How Realistic is D&D Combat?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 3 เม.ย. 2024
- I don't think we made a single helpful discovery in this video
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“How realistic is dnd combat” dude I don’t know I haven’t gotten the update that gives me burning hands yet
Well, do you know the spell/are a race that has it? :O
Have you tried aerosol can + lighter?
@@TheSteam02using this technique summons the hidden Fire Fighter subclass
@@felixamari157 i dont think any race has burning hands, do they?
I have, but it always takes a skill check to not blow up the can. It isn’t very high, but if you fail you take 1 slashing damage and 1d4 fire damage from the can exploding. I haven’t failed yet, which is why i still have the average amount of fingers.
"You leave yourself open. Why is that not a mechanic?"
*Cries in Reckless Attack*
I was thinking the same thing. 🤔
and battle master riposte
I think the point is that it’s a fairly generic concept that is entirely locked to a single class instead of simply being a mechanic. It’s the same as power attack being putting more force behind an attack in exchange for less accuracy, something that should also arguably be a generic option.
Ideally things like reckless attack should be generally available but specific classes get abilities or passives that enhance the effect or remove weaknesses.
For example, reckless attack as a non-barbarian could also reduce your movement on your next turn to 0 as well as give attackers advantage. Then barbarian gets to keep full mobility alongside features like rage reducing the incoming damage. This still makes them the best reckless attacker on average but allows anyone who wants to “attack recklessly” to do so.
I think the question was considering all classes, not only the Barbarian.
@@MonochromaticPrism Lots of stuff is dumbed down to reduce the number of dice rolls. Almost like people play this purely for the combat so to not have 16h fights they dumb it down so it only takes 8h.
this has the energy of two 11 year olds play fighting after school and arguing about if hitting a leg means you have to stand on one foot now
yuh huh
The LARP I played for over 20 years started with rules like that.
They later transitioned to hit points.
literally us 😂😂😂
Yes. And it was GLORIOUS.
To test what athletic and/or magical adventures could do, we got two guys with zero combat experience in a field. As the scientific method intended
@@paulgaither D&D surely suffers from trying to impose realism upon the martials while casters can break reality, they should be doing anime things like lifting houses, jumping tens of meters, lanching Air blades and hitting crowds with a single Slash.
Honestly, it's not a bad thing to try. If they can pull of things - completely untrained - that level 1 characters can't, then the rules are actually kind of restrictive.
They're both in difficult terrain, and can still get full movement and two attacks in 6 seconds.
@@CertifiedDocthe thing to keep in mind is that there is a difference between attacking fast and attacking fast with precision. Think of someone randomly flailing their arms without putting any real force behind it. They can get in like 5 hits in a second, but it'll do no real damage. Now think of a boxer like Mike Tyson. He's really fast and trained and can get like 4 hits but they hit SIGNIFICANTLY harder.
@@phelps6205that's not everyone's vibe though
@@paulgaither5th edition was not in anyway made to go to 10th level nor was any DnD edition. literally everything you said is wrong.
I can't even describe how Jacob runs. It's like nothing I've seen. It feels like he's simultaneously in a half G and 3 G atmosphere.
I grant you a point of Inspiration for that description.
It's kind of a gallop kinda gait
It's like if a T-1000 tried to run like a Georgian Gentlemen Thief.
_"Why isn't my AC equal to how good i can hold my sword"_ - So you want to play a Bladesinger Wizard...
Or take defensive duelist or play swords bard or take dual wielder or play battlemaster fighter or play pathfinder
Dex bonus basically accounts for your weapon skill. Two weapon fighting gives some AC along with Kensai for having a weapon too.
I’ve thought about that before but I always thought it was just part of your dex.
@@GreyfauxxGamingDex accounts for moving out of the way
The problem with dex representing defending yourself with your weapon is that your AC doesn't change when you get disarmed unless you have one of those specific features.
An old tumblr post said it best, "Wizards need somatic and verbal components to cast spells, so the best way to beat them would be to pin their hands to the wall and makeout with them sloppy style to prevent them from casting anything"
Might also work with some sorcerers with access to metamagic anyway, somehow
Don't let the bards know. They would be unstoppable.
I did that once kinda
Most campaigns usually don't allow sexual assault like that, so...
@@gazelle_diamond9768 emphasis on most...
Can't believe they invented real magic just to test this for us.
