How Much Does It ACTUALLY Cost to Charge an EV?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.พ. 2025
- How much does it cost to charge an EV? That's the most common question I get from anyone I talk with. I was actually surprised with the results. I'll breakdown a 100 mile road trip, and show you the true costs between an EV, and a Gas vehicle.
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Compare this to other EV average mi/kWh: (Your savings would be even higher with a more efficient EV.
Tesla Model 3: 4.0-5.5 mi/kWh
Tesla Model Y: 3.3-3.8 mi/kWh
Kia EV6: 3.5-4.0 mi/kWh
An EV vehicle (1:47)? So Electric Vehicle vehicle. People are so funny. And it is kilowatt hours, not kilowatts. Kilowatt is the flow rate and you have to add a time element to get power used. And I really doubt you are getting your electricity for $,08 per kWh. Average for Pennsylvania is $.1437.
Lucid Air Pure: 5mi/kWh
Numbers drop as battery ages
@@jjjohn5914 Yes, I have a 2012 Tesla S (which I'll be ditching.) It's lost about 15% of its range. However, that's also very old battery technology now.
@@themoretruthfultruth he's probably not wrong, but it's being either deceptive or ignorant of the fact you also pay for the transmission of that electricity by the kWh too... Which ends up basically doubling the actual cost of each kWh you use. Time of day usage can also get you upside down, if you are signed up for that.
The dirty little secret about electric vehicles is that electricity has no road tax associated with it. Gasoline has a road tax added to every gallon. Someday the government will have to tax EV electricity to pay for the roads.
as they have just done in NZ. Road taxes have become law here, for electric cars.
@@colonelfustercluck486 Very interesting. How are EVs being taxed. Is it by miles driven or electricity used? And how is it being monitored? Thank you
@@jamesn3513 miles/Km driven at certain weight ratings 1 ton, 2 ton 3 ton etc
So you buy a ticket for 5 or 10,000 Km for a 2 ton max weight as an example. The ticket has the car details and the milage maximum as the ticket runs out. It must be displayed on your windshield.The same as diesel vehicles in NZ since forever. So they didn't have to design a scheme from the ground up. Gasoline / Petrol cars pay the tax as part of buying their fuel. It's in the price.
It is displayed on your windsheild, and your odometer gets checked if you are stopped by police. (I am not sure if they have it easily available over a computer, they probably do.)
I guess they have milage records that are cross referenced as when you register your vehicle every year, or get a Warrant of Fitness (Compulsory vehicle safety inspection)
that is 6 monthly for old cars and annually for new and modern cars under a certain age. There is a bit of cheating, but you see a lot prosecuted in the Court for this, so they must be cross referenced off something like the Registration or WOF. It seems to be only the 'losers' that attempt it, and they get caught.
Hybrids are charged differently, but I don't really know anything about how that goes.
@@jamesn3513 They're now starting to extract fees annually with renewal of the plate or inspection in some states. Not a secret any longer.
They charged more in tegistation fees. Texas charge 75 bucks for gas cars but 200 bucks for EVs.
➖➖ *_MEANWHILE:_* ➖➖
1. You're paying about 40% more for an EV than an ICE vehicle. AND lose up to 50% resale value in the first year.
2. Higher insurance premiums.
3. Replace tires more often.
4. Range anxiety on longer trips.
5. Pathetic towing range.
Um, I'll stay with my ICE vehicle.
My sentiments EXACTLY! Now I will admit that the reciprocating piston internal combustion engine is one of the MOST inefficient designs, bar none, but the negatives of BEVs are STILL much worse than ICE vehicles. Rotary ICE & turbines & steam may be some interesting designs to pursue, IMHO.
Lol...going on year number 6 and everything you just said is an effing joke plus most have money...I live in reality and ftards like you is what me and friends talk about...betcha you're a libtard ...you sad demented soul...
This is not true at all. The Tesla model 3 and Y cost the same or less than similar performing ICE cars. It is not in the same lower league as econoboxes like a Civic or Corolla. The depreciation of these two Teslas is not any quicker than it was for my mercedes or any domestic brand vehicles - but it is quicker than a Toyota for sure.
@@planesandbikes7353 When comparing size classifications EV's cost around 40% more. Look it up.
@@planesandbikes7353 WIRED published an article three months ago headlined:
*EVs Are Losing Up to 50 Percent of Their Value in One Year*
Couple things I want to correct here... Tesla and EA don't deliver x amount of kilowatts per hour. The charging speed given by these stations is what is being delivered to the car at that specific moment. How fast or slow these numbers are is determined by the limitations of the charger and whatever your car is requesting from the charger. Some cars could take over 2 hours to charge at EA on a 350 and another can do it in 20 minutes. Yes I know this video is focused on the economics and not charging speeds but I felt it was important as well.
Another thing you have to factor in for electric cars vs gas/diesel cars is charging losses. For the gas/diesel vehicles they will only put into their car what the tank will hold (assuming no spilling or filling of jerry cans). When charging your electric car it isn't 100% efficient, some of that energy you're trying to put into the battery will get lost as heat. Lets just say your battery size is 100 kWh, you might need to put in 110 kWh to charge that battery all the way (amount will vary based on plenty of factors). So you might have paid Tesla $5.20 for 10 kWh but maybe only 9 kWh actually got stored in your battery. For example I drive a KIA EV6 and my lifetime average is right around 4.1 miles per kWh according to the computer in my car. When I put all the energy delivered (my home charger gives me stats) into a spreadsheet vs the amount of miles driven I'm only averaging 3.6 miles per kWh.
Also home charging rates vary wildly across the US. I consider myself lucky with $ .11 per kWh but I've seen people report they pay over $ .30 per kWh at home.
You are right on all your comments, but the main message of the video is still on point. Of course, different people have different circumstances and different needs but, for most people, the cost of driving an EV are roughly 3 times lower than the costs of driving an equivalent ICE as long as they charge at home.
The charging losses at normal level 2 rates of power (like 32/40 amp) are usually less than 10%. So if you charge on average 20kWh worth of distance a day it's going to cost you about 22kWh worth of electricity.
Another thing was the gas prices are priced including taxes and fees. The energy price excluded those. So the comparison isn't really fair.
The next is comparing high fuel use gas cars to very efficient EVs.
The next is comparing very high gas prices vs very low energy prices.
The next is ignoring the cost of a circuit install and replacing the EVSE every 10 years or so when it fails. In my case I had to run 240 across my house and through walls so just to get the circuit installed is like 1300 bucks and then a decent charger is going to be a grand (because I need 2 connectors so need to use something like the Gizzl-E duo or 2 chargers that can load share a single circuit).
The next is ignoring the greatest costs of a vehicle, the depreciation. The website IseeCars did a huge analysis found that on average hybrids lose about 30% of their value over 5 years and EVs are more like 50%. That means comparing so ethi g like a M3LR vs a civic hybrid the M3 is going to cost an extra 2-3 grand a year just in depreciation. That buys a ton of gas...
There is so much going in to these equations and the variable changes by location and personal circumstances so it's kind of idiotic to compare them. These are tools like any other so just let people buy what fits their needs.
Anyone who owns a phone is familiar with the difference between what a charger is rated at and how much a device will accept at any time. I describe charger capacity to non-tech people as being like the fuse for a circuit. It's the most that you could draw at any time through that device. An LED lamp will draw very little, while a plug in heater will draw a lot. Both devices have maximum current and watt ratings on their label. Cars should too.
@@Snerdles Just a small correction/addition. The Tesla stated supercharger price you see includes the tax. The rate depends on the state (and some states don't charge any tax for charging). Tesla users can find the invoice of every supercharging session they've done through their app.
"This has proven a consistent 94% to 95% charging efficiency. (AC to DC conversion losses and vehicle electronics overhead)" For superchargers, not 10%. It takes 5 seconds to Google the correct answers rather than guessing.
