The Battle of May Island | Down the Rabbit Hole
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 ก.พ. 2025
- In the early 1900s, an experiment with submarine technology precipitates one of the most absurd events in naval history.
Patreon: / fredrikknudsen
Twitter: / fredintheknud
Music by Ryan Probert: / probecomposer
Graphics and Animation by Christopher "Arcaxon" Malouin-Monjaraz: / arcaxon
Violin by Anna Olsson: / annaolssonmusic
Saxophone by Naomi Sullivan: / naomisullivan9
Vocals by Rachel Nicholas: / _rachnicholas
Illustrations by DerEineSchwarzeRabe: / d_e_s_r
"It surely can't get any worse."
"Surely it can't get ANY worse."
"SURELY, IT CANNOT GET ANY WORSE."
"ARE YOU SERIOUS?!"
Perfect summary
"What's the worse that could-"
*after the massive pileup*
"You just had to say it..."
What a shitfest
Murphy's Law, my friend.
Holy clusterfuck that I had never even heard of before !
It was like watching 10 episodes of the Three Stooges all at once.
"A man aboard a ship who had seen M2 that morning casually asked if it was normal for submarines to dive backwards. He was told that it was not."
Jesus Christ.
This WWI Bruh moment brought to you by the letter K.
That’s one of the best parts of the whole movie.
@@Aaron-hf5or Genuine question, no secondary meaning behind it: are you Romanian?
The whole disaster is just one big, “but wait, it gets worse!”
It's like a massive highway pileup but in slow motion and more lives at stake.
For real. Two submarines sinking with no survivors, even way after the battle. This is fucked
I felt a bit of relief every time those animations showed the subs and ships narrowly missing each other... just for it to zoom back out and show MORE subs and ships racing directly towards each other. And it just kept happening.
The first part is a big
Fisher: But what if I do anywaaaay?
At least the Kamchatka wasn't present.
My great grandfather died in this tragedy. He was on k-17. His name was Thomas Jackson and his diary is in the Portsmouth naval museum. The part of the diary I have is mostly about his time in the Dardenelles. My grandfather, also called Thomas Jackson served in the navy (HMS Edinburgh WW2) and never found out what happened to his father apart from he died. Just wanted to say thank you for sharing this.
My heart goes out to you and your family mate. I hope this video gave you some comfort.
I thank you and your family for their service and sacrifices. Cheers!
@@silentotaku8 I thank you but I have never served. I’m proud to come from a family that served their country for generations and it’s them and countless others that deserve our thanks.
@@thomasjackson4059 I respect your modesty friend! I raise a mug in your honor and wish you a wonderful rest of the year, skål! (Cheers!)
@@silentotaku8 Cheers all round.
"Desperately, he gave the order to turn to starboard..."
Me, having watched Cost of Concordia: "I know where this is headed"
Vada a bordo, cazzo!
I see my fellow culturemen
“He cocks up at the worst possible moment”
"Wait, I've seen this trick before!"
No Schetinos on board these boats/subs, thank God.
"Smashing the Periscope with a hammer"
What a wild time to be alive
Early air combat was pilots throwing bricks at each others propellers, and firing pistols and sawed of shootguns at each other.
Maybe the most ironic thing you can say about WW1.
It's such an absurdly British tactic, too. "I say old chap, submarines are unsporting!"
It was like Submarine Polo
WW1 truly was a GREAT War 😎
Imagine being a survivor of this massacre. You’ve just gone through one of the most insane and hellish experiences of your life, witnessing your crew die around you, only to be told that you can never talk about it. And not only that, but you then have to watch silently for years as these machines which you know are faulty and dangerous are casually used to kill more of your fellow sailors just because the high command doesn’t want to admit it made a mistake.
They say one of the few things that can match the size of human stupidity is human arrogance
unimaginable and eternal horror, back then you had no resources to heal from that
the nine survivors saw their crew mates get disintegrated into pools of bloody water. i think i'd go crazy after seeing something like that.
Sounds a lot like modern-day companies.
And what do they do with these deathtraps instead of dismantling them immediately? They slap ridiculous modifications on them and continue their use.
"Put a big fuckin gun on it"
*sinks, entire crew dies*
"Now put a plane on it."
*sinks, entire crew dies*
The description of K6 finding no survivors in the water after K4 broke in half and sunk gave me chills. Imagine being the captain of K6, still reeling from the crash and processing what just happened, suddenly realizing that the whole crew is dead and he is responsible.
It wasn't even his fault, but I imagine he had an awful case of survivor's guilt after that and blamed himself for the accident. What an awful clusterfuck.
@@BigPuddin I dunno about that - obviously the poor visibility relieves him to some degree, but the lights on a ship are colour-coded by direction specifically so something like this usually wouldn't happen to a competent captain
Remember that the lights were pretty scheisse to begin with, being dim and shuttered, so maybe it took him a bit of time to realize what light it was.
@@Nero_Karel
@@stevemc01Seconding this. The design of the lights was extremely subpar for emergencies due to their directional nature. This was essentially a Swiss cheese model disaster, too many holes lined up.
@@Nero_Karel they were also shuttered so you would be able to see it from the impact angle.
I've made all of the animations you see in the video! The video had me doing research on each specific boat so I could represent them as accuratly as possible and lots of questions to Fred about if the movement I had just animated was correct. There is a wealth of WIP stuff and scrapped content which we might utilize for a future mistakes video. This video also was the first time I created a poster out of the Designs within the show(Will be on sale later). This video uses the most graphics and animations of any episode so far with 32 minutes and 48 seconds of animation over the entire 1 hour run time of this video.
I really do hope you all enjoy the video; as usual Fred, Ryan and I worked hard on the video!
thanks for making the episode that much better!
Great job
Sweet profile Pic!
@UCTarQzfJsGBVYHIn8Tap0NQ it was probably private and made public. Or he is a witch
You’re a god
it took me a while to realise this wasn't a bunch of backstory leading up to the battle of may island, this WAS the battle
Yeah same XD Probably why the monument puts the biggest quotation marks around the word Battle.
I was kind of expecting the germans to show up during the mess and just kill everybody.
