And THAT folks is how a YT tutorial should be done! BRAVO!!!! Straight, to the point, no muscle memory, no theme intros and graphics, no long winding explanations of personal history.....no Distrokid ads. Perfect! I now have another valuable technique in my kit for my songs. Sir, THANK YOU. ☺☺
What folks don’t realize is super short punchy videos like this take a LOT of work to teach something. Every word has to be intentional, let me say I subbed and I hope to see a lot more videos like this! Straight and to the point, this was awesome
Not every video has to be 2 minutes long, but just writing a script and redoing takes if you mess up gets you 80% of the way there. I'd rather have a 10 minute video with jump-cuts than a 30-minutes video full of "ums", "ahms", repeating the same concept at least 3 times in the span of 15 seconds, "oh the program crashed", "where did I put that file"... 💀
@@SynthHackerTVtotally agreed with @dadtier564, also sub’d & liked. Was aware of polymeters, but never thought to use them in modulation - lightbulb moment for sure! Thanks so much 😊
You can use the factors of numbers to get complex with this. For example, the factors of 12 are 1,2,3,4,6,12. This means that you can play around with patterns cycling through resonance dissonance and back. Might even time a drop to hit in the 12.
One of the electronic artists I know of who pioneered this technique mid 2000s already, including syncopation (off-beat sounds, instead of on-beat) IIRC. After that, a lot of electronic music started to use it, which made a lot of EDM more interesting to listen to IMHO.
@@ericgelders FWIW, syncopation (putting accents on "weak" beats) has been a part of music since people started banging rocks and sticks together in the Stone Age. Syncopation is as fundamental to dance music in the 2020s as it was to jazz in the 1920s. Syncopation is basically another word for "funk". Most straight-ahead techno lacks funk by design (techno was originally supposed to sound like a machine made it, not a human), but house, hip-hop, drum n' bass, and many sub-genres of EDM are "funky" due to syncopation. The 'Amen' break, the Funky Drummer, and the 'Think' break (3 of the most sampled and influential beats of all time) are classic examples of syncopated beats. And of course it's not just drums that can be syncopated. Tangerine Dream and other artists of the Berlin school were doing hypnotic synth stuff with strange polymeters in the 1970s.
Fun to do a 4 beats over 3 thing, where the beat starts with everything in straight 4/4 timing, then add elements in 3/4 timing to groove on a 4 over 3 polyrhythm until finally the 3/4 timing "wins" and everything transitions to a 3/4 timing track -- then transition back to 4/4 before the track ends so it's not impossible to mix into the next. I love making the floor dance in weird time signatures without most of them even knowing, but 4 over 3 is by far my favorite. This is what happens when a prog rocker gets into electronic lol
Oh wow, I’d never thought of applying poly meters to automation - seems obvious in retrospect! Really cool video, BTW - clear, USEFUL tip and straight to the point. 🙏
Go into the actual clip modulation... Hit the 'envelopes' tab, select 'un-linked' and you can set your automation and modulation loop brace independent to that of your audio/midi-note loop brace.
woooooah, I cant believe how much i've used ableton since that was added somewhere in live 11 & I never even gave that linked/unlinked button under clip envelopes a second thought lol thx for reminding me to look deeper, I can already think of 3 projects where I need to put this new knowledge to use
I don't even own any of those apps, but I found myself watching 5 of your videos in a row. Something so soothing and hypnotic to your videos, i love it
This is golden. i knew about polyrhythms this is common in techno but i never thought about modulation the filter cutoff for example in 3 bars, that is really clever. Good stuff!
