+Assassin Hammer was the only boss. There was also an optional Spiked Graug, but it was just that, another Graug. Tower should have fought you together with his Talons at the end of his stronghold and Black Hand... it was basically begging to be a mirror fight with stronger version of Talion, who possessed same, but buffed many times abilities.
If you are going off this guys video, remember he has no fucking clue about the lore of LOTR so basically to him balrog running away sucks, to me that says It is tar goroth, the one commander of saurons armies, he is cunning and deadly smart, I garuntee he has plans, that is cool as hell, as appossed killin him easily? really?
Dude, the Balrog is a Maiar, which is pretty much a fucking Angel. Of course he could move swiftly even if he was huge. But I guess you have your opinion and I have mine.
Janessa Saldivar But their physical forms can be permanently scattered and much of their power with it, although one of the Valar or Eru could give it back. *cough* *cough* Melkor *cough* *cough*
Saruman is also an unfair comparison. He was locked in the form of an old man and only had access to that power which he could channel through his staff
I don't really agree with the point about the story missions lacking because they're not the nemesis system (I think if done well, the story can be just as engrossing and compelling), but I do completely agree with the fight being a letdown. I think the key word here is "iconic". The Balrogs are a part of the foundations of middle earth in the same way Gandalf and Sauron are (they are literally all Mayar). Fighting one and NOT being completely overwhelmed seems very disappointing. I don't think this fight should have happened at all, and if it does, it should be a fight that will change Talion/Celebrimbor forever.
elbentzo While I do agree that the fight should change Talion and Celebrimbor, we need to remember that Carnan is something similar to a Maiar (or maybe she IS a Maiar) and would be a massive help to Talion. So it's not that Talion can single-handedly go toe to toe against Tar'goroth, it's that he has a deity at his side in the battle, and he has a Ring of Power to top it off.
The Last Toaster Standing I agree The fight may have been underwhelming but Talion is a very skilled ranger plus he's possessed by a wraith of an elf lord with a ring of power plus literally Mother Nature is helping out.
The Last Toaster Standing it's probably going to end as Talion and Carnan winning but at the expense of Carnan's life. If the Balrog won, that would be a HUGE contradiction to the lore in LOTR/The Hobbit. Monolith said that they avoided anything that would be completely lore breaking and out of the realm of possibility. So Tar surviving and winning against Talion and Carnan would be weird considering Sauron didn't use Tar during the war of the ring nor did the fellowship ever encounter Tar on their journey to mount doom
It's a Godzilla/Kaiju sequence. Just doesn't make any sense in the context of a Tolkien game. There's also precedent of First Age elves killing Balrogs in the Silmarillion so it's not impossible for a non-cannon undead, resurrecting, possessed by a first age elf to get up to.
The fact that he's used only as a roaming roaring giant monster is a letdown here. The guy is a Maiar(or rather equivalent), he's far smarter then that.
You know, I don't think this fight was entirely underwhelming (maybe because I pictured the encounter with Tar to look exactly like this). Also, I don't think the Balrog's movements are particularly too quick for his size. Personally, I feel like I can see a Balrog fighting like this against the likes of Glorfindel, Ecthelion, Feanor etc. That leads into my next point... in the Silmarillion, it was said that Elf Lords were able to take on Balrog's in 1-1 combat (like ecthelion and gothmog). These elves, though, were exponentially more powerful than the elves we see in LOTR/The Hobbit. I believe (don't hold me on this because it's been a long time since I read the Silmarillion), that in the silmarillion, these elf lords were pretty much on the same power level as other Maia and even some were just below the Valar's power level. It remains to be seen that Monolith intentionally made it look like we were not strong enough to fight a Balrog one on one because we weren't on the same power level as the likes of Feanor and Ecthelion, but I think that needing Carnan (who is most likely another Maiar spirit) to fight possibly the second strongest Balrog in Morgorth's army, is rather interesting and lore driving. But that's just me. Would like to hear everyone else's thoughts.
There are a few Balrogs in the LotRs universe. The king and supposed most powerful being Gothmog. (Not the pale orc who commands the siege of Minas Tirith.)
Well since there's multiple encounters with the Balrog, the first encounter would probably be a little underwhelming? I mean isn't it a bit harsh to judge one part of a story arc?
I can't help feeling uneasy about this game. I think they're playing a little TOO fast and loose with the lore and the intention behind the fiction, and for me producing some things which don't really fit, like a scholarly orc just as an example. And this isn't necessarily a bad thing but just a bit weird I think; Monolith seem very keen to get a lot of the game out there before its release, including actual story content, like they're taking a sort of 'more is more' approach to marketing which is kind of unusual
GameThruz yeah I totally agree. The first one is less bombastic, its transgressions were much more minor and less in your face - no magic wielding orcs in there. There might be a few small instances which cause you to raise your eyebrows, but it did satisfy my desire for a quality LOTR action game and it did contain some nice nods to the lore. It depends how much of a purist you are really, but I personally would recommend you give it a go
At this point I'm really not all that interested in the game's story. It's clearly going to have several parts that conflict with what was presented in Tolkien's books. However, I'm not such a die hard fan of them that I won't at least try this game out. The first one was very fun just to screw around in so if the same can be said for the sequel that's all I really need. On top of that I'm sure they'll give us a bunch of new ways to kill or enslave orcs so I'm all in for that part.
Ray Hemminger yeah I mean each to their own, I've no doubt it'll be a great game. I'm certainly not saying I definitely won't play it, but for me personally (and I'm by no means a hardcore Tolkien lore fanatic, I can tolerate them playing around with things to benefit the game and I don't doubt there are many things I wouldn't even notice) I just find some of what I've seen in the new game a little too jarring
Yeah I agree. I'm looking forward to it but avoiding the gameplay because I feel the sheer amount of gameplay they are releasing will make my 1st play through feel like a 2nd
The balrog is very fast, but lore wise it's a balrog. Like a fiery being of destruction that can move fast. That scares the crap out of me that a monster of that scale can move fasgt
What do you expect when this game decides to take the lore into its own hands and make something very much unreal? If you're looking for good game play that's one thing, if you're looking for a story and characters/minions that make sense...well, this game will be sorely lacking. Should still be fun though overall.
