Dome building methods - Beveled frame
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ก.ย. 2024
- Probably the easiest way to build a dome, the beveled frame method is the most flexible and efficient dome building system for the DIY builder. You can cover a dome in polythene, glass, plywood or even double glassed units, the only time I wouldn't use this is if I where building a tent type structure that needed to be packed down.
I developed this system in 2008: geo-dome.co.uk/...
There are no patents just a Creative commons CC BY SA licence so anyone can use this method even to build domes commercially.
Any Questions just leave a comment below.
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as a woodworker i find this much more 'logical' to me... i like the 'no hubs'... no matter what other material i've seen - pvc, EMT etc, the intersections always seem to be unwieldy and the the point that will rip the plastic.
Thanks for posting this. We bought your plan this year and are finally getting around to building the dome part of our greenhouse. This along with your plan will help us a lot!
Did it work ?
Would you be willing to explain how the bevel angle of struts is calculated? How does one work out the dihedron angle? I'm struggling to find a formula. Thanks so much, really great video!
did u find out how to do so
I’m also looking for this formula. I found the formula to find the size/length of A•B•C. But on a v3. Still wondering how to find the angle formula.
Hi Paul,
Built a dome using the plans I purchased from you last year. Worked out great, very easy to build once you can wrap your head around the angle cuts and how it all comes together. This video would have been great to help visualize things. Glad it is out there now for those taking the plunge and building their own.
Brian Smith I don't see why anybody would pay for plans for something that could be found out for free, even plans that get purchased end up getting out somehow.
saves time maby :P
@@carolynmmitchell2240 Maybe it's a way of showing respect and gratitude towards those who are doing the calculus for you?
what tools did you used to build the dome?
Paul, this build method is by far the best. You are a genius and thanks for making this method public. If it ever gets warm here in Wisconsin, I plan to build my first beveled frame dome this Spring.
Thanks and good luck with your build, I would love to see a picture or two.
Ever build it?
@@NwoDispatcher No, but the plan is on the drawing board. Unfortunately, I now live in an apartment and my "building" of anything is very limited. I may not be able to build one until I relocate.
Exactly what I was looking for. Thanks for sharing. This video will stand the test of time.
We all in Holtspur Beaconsfield may well build a glass dome and replace the church here,.
Glass Biodomes and ones like your brilliant tuition mini TH-cam documentaries are really helping raise living standards around the globe. Thank you very much Paul. It is looking like all the dwellings around here should and must try to be alloted equal fair share of land to live off grid in and around.
Glass Biodomes look much more perfect, heavenly and celestial.I would love to help turn the whole globe into Ecovillages with 316 marine grade stainless steel off grid plumbing (without lead solder)
Nice vid very well thought out ~as small note : if plywood was chosen as a covering then strut lengths should be restricted to the width of the plywood sheet and this would increase the speed of a project and reduce wastage
What does that work out to for done size if the width is 4’? Also this doesn’t cover building a base wall.
Thank you so much for this video, it really helps to visualize. I would have to say you are the first person to be this detailed about this specific technique. I've been trying to learn this technique since I got a glimpse of Bucky's 60's Popular science version. I never could locate one of the plans... Still looking though.
I love the detail you showed at the end. The whole idea is awesome.
Paul, you are very generous to share so much of your know how. Thanks, I didn't know I was so interested in domes ;-)
Hi Paul, do you still feel this is the most cost effective easiest method to build a dome frame? Specifically one suitable to live in.
Thank you, Paul! You are very attentive to details. Many important nuances.
Yeah. this is brilliant! Nice work. I can tell you spent some hours scratching your head to come up with it!
Fabulous episode of a most worthwhile series. Thankyou.
Great video.
I wish I'd watched it before I ordered my hub kit, as it's not as complex as I'd imagined - and I have a table saw so itd be a doddle :)
beautiful results......a lot of precise calculations...but bravo.....I'm wondering only about...insects that eat wood...upkeep over the wood surface, and load bearing for windows and other materials such as metal and other plastic related insulation......and finally what kind of energz...or heat loss is released from a structure like this with any combination of windows and covering . Okay, I'll stop complaining. It's a beauty....
Rashidii Graffiti sum woods a bug resistant ceder . Cyprus. I know are
A very helpful video. (Everywhere I look, though, the actual math of calculating bevel angles is missing.)