I've been working with lots of things similar to this in Reason for the past few years. My latest experimentations has involved melodic polymeter arpeggios, doing relatively simple melody lines wiithin a scale, but the rhythm of these arps are set by some other repeating pattern, with a different step length than the arps, which makes the melody line "evolve" over time, but still stay the same in terms of which notes are triggered. So the horizontal order of the notes and the notes themselves stay the same, but the rhythm of how they are played, changes. Another thing I found out, is that you can route any LFO CV signal into an arpeggiator gate/step trigger (like on the Thor synth), with the steps synced to a specific division, to create crazy, varying ratchet arpeggios which are semi-random. Then you can of course link another LFO to the first one's speed or depth controls (or why not both? haha) to make things even more chaotic, but still within the boundaries you decide. Or, you can take any audio signal and convert it to a CV signal, then use that instead of a simple LFO shape. There's so many possibilities. I am sure stuff like this is possible in other DAWs too, but within the Reason rack, it is very easy to set up, since the gate and note CV inputs and outputs are separated on most of the stock devices and synths. This is the intended use of Reason's modularity, in my opinion, and as far as I know, the functionality has been there since day 1. Oh, as a final tip: if you're interested in rhythms, go listen to some Meshuggah, folks.
word. sometimes im lazy and I just make long drawn out notes/legato sustained notes and just add trance gates with different rhythyms. Kilohearts trance gate is a helpful tool especially since it show you visually in a circle your pattern. So you could start with a simple 16th note one and then duplicate it on another pad or element and then change the speed to triplets, dotted notes, the pattern of the gate etc. and really go crazy with trying to get a funky rhythym. Theres obviously experimentation thats required but definately a fun way to experiement and find those happy accidents, glad to see u back man, your videos on massive synth presets helped me so much years back!
You can apply this to stereo panning to make hats and shakers move around making the stereo field sound wider and leaving space in the mix for other elements.
Yes! Thank you for the definition of “polymetric modulation”! Whenever I run a sequence it’s usually in 3, 5, or 7 with a loop or drum machine in 4. I just subscribed and will check out the channel. Thank you.
I've once considered the idea of using some low frequency noise or pulsating signal that is slightly off-beat to automate some equalizers and effects to see if it would achieve an interesting effect. My idea was that if I modulated an filter or effect with some noise or off-beat sound that it would make some instruments sound more "random".
What I like to do is to control Gate and pitch separately, like you would do with modular synths. Melody or pitch is in 4/4 while the rhythm or gate is for example in 7/4. Then I additionally add a 2nd pitch modulation that transposes single notes and do that in another time signature.
Used to do the same thing with 5/4 and 4/4 - four bars of 5/4 for the lead line, and five bars of 4/4 for the backing - which sort of put †he whole tune into extended 5/4. Lots of fun. Haven't tried polymetric modulation as yet but I certainly will!
I know I'm late. But taking the lead line and starting it two beats in for the next section. So if your meldoy starts 1.1 in drop #1, you ignore 1.1 and 1.2 and start it at 1.3... then just tack 1.1 and 1.2 on at the end... just like starting a loop in the middle rather than at the head. You get a quick related variation of without doing any real work.
I Always use some Midi Controller foe this Kind of automations. Doesnt create polyrythimc modulations at all, but creates a very organic an precise Automation.
It would be really interesting to determine if a particular key or chord progression pairs better with different wave lengths based on applying mathematical values to each note in a chord based on its individual resonance, and relative pitch to the "center" key of principal chord for that key. You may be able to determine a subtle pattern like that of graphing prime numbers on a mass scale, which may help explain why our subconscious might be drawn to particular melodies or music genres.
Two things (the second youd be more curious about). First, im a music production teacher and this is now the basis for my next lesson. But secondly, Im recording a midwest emo album and all i want to do is apply these concepts to a genre where they're rarely used
An interesting way to use this is with detune/pitch bend, making the song slowly rise and fall in pitch. Another thing is just thought of is to make the pitch dip on only certain kick hits, like every two kicks it has a little dip when the kick hits
(Thanks for your video! And sorry for my English) My idea is to combine the polymetrics modulations with the straight ones in your composition, for example: if I have a long build-up and I want my drop to sound tight and heavy, I'll probably make my modulations polymetric in the build-up and when the drop kicks in they'll become straight and repetitive! Or the opposite: I have a cool straight modulations pattern through whole composition, but I want the last drop to go crazy, wild, insane and chaotic - of course the build-up will straight, and the drop will go with polymetric modulations!