So a creature from the ancient world is foiled by arrows what let down Did Gandalf say no weapons of this world can harm this creature but arrows........... When your a lore guy and know how strong balrogs are and then see this just so disappointed
- 'This Foe is beyond us Celebrimbor' - it bring smile to my face watching a fight with Balrog. And thinking that one Balrog is hard enough in Silmarillion, Melkor has an army with Balrogs fighting for him. Would love to see a game taking us back. I hope Shadow of War won't be the last game in LOTR universe
According to Tolkien, there were never more than 7 Balrogs in existence at any time. However, given that it only took one of them to murder most of Moria, your point still stands.
I understand that you felt like the boss was underwhelming but going as far as to say anti climax and it bad just doesn't make justifiable sense. This epic demon was just raised from the dead from a literal pit of lava that screams impressive of course the fight is gonna be lack luster the dude just got resurrected give him some time to get his legs back underneath him. It's kinda like watching the first 15 mins of a movie stopping it and going this movie is shit and lacks content.
Plus its not like the cliche last fight with a massive enemy using an equally big monster this is the first encounter meaning it breaks that trend and hopefully we get to fight the balrog with our full powers later on in the game on our own.
It's okay you guys don't worry. WB are gonna release a patch on release date that allows you to skip the fight AND own one for the price of just 5 bucks ;)
I'm sorry it sounded like you said the god of war bosses are better? Huh didn't realize spamming a bunch of buttons was fun and you don't understand how powerful a balrog really is, it would be unbelievable for talion to fight a balrog alone, as for the balrog being fast that's because they are do your research next time bud
I know we're talking about a magical creature here but there's actual physics for how something like that could move. Large animals lumber along like they do because it takes extra time for the brain to fire commands to its' limbs since they are a much farther distance away. For a creature that size to move so quickly it would have to preconceive all it's movements several seconds ahead of when it knew it needed to do them.
Of course god of war bosses were ten times better.But that one thing.Second thing is that this fight wasn't any diffrent from any graug fight in SoM/SoW.Soo that mean that in terms of pure power Balrog == Graug?
Yeah it was PC, I saw where it asked for a keyboard press around halfway through, also it was running at 60fps, I think the console version is 30fps, mind you, we don't know what graphical settings it was set at but yeah I agree, looking pretty good so far.
You can thank consoles for that, anyway, things have improved, it seems like a lot more is going on at any given time compared to the last one but considering how much is going on at a given time, you can't really expect it to be much more better visually compared to the last game. As for Metro, it's a corridor shooter thats not open ended like this game is, in other words, it's much harder to improve the graphics with open ended games like it is with closed ones. In any case, I was fine with the first games graphics, the only thing was lacking was enough things to do and I'm hoping this improves on that.
Maiar is the equivalent of an ArchAngel in Tolkien lore, powerful as Talion may be it wouldent make sense for him to fight a Balrog toe to toe without some HUGE Aid. I do admit it tho it may look anti-climatic for such a huge enemy tho :/ I at least hope its extra dificult.
judging it incredibly harshly even after saying the fights ramp up comparing it to a game that it really isn't connected to is just stupid yes god of war fights with button mashing a titan too death as a man seems cool but fighting a balrog with a dryad on your side actually makes it sound like it is a possible thing because you have a spirit fighting basically a god not a man fighting a god or whatever, this is an amazing thing to have in the game.
I can see what you mean, maybe the Balrog ...evolves over time? growing ever stronger with fewer, hardened weak spots. I'm trying not to get too hyped for this game but at the same time give the creators the benefit of the doubt.
Everything else aside I must say that Balrog looks good... The size scale is smaller than I expected as it was colossal when facing off against Gandalf and it is swift on its feet or um, hooves(?) for its size but cosmetically it's stunning and I love how it ignites those flaming wings into being.
Shadow of War is showing us lot of their main contents I'm thinking what surprises will they add when I play it on October. They just showing too much.
"It's very swift, which feels out of place with its sheer size." A lot of big animals can move a lot faster than you'd expect, mate. Ever been chased by a hippopotamus?
Yaboi Yaboy I don't think you understand the power of celembrimbor and the ring,they alone are more powerful than Gandalf and with carnan they can beat it
The balrog's model isn't lanky enough like in the LoTR movie. It's because it's essentially a re-texture of the giant trolls, but with extra. Which makes me incredibly sad.
hopefully in the end game there will be random nazgul and balrog encounters that allow you to go toe to toe without help. I would love to have a once in a while random super boss encounter
I have no real complaints about fighting the Balrog on a treant graug, as Talion is no Kratos. However my concern is for the Balrog not using his sword or whip to fight. He kills the uruks with the whip, why not use it against Talion? Just a nitpick and the Balrog will be fought again, so hopefully in a different style.
LOTR lore Balrog is literally a demi-god in terms of power. They're literally so powerful that not even Sauron, the lord of darkness, can actually control one. In fact up until the end I was worried because the Balrog seemed TOO EASY, and was quite satisfied when it killed the tree monster and flew off.
In Tolkien's earliest drafts on Balrogs (Book of Lost Tales) he talks about there being an army of Balrogs, and the Balrogs were a seperate race on their own: Then the Balrogs continued to shoot darts of fire and flaming arrows like small snakes into the sky, and these fell upon the roofs and gardens of Gondolin till all the trees were scorched, and the flowers and grass burned up, and the whiteness of those walls and colonnades was blackened and seared: yet a worse matter was it that a company of those demons climbed upon the coils of the serpents of iron and thence loosed unceasingly from their bows and slings till a fire began to burn in the city to the back of the main army of the defenders. "~Book of Lost Tales II, The Fall of Gondolin 'Company' suggests that there are quite a few balrogs. Also in BOLT you'll read that Ecthelion slays I believe 4, Turin slays another 5...etc. So, bottomline BOLT, Balrogs are a race on their own and there are armies of Balrogs. But, by the time LOTR, the Silmarillion, and Tolkien's final thoughts emerge about Balrogs he has changed their numbers, and has also made them more powerful. Once being an individual race, he changes Balrogs to being Maiar who were drawn into Morgoth's service, and he also greatly reduces their number: "There should not be supposed more than say 3 or at most 7 ever existed"~HoME 10, Morgoth's Ring What you heard was right, that there were thousands of Balrogs, and there were only few of them. In this case, since BoLT is Tolkien's earliest drafts, and he goes on later to alter this and change their numbers as well as their might I think the '3 to 7' number is the one that should be accepted.