Last time they invented real fights, now then invent magic
2:06 “Ok 25ft we can pretend that I’m a halfling”
“We have to Pretend”
“SHUT”
Thanks missed that joke
@@jvandep hefty hefty hafling
My thought: why not assume it's difficult terrain lol
Nearly spat out my tea at that comeback.
jacob went 25 feet and didnt realize the brush was difficult terrain smh
Alternate title: Jacob and Colton goof off in a field with swords for 10 minutes
Tree giving diagonal cover in melee is actually gigabrain
It makes sense. Castles in medieval times were made in a way where a right handed person would have a very hard time fighting while going up a set of stairs, but a very easy time going down. This was on purpose to make defending the upper floors easy. That's what narrow spiral staircases are for.
@@pal1d1nl1ght a design that was only useful for people using a sword and shield though
@@blackwingdragonmasta kinda hard to use a polearm in a narrow stair case.
@@blackwingdragonmastaYeah,let me use my Xbow on the staircase,of course your using a shield it's like an entire wall on those conditions.
"I have +5 AC right now" is the most relatably nerdy sentence I've ever heard
Oh shit, the bois got tape measures out. They WARGAMERS now!
Tape measures are just straight-up better than the square grid.
@@ClockworkBees That's why wargamers use them over a grid system (Heroclix and Battletech don't count)
@@ArtFord I’m aware. I made that comment because I’ve thought about this, and I’ve had time to think about this because it’s not new information.
_sensually maintains unit cohesion_
@@ikaemosno Slaanesh content here, this is a family rated channel!
As a fencer and HEMA practitioner, only with a simple attack (1 tempo attack directly at the target) would one swing of a sword be one "attack". If you're counter-timing, for example, the "action" will be a false attack (or other provocation) that draws your opponent's counter-attack, which you then defeat and strike him. That whole exchange would be 3 tempi or more, but it would be "one action" on your part ("attack by counter-time").
TL;DR: Its more complicated than "1 swing=1 attack in D&D". One "action" would encompass multiple movements, which is why it might take several seconds. Could even take six seconds, if you count the footwork to set up an attack.
I always think of it as 1 Attack = one Opportunity to hit. Fighters don't just "attack faster", they find more openings, wich is why they get more attacks.
@@isur4k ohhh that makes so much sense
Every time they revert to monkey brain I’m reminded that adults are just big children and thats beautiful.
The thing about the tree is, most trees in america (like the one in the vid) are comparatively younger than something like a 7 century old behemoth in medieval fantasy, so 5 foot around trees actually make a little more sense.
depending on your local druid population you could have trees in your campaign 10 to 15 feet across
personally as someone who is exactly 5ftx5ft I think it’s very realistic.
Ur 2 dimensional 😦
Women are just 5ft x 5ft planes of existence. Got it.
are we not gonna talk about how funny the "drop item" joke was ???
I think what helps with the realism a bit is that AC is both Armor and ability to dodge.
Like yeah, you can hit someone around a tree, but they'll probably see it coming
It is an interesting way you think about it. You're essentially representing the percentage chance a person or creature will be injured given X assumptions. Reminds me of the "survivability onion".
Is there a good reason hit and damage are two separate rolls, though? Is there a meaningful difference between an arrow missing and an arrow bouncing harmlessly off of a character's armor?
I might add a supression mechanic where every roll below a 3, let's say, but that is not a critical failure subtracts from the target's pool of "fortitude points" (FP). When those hit zero, a target either flees or is pinned.
This represents the only significant difference between a hit and an injurious hit, which is the fact getting hit is scary.
What do you think? I've only ever played DnD once.
@@iivin4233 well i mean like this mainly came up during the tree discussion, and it was where they were discussing that it was easy to hit around the tree
@@iivin4233 i have only played dnd once, isconfident to give mechanical and design advice truly a master of the system at hand here folks
@@iivin4233what the hell are you talking about
This is a video about the funniness of dnd, and I just added another way to think about a question they had
It would be interesting if dodging and armor weren’t combined into a single number. If AC was broken into AC and EV (evasion) for example. Having a high AC and low EV would mean you almost always get hit, but the hits do less damage, while having a high EV and low AC means you don’t get hit often, but when you do, you take a lot of damage. I sometimes play a rougelike that works that way, though it also has SH to represent your ability to block attacks with shields.
