This video is an experimental change in format. Quite a few people have commented that they would prefer the machining footage without background music. Others have said they enjoy the music. This video has music at the beginning and end only. I recorded another version with full orchestral accompaniment available at the link below. If you prefer videos with music, please watch the alternative version instead, and let me know in the comments which you prefer. I promise to read all feedback, but I'll also pay close attention to how many people watch the alternative version, and whether they watch the whole video. th-cam.com/video/7Ln4mb8Brdc/w-d-xo.html
I'm late to the party but prefer no music. I prefer hearing the machine and the cutting tool, they tell me about something that can't easily be put into words.
I’m a new machinist as a retirement rehabilitation from a 10 year cancer/transplant battle. I watch a great number of machining videos, and particularly enjoy both your filming with narration style, and most especially your problem solving. You are highly motivational!
Thanks for going with the no music format, get tired of the videos that have it all the way through. It’s nice to hear what’s happening. Thanks again and please keep sharing your videos.👍
Excellent video with good explanation as to and why each move is made. Thanks also for leaving in the little accident so the rest of us don't think such things only happen to them!
Thanks, really glad you have enjoyed watching. Since I started the channel I've become such toolmaking adict. :) I love the feeling of constantly building a more capable set of tools, along with improving the skills that went into making them.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe i own a small lathe myself so I can empathise with your situation. Its not as nice as your proxon though (chinese mini lathe). Thanks so much for doing what you do and thanks even more for sharing it with us
It's a pleasure to see how you are solving problems and in the end accomplish what you intended to make. Everytime watching a video of you I'm learning! Thanks!! Ronald Veraart The Netherlands
I came dangerously close to failing on this project. I was very lucky not to wreck the part when I crashed the parting tool. I'm very happy to know you find my videos educational, but make sure you also learn from real machinists like Abom79 and Keith Fenner. My technique is amateurish, and full of bad habits. ;) Keep watching!
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe I'm late to the party with this comment but I'd add several others to your list - Tom Lipton, for example - and in particular for small and precise stuff Robin Renzetti and Stefan Gotteswinter are unbeatable in my opinion.
@@cooperised Thanks for the suggestion. Tom (oxtoolco), Robin (robrenz), and Stefan are channels I follow religiously, and they have the best material out there, but I don't usually suggest them to beginners wanting to learn the basics. I should also make an addition to my suggested list above. Keith Rucker is really great for patiently stepping through all the details involved in setting up for a machining operation, in a way that I found easy to follow as a complete newbie. Abom is similar, especially with his older videos about larger heavier machining. I didn't know enough to understand what Tom, Robin and Stefan were even talking about until I had a couple of years of hobby work under my belt.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Fair enough! I've been watching them all since I was an armchair machinist, and I guess I learned to comprehend the content gradually, like immersing yourself in a foreign language. For beginners though Quinn Dunki (blondihacks) and This Old Tony have some wonderful content, plus of course the vast back catalogue of Mr. Pete (tubalcain). I'm very much enjoying your content too, having found it only recently, so thanks!
Great job! That green Loctite is some good stuff, we used to use it to hold in bushings that re-lined the bores of hi-pressure hydraulic cylinder blocks of hydrostatic pumps and motors... 3000 psi working pressure was the norm for those units!
Thanks! The Loctite certainly worked well. I was worried it might not be strong enough against the torque needed for thread cutting, and I tried to work out a way to pin the two parts together, but the hardness of the steel made it difficult.
Hi folks. One thing with most inserts is that they are made with a small radius on the cutting edge. They were developed for use in really heavy duty lathes designed for ripping stock off very quickly. Commercially these days most items would be brought to final size on some form of grinder - it's faster and cheaper than doing it all on the lathe. High Speed steel tooling can be brought to a very sharp edge. Hardened work pieces are a problem. You could anneal it, turn it to size and then case harden again. Or you can do what was done here ....BobUK.
If I may offer some advice, chamfer your holes before you ream them to avoid having to file the burrs. Adding a chamfer before you tap a hole seems to make starting the tap easier.