You also asked if there is a cheaper way to make domes - there may be one, though it does not have the aesthetics of joinery. Check out zip tie domes (TN, USA).
This is fantastic! Well done! Clear and concise. Thank you!
You are talented Mr Robinson. If you wrote a book I'd buy it in a snap. This looks like it would do the job, but if you were building a dome for your family what would you use "personally", what would you decide on for a hub that would be labour saving, would last a few seasons and would bring the highest level of stability to the structure. What would you choose for your hub. Would it be the new hub connectors you are working on?
How do you figure the angle cuts for the the pieces that make up the triangle prior to fastening the jigs?
What a great video. Love the idea of the jig and how to cover.. A huge help. Thanks
what us the bevel angle for the 4v so I can build it in this method
awesome video...however, a follow-up with how to calculate the length and how to calculate the angle of the 'fillet' to achieve the required curvature would be very much appreciated...that said, it all just clicked in my mind.
have a potential project where I would like to make a half-geo dome wrapped around a 'regular' shed shape at the top of my garden after levelling it off.
it's like the north face of the igor right now!!
Very ingenious design, if you can start with logs, it should save more materials. I think there is no need to stagger since there are two layers. Not concise enough.
How would you solve condensation in doubble layer glass? Argon gas will work if its 100% sealed, but might not work if its timber?
You gloss over the jigs fairly quickly and I couldn't tell if there was anything tricky about them. Are they attached to the plywood at flat 90 degree angles with all of the multiple angles accounted for in the beveled struts in the triangles? And is it obvious which way the beveled struts should be placed in the jigs or is it easy to get them reversed (upside down or backward) if you're not paying close attention?
Dear Paul! Tell me, please, how large can a non-hub dome be? And what size of timber is needed when building a dome 11 meters in diameter.
Not once has anyone mentioned the angles inside the isosceles triangle, which should remain the same if you've got lengths cut using the formula, or the option of only bevelling the triangles that fit between the pentagons to keep strength and save labour.
It would seem like this idea is straightforward until you start constructing it yourself and then you realise there's alot of useful, information missing. I hate to criticise given the nature of the subject but I can't help thinking that really basic stuff needs to be covered first. Using the jig in this manner is also redundant if you've ordered your lengths to size already and can't afford to have offcuts..
I tried a prototype built with pentagons, and although not as strong, may well be adequate for a greenhouse type structure where nothing is being fixed to the inside.. The angles where the faces meet create too much stress on the joins so definitely not weight bearing as far as I can tell..
Maybe you didn't notice his other videos that cover more of the details not to mention he was a website where he sells complete plans.
Fantastic video. worth more than i know to say
Thanks for this it really helped me understand the angles! 👍🙏
Paul, on a 2V dome , using 30mm x 60mm wood what would be the dimension/thickness of the wedge at 0:32 of the video using my scenario, I would very much appreciate your information and your advice. thank you
Just started watching, this is so interesting. I would love to make one out of resin, what do you think?
Why should I cover three with plastic as opposed to covering the whole thing with a giant plastic sheet like some other designs? Thanks!
Thank you for sharing this.. what's the ° of the cut
Unless you could get the glass panels cut directly from the factory, and not cut after the fact, it seems to be a lot of wasted material being cut to make it a triangle....
Hopefully the factory could cut it at the 60 degree angles as this glass is being made....
how do you come up with angle that you rip the board in half. I guess it depends on the size of your dome. is there a formula for figuring that out
Hello Paul. Does this method work using the krutschke method? I am in love with the appearance of this construction.
Are there calculations that show the relationships between the jig size (panel size) and the angle of the bevel cut and how that relates to the overall structure size? If you get the relationship between the length and the bevel edge wrong it wont line up right.
So, how is the dihedral angle between the triangles determined?
The best! Plus Geothermal would be the perfect greenhouse! Thank you.
la foto final, no corresponde con la tecnica descripta y propuesta en el video / the final photo does not correspond to the technique described and proposed in the video
Looks alright to me.
I like this system, but the endgrain you drew at 5:00 is strange.
Expert work
Please, I need the dihedral angle for a 1v Dome-- I believe it to be 54 Degrees but would like confirmation. Thanks
69.1 degrees.