Melee attacks are affected by cover. This becomes important to know when one of your players is a polearm master.
I'm tired, I read that as 'a pokémon master.'
Excuse me while I include a bunch of pesky goblins hiding behind stalagmites in my next session
@@ZenFr0g check out "bec-de-corbin" if you have full plate wearing players, lol. It's affectionately nicknamed "the can opener"
5:35 Those under-the-crotch shots have ended many a powerful Wizard's bloodlines. That is why the Magi decided to don the Robes, to alleviate the temptation... and 2:50 "Why isn't my AC equal to how good I hold my sword?" It is, as Dexterity Bonus for light armor.
But you don't need a weapon for the AC bonus though. And blocking in plate armor is possible aswell.
"any time one of your turn starts its a hear me out"
dudem my DM whenever i send a "i got an idea" he has nightmares, one time we were in session and i said "yo i just thought of something" and he was holding back tears.
3:01 "What does this do? What if I did this?"
....
That's gonna be a fireball from me, dawg.
"Why isn't my AC equal to how good I can hold my sword?" I mean, that's kinda what the Duelist fighting style does.
yea but why should that be a class-specific ability? any guy who knows how to use a sword also knows how to block
No, but it *is* what the Defensive Duelist Feat does.
@@isaacaliengot them mixed up, thanks for correction!
Jacob and pals waving around plastic swords at the park??? NOW THIS IS WHAT I'M HERE FOR!!!
You go up right? And you hit stuff, swing, swing swung then sing and swing and one last swing and there! That’s it you’ve got it! WIN!
When he comments on the video but doesnt post it on Discord
One thing important about the number of attacks is that it is not, at least in 3.5 and Pathfinder, that you are swinging more times. You are actually swinging way more times in a round than your number of attacks, but most of them are getting parried or blocked. Your number of attacks is the number of openings you see in your opponents defense, and thats why when you level up you get more of them. You become more skilled at noticing openings, not faster at physically swinging your weapon. Its also why iterative attacks have progressively worse penalties to attack. You are noticing smaller, harder to exploit openings that less skilled opponents wouldnt even see, but theyre still hard to exploit.
3:00 "why isnt my ac how good I can hold my sword"
ive actually pictured that as a reflavor for barbarian rage, so skilled with a sword your deflecting half of the damage youd take by deflecting blows
There's a feat called defensive duelist that literally let's you block with a sword
@the_netherqueen yeah I know that but that's only once per round
That's a really cool reflavour!!
So I feel like something that is often overlooked with the "5ft square" thing. Is that when people measure a 5ft gap and then test to see if they can reach eachother, you're too close. Characters are assumed to occupy the "center" of their respective tiles, with attacks simulating lunging, binding, and parrying. This means the distance between two adjacent squares is still 5ft when measuring properly center to center.
Another problem is that the number of "attacks" thinks of "how many times can I swing?" Rather than "how many times can I find or create an opening to actually strike?" With the attack roll determining how well your character created their opening and whether they actually succeeded in scoring their hit or if their opponents reflexes and armor defeated the strike.
Getting more attacks simulates gaining more skill that you can use to create and strike at these openings.
Edit 1: Spelling.
Yes, you get it!
That's a good point about attacks and extra attacks.
Please show a real game combat that lasts over an hour, then play it out in real time and realize only 42 seconds passed
I love that this is essentially two adults playing swords in the backyard. HARD SCIENCE is being done here.
2:10 “We have to pretend?!” 😂 … crit emotional damage right there!
That'll be 1d4 psychic damage and disadvantage on your next attack
5e? Not at all, you can swing a halberd or cast a spell while someone is actively wrestling you. 3.5? Phenomenal.
If thats youre only problem, you can homebrew
@@gorgit No, there's mountains of problems with 5e. See, it's not a roleplaying game, 3.5 is
just a couple of adult men playing with swords and tape measures in the middle of a field.
And it was glorious
Honestly based behavior. Simply embrace the cringe and you shall become free.
@@brandonogden3498true, sometimes cringe is based and that needs to be recognized more
"I couldn't hit you in a million years" (when talking about cover)
"I cast magic missile."
-Sighs heavily-
I Tested DnD combat on my 3 year old brother!
I Think it worked cause he hasn’t moved in hours!
Oh
Oh no
@@ZenFr0g let me test it on you Next!
