Another interesting thing is that nowadays most modern airlines lose money on flights, and make all their profit from the points & rewards card system. So they're basically credit card companies that do flying as a side hustle.
@@fatmirzekaj5582 I think here in Europe it's the riddiculously priced extras. Got an EMail from EasyJet a couple days ago, about flying to some nice and sunny place for just 49 CHF or something. Took a quick look at it, if I would like to bring some luggage with me, maybe have a seat where I don't torture my knees by pressing them against the next one, the price easily goes up 2.5 times. Now, if you also fancy a quick snack and coke on the Airplane, add another 10 or more to it. But I guess, if I was younger and a bit smaller, traveling could be insanely cheap. Mail your clothing there, mail back at end, travel only with a small backpack.
@@scmoratti Smaller. There was even plans on making it even tighter with having seats above you (luckily it never happened...still possible in the future)
@@mbogucki1 You still have the option of purchasing a bigger seat today, and it'll still be cheaper than flying coach back then. For the rest of us that can fit the smaller seats, we get to enjoy an even bigger cost savings
I remember my first flight in 1977 -- I was 9 and our family was flying from NY to Bermuda. Mom told me that I had to get a new "outfit" for the flight because people dressed up for flying. We were in coach, but had TV dinner style trays served to us with a hot meal (no one asked for money or a credit card). I dreamed to be a "stewardess" when I grew up...then I grew up and thought NO THANK YOU! Times change and everything comes down to dollars and cents. Great video!
There's an old saying in New York "If YOU can get into Studio 54, then it's not Studio 54 anymore." Flying stopped being glamorous as soon as an average person could afford a ticket. Then it became a bus in the sky.
What bothers me most about air travel isn't the amenities, it's the delays and security theater. It's not uncommon to spend more time in air terminals than in the air. And the lousy TSA doesn't make that experience any better.
Yeah, I didn't get into this in the video, because I don't understand it/didn't research it - but I gather that much of the congestion at airports is also a consequence of deregulation increasing flights without increasing airport/controller capacity.
Yeah, security theater. But this was interesting about the lounges. Now, it's all about airside ground lounges accessed by credit cards. But yeah, as a tall man, shrunk seat pitch requires me to buy domestic first class, which is less seat pitch than domestic coach class used to be. (Transatlantic and ME3 are another story.)
@@PhilEdwardsInc also after 9/11 they just made flying on an airplane more difficult without actually preventing any terrorism which was supposed to be the point. Like all the taking your shoes off and getting X-ray’d hasnt prevented anything and is effectively for no reason. Before you could basically just walk in w your ticket.
No one is going to suggest getting rid of the TSA because when the first tragedy happens in a post-TSA world, that person will take all of the blame and they'll just bring the TSA back.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Good insight into the airline industry. I enjoyed watching it. The deregulation of the airline industry caused a trade off, favoring load capacity, but creating lower prices for the consumer which can be viewed as a positive or a negative, depending on your preference. However, it really was George W. Bush's signing of the ATSA that not only caused the "flying experience" to become hellish, but it also made the "airport experience" miserable. Before the TSA, being at an airport was an enjoyable experience , but now they feel more like prisons that you want to flee from. An idea for your next video maybe?
Okay, thank you for this. When I was very young, my mom and me had to switch planes along with a bunch of other passengers. I remembered there being a pong table on this plane, but for the last several years now, in looking that up, I could never find any references of this being a thing. I thought it was my imagination or a dream I remembered.
Oh those were real. Continental Airlines in fact installed pong table screens in the onboard lounges of their 747’s and DC-10’s back in the late 60s. Get a drink and play pong while at 40,000 feet.
As a long retired pilot I was set to gig you on minor errors, but you did a great job. That was the environment. In the 70s, experts were opining that a 70% system load factor was the max possible. Crandall (American) put that to rest with his 'yield management ' system that he learned during his time at Hallmark. The irony is that the Kennedy-Cannon Deregulation Act was supposed to lead to more competitors than the "Legacy 12". Instead, over the long run, it has led to fewer.
No way it has led to fewer airlines. Mergers certainly happened, but this was largely due to other factors like aircraft technology and range improving (leading to what were basically regional airlines consolidating), mismanagement, the oil crisis, and consolidation which is common in more established industries. Overall the increased competition has at least led to far more demand now that many can afford to fly. Before deregulation, low cost carriers were essentially impossible (save for Southwest, but this was because they were not subject to the CAB's terrible management). Spirit, Allegiant, Sun Country, Frontier, etc. could not exist in the 1970s. Routes have greatly expanded too.
@@CarterHancockdo some research on how many airlines delta American and united have eaten up over the years. Regional airlines are basically extinct. It’s a big 3 with 6 other large airlines and that’s about it.
Every moment of interaction I’ve had, as a customer, with the airline industry in the last 10 years has been misery. Everything. Shopping for tickets, paying for tickets, managing luggage, waiting here, waiting there, crowding in over here, hearding into the tube, packing into a pathetic seat, dealing with fellow customers, trying to resolve an issue, facing unexpected costs, all of it, every part of this industry is awful. I do everything I can to avoid this type of travel now.
@@karlabritfeld7104 yes, always thought it would be a great experience to travel across America by train. Why did they rip so many tracks up ? I guess that's why everyone needs a car. Here in the UK, I have always managed to get to work by train, or bike. Where I live is relatively flat, so always had a bike. Public transport has got worse over the years and much more expensive, like everything else in this world. If I had the choice, would rather live in the US rather than the UK, which is like a third world country now, over crowded with illegal immigrants, poor standard of health care, customer service, everything closed and run down. At least in the states there is plenty of space, people have their guns, to ward off tyrannical nut job Govmint foot soilder's... I guess we can all relate to each other in regards to how the conspiracy is actually - the war is against us, in all reality. I know my enemy, but on a positive note, I know my Saviour Jesus Christ and. his love for you .,...too 🙂❣️🙏
I totally agree with you a complete nightmare I have chosen never to fly again I'm done it's too painful for my body it's too exhausting it's not enjoyable it's really a nightmare.
I started flying in the 50s. On my first unaccompanied flight from London to Madrid when I was 7, my grandparents didn't get the telegram telling them the flight number of my flight, so I was left alone at the baggage carousel until one of the stewardesses saw me, took pity on me, and took me to her house till she could find my grandparents the next day. That would be frowned upon today. Since then, I have flown extensively throughout 4 continents, from DC3s to Concordes (I have 23 flights on the Concord) and even allowed to sit in the 1st officer seat flying out of Amman until we arrived in Heathrow. I once flew from JFK to LHR on New Year's Eve and was the only passenger on the flight, -it was a lot of fun. I have lived it all. I used to love the excitement of taking off, knowing that something new would be waiting for me when I arrived. That all has changed, as you have pointed out so eloquently. I no longer fly commercial as it is too...unhumanizing. Besides I'm retired.
I bet you have great stories about your travels. What is your favorite destination? I too love to travel and actually travel a lot. I do mostly for work but I squeeze in a personal one as much as possible.
I feel like it's a whole journey vs destination thing. I feel like flying used to be treated more as an experience in itself, whereas now it's simply a means to an end - a way to get from point A to point B. Treating it as purely a mode of transport encourages lower prices so you have more to spend at your destination, but equally it encourages a steady degrading of comfort and experience, because your only goal is to pass the time until you get to where you want to go. The problem is that when you combine it with the torturous (and largely excessive) security process, unless you're going somewhere inaccessible by other means, you don't really save much time, and you arrive at your destination tired, grumpy, and with a massive crick in your neck. Plus you probably got groped by a stranger in the process. Flying nowadays is DEEPLY unpleasant, and I think they've started to reach a critical point where the price is no longer the issue. I think they need to simplify check in and security, make airports less depressing, and stop scrunching the seats closer and closer together. I would be willing to pay more for all of those things. I just want to be able to go on holiday without arriving in intense physical and mental discomfort.
Honestly, flying today is both very uncomfortable and very stressful. If it could just be basically comfortable and low-stress, I'd be much more willing to fly much more.
Premium cabins often have priority check in&priority security and nicer seats as well as improved service. You already can pay more for those things and many do
Imagine going to a priority check in lane with no line, the check in agent walks you over to security and puts you at the front of the express line, then you’re whisked off to a lounge to wait for boarding. Once boarding starts (or just before) you’re driven from the lounge to the gate, given priority boarding and once onboard you’re shown to your lay flat bed & offered a welcome drink That’s how flying is in premium cabins when your rich. I just worked at the airport, I’m far from rich. But I’ve seen it all
@@somethingsomething404 The only way you'll get that kind of experience in a lot of parts of the US is if you're wealthy enough to charter an airplane. First class on domestic flights gets you a bigger seat, nicer food, and priority boarding, but not much else. And some domestic flights don't even have first class anymore, and all you can pay for is a bit more legroom at the front.
I wonder if the re-emergence of medium/long distance train lines will create pressure on the quality and comfort of air travel again. In the UK services on the Edinburgh/Glasgow to London line specifically run ads about how much more comfortable 4 hours on a train city centre to city centre is, compared with flying which doesn't actually save that much time end-to-end.
@@PhilEdwardsInc The London-Edinburgh journey is 330 miles and it takes 4 hours 39 minutes on average. I have no sense of how fast American trains are on average. I wouldn't expect that much of a difference overall in the actual trackspeeds. I gather that where US trains suffer is that freight trains block up the whole network.
@@jordanmcgrory2171 That's quite fast by US standards. The NE Regional line, which is the most used line in the US, takes 14 hours to go 682 miles from Boston to Roanoke, which is almost 50% slower. The biggest problem in the US is the distances most people need to travel are way longer, and we don't have high-speed rail, which means the distances trains are competitive for are much shorter.
Yesterday my flight from Denver to San Jose left the gate after dark just as a snowstorm moved in. Ice accumulation, blowing snow, very low visibility. There was some delay while we got de-iced, and flying westward through the storm was a bit bouncy, and so we were a little late arriving in San Jose. At every step the crew told us what was going on and apologized for things they needed to do for our own safety. I think that's a pretty good deal.
It lost the glamour, but then again in the 60s tickets were so prohibitively expensive most people simply weren't able to experience flying ever, or did so only for a honeymoon or a funeral. So it's not like the transition for most people was "fly glamorous or fly cheap", it was "take a bus or fly cheap". People still can fly first today, but few opt to pay cash to do so.
But airline tickets aren’t that cheap today. In fact when accounting for inflation, tickets are more expensive than in the pre deregulation days. Not too mention taking the train is no longer a serious contender when traveling longer distances in the US.
@@Clipper1094 that's.... not how inflation works. Like, it's the exact opposite, those 500 dollars back in thee 1970s are equivalent to 3.8K$ today. And that was what it cost you to go from NY to London at the time. The price nowadays, went *down*, not adjusted for inflation. Taking into account inflation, it's less than a tenth of the cost of the 1970s. Yes, flying absolutely did get waaaaay cheaper.
I just had a flight aboard Malaysian Airlines from Kuala Lumpur to Haneda in Tokyo. Had a coach window seat without anyone beside me in the other two seats. Poor man's business class! Best flight I've ever had. The cabin crew kept serving me wine also. Winning!
This is basically what happened to me when I took an international flight at the start of the pandemic, March 2020. They had limited numbers because of people being grounded and cancelling their tickets. So I had 3 window seats all to myself and slept lying down. Actually got a good 8 hours of shut-eye, which is bloody rare for flying, let alone flying economy class!
@@ComedyLoverGirl In my case, the plane was 97% full. Just the rear area was lacking passengers. They kept some seats empty for the crew, but for some reason I had an entire row to myself. I did ask for exit row seating at the check-in counter, but they wanted me to pay. I said just give me a window seat then, so I think the attendant gave me the best of what they could offer because I'm tall.
My grandmother was a flight hostess with Continental back in the early 60s. As she said, what a time it was to fly. Everything was lavish and over the top on pretty much any airline you chose. She still has her Continental flying wings pin. She met my grandfather by chance at LAX after a storm delayed their flights, and after a few dates they were married in 1968 in Vegas. Man, what a time to be alive it was then.
@@dirty_mac and now people buy a ticket for $50 bucks then complain they have to pay extra to choose a seat, bring carry on, etc. but personally I prefer the low ticket price and add the things I want
In the late 80s and early 90s I would regularly fly from London to Belfast with BA or British Midland on a flight that took about an hour, as soon as we leveled off, the drinks trolley came by with my free scotch rocks then a ten minutes later the full meal service came by with a mini bottle of wine on every tray and the food was delicious, then when everyone had eaten, they cleared the trays and it was time to land. All food and drinks were included on the one class plane, BA Shuttle service and BM Diamond Service. I miss those days now, you felt special and the crew were amazing.
I flew for the first time in the early 60s on a PanAm plane-not a jet. The stewardesses were very kind. Even in the 70s we got real meals on china plates with silver cutlery. Now I feel like a nuisance to the airlines, jammed in with only the food and drink I brought along myself.
While I think it would be nice to experience the level of service from back in the 60s, I don't think people realize how most people were locked out of flying back then. Being able to fly was a luxury reserved for the rich, and I don't think heading back to that is the direction we want to go.
@@MakeB711 Have you not paid attention to this video at all? Flying wouldn't have been a luxury if it wasn't for the artificially inflated prices. It became a luxury to somehow justify the high prices.
@Rianza I'd say make rent and real estate affordable for college graduates and airfares can go up. At least that way we can stay home and have a job. But with unaffordable rent, no companies hiring engineers, and cheap airfares, what makes sense to do is to fly to cheap Asian countries and rent an apartment there, which is what I did in 2010, and I'm still living in China to this day.
This is why I prefer rail travel. Bigger seats and the ability to walk around. Walking to the cafe car is fun or even better if it's a full service restaurant car. That's why studies have shown people are willing to take longer rail journeys in Europe vs flying.
I started taveling by train because one, I didn't want to deal with a nut who started screaming and cussing out the flight attendants and other passengers. And two, fear of flying.
Originally airlines had to compete with passenger rail so they had to offer these luxurys, after almost all passenger rail ceased to exist (exept for some amtrak lines) suddenly there wasn't any competition and alot more people chose to fly
That would explain why high speed trains makers hire top class designers (for example the italian ETR 500 was designed by Pininfarina, the designers of Ferraris).
