Damn! My boy Nando usually opens with a "It has some fun bits but overall it's not very good" And then spends 20 minutes breaking it down. For Madam Web just opens with "No don't see it"
The problem with Sony spider movies is two fold 1. They continue to try to world build and drop Easter eggs instead of making a good movie. 2. They continue to try to make Spider-Man movies without Spider-Man. You have Venom make him the center of the universe
@@optimus2g he has enough to stand on his own though (you can build up his race, you build up knull, you can build up the insaine alien warlord he was bonded with before spiderman) Madam web requires spiderpeople though
@@jackmakila3776I don’t want them to do any of that (would rather the MCU do it) but they definitely would be better off than what they’re doing instead lol
Oh my god. SPUMM is spreading. It's the SSU (Sony Spider-Man Universe). But SPUMM is what Nick Mason of The Weekly Planet misremembered it as, and now it's what a lot of people think it is.
Cant believe Godzilla Minus One cost less than the 20% of the budget of this and still has everything (CGI/script/cinematography/acting) miles better than this
It's because Japanese movie studios are run like sweat shops and pay their employees peanuts. Plus Minus One had no big A Lister actors in it to draw big salaries.
@@kptmaci4979 This is like when Colin Farrell got hired for both Fantastic Beasts and Artemis Fowl. It's perfect except it was for those movies. So I totally agree with you. Adam Scott is good. I'm chalking this up to "He's working, it's a job and he probably thought it would be fun." Thank goodness Severance S02 is coming.
@@katherinealvarez9216There was a plot point that was cut out of the movie centred around the birth of Peter Parker. The pregnant lady in the film was originally meant to be his mother, Mary Parker.
To be fair the original premise for this movie was actually really good Ezekiel goes back in time to kill young Peter parker in the womb because he wants to be the only spider person and madame web has to pull the girls out the multiverse to help now that sounds like a movie and unfortunately we'll never see it the studio really needs to stop interrupting
@@ethanrodgers2838 yeah fair point Ive just been following the movie for years now knowing it was gonna be a bad but good but they even missed that mark it is what it is tho were getting Deadpool 3 this year so this will more then most likely be forgotten heck I don't even remember morbius is a thing until something mentions it
They’ll pull the same shit with Kraven too I’m sure of it. We’ll find out after it flops that the narrative originally tied into Spider-Man’s story but then they’ll cut it all out and ADR a bunch of dialogue to reshape the movie. They spend hundreds of millions of dollars to make a spider-man universe without spider-man and further erase whatever elements there are of him from these charm and excitement vacuums of slashed edits that get unceremoniously dumped into theaters without any love or care.
So many weird things in this movie but an EMT stealing an ambulance from two other EMTs that were responding to an emergency call is a bit strange to say the least. An EMT would know that could be a death sentence so it doesn't make sense unless your story is about an EMT that likes to steal life saving drugs and equipment at crucial moments so they can keep their save and death rates equal.
She took the ambulance that arrived to take Ben's sister to the hospital. Since she knew that Ben's sister was not in the apartment anymore, it was safe to take the ambulance.
@@richchappell she looks through the window and has the vision of Mary, Ben and the girls going to hospital then she sees the ambulance. It wouldn't be ludicrous for her to assume the ambulance was for Mary even if that building housed more than one apartment so I'd be totally with you if she wasn't an EMT . Also If she wasn't an EMT stealing an ambulance from another on duty crew then it would have been easier to believe she wouldn't have thought about how many lives she risked by stealing that life saving equipment from on duty EMTs because she wouldn't have experienced how a late arrival could be the difference between life and death.
Amy Pascal really did that one akward interview with Kevin Feige in 2017 and thought "I'm gonna bring his whole cinematic universe to the ground". There is just no other explanation for this it seems. It has to be intentional, right? Why would you hire the Morbius writers again? And Kevin this week just really went "No, you're not fucking with my universe anymore"
@@pickedceasar1216 iger still hung around a lot overseeing chapek even after he had technically stepped down. Chapek was basically just iger's puppet. I'm so tired of people acting like iger is some magical savior when several of his projects from before chapek got involved were shit and his projects after chapek got fired were shit too
@@idawg7332 Not Kevin Feige. He had to work with the screwy of Bob iger, the strikes, Johnathan Majors. Basically entire projects scrapped and plans reworked and all we were left with the bad projects. We still had Shang chi, Black Panther 2, and Guardians of the galaxy 3 as good films, so it's not entirely bad, but Marvel studios still has a lot of work to do before people start loving the MCU again.
@@Killgore-ip2yq Feige still had control over a lot of this and most of the recent movies and all of the tv shows have been shit. I'm curious t see how a captain america movie without steve rodgers ,an agatha harkness show, a blade movie that's been a production nightmare and a thunderbolts movie which is just discount suicide squad are going to "start people loving the MCU again"
Again ive been saying this for years, Sony is at this point REFUSING to learn the lessons taught to them by Spider-Man 3 and TASM2. Disrupting your creatives filmmaking process for forced inclusions, trying to force a cinematic universe into existence without a linchpin character, and now trying to shoehorn in your crappy characters into ANOTHER universe with no regard for narrative and story arcs, just trying to force them because "comic book name". Theyre dilluting the pool of villains that Feige can use and thus hurting their own profits of the second spiderman trilogy in the process. Like do these suits lose their memory with every franchise reboot? Im desperate to understand.
@@kingofhearts3185 They really did, but general audiences will never accept that because of the nostalgia factor. (The same way everybody's saying now that the OG Fantastic 4 was a perfect movie and the new one can't top it)
@@agilebeast9405 I genuinely don't think any of the Holland movies had such a well paced script, or can top how well Octavius played off of Peter at the start and end. I will say the Mysterio illusion scene is on par with the train as a fight scene, just not quite as impactful at the end with the people of NY.
The thing about suits is they think every success is the result of their genius, and every failure is the result of the failure of other people beneath them. When Amy Pascal and Avi Arad look at the failure of Spider-Man 3, TASM2, Morbius, etc, they blame it on the people who made those movies, and refuse to consider their disruptive role in the process. When they look at the success of Spider-Man 1 & 2, Spider-Verse, and the Home trilogy, they high five each other about how great they are at doing Spider-Man movies - instead of recognizing that Sam Raimi, Phil Lord, Kevin Feige, etc made those movies work _in spite_ of their meddling. And they've been desperate to ride the MCU's success for years. I remember an interview with Feige and Pascal promoting Homecoming, they were asked if Venom would be part of the MCU, and Pascal was like, "Yeah!" But then Feige was like, "Uhhhh... well, we'll see what happens."
Regarding the "car" Nando discussed, they also drove it back and forth to NJ at least once through the Holland or Lincoln tunnel. E-Z Pass existed in 2003, the cops would have caught them long ago
I have not seen Madame Web, but I have heard it described as “Final Destination meets The Terminator” That was probably the pitch that got this made, and which is probably lying on an editing room floor somewhere.
The question I found myself asking was “who did they actually make this movie for?” It honestly just feels like Sony doesn’t want to lose their rights to these characters so they made the most half-assed movies to justify their holding onto the characters
Sony and Disney seem to think women before and behind the camera are a substitute for compelling story, writing and characters, when it's indeed possible to have it all if they really wanted to and respected their audience.
@@macsmith2013 Actually, it's more that certain folks are obsessed with keeping women away from all media and look to blame them for anything and everything.
Apparently it was originally supposed to be in the Andrew Garfield Spider-Verse, then they changed their minds at the last second to make it in the Tom Holland Spider-Verse, then they realised it's set in the '90s (or whenever it's set) and had to remove all references to any form of a current, adult Spider-Man.