"Battle"
The British Navy decisively battled with the Stupidity Empire. Stupidity won.
Thought therebwas gonna be redemption but ended just depressed
I've never been more stressed watching ovals narrowly miss each other.
And, horribly, NOT missing each other...
Watch Historia Civilis, and you can get emotionality attached to occasionally spinning squares and rectangles.
Ngl I almost cried watching the ovals plough straight through the dots
RIGHT IM SWEATING
I can't believe 104 dots were killed by THEIR OWN FLEET of ovals. Holy shit. I hope someone got fired for that blunder.
for those wondering why there aren't any new uploads, don't worry he's working on a video about EVE Online that's gonna be over five hours, which is why its taking so long to make. seeing how an hour long vid about an officially documented event like this one took him about 4 months to make, a five hour long one about an ongoing subject with a bunch of vague/untrustworthy info taking over a year is to be expected.
Oh sweet! Looking forward to it.
thank you!
Thanks
I’ve never been so excited for a TH-cam comeback. The Eve online rabbit hole will definitely take you on through the looking glass.
Excellent. I was worried.
My thoughts through the battle "Please, everybody, JUST STOP MOVING, PLEASE!"
especially at 41:21
Pretty much, had an old naval Leutenent Comander talk about CBDR ( we are on track to crash in layman) and he said the only thing you can do that is pretty much fool proof is slow down or stop.
@@Zombiewizard And then at 43:54 5th battle squadron arrived.
@@hiddenshadow2105 Insert Avatar narrator voice: "Everything was going to hell and then the 5th battle squadron showed up"
@@lyravain6304 Exactly.
K22: "WHAT THE HELL ARE YOU DOING?"
The Inflexible: Read ✓
I call this "The very Inflexible"
Operation: Tiger
Back then “hell” was a much harsher swear, too
Vibin
Everyone's got that friend.
"Ooof that was a close near-collision, I'm glad those guys made it through."
Fredrik Knudsen: "But wait, there's more!"
Your pfp describes the whole video perfectly.
*Pain.* Especially when K6 bisected K4. That was just....yeah...
Watchers: F**K!
"But this would not last"
I love it when people with last names like "Fisher" end up with titles like "Sea lord".
It's a hypothesis called nominative determinism, that people's names influence their area of work to suit their names
@@cobalttj6356my ex-wife's surname should have been Harlot
@@cobalttj6356 And as a proof of that theory, there's Robert James Fischer, the best Chess player of all time! 💀
"Want to hear about some TH-camrs?"
"Sure Fred."
"Want to hear about the Deep Blue AI?"
"Sure Fred."
"Want to hear about the Battle of May Island?"
"Anything goes, Fred."
"Yes, chef."
"Yes, chef."
Shitshow of any kind: **exists**
Fredrik: It's free real estate
Fred, the master of diverse topics
"Oh by the way, I play hurdy gurdy"
We love a well-learned king~
This is the naval equivalent of when you’re carrying a load of loose laundry and you drop a sock but when you bend down to pick it up three more articles fall and so on and so on until you’re forced to just drop the lot and throw everything back together again. Except people died.
You dont know my laundry room. RIP Horatio from apartment 3C, you will be missed
"Except people died."
Nearly as many as at the Pentagon in the September 11th attacks at that.
(102 deaths in the May Island incident, 125 at the Pentagon in the September 11th attacks)
Life hack #833: Put a towel on top of the dryer and put laundry on top of that. Pick the towel up by it's corners. Button up shirts can work too.
Now the sock needs a giant gun or a plane.
Few things inspire more dread than hearing Fredrick Knudsen say "however".
Good lord. You shits going down when he says that.
THE ILLUMINATI / CIA CREATE AN UNDETECTABLE MIND CONTROL SLAVE BOOK. (walk in the rain) on my channel :)
@@mysteriousknowledgetexts9809 Joke's on you, I can't read
@@ShermTank7272 Jokes on you, they probably can't even spell.
Its been 2 years since fredrik went insane studying eve online.
wut
he’s finally free from it
I haven't watched it yet but I intend to it's just a fucking beefy video
Can anyone tell me why I should even care about EVE online?
Id rather he did more historical ones like this or the wine poisoning.
So many youtubers copycot but with this guy its always something I never knew about.
@@Smokey298if you’re only wanting historic episodes, go for those. You’ve kind of answered your question though. You like this guys work because he tell about things you don’t know. Even if you never wish to play Eve online, the history that DTRH dives into is something real. The location isn’t earth but the people and events actually existed . It’s a marvelous work.
Imagine being cold in the water, stunned by the shock of the accident. The relief from seeing friendly ships, only to be sucked into propeller of your countrymen's ships. What a brutal way to go
This was truly atrocious to hear
fuuuuk dude
During WW2, on more than one occasion, Allied ships not only ran over friendly sailors but also dropped depth charges into the water with them to try and sink enemy submarines.
And since the Admiralty decided to bury this incident and keep it a secret tells me they lied to the families of those who died in this incident about how they died. That's a lot of lying and that lying successfully added another fucked up kink in this story. Sorry for swearing but seriously there are no other words.
@@Wildstar40
The death reports given to families in the two World Wars very rarely reflected what actually happened to their loved ones. It was seen as being kinder to report that they died quickly and doing something brave. See for example the letters scene in _Memphis Belle_ . All of those letters are real.
The amount of anxiety this is giving me is horrid, when I think "oh okay, now it's gotta end right?" Another ship appears and it keeps getting worse
Knudson: HOWEVER...
"Oh man i sure got lucky that this Destroyer missed me and didn't cut me into ribbo...
wait is that 5 more of them?"
Its like a trainwreck spanning multiple tracks and dozens of trains... except depending on the severity of the crash the trains will sink into the earth killing literally everyone aboard.
I absolutely love how the memorial places quotations around “Battle”
In a battle between Britain and Britain, britain lost
@@phoebe5 The history of Britain, in one sentence.
the battle of the Superiors ego and the sub mariners lives....
I never knew how important the Navaho Code Talkers where until watching this and seeing how hard communication really was. Speed and making sure your enemy couldn't understand you must have been a nightmare.
THE KING HAS RETURNED
Indeed he has.