Here in California my cost to charge my car at home is 32 cents per kwh at the off peak rate. It was 12.7 cents when I purchased my first Tesla in 2014. So at my curren cost of electricity at my home the cost is 9.6 cents per mile. Using Nearby Tesla superchargers the cost is 46 cents per kwh or 13.8 cents per mile. Current price of gas where I live in Northern California is around $4.50 per gallon. So a Prius that gets 52 mpg would cost 8.7 cents per mile. There are a number of other hybrids that get above 40 mpg. At 40 mpg the cost is 11.3 cents per mile. A Toyota Camry gets 51 mpg so it would also be less than my Model S for fuel. Now my 427 Cobra I purchased in 1968 for $4995 only gets about 12 mpg and needs premium at about $4.70 per gallon. Cost per mile is about 40 cents per mile. However if you include depreciation/appreciation the life time ownership of my Cobra is a much better deal. When I sold my 2014 Tesla in 2023 my overall cost per mile including depreciation made it on of the most expensive cars per mile I have ever owned. That was the case even though I had free supercharging. One other fact is the cost of gasoline includes around $1.30 for fees and taxes. That's almost 30% of the cost of gasoline where I live in Northern California.
My rate in Orange County is 41 cents per KWH. Even worse. Hybrids make the most sense for me.
@@johng5642 For anyone interested in some form of electrification.
@@johng5642 My 32 cents per kwh is the PG&E EV off peak rate. Peak rate is 50 cents in winter and 63 cents per kwh in summer. The basic PG&E E-1 rate is based on use rather than time of day. It's cost starts at around 40 cents per kwh and increases to around 50 cents per kwh depending on how much energy you use. So it makes sense to use the EV time of use schedule and charge your car at night during the off peak rate.
By the way although a hybrid makes economic sense I replaced the 2014 Model S P85D with a Model S Plaid because I like the performance.
My home utility rate is currently $0.0988/kwh, with no off-peak rate (Manitoba Canada) Canadian currency --> $0.0711/Kwh US
Exactly, it's cheaper to drive our 2019 Camry Hybrid then an EV.
It is nice that you avoid all the road Taxes and milage Taxes that is baked into gas TAX. Once the government figures out how much they lose in road taxes, the milage TAX will be next.
There's a meme going around about how, if everyone was driving EVs, the gasoline/ICE car would seem like a miracle. And it's true!
To each his own. With an ICE car no need for apps to find or worse yet make a plan to get refueled. gas stations are plentiful and have big signs showing the price of gas. Then the tank in the car can be filled in about the same time I empty my bladder. My home electricity is 11.6 cents kWh.
No need, but I do use an app to find the cheapest gas, since there's up to a $1/gallon difference between the highest and lowest prices I see on my long road trips. With a 500+ mile range, I can be selective where i fuel up. Since even my pickup is costing me under 10c/mile, it's far cheaper than on the road recharging for an EV would be. My hatchback is currently about 6c/mile.
It's not like climate change is real and reducing use of fossil fuels is a good thing.😡If you haven't noticed extreme weather events are getting more and more common.
$0.47 in San Diego.
"gas stations are plentiful and have big signs showing the price of gas"
Exactly, it's physically impossible to do this for electric. You can't switch the LED sign to say "11.6 per kWh", impossible.
It's also impossible to build more chargers. Breaks the laws of physics.
It's also impossible to have standardized chargers that don't require an app.
It's always going to be this way. The universe is actually static and never changes.
I agree. If you can't charge at home, I recommend a good Hybrid vehicle. It's all about the cost per mile to drive, and relying on public fast charging is indeed more expensive, than fueling a good gas hybrid.
Know 5 persons who have EVs. Not one of the vehicles had tires that lasted 12,000 miles. One person , his tires lasted 10 months. All about weight of the vehicle.
It's a lot more about how you drive. I've watched several video about this issue, and not one is close to your figures.
There ar plenty of vehicles on the road that weigh more than an EV and they do not replace their tires every twelve thousand miles.
My 2012 Tesla S did need new tires when I finally dumped it with 54K miles on it. Tire wear varies wildly based on drivers and conditions.
The key thing with owning an EV and saving money ..is charging from home. But if you have to use Charging Stations then you’re better off having a Gas vehicle !!
For most people, yes.
Sure, if mobility cost savings is the ONLY benefit of a real EV (Tesla).
Uk night time cheap rate is about 50c/kwh. Better start queuing for the electric bus now.
@@brianlopez8855 Eh. NO! It is 9c per Kwh in the UK. You must have an especially expensive supply deal.
@@brianlopez8855 As low as 5c/KWh here in Ottawa Canada.
My electric bill keeps going up. Why? Ev's! I got someone at So Cal Edison [electric power provider] to admit to this. Make sure to keep your eyes open, or you might robbed or car jacked waiting to charge your car, at these unsecured charging stations. Do not forget, the faster you charge, the shorter your battery life is. An ICE car you control,an Ev, It controls you, wait time and is the charger working? Is there a line? Time is $$$$.
You are controlled by world oil prices and government energy policies. The EV owner can be truly freed from this trap by having their own solar generation at home - no ICE owner can hope to have such independence! So not only do I enjoy my EV at 1/10 the cost per mile as an average ICE car using public Grid power, I have the choice at my fingertips to take it further and plug into my solar powered battery system and drive indefinitely on free energy. Bonus is: rolling blackouts or storm caused outages do not affect me either. Electric is 12 cents per KWHr where I am though - super dirt cheap - and where I live has the highest EV adoption in North America too! So of course, it is not EVs that drive up electricity cost, it's more about who you vote for.
@planesandbikes7353 better to have competition between oil companies that keep prices reasonable instead of being a slave to the utility companies that you have no control over. 😅
@@planesandbikes7353 A friend bought his first EV. The insurance premium increased over the ICE car he traded so much that it alone would have covered my entire gas bill for my average yearly usage. The overall cost increase of trading to an EV doesn't even come close when all differences are calculated.
The sheer amount of re7ardation in this post is mesmerizing. How did you manage to even pass a driver's test if you can't even do some basic research about your long-debunked preconceptions?
@@planesandbikes7353 Where do the EV owners get the electricity to charge their EV's? Oh yea from oil, natural gas, coal, nuclear, solar, wind etc. so I guess EV owners are also controlled by world energy prices. Sorry to burst your bubble.
Nah wait hold on, I see you did the national average for gas prices, but why not do the same with home electric? 8 cents is dirt cheap, if I had that rate then yeah, EV would be a no-brainer. Last I checked my bill, I was averaging like 0.26/kwh. I still would be saving money probably. Also, did you include the delivery? Some people calculate based on only supply rate, I still don't understand why, its not like they could choose to not pay for the delivery.
More like .47 a KW in CA offpeak!
Actually if you check your rate, I'm sure your of peak is significantly less than that. That's the real benefit of home charging, you leave your vehicle plugged in and charging overnight at the lowest possible rate. No need to go to a charging station when you wake up and your vehicle is fully charged.
@@JohnS-yo5yt Use Super-Offpeak. It's .35 kWh.
@@JohnS-yo5ytyou’re making stuff up. Show us a pic of your electric bill with .47/kwh off peak.
You’re living in the wrong. CA gas is also like $7.00 a gallon in that state that wrips people off so bad. I would never live there.
So what you're really saying is that, unless you charge at home or find an available "free" charging station, even an ICE vehicle that gets as little as 20 mpg is cheaper to operate than charging at a public facility. And a car that gets 40mpg (as mine does on the freeway) costs less than half to operate than using a Tesla or Electrify America charging station (time stamp 5:58). And why do you select a "national average" of $3.75/gallon for gas, but use $0.08/KwH for electricity? In California, gas is about $4.50/gallon, but electricity costs $0.34/KwH to $0.45/KwH. That's 20% more than your estimate for gas, but home electricity is 400-562% more than your estimate. Tesla Supercharger rates in California are about $0.50/KwH, so that's 625% more than your estimate! So, at 20% more for gas, 100 miles for a 20mpg car would cost $22.50, but at $0.32/KwH, your cost for off-peak home charging would be at least $12.80, assuming 100% efficiency in charging (actually, EVs have a 10-15% energy loss due to resistance generating heat loss). An ICE vehicle making 40mpg would only cost $11.25, less than your off-peak home charging cost at $0.34/KwH! Time to rejigger your calculations. And, according to Kelley Blue Book, my 2018 VW Sportwagen is still worth more than I paid for it at an end-of-model-year promotion. Try that that kind of depreciation with a six year old BEV.