America gave up on the Railways when it was the Railways who built America. Instead of traveling in a dehumanised way on a short hop flight, the Americans could have had the choice of a slightly longer but much more comfortable train ride.
Many of the luxuries found on airline during the 1950s and 1960s originate from ideas from trains. The Pullman company was basically a hotel on wheels.
I think this really represents the alterations in our quality of life. I mean look at how people visualized the future in all sorts of optimistic ways. Now everything is so bland & soulless & people can barely afford to exist at the lowest level standards.
The creator of the video mentioned in a comment he skipped over the heavy subsidies the airline industry received from the government in “older days” which allowed for such luxury X
"this is your pilot speaking, in the event of an emergency please matrix dodge the piano and lounge seats flying back towards you, and the giant ENIAC computer for playing pong... Don't worry someday your kids will get that reference, also remember there's no seat belts in the lounges, that's for your protection, as seatbelts just make it harder to fight other passengers out of the plane in an emergency landing"
My first memory of life was being on an airplane at 6 years old alone. Under the care of the crew. They were quite kind. Today, I couldn't fathom sending a child alone across the transatlantic. Times have changed how trusting were parents that shuttled children across the world like if you were riding a bike around the block.
What I find most interesting about this is that something like this has been happening throughout commercial aircraft history, in various forms. Airships always lost money because planes were faster and even the very rich would rather go faster. Then after World War II the last propeller planes were designed for luxury only to fail anyway because jets were faster. Speed always beats luxury. And most recently the A380 failed to live up to expectations because people preferred more frequent service over a larger plane.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Long-distance passenger trains are a different animal in that they were always operated at a loss, and there’s a whole complicated history there. Freight has always been the moneymaker due to the size and landscape of the country, and the whole system is optimized for that rather than passenger service. Maybe I should get you in touch with Kraut and the three of us could make a video about that.
@@SamAronow Sadly, due to trains' design, it is impossible to make a profit on any passenger rail, short, medium, long or high speed. Yup, freight trains is where most railways get their cash and makes passenger rail affordable and sustainable.
@@rzpogi I believe the Shinkansen is profitable, it’s simply that it takes a much larger investment than modern finance is willing to do to start getting proper profits back. Kinda like with nuclear power having a large repayment period.
Didn’t fly until I was in my 20s, because prior to deregulation the lower & middle classes couldn’t afford it. We saved to travel 90 miles by car or bus to visit relatives. I biked it once, but parents thought I was going to be killed by strangers. As a young adult, I commuted 2 hours 1 way. That 90 miles seems like nothing now, but growing up it might as well have been 3k miles.
I rarely flew first class, but coach was fine. Lot's a fun on the planes in the 1970s. Plenty of room to lay down across empty seats. People drinking, fooling around, sex in the bathroom. It was great back then.
I think in the old days, even in coach, as long as you are on a plane, you already had to be rich and famous. I remember my parents back in 1960s couldn't afford to fly. They used to travel by ships.
It isn't true you had to be rich and famous to fly, at least not in the 1950s and 1960s when I was a kid. My family was middle class- not even upper middle class- and my parents were as frugal as you could get, but we could afford to fly from time to time. Coach of course, which was very comfortable back then.
Counterintuitively, as prices have fallen, the experience of flying has gotten so terrible, so cramped, and so anxiety-inducing that 99% of the time I will choose to take a train, drive myself, or even ride a frigging ferry overnight instead of getting "cheap" plane tickets and being miserable the whole time
The 70’s, 80’s and early 90’s were the best flying years for me. Every year I would take a champagne flight to Hawaii. The packages were reasonably priced. The true downfall of glamorous flying was when the budget and no frills airlines showed up. They literally turned the airlines into flying Greyhound buses. And the passengers started to reflect that trend.
@@Spanabama, I meant more of how the passengers look and act. It was a treat to fly and you would wear nice clothing and spruce yourself up to go the airport. You would arrive at your terminal and Skycaps would greet you, take your luggage and issue your boarding pass. You either parked your car or a valet service would take care of your car. You went through minimal security and your family can see you off at the gate. Today, you see people getting on who looks like they haven’t seen a bar of soap in weeks. Dirty feet in open sandals, uncombed hair, some have a pungent smell about them. After 9/11, I cut my flying by 85%. After Covid, I stopped altogether. You can’t pay me to fly, anymore.
@@Macjohn1419 Absolutely, everything you said is true. A trip to the airport used to be a fun outing. Flying used to be an enjoyable experience. When I was young I actually would go to nice restaurants at the airport on dates.
@@Macjohn1419You're Absolutely right, it's because of the idiotic young people of today who don't care about whats right, only about doing whatever they feel like, PERIOD!!!!!
For my first airline flight when I was 8, my parents bougjt me my first blazer and taught me how to tie a tie. 1962 seems so long ago. Flying was an event back then.
I remember flying back around 1970 and my favorite airplane was the DC-8. You could actually change position in the seat or sit cross legged if you wanted. For that matter you could even stand up in front of your seat. But as a college student in those days the biggest perk was that student fares were automatically upgraded to first class if you flew after 10pm. And I don't remember any such things like "ground holds" happening where they load the plane and then decide to go nowhere for a couple of hours but refuse to return to the gate to let you wait in the terminal.
Most likely ground holds and other delays are because as flights have become more affordable, companies have started buying more planes leading to more crowded airports
I've had the opportunity to visit the Intrepid Museum in NYC years ago and go on a tour of their British Airways Concorde. Booking a 20-minute Concorde tour is the only way you can get on board their Concorde. My mom and I were the only ones doing the tour during the time we selected, so we had the Concorde to ourselves. The specific Concorde at the Intrepid is the G-BOAD, which made the fastest Transatlantic crossing of ANY Concorde at 2 hours, 52 minutes, and 59 seconds in 1996. The experience of being able to sit in the cockpit of the fastest Concorde, let alone be on a Concorde in general, is incredible. My mom has never been able to afford first-class, so even if the Concorde was retired, being on it was special to her because it was something she saw on TV growing up but never thought she'd actually go on it until the tour. BA didn't even call the Concorde first-class but rather Concorde Class as it exceeded first-class in their eyes. Sure flying was once glamorous, but de-regulation helped make flying available to more people. People like my family.
My dad became a pilot for Pennsylvania Central in 1942 which changed it's name to Capital which was merged into United in 1961. He retired in 1977. I grew up in the 50's riding on his passes when it was good and glamourous. I became a pilot for United in 1966 and retired in 2002. So I went from when it was good to when it had become a horror show. I loved flying. That's what I was born to do, but now I want nothing to do with it. I won't go near an airport. If I can't get there in my RV or on my Harley, I ain''t goin. Screw it!
@@ralphsanchico2452 Thanks. It is. Now the only flying that appeals to me would be in an ultralight where I can fly with the birds just above the trree tops.
@@billlawrence1899 I work at Pittsburgh International. The worst part about airport workers is that they are very UN professional. And the pilots are so unfriendly now.
How come stuff like this is never mentioned in Air Crash Investigation shows? Like, they are never like "the turbulence was so severe that all the booze in the pub spilled everywhere"
@@chlojolo that American 96 wasn’t a disaster was an “only by the skin of their teeth” thing though. The problem with that floor getting sucked down into the cargo compartment wasn’t who was on top of it, it was that many of the control cables ran though that floor. American 96 only just managed to retain control with the remains of the cables that were left.
@@JasperJanssen actually idk if it is relevant but Turkish 981 crashed due to passengers afraid of the big hole on the back side of the plane and left their seats to move in front of the plane. So the plane lost its balance and crashed.
That was so cool. My first flight on an airplane was as a teenager in 1973 and 74. I forgot about those days until I ran up on this video. Nostalgia for sure. I’m a subscriber now. Thx much for bringing back the memories.
My dad worked for a company whose higher ups insisted that their business associates flew first class on business trips, that is, until the energy crisis of the early 1970s. And then, all employees on business trips were given coach seating. Although I was a young kid who was in elementary school in the 1970s, I remember things being considerably different about airlines and the flight. The last time I flew on a giant plane, a 747 whose seating across the plane was 3 seats, an aisle, 6 seats, another aisle and 3 more seats, was in 1976. The meals were part of the cost of the ticket, as were the drinks and other beverages, seasoned almonds, peanuts and other snacks the stewardesses gave out to passengers throughout the flight.
All I could think of watching the lounges is please don’t hit turbulence!! Thank you for explaining what the heck happened to glamorous flying. Always wondered when we became cattle.
I was a kid the first time I flew in 1975. My mother wore a dress and heels, and I wore a suit and tie. We were served breakfast on china plates with real flatware; in coach. As we descended to our destination, the "stewardess" put a little lapel pin on my suit jacket. Now, people wear yoga pants or a thong and flip-flops. The seats are paper thin, and the flight attendants have to dodge blows from crazy passengers. I realize that it's more affordable to fly now, but I'm not sure the trade-off was worth it.
There is no trade-off. You can literally fly first class if you want that experience of rich people again. Be happy that with cheaper tickets more people can discover the world and visit their families. Instead of nagging about not having to wear suits and ties anymore😂
Flew international flights often in the 1960s between NYC and Asia with stops in LA and Hawaii as a kid. My parents always dressed up. I remember wide-bodies half-full and sleeping across 2-3 seats .
Thank you - an excellent answer to a question I've had for years. Flying today truly sucks. But that is also related to TSA issues. My answer to the question has been, "airfair is too cheap." Your video confirmed that, but for reasons I had not considered.
I do think that people who get obsessed with how nice flying used to be "in the good old days" tend to blow off price entirely while they're grumbling. If you look at the inflation adjusted cost of a transatlantic economy ticket from the early seventies, it would by you a business class ticket today. Lie flat seats, champagne, better food and entertainment than you would have gotten then. If you go the other direction and adjust down the cost of a 2022 economy ticket from New York to Chicago to a seventies amount of money, you wouldn't be traveling on a plane at all. You'd be lucky to be taking a bus.
Yeah now look at the wages in the 70s. They made a lot more money than we did, accounted for inflation. A lot more. Especially if you consider homes were dirt cheap, cars were dirt cheap, and groceries were dirt cheap. We have been scammed into abject poverty.
The difference was that wages were higher in the 70s, so our shitty tickets now feel as expensive as the skylounges of the 70s. We were born at the wrong time.
Great video and I agree deregulation was the big change. The ads for lounges, piano bars, fancy dining, etc in the air - and the nostalgia for them - never mention weather and turbulence. That knocked plenty of those martinis out of people's hands! Problem was obviously worse before jet travel - and again never mentioned now - when the prop planes couldn't travel above the weather. Victor and Ilsa Laszlo would not have had a comfy flight on the "[Pan Am] Clipper to America."
We now have a cattle car approach in order to accommodate vastly more flyers. This has not lead to a more pleasurable flying experience to be sure. This presentation was done well and was enjoyable to watch. Thanks for the effort…
I was once on a flight where there were 13 rows of EMPTY seats . The flight attendants said we couldn’t move to an empty seat because we paid for the particular seat we were sitting in. On a recent flight, I was CHARGED EXTRA if I had brought 1 normal sized carry on luggage. Airplane industry is SO DUMB.
The reason you can’t move seats is because the plane is trimmed by the pilots based on the weight distribution being a certain way. If everyone moves to different seats it upsets that. Having said that in my experience they’ve let people move to different seats during cruise but make them move back during landing.
@@mrsmith1097 Is everyone going to move to different sits? No,.only few person would. Don't try to make up excuses for shitty service, separate people do not account that much for weight distribution
You can't move because the weight distribution on an aircraft can affect the balance. It is an aeroplane not a house. This goes with your carry on bag as well, everything is listed on the terms and conditions when you book a flight. Educate yourself before flying and attacking airlines and the people that work for them as they risk their lives trying to get everyone home or away
My earliest memories of a plane was 1968. I was 5 and older sister, Firstgirl was moving to Germany with husband an Army Captain. At SFO, they allowed me and our dad to walk onto the tarmac and board just to look at the inside of the plane. It was massive with an upstairs lounge and a little nursery for my baby niece. I see today's plane service as steerage.
I’m flying to New Zealand next week and New Zealand Airlines has a new thing called a SkyCouch. It’s in coach, and it’s basically 3 seats that can raise up the footrests to be level with the seat. So it’s kinda like a couch and you can lay down and stretch out. Talk about glamorous! My wife and I paid an extra $500 for it, so it better be worth it!
Is that the one where it's a three person set up. Two down on the floor and one seat above the two lower seats? If it is. I would worry about the top person passing gas.😊
How you buy your ticket (and how those options are presented) has also changed *a lot*. Back in the day the options were sorted by 'departure time' or 'total length of trip' and the price was an afterthought. (Which it often actually was if you were flying on expenses). Also it was presented by someone else looking at the computer screen who quickly lost interest in helping you the harder you tried finding the lowest fare (travel agents usually got a percentage of the ticket price for their service so their main interest certainly wasn't spending more time/effort on your behalf for earning less commission). Now you mainly sort by price and you are the one that benefits directly from a lower fare - whether that means 'looking harder' or 'accepting a tradeoff'. This obviously affects the outcome.
It depends. On a short flight (less than 3-4 hours) I can wait in a cheap cramped seat to get where I want and enjoy an actual piano bar at the destination, rather than the tacky bar on the plane, especially if that meant a cheaper price and an ability to fly many more times each year. But on a longer flight, creature comforts are definitely welcome (like wider seats), even at a higher price. Lounges and bars on airplanes are usually very tacky. Having said that, one of the best meals I ever had was on a plane in business class.
I recently did something I never thought I would do in my life as a frugal individual: I paid for a first class ticket on a long distance flight because I knew the coach section of that airline was terrible. I can't afford to do it regularly, and all I got was a wider seat, slightly more legroom, and an actually decent meal. All of these things were what coach flying was just 10-15 years ago. I still remember Continental's Gordon Bethune crowing about how Continental still served "Meals at mealtime". That was in the early 00's. Nobody does this at all now.
The logistics of loading meals onto the plane, and the benefit it brings to passengers doesn’t make it worth it. I’d rather get my own crappy sandwich if it increases the odds my flight leaves on time
@@blitzkrieg634 What? airplane tickets are significantly cheaper than ever before if you account for inflation. Why do you think airlines need to provide the same service they used to when the tickets are far lower now than they were back then? If prices were always going up, that would be one thing, but prices since then have gone down.