I LOVE YOU DAD
oh hey matt
Ryan from supermega?
Real
I am Enraged that it took over SEVENTY YEARS for a memorial to be created for them.
Thank you for putting all of their names at the end, that means more than can be said in words.
Except for perhaps.. The words at the end of the video.
You know, the words with their names.
@@Jay22222 Oh Jack, leave Kelsey alone- they are Enraged with a capital E about a naval mishap that happened over 70 years ago. Actaully it was a 103 years ago- but neverless... why would anyone have an emotional connection with this?
@@matthewharper7333 Heaven forbid that someone criticises an institution for sweeping a tragedy under the rug to save face, and heaven forbid similarly that anyone has an emotional reaction to aforesaid tragedy, which took over 100 lives through misfortune and the incompetence of those at the top of the chain.
@@matthewharper7333 "Why would anyone have an emotional connection with this?" Well, perhaps because it was due to mistakes and arrogance of people in command and, in case you haven't noticed, the ones in command today in most if not all places where decisions weigh on life or death of others are also people. It's almost as if documentary about human flaws leading to massive amounts of easily preventable deaths 100 years ago may have some significance to us. It might be a shocking revelation to you, but mankind has not dramatically changed in the span of such a massively long time.
Sarcasm over.
@@MPSmaruj The majority of the mishaps were caused by poor military doctrine regarding new weapon platforms and fleet movement. The military is inherently dangerous. Even without enemy fire, men and equipment are pressed into unsafe situations that can, and will, cause death. In this case, 3 floatillas are moving close to one another at night and with limited visiablity due to fog. Communications, apperantly, are also limited. A strange equipment malfuntion, the steering jammed on one of the subs, began a series of accidents.
Upper level brass are arrogent and closed minded- but they have to be because of the very nature of command. They hear so many ideas about how things should be run from so many people promoting their own agenda that a decision has to be made and the commander has to be resolute. Things may go well and the results are ignored (for example, we don't hear about the movements of southern fleet in the video. They were sailing in the same weather but arrived at point without an accident) or lauded as a hero. Things may go poorly, such as this event or countless others (like Gen Haig, a few years earlier who thought machine guns were ineffective and had 20,000 of 60,000 men killed in a few min's when he ordered a frontal attack on the German lines. He would go on to rack up a 260,000 deaths of his own troops before relieved of command). While it's easy to crap on these bad decisions- a poor decision is still better than an irresolute officer.
For example, look at Gen Elphonstone, whose weak and irresolute character lead to the complete failure of the British army in Afganistan. Or, Gen McCellan who could have, arguably, ended the American Civil War in 1862 if he had counter-attacked Lee.
My points are- the military is a very dangerous occupation. Even in peacetime or not under enemy fire. Those in command don't have a way to see the future and decisions are mostly made in the dark. There are always compeating ideas and there is really no way of telling which one is the best. Because the men who make these decisions are responsible for them, they tend to go with their own ideas. "Make you own mistakes- not someone else's." To be resolute is better than not to be. The Battle of May Island was a series of accidents caused by bad luck, bad communications, and bad doctrine.
The saddest part of this whole affair is that the men aboard these submarines and ships were very talented sailors. Their quick actions stopped what could have easily been a much greater loss of life. But they were sealed in death traps; ticking time bombs. They were sent to their death by their incompetent superior officers, plain and simple.
It's not just incompetence, it's pure hubris.
Their higher ups refused to adapt to the changing times and the true methodology of warfare. Their refusal to break from their "one fleet" ideology, make death traps that were borderline impossible at the time and to an extent even today, and even after such a harrowing disaster, they refused to admit their defeat and would rather cover up their obvious mistakes then actually be punished for it.
If I even heard about this at the time, I would make sure EVERYONE knows about this; these men should have been held accountable while they were alive, and those who died should have had their loved ones told about what happened.
Absolutely. Some of those maneuvers were intensely skilled, but there is only so much that skill can do for you in those conditions. There was no reason for such a horrific tragedy like this. None whatsoever.
"This could have been worse" is a haunting thought
That and that none of the surviving sailors shot their admirals.
I think that's basically the entire First World War, especially for the British (at least in our cultural memory). "Brave men sent to death by incompetent superiors."
What's wild to me is that despite how much ocean the submarines could have covered and how they all kept changing course, their paths *still* kept intersecting perfectly by sheer chance
That has to be some of the worst luck in the history of man.
A deadly "battle" where not a single shot was fired and the enemy, hubris and poor choices, clearly won.
Not unheard of. during WW2 Germany lost to itself in an Aircraft/Ship engagement where both German sides confused each other for enemy.
depends if flares count
@Rafael Enriquez Thanks for the name of it. I only remembered the rough outline from Qxir's video on it.
It's almost like a real life Twilight zone episode.
@@arciks11 the royal navy also accidentally shot at each other during the chase of the Bismarck
Even though this is just 2D shapes and dots on a black background, I couldn't help but be absolutely horrified and aghast when the ships plowed straight through the men in the water, and seeing the other ship torn in half... the terror those poor men suffered, what a terrible way to die, and yet they weren't even properly honored because the higher ups were to proud to admit their fault.
Leaves more to the imagination, which in turn makes it scarier.
I know! I was groaning and saying "Oh my god!" throughout the entire video.
I literally kept yelling OH NO everytime one of them was about to hit the other lol
I got terrible chills
I know. Just knowing that the dots were people, even with such simple drawings it was horrific.
Someone: does something reasonable
Narrator: *However*
🤣🤣🤣
The k12 plowed into k14 which was rapidly followed by sharks with bees in their mouths and the Martians landing their flying saucer on k22. After some time the meteor struck.
@@informitas0117 🤣🤣🤣 sounds accurate
Narrator: "you have no power here I control how your story starts and ends."
@@informitas0117 And then, the fire nation attacked.
44:45 this to me has to be the worst part. One of the last ships barging through helpless overboard men and lifeboats, sucking some into its propellers. All because of bad visibility and communication. Tragic and absolutely horrific
German soldier: "Look, British Navy, let's attack them!"
German Captain: "Let's just wait a little bit to see what happens..."