Great job and a nice solution to a 2 stage gear combo, lets see how the loctite fares, if it fails you can always peg the gears with small countersunk screws. Cheers Peter
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed the video. I've cut a test thread with no problems so far, so I'm optimistic. With the bushing, the Loctite is holding in three different directions, so I'm hoping it'll hold. If not, I have to work out how to get screws through hardened steel. :)
Adventures with a Very Small Lathe. The steel is case harden isn’t it, well tap the aluminium and grind a dimple through the hardening then drill / countersink. Cheers for Christmas Peter
Thanks for sharing. And Thanks for showing your mistakes like not applying loctite to the entire surface of the bushing so the joint failed on turning and not tightening the 3 jaw enough on the holding ring. Errors are as important as successes while i am learning. i agree that no music while turing is the right background for a machining video. the squeal you hear while turning is chatter and will leave marks on the surface. slow down the surface feet per minute to eliminate it if that is possible. I know with a small lathe and limited power that may not be possible.
Good to know! I'm pretty sure I'll keep making at least some mistakes, and I'll make sure I keep including them in the videos. I've now settled on a video style that has no music during the machining, so you can depend on me doing that from now on.
That was very impressive. I would not have thought to bind two gears together with Loctite. That will hold an elephant -- until it gets hot, in which case it will let go. But sitting at the back of the lathe it will not get too hot. Should work. I would not have thought of buying RC parts, either. And I like the Proxxon lathe more and more. It is bigger than my lathe. I also have made careful note of your slit-pipe clamp rings. I love the music, so put me on the love-the-music list.
I thought about using a pin, or retaining screw to hold them really firm, but the hardness of the steel gear made threading seem implausible, and drilling for a taper pin also very tricky, so I figured I would see if the Loctite alone was enough. I love my Proxxon very much, though I do sometimes yearn for something a bit bigger. I think some machinists refer to the holding rings as box chucks, but I wasn't certain enough of the terminology, so settled on the descriptive name.
I offer a helpful tip, use brazed carbide and high speed tool bits ground by you to various configurations for best results in the type of machining you are doing. You will be pleased with the results and the economy. CPM Rex 76 and Rex 49 are examples of high speed alloys. Momax and Tungalloy are also good. Hardinge can provide various brazed carbide tools for turning boring and threading. "T" type cut off blades are also a way to go for manual machining. These tools mentioned are free cutting compared to carbide inserts and of course much cheaper. All can be sharpened offhand with the right grinding equipment. Make an effort to study tool geometry and you will see superior results compared to the expensive inserts. In my opinion the inserts have their place in CNC machining with programed feeds and speeds. I enjoyed your video and can tell you are willing to think outside the box. I speak from 50 years of owning a production machine shop. JIM
Well done and enough to get my subscription. But I hope you don't mind a few suggestions. I've got a couple of very good and what were costly at the time Emco chucks for my little C5 lathe of the same make. Both those chucks will self center to under a thou at any dimension I've checked them at. However for gear type work such as in this video where parts are removed and replaced many times I'd still chose to use my 4 jaw independent chuck for it's almost zero runout capability. Loctite as good as the product is will still be like most hard holding glues and is shock sensitive. I've seen many instances in the past in an industrial environment where any shock or vibration can cause a loctite glue joint to fail. Possibly your face joined gears will be just fine as they are, but I think I'd still add 2-3 flat headed allen screws with matching counter sinks so there flush fitting around the perimeter to also provide a mechanical lock. When fitting change gears like those used on a lathe for single pointing threads then setting the tooth depth is a bit critical so the teeth can't bottom on the second gear or have too much clearance that increases the backlash. One method of doing so is to use a strip of standard printing paper between both sets of gear teeth to preset that clearance as there set and tightened in position. It works very well and is consistent. Well designed and made gears are meant to slide each tooth past a matching tooth with very little wear and friction. It's for that reason there shaped the way they are so those clearances are far more critical than most seem to think. If the teeth do bottom out then high rates of wear and friction can be expected. You mentioned bronze instead of brass but that you didn't have any. It seems to be known by few with home shops that because of the hardness of most bronze alloys that it's recommended any shaft it's running on be well hardened to prevent the bronze from quickly wearing soft steel shafts even with oil as a lubricant. Bronze is an excellent and hard wearing material, but only when it's used within it's engineered capability's. My guess is the gearing shafts Proxxon made for that lathe would be hardened, but it's worth checking to be sure if you were to use bronze.