Dude, the cost of a gas vehicle with good mileage per gallon costs around 20g's while an electric vehicle costs 40g's+. How many years to offset the cost of the ev compared to an ice? 5, 6, 7 years? Please continue....
He lost all credibility at 0:42 when he said "fifty-two cents per kilowatt." Electricity is charged by kilowatt-hour (energy), not by kilowatt (power).
EVs are a not a realistic option for people who rent apartments.
It all depends on your lifestyle. If you only travel a few miles per day, you won't need to charge at home. If you can charge at work, you won't need to either. It's easy to dream up a scenario where it won't work, but for a lot of other cases, it's perfectly viable.
This of course all falls apart for renters who have no access to home charging.
The reality is that once the number of EVs that require charging reaches a point where the grid needs to be upgraded to meet growing capacity demands, the rates to charge EVs using the charging network will increase significantly and this will eventually impact our home electricity costs as well. Don't believe, for one second, that you will be saving any money what so ever by purchasing an EV. We all know where this is going.
you can, however, get solar panels and charge cheaper, they get better investment return the more the electricity prices go up. You can't get fuel refinery or oil pump that cheaply or easily.
@@pezomarko The jury is out on the exact return on investment from solar panels. Imagine the glut of dead or dying solar panels in 10-20 years if everyone did it. There is no recycling solution.
And of course the millions of people who live in apartments and have to rely on charging stations 100% of the time are SOL.
Here in BC it costs us about 1/10 as much per mile to drive our Model 3, compared to my Gas mercedes or Tundra, just for the energy. Or 1/6 as much as my Crosstrek. But our hydroelectricity is cheap and our gas has a lot more taxes on it than in most US states.
There is lots of data you did not include in your calculations, probably on purpose, the time wasted in recharges, the cost of an EV, the cost of new batteries, the cost of tires due to the fact that an EV weights around 900 pounds more, the depreciation of an EV specially if the EV is being sold with the original batteries, maintenance, the cost of energy is rampant, the risk of fire in an EV is 10 times higher than an internal combustion. EVs already died 5 times, this is the 6th. And forget about the cleaner to the environment BS that all know it is a scam.
You will need all those free charges to pay for that $10k or higher battery.
Everyone always leaves that cost out. Funny how that is.
The likely need to replace the battery is the same as how often you need to replace the entire engine on an ice vehicle. I’m not disagreeing with the cost, just failed batteries that need replacement for the percentage of cars is still lower for ev’s. If you are still uncomfortable with the lower likelihood of a battery replacement then you still have the option of an ice vehicle or hybrid. For the record I own an ice vehicle and hybrid and have replaced equivalent cost items on both cars, including 2 hybrid batteries. New and used cars have pluses and minuses.
@bnight.7996 with me being in the automotive industry and speaking with our customers who supply to Ford and also speaking directly to Ford themselves and other manufacturers, this isn't the story we are being told about the longevity of the batteries and other components as well.
Which is why companies, including ours, are being requested from these manufacturers to do more R&D to come up with ways of prolonging the batteries and other components.
Trust me when I say, EVs are not 100% there yet. Not close. Even the infrastructure isn't there yet. Think of California having blackouts. Officials telling residents to shut off their AC and whatever else to help the power grid. And that was long before EVs came along. Now, California is trying to force you to buy an EV by law. Yet...California is still having blackouts. That makes a TON of sense.
Just add NJ to trying to force you to buy an EV. Now once you start to make EV vans I’d look at that with Solar panels up top for an RV conversion.
I can replace the drive battery in my EV every 100,000 miles (which is 99.9999% of the time NEVER needed) and still come out ahead of the costs for owning a gasoline powered car every day of the week and twice on Sunday. It is not that "every always leave that cost out," it is the FACT that it is a moot point only brought up by people who are clueless about EVs. It is funny how people who have never owned one, driven one, or ridden in one all of a sudden become "experts" on Social Media. I have driven ICE cars over 1,000,000 miles and EVs over 100,000 miles now! Who would have the most "expertise" in a situation where someone who has NEVER owned or driven one wants to make a point for which they have ZERO clue?
Battery are going to outlast the vehicle it self. Also EVs are almost zero maintenance, No oil change, no spark plus, air/oil filters and very little moving parts. Brake pads will last at least 100K miles thanks to the regen braking.
I can sleep soundly not worrying that my ICE vehicle will spontaneously combust in my garage.
Sorry, gasoline in central Tennessee is currently $2.50/gallon. This changes the calculus substantially. The economics MIGHT work if you charge exclusively at home or at free chargers. Otherwise, you're going to pay through the nose and waste a ton of time if you charge on the road.
Others have also mentioned the additional costs of EV over ICE (high initial cost, high depreciation, high insurance, sky high repair costs, poor cold weather efficiency, lack of flexibility, tied to charging stations, poor towing utility, heavy weight causes more tire and road wear, declining battery efficiency over time, cost to taxpayers of government subsidies for luxury cars, dubious environmental benefits of electric generation and transmission, environmental costs of producing and disposing of batteries, future road taxes to be imposed on EVs, etc.). If you really want to save money and help society, get a hybrid or an efficient ICE car.
Turns out here in Alabama there is no place to get a Tesla repaired. It has to be shipped to Tenn. This was brought up by a Tesla owner here in Alabama on Nightmare Neighbourhood last week. I'm like who buys a car you can't get repaired? Oh yeah, Tesla buyers.
prius prime = 1st 25 - 30 mi. pure ele. - then 55+mpg - fuel here currently $2.60/gal - + in Oh. you pay an extra $400/yr.in license fees for an electric- + prime 600 mi. range - + lower initial cost - + charger comes free with veh. - + all the time you save - plug in hybrids kinda rock -
I know he's talking about charging cost for using an EV but, you have to look at the whole picture not just the difference gas and electricity cost. You also have to look at the cost of maintenance i.e., Oil changes, tune ups, etc. JMO
Some states are charging an EV road tax….which they should be paying.
"Tune-ups" are a thing of the past.
@@foxlake6750 They aren't charging it yet. Of course the Democrats who want everyone to get them are the ones who now want to add a road tax. But some regions say 'Hey great lets just charge everybody, not just EVs.' They propose a device to report your mileage would be required in ALL cars.
@@iphonedoc - There is an EV road tax here in Ohio. $200 a year (every year) for a full EV, $150 for a plug-in Hybrid.
The difference in price for an EV versus an ICE makes up for maintenance, especially when you do it yourself. It is half price, or even less, to do the oil change yourself. I paid $14,000 in 2014 for a 2012 Ford Focus Hatchback with 16,000 miles on it, which is what I drive every year. It has a manual transmission (which I've had in all my vehicles since 1991) so no inherent transmission problem.
I won't buy a newer car because of all the data collecting they do on you. You didn't think "over the air" updates was for YOUR convenience, did you? They can download all that data at any time. Where you went. How many you took with you. Whether they were adults or kids. How many times you went there. How you accelerate. How you brake. What times you are on the road. What kinds of habits this activity supports. What personality traits your travel is typical of. Then this data is sold to a Data Collection Company. That company contacts your insurance company to see if they are interested in what kind of driver you are. They sell that info to the insurance company and they see you slammed your brakes on 3 times in one week! You must be driving hazardously. However, these were the times someone almost hit you while backing out of a parking space, a deer jumped out in front of your car, and a road worker stepped outside of the protection barrier. Never mind.....your rates are going up.
I also don't want the coffee maker, well drilling attachment, and satellite tracking software in my vehicle. I don't want to pay for them, and I don't want them to be there to break down.
Meanwhile, my $14,000 ($22,400 original sticker price) has 175,500 miles on it and it has never had any major problems. I had to replace the upper shock mounts in the rear, so I replaced those shocks at the same time. I also had to replace the coolant water outlet (kinda of a coolant hose junction housing) as the gasket went bad and part of the gasket lip was broken. Other than those 2 things, everything else was regular maintenance, and it still runs like new and its great gas mileage. It is also fun to drive, and I don't have to worry about a big screen going bad, or all the stuff you can control with the screen failing.