Lol Royal Navy my ass
Yes lol Royal Navy my ass! 👌🏻
@@dante666jt yeah not like Britain was known for clapping every other country with its navy
I'm picturing in my head the captain saying "no no just wait this is gonna be good " But in a silly German voice.
What if they didnt notice and just heard a ton of breaking and lights and their just like "you hear that?"
I have said "Are you FUCKING kidding me!" at least 16 times and I'm only like, halfway in. Holy shit what a trainwreck. I feel absolutely horrible for everyone who lost their lives in this disaster.
What were your total?
Hey! Trains can't go in water. Only ships and subs do. More like a shipwreck.
I just keep saying “oh god no, oh god NO”
“Dude what the fuck?” Was mine.
How many times can a ship decide to steer port side to evade collision. Only to be met by chaos.
"What the hell are you doing?" Shouted the man who had just moments prior done PRECISELY the same thing
Just tag me next time bro
You know how road rage is fam
If you shouted that at me, then I would have no choice but to continue what I was doing *insouciantly*
Lol I thought that exact same thing
What the HELL are WE doing ?
Just does not have the same punch tbh
with names like "the fearless" and "the inflexible" this really sounds like some kind of ancient myth
I just imagine the German fleet watching this unfold from the distance and the observer deck guy going to his superior and saying: 'Günther, you're not going to believe this shit.'
“Should we destroy them?”
“Nah they seem to be doing a pretty good job of it themselves.”
“I feel lazy we don’t even have to do anything!”
@@siennahartle9069 "we couldn't do it better ourselves"
"Never distract your enemy when hes making a mistake."
- Günther probably
“i wish we brought the lawn chairs and popcorn.”
Apparently, one of the main factors that led to the end of the First World War was the Imperial German Navy going on strike.
that play-by-play was one of the most stressful things i've ever listened to
The use of music and sound effects in this video elevates the tension of this seaborn tragedy so much.
when those destroyers were encroaching on the survivors in the watermy mouth was agape in disbelief and anticipation of the horrifying event that was to come.
Smashing the periscope glass with a hammer is one of the funniest things I've heard in a while.
"I've got a multi million dollar warship."
"I've got a claw hammer from Victorian Harbor Freight."
funfact they also applys to space during the space race the russians made a laser pistol specifally ment for cosmonauts to point blank shot america satiletes solar pannels to destroy them
@@wilmagregg3131 and launching the 30mm cannon from a BMP on a satellite
This kind of shit is what I worry about with the modern navy. Ffs, hitting modern radars is as easy as hitting the broad side of a barn, and I doubt that they are armored.
@@userequaltoNull The solar panels are covered in thick plates of steel to protect them.
Had I been alive back then, I would have volunteered to be a 'smash-lad' and would have done it naked. Could you imagine the German's befuddlement peering through a periscope in the open ocean only to see a naked man with a hammer smashing your periscope lens? 'Un Gott in Himmel, Franz, I'm going mad.'
I absolutely "loved" this, the research, script, animation and music all work so well together bringing us a haunting history dive into a disaster of arrogance, poor design, incompetence, communication problems, and a little bit of bad luck, all spilling into a cauldron of terrible weather conditions to bring about one the worst disasters in naval history.
Great work! Truly amazing work to everyone involved.
I think the main takeaway I get from this is that night-time naval missions before radar were fucking suicidal. Even just going back and forth in the mist could result in death with no ability to know where other ships were. Something that just would never happen after this era.
My other takeaway from this is that most suffering of workers/soldiers come from the disconnected hubris of upper management. The unfortunate fact of war is that human lives are a resource to use and take away, but these admirals are so far removed from the war that they gamble away lives like a playboy just for the sake of proving they’re right. I’m not a war buff, but I think it’s also a huge mentality of the Great War, just throwing people at a barbed wall like a subtraction game, while the aristocrats of countries lie in comfort since “die” is a 3 letter word.
Germany: "Great job sinking an entire fleet on your own!"
U-boats: "Huh?"
Uh.. yeah! It was a one in a million shot, but we me managed to pull it off!
Some fisherman: "So is it normal for submarines to dive backwards?"
The royal navy: "WHAT⁉️"
"Did you say *BACKWARDS* ??!!"
Well... British. So, "....I beg your pardon?"
"well, normally submarines... wait.. did you say backwards!?"
(spits out their tea)
"The Australia, The New Zealand, The Indomitable and The Inflexible"
This sounds like a bit in a comedy act, not a retelling of history.
An Australia, a New Zealand, an Indomitable, and an inflexible sail into fog...
New Zealand’s captain wore Maori war gear during the battle for good luck.
I was on the dive team you mentioned at the start who discovered the final resting place of the wrecks after the Battle of May Island. From my back porch I can see the site from here.
This was an engineering disaster, not a naval one. "Too many damn holes", as one account goes.
Worth noting as you mention in the last few minutes - nuclear powered submarines, including the V-boats where I served in the Royal Navy, are also steam powered. They just don't need coal.
Right idea, wrong time.
Respect to those who served upon these widow makers.
This is why I always come back to vids I watch, even years later. Sometimes, the people involved, who are unknown or not popular, show up and share some extra/specific info.
I LOVE knowing slightly more than others on various things. ^_^
The engineering wouldn't have been so disastrous if not for naval leaders demanding these ships be created to their exact specifications. Seemingly misunderstanding how these ships would work in practice, and regardless of the concerns many engineers raised. This is not how to spark competent innovation. Often they would simply replace concenered engineers with others who would do it, and were deterred from asking questions. Essentially telling engineers to just get it done, and figure it out somehow. They made these decisions without any understanding of how these ideas would be implemented, or their functionality at sea.
Due to the nature of the war, wanting to gain an advantage quickly. These projects were rushed aswell, to a point where serious design flaws were not noticed until it was far too late. The ones that were noticed only had superficial fixes. They did not keep many well working ships from previous years British crews knew how to navigate well as back ups, preferring to scrap them in order to start a new. The technicalities weren't being considered heavily enough by naval leaders, and they were too stubborn to see how unreasonable their demands actually were.