Works equally well when you combine a 4/4 melody with a 6/4 or even a 5/4 drum beat, or vice versa, because they appear to fall out of sync before one measure lines back up with the other.
Hellz yeah, music nerdery!❤ I know this mix and match kind of beats from drum circles, and being around people who are not only musicians but also magicians❤ Im a Sacred Dancer and layers are very enjoyable for me.
It would be interesting to try play the same line on two different leads that are side chained to each other and then add the modulation to create a kind of morphing synth sound. Just an idea though, don’t know if it works or not.
Let's see if I can use these technique on different elements of Europa, by automating different filters and other elements, everything in a different time scale
good insight. not that i hadn'tcame up with this by myself, but anyways, nice reveal! nice thing is you don't give the exact samples how to use it, but just give the process. right teaching tactics. those who don't get it -- not worthy. altho you explain it in depth as i see it. IN 2 MIN VIDEO. great delivery! i subscribe. looking forward to insights of this quality, that i havnt came up with myself yet =))
love the videos, if you're still looking for ideas I would love to see you remake the bass and leads from: Alok Ft Bebe - Deep In Your Love or even how you go about making bass amd leads for a track that's in an awkward key, it takes me wayyy longer than it should
And THAT folks is how a YT tutorial should be done! BRAVO!!!! Straight, to the point, no muscle memory, no theme intros and graphics, no long winding explanations of personal history.....no Distrokid ads. Perfect! I now have another valuable technique in my kit for my songs. Sir, THANK YOU. ☺☺
Thanks for watching 💚
amen
true story 👏
Yes indeed! Short but very sweet 😍
totally agree
What folks don’t realize is super short punchy videos like this take a LOT of work to teach something. Every word has to be intentional, let me say I subbed and I hope to see a lot more videos like this! Straight and to the point, this was awesome
Really appreciate that, it’s something i’ve been trying to get better at for a while, thanks for watching :)
totally agree
Most vids take 45 min to teach what this one did. Great work 🙌
Not every video has to be 2 minutes long, but just writing a script and redoing takes if you mess up gets you 80% of the way there. I'd rather have a 10 minute video with jump-cuts than a 30-minutes video full of "ums", "ahms", repeating the same concept at least 3 times in the span of 15 seconds, "oh the program crashed", "where did I put that file"... 💀
@@SynthHackerTVtotally agreed with @dadtier564, also sub’d & liked. Was aware of polymeters, but never thought to use them in modulation - lightbulb moment for sure! Thanks so much 😊
You can use the factors of numbers to get complex with this. For example, the factors of 12 are 1,2,3,4,6,12. This means that you can play around with patterns cycling through resonance dissonance and back. Might even time a drop to hit in the 12.
Love that idea!!
Also, prime numbers are useful if you want longer phrases
What about Fibonacci scale?🤪😆
1,1, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0, 0
Uh oh getting a bit mathsy
deadmau5 has always been really good at this!
Oh for sure!
Trent Reznor was also pioneering this way back in his Downward Spiral album
One of the electronic artists I know of who pioneered this technique mid 2000s already, including syncopation (off-beat sounds, instead of on-beat) IIRC. After that, a lot of electronic music started to use it, which made a lot of EDM more interesting to listen to IMHO.
@@ericgelders FWIW, syncopation (putting accents on "weak" beats) has been a part of music since people started banging rocks and sticks together in the Stone Age. Syncopation is as fundamental to dance music in the 2020s as it was to jazz in the 1920s. Syncopation is basically another word for "funk". Most straight-ahead techno lacks funk by design (techno was originally supposed to sound like a machine made it, not a human), but house, hip-hop, drum n' bass, and many sub-genres of EDM are "funky" due to syncopation. The 'Amen' break, the Funky Drummer, and the 'Think' break (3 of the most sampled and influential beats of all time) are classic examples of syncopated beats. And of course it's not just drums that can be syncopated. Tangerine Dream and other artists of the Berlin school were doing hypnotic synth stuff with strange polymeters in the 1970s.
Led Zeppelin did this with Kashmir and the Who with Quadrophenia back in the 70s.