Ok I drive a Toyota Corolla Hybrid average 50 MPG. 2 gallon per 100 miles. I can’t fill gas at home so I can’t compare to an EV charging at home. If you have to change your EV at a charge station it would cost you $24.00 That’s like paying $12 per gallon of fuel compared to my Toyota 😅
You need to include the replacement cost of the battery. Each charge reduces battery life. Fast charging does MORE damage to the battery.
Many batteries are getting 200K life. Newer cars have better battery charge management and battery temp control so battery damage not as much of a thing now.
Most people only need to slow charge for their daily needs.
What about all those people who do 10K oil changes or skip them because of time or cost? Or those who tow frequently?
People never tell you ev car insurance cost a lot. All the money you save it go to insurance.
That’s not entirely true for all people.
Yes my Model 3 was $2000k a year but my Lightning is $1091 in Mass. Part of the reason I changed to the Lightning
The time to charge and the frequency of charging is an issue for those who want to travel more than 250miles. You also need to figure out milage reduces when using accessories such as ac and heating. Lastly electric battery efficiency goes way down during cold weather, hard to avoid in the northeast. I would think the best bet would be a hybrid vehicle
Some of you mentioned the taxes on gas well that is baked into the cost at the pump snd as such is transparent to cost. Here in Michigan if you buy an EV or hybrid, you can plan to pay a much higher registration fee. Another hidden tax that you will not know about until you by the car. They know you will not be paying taxes at the pump for the road so they get it from you in your annual registration.
Three things about your home charging calculations. 1) Home charging is pretty much limited to homeowners, renters are largely left out of the convenience of home charging. 2) you need to add the cost of the charging infrastructure and installation to your home charging cost, that stuff isn't free. 3) finally there is your statement that charging from home will always be cheaper doesn't account for rate increases. We saw an 18.5% increase last year, that doubles the cost of electricity every 4 years. In light of the fact that this big push to electrify transportation doesn't include any plan to provide the power generation to feed these vehicles means you can expect the cost of electricity to continue to sky rocket.
what about the charge the DMV adds when you renew your registration. some states have a per mile charge for road tax. this needs to added to this
I didn't see where you factored in the cost of the home charger and installation of it. Wouldn't that make a difference in the cost?
Not in my opinion, because that's a one time thing.
You will also never see the cost of the replacement battery and the disposal of the dead battery included in these calculations.
@@scottmckenna That is short sighted, it's a start-up cost that needs to be factored in. It's a lot of money that an ICE car won't have to spend.
The cost for me was free after state and federal incentives. And currently ford is offering to install a free charger in any new buys home.
What was the cost to install the home charger? Or was that free??
A lot of companies offer it free as incentive. If you pay for it, it’s between $750-$1500 one time.
So the moral of the story is, financially speaking, to only get an EV if you can have home charging. Otherwise, it is less expensive to own an ICE/Hybrid vehicle. If you live in an apartment or town home then an EV then electricity is going to be as, or more expense, than gas plus you will have to charge more often than you would have to go to the gas station in an ICE car and stay at the charger 10 times longer each time.
When you add the fact that EV's generally cost more than their ICE counterpart, generally depreciate faster, and some states (where I live) charges an extra $200 a year for EV registration to offset loss in "gas tax" then owning an EV without a home charger doesn't make financial sense.
However, buying a vehicle isn't always about financial sense. Plenty of people pay $70,000 for an F-150 Lariat that live in an apartment and have zero need for a truck. Just because they want a truck.
Not necessarily less expensive to own a gas vehicle (unless you have something like prius). But might more of a hassle waiting at super chargers and not saving a ton. But there's no way for your at home charger, because every day you wake up with a charge.
@@scottmckenna You've made my point. EV's are a great option for middle/upper income home owners who can install home charging.
For everyone else, not so much.
@@lanmansvideos Haters won't give up. They are stuck in their beliefs and facts won't deter them. What is the number one selling car in the World including ICE, EV, and anything else? Good guess - Tesla Model Y for the last 2 years.
But feel free to ignore all the dozens of other advantages to operating a quality (Tesla) EV unless energy cost savings matters more than convenience, crash safety, maintenance, multiple-lifetime battery life, etc, etc.
@@scottmckenna Just for kicks I ran the numbers on a Camry getting 45 Mpg and a Tesla Model 3 getting 3.5 Mile per Kwh. I used those two because they are basically the same size car and are in the same price range.
Assuming gas is 3.00 per gallon (I paid 2.60 this morning) a Camry will cost 6.6 cents per mile. A Tesla exclusively using supercharging at .42 cents per Kwh is 12 cents per mile.
However, that same Tesla using home charging at 12 cents per KW would cost 3.4 cents per mile.
Driving 15,000 miles in the Tesla exclusively using home charging would be around $510
Driving 15,000 miles in the Tesla exclusively using supercharging would be around $1,800
Driving the Camry 15,000 miles would be around $990
It appears that a Tesla exclusively using supercharging is around the same cost per mile as a gas car that gets 27-28 mpg, maybe 31 or 32 mpg if you do mostly city driving.
I would tell someone that it you can't charge at home and must use a fast charger then a car that gets 30 mpg will cost less per mile for fuel/electricity.
Of course, variables will change these numbers a lot. Gas prices , supercharging prices and home electricity charges vary by location. How a person drives (fast/slow) and where they are driving will change the numbers (city, hwy, elevation) and weather conditions also have an effect (more so for the Tesla).
Its not the cost of EV charging but my time waiting for the charge when I am on the go.
Don't EVER forget, EV's are throw away cars since the price to fix them is far and above what you'd want to pay.
Sweet.
They're manifestly not, at least not Teslas. There's a thriving market in used ones. And it's not like the roadside is littered with broken, abandoned ones. Yes, a repair can be large, but how often does that happen?
EV cars are much more expensive to buy than a real car. Insurance is higher on EV cars. Convenience on the road is an issue with EV - you best plan ahead. Gas stations are everywhere and Joe Biden cannot change that. Liquid gas is the most convenient and user friendly fuel. EV is fine for metro use, say no more than 100 miles a day and charge at home if the power is working but the purchase price alone puts EV out of most peoples reach unless you inherit a bunch of money from rich parents.
One need not do the calculation, albeit it’s simple math. Simply this, if you charge at “fast chargers” you will pay more than typical gasoline at the station. There is “no” fuel savings outside home charging-and that’s before you pay any State tax on EV mileage.
OK John. If you say so.
@ Can you say otherwise? You own an EV? What type? And where have you traveled.? What chargers do you use? Of course you can’t, cause you are like the others-ready to comment with no real world experience. I own an EV and ICE and I’ve travelled and used both and compared the numbers. Fast chargers are at least 4 times more expensive per kWh. Do the numbers and compare to ICE vehicles. EV’s are only economical-fuel-wise-with home charging. Otherwise, they are at best equal in fuel cost, especially if you live in a non-temperate area of the country. Economics of travel tank in “both” cold and hot weather. This is not true of ICS vehicles. Quit your snide remarks and respond with experience and numbers.
You’re crazy if you don’t think Hotels and restaurants aren’t baking the costs into their goods and services to cover the “Free” charging services.
1) know what you pay for electricity. I pay $0.285/kWh which is high. The national average in the US is around $0.16/kWh
2) know how efficient your vehicle is - most Tesla's will be around 3-4 miles per kWh. A Ford Lightning is more like 2 miles/kWh
3) divide the two to determine your cost per mile. No one should care about how much it costs to "fill up" as ranges will be lower with EV's, the cost to "fill up" could be less than an ICE even though the cost per mile is more.
example - for me @ $0.285 and 3-4 m/kWh (e.g. generic tesla), it would cost on the order of 7-10 cents per mile to drive. Meanwhile my hybrid CRV that gets 40mpg @ $2.80/gallon, it costs me about 7 cents per mile to drive.
The above does not include inefficiencies in charging - there are thermal losses, so to get 50kWh in a battery pay might take more like 52 or 53 kWh from the utility.