5:26 I have a grype against what I call trailer click bait, effectively where something is put in a trailer to trick people into thinking it’s in the film when actually, what you see in the trailer is the extent of it, either you have to not show it in the trailer, or you have to build on it in some way, other examples include the dead robin suit in BVS (a cool Easter egg spoiled in the trailer, tricking people into thinking they were setting up red hood) and dark ray (making people think that ray might turn to the darkside when that is about 30 seconds of the movie) the spider women costumes were definitely included last minute to trick people into thinking that they would be in the film
it's crazy that they have the ability to make a venom verse and don't do it. things they could do: agent venom separation anxiety the king in black/null the symbiote god if they wanted to do other spider characters: wraith hobgoblin (the idea of a goblin wars movie if done correctly is dope) black cat (obviously) adult mayday parker silk
Thats a better pitch for a Spiderman Spinoff Universe than the one Sony had made. Guess Fans and Indie Artists can come up better ideas than Hollywood can.
@@j.e.s.m.4686 It’s so crazy, and the writer’s strike was supposed to make use root for writers. Well how can that be if writers churn out this kind of crap?? I mean, if the studio forces them into writing these kinds of movies, maybe I can understand, but if this is the best they can come up with, then perhaps they shouldn’t work for the industry in the first place! 🙄
@@JamesLawnerThe reason the writers strike even happened is because corporate goons were pressing their boot heel on the writers throats. This is a direct result of studio execs making life difficult for the writers. This is the product you get when you don't let people do their job.
Yeah seriously a black cat heist movie could’ve stood on its own. People love heist movies. You could’ve even had Black Cat team up with other Spidey villains to make the team, only for Cat to double cross them all at the end
14:30 the best part of _The Marvels_ is probably Carol’s expression when she discovers that the solution is to /literally/ herd cats. Or maybe the dance-sing planet. Or maybe the training montage. It’s a tough call.
That and the cat scene are probably the few good scenes in the movie Kind of ironic that it used the song from the cats play better than the actual cats movie
Huge whiffs of "if you don't use this property annually, the rights revert to someone else," and then you make the movie for as little money as you can because as long as you make *anything* the goal is accomplished.
Besides Silk, they should've absolutely built up to the Outlaws (but with Black Cat replacing Will O'the Wisp) if they were doing a universe without Spider-Man. A bunch of characters who turn their life as criminals around to help their community instead and then join forces. That's a bunch of diverse characters with a clear shared theme bringing them together. And through those movies you could also include a bunch of classic Spider-Man villains. Chameleon could show up in a Silver Sable spy thriller. While I don't think Puma and Kraven have traditionally faced each other both character' themes and goals seem tailor made to pit them against each other. And as much as people may joke, a Rocket Racer VS Big Wheel movie could go so hard. And it's not like nobody has heard of Black Cat or Sandman, and with Spiderverse Hobie Brown as the Prowler has now gotten double name recognition.
16:01 No, you're right about Argyll. Vaughn wanted to make that movie and those action scenes, so his team contracted a 'series' of spy books (only one actually) ghostwritten by an actual author (Tammy Cohen) and kept that under wraps so they could pretend after the fact that the mystery was similar to the film's setup.
A Superior Foes of Spider-Man film in the style of The Suicide Squad by James Gunn would be a fun time. I can imagine those characters having to come together by way of Mayor Jameson to combat an outbreak of Symbiotes, or a Green Goblin-released toxin; or using a character like Silk or Miles to be their target in a “this could get us on the Webhead’s radar” heist movie.
There's a lot of people out there who probably hate this just because it's a superhero movie with women in it. I really appreciate you Nando, because I know you want to like these movies, and that if you don't, it's for good and normal reasons
See I like that. You see a title, you see the thumbnail… title presents a question and the thumbnail just gives you a solid, no hold’s barred answer. That’s the kind of TH-cam we need in today’s day and age… … I mean I knew I wasn’t gonna see Madame Web anyways, but I appreciate stuff like this, thank you Nando.
The frantic energy in this, like you have to make the video but you feel in your bones that you absolutely MUST minimize the amount of your life that intersects with the movie.
Apparently this was supposed to be connected to Tom Holland's Spider-Man. Something tells me this script was drafted after FFH when Tom Holland's MCU deal ended.
I just had a moment of lighting when you were describing "Web doesn't like people, doesn't want friends or a family," and I'm aware of how absolutely INSANE i go for characters who claim that they don't want friends/family, but the truth is they DO, they want it BADLY, they are CRAVING human connection, affection, attention, and community. The latest example that's easy to pull out of context is "Misfits and Magic Animatic | Evan Learns How To Fly" by DM-in-Training on TH-cam. I know that's from a live tabletop podcast and not a superhero movie, but I refuse to believe that the storytelling strategies can't apply in both situations. LET YOUR CHARACTERS FEEL INTENSE EMOTIONS, AND THEN THE AUDIENCE UNDERSTANDS WHY THINGS MATTER! :C
That’s the thing, that’s the idea for her character in this but the execution just fails to make it work. Probably because you don’t get that satisfaction of the found family coming together and just how fulfilling that is for the character like you do with Evan Kelmp, to borrow your example. And it’s such a shame
If you do see Argylle, after the train scene go ahead and take a nap until Act 3B when the colors start. Act 2 is interesting but kind of a snoozefest and that leads into Act 3A. But the whole first like 45mins and last 30 mins are very entertaining
I haven't watched this, but based only on the trailers and description, I think that the hook that Dakota needed was that she was a hopeful person who had given up. She's a paramedic. She should have lost a LOT of patients over the years, and some of them had to be cases where it was because she had missed something, that if she had known what was going to happen, she could have prevented it and saved them, but she didn't. Wee need to see at least one or two of these, and have her monologue a bit about it (in a way that makes sense). And so now she's jaded, and just going through the motions, and that's who she is. Because then, when she _can_ see the future, and she can _prevent_ these bad outcomes, it helps resolve her core character conflict. Also, I have no idea how they handle the action scenes, but it would need to be with her as a general leading troops, because that is her role, strategic support, so she needs to be guiding the others into positions that allow them to overcome a clearly stronger threat.
Sydney Sweeney’s outfit choice with her character trope made no sense at all. She is presented an acts in the film as the shy, demure, introverted girl, who is innocent, follows the rules, and needs to be brought out of her shell. But she is literally dressed as Britney Spears in the music video ‘Hit Me Baby One More Time.’ Literally! At one point she even knots the bottom of her button up to look exactly like it, and dances to a Britney Spears song. It makes zero sense why a character with this personality would be wearing this outfit. It really feels like they didn’t consider her character at all in this wardrobe choice, and were just like “What was sexy in the early 2000s? Oh yeah-Britney Spears. Have her wear that.“ It’s utterly absurd. Which, to be fair, is tonally consistent with the entire film.
Vonnegut's rules for short stories: characters have to want something. A protagonist who is drifting along breaks those rule. Breaking rules is fine... if it's consciously done w/a purpose.
I'd of liked a movie about a spider man villain coming back in time to kill Peter Parker before her was born, main character is uncle Ben and its how he learns about Peter parkers future and his responsibility hence why he instantly said his famous lines to Peter before he died because he knew he'd need to hear that to become spiderman
I thought venom and morbius were in the same universe cuz that one line where they say something along the lines of “we haven’t seen anything this crazy since that thing in San Francisco
It says something that three days in, the Wikipedia page still doesn't have a plot synopsis written up. Apparently the script was wildly differently from the one handed to the actors when they signed on. One wonders if poor acting was lack of enthusiasm.
The stolen cab...I love how they explicitly showed her taking the plates off the car. But the license numbers were still on the doors and on the roof marquis. And then she just drives it around with no plates...no problem, not suspicious at all. 🤣
That's exactly what it is. No one at Sony or hired by Sony cares about making something good. They just want to fight with Disney to get a cut of the Tom Holland money.