I can't use wood where I am, due to termites and very humid conditions. I was hoping to use some sort of polymer piping.....maybe ABS. Have you consolidated all these great videos into a DVD for download, or a book perhaps ? Thanks for sharing.
It's called a playlist, you can make one.
Thank you for doing all these instructive videos !!
Geometric power! it is inherited from ancient time, a forever great force, not only human being is benefit from it, other creatures too.
I have a way of doing something similar to this, but with any skape struts... the ends are halved, then overlapping eachoter.
, i`ll work ona dome Project in 2016, ecsact like this way.
was on you web page , thx for the work.
im asking if you have a tool for calculate a ZOM(swiss re tower) ? that would be nice!
This is amazing! Such a great method... I was just wondering if you have any info on how to find those bevel angles on a sketch up model...
also, how do you screw all the triangles together at the hub?
it seems like one triangle would be left out if I screw them in at the ends
Hey Paul, when you say frames won't pack down as well, you mean there will be gaps?
I cant help but think that making Pentagon panels would save on wood and time and you would only need to make a few triangular frames to join them? I wonder if the pinned joins in a pentagon would be under more or less stress than the triangular ones
Problem is that the pentagons aren't even but slightly pointed outwards. Therefore your Pentagon needs to be built with 5 triangles.
Pentagons would be much weaker. It's a push with steel let alone wood.
Hmmmmm, I thought about this for a long while & I've got nowhere on it. Plz take a look at it.
Between a pair of two identical/symmetical triangles (ex: 2 freq hexagon & hexagon) it's intuitive the bevel angle is half of their dihedral angle.
But between a pair of two different triangles (ex: 2 freq hexagon & pentagon) it's intuitive the bevel angle would be NOT quite half of their dihedral angle.
Any comments might help, Thks
I also thought this, I'm going to make a 1/10 scale model to work it out.. Can't help but think making up pentagons and joining them with triangles would be easier?
@@TheDeft1s Wellll I'm going with a truncated icosahedron design, done the calculations for the dihedral angles, & they agree with en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truncated_icosahedron dihedral angles 6to6-agons: 138.189685°& 6to5-agons: 142.62° . The bevel angles between 6to6-agons is half of 138 as expected but the bevel angles beween 6to5-agons is 67.6 & 72.3 which is very close to half of 142.
If a redo them for a 2freq geodesic dome design, I post them.
is there a way or formula to know what the angle of the bevel should be in degrees?
I'm trying this for the first time. Can someone help me with the math? How to determine the diequal angle and the size of the triangles. I want to build a 10' diameter dome set on a 3" high knee wall. The bevel method seem to be the least complicated. This is for my granddaughters green house. I think it will be a fun learning experience for them. ... and me. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Jim Mc
After looking at a few online calculators, we decided to purchase Paul Robinson's plan (very reasonable price) and modify it to the size we wanted. It was MUCH easier than having done it ourselves.
i want to find the exact mesure for the triangle for a 3v beveled frame of a 30 ft dome
Hello Paul, Do you sell the plans for this so that I may obtain a cutlist?
He's selling plans on his website, links at the channel info
What's the relation of the dihedral angle to the cut? There is a 90 degree but what angle should the saw be set to cut the bevel?
He tells you at the beginning of the video. The bevel angle changes with the size of the radius, Its variable. :44 seconds
Hi paul, i always get leaking in my dome and other people I've spoken to that have used this method say that they struggle with this problem too. Any advice when using rigid polycarbonate? i used the glazing tape but all the panels fell off in the wind
OK first thing is to use good quality glazing tape, stuff you buy from the local DIY shop isn't that good, I also seal all the joints with polythene repair tape, the panels can't fall off if you do this. Use 50mm and you won't even see it as it only covers the frame area. Let me know how this works for you.
Could this wood shape be substituted by ribar enforced concrete?
I dont see why not I always thought they were in compression so you could skip the rebar maybe it would be really hard to make such small cages although if you put a skin over it in concrete with some mesh stand up bars where you going to bolt through it. It would be very heavy to assemble.
great to see. are there plans for this? - or a paypal i can contribute to for the plans?
Yes I have plans here: geo-dome.co.uk/domeshop/
Hi Paul,
Thank you for all these precious info. Question : Have you ever tried to use glass instead of polycarbonat ? Can this type of structure can handle the weight ?