1. I know what I pay. It's 8 cents. I have a cool thing called a bill that I looked at.
2. I have a Ford Lightning, and In the last 2,500 miles, my average is 2.5/kWh like I said.
3. Is that how Math works?
@@scottmckenna now take your WHOLE bill and divide it by Kw used so you include all the state taxes, transmission, distribution, wire maintenance, and fuel adjustment fees. IOW, not just the cents per Kw on that one line. I only pay 10 cents per Kw but looking at the big picture (just 100 miles away from you) my bill is around 30 cents per Kw. Yeah, 8 cents is "pie in the sky" for the rest of this country.
@@scottmckenna Where do you live getting $.08? I thought $.14 was cheap and that's just for supply, not including the other charges, taxes, etc.
You need to get the terminology straight: there is a huge difference between "kilowatt" and "kilowatt-hour." Kilowatt is an instantaneous measurement of power -- similar to gallons per second for water, but it does not state how much total water you use. Kilowatt-hour is a measurement of total energy -- using the water analogy it is similar to total gallons used. Several times in the video you mention kilowatt where you probably mean kilowatt-hour. At 1:31 you said "48 cents per kilowatt," but it's being delivered by a 350 kW charger.
Tesla owners in OH, PA, WV, VA, NC area pay typically $0.30 to $0.40 cents per kWh. Some chargers are less expensive at off peak times. Ford, Rivian, etc owners that use Tesla Superchargers pay an additional premium for the convenience, and reliability!
Correct. That's why I put *Non member pricing
@@scottmckennaBTW I pay 16 cents per kWh at home for level 2 charging in NE Ohio
I'd advise you to move to Canada...but we're already full as it turns out.
I pay 9 cents CDN / kWh offpeak. Fuel savings alone since getting a Model 3 are staggering. I need something else to spend this money on...
I charge my Tesla between midnight and 6 AM at a super off peak rate of .03 per Kwhr. That cost can't be beat.
That said I don't road trip my Tesla any more because it is cheaper and more convenient to drive my wife's 40 mpg Toyota Venza hybrid.
52 cents/kwh x 33.7 kwh/gallon = $17.52/ gallon equivalent to gasoline. That does NOT include road tax or battery costs. Road tax should be 4 cents/mile and battery is 10 cents/mile ($15,000/150,000 miles = 10 c/mile). Total is 14 cents/mile at 133 MPGe. 133 x 0.14= $18.62/gallon gasoline. Total cost is $17.52 + $18.62 = $36.14/gallon. $36.14/133 MPGe = 27.2 cents/mile.
New combustion tech will be 200 MPG average (150 MPG HWY, 240 city) or 1.5x better than and EV at 133 MPGe. 1.5 x 36.14 = $54.21/gallon with new combustion tech.
New RE fuel from solar thermal will be $1/gal. $1/200 MPG = 0.5 cents/mile.
27.2/0.5 = 54.4 times more for EV. No EV will be able to compete with new combustion. HINT.
As for CO2, the battery and 100% RE grid will be 800 gCO2/kwh at the wheel. Combustion will be 4 at the wheel with 100% RE fuel made OFF grid.
Actually home charging will be 60 cents/kwh with a 100% RE grid. Super charger will be 90 cents/kwh. That is $20 to $30/gallon. RE fuel is $1/gal. So, 20 to 30 times MORE for EV...
I do like the new combustion tech comment. and all that followed...
In the interest of being completely transparent,
I can only mis-quote Greenspan "you may not have meant what I read"
@@victormiranda9163 No I meant what I wrote. I am the engineer and I know how to achieve the above comment. Combustion bans are preventing investors. Maybe if Trump ends the mandates on EVs and bans on combustion, I can get the funding to get this done 3 to 4 times faster. It unplugs the CO2 scam, btw.
@@seaplaneguy1 I think I did understand your comment. also, I could see/hear where it could be taken wrong. luck on the project, I do know how long it takes to complete self funded research.
Huh? What are you trying to say? I can't decipher your comment. So you think some newly discovered miracle will give 200 MPG? I've got a real nice bridge I am tryiing to sell. You won't see that tech in your lifetime, if ever. Your figures are woefully wrong."The average battery life of a Tesla is between 300,000 and 500,000 miles, or 1,500 battery charge cycles. This translates to a battery life of 22 to 37 years for the average driver, who drives 13,476 miles per year." So your battery cost is at least twice the real cost. How much is the cost of 15 years of oil changes and tuneups, etc. plus the cost of a new engine. "Nissan quoting $16500 for a full engine replacement - Reddit"
How much does a level2 home charger cost?
Can vary between about $500-$1,500. But a bunch of companies like Fore currently are including level 2 chargers for your home. Incentives to get you to buy.
There's is no 'free lunch in a capitalist society. The cost associated with this 'fee charging' is actually paid for by increasing the prices of the goods and services provided at that commercial, hotel or retail establishment and everyone has to pay these extra costs for the 'froo-froo' EV vehicle crowd.
see my math above. The average cost to individual guests of a hotel is about 15 cents per night, if it was averaged out across every guest. A drop in the bucket. But in reality the presence of free chargers brings in extra business to the hotel, so they do not have to pass ANY of the cost of the charging on to their ICE driving guests.
@planesandbikes7353 this may work in jurisdictions where's power is dirty cheap. Where I live the utility charges $0.63/kWh, and just applied for a 25% increase in electricity rates. Forcing out the majority of ICE vehicles will badly indeed thy costs of fuel for the remaining ICE vehicle owners which will almost exclusively be rural and because of economies of scale make it insufferably, cryshingly expensive, which is the entire point of the tree hugger movement.
There’s no free lunch in any society.
The first question to always ask when considering an EV is, "How much will a new battery cost?" Then divide that cost by the expected life of a battery in years to calculate an annual cost for battery depreciation. Factor that in when calculating annual operating expenses for an EV.
Why doesn’t anyone in these comparisons look at depreciation? It’s the highest expense of car ownership.
What about insurance cost? and tire cost?
What doesn't seem to be taken into account on any of the cost comparison sites I've seen, is that states are getting savvy about collecting road taxes EV's are not paying at the gas pumps. States are starting to assume that you drive some fictitious number of miles, (No matter what your actual average yearly mileage is.) and just add the road taxes they are missing at the pump, to your yearly registration fees. Which skews these cost comparison sites. By how much, depends on the state your in.
Wait till they (govt) realize that EV's are chewing roads up at ate far beyond what ECI do it will really be fun if/when they get a lot of electric trucks going. Taxes , Fees, and more taxes. If they don't get them from the consumer directly they will get it from the power companies, the grid, charging stations, and ultimately the consumer will pay it in higher prices.
In Victoria, Australia they were actually taking odometer readings yearly and adding a 2.8 cents per/km amount to yearly registration fees. The High Court found this to be unconstitutional and now refunds have been ordered.
Nothing is "free" ... there is a cost for the "free" energy. That cost borne by taxpayers and customers of the establishments offering the "free" energy.
Nothing is free, period. Not energy, not food, not shelter, not clothing, not health care. Not even in a communist country where "the people" "own everything". Some resource, possibly time or labor or attention or of course money is taken from SOME HUMAN to pay for everything that exists. Even if it is a "tax" on a corporation, at some point down the line it becomes a human paying for it somehow. TAANSTAFL (Robert A Heinlein's watchword)
In California, Superchargers are 58cents/kWh during daytime.
Discuss your "cost" twelve years later - when you have to totally replace the BATTERY - to even have a working vehicle.
The motor on a gas vehicle will run hundreds of thousands of miles and las15 to 20 years or more.
How long do you think that expensive battery will last? That is not an expense I want to deal with.
Then there is the battery fire possibility to worry about. The battery is the big problem that is not ready at this time. I will stay with gas thank you very much.
Bullshit. The gas car will run worse (less efficient and need excessive maintenance) and how many 15 year old cars do you see on the road? And Ted baby, here is a quote from Google - "The average battery life of a Tesla is between 300,000 and 500,000 miles, or 1,500 battery charge cycles. This translates to a battery life of 22 to 37 years for the average driver, who drives 13,476 miles per year." And getting better. The motors don't wear out like an ICE. As Robert Duvall said "Suck it!"