A demon of the ancient world that is shadow and flame fought with a arrows and a being made of leaves and wood? Beyond that, it appears here it is made of flesh and it basically moves like a reskinned Graug.
oh im sorry but one of the highest ranking balrogs in Morgoths army just got awoken and you get to fight him thats a level of epic that i can appreciate
Complaining about the first Balrog encounter out of many, is like complaining about the first boss battle against Dr. Robotnik not being more spectacular.
For a balrog it's lacking they can't be harmed by mortal weapons but arrows come on could have done a quest to dive into a dwarven ruin city to find a artifact or something
man my problem with these games is that the gameplays great but the story just ruins it for me i mean hes fighting a freaking maiar here i dont care if theres a first age elf even they had trouble with balrogs it just seems silly cause this random ranger has quickly become one of the strongest entities in all middle earth
Zog could possibly be how they work in the nemesis forge content? He revives your nemesis from Shadow of Mordor? Once dominated revives your ally? Possibly?
This has me a bit worried I must admit. As for this is a BALROG not just some scumy thug of Sauron and why would a Balrog follow the orders of Sauron. It baffles me really, because the Balrogs and Sauron where the same rank within Morgoth's army if I'm not mistaken. This fight is also a bit of a letdown, it should have the same magnitude as if we were fighting Sauron because their both Mayar ( I'm pretty sure that's how you spell it, correct me if I'm wrong). Alas however stupid this fight is, it's pretty god dam cool to fight a Balrog.
Dylan Taylor no they're not the same level morgoth controled tham as he was the dark lord and now sauron is so he can command them as the succesor of Morgoth
Dylan Taylor but balrogs are not just simple enemys they have their own mind and agenda they do as their own will but they follow the dark lord because they want the world in ruins too
Dylan Taylor and BTW this is kinda a small balrog a real "first kind" balrog is huge and easily defeat a whole army with ease just look up the lord of balrogs that guy was literally unstoppable
Gabor Csizmadia Thanks, that's pretty insightful. Just in my train thought I wasnt quite aware that Sauron was considered a successor to Morgoth and that a Balrog could possibly fight against Sauron so that it could take over because infighting just makes sense to me. However I do agree that Tar Goroth looks considerably smaller compared to as you suggested, Gothmog.
You found the whole thing fairly disappointing? Going off the lore most balrogs were asleep after running as refugees to mountains shortly after the first age, if this follows LOTR which, it should...the balrog as @truemadmanmatrix stated, "he literally has not got his legs yet" I totally agree! they have been asleep for nearly 600-700 years judging off this timeline, and he has just been awoken to find a wind spirit beating the shit out of him, no wonder he runs away, balrogs arent dumb demons, they are smart and cunning, It is obvious he ran away to get a leg up due to his time of inactivity. I believe the end battle can be brilliant...let's be honest....even gandalf fought for 8 days to bring down a balrog, I dont see us fighting him for 10 mins to kill him and boom that be it? Interestingly enough Tar Goroth has his own cultists, formed from Sauron's most trusted Orc necromancers that make spells to increase Tar Garoth's power, but Sauron seems to be the only individual he considers an ally as he killed several of his master's sent cultists for no reason yet he answers he considers Sauron his master. So he could be running to sauron, or maybe to command more of his army? anything can happen. I mean hey, (For example) I could have watched the first 1 min of you're vid and said...ehh sort of lackluster....seeing as this is part 1....I would suggest maybe giving some kinder feedback as opposed to bashing something that you haven't even seen most of the full game yet?
The Dwarves woke Durin's Bane and it literally destroyed the entire city of Moria and almost everyone in it, including King Durin VI. Balrogs are Mayar. Literal immortal god spirits. One human with a dead elf in his body and a Graug aren't going to beat an actual Balrog. And as for 600-700 years, it's actually closer to 10,000, not that that makes a difference.
This guy hasn't watched the movies or he'd remember gandalf fighting one. The balrog looks an feels awesome. You're playing a mere mortal that's binded to a wraith. If the elemental wasn't distracting the balrog you'd turn into a pile of red discharge on the floor.....
believe me this one looks like he is like 22 ft tall the only balrog that comes close is morgoth (leader of the balrogs) which is 20 ft tall a regular balrog is like 14 ft tall all lores say it
Eh, i mean it could just be because of the angle, or the size of the room he was in, but Durin's Bane (the balrog that gandalf fought and killed) seemed drastically larger...even if it might not have been. Also, Morgoth was the Dark Lord...technically, the leader of the balrogs was a balrog itself, named Gothmog.
tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Gothmog_(balrog) gothmog was a lord to the balrogs but a chief compared to morgoth morgoth was the creator of evil id say cuz sauron first was one of his servants but he became more powerful
correct me if im wrong maybe gothmog became more powerful then morgoth himself but from what i see gothmog is a chieftain and not the real leader ifu know what i mean
So much for "this foe is beyond any of you" line. Apparently anyone can just take out a Balrog. This guy should be like 10x taller and nearly impossible to kill. Gandalf got killed just taking one out but apparently in this game you can just climb on one and slap him around.
So, basically you have to fight a enemy to take control of him for help you to fight a enemy and take control of him, and fight a enemy to take control of him?!