The navy also disregarded opinions of skilled sailors telling them these ships were unmanageable, and there were too many issues with the limitations of communication technology at that time. I'm not saying the engineering isn't at fault, but the navy also played a key role in how this tragedy came about. They are both responsible for what happened to those ships, and the crews aboard them.
This was a disastrous blunder by the navy as naval leaders continuously made poor, ill informed decisions. Stuck by them despite the obvious, and severe problems. Then once something truly horrifying happened, costing the lives of many. They tried to cover it up rather than take any accountability, or confront the families of those who needlessly died. Their actions were not innocent in this. The navy had many many opportunities to prevent such an incident, but they opted to ignore them. Utterly cruel, and embarrassing behavior.
These subs weren't running on coal, they were running on heavy fuel oil. The problem was the preheaters needed to make it a liquid before it could be used. And the problems here weren't anything to do with engineering, they were to do with violations of proper procedure and driving a squadron of large vessels into an approaching fleet without any idea if it knew they were coming. Without that, this was a minor collision with two casualties.
@@EmoLozer500 ^This
You can't fault an engineer if he's forced to design something against their judgement because someone higher on the command chain forced them to do so. As a Geological Engineer, the times I've heard stories of colleagues who had to leave good paying jobs in the Geotechnical/Civil engineering field because the one putting the cash tried to force them to build something against regulations/plain proven science facts that would go against the structure integrity and therefore the lives of the people using such structure is too damn high to not be concerning.
Most of the times is exactly as you said, first you raise the issue to your boss and then they either ask for other options that can cut corners while still being legally "safe enough" or they just straight up force you to retire and then find someone willing to do the job/dirty their hands for a quick buck. It's actually sickening how some people play with other people's safety/lives just to save some money because they made a bad investment/didn't care from the start.
@@chonchjohnch
No, what's being said is that the "steam" part isn't the problem, it's that the power source was boilers burning heavy fuel oil. That was what caused all the issues.
The instant he mentioned that the British thought steam engines would work for submarines I knew some next-level bullshit was about to go down.
“chugga chugga boom drown”
Ehhh im no engineer but that sounds pretty messed up idea.
@@d.aardent9382 it seems forever go down in history as one of those instantly recognisable bad ideas like the steam powered aircraft and the nuclear powered train
Oh and that nuclear-powered bomber the Americans tried making that one time
they woulda been better off ramming them like they did everyone else
Unreal
The German U Boats just decided to make some popcorn and watch this shit show for their entertainment
"Hans?"
"Jawohl?"
"Double sauerkraut rations for the boys. We have a show tonight"
it was really fucking dangerous to get close anyway
It was Joseph Joestars submarine
I'm sure they were lol. Jesus Christ, Britain. What happened? Thought you guys were the masters of the sea?
@@TheDeadAlewives ya they are. On it. not under it.
The scale of this clusterfuck is incredible, all happening in excruciating slow motion. Absolutely gripping.
Willie D much?
Lions led by donkeys.
😆that is exactly the right classification, a munsta CLUSTERFUCK.. great piece of history, me as an old signalman comms , dutch navy submarines, know what manouvring technics came after this.. NATO created some great uniformity
Can you imagine the ptsd from that
@@benwadley3163 I wouldn't even want to imagine the PTSD from this. It would be horrible.
Give your music editor a raise. They're doing a great job! All of the ambient sounds and the way the music speeds up as the tension increases show someone who really knows what they're doing :D
This takes “a series of unfortunate events” to a whole nother level
Lemony Snicket wrote this battle.
I have never been so intensely enthralled by a couple of black and white lines slowly moving past each other. Amazing work!
Not funny shut up
Sometimes some abstract demonstrations and your imagination is more than enough to give a terryfying image.
Now that could be a YT channel. Just some dude who loves naval battles and is willing to go through them frame by frame with black/white visuals overlayed.
@@jacobstallard2678 try drachinifel
@@Arvidus89 Look up "the first metal of honor ever recorded" if you have never seen it before.
Between this and Internet Historian's the Cost of Concordia, I am staying on dry ground as God intended.
both ships were cursed by the number 13. but i agree with you
Dunno, maybe Poseidon is feeling angry that navies have forgotten him.
Read The Atlantic article on the Estonia, if you want a really bad night in.
Then I'd better not going to tell you about Drachinifel's channel.
It's why they wrote the Sea Chanty:
♪Ye gentlemen of England♪
♪Who live home at ease,♪
♪It's little do you think♪
♪Of the dangers of the seas;♪
I don't know why but now I want Fredrik Knudsen to just voice more war documentaries just cause his voice has that feeling of tension that is perfect for them.
“If a U-boat came now, there was no telling how many lives would be lost”
The U-boats: haha they crashed into each other again
@Ebola U-Boats: (Rise up) "Heheheheh- eh-" (Sees this unfolding) "......." (Proceeds to dive down again)
If a U-boat saw this, they’d be more afraid that a random British submarine would accidentally ram them too
@@ElPresidenteofTropico84
*Proceeds to dive backwards*
The uboat crews were eating popcorn while watching
Uboat captains had a record of showing up and helping the crew they just sank. But I'd avoid this clusterfuck if I were them.
The moral here is simple: if you’re going to make a mistake make sure it’s a huge one so you can keep your job
@T teg Egg Too big to fail.
If you're going to F something up, do it so badly they put your name in the history book.
Corollary: If you're high enough to make a huge mistake, there is none above you to fire you.
Ego >> Everything
If you're doing something wrong, just keep telling everyone you're doing the right thing.
-Might as well be a quote by Matt Hancock, current Secretary of State for Health and Social Care for the UK; still in government nearing 4 months after being declared to have acted unlawfully by a High Court judge in regard to contracts worth hundreds of millions of pounds.
EDIT: Deleted a duplicate post that somehow occurred.
The word "arrogance" seems to pop up a lot in The Great War.
It really was so critical. Dan Carlin's Hardcore History series on WW1 goes into it in fantastic detail. Politics and arrogance abound.
@@eddedmonds5753 “just run at the machine gun nest, it’s going to work at some point”
The only thing to match human ingenuity is human arrogance, after all.
