderately-steep incline, and it slows to a crawl. Which, with my delivery job, can be a pain, as I really need to pedal-up to get any kind of speed out of it. I'd say for a heavier person, 750w should be a minimum. Even 500 wouldn't really cut it, i think.
That being said, for a 60-65kg person, I have no doubt 250W is plenty. And again, I can make do with 350W (have been for 2 years now), but up the hill, you'll get your leg day's worth of workout, whether you want it or not. So as far as electric ASSIST goes, I'd say 350 is perfect for a recreational e-bike. As far as a COMMUTE vehicle goes - no. Not even close. 750 minimum.
What bike do you have?
Do you need license for this ebike 20 years old asking
I’m going with ebike kit 250 watt Hilltopper and I still want to get a workout just sometimes it’s a matter of commute time and I’m just a little too tired to put in the max effort
A crucial question = can it hit 25 kmh in a reasonable UPHILL road ?
I have a 250W as that is the legal max in my country, and it handles most hills at 20-25 with minimal effort. A bigger hill I prefer to go a bit slower in a lower gear but 95% of the time (outside of extreme gradients) it chugs up no problems
I want a 250w folding ebike with high torque, front and rear suspension, rear rack, 20" fat tyre wheels, hydraulic brakes, wide handlebar (or replaceable) can handle up to 300lbs and is not so short that it looks like a unicycle. I know its an impossible ask. Maybe I could modify a 250w base model.
750w with 120nm is my sweet spot :)
Agreed. Wish we had the US laws in the UK!
whats it like uphill with luggage?
I share your views, hopefully the scooters become legal soon, I live in Bristol and it’s perfectly legal to drive them everywhere when you RENT them. So what gives...🧐
If you purchase a scooter you pay tax once on the price ie the business selling it pays once. If you hire a bike tax is collected on each hire payment.
Government figuring a way they can tax them and demand insurance the scooters. Can't have people move around without getting a slice.
You will own nothing, and you will be happy. That's the agenda.
Personally I have had one experience for 5 minutes of an ebike and I loved it. Don’t know the brand but it was a 250w motor and it was just ok. I say this because I live in Huddersfield, Yorkshire and we have hills here that our American cousins call mountains.
I am in my late 50s and struggle to walk up the hills so an ebike would be brilliant for me. I am hoping to get a 1000w bike that can be derestricted to 250w’s for road use. Ezebikes UK have one that looks interesting and is reasonably priced.
So basically my argument is if you live somewhere that’s relatively flat, like Andy Kirby, a 250w bike probably would be sufficient, but if you live somewhere like where I am, you need something with a bit more powerful. Peace x
Huddersfield is nearly the UK equivalent of San Francisco!!
Never been to the Rockies.
@@ghz24That John Denver's full of shit man!
@@Comewithmeifuwant2live No the op is full of shit.
Mountains in england are barely over foothills.
At age twelve I climbed mount Timpanogos
4 times higher than the highest "mountain" in England (by sea level) and three times the prominence.
In reality he has it completely backwards England has "mountains"we would call hills.
And the area he states he lives in looks more flat, even states we make fun of as flat as a pancake have hills bigger than I see on maps of his area.
Not that I care but what did Johnny say?
@@ghz24 th-cam.com/video/GV3E5e7fZ6M/w-d-xo.html&ab_channel=JimCarrey
Just a joke, dude!
Did you hold the brake and trottle and turn it on all at the same time to get Error 4 it goes 10kmh faster, I like the M1 thinking of the m1pro tho 🤑
Mine is 😄 I bought a 22amp 36/48 controller with the nice coloured "Julet" connectors, I run a 55v 13ah battery and it does me great and I'm 6'2" 17 stone solid brick wall 😄👍🙋That's over 1000w at full throttle and the motor loves it .
Nice one, enjoyed the video, keep them coming sir, all the best Andy.
Andy, what did you think to the gloves?