I feel like this mission needed to be really freaking difficult to justify the presence of a Balrog, or maybe make it so that in the first encounter you get your ass handed to you but survive because deus ex machina so you come in later with an army to banish the thing. The fact that you're landing critical hits on the thing and all it does is roar at you is ridiculous. To keep up the sense of awe you need to make it able to attack the PC from the get-go- after all, you can't have an engaging fight if there is no fight.
in Tolkein's stories you have guys like Glorfindel or Gandalf fighting Barlogs by themselves with their own powers and weapons and win while in Shadow of War Thalion, even though he has a wraith,spirit and a walking mech like tree helping him in the fight he just end up barely scratching the Balrog!? disapointing indeed.
I love the nemesis system with this game but I'm confused in how it builds up this side set of stories or relationships when in my game any time I encountered a named orc they would always die within the first or second encounter I had with them. Was I supposed to let them get away or kill me a few times to build up that "relationship" that I hear everyone talk about all the time?
A fused being of an Elf-lord wraith and a skilled undead-ranger -- WITH a ring of power... I'd say it's a pretty fair fight to pit him against a Balrog... Even Gandalf was able to solo a Balrog and he was hardly all that powerful himself. Sure it killed him to do so... but eh. Also "No-one can tame a Balrog". Bitch, Morgoth isn't no-one.
It would have been a lot cooler if you got to fight it David and Goliath style. The dynamic between a massive enemy like the balrog vs your character would be cool to see. Oh well. Still excited for this game.
If you even watched the movies and read the lore behind Balrogs then you would know that just cause the beast is huge it's still able move swiftly. Also you can not compare this game to god of war as these games head in two different directions entirely. The story for shadow of Mordor I thought was well done, and left off with us wanting more and that is why we are getting shadow of war.
I'm 13 and good thing this balrog came with hints, slow-motion quick time events, glowing weak areas, and the ability to be killed with a few brain-dead button presses. Otherwise my mom would be calling this company for a refund!
So basically like shadow of mordor, where the boss battles sucked and the game was awesome.
The boss is just, ok. It should be more. Hopefully the battles afterwards with this balrog are better.
+Assassin
Hammer was the only boss. There was also an optional Spiked Graug, but it was just that, another Graug. Tower should have fought you together with his Talons at the end of his stronghold and Black Hand... it was basically begging to be a mirror fight with stronger version of Talion, who possessed same, but buffed many times abilities.
fight with Tower was good? where you pretty much just stealth drain him? that was good?
HA! I dont even remember the boss battles. They must've sucked
If you are going off this guys video, remember he has no fucking clue about the lore of LOTR so basically to him balrog running away sucks, to me that says It is tar goroth, the one commander of saurons armies, he is cunning and deadly smart, I garuntee he has plans, that is cool as hell, as appossed killin him easily? really?
Dude, the Balrog is a Maiar, which is pretty much a fucking Angel. Of course he could move swiftly even if he was huge. But I guess you have your opinion and I have mine.
GameThruz key word defeated, they can't be killed
Janessa Saldivar But their physical forms can be permanently scattered and much of their power with it, although one of the Valar or Eru could give it back. *cough* *cough* Melkor *cough* *cough*
GameThruz That's not my point??
Saruman is also an unfair comparison. He was locked in the form of an old man and only had access to that power which he could channel through his staff
TheTrigger124 True, same with others like Gandalf. Was Sauron's power restricted when he had a physical form or not?
I don't really agree with the point about the story missions lacking because they're not the nemesis system (I think if done well, the story can be just as engrossing and compelling), but I do completely agree with the fight being a letdown. I think the key word here is "iconic". The Balrogs are a part of the foundations of middle earth in the same way Gandalf and Sauron are (they are literally all Mayar). Fighting one and NOT being completely overwhelmed seems very disappointing. I don't think this fight should have happened at all, and if it does, it should be a fight that will change Talion/Celebrimbor forever.
elbentzo While I do agree that the fight should change Talion and Celebrimbor, we need to remember that Carnan is something similar to a Maiar (or maybe she IS a Maiar) and would be a massive help to Talion. So it's not that Talion can single-handedly go toe to toe against Tar'goroth, it's that he has a deity at his side in the battle, and he has a Ring of Power to top it off.
The Last Toaster Standing I agree The fight may have been underwhelming but Talion is a very skilled ranger plus he's possessed by a wraith of an elf lord with a ring of power plus literally Mother Nature is helping out.
Dylan Bennett Exactly. And Elf-lords were known for slaying Balrogs, although Celebrimbor not so much, but still.
SpydersByte I personally hope that the Balrog ends up defeating Carnán and Talion.
The Last Toaster Standing it's probably going to end as Talion and Carnan winning but at the expense of Carnan's life.
If the Balrog won, that would be a HUGE contradiction to the lore in LOTR/The Hobbit.
Monolith said that they avoided anything that would be completely lore breaking and out of the realm of possibility. So Tar surviving and winning against Talion and Carnan would be weird considering Sauron didn't use Tar during the war of the ring nor did the fellowship ever encounter Tar on their journey to mount doom
It's a Godzilla/Kaiju sequence. Just doesn't make any sense in the context of a Tolkien game. There's also precedent of First Age elves killing Balrogs in the Silmarillion so it's not impossible for a non-cannon undead, resurrecting, possessed by a first age elf to get up to.
Sam Barnard Not all the balrogs are dead. For example, durins bane and this one. There were balrogs left in middle earth they just went into hiding.
Tristan Riffle yes I agree. Hence I said balrogs killed, not all balrogs killed :)
The fact that he's used only as a roaming roaring giant monster is a letdown here. The guy is a Maiar(or rather equivalent), he's far smarter then that.
TheArklyte he might have gone bonkers from how long he was hidden.
Sam Barnard Celebrimbor is a Second Age elf, not First Age.
You know, I don't think this fight was entirely underwhelming (maybe because I pictured the encounter with Tar to look exactly like this). Also, I don't think the Balrog's movements are particularly too quick for his size. Personally, I feel like I can see a Balrog fighting like this against the likes of Glorfindel, Ecthelion, Feanor etc.