I think it's very similar to what happened with motorway services. When the motorways first opened, the service stations were seen as glamorous and luxurious - people even used to go on day trips to them! They had high-end restaurants with table cloths, waiters and proper crockery and cutlery. Nowadays, they're just somewhere to stop and rest. People's preferences changed as it was no longer a marvel, but a part of normal life. They now wanted to stop for as little time as possible and thus services filled with fast food places and small shops selling snacks, magazines, etc. I have noticed a slight shift back to the old ways though in recent years, as people got fed up with the same few places to eat with no quality options for those that want them. Some services now have slightly healthier options like noodles bars or sit down restaurants (still chains, rather luxury restaurants though) or even farm shops! I wonder if planes might start to see similar changes in the next few years as people are starting to move away from air travel again - it's now inconvenient and uncomfortable and not necessarily cheaper than the alternatives. If people want convenience, they'll drive; if they want cheap, they'll get a coach; if they want comfort, they'll take the train. Air travel only really wins on speed and this is often negated by how early you have to arrive at the airport. I can see flying becoming mostly for longer distances, where the pros would still outweigh the cons. I don't think most people would want to take several weeks to get to their destination by boat for example!
Don't forget about all the Buckyes that are opening up along the interstate highways. Have fun getting a parking space, filling up, and getting trampled in the retail section.
@@manomaylr So does Fleet, since it was refurbished. Not sure I'd quite call it luxury, although definitely a step up from some of the other offerings. Gloucester is supposed to be quite swanky, but I've never been myself.
I think one thing that gets lost is the government, during the glamorous days, was still heavily subsidizing the airline industry. They could afford to cater to the upper class because they were getting loads of tax dollars from lower/middle class people. You briefly mentioned subsidies, but people really underestimate how much money came from the government. Lots of these airlines would have failed earlier if not for subsidies.
If you look at subsidies for airports and the air traffic control network, the government is still putting in a lot of tax dollars to support air travel. Meanwhile we have an entrenched political faction that resents every penny spent on Amtrak.
@@arthurbrumagem3844 That's true, if your only goal is getting to LA. If you want to see some of the USA, take the train. I've done Chicago to San Francisco and it was a lot of fun.
A factor not mentioned here is that as prices fell dramatically (in constant dollars, a coach ticket in the 70s cost roughly what a business class ticket does today), more and more people with less disposable income started flying. Airliners were no longer just the preserve of the middle-middle- to upper-middle class.
Happy New Year, Phil! Great vid - though I will have to say a huge part of the de-glamorisation of flight has to do with the airport experience too. The immersion-breaking experience when watching an airport chase finale in any 1990s romcom.
That's true - though I must admit Newark airport was kinda nice recently. However, there was no Love Actually moment where a cherubic blonde boy professed his love to his classmate.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Phil, I've been holding this back for long enough. Today is the day. I love you, Phil. I've always loved you, since the day we didn't meet. That soft silver hair, the mustache, those meaty glasses atop a perfectly sculpted face. Let's run away, Phil. We'll go somewhere your subscribers will never find us. The Caribbean, or that one gym down on 10th street.
@@PhilEdwardsInc you gotta come on out to Vancouver then, YVR is one of the nicest airports you'll ever see, perfect for your next romantic confession😂
Great info. Thanks! I remember the days of way more space on planes in coach. I have flown first class on emirates with a private berth and the relative price of that seat and coach was in the 10s of thousands. Incredible! I think we have gone too far though. The coach seats are so claustrophobic and they don’t seem to have taken into consideration that a lot of travellers are bigger.
Just take the price of the ticket then, adjust it for inflation and here is your answer. You see back then riffraffs took Greyhound busses for travel, now they switched to air travel. And... Airlines lose money on economy seats (at least on transatlantic flights). All the profit is from first class and business class passengers for whom the travel is as glamorous as ever. This, and also, back then they also had an extra incentive to draw people into this new mode of transportation.
This was SOOOO GOOD! ❤ I have what’s called Osteogenesis Imperfecta or brittle bones and from the age of six months (1989) I started flying to Washington DC every six months to participate in a study for my bones at NIH. So in my life I’ve flown almost 100 times and I was able to catch the very tail end of the “good old days” of flying lol. If there were empty seats in first class my mom would tell me to ask the stewardess if we could move up and 9/10 times they’d say yes! I can remember drinking chocolate milk in a champagne glass! But as 9/11 happened, everything changed 😮💨
9/11 was the final blow to a recession that changed business travel. Also, factor an ever improving Internet that made teleconferences more practical. The 90s saw a boom in air travel and a boom in tech. As a chauffeur who started in '97, I heard all about business and first class travel on planes. Companies could spend ridiculous amounts on travel and the programs airlines had made it easy enough to achieve elite statuses, especially with how much business travelers would fly. Planes could run with a lesser load because the airlines were charging a ton for business and first class tickets. In the early 2000s, business travel completely flipped. Instead of chauffeuring people around in a stretch limo, we used Suburbans and Navigators. Instead of 2 guys riding around in a limo, we'd have a team of 6 stuffed into an SUV. If there were 2, it was sedan only. But these same companies also started making more of their employees ride coach or only choose business if the cost or flight length met a certain threshold. The 90s were a different animal to the 00s for business travel. That meant needing to fill the planes was now of paramount importance. The way routes are constructed, the ease of finding flight prices online and dependability of planes have all fed the entire public buying into flying much more than they ever did before. As long as people want the cheapest, flying will be like this for the foreseeable future.
@@derbagger22 yup I couldn’t agree more. Travel was relaxed and laid back one min and then on 9/12 it was 100% different. Granted I was a kid at the time but nearly every time I would fly they would invite me into the cockpit before AND DURING the flight and let me push a few inconsequential buttons lol. The 90s were the best decade. Micro machines, SNES and NSYNC… the 90s had it alllllll
My first flight was on a United Airlines Caravelle. We had steak in coach, served on a real plate with silverware. Everyone on board was well dressed and behaved. No pajamas back then.
“Jet set” was literally the descriptor of a class of people. Now almost everyone flies. It has definitely been democratized, and with that, you take the rough with the smooth…
Have lived in Korea and Japan for the last 20 years. I never fly U.S. carriers anywhere. KAL, Asiana Air, Japan Air are far preferable for service, experience and they way we are treated on the plane is fantastic. One of the nicest things is, I get to pick my seat in coach and do not have to pay extra for it -- and I get two free carry on bags and checked luggage can be heavier
I really do believe you hit on something there! How often do you see videos uploaded about a passenger or passengers acting in woefully in an unruly manner on a foreign flight or airline?
I find it Interesting and a sign of the times that 1st class used to be very social ( lounges /bar etc…) now you crawl into a comfortable but isolating pod.
I loved Continental, great airline. Too bad United took it over. What’s really awful about travel today is how squashed it is, trying to squeeze the max amount of people into narrower seats, no leg room and very uncomfortable seats. I’d love to see the airline execs take a 6 hr flight in coach. I remember when the change over happened and for one leg of my trip I got an older plane that hadn’t been reconfigured yet. I thought I died and went to heaven.
My grandfather was an exec at PanAm in the 60's and 70's so I got to see the glamour side of flying. For my post-military career, I flew all over the world as a trainer and flew on the gov't dime so it was always the back-of-the-bus coach seats. But I refuse to this day to lower my personal standards so I fly in a shirt, tie, jacket, and hat (no, ballcaps don't count as hat!). I can tell you that the cabin crew appreciates the effort (and general kindness to them) and I often get upgraded. When I fly on my dime for long-distance flights, I will pay a little bit extra for the economy plus seats to get a little extra legroom for this long-legged cowboy. Life is more about how you deal with it than how it is served up to you. Great video!
I have read a lot about the aviation industry for decades, but this is the first time I have seen this question addressed so well. Great Video Phil. I have subscribed!
I will add that this is also the period when the US Postal service predominately switched from transporting mail by trains to planes. It's also the time when the federal reserve started transporting money on planes rather than trains. When the train industry lost these contracts it was one of the main factors which made passenger train service unprofitable in the US.
Another aspect to consider is that in the 50-60's airlines were competing with ocean liners as well at the time, where glamour was also being heavily marketed to attract passengers to their dwindling passenger counts due to their much longer trips (at least a few days to cross the atlantic vs several hours on a plane). 😊
When I came up from Jamaica in 1972.....I had a full course meal with real silverware. Seemingly unlimited soda (the can) not in a plastic cup. My aunt, who I flew up with, was holding on to a meal in a pot. She had it in her lap while we flew....Only put it down when it was time to eat.
They went from extreme regulation to literally no regulation outside of safety regulations, and with the way seats are packed in today, I am skeptical as to whether a plane could be evacuated in the regulated time in an actual emergency. The regulators need to establish what the minimum in seat pitch should be. Soon there will be standing room only on some airlines where you have to pay extra to sit down! (that is only half in jest). Yes people want cheap fares, but outside of the pandemic, most well run airlines were very profitable. There also needs to be a halt to the industry consolidating, and laws against predatory pricing that drives out new entries when the legacy carriers lower prices to below cost. It doesn't have to be so awful. After this Christmas debacle by Southwest...consumers should demand these changes.
After spending decades in the airline industry, I believe that in the 90's the biggest influence on cheapening the airline experience occurred. That began the decade of the internet boom where folks would create a company, brought it public and sold it for ridiculous profits. In the airline industry it became common practice to include crazy stock packages to many of the upper management hires sighting a need to get the best and brightest. But in reality it was a revolving door where the same group would get hired over and over throughout the industry receiving huge stock gifts. Each time there was a new CEO the shareprice would rocket up and all was well. At some point due to dilution and monthly selling by management personnel the stock price would begin to drop. Cost cutting and fuel costs became the crying point for whichever airline felt the need to go into bankruptcy protection and start the entire process over and issue new shares. Taxpayers bail out was common. The new CEO would enter with a new package and loads of stock at rock bottom prices. In the case of United, the employees were given stock ownership and ironically short thereafter, they went into bankruptcy and poof, it's all gone. So today, they care very little about customer service and more about cutting costs to the barest of minimum because that relates best to shareholders and stock price. We went from an airline pleasurable experience to the greyhound bus, pack 'em in like sardines experience. People fighting on aircraft and homeless riding with one way fares to get them out of major cities with problems. Cost cutting, contracting services and hiring at ultra low rates has turned air travel into a risky endeavor. I'm surprised we don't see more accidents. My solution was to pay management by long term customer and employee satisfaction. rather than by the share price which has been a disaster. Never happen though. Make sure you fasten your seatbelts and put your try tables in an upright position. This is going to be a rough flight
Thank you for the perspective of an 'insider,' which confirms what I have always thought. It's similiar to Wal-mart's strategy of offshoring production to obliterate their competition. Consumers flocked to Walmart, but the company's procurement strategy contributed to the collapse of American manufacturing, which eviscerated the jobs of working class and middle class Americans. Big Box retail, like Walmart also contributed to the declining economies of small towns. But for Walmart it's a win, because they now have a self perpetuating demographic partly composed of an economically distressed clientele. With automation looming, we can expect even less, perhaps flights without flight attendants.
Great way to start the year Phil! Happy new year to all who are looking forward to some new insights from Phil into how history is shaped in little tweaks that only reveal themselves in the big picture. Thanks!!!
In 1978 I was stationed at Grand Forks Air Force Base and bought a round trip ticket to and from Evansville Indiana. It cost me $325 (with a 10% military discount!) but I only made $5,400 that year! So it essentially cost me 6% of my annual income. So, if you make $40,000 a year now could you imagine paying $2,400 for a round trip ticket to fly just HALFWAY across the U.S.?
People are so crammed that it's resulted in so much "air rage". One could make the argument that some modest regulation to mandate an increase in the space per passenger is a matter of national security and safety. Certainly it would be an improvement in consumer protection. It seems that consumer protections have been eroding over the past few decades in general. I don't think going back to the regulation from the 70s makes sense, but bringing in some modest amount of consumer protection seems necessary at this point.
Yeah I would love to know how consumer protection works these days considering some of the fees. They're all posted, but they can be quite hidden. It'd be nice to see final costs in search results, for example, after fees.
Sadly yes. Nowadays noone would care about the piano lounges. I would say we are so jaded that even if they would offer food like free popcorn most would be suspicious and ask what is the catch, how much extra is this? Lol. We have gotten so cynical to the amenities they had back then it wouldn't be really taken with a smile but a smirk like hm, how much extra is that costing me. Traveling by plane Nowadays is a means to an end, not really a luxurious experience as how it was back in the 70s. And remember the trade off would be all that cigarette smells in the planes back then too, yucky!
There is nothing "sad" about it. Nowadays, anyone with the ability to fly on a plane also has the ability to bring their own entertainment with them. Why should they pay extra for entertain chosen for them and forced camaraderie with strangers? It's a several-hour trip on a bus in the air, not a grand tour on the Orient Express.
@@capricorndrbird it's important to be cynical nowadays. If you check into a better hotel and are not cynical, you may end up paying hundreds of dollars using the hotel rooms emnities.
My biggest peeve with flying is not the price. It is the fact that it is not an honest price. They give you a price but by the time you have added luggage, food, being forced to pay extra to be seated together you ad about 20% to the price.
@@robertlee6338 Obviously you did not read what I wrote. It is not the price it is the fact that the price is not honest. It does not matter if it is low cost or full service. The first price that shows up is not the final price like it used to be.
Idk where you have been flying but thats not my experience. Im in the Philippines rn and flew from the US. Only paid for my ticket which also included 2 bags to carry on. Meals werent charged nor were the drinks. You just suck
That piano bar was something. It reminds me of a disaster movie of which I don't recall the name anymore, in which there was a grand piano (!) on board of an airplane and then disaster struck (and not only the keys) and the piano crushed everybody (probably they forgot to lock the wheels). But I digress. Thanks for uploading and happy new year.
@@jst7714 yes, it is possible there was a piano in The Poseidon Adventure. But it was definitely on a plane and it seems 'Airport 77' has a 'piano man' (a character that seems to be blind, enhanced by the fact that the actor playing him is not exactly aiming very precise at his (invisible) piano). And it is not clear where this scene is located because we see a very copiously decorated bar of a hotel. th-cam.com/video/5lYzb8va49I/w-d-xo.html
@@PhilEdwardsInc People would be better served if you looked into the monopoly power and disinvestment in infrastructure by freight companies...the Autotrain has been done (and reasonably well) by another channel.