@@iphonedoc My car is 30 yrs old, still has the original engine and transmission and still gets about the same milage as it did when new 250,000 miles ago
@@donaldvandenberg4429 So would you call that average? Of course not. You are an outlier, less than 1%. Apples to oranges Donny. Congrats on your frugality but most people don't want to drive an ancient car, no matter how cheap. Does your wife feel as proud as you do driving it? What about safety? Adaptive cruise control, Lane keeping, Blind spot warning, emergency stopping, Back up cameras and guidance? Newer cars may just have some desireable things besides new paint.
I will likely NEVER have to change my fuel tank...an EV, on the other hand...
How about long term cost comparison? Maintenance costs over 10 years including EV battery replacement. Nice that homeowners can charge EVs at home overnight
You don't have to do oil changes and other maintenance associated with gasoline vehicles..
"The average battery life of a Tesla is between 300,000 and 500,000 miles, or 1,500 battery charge cycles. This translates to a battery life of 22 to 37 years for the average driver, who drives 13,476 miles per year." Google it.
Another much ignored advantage is Regen. No other technology adds energy back into the vehicle for merely rolling downhill, the best you can hope for is Zero fuel usage …it might not convert quite as much as is used on the climb but it comes very cheaply ….
@@randshelton9588 ok. Let's say 10 years of oil changes is about $1,000 and ten years of gas might be $24,000. 120k miles will be about 30,000kW which may cost about $9000 then a $10,000 battery change on top of that? The comparison narrows significantly.
What a crock! Now add in the original purchase price, battery replacement and insurance which is blowing up crazy in my country. Talk about fanboi economics! 😂😂😂
What a crock.
So I have to pay for everybody's free charging and repay their student loans?
The hotel and airports are paying for the charging. Not your taxes.
Well if a hotel offers free charging, it's part of the bill the guests pay. It's also voluntary, unlike student loan repayment. If the government lets students off the hook and agrees to take on the debt, that finds its way to your tax bill. If Hampton Inn offers free charging, that's a cost Hampton Inn bears, and passes on in some way to its customers.
There are several points to consider here.
An electric car is much more expensive. Question: how much gasoline can you buy with 10'000 $ ? For 20'000 $ ? You'd need to drive really a lot to recoup the additional cost of the EV
Typically, EV cannot be used for long trips so they're driven less miles than ICE vehicles.
The second factor is: Do you drive as a private person or is it part of your job? If someone is a service technician, the charging time often is not acceptable. No company wants to pay employees to wait for the car to be charged, even if charghing is much cheaper. (Which is not). In addition, more service technicians would be required and more vehicles to do the same quantity of work.
If the goal is to be cheap, drive diesel, like we do in Europe!
I drive a Peugeot Traveller, large family van about the size of a Ford Transit, both for the job and family. I get 38 US mpg in average calculated on 65'000 miles.
My coworker has a BMW 5 series with the smallest possible diesel engine and he gets 54 US mpg again in real driving conditions.
Diesel is the most efficient and economical fuel. That's why all large trucks, farm equipment, etc. use diesel.
Then there is the problem of the price of electricity. The more EV there are, the higher the price will be!
Ok
Could you do the calculation for an apartment dweller on the third floor. My parking spot is not assigned. There are no free chargers near me.
$1,000,000 per month.
@@scottmckenna The big part of the cost is the 10-ton crane to lift the car up to his bedroom window so he can plug it in.
Only legitimate comparison is total cost of ownership over say 5 years or 10 years. That includes the higher cost for EV insurance, repairs and DEPRECIATION, installing a charger in your garage, possible battery replacement or junking your EV as worthless if a battery replacement costs more than the car is worth at the time, and the cost of your time spent hunting for chargers or sitting at a charging station playing with your smartphone.
EVs = idiotic solution for an imaginary problem.
I love it when someone tells me that if I buy a $400k house, $100k ev, and $30k worth of solar, i can drive for free.
I didn’t tell you to buy a house or solar. Though I do think Solar is super smart.
I love it when someone wants to live life as a victim and looks for all the reasons outside themselves on why they can't do something. You can buy an EV for $0 over what you needed to spend for a comparable car. Rent a room at a house that has solar and negotiate that in with the rent. Find a company to work for that offers free low level charge. Buy something like an Aptera that has panels on its roof and will charge when it's parked while you work.
@sd70cal or I just keep my cheap apartment and my $5000 gas burning pos that is paid for and cannot depreciate anymore. Have fun with your car payment.
@sd70cal I could literally buy enough gas to drive 200,000km with the amount a new ev would depreciate in 5 years.
@scottmckenna if I had a house and the financial ability to put solar on it I definitely would it's a no brainer. It's just I have often seen comments online that you could drive an ev for free with solar which is ridiculous
So as other folks on here have pointed out Scott's numbers are not accurate and he certainly is going for best case. The item that always amazes me when EV lovers state their case is their time is not worth anything or zero. They don't seem to care how long it will take to charge the car. He doesn't talk about how much it cost to install the charger at home and as some have pointed out there is risk of fire. Floridians with EVs found out that the batteries which are closest to the road can short and catch fire if the water submerges them. Lithium battery fires are very difficult to extinguish. I am not willing to risk burning my home down so I can park an EV in my garage. Depending on which survey you read about half of buyers go back to ICE vehicles. Electricity presently is about 60% fossil fuels, 20% nuclear, 6% wind/solar and Biomass/geothermal. The electricity grid in the USA is tenuous at best and I don't see or read of any significant movement to improve. Electricity demand will be much higher with the advent of large datacenters especially for AI. The more demand will put more strain on the power plants, distribution systems and substations with more maintenance and repairs. The additional cost will be passed on to the consumers. There is no free lunch in our world in spite of what the dreamers touted. I could go on but many on here who are realists not idealists have already stated many other drawbacks to EVs.
To add to the mix, in Australia, you can get free electricity at home on an EV plan. I have free power form 11:00am to 2:00pm. This is because we have so much solar on roofs, suppliers can play the negative market for electricity that is created during high production times. We also have $0.08 per kw/h off peak between 12:00am and 6:00am. Rest assured, they stinging us for peak time, 4:00pm to 9:00pm which for me is about $0.53 per kw/h. Luckily, I have a home battery which charges up for free during the day, so this does not impact me too much (Home batteries in Australia are still quite uncommon).
Solar on the roof also assists for other times during the day, so this is a great investment - it is a shame solar in America specifically costs so much, as it puts energy independence out of reach for so many people. In Australia, a 6.6kw system is under $3500 (after rebates) which is about $2,276 USD.
The point being, it is possible to live without paying for petrol, and not have to worry about your electricity bill too. There is a large capital outlay to begin with, but the dividends start paying immediately.
In Western Australia there is NO off peak tariff, the current rate is 27c/kw and 102c per day connection fee, and solar systems are government mandated to a maximum of 6kw. It is not easy to get cheap electricity with such restrictions.
@Realist-m9c In WA, you can certainly have more than 6kw systems, you just need to have 3 phase power - So it is certainly achievable; Perth Solar Ware House has a 13kw system for $5790.
OVO energy is in WA. Check out their EV plans. Alternately, a quick google shows Synergy Electric Vehicle Add On Plan has Super Off Peak electricity charging 8.4c per Kw which runs from 9am to 3pm. That is long enough to completely recharge your car. At the same time, charge up a battery during this time, and your night time usage is very cheap; you don't need solar to do this, but is certain would not hurt to have it. If you are not accessing off peak times, then you need a smart meter to do this.
Hope that assists.
Rented EV car in Scotland. Wasted 3 days chasing charging stations. Spent more time trying to get a charge than being able to see anything. Inverness Airport to Glasgow Airport used 83% of the battery. That's 168 miles or roughly 270 km. When we rented the EV, we told them what we were trying to see and visit. Lots of lies and no problem charging stations everywhere. Didn't dare stop to see anything. Getting to Inverness was even worse. Beware!!!
Home electric rate is much higher than stated. Mine is 15 cents p/kw off peak. Gas is actually $2.79 currently.
No mention of infrastructure cost, power plants, high voltage grid, fuels, batteries, or the high cost of renewables. No mention of high repair and replacement, insurance costs.