That leads into my next point... in the Silmarillion, it was said that Elf Lords were able to take on Balrog's in 1-1 combat (like ecthelion and gothmog). These elves, though, were exponentially more powerful than the elves we see in LOTR/The Hobbit. I believe (don't hold me on this because it's been a long time since I read the Silmarillion), that in the silmarillion, these elf lords were pretty much on the same power level as other Maia and even some were just below the Valar's power level.
It remains to be seen that Monolith intentionally made it look like we were not strong enough to fight a Balrog one on one because we weren't on the same power level as the likes of Feanor and Ecthelion, but I think that needing Carnan (who is most likely another Maiar spirit) to fight possibly the second strongest Balrog in Morgorth's army, is rather interesting and lore driving.
But that's just me. Would like to hear everyone else's thoughts.
Is it THE Balrog or A Balrog?
It's A Balrog, but given there isn't another one in Shadow of War (I think), in the context of that game it is The Balrog.
This answers a lot. Did they make this guy up for the game? Isn't there only 7 that ever existed?
It's a Balrog. But in this game it's the Balrog. It's the only one in game. Not in the lore.
There are a few Balrogs in the LotRs universe. The king and supposed most powerful being Gothmog. (Not the pale orc who commands the siege of Minas Tirith.)
you realize how huge the lore is when you have 2 characters called fkn Gothmog
Well since there's multiple encounters with the Balrog, the first encounter would probably be a little underwhelming? I mean isn't it a bit harsh to judge one part of a story arc?
True. It's like judgeing the Star Wars saga only on episode 1 and 2.
it should be hard... its a frickin BALROG... and the previous game had the same problem....
I want to brand him
That's going to take a whole lot of burn cream.
balrogs bow to none save morgoth, good luck with that fam
Even a Balrog in the first age was even on power (or more) with Sauron.
You'd need to know what a valaraukar is first, and then you'd laugh at your own intentions
This games marketing strategy is giving spoilers and showing every suprising part of the game so the viewers would buy it i guess
Good point it seems like you fighting another graug like the horned invulnerable to ranged from the first game
I can't help feeling uneasy about this game. I think they're playing a little TOO fast and loose with the lore and the intention behind the fiction, and for me producing some things which don't really fit, like a scholarly orc just as an example. And this isn't necessarily a bad thing but just a bit weird I think; Monolith seem very keen to get a lot of the game out there before its release, including actual story content, like they're taking a sort of 'more is more' approach to marketing which is kind of unusual
GameThruz yeah I totally agree. The first one is less bombastic, its transgressions were much more minor and less in your face - no magic wielding orcs in there. There might be a few small instances which cause you to raise your eyebrows, but it did satisfy my desire for a quality LOTR action game and it did contain some nice nods to the lore. It depends how much of a purist you are really, but I personally would recommend you give it a go
At this point I'm really not all that interested in the game's story. It's clearly going to have several parts that conflict with what was presented in Tolkien's books. However, I'm not such a die hard fan of them that I won't at least try this game out. The first one was very fun just to screw around in so if the same can be said for the sequel that's all I really need. On top of that I'm sure they'll give us a bunch of new ways to kill or enslave orcs so I'm all in for that part.
Ray Hemminger yeah I mean each to their own, I've no doubt it'll be a great game. I'm certainly not saying I definitely won't play it, but for me personally (and I'm by no means a hardcore Tolkien lore fanatic, I can tolerate them playing around with things to benefit the game and I don't doubt there are many things I wouldn't even notice) I just find some of what I've seen in the new game a little too jarring
You do realize that they only summoned it, not made it?
Yeah I agree. I'm looking forward to it but avoiding the gameplay because I feel the sheer amount of gameplay they are releasing will make my 1st play through feel like a 2nd
if Balrog was able to speak, the 1st thing he would say is: "FROM THE EYE OF TERROR, I COME TO KILL!"
Sometimes I like a good stand-alone set piece. This fight looks amazing.
The balrog is very fast, but lore wise it's a balrog. Like a fiery being of destruction that can move fast. That scares the crap out of me that a monster of that scale can move fasgt
I will remain optimistic, if this was the ONLY time you encounter the Balrog then I would be annoyed.
dont worry. they said this is the first encounter. there will be more fights with it.
The games already good enough for me, this is just icing on the cake, be grateful this game is this good
What do you expect when this game decides to take the lore into its own hands and make something very much unreal? If you're looking for good game play that's one thing, if you're looking for a story and characters/minions that make sense...well, this game will be sorely lacking. Should still be fun though overall.
ErelasInglor You serve the bright lord now.
That fight looked very fun.
+Assassin Well there is more encounters afterwards, so :)
Assassin you fight him again so this is not the end
So a creature from the ancient world is foiled by arrows what let down
Did Gandalf say no weapons of this world can harm this creature but arrows...........
When your a lore guy and know how strong balrogs are and then see this just so disappointed
epicmcpixels but they are not mortal arrow from that world. He uses the arrows from the spirt world
Yeah. The whole world doen't feel like its in the Middle-earth universe. I wonder what Tolkien would say :(
Tolkien : " And you say you can control what goes on in that television just by pressing those buttons ? What a fascinating technology !"
MaddeningFly that's pretty good
Gandalf did. Those arrows are not only of elven makeing but they are also from the wraith world. So it makes more sense.
- 'This Foe is beyond us Celebrimbor' - it bring smile to my face watching a fight with Balrog. And thinking that one Balrog is hard enough in Silmarillion, Melkor has an army with Balrogs fighting for him. Would love to see a game taking us back. I hope Shadow of War won't be the last game in LOTR universe
According to Tolkien, there were never more than 7 Balrogs in existence at any time. However, given that it only took one of them to murder most of Moria, your point still stands.
I understand that you felt like the boss was underwhelming but going as far as to say anti climax and it bad just doesn't make justifiable sense. This epic demon was just raised from the dead from a literal pit of lava that screams impressive of course the fight is gonna be lack luster the dude just got resurrected give him some time to get his legs back underneath him. It's kinda like watching the first 15 mins of a movie stopping it and going this movie is shit and lacks content.