I love the style of these videos so much! I really trust that you are credible. These videos give me lots of joy. If possible a sources cited page would be amazing. I know how much work it is but if convenient moments arise it would be fantastic
yes! i typically put everything important in the description. don't include all the newspaper links, but almost everything else makes it in. feel free to comment or email if a particular one is missing.
When flying became more affordable, the same people who used to ride the Greyhound started flying. That's when all the in-flight incidents involving passengers fighting, assaulting stewardesses, ect.
@@draggonsgate It was lack of security that led to the booming of that Pan Am flight. Same as 9/11 security became to lax an after thought, After 9/11 a police state.
@@MHdollrevievs What I meant was the lawsuits that followed, did irreparable damage to already financially strapped airlines, let alone the reputation loss.
I remember when younger my grandparents told me riding the train was a classy way to travel. I prefer traveling by air because its faster. My first flight was on Continental airline from LAX to Houston in the 70s.
I remember almost everything about the first time I flew. In the summer of 1970, my folks approached me, telling me it would be my choice of what our family did next year for summer vacation. They gave me a choice of an in ground pool, or flying to California and spend the summer with my mother’s sisters family. I chose California. I had never flown before, I was more than excited. When my dad started planning our trip, I asked if he could PLEASE see if we could fly on the new 747. He came home from the travel agent with disappointing news. We would fly into San Diego, and the airport wasn’t big enough for the new jumbo jet. I was still excited. We’d fly from DTW, to Chicago, and then arrive in California. I thought summer vacation would never arrive. I got my first “adult” luggage, new clothes for the summer, and we were going to Disneyland and Mexico too. It would be a trip to remember. The day arrived, my grandfather came by to take us to the airport. I’d never seen a place so big. Our flight arrived, a bright silver AA 707. We boarded and I was given the window seat. When we arrived in Chicago, we stayed on the plane, and others boarded. I fell asleep some where over Kansas. My mother woke me up when we were close to landing. When we walked through the door, I was surprised about the stairs to the tarmac. My aunt and uncle were waiting for us all smiles. Our summer adventure began the next morning. It was a beautiful vacation, I felt very lucky. When July was over, my dad had to get back to work at Ford, but my mom and I stayed an extra 3 weeks. I was ready to get back and start school. I’d miss California, but we’d seen just about everything. A few days before our trip, my mom told me instead of flying through Chicago, we’d be flying through LAX. We were dropped off at the airport by my uncle. This flight was on a 727, we boarded from the rear stairs. The flight was very short. LAX was bigger than DTW, and looked confusing, but my mom got us to our gate. The plane would be at the gate shortly. After about 30 minutes my mom said “look John, here comes our plane”. A 747 was pulling up to the jet walk. “Are you surprised?” My mom asked. I couldn’t believe it. After my dad was back home, he pulled some strings and arranged this surprise for me. My head was spinning as we boarded. There were so many people. We found our seats and soon we were flying down the runway. I couldn’t believe this huge thing would be in the air soon. I was so happy with the surprise. After lunch I asked the stewardess if I could see the upstairs lounge. It was for first class only. I tried. I had to visit the men’s room and headed back the rear of the plane. When I walked through the partition, I didn’t believe my eyes, there was a cocktail lounge with club chairs, tables with chrome mushroom lamps, and a bar with a bartender. I went back to my mom. She didn’t believe me at first until we were both sitting at a table looking out at the Grand Canyon. She ordered drinks for us. It was the best part of the trip. When we arrived in DTW, my dad was at the gate grinning, he asked “well, well, well? What did you think?” I thanked him so much. I told him how it was the best part of the summer. Now everyone wears flip flops and t shirts, the magic is gone.
I had a teacher that grew up rich and loved talking about flying back in the day. He said they would go shopping and buy fancy outfits for their plane ride. He said flying was a beautiful thing “until you poor people ruined it” 😂 I miss Mr. P
While flying has become more ' accessible ' to everyone, I absolutely despise as to how it became that way. It is now an uninspiring, mundane, stressful and rather depressing experience. I wish for not just air travel, but all forms of travel, to become classy and elegant again.
It is still glamorous if you pay the same as people would pay back then for their tickets. A tourist class ticket of the day compares to a premium class nowadays and you get much better service and features, like lie flat seats and individual screens.
It still sucks! First class flight attendants, just as much as coach flight attendants, still hate their jobs, their pay, their passengers, their airline. The seat in 1st class is more comfortable, wait we have to PAY MORE to be comfortable?
Few people realize the connection between airline regulation and the level of comfort they get in this business. Great job! As an airplane lover (aeronautical engineer here), I saw the seats and space shrink tremendously from 80s to 2010s, and I really hate to see the planes we design and build with a 34 inch pitch in mind, being squeezed to 29 inch by airline competition. This also leads to windows not being aligned with the seats which is why you might sit on a row with two half windows instead of a decent outside view. I think the 50s and 60s were too opulent with few people being able to afford to fly, but todays environment is also humiliating. It is not just about lack of space, it is getting to a point that is also starting to pinch on safety. If you sit on a confined space for too long it can lead to blood clogging, and some regional airline pilots are getting such low pay after so much investment in training, that discourages young people to pursue this career. The aftermath is that there are less pilots for an ever increasing demand for flights, and this will lead to more flight cancelations, and abusive business practices such as overbooking, while the rich are flying on private jets increasing carbon footprint. In my opinion there needs to be a balance of regulation and free competition. The government should not interfere on price practice, flight routes, and general services, but it should regulate the safety, working conditions, and minimum seat pitch for the general public health. If anyone reading this thinks the same, maybe you should take a look at what senators Tammy Duckworth and Tammy Baldwin are advocating for.
Thank you Phil! Very informative, I work in Asia so have managed to be comfortable during flights to and fro but the contrast is very vast from the glamour days 🥺 Hugs from Asia 🌺
Just give me better and more comfortable seating and I'll be a happy flyer. It is crazy to think about all the glamour involved in the earlier years of flying. Kinda wish it didn't cost so much. In a perfect world of balance between flight prices and good service I think I would be more willing to travel and fly more than now.
Planes are absurdly expensive, uncomfortable, and inconvenient as compared to any other mode of public transit. I really wish the US had a decent passenger rail system like in Europe, China, Japan, etc.
Piano bar in a plane? I remember taking a TRAIN that had a piano bar... and it was Amtrak. One of my best trips ever, the party went all night. Those were also the days when trains had real dining cars, with waiters, real china, sit down meals ordered from a menu, just like dining out in a restaurant. Good times.
you've hit it phil! consistantly great videos, unique editing with funny bits. and the Clinton in the back referencing that video is great. So happy to see you reach this point :)
It all falls on one thing from flying to supermarkets to ANYTHING that involves consumers. That thing is EXPECTATIONS. When the public at large has lower expectations then standards DROP. Consumers determine the market value and quality. If people keep paying for airline tickets and continue to accept crap for service then the airlines will lower their standard of service to increase profits. When people stop accepting crap then things get better. It applies to nearly everything in our daily lives.
I didn't know you had this personal channel. I love it! And...I think the industry now a days is so different. "You'll never be glamour". Even among the american carriers, the "glamourous" business class leaves a lot to be desired lol.
This makes me think of a cause and effect cycle particularly in the US - back in post world war 2 US flux with cash and social programs, wages up and inflation down... A cost war wouldn't have thrived, consumers wanted luxury. But is it fair to say that modern consumers want cheapest when their wages are nowhere near close what they used to be? When they want cheap so they can afford it? And is it a cycle of cost slashing also partly responsible for wage drops (To keep prices down, companies underpay). Are CEO's and mega business owners given TOO much freedom to pay themselves with all the benefits of cost-slashing, therefore cornering the luxury market and forcing everyone else into a cheap economy? -- It just makes me think about it, as I wish I just had a few more inches of chair width.
The main goal was to destroy traditional currency for the last 100 years. I always wondered if their was only other part in history where they purposely wanted destruction this lethal.
In college, 1987-1991, going home for Christmas break, I could check my suitcase and “carryon” for free, and take my saxophone (properly cased, it wasn’t THAT crazy), big winter coat, and purse to my seat, which was usually the only occupied one in my row or at least had an empty seat in the middle. Overhead compartments were mostly empty. The cheapest tickets also cost like $600 from MSP to FWA and back, bought way in advance, and had to be purchased by my parents at a travel agency and physically mailed to me. It was much more pleasant, and I also liked just strolling through a metal detector instead of being displayed and groped like a medical specimen. I love when they have the dogs + old metal detectors at our airport. Absolute bliss. Still have to take my shoes off but whatever.
Less money spent on the flight means more money spent at the destination of the vacation. Lower fares is a win for me, even if it means sacrificing comfort.
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Another interesting thing is that nowadays most modern airlines lose money on flights, and make all their profit from the points & rewards card system. So they're basically credit card companies that do flying as a side hustle.
Fan of Wendover? Love that video
That may be the case in America, but not over here in Europe.
Their reward miles drive share prices and valuation. Nice to see you mention it!
@@fatmirzekaj5582 I think here in Europe it's the riddiculously priced extras. Got an EMail from EasyJet a couple days ago, about flying to some nice and sunny place for just 49 CHF or something.
Took a quick look at it, if I would like to bring some luggage with me, maybe have a seat where I don't torture my knees by pressing them against the next one, the price easily goes up 2.5 times.
Now, if you also fancy a quick snack and coke on the Airplane, add another 10 or more to it.
But I guess, if I was younger and a bit smaller, traveling could be insanely cheap. Mail your clothing there, mail back at end, travel only with a small backpack.
@@RevCode Easyjet - luxury travel, Ryannair - they would charge you money just to breath in flight if they could.
People are surprised with how glamorous it was to fly coach back then but perhaps they don't realise that it was as expensive as first class is today!
At least I could fit in the seat.
@@mbogucki1 Are the seats smaller now or you bigger?
@@scmoratti Smaller. There was even plans on making it even tighter with having seats above you (luckily it never happened...still possible in the future)
@@mbogucki1 You still have the option of purchasing a bigger seat today, and it'll still be cheaper than flying coach back then. For the rest of us that can fit the smaller seats, we get to enjoy an even bigger cost savings
So what if it was expensive? It was a thousand times better.
I remember my first flight in 1977 -- I was 9 and our family was flying from NY to Bermuda. Mom told me that I had to get a new "outfit" for the flight because people dressed up for flying. We were in coach, but had TV dinner style trays served to us with a hot meal (no one asked for money or a credit card). I dreamed to be a "stewardess" when I grew up...then I grew up and thought NO THANK YOU! Times change and everything comes down to dollars and cents. Great video!
Some ppl still dress to fly. I do.
Same. I remember my first flight to Singapore as a kid in the 70s. My family dressed up & we still do… no shorts, flip flops or sleveless shirts.
@@trawlins396 why
@@awesomeguy3211 cause it's what I prefer.
I too dress to fly. In comfortable clothing with a jacket just in case it gets cold. With probably messy hair to match
There's an old saying in New York "If YOU can get into Studio 54, then it's not Studio 54 anymore." Flying stopped being glamorous as soon as an average person could afford a ticket. Then it became a bus in the sky.
A crappy bus in the sky!!!!
Wouldn't gaining more customers like this generate more revenue for the air lines?
So true. Excellent point.
Some planes are literally called airbus
So…air travel should have only ever been accessible to the asshat elite?
What bothers me most about air travel isn't the amenities, it's the delays and security theater. It's not uncommon to spend more time in air terminals than in the air. And the lousy TSA doesn't make that experience any better.
Yeah, I didn't get into this in the video, because I don't understand it/didn't research it - but I gather that much of the congestion at airports is also a consequence of deregulation increasing flights without increasing airport/controller capacity.
Yeah, security theater. But this was interesting about the lounges. Now, it's all about airside ground lounges accessed by credit cards. But yeah, as a tall man, shrunk seat pitch requires me to buy domestic first class, which is less seat pitch than domestic coach class used to be. (Transatlantic and ME3 are another story.)
@@PhilEdwardsInc also after 9/11 they just made flying on an airplane more difficult without actually preventing any terrorism which was supposed to be the point. Like all the taking your shoes off and getting X-ray’d hasnt prevented anything and is effectively for no reason. Before you could basically just walk in w your ticket.
No one is going to suggest getting rid of the TSA because when the first tragedy happens in a post-TSA world, that person will take all of the blame and they'll just bring the TSA back.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Good insight into the airline industry. I enjoyed watching it. The deregulation of the airline industry caused a trade off, favoring load capacity, but creating lower prices for the consumer which can be viewed as a positive or a negative, depending on your preference. However, it really was George W. Bush's signing of the ATSA that not only caused the "flying experience" to become hellish, but it also made the "airport experience" miserable. Before the TSA, being at an airport was an enjoyable experience , but now they feel more like prisons that you want to flee from. An idea for your next video maybe?
Okay, thank you for this.
When I was very young, my mom and me had to switch planes along with a bunch of other passengers.
I remembered there being a pong table on this plane, but for the last several years now, in looking that up,
I could never find any references of this being a thing. I thought it was my imagination or a dream I remembered.
Oh those were real. Continental Airlines in fact installed pong table screens in the onboard lounges of their 747’s and DC-10’s back in the late 60s. Get a drink and play pong while at 40,000 feet.
As a long retired pilot I was set to gig you on minor errors, but you did a great job. That was the environment. In the 70s, experts were opining that a 70% system load factor was the max possible. Crandall (American) put that to rest with his 'yield management ' system that he learned during his time at Hallmark.
The irony is that the Kennedy-Cannon Deregulation Act was supposed to lead to more competitors than the "Legacy 12". Instead, over the long run, it has led to fewer.
Yip....there's always a Kennedy in there to screw it up somewhere.
And no one has bothered to correct the ‘error’
No way it has led to fewer airlines. Mergers certainly happened, but this was largely due to other factors like aircraft technology and range improving (leading to what were basically regional airlines consolidating), mismanagement, the oil crisis, and consolidation which is common in more established industries. Overall the increased competition has at least led to far more demand now that many can afford to fly. Before deregulation, low cost carriers were essentially impossible (save for Southwest, but this was because they were not subject to the CAB's terrible management). Spirit, Allegiant, Sun Country, Frontier, etc. could not exist in the 1970s. Routes have greatly expanded too.