Thank you for your help
@4:36 he briefly talks about flaw as a covering
If only some store sold this priced by the triangle already premade with a self locking no tools required feature
Yep, I would buy it in a heartbeat
It would have to be made to order cos they wouldnt have space or cash to stock the triangles for every frequency and size of dome. Made to order would likely be 10x the price vs making it yourself
super how you explained!! Thanks - I hope we will build one!!!
Where do i get the "di-hedral" make the bevels you speak of?
why you do not show most important angle of this 0:46 how much is angle ???????????otherwise how can i build dome.
I’m trying to make a hanging chair that’s basically 1/2 of a dome using this method. Now, I don’t have very strong math skills whatsoever so finding the bevel degree is really difficult. So could you explain how to calculate the bevel? As in how do you find the dihedral angle?
Working out dihedral and bevel angles can be a bit of a problem because they often vary depending on frequency and geometry used. Best thing to do is decide on your geometry then work it out from there. Are you thinking 2v or 3v? 2v is super easy with a nice straight edge, 3v will be more challenging but looks cool. If you let me know frequency and size I can put some quick plans together.
@@Geo-Dome I want to build this hanging chair pin.it/LdleIJ7
Paul I have tried to order plans and email you through your website with no response is there any other way to get in contact with you thanks for sharing I'm trying to find the bevel angles on a 16ft diameter 2v dome I don't understand how you figure I have to can you help thanks
That's genius! Now I need to figure out the angle and the dimensions... do you have some kind of calculator for that?
Thanks for sharing!
Excellent, thanks!
Thank you
tremendo aporte, gracias por tu tiempo.-
i love trimming wood floosh. :)
At 1:10 you mention using a thicker piece of wood and cutting down the center. I want to use this method because it saves money on lumber. However my father keeps warning me that cutting a piece of lumber down the center (aka: ripping) causes the cut pieces to warp. It would be impossible to build a geodesic dome with such curvature in the struts.
How do you address this problem?
Treated wood warps less than untreated. Cured wood now a days warps very little. If buying from a box store look at the rings. Cutting with the grain or against matters. Wood type matters. A little bend can be removed mechanical. Like by an Archimedes screw or bolt when put in a geodesic structure.
Tell your dad to go look at his rafters with a laser level and replace all the twisted ones at once! When he is finished send him over to my house. While hes doing this ask him how saw mills cut tree's?
@@sclabhailordofnoplot2430 Ive found treated wood in my area warps more than red cedar that I made a fence out of. The treated wood here is made of the worst wood available it seam to me.
You you please tell me what size timber your using
Hmmm, you explain it as one size of triangle element, but on the next visualisation it's clearly different sizes of triangles? How does that work?
Typically there are at least 2 different size triangles in a dome, search unity dome if you want to a see a dome with only one size. If you look up 2v dome calculator or 3v dome calculator you can get the sizes for a dome with two unique triangles, hope that helps
Thanks Paul
I love the idea of building this but how do you calculate the length of each strut?
Thanks you very much for this video. Everything is very clear.
many thanks ! Cheers
Beautiful video thank you very much. Could you tell me what angle I have to cut the wood?
It depends on the dome frequency and a few other things, this link shows angles for a classic 3v: geo-dome.co.uk/3v_tool.asp work out the bevel from the dihedral like this - dihedral divide by 2 then take away from 90. Example 166° dihedral /2= 83 (90-83) = 7° bevel angle. I will post some more calculation tools when I get time.
for 4v ???? gracias!
Here you go: geo-dome.co.uk/4v_tool.asp
Dihedral angles are at the bottom, this is classic 4v so there are 6 different panels. I have improved this with a new 4 panel design, do you have a diameter in mind?
To clarify the 3v dome would require 2 different angle bevels 7 & 5.5?
Could you give the information for a 2v I found the part for 3v thanks for sharing
thanks for your effort ,,, what you mean by building a tent ??? is it not to use a fabric
I mean canvas covered domes that you want to build then take down, marquees, etc
Спасибо , очень интересно...
Disadvantage: lots of ripping, requiring a table saw, more work, as each strut is double, and more chance of leaks.
compared to what? You should watch his other videos and put the whole build together it will make a lot more sense then.