A lot of Europe's generals were around the end of rank and file combat and were members of the upper class
That's what's it was all about
I don't think I've ever felt sick when hearing how personnel -of any disaster- died. I think it feels so awful because of just how much of a perfect storm everything was. Imagine being on one of the boats that sailed through the survivors, and learning later that you mowed through a bunch of your own comrades. I almost hope they never learned of what happened since they didn't mean to harm anyone.
Sub: *Already dives backward sometimes*
Admiralty: *G U N*
"Sir, these ships are terrible."
Admiralty: "Put a big gun on it lol."
@@CarrotConsumer "Sir, it's gotten worse"
Admiralty : "You're right... Put a plane on some of them instead so they can't dive"
Ship too heavy to work properly? Put big gun. Still no work? Put plane hangar.
@@CarrotConsumer
I've said this elsewhere, but Fred got that wrong. The M class weren't K class refits, they are a novel design. Most obviously, they didn't have a steam engine.
@@CruelestChris that somehow makes it worse. Because not only did they get one submarine obscenely wrong, they got two
Can't help but wonder how many other disasters like this haven't been disclosed yet.
Mutsu's 3rd Gun Battery is a Good Example
I would say, many. Probably many on a smaller scale, but still, many.
Many.
The more I write and look at the word 'many', the stranger it looks.
A-4 Incident
Not really on the same scale, but I just feel like more people should be aware of the fact a nuclear warhead is currently at the bottom of the Philippine Sea...
I can only imagine all the messed up "top secret" shenanigans going on. The amount that gets leaked only to be covered up or thrown in the mud as a "conspiracy theory".
I have no trust in the deep state or any government bureaucracy. Psychopaths will do anything for power.
Shit dude. The world monitary system is built off of debt and death.
Maybe I should learn how to become ignorant and optimistic again....
@@facepalm5134 once you have the burden of knowledge you cannot turn back
this made me think about how no matter how comically, absurdly ridiculous something seems in fiction, something much more horrifying and insane has happened in real life (and almost always due to the negligence and arrogance of those in power). what a tragic loss of life in a surreal set of events that could have been avoided if their superiors cared about them at all.
I was just talking about exactly this recently, watching true crime stories a lot. The horrors in movies don't even compare to things that have really happened.
Just another reminder for people why you never blindly follow "the experts". This is an accurate depiction of "the experts" in most cases - people who just sort of think they know what they're doing and probably don't, and if they mess up it doesn't effect them personally.
@@emeryltekutsu4357 I've met some "Experts" myself, just a bunch of overconfident, narcissistic assholes covering their backsides. Blind trust never leads you to the right path.
Fiction has to be believable for it to be successful; reality doesn't.
@sagekaley@ I know what you mean, Sage. Many Generals, Admirals and the like, haven't paid anywhere close to enough attention to the welfare of their troops and sailors. Yet, in this case, Fred remarks quite early on in the video that this particular Sea Lord, Sir John Fisher, was of a different stripe from that unfortunate norm.
Fisher attempted to revolutionise the British Navy in the time of his power, 1904-1910 and then briefly from Oct. 1914 until May 1915. One example of his concern for his sailors, Sage, was to improve rations across the board. For instance, instead of their normal daily supply of "hardtack", he insisted that they be fed fresh bread, baked aboard the ship. Here's a description of hardtack;
"And, as it had been for thousands of years, hardtack remained a staple. The British Royal Navy began mass-producing hardtack in the mid-17th century. The recipe was flour, salt, and water. To make it last on a long voyage, they removed all the moisture, sometimes baking it four times. Sailors referred to these unpalatable but sustaining sea biscuits as “molar breakers.” They soaked them in tea or brine to make a sort of mush.
Accounts of life at sea describe sailors rapping their hardtack, a/k/a “worm castles” on the table or deck to knock the weevils out of it.
The cook wasn’t a regular position, either. Instead, whatever injured crew member was unfit for regular duty was assigned to feed the hungry masses. Considering what their culinary skills might have been explains why shipmates coined the phrase, “God made the vittles, but the devil made the cook.”
Apparently, hardtack was frequently infested by biscuit beetles (oh, yummy, my favourite)!
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Fisher,_1st_Baron_Fisher
Wishing you all the best ... Dave
"the difference between fiction and reality is that fiction has to make sense" Tom Clancy
Never have I wailed "NO" so repeatedly
England really is the only country where your official title could be "Sea Lord"
Britain *
@@Gimmers18 shut up
@@Gimmers18 **GREAT britain
@@EvatronX The United Kingdom*
@@EvatronX Britain
K17 "We're damaged, and sinking, but all crew have survived."
HMS Warspite "Not on my watch you don't."
*plows through men in water*
She really lived up to her name, didn’t she?
But it wasn't the Warspite but the destroyers screening her
the screening destroyers sweeping over the men fleeing k-17 sounded terrifying, honestly. i cant imagine how any of those 9 men coped with living after that, the survivors guilt must have been intense
If this wasn't kept secret for so long we could have asked them.
It's a real shame this didn't perform as well as his videos about lolcows or videogame scams. I loved the visuals, and his enthusiasm about this event really sells it.
Because videos about lolcows are better. Other people have covered this better and in less time
@@aydon1276 why are they better?
Not nearly as many people want to hear about awful horrible war attrocities
@@aydon1276 'They aren't
@@aydon1276 Thanks for your highly subjective opinion.
I would’ve laughed harder at the “is it usual for submarines to dive backwards?” if 60 men hadn’t died
With the buildup and the horror of the previous shit, I felt a chill of terror and horrific realization when he said that
Harder?
God, 60 lives just burnt away for the sake of avoiding embarrassment.
NIGHT AND LOVE
@@Intestine_Ballin-ism YES!! you have a great taste in music my good sir
The use of sound effects, animation, and music in this documentary is sublime.
The information alone is an excellent detailing of a tragedy caused by foolish pride and stubbornness, combined with a variety of costly mistakes.
But the audio backing to the video side just works so well to enhance the mood and tone of this.
my only criticism would be that he should have made the ships more distinguishable. i found it a bit hard to tell them apart at times and had to rewind to understand what was happening.
Someone needs to get an award for the audio work, it's that good.