I agree
truemadmanmatrix your right
Plus its not like the cliche last fight with a massive enemy using an equally big monster this is the first encounter meaning it breaks that trend and hopefully we get to fight the balrog with our full powers later on in the game on our own.
truemadmanmatrix but it is shit like the game was...
Balrogs are Maiar, it was not dead really, just dormant deep inside the earth.
It's okay you guys don't worry. WB are gonna release a patch on release date that allows you to skip the fight AND own one for the price of just 5 bucks ;)
For God's sake, don't give them ideas! They still might do it!
I'm sorry it sounded like you said the god of war bosses are better? Huh didn't realize spamming a bunch of buttons was fun and you don't understand how powerful a balrog really is, it would be unbelievable for talion to fight a balrog alone, as for the balrog being fast that's because they are do your research next time bud
I'd call God of War bosses better than that. Also, why doesn't it matter so much? It's a game, and it's already been stated as non canon in the past.
I know we're talking about a magical creature here but there's actual physics for how something like that could move. Large animals lumber along like they do because it takes extra time for the brain to fire commands to its' limbs since they are a much farther distance away. For a creature that size to move so quickly it would have to preconceive all it's movements several seconds ahead of when it knew it needed to do them.
there is physics involved here, it is fiction don't over think this.
Balrog is literally a spirit. I don't think the laws of biology apply here.
Of course god of war bosses were ten times better.But that one thing.Second thing is that this fight wasn't any diffrent from any graug fight in SoM/SoW.Soo that mean that in terms of pure power Balrog == Graug?
I was sold once I found out you can fight a balrog
My game kept crashing for 8 times whenever the debris falls or when I look at Canan in this mission.
Wow. That voice actor for the necromancer orc is amazing...
Graphically this game is stunning! Was this captured from PC, or is console seriously running at 60?
Yeah it was PC, I saw where it asked for a keyboard press around halfway through, also it was running at 60fps, I think the console version is 30fps, mind you, we don't know what graphical settings it was set at but yeah I agree, looking pretty good so far.
You can thank consoles for that, anyway, things have improved, it seems like a lot more is going on at any given time compared to the last one but considering how much is going on at a given time, you can't really expect it to be much more better visually compared to the last game.
As for Metro, it's a corridor shooter thats not open ended like this game is, in other words, it's much harder to improve the graphics with open ended games like it is with closed ones.
In any case, I was fine with the first games graphics, the only thing was lacking was enough things to do and I'm hoping this improves on that.
People never learn! A fire type Pokemon will always beat a grass type!
Maiar is the equivalent of an ArchAngel in Tolkien lore, powerful as Talion may be it wouldent make sense for him to fight a Balrog toe to toe without some HUGE Aid.
I do admit it tho it may look anti-climatic for such a huge enemy tho :/ I at least hope its extra dificult.
judging it incredibly harshly even after saying the fights ramp up comparing it to a game that it really isn't connected to is just stupid yes god of war fights with button mashing a titan too death as a man seems cool but fighting a balrog with a dryad on your side actually makes it sound like it is a possible thing because you have a spirit fighting basically a god not a man fighting a god or whatever, this is an amazing thing to have in the game.
How much is the microtransaction to fight the Balrog?
all of your college funds and quite possibly your home family xbox/ps4/pc your pets.
TheSithlord259 Yeah
JRobin1983 it comes with the game
Nah, a US4.99 microtransction to skip the boss and win the game. Simple, since it's WB.
Alfred Ong alright we will see
I can see what you mean, maybe the Balrog ...evolves over time? growing ever stronger with fewer, hardened weak spots. I'm trying not to get too hyped for this game but at the same time give the creators the benefit of the doubt.
PS: I know next to nothing about LOTR lore. Just being wishful.
Everything else aside I must say that Balrog looks good... The size scale is smaller than I expected as it was colossal when facing off against Gandalf and it is swift on its feet or um, hooves(?) for its size but cosmetically it's stunning and I love how it ignites those flaming wings into being.
according that this beast does not exist and the lores say it is 14 ft tall it is much bigger then it should be believe me
If you are a fan of the Middle Earth lore, This battle with the balrog is VERY INTERESTING.
The power of Christ compels you! Wait... wrong bible.
It looks awesome to me
Assassin oh shit I jsut realized that :(
AyZeD
Is your profile picture from Earth 2?
The Bright Lord
Earth 2 is an old television series from the mid 90's, his profile picture/avatar looks like a character from that show.
Anyone was expecting a dark souls like boss fight?
Carnán comes to give a tongue lashing --> Celebrimbor quickly disappears
Shadow of War is showing us lot of their main contents I'm thinking what surprises will they add when I play it on October. They just showing too much.
"It's very swift, which feels out of place with its sheer size." A lot of big animals can move a lot faster than you'd expect, mate. Ever been chased by a hippopotamus?
So the orcs idea to stop the unkillable guy is to summon an unstoppable, uncontrollable Balrog?
No one said Uruks were smart
It always comes down to a punch up 'round the back of the pub. Always.
The Balrogs where fallen Maiar shaped and created FOR COMBAT EXLUSIVELY! It should be far harder to beat.
But he didn't beat it
the fact that he was able to fight for so long is still unreal.. balrog should be veeeeeery hard to fight (atleast a dark souls level of hard)
Gandalf fought it for 8 days, Gandalf is a minor god given mortal form, and the fight killed him.
Yaboi Yaboy I don't think you understand the power of celembrimbor and the ring,they alone are more powerful than Gandalf and with carnan they can beat it
That pale orc in RotK, Gothmog.. He shares the same name as the king of the balrogs.. I wonder how strong he would be!
A definite purchase for me, but trying to limit the videos I watch on the game so I don't spoil it for myself.
The balrog's model isn't lanky enough like in the LoTR movie. It's because it's essentially a re-texture of the giant trolls, but with extra. Which makes me incredibly sad.