@@dustintinsley3899
Make a 6v panel dome and a 6v hub and strut and see which one takes the longest ;) Hint; you`ll have to make 8 triangle jigs before you even begin to cut the 1080 struts to make up the 360 triangles.. A 6v hub and strut would be up by the end of play on day two, day three if you have long coffee breaks, its only 196 hubs and 555 struts.
Great video lovely detail
Thanks Paul. Rip 2 bevels at the same time. Thanks.
Very helpful video.
I loved that
What length of stutts your using
what is the angle of the bevel cut?
Nice work bro, helped me a lot! Thks
Can you do this with 2x2 members? (2x4 ripped in half)
Yes but it's a bit thin with US sizes because 2x2 is actually 1 1/2" x 1 1/2" You could try 3x2 with the bevel angle cut down the centre to get two struts from a single board.
very nice.
Great work!
I cant understand these English terms .What is angle of the bevel one ? 6.5? I ordered plans and asked Paul Robinson questions about it. He did not answer to me clearly. Just linked video.... "This bevel is half of die iqul angle " What does that even means? Can I get help from someone else?
Half of the equal angle...
"Dihedral angle". It's just a fancy word for the angle of the "v" between the two pieces of wood at 1:35. The faces of that V are on the outside of the panels, and that causes the panels to be turned by the same angle relative to each other, as seen at 3:29.
are the triangles all equilateral? you didn't show the dimensions of each side. Are all triangles exactly the same for the entire globe? (I guess I am unclear on the meaning of '2-frequency')
There are 10 equilateral triangles in a 2v dome, they are located between pentagons
@@JohnGuest45 I do not understand your answer. Is the entire structure built with ONLY the same size equilateral triangles? how many do you need? The 'globe' you show has dozens of triangles, but you said I would only need 10? How do you make a pentagon AND hexagon with only the same size triangles? I assume something must be different between the triangles used for a hexagon and the triangles used for a pentagon. This is an excellent video though! I want to build one based on this, I intend to video it and credit your site.
.
@@mikekosak9598
A 2v panel dome has a total of 40 triangles, 10 are equilateral. The dome is made up of 6 pentagons and 10 equilaterals. A 1v dome uses 15 equilateral triangles, if you search you tube for "star plate dome" you will find a few. Note the edge of the triangles are not 90 degrees, you will need a 21 degree dihedral angle to make them fit together. The easiest way to do this is to set the tilt on your table saw to 69 degrees and rip wider timber in half lengthwise.
@@JohnGuest45 ok thank you for replying but I guess I still am not getting it. This video clearly shows the beveled edge and the way to cut a board the correct way to get 2 pieces. But then it shows only the hexagon built. There must be something different to make a pentagon.
@@mikekosak9598
A 2v dome doesnt have hexagons, it has 6 pentagons made up of 30 triangles (6x5) and 10 equilateral triangles that fill in the gaps between the pentagons :) There are 2 chord factors for a 2v dome, 0.6180 and 0.5465. For a 2v dome with a radius of 1 you need 10 equilateral triangles with 3 side lengths of 0.6180. For the 30 triangles that make up the 6 pentagons you need triangles with one long side at 0.6180 and two short sides at 0.5465. The internal angles for the equilateral triangle is 60 deg (x3). The internal angles for the pentagon triangle is 55.57 deg (x2) on each end of the long side and 68.86 deg (x1 at the apex). The dihedral angle on the 0.6180 sides is 7.22 deg, the dihedral angle on the 0.5465 sides is 11.23 deg. These translate into table saw blade tilt angles of 82.78 deg and 78.77 deg. Lengths are measured from vertex to vertex which are on the outside of the dome.
Realy nice video. But! The damn screw at 5:42 is reverse treaded, couldn't stop focusing on it.
Ha ha you are right, Who would even notice that? I can only suggest viewing the video through a mirror would fix this issue, everyone will be checking it out now.
was building it in my head and got stuck when that screw showed up, i gues everyone have their autistic moments :)
It's probably english tread ;-)
Or does that only work with english treaded bolts
What are the dimensions of the wood depicted in the video?
It's a beveled peace of wood about 45mm x 25mm (2" x 1") but it comes out at about 22mm at the thick side and 16mm on the thin side. (7/8" and 3/4")
Mолодец! Regular fellow, It is clear even the deaf Papuans!.))
what is a hobe ?
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