I really wanna listen to that beat for a full song length. Such a cool beat!
You beat me to it. It sounds so good.
Fun to do a 4 beats over 3 thing, where the beat starts with everything in straight 4/4 timing, then add elements in 3/4 timing to groove on a 4 over 3 polyrhythm until finally the 3/4 timing "wins" and everything transitions to a 3/4 timing track -- then transition back to 4/4 before the track ends so it's not impossible to mix into the next. I love making the floor dance in weird time signatures without most of them even knowing, but 4 over 3 is by far my favorite.
This is what happens when a prog rocker gets into electronic lol
Thanks for actually referencing the time signatures. "1 and a half bars" bugged my more than it should have
Oh wow, I’d never thought of applying poly meters to automation - seems obvious in retrospect!
Really cool video, BTW - clear, USEFUL tip and straight to the point. 🙏
@@johncitizen8828 Thanks for watching glad you liked it :)
Go into the actual clip modulation... Hit the 'envelopes' tab, select 'un-linked' and you can set your automation and modulation loop brace independent to that of your audio/midi-note loop brace.
Great tip thankyou!
woooooah, I cant believe how much i've used ableton since that was added somewhere in live 11 & I never even gave that linked/unlinked button under clip envelopes a second thought lol
thx for reminding me to look deeper, I can already think of 3 projects where I need to put this new knowledge to use
I don't even own any of those apps, but I found myself watching 5 of your videos in a row. Something so soothing and hypnotic to your videos, i love it
so hypnotic I cannot stop replaying this video, help I am stuck in a loop
You cut straight to the chase, no lengthy explanations. I left a thumbs up and subscribed in an instant!
Short, sweet and to the point without getting lost in the technical details of the DAW. Instant like and sub.
This is golden. i knew about polyrhythms this is common in techno but i never thought about modulation the filter cutoff for example in 3 bars, that is really clever. Good stuff!
I've been working with lots of things similar to this in Reason for the past few years. My latest experimentations has involved melodic polymeter arpeggios, doing relatively simple melody lines wiithin a scale, but the rhythm of these arps are set by some other repeating pattern, with a different step length than the arps, which makes the melody line "evolve" over time, but still stay the same in terms of which notes are triggered. So the horizontal order of the notes and the notes themselves stay the same, but the rhythm of how they are played, changes.
Another thing I found out, is that you can route any LFO CV signal into an arpeggiator gate/step trigger (like on the Thor synth), with the steps synced to a specific division, to create crazy, varying ratchet arpeggios which are semi-random. Then you can of course link another LFO to the first one's speed or depth controls (or why not both? haha) to make things even more chaotic, but still within the boundaries you decide. Or, you can take any audio signal and convert it to a CV signal, then use that instead of a simple LFO shape. There's so many possibilities.
I am sure stuff like this is possible in other DAWs too, but within the Reason rack, it is very easy to set up, since the gate and note CV inputs and outputs are separated on most of the stock devices and synths. This is the intended use of Reason's modularity, in my opinion, and as far as I know, the functionality has been there since day 1.
Oh, as a final tip: if you're interested in rhythms, go listen to some Meshuggah, folks.
whats your way to convert audio to cv? i only know thor can do this.
@@Timsturbs I was thinking of Thor, yeah. It's fairly easy to set up within the programmer.
New technique added to my skill list ✅️ (Works great on progressive house)
Wow, that sounds cool ... I would love to hear the whole track 😊
You might like Goa trance.
word. sometimes im lazy and I just make long drawn out notes/legato sustained notes and just add trance gates with different rhythyms. Kilohearts trance gate is a helpful tool especially since it show you visually in a circle your pattern. So you could start with a simple 16th note one and then duplicate it on another pad or element and then change the speed to triplets, dotted notes, the pattern of the gate etc. and really go crazy with trying to get a funky rhythym. Theres obviously experimentation thats required but definately a fun way to experiement and find those happy accidents, glad to see u back man, your videos on massive synth presets helped me so much years back!
You LAZY BUM !!