The music reminds me Jonny Greenwood’s composition for the movie, “There will be blood”, absolutely amazing audio work
I head him on a podcast say how he has someone doing sound for him who literally goes through and will change volume of the backing track to match narration, etc. Knudsen was smart to get this persons help and this person is crazy good!!
The soundtrack was great. Reminded me of a subdued Christopher Nolan movie soundtrack.
"...the price of this self-assuredness would be paid, not by those in command, but by those serving..."
A great deal of British history in a nutshell.
More like "in a k-class submarine"
Well, that's how war works: The peons on the forefront pay for it all. Doesn't matter if the cause is justified or not, whether your side is attacker or defender, or anything else. The common soldier will take it in the shorts
That is the history of ALL war....
The really mind-blowing thing is that most of Britain's enemies were worse.
More like most history tbh
Holy crap this needs a movie. Seriously, the suspense and the horror is insane.
Every time you think it couldn't get worse - "But wait! Here comes another ship!"
I’m really glad that you choose to cover topics and events that particularly interest you, as opposed to trending rabbit holes that hundreds of channels are already talking about or giving in to your fans’ requests. It makes these mini-documentaries all the more special, interesting and fun to watch, and full of great attention to detail.
It also means that for many of us, it's almost a sure guarantee to learn something new every time.
Plus who doesn't love a good history documentary
@@randomtinypotatocried Good history documentary read in good voice.
Exactly. One of the dumbest comments I ever read was someone suggesting that he go down the Paul brothers rabbit hole. What is there left to say? Has nobody heard of them? Anyway,I love Fredrik going for stuff I know I've likely never heard of or had any interest in.
His interesting (if a little autistic) dives into things may bore and irritate some, but I find them (mostly) fascinating.
The hurdy-gurdy was a stinker, but that's just like.. my opinion, man.
Keep up the unpredictability, I say.
May I just say, Ryan Probert knocked the music absolutely out of the park. The music adds so much to the story telling of the video
UMMM no its intrusive
Ok pimp, time to post a new 3 hour video that I can listen to a dozen times while working.
He's working on a 6 hour long one
The very definition of a clusterfuck, this was painful to listen to, can't even begin to imagine what it could have been to live it.
I would argue the only reason it's called a "battle" is to sound more dignified than the series of unfortunate events it truly was
@@vangobango7627 agreed
With all the eerie in this video, that line at 53:01 is somehow the most chilling. "Is it normal for submarines to dive backwards?", presumably asked innocently to an officer. I'm imagining the frightening pause and cold spike of realisation, that something horrible may have just happened.
Yo wtf first
Wow, check mark and everything lol
Can we expect more Silent Hunter III streams coming soon after this?
Womble has good taste. The only other comment I've seen from him is on a Jim Can't Swim video.
If it was in a video game, Cyanide would somehow do it.
"Dismantled for her metal" was the only good thing that happened in this story, jesus
Imagine having to be the guy to clean and salvage the turbines the men fell into..oh god..
@@asneakylawngnome5792 he probably had PTSD after looking at those turbines.
@@asneakylawngnome5792 Probably felt similar to the guys cleaning up tank crew remains out of the damaged tanks. Horrible.
"He believed that if a ship could move and shoot fast enough, it wouldn't need defense."
manses was using video game logic.
Bro went for the glass cannon build
@@XXXTENTAClON227 da shin akuma ship
If the Battlecruisers hadnt been used as intended they could have been much more sucessful.
Zarathustra spake and he said “Gaze thee not into the abyss. Lest the abyss gaze into thee and ask “Is it normal for submarines to dive backwards?” And judge thee empty.”
Well played there.
underrated comment
Absolutely splendid
What? Nietzsche for God's sake. Thus Spoke Zarathustra is the name of the book. Why are so many people upvoting an embarrassing misquote?
@@SwitchTF2 I was hoping no-one would notice that the gaze ye not into the abyss wasn’t said by Zarathustra. Zarathustra is a character in Thus spake Zarathustra. But you’re right that the abyss quote is not from that book. I was only having some fun and hope you don’t find it to big a deal. Seeing as Zarathustra was a semi author insert character for the guy who said the abyss quote.
Man, it’s one thing to die in war, but dying in such a needless way is so depressing.
It’s really all needless
"dying in such a needless way"
WW1 In a nutshell
Operation tiger I think it was called. When the allies in ww2 were field dressing the d-day beach landing in the English southern coast. The flotilla of men cargo ships and men in Higgins landing boats were mistaken for an enemy landing force and shot at. Many numbers were killed and injured. It was buried because it was a week before June 6th and for secrecy.
The whole war was needless, the main leaders were all fucking cousins, since they all shared Victoria as their grandma.
dying in war is already pointless. you die for the politicians, who refuse to talk like normal people until thousands are needlessly killed
Knudsen’s docs are getting more and more cinematic. Amazing how his content has evolved.
That was straight up incredible. Unnerving, well-narrated, well scored, brilliantly scripted. More importantly, I had no idea about this forgotten bit of history. Those poor men-like hell on Earth. I discovered you on The Official Podcast. Bravo, liked and subbed. Thank you.
Yet submarines are boats not ships
There has never been an event that more accurately represented the term “cluster fuck.”
Imagine casually asking if it was normal for a submarine to dive backwards and being told no.
Did he mean diving while going in reverse or diving stern first?
@@KlaxontheImpailr Presumably the latter.
I'm watching ovals slowly slide around black screen and yet I feel like I'm gonna pass out.
This video is a masterpiece
Not since the WingsOfRedemption video have I so raptly watched a diagram
haha right?? how is it so fucking tense, they're just like lil toys fuckin around and i feel queasy
The little dots are my favorite part of the animation.
The horror of watching the ovals run over the little dots.... god.
This is such an underrated episode i was enthralled and so was my roommate just threw it up on the tv one day and bam hes a fan
Amazing story.
From what I counted, the K-class had a kill-death ratio of something like 0 to 300, and all the deaths were self-inflicted!
Cool. Now give Lance the blueprints.
The man, the legendary Matt Roszak. Always a big fan of yours Epic Battle Fantasy series. Thank you Matt,
The sheer amount near misses gets overshadowed by just how bad the actual collisions were.