EV charging is generally cheaper than gas NOW, but it is virtually certain that this will not be the case in the future. This situation is essentially the same as a company pricing its product at an "introductory sale" level, to create interest and a market. There is ZERO chance that electric rates will stay where they are now if EVs become a large component of electrical use in the future. The ONLY way that electrical rates will have a chance to increase at a lesser rate than they will using our current power infrastructure is for that infrastructure to change to include a SIGNIFICANT increase in the percentage of electricity generated by nuclear energy, which unfortunately does not look very likely, at least in the short term. Solar and wind WILL NOT generate enough power at a cheaper rate in order to 'replace" nuclear. There just isn't enough energy density in either of those sources for that to be possible. It is possible, however, that general home usage may not be swept up in the EV-generated electrical pricing of the future though, as it is possible to differentiate between the power to a house and to a charging station at that house, and to charge a different rate for each, which will at least minimize the penalty that non-ev electrical use will bear as the rates increase due to higher demand from evs. Remember; the total AMOUNT of energy used will basically be the same no matter what the source of that energy is; it will simply have a greater amount of it be in the form of electricity relative to liquid fuels or other.
Also as ICE cars disappear gas will get really cheap again. And then stations will become rare. Coal wont be used at all. The world turns, life moves on. Tough to get horses shod these days.
What about depreciation? It’s the highest cost of car owner. So far, it looks like EVs have a higher rate of depreciation
@@foxlake6750 Hard to say. EVs are still new so its like computers, the next generation kills the previous one pretty fast cause its way more capable. On the other hand in the US most people who bought one new got a huge discount, and used ones arent going to sell for more than new ones so that caps the price. Once the rebates go away it will probably be exactly the same as ICE cars.
@@foxlake6750 very good point.
He left out the coat of buying the home chargers and the other xtra initial cost of buying the ev vehicle.
Nice video for those who are still hesitating between ICE and EV, thanks. However, I wonder how dirty cheap is your home electricity (8 cent per kWh). In Europe, that would be almost free electricity, as prices here are around 30 cent per kWh. Also, your Tesla and Electrify fast chargers are dirty cheap (fast chargers in Europe by roads are between 0.6 and 1.2 USD). In addition, free chargers almost completely disappeared in Europe (even in shopping malls) and everything is paid even slow chargers e.g. 7 kW.
Anyway, it is quite clear, at least in Europe, that if someone wishes to compare just mileage cost based on energy/fuel consumed during driving on a long trip (using fast chargers on highways or around) the cost for EVs will be very comparable to ICEs. This is how big energy/oil companies are switching to 'green energy' and asking the same price tag as previously for fuel. However, most of us are not on vacation all year around, and mainly using cars for commuting or short distances, for which charging at home has still the cost advantage over ICEs.
I own EV for 1 year and would never go back to ICE (despite never having technical big issues with ICEs before).
$0.08 a kilowatt hour is really cheap for the US. The average is closer to $0.16 per kilowatt hour. I pay $0.14 a kilowatt hour in Oklahoma. On the other hand, gasoline is only $2.45 per gallon which makes an EV more difficult to justify.
@@mowcowbellI only charge during off peak ours at home for 6 cents per kWh here in North Carolina. And there are two electric vehicles at my home, we only need to charge maybe one of them once per week depending on which one we drive. We usually go out together in one car. On rate occasions will both cars need to leave home.
Yes. Depending on your costs in your area; results can vary for sure. My energy is cheap.
Hybrids are the way to go. Remember, depreciation is your highest cost of car ownership and from what I’ve seen, EVs depreciate at a higher rate.
After paying for the extension cord, adapter, and any kind of time expense and the EV is not and will never be cheaper...
No such thing as free chargers.
Someone else is paying for it through higher taxes and fees.
We are paying for a lot of things with taxes so I’m fine with it. We are also paying for people student loan forgiveness and I didn’t go to college so it’s all unfair.
When kids get candy from strangers on Halloween, they don't pay for it whether or not their parents are gifting candy to other kids. It's a gift. This is no different.
Many times the free chargers are located in malls, I assume the mall is paying for it as a way to entice you to come and shop.
it´s hotels, restaurants, malls... not government... free enterprise deciding to attract clients... it´s a marketing cost for them. Stop making up issues.
Back before 2023 There were free charging stations until EVs got more popular. Some people still share their plug for people in need, you just have to find them
Gotta be a rich tree hugger to just ignore initial cost for vehicle and charge setup at home. Then hop in that care and head out on a hot day in the mountains with the kids. OOPS there's a road closure and a 2 hour delay for that detour. No worries got that GPS guiding us to the next charge station. Just roll the windows down get some nice clean hot air blowing through here. And no worries about about all those recalls, aren't they free? And to be a true to the cause tree hugger don't ya have to set up windmills along your route? And hey we got really nice high cost insurance too. And I'm sure the ev will be totalled for a fender-bender that would cost $3000 on that evil gas vehicle. If you're not upside down on your car payments you'll just get a new one. Woohoo nice!
But how long will the free chargers be free? In time they will charge, just like they now even charge for the air to fill your tires!
Many businesses will continue to offer low level free charging to entice people to come and spend. Sort of like a loss-leader.
How long will it take to make up the $12000.00 difference in the purchase price of the ev?
Ev.
$3.75/gallon? Where do you live? I paid $2.659 yesterday at Costco. The regular price in the Twin Cites is around $3.10/gallon
Best price where I live is $3.79/gal if you pay cash at a off brand station. Nearby brand name station is $4.89/gal. Side note, home electric rates are 32cents/kw off peak and 51cents/kw peak.
ya, he is using bogus numbers to drive his narrative.
@@andrewkelly1225 he's really using what is local to him. 100 miles away I pay $2.95 for gas and 30 cents / Kw because the state just added a new surcharge. I would also bet he's pulling that 8 cents from the data on his bill without giving a second thought to the other charges. My per Kw fee" is only 10 cents but with distribution, transmission, fuel adjustment, state surcharges, and taxes, it's just over 30 cents. IOW, to fill up that 250 Kw battery to 80% at home will be near $60 in electricity. That's hardly an incentive if it's only $10 difference twice a month.
It still would be more to fill up your tank. You don't get 100 miles per mile on your car.
@@ronportillo3851 If you read my example (above) you would see the difference narrows by a bunch at 30 cents / Kw and less than $3 a gallon.
Just how much did your home charger cost you to install??? How about EVs on a cold winter day??? How about trying to go on a long trip with your EV ??? How about the actual cost of owning an EV ??? The list of Plus and Minus goes on and it does not come out on the Plus side for me.
What to do when your EV gets busted and your town doesn't have a service center? How easy is it to get it repaired by your friendly neighborhood mechanic?
If you drive a Tesla, that’s an issue for sure but fortunately if you’re buying any Evs from other companies, there are plenty more service centers and dealerships. My local mechanic services evs though. Not battery stuff though.
I’d like people that buy an EV because it has no maintenance. Then find out it cost five times as much.
Hotels require you to stay there. airport parking is like $10+/day. I've seen dealerships have free chargers but I guess they are expecting you to trade in your vehicle for the $4 of electricity they give you?
Your facts aren’t correct. PHL airport doesn’t charge you anything for charging and neither do the majority of hotels that I stay at. You have to pay for parking of course just like anyone else at the airport, but the charging is free.
$10 a day for parking you are living back in the 80s
The saying goes, there ain't no free lunch. You may charge your car at a free charger but someone pays for it even if you don't. The sad thing is taxpayers are probably the ones that have to pay for it.
8 cents... where? It is 27 cents where I live and that is considered a great price. Also, I have solar so it is really zero..
Solar is the way to go. And I live in northeast PA so my rates are cheap. And I love it that way.
and the cost of the solar is......?
@@tomwalma4762 I paid 14k October 4 years ago for a slightly oversized array. My break even point is next month. I have no electric bill, and get a check between 20-50ish dollars a month, depending on the time of year. I also live in MA where solar laws are good, your milage may vary.
yeah but a corolla or a civic or a hyundai venue or nissan versa costs $20k-$25k and a tesla 3 costs $40k. ICE cars also typically last longer. this video isn't showing the entire picture.
Power grid goes down too bad
Yeah then even the gas station pumps don’t work ….