LOL😀
Very cool, would've enjoyed hearing a few longer examples. 👍
I don't know nothing about producing music but I've been Hypnotized for 2 minutes, thank you.
You can apply this to stereo panning to make hats and shakers move around making the stereo field sound wider and leaving space in the mix for other elements.
This is why I love many of Underworld's bangers, they are so good at using polymeters for their synthwork. Rez is a classic example of this.
Is this song posted on yt , if isn t please make this song it sounds sick...
Awesome tip, great explanation, all in under two minutes? Yes please, thank you very much!
I make mostly hip hop, but always love learning techniques from other genres
same!! i'm much more active in making rock but you can learn such a wider array of techniques if you start looking at how other genres do it 🖤
This is common to most types of music.
The Who (Quadrophenia) and Led Zeppelin (Kashmir) were doing this in the 70s.
My tip, put little bit Auto Pan and Perc and some of leads Left and Right
Yes! Thank you for the definition of “polymetric modulation”! Whenever I run a sequence it’s usually in 3, 5, or 7 with a loop or drum machine in 4. I just subscribed and will check out the channel. Thank you.
I've once considered the idea of using some low frequency noise or pulsating signal that is slightly off-beat to automate some equalizers and effects to see if it would achieve an interesting effect.
My idea was that if I modulated an filter or effect with some noise or off-beat sound that it would make some instruments sound more "random".
Man, this is a good channel. I love you, Synth Hacker. Gimme a hug!
Using polymetric intervals such as transcendental numbers like phi, pi and the sqrt of 2 or 3 can be very satisfying 👍Thanks for the video 🙏
Leaves you wanting more. Bravo!
I commonly will chop a drum sample into a non 4/4 feel and layer it as a polyrhythm on some basic drum grooves. pretty fun to play with
What I like to do is to control Gate and pitch separately, like you would do with modular synths. Melody or pitch is in 4/4 while the rhythm or gate is for example in 7/4. Then I additionally add a 2nd pitch modulation that transposes single notes and do that in another time signature.
Example track sounded like Boris Brejcha, love it
done this for a long time without knowing the name of it.. yes. this is great :)
Oh man, this'd be amazing for psytrance.i think its even used in a decent amount of tracks as well.
Was just getting hypnotised by that. play the whole song!
We can go even further, odd and prime numbers work well
Now this is actually genius
Used to do the same thing with 5/4 and 4/4 - four bars of 5/4 for the lead line, and five bars of 4/4 for the backing - which sort of put †he whole tune into extended 5/4. Lots of fun. Haven't tried polymetric modulation as yet but I certainly will!
I know I'm late. But taking the lead line and starting it two beats in for the next section. So if your meldoy starts 1.1 in drop #1, you ignore 1.1 and 1.2 and start it at 1.3... then just tack 1.1 and 1.2 on at the end... just like starting a loop in the middle rather than at the head. You get a quick related variation of without doing any real work.
I love doing this kind of stuff. It makes a simple track more complex and interesting. :)
Subbed! Idk who you are but i love the way you make videos fast and easy to understand. No youtube BS.
@@All_Together_Now Welcome :)
I Always use some Midi Controller foe this Kind of automations. Doesnt create polyrythimc modulations at all, but creates a
very organic an precise Automation.
That’s really slick!
I'll need to try this on my hardware setup after recording the track I'm currently working on.
It would be really interesting to determine if a particular key or chord progression pairs better with different wave lengths based on applying mathematical values to each note in a chord based on its individual resonance, and relative pitch to the "center" key of principal chord for that key. You may be able to determine a subtle pattern like that of graphing prime numbers on a mass scale, which may help explain why our subconscious might be drawn to particular melodies or music genres.
Great video thank you. I don't make much dance/techno, but I think I can apply this to other genres
sounds hypnotic indeed
Two things (the second youd be more curious about).
First, im a music production teacher and this is now the basis for my next lesson.