Wow, an actual boss-fight. Cool.
hopefully in the end game there will be random nazgul and balrog encounters that allow you to go toe to toe without help. I would love to have a once in a while random super boss encounter
I have no real complaints about fighting the Balrog on a treant graug, as Talion is no Kratos. However my concern is for the Balrog not using his sword or whip to fight. He kills the uruks with the whip, why not use it against Talion? Just a nitpick and the Balrog will be fought again, so hopefully in a different style.
"WE RESPECT THE SOURCE MATERIAL AND LOVE IT!!!"
LMAO these people are horrible.
LOTR lore Balrog is literally a demi-god in terms of power. They're literally so powerful that not even Sauron, the lord of darkness, can actually control one.
In fact up until the end I was worried because the Balrog seemed TOO EASY, and was quite satisfied when it killed the tree monster and flew off.
If you guys continue to talk shit about this game, I swear you'll all suffer me now.
In Tolkien's earliest drafts on Balrogs (Book of Lost Tales) he talks about there being an army of Balrogs, and the Balrogs were a seperate race on their own:
Then the Balrogs continued to shoot darts of fire and flaming arrows like small snakes into the sky, and these fell upon the roofs and gardens of Gondolin till all the trees were scorched, and the flowers and grass burned up, and the whiteness of those walls and colonnades was blackened and seared: yet a worse matter was it that a company of those demons climbed upon the coils of the serpents of iron and thence loosed unceasingly from their bows and slings till a fire began to burn in the city to the back of the main army of the defenders. "~Book of Lost Tales II, The Fall of Gondolin
'Company' suggests that there are quite a few balrogs. Also in BOLT you'll read that Ecthelion slays I believe 4, Turin slays another 5...etc. So, bottomline BOLT, Balrogs are a race on their own and there are armies of Balrogs.
But, by the time LOTR, the Silmarillion, and Tolkien's final thoughts emerge about Balrogs he has changed their numbers, and has also made them more powerful. Once being an individual race, he changes Balrogs to being Maiar who were drawn into Morgoth's service, and he also greatly reduces their number:
"There should not be supposed more than say 3 or at most 7 ever existed"~HoME 10, Morgoth's Ring
What you heard was right, that there were thousands of Balrogs, and there were only few of them. In this case, since BoLT is Tolkien's earliest drafts, and he goes on later to alter this and change their numbers as well as their might I think the '3 to 7' number is the one that should be accepted.
I took a double glance at the title. I thought it said Ballrag....
A demon of the ancient world that is shadow and flame fought with a arrows and a being made of leaves and wood? Beyond that, it appears here it is made of flesh and it basically moves like a reskinned Graug.
The Tolkeen nerd in me is weeping. I loathe it when game developers just pluck things out of a book and say "Hay. It would be cool to fight that."
"Too swift" isn't really legitimate here. Even the balrog in the movie is swift, whipping around its tail and being generally badass.
oh im sorry but one of the highest ranking balrogs in Morgoths army just got awoken and you get to fight him thats a level of epic that i can appreciate
A bit disappointed that a demon of fire and shadow loses to arrows and an entity made from sticks and stones.
I hope that lava is using placeholder textures. It looks so cartoony.
Complaining about the first Balrog encounter out of many, is like complaining about the first boss battle against Dr. Robotnik not being more spectacular.
how a creature of fire and rage couldn't take on a spirit made out of wood, i'll never understand
You fought A Balrog. There are more than one.
For a balrog it's lacking they can't be harmed by mortal weapons but arrows come on could have done a quest to dive into a dwarven ruin city to find a artifact or something
man my problem with these games is that the gameplays great but the story just ruins it for me i mean hes fighting a freaking maiar here i dont care if theres a first age elf even they had trouble with balrogs it just seems silly cause this random ranger has quickly become one of the strongest entities in all middle earth
States that it isnt the LAST confrontation with the Balrog, complains about it being "anti-CLIMACTIC". Well no shit, Sherlock.
Zog could possibly be how they work in the nemesis forge content? He revives your nemesis from Shadow of Mordor? Once dominated revives your ally? Possibly?
Yep.
He should have an overpowered V-trigger of some sort.
Dude the Balrog is a Maiar he is an angel so his size doesn't really affect his speed.
This has me a bit worried I must admit. As for this is a BALROG not just some scumy thug of Sauron and why would a Balrog follow the orders of Sauron. It baffles me really, because the Balrogs and Sauron where the same rank within Morgoth's army if I'm not mistaken. This fight is also a bit of a letdown, it should have the same magnitude as if we were fighting Sauron because their both Mayar ( I'm pretty sure that's how you spell it, correct me if I'm wrong). Alas however stupid this fight is, it's pretty god dam cool to fight a Balrog.
There is no saying sauron will control the balorg, but a balrog will definitely be a threat alone or with others
Dylan Taylor no they're not the same level morgoth controled tham as he was the dark lord and now sauron is so he can command them as the succesor of Morgoth
Dylan Taylor but balrogs are not just simple enemys they have their own mind and agenda they do as their own will but they follow the dark lord because they want the world in ruins too
Dylan Taylor and BTW this is kinda a small balrog a real "first kind" balrog is huge and easily defeat a whole army with ease just look up the lord of balrogs that guy was literally unstoppable
Gabor Csizmadia Thanks, that's pretty insightful. Just in my train thought I wasnt quite aware that Sauron was considered a successor to Morgoth and that a Balrog could possibly fight against Sauron so that it could take over because infighting just makes sense to me. However I do agree that Tar Goroth looks considerably smaller compared to as you suggested, Gothmog.
You found the whole thing fairly disappointing?