Fun fact: if you want to cast fireball, turn on the gas in your house, wait for a while then strike a match
2:08 Guards! Guards! There's been a murder!
Something about everything with this video felt like a much welcome return to form of the youtube format. Reminded me of the original charm of people just going out to have fun and share it and that's it; SUBLIME! Reminded me and when my friend and I would sword fight on a trampoline. Thanks for this wholesome charm of what TH-cam used to be.
The editing really made this video.
Cracked me up everytime there was any memery. Good shit.
You are forgetting that to cast spells you must use material components, naruto ninjutsu signs AND scream
tbf most material costs are covered by the spellcasting focus. The most important part here is the Naruto signs for sure. Always liked the Anti-Magic barbarian though who puts his fist in the spellcasters mouth.
8:40 cover does indeed apply to melee attacks, alot of people don't know that, but like, yes, if you are trying to hit someone behind a tree, they have half cover
*we have to pretend??*
Was CRAZY DUDE😂😂😂😂
Colton's heartfelt, "You're a hostile combatant" was so earnest I died laughing
ObiAni technique is OP and is banned at all the tables I play at as well as RL fencing tournaments. Also nothing wrong with two bros fighting with their wands alone in the woods.
This has the energy of two brothers playing outside and arguing about their play pretend rules 😂
I want an edit of this video where every time they fight, battle music plays.
Ahhhh love this! The old combat videos were some of the first videos that drew me to this channel years ago!
me: I can always expect the highest quality content from XP to level 3.
XP to level 3: 5:26
Can I just say the graphics in this were fantabulous. Also was kinda hoping the dash would be like the knight from the Holy Grail...
you look absolutely insane doing these
plz more
Love this kind of videos, please do more where you're both out and about lol
Your sounds effects and animations are wonderful. So funny.
I love the idea of putting trees in between squares. It could add a lot of interesting dynamics into fights.
2:15 just the loudness of the "SHUT-" is so funny to me.
You make this video every two years and I love it
the way i view attacks in dnd is that you’re locked in a back and forth combat whenever you’re adjacent to an enemy. the amount of attacks you have in a turn is the amount of times that you’re able to find or make an opening to deliver an attack to the vitals.
Jacob really went hard on the edits this video huh
This is the dumbest video I've watched in weeks and I loved every second of it.
3:00 As a THEATRICAL combat performer, I am embarrassed by this.
2:52 Hey, remember how you add your dex to your AC?
Yeah, that's all the parrying and dodging you're doing irl
Two friends goof around a tree for ten minutes and twenty six seconds straight
Lol I loved watching you and Colton geek out. It was hilarious just watching a couple of friends mess around in the woods.
Since early days I tend to see attacks below 10+DEX as not making contact at all, next I add shield on top, then armor itself, then natural armor like thick skin. Unarmored Defense would fall into the "no contact" part and in general anything that enhances something falls into that camp. Tedious to keep track of, but once every interval is tracked it can help add flavor/narrative to the boring basic attacks. If attack is only stopped by the very last natural armor part, you could see this as the armor getting damaged but thick skin saves the day.
For dexterity based characters, your AC is based on how well they can use a sword! But letting strength also define your AC seems like it would even the gap slightly
I think all classes should add WIS to AC and only DEX if in light armor. Maybe Monks get resistances like a barb?
Nah, that would be weird. Like, what will be the point of heavy armor then?
Dwayne! Dwayne, them two pale fellers is in tha field swinging swords at eachother again!
2:05 Best Roast In D&D TH-cam History
There's a lot of perfect out of context moments here
Honestly, I agree with you on the sword AC thing. I think Parry to add 2 to your AC when hit with an attack to potentially turn it into a miss as a reaction should be baseline for everyone wielding only weapons (wizard staff counts as a quarterstaff).
About radius damage, when my PCs dodge the fireball or lightning i describe this as they rolled or jumped even if the didnt use movement. Sometimes i confuse an older exp DM but i think its worth it.
YOU KEEP DOING THESE VIDEOS AND THEY'RE GOLD EveryTIME
I’ve actually been trying to develop a different combat system that’s more dynamic, but I’m still working out how to balance it, and incorporating armor/shields. Basically when you make an attack roll against someone they also roll, either to dodge (dex) or block (con), if your attack is higher than their dodge, you hit as normal. If their dodge is higher you miss, if they choose to block, your damage is reduced by the difference between your rolls (you roll an 18 and they roll a 14 that’s a -4 to damage). And if they roll a crit on their block/dodge they can make a retaliatory strike
"I've got extra attack... with a foam/ plastic sword that weighs under a pound"
Longswords weigh 2-4 lbs so him maybe getting one attack out is also kinda on the money.