Good video andy , enjoyed it 👍
great to see you back and sounding positive. any chance of a video on the cheapest DIY e bike possible that just does the job and don't break the bank I had planned to build a bike like your monster last year but times are heard and I'm not spending anything on my self my kids come first Christmas was hard but the kids are happy
im new to ebikes do you know a good foldable e bike that dont cost crazy money
Halfords do a basic foldable for 500 quid
What’s smaller diameter wheels like over potholes etc?
Those are 4in fat bike tyres and over put holes they feel Excellent because they have much more cushion effect than Normal ones do.
I'm looking for a 250watt mid-drive electric bike,need to hurry and choose one incase I need to order it, don't know what motor to choose? 👍🚴
Great content as usual keep up the good work and stay safe.
i live in southern Arizona ! i commuter 10 miles round trip daily.. headwinds here are up to 17-20 mph and lots of slight hills. i think a 500-750 watt electric bike would be perfect for me
My ebike motor is on the way (terrified about the import taxes) its a 5000w 3.5T 26" motor accompanied with 100A sabvoton controller and a 20s5p battery (manual balancing) using 25r 2500mah cells (5s x 4 setup) - I can't wait (I hope there's no fires lol)
Top notch vlog Andy, great camera quality and audio too. cheers
i heard they barely go 25km/h...or are limited to that even in pedal assisted mode or something and honestly it feels too little seeing that people can cycle at 30-45km/h on regular cheap road bikes
If u can go 30/h that easily just drive normal bike:)
I'm in the US in Northern Colorado and scooters have really caught on. So far it has been pretty good for the college kids. I'm all for them if everyone keeps safety in mind.
Love the dawless studio btw 😎
Great Vlog Andy. That’s an awesome little scooter, I want one! Love the music in this video. Top notch.
500w minimum lol. my ebay esc runs at 750w in limited mode which is how I usually go. It will choke going up very steep hills, I doubt it would be much useful in somewhere like Wales. I rarely use the full 1500w mode as it shortens range and only have a 20 ah battery ( still quite expensive though ).
Can someone advice me on a great off the shelf e-bike please? I don't have time for another 'hobby' just want something off the shelf which is good for both on / off road. Thanks in advance if anyone can help?
Can someone help me here please? I'm a fit 31 year old, only weigh about 75kg, and will usually cycle to the town centre rather than faff about woth parking since its only about 2 miles. Trouble I have is I live on a big hill, which is about 60m higher than town and a fairly steep elevation. I'll cycle up it when I can be bothered but am usually blowing by the time I get to the top and hava decent sweat on, so I usually just push the bike. So my question is, is it likely that with peddle assist I could get up that hill, without sweating, with a 250W motor, or do i at least want 500W?
Hi, Yes 250W will be fine, try and go for a mid drive motor as they have more torque becuase you can use the gears as its effectively adding power to the pedals and then driving the rear wheel throught the chain, these are a bit more expensive than hub motor bikes where the motor is in the rear wheel. Both will make a massive difference to you though. 😁👍🏼 I have a nice 250W bike for sale if you are anywhere near Hertfordshire 😁 you can email me at andy@cloudsto.com
I want to make my bike with 1000 w or 1500 W. I can go with my bike 30 km/h , I want to fell the speed like on the motorcycle. And like this I can go between city 30 km distance. If I build one with 1500 W I could get a speed of 75km / h?! Am I right? I already try an e-motorcycle that goes 65 km/h and feels so good.
They are shite . I live in a hilly area and they are just not enough and are too heavy . 500W plus is where it's at . I still get tailgated and exiting a roundabout is slow af .
Good video, good tunes, look forward to your review of the car because my father has recently got the Seat Leon Sport FR I believe it's virtually the same as the Audi but without the electric.