Yep the theatre options aren't great presently. On the bright side though the Marvels is finally streaming on D+ and I thought that was actually pretty good. Definitely better than the critical narrative across the web would have one believe.
Ok from your description only because I HAVE NOT seen the movie, It would have been so easy to say something like "I don't want any other kid to grow up without a mother" to explain/give the character a motivation
You would need to cut or modify the ambulance stealing scene because as soon as she steals an ambulance from two other paramedics that are clearly rushing to an emergency that motivation goes out of the window. This is how I saw that going down off screen. Paramedic 1 "We've got 3 unconscious kids likely due to carbon monoxide poisoning and the adult is in cardiac arrest. Frank I'll start CPR but we need the oxygen and the defibrillator from the ambulance urgently." Twenty minutes later Paramedic 2 (Frank) "We could of saved them if someone didn't steal the ambulance. These professional crack heads don't care about the lives they endanger to get their fixes." Policeman 1 "She wasn't a professional crackhead, she was a paramedic." Paramedic 1 and 2 😲
I kinda have to disagree with a lot of your points. [Spoilers Throughout] . . . . . . 11:59 - Early on, I had a lot of enjoyment out of Dakota's Cassie. I do feel like flashback cold open might have overplayed some of it's hand. Maybe have left it a little more mysterious how Cassie made it back to civilization, maybe concealed the fact Constance got a spider bite and even the full reveal of the Arañas. But once we catch up with Cassie herself, I found her dryly fun and entertaining. Her dedication to saving lives but also a sort of detachment from LIVING people is really interesting. This mindset of "you are not in distress so I don't know how to interact with you." Someone that is basically either in crisis mode or vegging out in front of the TV. No in between. Her awkwardness at handling the kid who's mother she JUST saved because she doesn't do "comfort" she does "solving". And this attitude is further reflected in her early interactions with the girls. She's harsh on them, but it shows she doesn't LIKE being that way but she's never figured out something better. The only character that seems to have a good, REAL relationship with her is Ben, and of course we all understand Ben has the patience of a saint and a smooth, easy charm. 13:28 - I do feel they managed the bonding, it just wasn't all in one moment. As I mentioned before, we can see in the earlier taxi ride, Cassie feels at least a little bad being so harsh on them even when they're being impulsive or jerks. Then we get the first forest scene, showing them starting to put things together. And I think it's the FIRST motel scene that helps unify them a little more. Everyone is done playing keep-away with their background and secrets. And Cassie is learning that these girls have all been abandoned (intentionally or otherwise), just like she was. That's the moment she's hooked. But the movie-wide interactions between them were something I found charming and fun. You can see why they could be close but also how they get on each other's nerves. 15:23 - I didn't really need to get some explicit explanation for why Cassie became an EMT. They drop a decent number of breadcrumbs along the way that I GET it without it having to be some kind of "higher calling". Her only connection with her mother is a bunch of papers from Constance's medical research, planting a career in medicine in Cassie's mind. We get some comments about the not TOO bad but also not exactly easy world of growing up a foster child, helping understand the dual modes of either crisis or isolation. And just, as a Spider-Person, we can understand that never ending drive to help people, even if at great personal cost. 18:04 - I honestly think this was more about having a springboard moment for all four Spider-Women, with Madame Web as the sort of Professor X of this corner of the Spider-Verse. And now, each of them has the room to basically operate AS the central character and side-step having Peter as the core character at all. One of the continuous questions with the slow build towards the Sinister Six film has always been "Okay, but who's Spider-Man?", with the common fan idea of just bringing back Garfield. But this avenue angles for an entirely different answer. "Who the hell is Spider-Man?" Like, overall, it didn't blow my socks off and had some very definite flaws. But I had fun, specifically with the character banter and interplay. Your main four protagonists are distinct but have stuff going on. Ben is a fun support character. I will admit, Ezekiel Sims is a little weak as an antagonist, his ADR and accent being particularly off-putting. But as just a sort of murderous a-hole, he did well enough. I would be interested to see ALL of the main women come back, together or individually. Timeline wise, it is a weird fit. It was so definitively put into specific years, I'm not sure how you're integrating it with Venom or Morbius. I've definitely seen better put together movies. The entire final climax had POTENTIAL but failed to really make it pop. A bunch of leaps of logic or dropped plot threads (how EXACTLY did she fly to Peru in immediate Post 9/11 America where the NYPD thought she'd killed multiple cops? This is a PROBLEM, and do not mind saying so). But the overall charm and fun of the movie carried me through. 6/10, but something I wouldn't mind seeing continued.
I would personally rate it lower than you, but have to agree with some of your points. It’s clear what they were trying to do in sone places, but it didn’t quite click.
I feel like Sony can have fun with these characters but instead they just give these characters to writers who either don’t care about the characters or don’t have passion for writing something good and take the time to study the characters or make something up that’s good.
After madame web successfully used her domain expansion (webbing time) Morbius smirks and asked madame web "are you madame web because you're madame web or are you madame web because you're madame web" Madame web replied with "when it comes to morbing and webbing, my abilities are truly uncontested which led me to leave an overwhelming intensity behind your back, therefore with this treasure I summon always bet on madame web" Morbius laughs and said "Nah I'd win"
There seems to be some Legal screwyness with spiderman and aunt may and uncle ben. The sony live actions films (expect when they did a mcu tie in with vulture) Can't mention anything from the mcu including peter parker, aunt may and spiderman himself while the mcu can't seem to mention Uncle ben or the newspaper daily bugle. Even when we did see Spiderman it was just known as "That guy" and the photo in Morbius was ps4 game version of Toby's suit.
i dunno if i agree. the bits that *weren't* about the plot were fun, which sounds like a weird compliment. Madam has good acting presence except whern she's forced to deal with her origin or Ezekiel. the Ben Parker scenes were fun and I'm glad the Peter Parker easter eggs weren't super obvious their use of the Patriot Act tech roots this in a post-9/11 era, which is great
The very ending of this video hit too hard. It's a long weekend for me, so I was considering making a trip to a theatre (it's a 2-3 hr drive one way) but then I looked at what is playing in the nearest theatre and...no, there's nothing I really want to see. Argylle seemed fun and if I was making that trip anyway, then I might've watched it, but it's not enough to bring me there, nor is The Beekeeper. The rest of this video doesn't surprise me, sadly. It's really what I'd expected from the first trailer, maybe even before that.
I think that we are reaching the logical conclusion of the corporatization of the films industry clashing against the wishes of the consumers, the staff is overworked, the viewers are waiting for home releases (if at all) and the corporations are so caught up in quotas and legal battles that movies barely constitute as art anymore, or at least as much art as a roller-coaster ride with cheap thrills
love both this video and chris stuckman's take on it. more and more we are in a bizzare nothing-verse multiverse. it's hard to say anything really anyways, so excited for the pod!
Maybe someone can show me differently, but that time period just doesn't really pop when it comes to fashion. I remember watching Ladybird, which is set in 2002/03 and thinking the same thing.
I'm 90% Venom 2 ends with the characters on a beach admitting their love to each other. 100/10 romcom film, idk why everyone's talking about it was a superhero movie.
@@lpj2216 Un Prophete. French movie, critically acclaimed. I recommend watching in the original language with subtitles. Ryan Coogler cited it as an inspiration for Black Panther, likely Killmonger's arc.
What kills me is that Nando has been talking about the F4ncasting for ages, what feels like at least a year now. Desperately hoping that after so many rumors and leaks, they’ll finally release an official cast. He mentions it in so many videos that are unrelated. But the day Marvel finally breaks the news, he went “No. There’s something more important the people need to know first. I need to warn them…about the Web.” That’s how bad it is.
Salt burn and the first season of The After-party both used fashion to clearly set themselves in the early 2000s. It can be done, but it needs to be more overt to be effective!