@@Medul759 I came to say this. If my opponent is not providing threat, I can easily throw a cut per second.
The editing on this is out of this world
Man, i forgot how much fun it is to just fuck around with the boys in the yard.
I am so happy you guys can make a living of of this. This is 200% wholesome content.
Jacob has discovered the power of disarming attacks
Wow boys you are looking great! More field episodes please. And wow hilarious editing 😂
There were a lot of issues with this if you really want to test it
Attacks per turn are attacks that actually have a chance to hit. During the 6 second period its assumed that many attacks/clashes are going on. So if you wanted to test how many attacks you could get off, you would need to run 30 feet to him, while he is moving around in his 5 foot box avoiding you. (This prob be easier if you had 5 foot mats to stand on to stay in.
Funny vid for a halfling tho
Dude I was just thinking about these rules videos where you guys are putting it to the test outside.
3:03 "What if I do this in D&D?"
DM voice: Ahem. I believe that is known as the Full Defensive Action. Rather than striking at your foe, you devote all your energy to defense.
I love this sort of video. It just looks exactly like the sort of thing that I’d end up doing with my friends
“Disengage should not be an action”
But you disengaged from the combat by walking backward, which is not going to be as fast as going forward
New idea: everyone gets bonus action disengage, but for non-rouges, your speed is cut in half when doing so
this might be the nerdies shit I have seen in ages and I love it
8:36 Literal opportunity attack in action, you saw it here folks
“You leave yourself open. Why’s that not a mechanic?”
Reckless attack
Only barbarians leave themselves open?
Any action that isn't Dodge is automatically leaving yourself open.
I love that Jacob just starts impromptu blade dancing partway through, then immediately devolves into the most awkward defensive stances ever. XD
The 5' rule at the beginning I had down as you occupying a 5' square space in whoch your character uses the space to fulfill his actions. So 2 characters can be in eachothers face whilst still occupying thier respective squares.
Great edits, very funny.
An attack roll =/= one swing. It’s an abstraction.
Your attack roll represents about 6 seconds of combat- however that may look like for a character of your skill level.
So what does 6 seconds of combat look like? Probably several swings, feigning, juking, parrying, blocks, and hopefully something that gets through in that 6 seconds to do some damage 😂
Maximal shitposting. I love it.
You know what I just tried? Watching this with the Soundtrack from the "French Taunter" skit from MP and the holy grail. It fit quite nicely.
I for one am in favor of having a weapon in hand applying to Ac, only concern is the added layer of remembering to alter your AC based on having your weapon readied.
defensive duelist
I love this video so much because it just shows the two of you being goof balls and having a good time!
This was at the same time the most scuffed and most epic combat ever. I loved it
Realest video I've seen in 3 years, 4 months, a week, a day, an hour, and a minute
Your AC includes your parry/dodge of incoming attacks. That's why it's based on Dex! And also why, although your "turn" might be completable in under 6s, that 6s also includes the time you're responding to others' attacks by doing said parrying/dodging 😊
Edit: I remember watching a different video somewhere (can't remember where sorry) by somebody who actually knew how sword fighting worked and said turn-based combat actually _does_ make sense for this type of combat because you do kinda take "turns" being on the attack and the defence. And so that 6s round includes both your time on the attack (your turn) and on the defence (the enemy's turn)
my favorite part of dnd combat is how if someone is prone and you make a ranged attack within 5 ft its still disadvantage. i feel like it should be advantage because if you are shooting someone lying on the floor directly in front of you with a bow or spell or whatever it should be much easier to hit them and much harder to avoid, unless one is to assume that the ranged user is scared of being poked in the shins and the melee user is really good at barrel rolling to the side to avoid point blank arrows, which, yeah i guess is see it. but it feels a lot more goofy than having the "knock them over and then execution" work. actually i think the issue is that there should be a difference between "lying prone to get cover" and "lying prone due to being knocked over" where one gets advantage against range and the other gets disadvantage
Mom: "Go play with the neighbors kids"
the neighbors kids: "could you hit me with a fire ball"
So many ticks receiving reactions in this video.