I'd love to have that one at 1500 watts with the back shock maybe even 2000 Watts can't afford it though I'm saving up for 1500 watt
Buy a motorbike. It would be cheaper and will go better. A learner legal 125 has 7500 watts and can ride at 55 / 60 mph. Granted it will last a lot longer at 50mph all day, but you would only pay less than a thousand quid for an older one with about 8000 miles on it. I have a 15000 watt (20 hp) 250 cc Honda that I bought for £650. It is immaculate, twenty years old and had only 10500 miles on it when I bought it. It does 80 miles to the gallon. I'm looking at not that great ebikes online and they cost £2k and £3k!!!
I couldn't imagine having only 250 watts of power on my bike. I live in a very bustling city, and the ebike I ride around with has 500 watts, and I barely feel like that's enough to hang with the cars. Sometimes being too slow is a safety issue, so depending on where you live, more speed and power is definitely appreciated.
Its illegal in the UK to go more that 25km an hour on an ebike. So theres no hanging with cars. You go at your own pace. Although I get 18mph out of my HITWAY. And that's enough in the city. Which is all stop and start.
*The form factor of that eScooter is awesome but it's too slow to be practical.* Ridiculously high price fpr it.
Still a huge positive as a concept. If they make it a bit faster and get the price down a bit, it is the future, so portable.
250watts , Maybe on a Mid Drive , unlocked
Im dying to see a review on the kugoo kirin b2...looks powerfull
I love the music! Great video overall
I have cycled down hill at 35 mph and also rode on the flat at 20 mph a its within the law but e scooter and e bikes cant go above 15.5 mph.
I live in a mountain area and about 1500w with geared pedaling gets me up the worst
Please need your help I wannabuikd my own but haven't got a clue how to do it lol
th-cam.com/video/YtF_16RA2Jo/w-d-xo.html
It is supposed to be you have to register the Scooter/bike with DVLA you then have to get a Sort of MOT and Public Liability insurance and the Most important part you Must have a Current CBT Certificate and you can only use them on road no Cycling lanes or parks.
Do u need a car or bike license for this ebike
I've got a 500W fat bike on order. Think it'll do about 20mph with pedal assist. Getting it more for trails than roads but I'll still do some road riding.
I have two e-bikes one is 250 w front wheel drive Voilmart tied up to a 36 10ah battery the other is a 200 w rear wheel drive un named just 200w 36 volt both bikes have 36v 10 ah batteries . both home built . the only problem I have is soft ground or soggy grass both perform good on roads and hard pack and get me quite away with no problems .
How tall are you Andy, you look tall. I'm 6'6' wondering if a folding bike would work well for me.
where can i find your music?
Spotify, apple music and my Instagram!
I have the m1 myself having moved from motorcycles and I can honestly say its enough power for me . the difference between this and say a non ebike is night and day. don't have to worry about hill wind or sweat what's not to love just hope it proves reliable because no electric know how lol.
Love the little Speech at the end as I am a scooter rider and I have had to put a hold on the scooter riding they definitely need to change the law on them good video keep it up
I have a heated shirt similar to those gloves. On the default mode it starts on red (high), after a few minute it goes to white (medium) and then blue (low) when it's low battery. You can also cycle through the modes manually if you want it to stay on high but it shortens battery life considerably.
the gloves turn white when its gets to a certain temperature so they dont overheat, you turning it on and off is just resetting it
It’s not enough power at all! 1000 watts is the minimum you need for hills. I have the same gloves and you need to leave them pulsing for 5 mins to warm up until a solid white light appears. That is the low setting, press again for blue (medium) then again for red (high). I hope that helps.
is it just my 250w that doesnt struggle on hills???
Back to form Andy. Keep up the vids
Watched the whole thing and couldn’t figure out what this video was about exactly. So chaotic! Electric cars, gloves, scooters, bikes, road rules but no clear focus
Great vid Andy,I know it's a pretty crap time your going thru at the moment so any vid from you is a good vid.
500 watt I`d say, great video!
We have the same 250w rule in Australia (NSW) - it used to be 200w max!
Thought you said 250w is only candle power Andy in one of your previous vloggs ? 🤣
Ssshh! They sent me the bike for free!