It's never fail me to amaze, how far Nando from people in his movie taste. Even when we on the same plate, when it's come to quality of the film, even then he throws a curveball of opinion, that this movie is "boring bad", thing that couldn't be furter from the true. Truly amazing specimen.
It’s a very bad movie but it has some parts that aren’t so bad. I also liked some of the action shots. I liked the first version she gets that foreshadows the end. I like that she used her powers in creative ways (exactly 2 times), I like the scene the girls learn CPR because it shows Webb being a maternal figure and using her skills proactively. I liked Adam Scott and I honestly kinda liked Webb despite Dakota Johnson kind of phoning it in but she was awkward in a relatable way and kind of charming at times
Thanks for mentioning Bendis & Maleev. I didn't know they did a Spider-Woman run. Their run on Daredevil is one of my favorite comics, and their original series Scarlet was a major influence that got me reading comics again as an adult. (I also just heard they're doing a new series from Dark Horse called Masterpiece. I'm looking forward to getting that one.)
What annoys me, is that the actors in the film now won’t do mcu stuff probably, and some of them could’ve been great in different roles. Specifically isabel merced and Celeste o Connor could’ve been different mutants, and Adam Scott and Dakota Johnson would be good as 2-3 characters of the top of my head
My recommendation for Spiderwoman (Jessica Drew) is her Dennis Hopeless run where she has a baby. It's a great unique story of a superhero and plenty to enjoy from start to finish. I read it to my 4yo son and he enjoyed it so much we had to buy the physical book and read it again.
5:43 Mattie Franklin is the one that gained her powers in a meeting of 5 people (Norman Osborn and Madam Web included). Iirc this meeting had some supernatural element that dictated 3 people would receive gifts and 2 people would be cursed randomly with death or madness. She’s also the Spider-Woman who fell in love with Peter Parker in that one issue.
This film fried Nando's brain. This is 20m minutes of him trying to warn people away from the movie while his brain is suffering the dreaded Blue Screen of Death. I feel for ya man.
People keep wondering why Sony makes these weird unrelated off-shoots instead of actual spider-people movies, but I actually think its because of some clause in their contract with Marvel. Studio execs are incredibly stupid, don't get me wrong, but I think even *Sony* studio execs wouldn't make a "Madame Web" movie before they made an honest-to-god (generic as it may have been) "Spider-Woman" movie. I just think whatever they signed with Marvel prohibits them from making a movie where the main character has spider-powers (or something like that). That is what this feels like -a studio dancing around a contract clause.
The movie is camp. It's stupid but has some so-bad-it's-good qulaity, and it's hard for me to be angry about that. Certianly, criticism is warranted. That said, the criticisms of her character juxtaposed with "not everyone has to be as charismatic as Iron Man" is... kinda weird? I don't think her introverted aversion of people is a bad thing: it's pretty much standard character flaw stuff. And Tony was like the most flawed dude there was. He also did not care about people or want a family in his first appearance. Soooooo these criticisms specifically are kinda weird. There is definitely stuff missing from her development, but I wouldn't say that's it.
All sony has to do is make a spiderman movie with andrew garfield and theyd make money. The goodwill they had from the no way home stuff was so high and yet they fumbled it.
What I was/am hoping for with the "Spiderverse" series: Turns out that Olivia "Doc-Ock" survived the fight at the end "Into the Spider-Verse" but disappeared from Earth-1610. And during "Beyond the Spider-Verse" she is revealed to have become Madame Web.
I dread thinking about this part of the studio making a Miles movie. Superior Foes could be their Guardians of the Galaxy, but at this point I expect them to make a Slyde movie first.
It’s somehow even worse than Morbius that said I did enjoy watching it because the dialogue was some of the worst dialogue I’ve ever seen, it’s like they wrote a first draft and went straight to filming, it totally lives up to the reputation of these Sony movies
Damn! My boy Nando usually opens with a "It has some fun bits but overall it's not very good" And then spends 20 minutes breaking it down. For Madam Web just opens with "No don't see it"
Its even in the thumbnail, simply: “No.”
He's generally positive but this time he was: no 😐
Has he ever done a positive review for any film ?
@@OldManJenkins69I liked it.
@@HepCatJackYes, he's general a fan of the MCU. The only content from that company he doesn't like are Secret Invasion and Thor: The Dark World.
I really love anti-clickbait like this. Like the title has a clickbait question but the thumbnail immediately answers it.
And he got our click anyway!
It’s super meta. Sony advertised the movie with everything we wanted to see and he gave us the answer right there.
I think it's more effective than clickbait because you go into it having the poster's answer already and then get to listen to WHY that's the answer
It’s genuinely impressive how much this studio continues to mess things up
"Wow Marvel cannot do worse"
Sony: "Allow me to introduce myself"
There must be someone there deliberately trying to Morbius everything
@@itisaptsabotage
Bruh they made Spider-Man 2
Sony Pictures is run by monkeys.
It’s incredible that the premise of this movie is, basically, these characters are going to be interesting one day, but not today
A lot of movies nowadays (especially comic book hero movies) feel like the in-between of two other more interesting movies
In a sequel that will never come, if we're lucky..
Its T2 but 10,000 x worse lol
@@macsmith2013I’d be down for a Sydney Sweeney centric Spider-Woman movie though ngl
Audience: You are without doubt the worst movie I've ever seen.
Madame Web: But at least you've seen me.
*Cue Pirates theme*
Yeah I think this applied more to morbius and its memeability than Madame Web. It got 6 million on opening day. Six. Fu*ng. Million.
I kinda want to skim through it but I don’t want to support them monetarily. I’ll just watch it on twitch in the Artifact game section. Or on kick
Judging from the box office no they didnt see her lol
But you *have* seen me.
The official name ought to be "Sony's Spiderless Universe".
Or the "Universe of Sony's Spider-manless Releases"
Or the "USSR" for short
The problem with Sony spider movies is two fold
1. They continue to try to world build and drop Easter eggs instead of making a good movie.
2. They continue to try to make Spider-Man movies without Spider-Man. You have Venom make him the center of the universe
Which is STILL whack. Venom himself is an offshoot of Spidey. Continuing to NOT make sense is not a strategy.
@@optimus2g he has enough to stand on his own though (you can build up his race, you build up knull, you can build up the insaine alien warlord he was bonded with before spiderman)
Madam web requires spiderpeople though
@@jackmakila3776I don’t want them to do any of that (would rather the MCU do it) but they definitely would be better off than what they’re doing instead lol
Quit holding Spider-Man hostage!
What crawled up your ass and died? Genuine question because your level of negativity is wild@@AngelBatistaa
Oh my god. SPUMM is spreading. It's the SSU (Sony Spider-Man Universe). But SPUMM is what Nick Mason of The Weekly Planet misremembered it as, and now it's what a lot of people think it is.
Spumm? What could that stand for?
@@SodorTimesTodaybefore the SSU, the universe was referred to as the SPUMC (Sony pictures universe of marvel characters)
@@SodorTimesTodaySony Pictures Universe of Marvel Movies, which is what it used to be called until Sony changed it.
@@carrott0pgaming844 that's what I remember it as! I still call it that and pronounce it spumcy haha!
No. It was never that. It was alwyas Spumc, and then SSU. Maso just misremembered it as SPUMM. It was never SPUMM! @@darthamalgamation
Cant believe Godzilla Minus One cost less than the 20% of the budget of this and still has everything (CGI/script/cinematography/acting) miles better than this
well they also pushed labor laws and did a lot of stuff for free with no pay
It's because Japanese movie studios are run like sweat shops and pay their employees peanuts. Plus Minus One had no big A Lister actors in it to draw big salaries.
I think my favorite thing about watching the movie were:
1. The Taylor Swift Eras Tour popcorn bucket
2. Adam Scott as Ben Parker
Oh snap, this movie has Taylor Swift Eras Tour popcorn buckets?
Way to bury the lede, Sony/Trailer!