@@CarterHancockdo some research on how many airlines delta American and united have eaten up over the years. Regional airlines are basically extinct. It’s a big 3 with 6 other large airlines and that’s about it.
Every moment of interaction I’ve had, as a customer, with the airline industry in the last 10 years has been misery. Everything. Shopping for tickets, paying for tickets, managing luggage, waiting here, waiting there, crowding in over here, hearding into the tube, packing into a pathetic seat, dealing with fellow customers, trying to resolve an issue, facing unexpected costs, all of it, every part of this industry is awful. I do everything I can to avoid this type of travel now.
@ anckrnews, that is exactly the Globalist's intentions, to put you off traveling, job done
Air travel now is total misery and it's destroying travel. Taking a train in the USA is out of the question since so many rail lines were ripped out.
@@karlabritfeld7104 yes, always thought it would be a great experience to travel across America by train. Why did they rip so many tracks up ? I guess that's why everyone needs a car. Here in the UK, I have always managed to get to work by train, or bike. Where I live is relatively flat, so always had a bike. Public transport has got worse over the years and much more expensive, like everything else in this world. If I had the choice, would rather live in the US rather than the UK, which is like a third world country now, over crowded with illegal immigrants, poor standard of health care, customer service, everything closed and run down. At least in the states there is plenty of space, people have their guns, to ward off tyrannical nut job Govmint foot soilder's... I guess we can all relate to each other in regards to how the conspiracy is actually - the war is against us, in all reality. I know my enemy, but on a positive note, I know my Saviour Jesus Christ and. his love for you .,...too 🙂❣️🙏
I totally agree with you a complete nightmare I have chosen never to fly again I'm done it's too painful for my body it's too exhausting it's not enjoyable it's really a nightmare.
that and airports are always far away from civilization at least in my country.
I started flying in the 50s. On my first unaccompanied flight from London to Madrid when I was 7, my grandparents didn't get the telegram telling them the flight number of my flight, so I was left alone at the baggage carousel until one of the stewardesses saw me, took pity on me, and took me to her house till she could find my grandparents the next day. That would be frowned upon today. Since then, I have flown extensively throughout 4 continents, from DC3s to Concordes (I have 23 flights on the Concord) and even allowed to sit in the 1st officer seat flying out of Amman until we arrived in Heathrow. I once flew from JFK to LHR on New Year's Eve and was the only passenger on the flight, -it was a lot of fun. I have lived it all. I used to love the excitement of taking off, knowing that something new would be waiting for me when I arrived. That all has changed, as you have pointed out so eloquently. I no longer fly commercial as it is too...unhumanizing. Besides I'm retired.
I bet you have great stories about your travels. What is your favorite destination? I too love to travel and actually travel a lot. I do mostly for work but I squeeze in a personal one as much as possible.
@@dontshoot7665 Yes, and I would have spent some time in social services or whatever it is called.
@@deverismx3618 My fav always was the next destination. I did write about some trips in various books I published. Fun times.
@@dontshoot7665 not sure where you're from, but where i'm from, kidnapping is frowned upon....
This is an amazing comment. What was your work area? That allowed for so much traveling. I’m really curious.
I feel like it's a whole journey vs destination thing. I feel like flying used to be treated more as an experience in itself, whereas now it's simply a means to an end - a way to get from point A to point B. Treating it as purely a mode of transport encourages lower prices so you have more to spend at your destination, but equally it encourages a steady degrading of comfort and experience, because your only goal is to pass the time until you get to where you want to go.
The problem is that when you combine it with the torturous (and largely excessive) security process, unless you're going somewhere inaccessible by other means, you don't really save much time, and you arrive at your destination tired, grumpy, and with a massive crick in your neck. Plus you probably got groped by a stranger in the process.
Flying nowadays is DEEPLY unpleasant, and I think they've started to reach a critical point where the price is no longer the issue. I think they need to simplify check in and security, make airports less depressing, and stop scrunching the seats closer and closer together. I would be willing to pay more for all of those things. I just want to be able to go on holiday without arriving in intense physical and mental discomfort.
Honestly, flying today is both very uncomfortable and very stressful. If it could just be basically comfortable and low-stress, I'd be much more willing to fly much more.
Premium cabins often have priority check in&priority security and nicer seats as well as improved service. You already can pay more for those things and many do
Imagine going to a priority check in lane with no line, the check in agent walks you over to security and puts you at the front of the express line, then you’re whisked off to a lounge to wait for boarding.
Once boarding starts (or just before) you’re driven from the lounge to the gate, given priority boarding and once onboard you’re shown to your lay flat bed & offered a welcome drink
That’s how flying is in premium cabins when your rich. I just worked at the airport, I’m far from rich. But I’ve seen it all
@@somethingsomething404 The only way you'll get that kind of experience in a lot of parts of the US is if you're wealthy enough to charter an airplane. First class on domestic flights gets you a bigger seat, nicer food, and priority boarding, but not much else. And some domestic flights don't even have first class anymore, and all you can pay for is a bit more legroom at the front.
idkmane
I wonder if the re-emergence of medium/long distance train lines will create pressure on the quality and comfort of air travel again. In the UK services on the Edinburgh/Glasgow to London line specifically run ads about how much more comfortable 4 hours on a train city centre to city centre is, compared with flying which doesn't actually save that much time end-to-end.
I wish you could get connecting tickets for rail & air or even bus/coach combinations with checked in baggage all the way.
Are UK trains faster than US ones?
@@PhilEdwardsInc The London-Edinburgh journey is 330 miles and it takes 4 hours 39 minutes on average. I have no sense of how fast American trains are on average. I wouldn't expect that much of a difference overall in the actual trackspeeds. I gather that where US trains suffer is that freight trains block up the whole network.
@@jordanmcgrory2171 That's quite fast by US standards. The NE Regional line, which is the most used line in the US, takes 14 hours to go 682 miles from Boston to Roanoke, which is almost 50% slower. The biggest problem in the US is the distances most people need to travel are way longer, and we don't have high-speed rail, which means the distances trains are competitive for are much shorter.
@@jordanmcgrory2171 oh yeah- it may just be some route thing, but i live that same distance from nyc and it's 6 hours. i'd kill for 4.5!
Yesterday my flight from Denver to San Jose left the gate after dark just as a snowstorm moved in. Ice accumulation, blowing snow, very low visibility. There was some delay while we got de-iced, and flying westward through the storm was a bit bouncy, and so we were a little late arriving in San Jose. At every step the crew told us what was going on and apologized for things they needed to do for our own safety. I think that's a pretty good deal.
It lost the glamour, but then again in the 60s tickets were so prohibitively expensive most people simply weren't able to experience flying ever, or did so only for a honeymoon or a funeral. So it's not like the transition for most people was "fly glamorous or fly cheap", it was "take a bus or fly cheap". People still can fly first today, but few opt to pay cash to do so.
Back in the 1970's the bus and train were the preferred solutions for many of us who didn't own a car.
But airline tickets aren’t that cheap today. In fact when accounting for inflation, tickets are more expensive than in the pre deregulation days. Not too mention taking the train is no longer a serious contender when traveling longer distances in the US.
@@Clipper1094 that's.... not how inflation works. Like, it's the exact opposite, those 500 dollars back in thee 1970s are equivalent to 3.8K$ today. And that was what it cost you to go from NY to London at the time. The price nowadays, went *down*, not adjusted for inflation. Taking into account inflation, it's less than a tenth of the cost of the 1970s. Yes, flying absolutely did get waaaaay cheaper.
@@Clipper1094 That's completely false, and totally contrary to the evidence.
@@Clipper1094 In Canada taking the train is for the rich. Lovely scenery, etc. But too much for normal people.
I just had a flight aboard Malaysian Airlines from Kuala Lumpur to Haneda in Tokyo. Had a coach window seat without anyone beside me in the other two seats. Poor man's business class! Best flight I've ever had. The cabin crew kept serving me wine also. Winning!
poor man's business is the best!
This is basically what happened to me when I took an international flight at the start of the pandemic, March 2020. They had limited numbers because of people being grounded and cancelling their tickets. So I had 3 window seats all to myself and slept lying down. Actually got a good 8 hours of shut-eye, which is bloody rare for flying, let alone flying economy class!
@@ComedyLoverGirl same here in the same period i was in Spain and heading home to Denmark , only like 5 people on the plane
@@ComedyLoverGirl In my case, the plane was 97% full. Just the rear area was lacking passengers. They kept some seats empty for the crew, but for some reason I had an entire row to myself. I did ask for exit row seating at the check-in counter, but they wanted me to pay. I said just give me a window seat then, so I think the attendant gave me the best of what they could offer because I'm tall.
Malaysia airline imo have the best flight seats n services
My grandmother was a flight hostess with Continental back in the early 60s. As she said, what a time it was to fly. Everything was lavish and over the top on pretty much any airline you chose. She still has her Continental flying wings pin.
She met my grandfather by chance at LAX after a storm delayed their flights, and after a few dates they were married in 1968 in Vegas.
Man, what a time to be alive it was then.
Amazing! I'd love to meet her, him too. An airline stewardess meets her husband at LAX and gets married in Las Vegas?! They must be both incredible.
Hell, flying in the 90's was glamorous compared to now. Bags were free to check and hot meals were served on 3-hour flights!
But those costs were already included in the ticket prices so people who don't want those amenities had to pay for them anyway.
now even a tiny cup of coffee costs $4
@@dirty_mac and now people buy a ticket for $50 bucks then complain they have to pay extra to choose a seat, bring carry on, etc. but personally I prefer the low ticket price and add the things I want
even in the late 2000's. flying has gotten progressively worse over the years
@@jonathanhindson4580what flights are you paying 50 bucks for? I can't even fly from one city in California to another for under 150
In the late 80s and early 90s I would regularly fly from London to Belfast with BA or British Midland on a flight that took about an hour, as soon as we leveled off, the drinks trolley came by with my free scotch rocks then a ten minutes later the full meal service came by with a mini bottle of wine on every tray and the food was delicious, then when everyone had eaten, they cleared the trays and it was time to land. All food and drinks were included on the one class plane, BA Shuttle service and BM Diamond Service. I miss those days now, you felt special and the crew were amazing.
wow! that's a short flight too
Still on Canadian North I believe, but not a lot people going up there
I too miss those days when poor/middle class people couldn't afford to fly.
@@simrdownmon6431lmfao
@@simrdownmon6431 that was just 30 years ago 🤦♂️
I flew for the first time in the early 60s on a PanAm plane-not a jet. The stewardesses were very kind. Even in the 70s we got real meals on china plates with silver cutlery. Now I feel like a nuisance to the airlines, jammed in with only the food and drink I brought along myself.
How much did you pay for a ticket back then versus now?
Fly business on Qatar it’s fine there
On Emirates and Turkish Airlines you still get free meal and drinks included in the flight in economy, and their meals are quite good.
While I think it would be nice to experience the level of service from back in the 60s, I don't think people realize how most people were locked out of flying back then. Being able to fly was a luxury reserved for the rich, and I don't think heading back to that is the direction we want to go.
@@MakeB711 Have you not paid attention to this video at all? Flying wouldn't have been a luxury if it wasn't for the artificially inflated prices. It became a luxury to somehow justify the high prices.
@Rianza I'd say make rent and real estate affordable for college graduates and airfares can go up. At least that way we can stay home and have a job. But with unaffordable rent, no companies hiring engineers, and cheap airfares, what makes sense to do is to fly to cheap Asian countries and rent an apartment there, which is what I did in 2010, and I'm still living in China to this day.
DEMOCRAT TED CHAPPAQUIDDICK KENNEDY - - party of the KKK/ BLM & ANTIFA, fed by the lion of death
Yeah "what went wrong", should be changed to "what went right", couldn't care less about a piano bar in a plane, fuck the 60s
@@MakeB711 spoken like a true elitist
This is why I prefer rail travel. Bigger seats and the ability to walk around. Walking to the cafe car is fun or even better if it's a full service restaurant car. That's why studies have shown people are willing to take longer rail journeys in Europe vs flying.
we definitely need more railways in the states. my first long train ride was portland to sf on amtrak and it was LEAGUES better than flying
I prefer trail. I despise airline travel now. Won't fly again.
I started taveling by train because one, I didn't want to deal with a nut who started screaming and cussing out the flight attendants and other passengers. And two, fear of flying.
Rail travel in the U.S. (outside the East Corridor) sucks
US rail travel is total shit except for a couple corridors
Originally airlines had to compete with passenger rail so they had to offer these luxurys, after almost all passenger rail ceased to exist (exept for some amtrak lines) suddenly there wasn't any competition and alot more people chose to fly
only in the US though, in the UK it's absolutely fabulous that i can choose to take the train instead of flying to another town!
That would explain why high speed trains makers hire top class designers (for example the italian ETR 500 was designed by Pininfarina, the designers of Ferraris).
America gave up on the Railways when it was the Railways who built America. Instead of traveling in a dehumanised way on a short hop flight, the Americans could have had the choice of a slightly longer but much more comfortable train ride.
Many of the luxuries found on airline during the 1950s and 1960s originate from ideas from trains. The Pullman company was basically a hotel on wheels.
But they still have to compete with private jets. First class has never been more luxurious
I think this really represents the alterations in our quality of life. I mean look at how people visualized the future in all sorts of optimistic ways. Now everything is so bland & soulless & people can barely afford to exist at the lowest level standards.
you have just described getting older in America. thanks.
The creator of the video mentioned in a comment he skipped over the heavy subsidies the airline industry received from the government in “older days” which allowed for such luxury X
@@teem9010 yea right still looked better back then
In a sense, yes, since your smart phone can take you to a mental hideout no matter how miserable your current situation is.
Late Stage Capitalism
"this is your pilot speaking, in the event of an emergency please matrix dodge the piano and lounge seats flying back towards you, and the giant ENIAC computer for playing pong... Don't worry someday your kids will get that reference, also remember there's no seat belts in the lounges, that's for your protection, as seatbelts just make it harder to fight other passengers out of the plane in an emergency landing"
lol hahaha
And also everywhere in plane, feel free to smoke
My recollection is there were seatbelts in the lounge. Unused, but they were there.