I'm 18 minutes in but I wanted to comment on the fact that the British Royal Navy probably advanced submarine development by showing exactly how *not* to build a submarine. Like they practically invented new ways for stuff to go wrong.
Its like Onision helping literature class since English teachers use his books as examples on how *not* to write a story.
Yeah cuz see I had thought it would probably be good for subs to dive into the ground nose first but thanks to the British navy I now know that's not good
@Astolfo Desu What makes you think British Submarines were any better than German ones?
The thing is most of what's in the early part of the video not only isn't true but is the complete opposite of the truth. The British started the war with the largest submarine fleet in the world (76 compared to Germany's 28, including 16 long-range patrol subs), pioneered diesel submarines, and by the end of the war had the first hunter-killer submarines in service. Fischer was actually a proponent of submarines. The issue with the K Class was that they were literally the only solution to a demand for a surface speed of 21 knots: even at the end of the war the fastest subs with diesel engines (British J Class) could only manage 19.
We all miss you Fredrik Knudsen hopefully your hiatus comes to an end and we can get more rabbit hole videos!
"Klaus are we ever going to take a shot at these Brits?"
"I... I really don't think we need to."
"Drive us in close, Klaus. Lets give them a handicap."
"Sir they have fired a torpedo- impact is imminent!"
*dud*
"Well. There is their handicap. Set course back to Germany, Klaus."
"Well we could just tell the Kaiser we were the ones who did it."
@@BloodfelX lol are you making this up or is this from something
@@ASAPShitPost Based on the incident mentioned in the video where the only time a K-Class came in contact with a U-Boat it hit it with a dud torpedo.
5 minutes in: oh this seems interesting
20 minutes in: haha this is gonna be wild
35 minutes in: damn this is going terribly
45 minutes in: holy shit this is hell god has abandoned us
Very true
That's the magic of Fredrik Knudsen for ya
Let's get deeply invested in something I didn't know two minutes ago
After this, look up the battle of Ramree island. They were all devoured by gators.
@@PunishedNegativeZer0 goddamn you. There goes the rest of my morning. Two or three more islands and my whole day is fucked.
@@mariaquiet6211 So I shouldn't tell you about:
Cargo Cults: islands with indigenous people that worship planes like gods because they used to drop supplies on the islands
Helligo Island: one of the largest non-nuclear explosions of all time
Anthrax island: an island used to test anthrax as a biological weapon
Jekyll Island: a self governing island located a small distance off georgia
This is what "Down The rabbit hole" culture looks like.
@@PunishedNegativeZer0 Lol I'm gone... goodbye world...
Hope you return, and I hope all is well! 2023 is around the corner!
Few things strike as much fear into me as the thought of sailing on a WW1-era submarine. The claustrophobia, the helplessness in case anything goes wrong, the likelihood of dying in the most horrible ways. I'm sure I'm not alone in that.
I feel you but I'd much rather be one those than on a civil war submarine
Have you heard of cartel subs lol
Mining is possibly scarier to me.
For me it would be being a fighter or bomber pilot, now I imagine that for both subs and planes it helps for the crews to be more cavalier than most anyone else on the planet but still, having to deal with rampant snobbish and bigoted bullshit from people over you throwing your lives away for their own sake of pride alongside the high risk of casualty
Dude I'd be terrified of riding in a submarine now, I cant imagine the sheer dread
So when I first started watching this I was like "alright, they're gonna mistake the K classes for U boats and start shooting at them". I don't think I possibly could have predicted the true incompetence that took place that night
Im right there with you bro.
Lol that's what I thought too.
Only problem being that the real incompetence took place not on that night, and hundreds of kilometers away - in headquarters
The fleet wasn't incompetent, the situation itself was a disaster while they were forced to follow orders from the real incompetent people
Name one mistake you wouldn't have made in this situation without the benefit of hindsight
"Hello sir? Yes, I've changed my mind. I'd like to go to the trenches."
My sides man. You can‘t do me like that
Seriously
“you do realize organization and leadership is just as incompetent out there as well right?”
@@D00000T"I'd rather not drown in a field exercise sir."
An least you won't need to worry about being runover buy your own warships.
for anybody wondering: his next video will be about EVE Online, and (according to his twitter) it will be out in August
Even though the visual focus being mostly on the step-by-step event timeline might not seem as dramatic at first, it was absolutely crucial for the understanding of the chaotic series of events and its relative starkness, combined with the narration and haunting music, created a great, eery atmosphere.
Amazing documentary, great work by everyone involved in the project. I'll be sure to watch this again and again.
Seems downright cynical to call this a "Battle", but you described the nature of the military at that time in a way that makes this plausible enough.
Even though I can't think of an example off the top of my head, friendly fire incidents are very commonly referred to as battles.
It was genuinely suspenseful seeing the ships approach one another. Never has the overlapping of PNG images been so intense.
honestly the dark background and eerie music almost made you feel like you were in a dark ocean during a foggy night
scary stuff
I started squirming in my seat when the destroyers started approaching the survivors, holy shit. This is horrifying.
This is like one of those videos of cars slowly sliding into each other on an icy day, except it's at sea with fog and it's brutal and very unfunny.
It was specifically like the video of that big 70 car pile up in Iowa. You think it's over and people are fine but it all gets worse. There are semi trucks scrapping out and sliding off the road, one even followed another in drifting between cars and both continued on their way like true pros like nothing happened. But then people start getting off their stranded cars and the vehicles coming behind hit the people walking in the snow or other cars and smush them into paste. Some cars try to go off the embankment to get out of the way of the ones still sliding behind but at the same time vehicles coming behind swerve off the road right into their side. Notably, much like in this case with the battleships and cruisers, the biggest trucks managed to avoid crashing into people due to being the only professionals there, likely saving lives. The one big vehicle that hit a car was a double decker travel bus that hit a minivan and sent it flying into the incoming traffic.
@@LuizAlexPhoenix I did not know this was a thing, but the description already makes me sick.
This was an Excellent mostly forgotten historical documentary. I have watched thousands of history documentaries & this is on of the best I’ve watched. Simple but very detailed & entertaining. I don’t know if you still make videos like this anymore but sure hope you do more.