I'm sorry. Adam Scott is who? What? What happened?
@@katherinealvarez9216 Dont do my boi like this. He is great actor. Shame, he and others were buried in another sonyverse shitverse flick.
@@kptmaci4979 This is like when Colin Farrell got hired for both Fantastic Beasts and Artemis Fowl. It's perfect except it was for those movies.
So I totally agree with you. Adam Scott is good. I'm chalking this up to "He's working, it's a job and he probably thought it would be fun." Thank goodness Severance S02 is coming.
@@katherinealvarez9216There was a plot point that was cut out of the movie centred around the birth of Peter Parker. The pregnant lady in the film was originally meant to be his mother, Mary Parker.
To be fair the original premise for this movie was actually really good Ezekiel goes back in time to kill young Peter parker in the womb because he wants to be the only spider person and madame web has to pull the girls out the multiverse to help now that sounds like a movie and unfortunately we'll never see it the studio really needs to stop interrupting
I’m not a fan of how Ezekiel is portrayed here, so I still hate the original premise.
@@ethanrodgers2838 yeah fair point Ive just been following the movie for years now knowing it was gonna be a bad but good but they even missed that mark it is what it is tho were getting Deadpool 3 this year so this will more then most likely be forgotten heck I don't even remember morbius is a thing until something mentions it
They’ll pull the same shit with Kraven too I’m sure of it. We’ll find out after it flops that the narrative originally tied into Spider-Man’s story but then they’ll cut it all out and ADR a bunch of dialogue to reshape the movie.
They spend hundreds of millions of dollars to make a spider-man universe without spider-man and further erase whatever elements there are of him from these charm and excitement vacuums of slashed edits that get unceremoniously dumped into theaters without any love or care.
Nah is still dumb, it was just less dumber
So many weird things in this movie but an EMT stealing an ambulance from two other EMTs that were responding to an emergency call is a bit strange to say the least. An EMT would know that could be a death sentence so it doesn't make sense unless your story is about an EMT that likes to steal life saving drugs and equipment at crucial moments so they can keep their save and death rates equal.
Perfectly balanced as all things must be.
She took the ambulance that arrived to take Ben's sister to the hospital. Since she knew that Ben's sister was not in the apartment anymore, it was safe to take the ambulance.
@@richchappell she looks through the window and has the vision of Mary, Ben and the girls going to hospital then she sees the ambulance. It wouldn't be ludicrous for her to assume the ambulance was for Mary even if that building housed more than one apartment so I'd be totally with you if she wasn't an EMT . Also If she wasn't an EMT stealing an ambulance from another on duty crew then it would have been easier to believe she wouldn't have thought about how many lives she risked by stealing that life saving equipment from on duty EMTs because she wouldn't have experienced how a late arrival could be the difference between life and death.
Amy Pascal really did that one akward interview with Kevin Feige in 2017 and thought "I'm gonna bring his whole cinematic universe to the ground". There is just no other explanation for this it seems. It has to be intentional, right? Why would you hire the Morbius writers again? And Kevin this week just really went "No, you're not fucking with my universe anymore"
Kevin’s already fucked his universe anyway he doesn’t need Amy’s help
@@idawg7332 pretty sure that was the ceo of Disney. Bob Iger had to come back because the dude screwed up so bad
@@pickedceasar1216 iger still hung around a lot overseeing chapek even after he had technically stepped down. Chapek was basically just iger's puppet. I'm so tired of people acting like iger is some magical savior when several of his projects from before chapek got involved were shit and his projects after chapek got fired were shit too
@@idawg7332
Not Kevin Feige. He had to work with the screwy of Bob iger, the strikes, Johnathan Majors. Basically entire projects scrapped and plans reworked and all we were left with the bad projects.
We still had Shang chi, Black Panther 2, and Guardians of the galaxy 3 as good films, so it's not entirely bad, but Marvel studios still has a lot of work to do before people start loving the MCU again.
@@Killgore-ip2yq Feige still had control over a lot of this and most of the recent movies and all of the tv shows have been shit. I'm curious t see how a captain america movie without steve rodgers ,an agatha harkness show, a blade movie that's been a production nightmare and a thunderbolts movie which is just discount suicide squad are going to "start people loving the MCU again"
Again ive been saying this for years, Sony is at this point REFUSING to learn the lessons taught to them by Spider-Man 3 and TASM2. Disrupting your creatives filmmaking process for forced inclusions, trying to force a cinematic universe into existence without a linchpin character, and now trying to shoehorn in your crappy characters into ANOTHER universe with no regard for narrative and story arcs, just trying to force them because "comic book name". Theyre dilluting the pool of villains that Feige can use and thus hurting their own profits of the second spiderman trilogy in the process. Like do these suits lose their memory with every franchise reboot? Im desperate to understand.
Imo they have no made a good live action Spider-Man movie since 2004's Spider-Man 2...the Holland movies not counting.
@@ZachBobBob Even the Holland movies haven't reached Spiderman 2 in terms of quality.
@@kingofhearts3185 They really did, but general audiences will never accept that because of the nostalgia factor. (The same way everybody's saying now that the OG Fantastic 4 was a perfect movie and the new one can't top it)
@@agilebeast9405 I genuinely don't think any of the Holland movies had such a well paced script, or can top how well Octavius played off of Peter at the start and end. I will say the Mysterio illusion scene is on par with the train as a fight scene, just not quite as impactful at the end with the people of NY.
The thing about suits is they think every success is the result of their genius, and every failure is the result of the failure of other people beneath them.
When Amy Pascal and Avi Arad look at the failure of Spider-Man 3, TASM2, Morbius, etc, they blame it on the people who made those movies, and refuse to consider their disruptive role in the process.
When they look at the success of Spider-Man 1 & 2, Spider-Verse, and the Home trilogy, they high five each other about how great they are at doing Spider-Man movies - instead of recognizing that Sam Raimi, Phil Lord, Kevin Feige, etc made those movies work _in spite_ of their meddling.
And they've been desperate to ride the MCU's success for years. I remember an interview with Feige and Pascal promoting Homecoming, they were asked if Venom would be part of the MCU, and Pascal was like, "Yeah!" But then Feige was like, "Uhhhh... well, we'll see what happens."
Regarding the "car" Nando discussed, they also drove it back and forth to NJ at least once through the Holland or Lincoln tunnel. E-Z Pass existed in 2003, the cops would have caught them long ago
I have not seen Madame Web, but I have heard it described as “Final Destination meets The Terminator”
That was probably the pitch that got this made, and which is probably lying on an editing room floor somewhere.
Im pretty sure Madame Web was probably not this hated if Spider-man connections were removed.
@@kristjanbirnirivansson528nah not even that would’ve saved the movie
Not even editing. This movie's script was changed as soon as they tied down the lead actress
I’ll put it to you this way dragon ball evolution is a masterpiece compared to this movie
The question I found myself asking was “who did they actually make this movie for?”
It honestly just feels like Sony doesn’t want to lose their rights to these characters so they made the most half-assed movies to justify their holding onto the characters
You're right that's what it is , which makes them really pathetic
Yes, but they could have made a GOOD film, then made more money, and kept the rights as well.
I trust Nando to not play into the “woman bad😾” movie criticisms
When I was a kid in the 1600s watching new Shakespeare plays at the Globe Theatre, all the women were played by men and it worked out great!
@@emperorbaileythey understood that sometimes it takes a man to be best girl
Sony and Disney seem to think women before and behind the camera are a substitute for compelling story, writing and characters, when it's indeed possible to have it all if they really wanted to and respected their audience.
@@macsmith2013 Actually, it's more that certain folks are obsessed with keeping women away from all media and look to blame them for anything and everything.