@@jacksons1010 oh they definitely didn't want them in the pictures then as I saw none
Ahhh who needs seatbelts, cars didn't have them back in the 70s either.
My first memory of life was being on an airplane at 6 years old alone. Under the care of the crew. They were quite kind. Today, I couldn't fathom sending a child alone across the transatlantic. Times have changed how trusting were parents that shuttled children across the world like if you were riding a bike around the block.
Of course you could still do it today. Ingat what way would it be unsafe? Airlines have specific procedures in place for this exact scenario.
Oh please you are far more likely to hurt your own child than any of the crew or passengers
What I find most interesting about this is that something like this has been happening throughout commercial aircraft history, in various forms. Airships always lost money because planes were faster and even the very rich would rather go faster. Then after World War II the last propeller planes were designed for luxury only to fail anyway because jets were faster. Speed always beats luxury. And most recently the A380 failed to live up to expectations because people preferred more frequent service over a larger plane.
probably some lessons for US trains too, in a weird way
@@PhilEdwardsInc Long-distance passenger trains are a different animal in that they were always operated at a loss, and there’s a whole complicated history there. Freight has always been the moneymaker due to the size and landscape of the country, and the whole system is optimized for that rather than passenger service. Maybe I should get you in touch with Kraut and the three of us could make a video about that.
@@SamAronow Sadly, due to trains' design, it is impossible to make a profit on any passenger rail, short, medium, long or high speed. Yup, freight trains is where most railways get their cash and makes passenger rail affordable and sustainable.
Propeller planes for regular passengers still exist for small airports. Don't expect luxury on them though.
@@rzpogi I believe the Shinkansen is profitable, it’s simply that it takes a much larger investment than modern finance is willing to do to start getting proper profits back. Kinda like with nuclear power having a large repayment period.
Didn’t fly until I was in my 20s, because prior to deregulation the lower & middle classes couldn’t afford it. We saved to travel 90 miles by car or bus to visit relatives. I biked it once, but parents thought I was going to be killed by strangers. As a young adult, I commuted 2 hours 1 way. That 90 miles seems like nothing now, but growing up it might as well have been 3k miles.
Yes, vacations were saved to travel when gas prices were likely under $1 per gallon too. Times have changed.
Yes we’re privileged
I rarely flew first class, but coach was fine. Lot's a fun on the planes in the 1970s. Plenty of room to lay down across empty seats. People drinking, fooling around, sex in the bathroom. It was great back then.
I think in the old days, even in coach, as long as you are on a plane, you already had to be rich and famous. I remember my parents back in 1960s couldn't afford to fly. They used to travel by ships.
For some reason, I was able to afford to fly from New Orleans to Chicago when I was a college student in the 60s.
It isn't true you had to be rich and famous to fly, at least not in the 1950s and 1960s when I was a kid. My family was middle class- not even upper middle class- and my parents were as frugal as you could get, but we could afford to fly from time to time. Coach of course, which was very comfortable back then.
Counterintuitively, as prices have fallen, the experience of flying has gotten so terrible, so cramped, and so anxiety-inducing that 99% of the time I will choose to take a train, drive myself, or even ride a frigging ferry overnight instead of getting "cheap" plane tickets and being miserable the whole time
Heck, I’ll just walk there
I'd rather walk than fly.
@@firelordeliteast6750 lol same!!
....and thugs.
I wish we had these overnight ferries in the states.
The 70’s, 80’s and early 90’s were the best flying years for me. Every year I would take a champagne flight to Hawaii. The packages were reasonably priced. The true downfall of glamorous flying was when the budget and no frills airlines showed up. They literally turned the airlines into flying Greyhound buses. And the passengers started to reflect that trend.
The seats on a Greyhound bus are far more comfortable than airline seats.
@@Spanabama, I meant more of how the passengers look and act. It was a treat to fly and you would wear nice clothing and spruce yourself up to go the airport. You would arrive at your terminal and Skycaps would greet you, take your luggage and issue your boarding pass. You either parked your car or a valet service would take care of your car. You went through minimal security and your family can see you off at the gate. Today, you see people getting on who looks like they haven’t seen a bar of soap in weeks. Dirty feet in open sandals, uncombed hair, some have a pungent smell about them. After 9/11, I cut my flying by 85%. After Covid, I stopped altogether. You can’t pay me to fly, anymore.
@@Macjohn1419 Absolutely, everything you said is true. A trip to the airport used to be a fun outing. Flying used to be an enjoyable experience. When I was young I actually would go to nice restaurants at the airport on dates.
Yall sound snobishly rich
@@Macjohn1419You're Absolutely right, it's because of the idiotic young people of today who don't care about whats right, only about doing whatever they feel like, PERIOD!!!!!
For my first airline flight when I was 8, my parents bougjt me my first blazer and taught me how to tie a tie. 1962 seems so long ago. Flying was an event back then.
People used to dress to the 9s and took pride in their appearance. Nowadays they should be denied boarding due to dressing and looking like a slob.
For me it still is , I still dress up
@@hlengiwemasondo2858 I'm in the time of my life where I can afford Business Class, and yes I don't dress like a slob in Biz Class.
@@luigivincenz3843 awesome, that's great ♥
aww how times have changed. by the way, it must’ve been nice living in the 60’s!!
I remember flying back around 1970 and my favorite airplane was the DC-8. You could actually change position in the seat or sit cross legged if you wanted. For that matter you could even stand up in front of your seat. But as a college student in those days the biggest perk was that student fares were automatically upgraded to first class if you flew after 10pm. And I don't remember any such things like "ground holds" happening where they load the plane and then decide to go nowhere for a couple of hours but refuse to return to the gate to let you wait in the terminal.
I hate ground holds- omg!
I hate that!
Most likely ground holds and other delays are because as flights have become more affordable, companies have started buying more planes leading to more crowded airports
I've had the opportunity to visit the Intrepid Museum in NYC years ago and go on a tour of their British Airways Concorde. Booking a 20-minute Concorde tour is the only way you can get on board their Concorde. My mom and I were the only ones doing the tour during the time we selected, so we had the Concorde to ourselves. The specific Concorde at the Intrepid is the G-BOAD, which made the fastest Transatlantic crossing of ANY Concorde at 2 hours, 52 minutes, and 59 seconds in 1996.
The experience of being able to sit in the cockpit of the fastest Concorde, let alone be on a Concorde in general, is incredible. My mom has never been able to afford first-class, so even if the Concorde was retired, being on it was special to her because it was something she saw on TV growing up but never thought she'd actually go on it until the tour. BA didn't even call the Concorde first-class but rather Concorde Class as it exceeded first-class in their eyes. Sure flying was once glamorous, but de-regulation helped make flying available to more people. People like my family.
Oh my god why do I see you everywhere
My dad became a pilot for Pennsylvania Central in 1942 which changed it's name to Capital which was merged into United in 1961. He retired in 1977. I grew up in the 50's riding on his passes when it was good and glamourous. I became a pilot for United in 1966 and retired in 2002. So I went from when it was good to when it had become a horror show. I loved flying. That's what I was born to do, but now I want nothing to do with it. I won't go near an airport. If I can't get there in my RV or on my Harley, I ain''t goin. Screw it!
Ditto! I was a fractional pilot for 21 years, flew jets. I flew the airlines to get into position for work. I absolutely never fly anymore, ever!!!!
Wow! that's sad that what you were born to do, became something you loth!
@@ralphsanchico2452 loathe? I don't loathe it, I just don't want to do it as a pilot anymore.
@@ralphsanchico2452 Thanks. It is. Now the only flying that appeals to me would be in an ultralight where I can fly with the birds just above the trree tops.
@@billlawrence1899 I work at Pittsburgh International. The worst part about airport workers is that they are very UN professional. And the pilots are so unfriendly now.
How come stuff like this is never mentioned in Air Crash Investigation shows? Like, they are never like "the turbulence was so severe that all the booze in the pub spilled everywhere"
"The piano bar was burned to a crisp..."
@@chlojolo that American 96 wasn’t a disaster was an “only by the skin of their teeth” thing though. The problem with that floor getting sucked down into the cargo compartment wasn’t who was on top of it, it was that many of the control cables ran though that floor. American 96 only just managed to retain control with the remains of the cables that were left.
@@JasperJanssen actually idk if it is relevant but Turkish 981 crashed due to passengers afraid of the big hole on the back side of the plane and left their seats to move in front of the plane. So the plane lost its balance and crashed.
@@PhilEdwardsInc" the piano on board was in pieces after the impact. Some of the passengers have injuries from the debris"
Did you have to go there??
That was so cool. My first flight on an airplane was as a teenager in 1973 and 74. I forgot about those days until I ran up on this video. Nostalgia for sure. I’m a subscriber now. Thx much for bringing back the memories.
My dad worked for a company whose higher ups insisted that their business associates flew first class on business trips, that is, until the energy crisis of the early 1970s. And then, all employees on business trips were given coach seating. Although I was a young kid who was in elementary school in the 1970s, I remember things being considerably different about airlines and the flight. The last time I flew on a giant plane, a 747 whose seating across the plane was 3 seats, an aisle, 6 seats, another aisle and 3 more seats, was in 1976. The meals were part of the cost of the ticket, as were the drinks and other beverages, seasoned almonds, peanuts and other snacks the stewardesses gave out to passengers throughout the flight.
All I could think of watching the lounges is please don’t hit turbulence!!
Thank you for explaining what the heck happened to glamorous flying. Always wondered when we became cattle.
You have made me curious how they dealt with that!
Just wait until they load us all into individual little carriers like coffins and fly us as cargo.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Dodged the weather where possible or else just called off the flight?
That's why now I've run away from the herd and quit flying.
I used to fly in DC-10s cross-country with piano bars and lounges. So much fun and so nice.
I was a kid the first time I flew in 1975. My mother wore a dress and heels, and I wore a suit and tie. We were served breakfast on china plates with real flatware; in coach. As we descended to our destination, the "stewardess" put a little lapel pin on my suit jacket. Now, people wear yoga pants or a thong and flip-flops. The seats are paper thin, and the flight attendants have to dodge blows from crazy passengers. I realize that it's more affordable to fly now, but I'm not sure the trade-off was worth it.
I forgot to mention the pins! I got one when I was a kid and even as a non-airplane superfan, it was quite a trip.
Nah that's only America ppl dress up alot abroad but not a suit and tie level tho 💀 I m just happy I get to travel
@@thomasmaresh5264 do you still wear a suit and tie for long flights , like 8+ hours?
@@thomasmaresh5264 Pretentious much?
There is no trade-off. You can literally fly first class if you want that experience of rich people again. Be happy that with cheaper tickets more people can discover the world and visit their families. Instead of nagging about not having to wear suits and ties anymore😂
Flew international flights often in the 1960s between NYC and Asia with stops in LA and Hawaii as a kid. My parents always dressed up. I remember wide-bodies half-full and sleeping across 2-3 seats .
population more then doubled since the 60s, they had to figure out how to plese everyone
Thank you - an excellent answer to a question I've had for years.
Flying today truly sucks. But that is also related to TSA issues.
My answer to the question has been, "airfair is too cheap." Your video confirmed that, but for reasons I had not considered.
I do think that people who get obsessed with how nice flying used to be "in the good old days" tend to blow off price entirely while they're grumbling. If you look at the inflation adjusted cost of a transatlantic economy ticket from the early seventies, it would by you a business class ticket today. Lie flat seats, champagne, better food and entertainment than you would have gotten then. If you go the other direction and adjust down the cost of a 2022 economy ticket from New York to Chicago to a seventies amount of money, you wouldn't be traveling on a plane at all. You'd be lucky to be taking a bus.
Yeah now look at the wages in the 70s. They made a lot more money than we did, accounted for inflation. A lot more. Especially if you consider homes were dirt cheap, cars were dirt cheap, and groceries were dirt cheap.
We have been scammed into abject poverty.
@@beardedwolf628 Fuck the central bank, the Federal Reserve, for that.
Are you talking about times when families could still live comfortably on one income ?
Exactly.
The difference was that wages were higher in the 70s, so our shitty tickets now feel as expensive as the skylounges of the 70s. We were born at the wrong time.
Great video and I agree deregulation was the big change. The ads for lounges, piano bars, fancy dining, etc in the air - and the nostalgia for them - never mention weather and turbulence. That knocked plenty of those martinis out of people's hands! Problem was obviously worse before jet travel - and again never mentioned now - when the prop planes couldn't travel above the weather. Victor and Ilsa Laszlo would not have had a comfy flight on the "[Pan Am] Clipper to America."
Riley, I think this is the beginning of a beautiful friendship.
We now have a cattle car approach in order to accommodate vastly more flyers. This has not lead to a more pleasurable flying experience to be sure.
This presentation was done well and was enjoyable to watch. Thanks for the effort…
If it was legal, some airlines would eliminate most of the seats and make people stand, especially if the flights were under 1 hour.
I was once on a flight where there were 13 rows of EMPTY seats . The flight attendants said we couldn’t move to an empty seat because we paid for the particular seat we were sitting in.
On a recent flight, I was CHARGED EXTRA if I had brought 1 normal sized carry on luggage.
Airplane industry is SO DUMB.
The reason you can’t move seats is because the plane is trimmed by the pilots based on the weight distribution being a certain way. If everyone moves to different seats it upsets that. Having said that in my experience they’ve let people move to different seats during cruise but make them move back during landing.
@@mrsmith1097 if everyone sits in the back left, will the plane tilt towards the back left
agreed.
@@mrsmith1097 Is everyone going to move to different sits? No,.only few person would. Don't try to make up excuses for shitty service, separate people do not account that much for weight distribution
You can't move because the weight distribution on an aircraft can affect the balance. It is an aeroplane not a house. This goes with your carry on bag as well, everything is listed on the terms and conditions when you book a flight. Educate yourself before flying and attacking airlines and the people that work for them as they risk their lives trying to get everyone home or away
My earliest memories of a plane was 1968. I was 5 and older sister, Firstgirl was moving to Germany with husband an Army Captain. At SFO, they allowed me and our dad to walk onto the tarmac and board just to look at the inside of the plane. It was massive with an upstairs lounge and a little nursery for my baby niece. I see today's plane service as steerage.
wow! a nursery!
Exactly. And people will still fly.
Profits and terrorists changed all of that.