But secondly, Im recording a midwest emo album and all i want to do is apply these concepts to a genre where they're rarely used
An interesting way to use this is with detune/pitch bend, making the song slowly rise and fall in pitch. Another thing is just thought of is to make the pitch dip on only certain kick hits, like every two kicks it has a little dip when the kick hits
(Thanks for your video! And sorry for my English)
My idea is to combine the polymetrics modulations with the straight ones in your composition, for example: if I have a long build-up and I want my drop to sound tight and heavy, I'll probably make my modulations polymetric in the build-up and when the drop kicks in they'll become straight and repetitive! Or the opposite: I have a cool straight modulations pattern through whole composition, but I want the last drop to go crazy, wild, insane and chaotic - of course the build-up will straight, and the drop will go with polymetric modulations!
Works equally well when you combine a 4/4 melody with a 6/4 or even a 5/4 drum beat, or vice versa, because they appear to fall out of sync before one measure lines back up with the other.
This is honestly beautiful. Thanks for that.
This is interesting, who are some artists that currently use this technique? I wanna hear more examples
That is a great video, straight to the point
That's really refreshing to see
One 2 min video and I'm hooked. Thank you. Subscribed and looking forward to more.
@@Jazman342 So glad you found it helpful, welcome to the channel! :)
Hellz yeah, music nerdery!❤
I know this mix and match kind of beats from drum circles, and being around people who are not only musicians but also magicians❤
Im a Sacred Dancer and layers are very enjoyable for me.
🙌🙌 Short but gold.
This is life changing advice, Can't thank you enough!
Dude, truly love your way of explaining these types of things. Always leave with a gem
So glad to hear it! Thanks for watching :)
this is how every tutorial should be presented.
☮️💜🏡🎵♾️
Useful information quickly conveyed is so fantastic! Thank you.
Excellent, thanks!!
Superb! Thanks
It would be interesting to try play the same line on two different leads that are side chained to each other and then add the modulation to create a kind of morphing synth sound. Just an idea though, don’t know if it works or not.
That doesn't make sense that it could work, but it does work brilliantly! 😧👍
Weaving in and out, perfect description
Absolute gold!! Thank you so much!
Amazing tutorial, saved it
Great video, short and sweet. Pog
Great video. Appreciate what you are doing 🙏
you got me to hit subscribe after these two minutes 👏
No way that I have been singing some new polyrythemic ideas and this appears! Great video! Technology is scary lol
Good video! Straight and to the point. 😀
Top tier tutorial as usual
The one song I put out I put three chords spread evenly over 4 bars of bass and drums.
Great video, very succinct and explained perfectly
One more layer of understanding added. Thanks :)
Love this! Great tip.
More Videos please!
Good inspiration! Thanks!
Haven’t seen your channel in a while good lord! You back
I've been doing this for years with an app I wrote for Mac.
Early foo fighters track 'good grief' did this, with chord changes
Alternative title: Why deadmau5 is so good
Awesome insight.
has this song been released yet? I love it.
This is crazy good. 🤯
What! I’ve never thought of that 🥵 thanks!:))
Please tell me all techno sounds you know that use that technics guys, i love it.
Instant sub. Thank you good sir!
Thanks for this. Feels like it should have been obvious but I certainly wasn't doing it 😂
Let's see if I can use these technique on different elements of Europa, by automating different filters and other elements, everything in a different time scale
I’ve done similar things with panning before, having track oscilate between ears out of sync with the metre of the music.
good insight. not that i hadn'tcame up with this by myself, but anyways, nice reveal!
nice thing is you don't give the exact samples how to use it, but just give the process. right teaching tactics.
those who don't get it -- not worthy. altho you explain it in depth as i see it. IN 2 MIN VIDEO. great delivery!
i subscribe. looking forward to insights of this quality, that i havnt came up with myself yet =))
I can tell you are the type of person that just canntttttt stop talking about themselves
I don't compose music but this was neat 😊
that beat on 1.5x speed is 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥
love the videos, if you're still looking for ideas I would love to see you remake the bass and leads from: Alok Ft Bebe - Deep In Your Love
or even how you go about making bass amd leads for a track that's in an awkward key, it takes me wayyy longer than it should
Nice one , bruva
Can you drop this song?