Apparently it was originally supposed to be in the Andrew Garfield Spider-Verse, then they changed their minds at the last second to make it in the Tom Holland Spider-Verse, then they realised it's set in the '90s (or whenever it's set) and had to remove all references to any form of a current, adult Spider-Man.
@charleshastings7260 the last part of that comment 😦
5:26 I have a grype against what I call trailer click bait, effectively where something is put in a trailer to trick people into thinking it’s in the film when actually, what you see in the trailer is the extent of it, either you have to not show it in the trailer, or you have to build on it in some way, other examples include the dead robin suit in BVS (a cool Easter egg spoiled in the trailer, tricking people into thinking they were setting up red hood) and dark ray (making people think that ray might turn to the darkside when that is about 30 seconds of the movie) the spider women costumes were definitely included last minute to trick people into thinking that they would be in the film
The TIE fighter in the Rogue One trailer is another one.
it's crazy that they have the ability to make a venom verse and don't do it.
things they could do:
agent venom
separation anxiety
the king in black/null the symbiote god
if they wanted to do other spider characters:
wraith
hobgoblin (the idea of a goblin wars movie if done correctly is dope)
black cat (obviously)
adult mayday parker
silk
Thats a better pitch for a Spiderman Spinoff Universe than the one Sony had made. Guess Fans and Indie Artists can come up better ideas than Hollywood can.
@@j.e.s.m.4686 It’s so crazy, and the writer’s strike was supposed to make use root for writers. Well how can that be if writers churn out this kind of crap?? I mean, if the studio forces them into writing these kinds of movies, maybe I can understand, but if this is the best they can come up with, then perhaps they shouldn’t work for the industry in the first place! 🙄
@@JamesLawner The Morbius writers should definitely be learning how to code or something and starting new careers, not writing more superhero movies.
@@JamesLawnerThe reason the writers strike even happened is because corporate goons were pressing their boot heel on the writers throats. This is a direct result of studio execs making life difficult for the writers. This is the product you get when you don't let people do their job.
Yeah seriously a black cat heist movie could’ve stood on its own. People love heist movies. You could’ve even had Black Cat team up with other Spidey villains to make the team, only for Cat to double cross them all at the end
That sounds like way too good an idea for Sony.
Her motive could be a friend or family member that needs an expensive procedure
14:30 the best part of _The Marvels_ is probably Carol’s expression when she discovers that the solution is to /literally/ herd cats. Or maybe the dance-sing planet. Or maybe the training montage. It’s a tough call.
That and the cat scene are probably the few good scenes in the movie
Kind of ironic that it used the song from the cats play better than the actual cats movie
I really like the title-thumbnail combination. Got a good chuckle out of me
Huge whiffs of "if you don't use this property annually, the rights revert to someone else," and then you make the movie for as little money as you can because as long as you make *anything* the goal is accomplished.
Besides Silk, they should've absolutely built up to the Outlaws (but with Black Cat replacing Will O'the Wisp) if they were doing a universe without Spider-Man. A bunch of characters who turn their life as criminals around to help their community instead and then join forces. That's a bunch of diverse characters with a clear shared theme bringing them together. And through those movies you could also include a bunch of classic Spider-Man villains. Chameleon could show up in a Silver Sable spy thriller. While I don't think Puma and Kraven have traditionally faced each other both character' themes and goals seem tailor made to pit them against each other. And as much as people may joke, a Rocket Racer VS Big Wheel movie could go so hard. And it's not like nobody has heard of Black Cat or Sandman, and with Spiderverse Hobie Brown as the Prowler has now gotten double name recognition.
For a second, I wondered why Jason would be in the Marvel universe.
16:01 No, you're right about Argyll. Vaughn wanted to make that movie and those action scenes, so his team contracted a 'series' of spy books (only one actually) ghostwritten by an actual author (Tammy Cohen) and kept that under wraps so they could pretend after the fact that the mystery was similar to the film's setup.
A Superior Foes of Spider-Man film in the style of The Suicide Squad by James Gunn would be a fun time. I can imagine those characters having to come together by way of Mayor Jameson to combat an outbreak of Symbiotes, or a Green Goblin-released toxin; or using a character like Silk or Miles to be their target in a “this could get us on the Webhead’s radar” heist movie.
There's a lot of people out there who probably hate this just because it's a superhero movie with women in it. I really appreciate you Nando, because I know you want to like these movies, and that if you don't, it's for good and normal reasons
See I like that. You see a title, you see the thumbnail… title presents a question and the thumbnail just gives you a solid, no hold’s barred answer. That’s the kind of TH-cam we need in today’s day and age…
… I mean I knew I wasn’t gonna see Madame Web anyways, but I appreciate stuff like this, thank you Nando.
The frantic energy in this, like you have to make the video but you feel in your bones that you absolutely MUST minimize the amount of your life that intersects with the movie.
Apparently this was supposed to be connected to Tom Holland's Spider-Man. Something tells me this script was drafted after FFH when Tom Holland's MCU deal ended.
I just had a moment of lighting when you were describing "Web doesn't like people, doesn't want friends or a family," and I'm aware of how absolutely INSANE i go for characters who claim that they don't want friends/family, but the truth is they DO, they want it BADLY, they are CRAVING human connection, affection, attention, and community. The latest example that's easy to pull out of context is "Misfits and Magic Animatic | Evan Learns How To Fly" by DM-in-Training on TH-cam. I know that's from a live tabletop podcast and not a superhero movie, but I refuse to believe that the storytelling strategies can't apply in both situations. LET YOUR CHARACTERS FEEL INTENSE EMOTIONS, AND THEN THE AUDIENCE UNDERSTANDS WHY THINGS MATTER! :C
That’s the thing, that’s the idea for her character in this but the execution just fails to make it work. Probably because you don’t get that satisfaction of the found family coming together and just how fulfilling that is for the character like you do with Evan Kelmp, to borrow your example.
And it’s such a shame
If you do see Argylle, after the train scene go ahead and take a nap until Act 3B when the colors start. Act 2 is interesting but kind of a snoozefest and that leads into Act 3A. But the whole first like 45mins and last 30 mins are very entertaining
I haven't watched this, but based only on the trailers and description, I think that the hook that Dakota needed was that she was a hopeful person who had given up. She's a paramedic. She should have lost a LOT of patients over the years, and some of them had to be cases where it was because she had missed something, that if she had known what was going to happen, she could have prevented it and saved them, but she didn't. Wee need to see at least one or two of these, and have her monologue a bit about it (in a way that makes sense). And so now she's jaded, and just going through the motions, and that's who she is. Because then, when she _can_ see the future, and she can _prevent_ these bad outcomes, it helps resolve her core character conflict.
Also, I have no idea how they handle the action scenes, but it would need to be with her as a general leading troops, because that is her role, strategic support, so she needs to be guiding the others into positions that allow them to overcome a clearly stronger threat.
At a certain point they should’ve just made a Sydney Sweeney Spider-Woman movie
Sydney Sweeney’s outfit choice with her character trope made no sense at all. She is presented an acts in the film as the shy, demure, introverted girl, who is innocent, follows the rules, and needs to be brought out of her shell. But she is literally dressed as Britney Spears in the music video ‘Hit Me Baby One More Time.’ Literally! At one point she even knots the bottom of her button up to look exactly like it, and dances to a Britney Spears song. It makes zero sense why a character with this personality would be wearing this outfit. It really feels like they didn’t consider her character at all in this wardrobe choice, and were just like “What was sexy in the early 2000s? Oh yeah-Britney Spears. Have her wear that.“ It’s utterly absurd. Which, to be fair, is tonally consistent with the entire film.
My favorite part of Madame Webb was them filming it in Boston so I could see Adam Scott on the Comedy Bang Bang Tour
Yeah Kraven having lion powers is so silly
Whoever cut the Furiosa trailer should be in charge of all movie trailers going forward.