I’m flying to New Zealand next week and New Zealand Airlines has a new thing called a SkyCouch. It’s in coach, and it’s basically 3 seats that can raise up the footrests to be level with the seat. So it’s kinda like a couch and you can lay down and stretch out. Talk about glamorous! My wife and I paid an extra $500 for it, so it better be worth it!
well…how was it?!
Is that the one where it's a three person set up. Two down on the floor and one seat above the two lower seats?
If it is. I would worry about the top person passing gas.😊
How you buy your ticket (and how those options are presented) has also changed *a lot*.
Back in the day the options were sorted by 'departure time' or 'total length of trip' and the price was an afterthought. (Which it often actually was if you were flying on expenses).
Also it was presented by someone else looking at the computer screen who quickly lost interest in helping you the harder you tried finding the lowest fare (travel agents usually got a percentage of the ticket price for their service so their main interest certainly wasn't spending more time/effort on your behalf for earning less commission).
Now you mainly sort by price and you are the one that benefits directly from a lower fare - whether that means 'looking harder' or 'accepting a tradeoff'. This obviously affects the outcome.
You can still use a travel agent. They sometimes charge a fee to handle the airfare. They make a commission of the hotel etc.
It depends.
On a short flight (less than 3-4 hours) I can wait in a cheap cramped seat to get where I want and enjoy an actual piano bar at the destination, rather than the tacky bar on the plane, especially if that meant a cheaper price and an ability to fly many more times each year.
But on a longer flight, creature comforts are definitely welcome (like wider seats), even at a higher price.
Lounges and bars on airplanes are usually very tacky. Having said that, one of the best meals I ever had was on a plane in business class.
I recently did something I never thought I would do in my life as a frugal individual: I paid for a first class ticket on a long distance flight because I knew the coach section of that airline was terrible. I can't afford to do it regularly, and all I got was a wider seat, slightly more legroom, and an actually decent meal. All of these things were what coach flying was just 10-15 years ago. I still remember Continental's Gordon Bethune crowing about how Continental still served "Meals at mealtime". That was in the early 00's. Nobody does this at all now.
Why not just pay for food before your flight? No one prevents you from eating your own food on the plane.
The logistics of loading meals onto the plane, and the benefit it brings to passengers doesn’t make it worth it. I’d rather get my own crappy sandwich if it increases the odds my flight leaves on time
@@DP-eo5xd Your own sandwich would probably be better and obviously more personalized than anything you would get on board a plane.
@@MegaLokopojust defend airlines cheapening out eh?
@@blitzkrieg634 What? airplane tickets are significantly cheaper than ever before if you account for inflation. Why do you think airlines need to provide the same service they used to when the tickets are far lower now than they were back then? If prices were always going up, that would be one thing, but prices since then have gone down.
I think it's very similar to what happened with motorway services. When the motorways first opened, the service stations were seen as glamorous and luxurious - people even used to go on day trips to them! They had high-end restaurants with table cloths, waiters and proper crockery and cutlery.
Nowadays, they're just somewhere to stop and rest. People's preferences changed as it was no longer a marvel, but a part of normal life. They now wanted to stop for as little time as possible and thus services filled with fast food places and small shops selling snacks, magazines, etc.
I have noticed a slight shift back to the old ways though in recent years, as people got fed up with the same few places to eat with no quality options for those that want them.
Some services now have slightly healthier options like noodles bars or sit down restaurants (still chains, rather luxury restaurants though) or even farm shops!
I wonder if planes might start to see similar changes in the next few years as people are starting to move away from air travel again - it's now inconvenient and uncomfortable and not necessarily cheaper than the alternatives.
If people want convenience, they'll drive; if they want cheap, they'll get a coach; if they want comfort, they'll take the train. Air travel only really wins on speed and this is often negated by how early you have to arrive at the airport.
I can see flying becoming mostly for longer distances, where the pros would still outweigh the cons. I don't think most people would want to take several weeks to get to their destination by boat for example!
Don't forget about all the Buckyes that are opening up along the interstate highways. Have fun getting a parking space, filling up, and getting trampled in the retail section.
Well Leeds Skelton Lake has a Pizza Express, if that counts for anything.
@@manomaylr So does Fleet, since it was refurbished. Not sure I'd quite call it luxury, although definitely a step up from some of the other offerings.
Gloucester is supposed to be quite swanky, but I've never been myself.
I think one thing that gets lost is the government, during the glamorous days, was still heavily subsidizing the airline industry. They could afford to cater to the upper class because they were getting loads of tax dollars from lower/middle class people. You briefly mentioned subsidies, but people really underestimate how much money came from the government. Lots of these airlines would have failed earlier if not for subsidies.
Yeah I probably should have gotten specific with that.
If you look at subsidies for airports and the air traffic control network, the government is still putting in a lot of tax dollars to support air travel. Meanwhile we have an entrenched political faction that resents every penny spent on Amtrak.
How were they getting money from lower class folks? Hogwash.
@@jacksons1010 taking Amtrak from NYC to LA would wear out most people while flying is a 3-4 hour deal ( or close )
@@arthurbrumagem3844 That's true, if your only goal is getting to LA. If you want to see some of the USA, take the train. I've done Chicago to San Francisco and it was a lot of fun.
A factor not mentioned here is that as prices fell dramatically (in constant dollars, a coach ticket in the 70s cost roughly what a business class ticket does today), more and more people with less disposable income started flying. Airliners were no longer just the preserve of the middle-middle- to upper-middle class.
Happy New Year, Phil! Great vid - though I will have to say a huge part of the de-glamorisation of flight has to do with the airport experience too. The immersion-breaking experience when watching an airport chase finale in any 1990s romcom.
That's true - though I must admit Newark airport was kinda nice recently. However, there was no Love Actually moment where a cherubic blonde boy professed his love to his classmate.
@@PhilEdwardsInc Phil, I've been holding this back for long enough. Today is the day. I love you, Phil. I've always loved you, since the day we didn't meet. That soft silver hair, the mustache, those meaty glasses atop a perfectly sculpted face. Let's run away, Phil. We'll go somewhere your subscribers will never find us. The Caribbean, or that one gym down on 10th street.
@@PhilEdwardsInc you gotta come on out to Vancouver then, YVR is one of the nicest airports you'll ever see, perfect for your next romantic confession😂
@@jhawk1229 I have actually been to Vancouver and it was amazing!!! I gosh over it any time airports come up in conversation.
@@literarynick Sounds like Vancouver airport is the consensus.
Great info. Thanks! I remember the days of way more space on planes in coach. I have flown first class on emirates with a private berth and the relative price of that seat and coach was in the 10s of thousands. Incredible! I think we have gone too far though. The coach seats are so claustrophobic and they don’t seem to have taken into consideration that a lot of travellers are bigger.
first class emirates! sweet!
Just take the price of the ticket then, adjust it for inflation and here is your answer.
You see back then riffraffs took Greyhound busses for travel, now they switched to air travel.
And... Airlines lose money on economy seats (at least on transatlantic flights). All the profit is from first class and business class passengers for whom the travel is as glamorous as ever.
This, and also, back then they also had an extra incentive to draw people into this new mode of transportation.
This was SOOOO GOOD! ❤
I have what’s called Osteogenesis Imperfecta or brittle bones and from the age of six months (1989) I started flying to Washington DC every six months to participate in a study for my bones at NIH. So in my life I’ve flown almost 100 times and I was able to catch the very tail end of the “good old days” of flying lol.
If there were empty seats in first class my mom would tell me to ask the
stewardess if we could move up and 9/10 times they’d say yes! I can remember drinking chocolate milk in a champagne glass!
But as 9/11 happened, everything changed 😮💨
Wow, I think you need to start treating yourself to chocolate milk in a champagne glass at home. That sounds great.
@@PhilEdwardsInc 😂
Have a happy new year Phil!
9/11 was the final blow to a recession that changed business travel. Also, factor an ever improving Internet that made teleconferences more practical.
The 90s saw a boom in air travel and a boom in tech. As a chauffeur who started in '97, I heard all about business and first class travel on planes. Companies could spend ridiculous amounts on travel and the programs airlines had made it easy enough to achieve elite statuses, especially with how much business travelers would fly.
Planes could run with a lesser load because the airlines were charging a ton for business and first class tickets.
In the early 2000s, business travel completely flipped. Instead of chauffeuring people around in a stretch limo, we used Suburbans and Navigators. Instead of 2 guys riding around in a limo, we'd have a team of 6 stuffed into an SUV. If there were 2, it was sedan only. But these same companies also started making more of their employees ride coach or only choose business if the cost or flight length met a certain threshold.
The 90s were a different animal to the 00s for business travel. That meant needing to fill the planes was now of paramount importance.
The way routes are constructed, the ease of finding flight prices online and dependability of planes have all fed the entire public buying into flying much more than they ever did before. As long as people want the cheapest, flying will be like this for the foreseeable future.
@@derbagger22 yup I couldn’t agree more. Travel was relaxed and laid back one min and then on 9/12 it was 100% different. Granted I was a kid at the time but nearly every time I would fly they would invite me into the cockpit before AND DURING the flight and let me push a few inconsequential buttons lol. The 90s were the best decade. Micro machines, SNES and NSYNC… the 90s had it alllllll
Interesting subject. Those cargo pants...comfortable, stylish, AND functional.
My first flight was on a United Airlines Caravelle. We had steak in coach, served on a real plate with silverware. Everyone on board was well dressed and behaved. No pajamas back then.
“Jet set” was literally the descriptor of a class of people. Now almost everyone flies. It has definitely been democratized, and with that, you take the rough with the smooth…
Have lived in Korea and Japan for the last 20 years. I never fly U.S. carriers anywhere. KAL, Asiana Air, Japan Air are far preferable for service, experience and they way we are treated on the plane is fantastic. One of the nicest things is, I get to pick my seat in coach and do not have to pay extra for it -- and I get two free carry on bags and checked luggage can be heavier
I really do believe you hit on something there! How often do you see videos uploaded about a passenger or passengers acting in woefully in an unruly manner on a foreign flight or airline?
I find it Interesting and a sign of the times that 1st class used to be very social ( lounges /bar etc…) now you
crawl into a comfortable but isolating pod.
I loved Continental, great airline. Too bad United took it over. What’s really awful about travel today is how squashed it is, trying to squeeze the max amount of people into narrower seats, no leg room and very uncomfortable seats. I’d love to see the airline execs take a 6 hr flight in coach.
I remember when the change over happened and for one leg of my trip I got an older plane that hadn’t been reconfigured yet. I thought I died and went to heaven.
My grandfather was an exec at PanAm in the 60's and 70's so I got to see the glamour side of flying. For my post-military career, I flew all over the world as a trainer and flew on the gov't dime so it was always the back-of-the-bus coach seats. But I refuse to this day to lower my personal standards so I fly in a shirt, tie, jacket, and hat (no, ballcaps don't count as hat!). I can tell you that the cabin crew appreciates the effort (and general kindness to them) and I often get upgraded. When I fly on my dime for long-distance flights, I will pay a little bit extra for the economy plus seats to get a little extra legroom for this long-legged cowboy. Life is more about how you deal with it than how it is served up to you. Great video!
Yes, I wear coat and tie and feel that I get respect from ground staff and flight staff.
I have read a lot about the aviation industry for decades, but this is the first time I have seen this question addressed so well. Great Video Phil. I have subscribed!
I will add that this is also the period when the US Postal service predominately switched from transporting mail by trains to planes. It's also the time when the federal reserve started transporting money on planes rather than trains. When the train industry lost these contracts it was one of the main factors which made passenger train service unprofitable in the US.
Also general motors got government money to rip out rail lines and put in more roads. So that Americans would be forced to buy more cars.
Another aspect to consider is that in the 50-60's airlines were competing with ocean liners as well at the time, where glamour was also being heavily marketed to attract passengers to their dwindling passenger counts due to their much longer trips (at least a few days to cross the atlantic vs several hours on a plane). 😊
When I came up from Jamaica in 1972.....I had a full course meal with real silverware. Seemingly unlimited soda (the can) not in a plastic cup. My aunt, who I flew up with, was holding on to a meal in a pot. She had it in her lap while we flew....Only put it down when it was time to eat.
They went from extreme regulation to literally no regulation outside of safety regulations, and with the way seats are packed in today, I am skeptical as to whether a plane could be evacuated in the regulated time in an actual emergency. The regulators need to establish what the minimum in seat pitch should be. Soon there will be standing room only on some airlines where you have to pay extra to sit down! (that is only half in jest). Yes people want cheap fares, but outside of the pandemic, most well run airlines were very profitable. There also needs to be a halt to the industry consolidating, and laws against predatory pricing that drives out new entries when the legacy carriers lower prices to below cost. It doesn't have to be so awful. After this Christmas debacle by Southwest...consumers should demand these changes.
Interesting. I noticed as the airfare ptices whent down, the dollar value of the clothes people wrote to fly, also dropped.
After spending decades in the airline industry, I believe that in the 90's the biggest influence on cheapening the airline experience occurred. That began the decade of the internet boom where folks would create a company, brought it public and sold it for ridiculous profits. In the airline industry it became common practice to include crazy stock packages to many of the upper management hires sighting a need to get the best and brightest. But in reality it was a revolving door where the same group would get hired over and over throughout the industry receiving huge stock gifts. Each time there was a new CEO the shareprice would rocket up and all was well. At some point due to dilution and monthly selling by management personnel the stock price would begin to drop. Cost cutting and fuel costs became the crying point for whichever airline felt the need to go into bankruptcy protection and start the entire process over and issue new shares. Taxpayers bail out was common. The new CEO would enter with a new package and loads of stock at rock bottom prices. In the case of United, the employees were given stock ownership and ironically short thereafter, they went into bankruptcy and poof, it's all gone.
So today, they care very little about customer service and more about cutting costs to the barest of minimum because that relates best to shareholders and stock price. We went from an airline pleasurable experience to the greyhound bus, pack 'em in like sardines experience. People fighting on aircraft and homeless riding with one way fares to get them out of major cities with problems.
Cost cutting, contracting services and hiring at ultra low rates has turned air travel into a risky endeavor. I'm surprised we don't see more accidents.
My solution was to pay management by long term customer and employee satisfaction. rather than by the share price which has been a disaster.
Never happen though.