@@chrisbraid2907 But the ICE car will. Can't let an EV get cold so it can't be outside up north (or so my EV owner friends say)
After a cyclone in 2021 we had no electricity for 4 days. The petrol stations weren’t operating but anyone that had prepared for the cyclone could easily top up a tank with a Gerry can of fuel. Even farmers were fine as they usually have fuel storage for their tractors. An EV would have been impossible to “refuel”.
Except for the fact that your entire house could run off the EV for 3-4 days.
speaking of economics... are E/V's more expensive? and What is the resale value like?
And how much weight of coal is needed per Kilowatt to supply the clean and green E/V? And how much methane, CO2 and carbon will go into the atmosphere due to this.?
After 8-10 years that battery pack on that F150 lightening is going to go bad. It will cost $35,000 to replace and your car goes to the junk yard because the replacement cost exceeds the value of the vehicle. $35,000 will buy you around 14,000 gallons of fuel or enough to operate a gas vehicle for 28 years at 12,000 miles per year average. The depreciation on that F150 is probably more than the cost of gas meaning there is no savings.
Jim Farley, the CEO, agrees with you. They plan to introduce the EV Ranger using better battery technology. They are learning from their mistakes. In twelve years, battery packs have gone from $1200 to under $100 this year. At the same time, some vehicle manufacturers are offering a lifetime or one million-mile warranty on their complete electric power trains now that they cost less than engine power trains. Even in the semi-truck industry, companies like Freightliner, Volvo, Navistar Cummins, Tesla, and Windrose see cost savings over the vehicle's life with electric power trains. By 2028, these manufacturers in the trucking industry plan to produce 150k/yr of electric power trains.
We shall see.
First thing: batteries are required to be under warranty for 8 years/100,000 miles to comply with US law. In CA (where many EVs are sold) they have to maintain 70% to 150,000 miles for 10 years/150,000 miles to comply with CA law. Tesla's warranty standard is 70% at 8 years/150K and Ford is 70% at 8 years/100K - but it needs to feel good enough to meet the CA requirements.
May I add - this far surpasses the warranty on an engine for a standard F-150. And it only requires proof that the battery coolant was serviced - which isn't recommended until 200K.
Your comment about batteries "going bad" after 8-10 years has been debunked by a plethora of studies. Generally, the expectation is that the max. charge will probably go down (to about 90% of the original capacity) in the first 2-3 years and then remain quite steady (e.g. down to about 80% of the charge) for the 10-year period that you mention. In any case, there are different types of battery chemistries that behave differently, and some people can get unlucky and their battery may fail right after the 8-year guarantee, but so do ICE engines.
Nothing you said is truthful
There are losses all along the way, including losses when charging the EV battery and losses when the battery is discharged for use. I wouldn't be surprised if the calculations here, don't take those into account. And if it's just mileage, it also wouldn't take into account things such as using heat or a/c during the trip.
I live in California, and have driven my Tesla model Y from SoCal to NorCal several times this year. On average, the cost per kWh at Tesla chargers has been around 44 cents per kWh, and the average price per gallon of gas here is $4.46 (Per AAA's website today), so our savings are even greater here. The flip side to my situation is home charging costs more than the .09 cents in your example. Either way, who misses going to a gas station?
I agree. EVs are great.
$.44 per kwh getting 4 miles per kwh is $.11 a mile
$4.46 a gallon of gas in an equivalent size car getting 30 mpg is $.148 cents a mile.
Not much of a savings to justify the extra time spent charging vs buying gas. And you can get cars that get 40 to 50 mpg that would cost less than charging. My Prius Prime gets 55mpg over 271,000 average and is actually roomy inside.
Gas is so expensive in California because the government is forcing adoption of electric vehicles and taxes on gas. It's a self inflicted wound. In Texas, I buy gas for $2.17 sometimes and haven't been over $2.50 in months. At $2.50 and 30mpg that's 8 cents a mile.
Electric isn't cheaper in states that aren't forcing adoption of electric vehicles. When you add time to the equation it can get ridiculous. Sure, you can charge at home and save that time but that requires planning and possibly installing expensive equipment.
I'm not against electric but believe hybrid is a much better method. I wish I had a generator hooked to batteries that supplied power to the drive motors.
@@cc-tb3st Yes, you are correct comparing highway driving ICE vs. EVs - the cost is about the same. Where you save is if you can charge at home mostly with lots of local and daily driving. Then it comes out to 1/3 to 1/4 the price of gas on a per mile basis. Mixed use: Going on a round trip of 350 miles to visit relatives (with a short 10 minute stop to charge enough to get home) ends up for me about 1/2 the price of my gas car (accounting for the home charging upon return - I did not forget that)
@@civwar64bob77 oh good. A real example rather than math.
@@softwarephil1709 I looked at my cross country trip in my 2023 Tesla Y/LR and I averaged 15 minute charging every 100 miles. I wasn't trying to be most efficient. Out of Spec Reviews does a 10% challenge. They charge an EV starting at 10% charge for exactly 15 minutes and see how far they go back to 10% at 80mph. The smaller Tesla 2024 3/LR went 130 miles. The Porshe Taycan went 200 miles (but much less efficient charges lots more, and is like 3x the price of the Tesla). They recently did a Seattle to Boston run and the regular Acura gas car 'won', the Taycan was 2 hours behind and the Tesla model 3 was 2 hours behind that.
So here in Australia, there are energy companies that sre setting up yo pay people to chatge their EV between 11 and 3, we have solar generation that is curtailed during this period as it is surplus to the grid
Just wait till the federal subsidies expire on EV charging. Then it’ll be the equivalent of $17 per gallon of gas.
Wait for more EV fires and watch the insurance companies cancel EV's which will be a great thing.
They will never undercut my rooftop solar at 7c/kWh
@@guringai that’s awesome but I’m referring to the average grid only person.
The cost at home charging is a complete lie the final cost of electricity at home must include all fees not just the electricity rate an example is my electricity costs around 0.17 per Kwh but that does not include all the other fees relating to paying for electricity my final rate including all costs and fees are around 0.43 per Kwh
Dude has totally ignored the absolutely massive drain that EVs have on the electrical grid and that no city is able to cater for Full adoption of EV.
Looks to me that if you cant charge at home the gas car is very competitive, especially when you consider the original purchase price of the ev is usually more. Plus gas cars can last 20 years. Not likely an ev battery will last 20 years
EV Tesla driver here. I love it. For now it's super cheap for electric. I only deal with Tesla superchargers and my home charger which i find is the best experience for me. I find some of the other charging stations are so undependable. I've never had any issues with chargers not working at a Tesla stop. I also have a portable Tesla charger in the trunk that plugs into a standard outlet as a plan c. It's for if i end up somewhere far overnight where a charger might be too far to get to. Only used it once when i went out to the Carolina beaches to my in-laws house and the nearest super charger was 50 miles back on the freeway. I plugged in the Tesla portable charger (which is very slow since it's pulling from standard outlet) into the outlet outside overnight and I had plenty of charge to get around and make it to the Supercharger to get a fast charge as I was headed back home which is a couple hours away.
We had a Tesla for awhile as well. Great vehicles. I love my EVs
Very convenient.
It's funny when people do these comparisons they only show part of the picture......first of all an EV car is considerably more expensive then a gas car to buy,and where are you gonna get electricity for .8kw......I will put a toyota camry or honda accord against any EV those cars will still be running long after a Tesla in the junkyard.
This is why I have a Level 2 charger at home, always leave with full battery, unless you are going 300 miles no need to charge. I've had a EV since 2018 and have 2 EV now and only used public charger twice. Getting our 3rd EV today no more ICE so will be installing a second L2 charger.
I mostly use home L1 basic charging and charge in public when it was free, unless my daily routine changes I won't be needing to charge in public. 150M range for myself home < work > Home shopping is suffient
YEAH. BUT HOW MUCH WILL IT COST YOU WHEN YOU HAVE TO REPLACE YOUR BATTERIES? $10,000, $15,000, OR MAYBE $20,000. YEAH RIGHT!
OOF -- mere seconds into the video, and were already getting basic energy/power units confused.
I think you understand what I’m saying.
@@scottmckennaWe understand what you are trying to say... But getting the basics so wrong makes it look like you have no clue what you are saying.