I guess it wasn’t Madam Webbin time
Making this many spiderman universes without spiderman is criminal
It’s just 1 universe I’m pretty sure
@@QuinnJustCantWinNo 2 this movie takes place in another universe
@@kaponosucks I know now thanks though
Vonnegut's rules for short stories: characters have to want something.
A protagonist who is drifting along breaks those rule.
Breaking rules is fine... if it's consciously done w/a purpose.
I'd of liked a movie about a spider man villain coming back in time to kill Peter Parker before her was born, main character is uncle Ben and its how he learns about Peter parkers future and his responsibility hence why he instantly said his famous lines to Peter before he died because he knew he'd need to hear that to become spiderman
I thought venom and morbius were in the same universe cuz that one line where they say something along the lines of “we haven’t seen anything this crazy since that thing in San Francisco
Exactly! And Morbius said, “I’m Venom”, so how come Morbius and Venom are in separate universes??
It says something that three days in, the Wikipedia page still doesn't have a plot synopsis written up.
Apparently the script was wildly differently from the one handed to the actors when they signed on. One wonders if poor acting was lack of enthusiasm.
Argyle was fun. Not a cinematic masterpiece but the hallway fight scene at the end I laughed all the way through and had a great time.
The stolen cab...I love how they explicitly showed her taking the plates off the car. But the license numbers were still on the doors and on the roof marquis. And then she just drives it around with no plates...no problem, not suspicious at all. 🤣
This feels like when fox made the fantastic four movies to keep the rights
That's exactly what it is. No one at Sony or hired by Sony cares about making something good. They just want to fight with Disney to get a cut of the Tom Holland money.
Apparently atleast pre strikes there’s a Silk live action show coming to Amazon from Lord and Miller
I hope Loki sees this universe and the Morbius universe and says, "Maybe these can be pruned."
If it genuinely piss off even NANDO then you know this movie has crossed the line 🤯🤯🤯
19:04 Oh, I remember this! It was such a fun story.
Honestly a live-action comedy of it could work really well.
Yep the theatre options aren't great presently. On the bright side though the Marvels is finally streaming on D+ and I thought that was actually pretty good. Definitely better than the critical narrative across the web would have one believe.
madame web review before fantastic 4 cast reaction 😭
Ok from your description only because I HAVE NOT seen the movie, It would have been so easy to say something like "I don't want any other kid to grow up without a mother" to explain/give the character a motivation
You would need to cut or modify the ambulance stealing scene because as soon as she steals an ambulance from two other paramedics that are clearly rushing to an emergency that motivation goes out of the window.
This is how I saw that going down off screen.
Paramedic 1 "We've got 3 unconscious kids likely due to carbon monoxide poisoning and the adult is in cardiac arrest. Frank I'll start CPR but we need the oxygen and the defibrillator from the ambulance urgently."
Twenty minutes later
Paramedic 2 (Frank) "We could of saved them if someone didn't steal the ambulance. These professional crack heads don't care about the lives they endanger to get their fixes."
Policeman 1 "She wasn't a professional crackhead, she was a paramedic."
Paramedic 1 and 2 😲
I kinda have to disagree with a lot of your points. [Spoilers Throughout]
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11:59 - Early on, I had a lot of enjoyment out of Dakota's Cassie. I do feel like flashback cold open might have overplayed some of it's hand. Maybe have left it a little more mysterious how Cassie made it back to civilization, maybe concealed the fact Constance got a spider bite and even the full reveal of the Arañas. But once we catch up with Cassie herself, I found her dryly fun and entertaining. Her dedication to saving lives but also a sort of detachment from LIVING people is really interesting. This mindset of "you are not in distress so I don't know how to interact with you." Someone that is basically either in crisis mode or vegging out in front of the TV. No in between. Her awkwardness at handling the kid who's mother she JUST saved because she doesn't do "comfort" she does "solving". And this attitude is further reflected in her early interactions with the girls. She's harsh on them, but it shows she doesn't LIKE being that way but she's never figured out something better. The only character that seems to have a good, REAL relationship with her is Ben, and of course we all understand Ben has the patience of a saint and a smooth, easy charm.
13:28 - I do feel they managed the bonding, it just wasn't all in one moment. As I mentioned before, we can see in the earlier taxi ride, Cassie feels at least a little bad being so harsh on them even when they're being impulsive or jerks. Then we get the first forest scene, showing them starting to put things together. And I think it's the FIRST motel scene that helps unify them a little more. Everyone is done playing keep-away with their background and secrets. And Cassie is learning that these girls have all been abandoned (intentionally or otherwise), just like she was. That's the moment she's hooked. But the movie-wide interactions between them were something I found charming and fun. You can see why they could be close but also how they get on each other's nerves.
15:23 - I didn't really need to get some explicit explanation for why Cassie became an EMT. They drop a decent number of breadcrumbs along the way that I GET it without it having to be some kind of "higher calling". Her only connection with her mother is a bunch of papers from Constance's medical research, planting a career in medicine in Cassie's mind. We get some comments about the not TOO bad but also not exactly easy world of growing up a foster child, helping understand the dual modes of either crisis or isolation. And just, as a Spider-Person, we can understand that never ending drive to help people, even if at great personal cost.
18:04 - I honestly think this was more about having a springboard moment for all four Spider-Women, with Madame Web as the sort of Professor X of this corner of the Spider-Verse. And now, each of them has the room to basically operate AS the central character and side-step having Peter as the core character at all. One of the continuous questions with the slow build towards the Sinister Six film has always been "Okay, but who's Spider-Man?", with the common fan idea of just bringing back Garfield. But this avenue angles for an entirely different answer. "Who the hell is Spider-Man?"
Like, overall, it didn't blow my socks off and had some very definite flaws. But I had fun, specifically with the character banter and interplay. Your main four protagonists are distinct but have stuff going on. Ben is a fun support character. I will admit, Ezekiel Sims is a little weak as an antagonist, his ADR and accent being particularly off-putting. But as just a sort of murderous a-hole, he did well enough.
I would be interested to see ALL of the main women come back, together or individually. Timeline wise, it is a weird fit. It was so definitively put into specific years, I'm not sure how you're integrating it with Venom or Morbius.
I've definitely seen better put together movies. The entire final climax had POTENTIAL but failed to really make it pop. A bunch of leaps of logic or dropped plot threads (how EXACTLY did she fly to Peru in immediate Post 9/11 America where the NYPD thought she'd killed multiple cops? This is a PROBLEM, and do not mind saying so). But the overall charm and fun of the movie carried me through. 6/10, but something I wouldn't mind seeing continued.
I would personally rate it lower than you, but have to agree with some of your points. It’s clear what they were trying to do in sone places, but it didn’t quite click.
I heard the film described as a 2 hour post credits scene setting up a Spider Girls sequel.
I feel like Sony can have fun with these characters but instead they just give these characters to writers who either don’t care about the characters or don’t have passion for writing something good and take the time to study the characters or make something up that’s good.
After madame web successfully used her domain expansion (webbing time)
Morbius smirks and asked madame web "are you madame web because you're madame web or are you madame web because you're madame web"
Madame web replied with "when it comes to morbing and webbing, my abilities are truly uncontested which led me to leave an overwhelming intensity behind your back, therefore with this treasure I summon always bet on madame web"
Morbius laughs and said
"Nah I'd win"
There’s no way Lobotomy Kaisen has spread this far 😂
There seems to be some Legal screwyness with spiderman and aunt may and uncle ben. The sony live actions films (expect when they did a mcu tie in with vulture) Can't mention anything from the mcu including peter parker, aunt may and spiderman himself while the mcu can't seem to mention Uncle ben or the newspaper daily bugle. Even when we did see Spiderman it was just known as "That guy" and the photo in Morbius was ps4 game version of Toby's suit.