Make sure you fasten your seatbelts and put your try tables in an upright position. This is going to be a rough flight
Thank you for the perspective of an 'insider,' which confirms what I have always thought. It's similiar to Wal-mart's strategy of offshoring production to obliterate their competition. Consumers flocked to Walmart, but the company's procurement strategy contributed to the collapse of American manufacturing, which eviscerated the jobs of working class and middle class Americans. Big Box retail, like Walmart also contributed to the declining economies of small towns. But for Walmart it's a win, because they now have a self perpetuating demographic partly composed of an economically distressed clientele. With automation looming, we can expect even less, perhaps flights without flight attendants.
Travelling by plane used to be a pleasure and turned to be an endurance test. But it is also true it has never been so affordable.
I wouldn't fly if it was free!!!!
Great way to start the year Phil! Happy new year to all who are looking forward to some new insights from Phil into how history is shaped in little tweaks that only reveal themselves in the big picture. Thanks!!!
We are all getting boiled like frogs.
In 1978 I was stationed at Grand Forks Air Force Base and bought a round trip ticket to and from Evansville Indiana. It cost me $325 (with a 10% military discount!) but I only made $5,400 that year! So it essentially cost me 6% of my annual income.
So, if you make $40,000 a year now could you imagine paying $2,400 for a round trip ticket to fly just HALFWAY across the U.S.?
People are so crammed that it's resulted in so much "air rage". One could make the argument that some modest regulation to mandate an increase in the space per passenger is a matter of national security and safety. Certainly it would be an improvement in consumer protection. It seems that consumer protections have been eroding over the past few decades in general. I don't think going back to the regulation from the 70s makes sense, but bringing in some modest amount of consumer protection seems necessary at this point.
Yeah I would love to know how consumer protection works these days considering some of the fees. They're all posted, but they can be quite hidden. It'd be nice to see final costs in search results, for example, after fees.
If you put a coach lounge with a piano on a plane today, people would still just sit there on their phones
Yep. People today, especially Americans, lack a sense of culture and art. The cell phone is their culture.
Sadly yes. Nowadays noone would care about the piano lounges. I would say we are so jaded that even if they would offer food like free popcorn most would be suspicious and ask what is the catch, how much extra is this? Lol. We have gotten so cynical to the amenities they had back then it wouldn't be really taken with a smile but a smirk like hm, how much extra is that costing me. Traveling by plane Nowadays is a means to an end, not really a luxurious experience as how it was back in the 70s. And remember the trade off would be all that cigarette smells in the planes back then too, yucky!
There is nothing "sad" about it. Nowadays, anyone with the ability to fly on a plane also has the ability to bring their own entertainment with them. Why should they pay extra for entertain chosen for them and forced camaraderie with strangers? It's a several-hour trip on a bus in the air, not a grand tour on the Orient Express.
@@capricorndrbird it's important to be cynical nowadays. If you check into a better hotel and are not cynical, you may end up paying hundreds of dollars using the hotel rooms emnities.
Yeah, I’d find it annoying since I prefer to listen to my music.
My biggest peeve with flying is not the price. It is the fact that it is not an honest price. They give you a price but by the time you have added luggage, food, being forced to pay extra to be seated together you ad about 20% to the price.
@@robertlee6338 Obviously you did not read what I wrote. It is not the price it is the fact that the price is not honest. It does not matter if it is low cost or full service. The first price that shows up is not the final price like it used to be.
Idk where you have been flying but thats not my experience. Im in the Philippines rn and flew from the US. Only paid for my ticket which also included 2 bags to carry on.
Meals werent charged nor were the drinks. You just suck
@@Dummatzen No he was completly right. You buy a ticket for a sit on a plane, that is all you get.
That piano bar was something. It reminds me of a disaster movie of which I don't recall the name anymore, in which there was a grand piano (!) on board of an airplane and then disaster struck (and not only the keys) and the piano crushed everybody (probably they forgot to lock the wheels). But I digress. Thanks for uploading and happy new year.
oh yikes!
Hmmm I have a vague recollection of this in The Poseidon Adventure
@@jst7714 yes, it is possible there was a piano in The Poseidon Adventure. But it was definitely on a plane and it seems 'Airport 77' has a 'piano man' (a character that seems to be blind, enhanced by the fact that the actor playing him is not exactly aiming very precise at his (invisible) piano). And it is not clear where this scene is located because we see a very copiously decorated bar of a hotel. th-cam.com/video/5lYzb8va49I/w-d-xo.html
Loved this! How about a dive into the changes in the train industry over the same time period? Perhaps there are some similar themes
I have kinda been wanting to do something about the Autotrain. It goes down to this state called Florida.
@@PhilEdwardsInc People would be better served if you looked into the monopoly power and disinvestment in infrastructure by freight companies...the Autotrain has been done (and reasonably well) by another channel.
@@scpatl4now Peter Dibble, to give that channel a name.
@@fishflake1209 Yeah, and it was a very good video
The rail lines were ripped out by general motors and replaced with roads so that Americans would be forced to buy cars.
I love the style of these videos so much! I really trust that you are credible. These videos give me lots of joy. If possible a sources cited page would be amazing. I know how much work it is but if convenient moments arise it would be fantastic
yes! i typically put everything important in the description. don't include all the newspaper links, but almost everything else makes it in. feel free to comment or email if a particular one is missing.
When flying became more affordable, the same people who used to ride the Greyhound started flying. That's when all the in-flight incidents involving passengers fighting, assaulting stewardesses, ect.
Great video! I’ve always wondered why we’ve gone away from these lounges. You should make a video about Pan Am or TWA, and why they failed. Thanks!
Fun idea but space on a plane is too expensive. Not even the most luxurious first class cabins in the middle eastern airlines have such lounges.
Lockerbie and Long Island
@@draggonsgate It was lack of security that led to the booming of that Pan Am flight. Same as 9/11 security became to lax an after thought, After 9/11 a police state.
@@MHdollrevievs What I meant was the lawsuits that followed, did irreparable damage to already financially strapped airlines, let alone the reputation loss.
I remember when younger my grandparents told me riding the train was a classy way to travel. I prefer traveling by air because its faster. My first flight was on Continental airline from LAX to Houston in the 70s.
I remember almost everything about the first time I flew. In the summer of 1970, my folks approached me, telling me it would be my choice of what our family did next year for summer vacation. They gave me a choice of an in ground pool, or flying to California and spend the summer with my mother’s sisters family. I chose California. I had never flown before, I was more than excited. When my dad started planning our trip, I asked if he could PLEASE see if we could fly on the new 747. He came home from the travel agent with disappointing news. We would fly into San Diego, and the airport wasn’t big enough for the new jumbo jet. I was still excited. We’d fly from DTW, to Chicago, and then arrive in California.
I thought summer vacation would never arrive. I got my first “adult” luggage, new clothes for the summer, and we were going to Disneyland and Mexico too. It would be a trip to remember. The day arrived, my grandfather came by to take us to the airport. I’d never seen a place so big. Our flight arrived, a bright silver AA 707. We boarded and I was given the window seat. When we arrived in Chicago, we stayed on the plane, and others boarded. I fell asleep some where over Kansas. My mother woke me up when we were close to landing. When we walked through the door, I was surprised about the stairs to the tarmac. My aunt and uncle were waiting for us all smiles. Our summer adventure began the next morning.
It was a beautiful vacation, I felt very lucky. When July was over, my dad had to get back to work at Ford, but my mom and I stayed an extra 3 weeks.
I was ready to get back and start school. I’d miss California, but we’d seen just about everything. A few days before our trip, my mom told me instead of flying through Chicago, we’d be flying through LAX. We were dropped off at the airport by my uncle. This flight was on a 727, we boarded from the rear stairs. The flight was very short. LAX was bigger than DTW, and looked confusing, but my mom got us to our gate. The plane would be at the gate shortly. After about 30 minutes my mom said “look John, here comes our plane”. A 747 was pulling up to the jet walk. “Are you surprised?” My mom asked. I couldn’t believe it. After my dad was back home, he pulled some strings and arranged this surprise for me.
My head was spinning as we boarded. There were so many people. We found our seats and soon we were flying down the runway. I couldn’t believe this huge thing would be in the air soon. I was so happy with the surprise. After lunch I asked the stewardess if I could see the upstairs lounge. It was for first class only. I tried. I had to visit the men’s room and headed back the rear of the plane. When I walked through the partition, I didn’t believe my eyes, there was a cocktail lounge with club chairs, tables with chrome mushroom lamps, and a bar with a bartender. I went back to my mom. She didn’t believe me at first until we were both sitting at a table looking out at the Grand Canyon. She ordered drinks for us. It was the best part of the trip. When we arrived in DTW, my dad was at the gate grinning, he asked “well, well, well? What did you think?” I thanked him so much. I told him how it was the best part of the summer. Now everyone wears flip flops and t shirts, the magic is gone.
I had a teacher that grew up rich and loved talking about flying back in the day. He said they would go shopping and buy fancy outfits for their plane ride. He said flying was a beautiful thing “until you poor people ruined it” 😂 I miss Mr. P
He was a snobby asshole. Good thing more people can afford to fly.
😂😂 ayooo
While flying has become more ' accessible ' to everyone, I absolutely despise as to how it became that way. It is now an uninspiring, mundane, stressful and rather depressing experience. I wish for not just air travel, but all forms of travel, to become classy and elegant again.
Being stuck with two Phil Edwards(s) doesn't sound too bad, could probably be one of the best flights I can imagine
It is still glamorous if you pay the same as people would pay back then for their tickets. A tourist class ticket of the day compares to a premium class nowadays and you get much better service and features, like lie flat seats and individual screens.
It still sucks! First class flight attendants, just as much as coach flight attendants, still hate their jobs, their pay, their passengers, their airline. The seat in 1st class is more comfortable, wait we have to PAY MORE to be comfortable?
Few people realize the connection between airline regulation and the level of comfort they get in this business. Great job!
As an airplane lover (aeronautical engineer here), I saw the seats and space shrink tremendously from 80s to 2010s, and I really hate to see the planes we design and build with a 34 inch pitch in mind, being squeezed to 29 inch by airline competition. This also leads to windows not being aligned with the seats which is why you might sit on a row with two half windows instead of a decent outside view.
I think the 50s and 60s were too opulent with few people being able to afford to fly, but todays environment is also humiliating. It is not just about lack of space, it is getting to a point that is also starting to pinch on safety. If you sit on a confined space for too long it can lead to blood clogging, and some regional airline pilots are getting such low pay after so much investment in training, that discourages young people to pursue this career. The aftermath is that there are less pilots for an ever increasing demand for flights, and this will lead to more flight cancelations, and abusive business practices such as overbooking, while the rich are flying on private jets increasing carbon footprint.
In my opinion there needs to be a balance of regulation and free competition. The government should not interfere on price practice, flight routes, and general services, but it should regulate the safety, working conditions, and minimum seat pitch for the general public health. If anyone reading this thinks the same, maybe you should take a look at what senators Tammy Duckworth and Tammy Baldwin are advocating for.
any good link describing the duck worth baldwin proposal? just curious.
Thank you Phil! Very informative, I work in Asia so have managed to be comfortable during flights to and fro but the contrast is very vast from the glamour days 🥺 Hugs from Asia 🌺
thanks!
Just give me better and more comfortable seating and I'll be a happy flyer. It is crazy to think about all the glamour involved in the earlier years of flying. Kinda wish it didn't cost so much. In a perfect world of balance between flight prices and good service I think I would be more willing to travel and fly more than now.
Planes are absurdly expensive, uncomfortable, and inconvenient as compared to any other mode of public transit. I really wish the US had a decent passenger rail system like in Europe, China, Japan, etc.
Piano bar in a plane? I remember taking a TRAIN that had a piano bar... and it was Amtrak. One of my best trips ever, the party went all night. Those were also the days when trains had real dining cars, with waiters, real china, sit down meals ordered from a menu, just like dining out in a restaurant. Good times.
I’m pretty happy that the piano bar is gone though. Imagine a karaoke session….
@@OLDMANTEA 🤣
you've hit it phil! consistantly great videos, unique editing with funny bits. and the Clinton in the back referencing that video is great. So happy to see you reach this point :)
It all falls on one thing from flying to supermarkets to ANYTHING that involves consumers.
That thing is EXPECTATIONS.
When the public at large has lower expectations then standards DROP.
Consumers determine the market value and quality.
If people keep paying for airline tickets and continue to accept crap for service then the airlines will lower their standard of service to increase profits.
When people stop accepting crap then things get better.
It applies to nearly everything in our daily lives.
I didn't know you had this personal channel. I love it! And...I think the industry now a days is so different. "You'll never be glamour". Even among the american carriers, the "glamourous" business class leaves a lot to be desired lol.
This makes me think of a cause and effect cycle particularly in the US - back in post world war 2 US flux with cash and social programs, wages up and inflation down... A cost war wouldn't have thrived, consumers wanted luxury. But is it fair to say that modern consumers want cheapest when their wages are nowhere near close what they used to be? When they want cheap so they can afford it? And is it a cycle of cost slashing also partly responsible for wage drops (To keep prices down, companies underpay). Are CEO's and mega business owners given TOO much freedom to pay themselves with all the benefits of cost-slashing, therefore cornering the luxury market and forcing everyone else into a cheap economy? -- It just makes me think about it, as I wish I just had a few more inches of chair width.
The main goal was to destroy traditional currency for the last 100 years. I always wondered if their was only other part in history where they purposely wanted destruction this lethal.
In college, 1987-1991, going home for Christmas break, I could check my suitcase and “carryon” for free, and take my saxophone (properly cased, it wasn’t THAT crazy), big winter coat, and purse to my seat, which was usually the only occupied one in my row or at least had an empty seat in the middle. Overhead compartments were mostly empty. The cheapest tickets also cost like $600 from MSP to FWA and back, bought way in advance, and had to be purchased by my parents at a travel agency and physically mailed to me. It was much more pleasant, and I also liked just strolling through a metal detector instead of being displayed and groped like a medical specimen. I love when they have the dogs + old metal detectors at our airport. Absolute bliss. Still have to take my shoes off but whatever.
Less money spent on the flight means more money spent at the destination of the vacation. Lower fares is a win for me, even if it means sacrificing comfort.
As with everything, you get what you pay for.
@@hewitc first class still exist for glamourous flyers
Written by a person who has NO IDEA how awful flying today compares to just a couple decades ago!!!!