Going off the lore most balrogs were asleep after running as refugees to mountains shortly after the first age, if this follows LOTR which, it should...the balrog as @truemadmanmatrix stated, "he literally has not got his legs yet" I totally agree! they have been asleep for nearly 600-700 years judging off this timeline, and he has just been awoken to find a wind spirit beating the shit out of him, no wonder he runs away, balrogs arent dumb demons, they are smart and cunning, It is obvious he ran away to get a leg up due to his time of inactivity. I believe the end battle can be brilliant...let's be honest....even gandalf fought for 8 days to bring down a balrog, I dont see us fighting him for 10 mins to kill him and boom that be it? Interestingly enough Tar Goroth has his own cultists, formed from Sauron's most trusted Orc necromancers that make spells to increase Tar Garoth's power, but Sauron seems to be the only individual he considers an ally as he killed several of his master's sent cultists for no reason yet he answers he considers Sauron his master. So he could be running to sauron, or maybe to command more of his army? anything can happen.
I mean hey, (For example) I could have watched the first 1 min of you're vid and said...ehh sort of lackluster....seeing as this is part 1....I would suggest maybe giving some kinder feedback as opposed to bashing something that you haven't even seen most of the full game yet?
The Dwarves woke Durin's Bane and it literally destroyed the entire city of Moria and almost everyone in it, including King Durin VI. Balrogs are Mayar. Literal immortal god spirits. One human with a dead elf in his body and a Graug aren't going to beat an actual Balrog.
And as for 600-700 years, it's actually closer to 10,000, not that that makes a difference.
This guy hasn't watched the movies or he'd remember gandalf fighting one. The balrog looks an feels awesome. You're playing a mere mortal that's binded to a wraith. If the elemental wasn't distracting the balrog you'd turn into a pile of red discharge on the floor.....
It would be cool is it randomly spawned around the world and there were multiple ways to beat it, each time gaining a malrog loot chest :3
Not all balrogs are big if you read the lord of the rings books
Well that fight seems badass, can't wait to see a graug vs balrog battle
Oh its a diffrent balrog now it makes sense
This isn't the only encounter with the Balrog
This balrog seems....smaller than it should be.
believe me this one looks like he is like 22 ft tall the only balrog that comes close is morgoth (leader of the balrogs)
which is 20 ft tall a regular balrog is like 14 ft tall all lores say it
Eh, i mean it could just be because of the angle, or the size of the room he was in, but Durin's Bane (the balrog that gandalf fought and killed) seemed drastically larger...even if it might not have been. Also, Morgoth was the Dark Lord...technically, the leader of the balrogs was a balrog itself, named Gothmog.
tolkiengateway.net/wiki/Gothmog_(balrog)
gothmog was a lord to the balrogs but a chief compared to morgoth morgoth was the creator of evil id say cuz sauron first was one of his servants but he became more powerful
correct me if im wrong maybe gothmog became more powerful then morgoth himself but from what i see gothmog is a chieftain and not the real leader ifu know what i mean
Ouch, this is like Network tv level plot writing here.
Dude Zog the eternal was just like my villain Ult Ar Cur.
Brand the Balrog! Wait, BRAND SARUMAN! OR SAURON! BRAND FUCKING MORGOTH!!!
Rip Tree golem.... You will be missed
So much for "this foe is beyond any of you" line. Apparently anyone can just take out a Balrog. This guy should be like 10x taller and nearly impossible to kill. Gandalf got killed just taking one out but apparently in this game you can just climb on one and slap him around.
I wonder - is Zog the Eternal a generated orc or a premade "story" orc? I'm hopeful we'll see unique uruks in key story roles!
So, basically you have to fight a enemy to take control of him for help you to fight a enemy and take control of him, and fight a enemy to take control of him?!
I feel like this mission needed to be really freaking difficult to justify the presence of a Balrog, or maybe make it so that in the first encounter you get your ass handed to you but survive because deus ex machina so you come in later with an army to banish the thing. The fact that you're landing critical hits on the thing and all it does is roar at you is ridiculous. To keep up the sense of awe you need to make it able to attack the PC from the get-go- after all, you can't have an engaging fight if there is no fight.
Gonna stand 5 feet away from a monologuing sorcerer and stare at him and do nothing until he teleports away. "Oh noooo, he got away." Come on, really?
Is Carnan a Majar? And since the Balrog is a Majur that would explain why his moves are swift
And the balrog isn't really a creature
No. Stop. You... you can't... you don't... Balrogs....you don't...you can't...you don't summon balrogs. They're either here or they have to sail.
in Tolkein's stories you have guys like Glorfindel or Gandalf fighting Barlogs by themselves with their own powers and weapons and win while in Shadow of War Thalion, even though he has a wraith,spirit and a walking mech like tree helping him in the fight he just end up barely scratching the Balrog!? disapointing indeed.
Good job Ash, picking grass against fire once again
I love the nemesis system with this game but I'm confused in how it builds up this side set of stories or relationships when in my game any time I encountered a named orc they would always die within the first or second encounter I had with them. Was I supposed to let them get away or kill me a few times to build up that "relationship" that I hear everyone talk about all the time?
A fused being of an Elf-lord wraith and a skilled undead-ranger -- WITH a ring of power... I'd say it's a pretty fair fight to pit him against a Balrog... Even Gandalf was able to solo a Balrog and he was hardly all that powerful himself. Sure it killed him to do so... but eh.
Also "No-one can tame a Balrog". Bitch, Morgoth isn't no-one.
I think we've seen the majority of the game now.
It would have been a lot cooler if you got to fight it David and Goliath style. The dynamic between a massive enemy like the balrog vs your character would be cool to see. Oh well. Still excited for this game.
2:22 Surely if anybody is a /shade/ too late, it's Celebrimbor, not Talion?
If you even watched the movies and read the lore behind Balrogs then you would know that just cause the beast is huge it's still able move swiftly. Also you can not compare this game to god of war as these games head in two different directions entirely. The story for shadow of Mordor I thought was well done, and left off with us wanting more and that is why we are getting shadow of war.
I'm 13 and good thing this balrog came with hints, slow-motion quick time events, glowing weak areas, and the ability to be killed with a few brain-dead button presses. Otherwise my mom would be calling this company for a refund!
The Balrogs in Silmarillion were pretty swift.
Why did talion not just ghost jump and shoot while his things gets fcked?