It's like we're seeing the parent that didn't get the kid in the custody battle desperately trying to seem cool and failing miserably
i dunno if i agree. the bits that *weren't* about the plot were fun, which sounds like a weird compliment. Madam has good acting presence except whern she's forced to deal with her origin or Ezekiel. the Ben Parker scenes were fun and I'm glad the Peter Parker easter eggs weren't super obvious
their use of the Patriot Act tech roots this in a post-9/11 era, which is great
The very ending of this video hit too hard. It's a long weekend for me, so I was considering making a trip to a theatre (it's a 2-3 hr drive one way) but then I looked at what is playing in the nearest theatre and...no, there's nothing I really want to see. Argylle seemed fun and if I was making that trip anyway, then I might've watched it, but it's not enough to bring me there, nor is The Beekeeper.
The rest of this video doesn't surprise me, sadly. It's really what I'd expected from the first trailer, maybe even before that.
I think that we are reaching the logical conclusion of the corporatization of the films industry clashing against the wishes of the consumers, the staff is overworked, the viewers are waiting for home releases (if at all) and the corporations are so caught up in quotas and legal battles that movies barely constitute as art anymore, or at least as much art as a roller-coaster ride with cheap thrills
love both this video and chris stuckman's take on it. more and more we are in a bizzare nothing-verse multiverse. it's hard to say anything really
anyways, so excited for the pod!
Maybe someone can show me differently, but that time period just doesn't really pop when it comes to fashion. I remember watching Ladybird, which is set in 2002/03 and thinking the same thing.
Appreciate you giving away the video title's conclusion in the thumbnail, made me watch the whole thing.
I think Sony calls it the SUMC, James and Maso from The Weekly Planet call it SPUMM. 😂
I'm 90% Venom 2 ends with the characters on a beach admitting their love to each other. 100/10 romcom film, idk why everyone's talking about it was a superhero movie.
Tahar Rahim should fire his Hollywood agent.
What other stuff has done?
Cuz this movie is my only approach of him tbh
@@lpj2216 Un Prophete. French movie, critically acclaimed. I recommend watching in the original language with subtitles.
Ryan Coogler cited it as an inspiration for Black Panther, likely Killmonger's arc.
Dakota Johnson literally did.
Can’t wait to hear you talk about the fantastic four casting
“I’m so excited to see Madame Web” *SAID NO ONE EVER*
Lmao not even Madame Web actress herself
Nobody is talking about how they changed Julia Carpenter's name to Julia Cornwall. CORNWALL. WHY?
I did find it funny that she hit the bad guy with a car twice and he was killed by a product placement
What kills me is that Nando has been talking about the F4ncasting for ages, what feels like at least a year now. Desperately hoping that after so many rumors and leaks, they’ll finally release an official cast. He mentions it in so many videos that are unrelated. But the day Marvel finally breaks the news, he went “No. There’s something more important the people need to know first. I need to warn them…about the Web.” That’s how bad it is.
This movie has actors who perform scenes!
Please tell me they remembered to switch on the cameras to capture this ?
Salt burn and the first season of The After-party both used fashion to clearly set themselves in the early 2000s. It can be done, but it needs to be more overt to be effective!
It's never fail me to amaze, how far Nando from people in his movie taste. Even when we on the same plate, when it's come to quality of the film, even then he throws a curveball of opinion, that this movie is "boring bad", thing that couldn't be furter from the true.
Truly amazing specimen.
It’s a very bad movie but it has some parts that aren’t so bad. I also liked some of the action shots. I liked the first version she gets that foreshadows the end. I like that she used her powers in creative ways (exactly 2 times), I like the scene the girls learn CPR because it shows Webb being a maternal figure and using her skills proactively. I liked Adam Scott and I honestly kinda liked Webb despite Dakota Johnson kind of phoning it in but she was awkward in a relatable way and kind of charming at times
Thanks for mentioning Bendis & Maleev. I didn't know they did a Spider-Woman run. Their run on Daredevil is one of my favorite comics, and their original series Scarlet was a major influence that got me reading comics again as an adult. (I also just heard they're doing a new series from Dark Horse called Masterpiece. I'm looking forward to getting that one.)
Bendis/Maleev Daredevil is about as good as comics can get. Thanks for the tip off on the new thing.
I have a feeling that these producers write everything Kevin says to them, then make sure they do the exact opposite just to spite him.
What annoys me, is that the actors in the film now won’t do mcu stuff probably, and some of them could’ve been great in different roles.
Specifically isabel merced and Celeste o Connor could’ve been different mutants, and Adam Scott and Dakota Johnson would be good as 2-3 characters of the top of my head
Dude, who cares. They suck.
My recommendation for Spiderwoman (Jessica Drew) is her Dennis Hopeless run where she has a baby. It's a great unique story of a superhero and plenty to enjoy from start to finish. I read it to my 4yo son and he enjoyed it so much we had to buy the physical book and read it again.
Shout-out to the Spummiverse!!
Sony keeps reminding WHY I want them to lose the rights of spider man
Except for spiderverse
10:16 damn, even Nic Cage's Next knew to do that
5:43 Mattie Franklin is the one that gained her powers in a meeting of 5 people (Norman Osborn and Madam Web included).
Iirc this meeting had some supernatural element that dictated 3 people would receive gifts and 2 people would be cursed randomly with death or madness.
She’s also the Spider-Woman who fell in love with Peter Parker in that one issue.
This film fried Nando's brain. This is 20m minutes of him trying to warn people away from the movie while his brain is suffering the dreaded Blue Screen of Death. I feel for ya man.
People keep wondering why Sony makes these weird unrelated off-shoots instead of actual spider-people movies, but I actually think its because of some clause in their contract with Marvel. Studio execs are incredibly stupid, don't get me wrong, but I think even *Sony* studio execs wouldn't make a "Madame Web" movie before they made an honest-to-god (generic as it may have been) "Spider-Woman" movie. I just think whatever they signed with Marvel prohibits them from making a movie where the main character has spider-powers (or something like that). That is what this feels like -a studio dancing around a contract clause.
The movie is camp. It's stupid but has some so-bad-it's-good qulaity, and it's hard for me to be angry about that. Certianly, criticism is warranted.
That said, the criticisms of her character juxtaposed with "not everyone has to be as charismatic as Iron Man" is... kinda weird? I don't think her introverted aversion of people is a bad thing: it's pretty much standard character flaw stuff. And Tony was like the most flawed dude there was. He also did not care about people or want a family in his first appearance. Soooooo these criticisms specifically are kinda weird. There is definitely stuff missing from her development, but I wouldn't say that's it.
I went with my friend and we couldn’t stop laughing for all the wrong reasons because of how stupid it is
That thumbnail made me laugh out loud. So curt 😂😂
Thank you for producing joy from this void of sorrow.
All sony has to do is make a spiderman movie with andrew garfield and theyd make money. The goodwill they had from the no way home stuff was so high and yet they fumbled it.
I LOVE this thumbnail. 🤣
What I was/am hoping for with the "Spiderverse" series: Turns out that Olivia "Doc-Ock" survived the fight at the end "Into the Spider-Verse" but disappeared from Earth-1610. And during "Beyond the Spider-Verse" she is revealed to have become Madame Web.
That’s dumb
“so if you’re gonna go to the movies you should watch … wow .. none of these are good .. uhh.. there’s plenty of good movies to watch at home “ 😂😂😂
I dread thinking about this part of the studio making a Miles movie. Superior Foes could be their Guardians of the Galaxy, but at this point I expect them to make a Slyde movie first.
It’s somehow even worse than Morbius that said I did enjoy watching it because the dialogue was some of the worst dialogue I’ve ever seen, it’s like they wrote a first draft and went straight to filming, it totally lives up to the reputation of these Sony movies
I remember hearing once they were planning on doing a Black Cat and Silver Sable movie called "Black & White", but they canceled it.
madame web somehow only had one single trailer😭