Welcome Turning Point, and thanks! I always welcome suggestions, and am continually trying to learn. Thanks for the tip about Emco checks. What is their diameter size? One major challenge of a lathe as small as mine is weight. I've had quite a few problems with a third party 4-jaw causing major chatter problems due to the weight. I recently got a new, lighter weight 4-jaw, but still need to make the backplate.
I like your idea about adding little screws to secure the gear to the pulley. I considered it, but didn't go ahead because the gear material is so hard, and difficult to work with. I had to use CBN to turn it, and it was really difficult to drill. I'll definitely give it a go if I get problems.
Thanks for the tip about using paper for the gear spacing. The gear itself run on a brass bushing, so based on what you are saying, I am guessing bronze would have been a poor choice? It would have been too hard, and caused wear.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLatheWell if? Proxxon hardened the shaft that gear bushing rotates on using bronze would have been fine. I included the information about bronze requiring hardened shafting because many don't know about it. After more than 30 years of studying as much as I could about machining I only learned that myself a couple of years ago. I've got some aluminum bronze scrap plate here that's noticeably harder than the common variety's of mild steel. My Emco chucks are approximately 3" in diameter and when bought were listed as heavy duty. There likely a bit heavier than what you now own. I get a feeling from watching your videos that you might have a very slight adjustment problem on your spindle bearings. I could also be wrong, but it's easy enough to double check just to be sure. At higher rpms a heavy chuck has a flywheel effect and given the average ratings for between centers weight most lathes are capable of your current chuck weight shouldn't cause any real issues unless Proxxon used narrow and light weight spindle bearings. You might keep an eye on Ebay around your area for a Emco Compact 5 independent 4 jaw chuck. There fairly light weight and of good quality. Emco and Compact 5 accessories do sell for higher prices than most others though. The Compact 5 lathes used pretty much the same system as your Proxxon does by through bolts from the front of the chuck and if you were real lucky might well be the same PCD and bolt sizes. If not a simple adapter wouldn't take long to make.
My apologies for not explaining it clearly; the gears don't run on a steel shaft at all. They run on a brass bushing which fits around a stock bolt. The inner lining of the gear is sintered metal, die cast to the shape of the gear. If I lined the new gear with hard bronze, it would be running against the brass bushing. I'm guessing the 3" Emco chucks are no longer available new? 3" would be the perfect size, as my stock 3-jaw is 75mm. Most third party chucks are 80mm or larger. I'm very interested in hearing that the spindle bearings may not be perfect. I've watched a few videos about replacing bearings on a small lathe, but I'm cautious about stripping down my lathe head, as it's not made for easy access. It's certainly something I'll look into further. Would you recommend taper bearings if suitable sizes are available? They seem to be a popular option for small, cheaper lathe upgrades.
Excellent video. I am interested in purchasing this model but it isn't cheap. Could I ask you to give your response to a customer review that seems rather damming of the lathe: ' Cross slide too small to support vertical slide. 3 and 4 chucks held on by 3 and 4 small Allen screws, not easy to find holes for them. No proper face plate. Insufficient motor power, and belt slip a common problem. Tailstock awkward to clamp near to Chuck. Accessories leave a lot to be desired, tray warped, 4 jaw chuck supplied with fixing screws too long. Avoid the tailstock die holder and metric dies, non split dies impossible to use in larger sizes due to grip strength required'.
It sounds like that reviewer bought a bunch of extras that I haven't bought, so I can't speak about their review of the face plate, 4-jaw chuck, tray, and tailstock die holder. Finding the screw holes for the 3-jaw chuck is pretty easy in my experience, so I don't take that complaint especially seriously. The cross slide is small, and probably won't support most third party vertical slides, so that is a relevant criticism if you need that. The criticism of the tailstock is also valid, as the tailstock is by far the weakest part of the lathe.
Surface treating the 3D printed gears may improve their wear and damage characteristics: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1350630719314220
Great job, Well done!! I can sympathise about projects seeming straightforward at the outset, only to become a full-blown technical challenge. Looking forward to seeing the next stage of your journey. regards Colin
I hope over time that I'll gradually get better at understanding how complex projects are from the start. I'm hoping it won't be long before I have the custom tap made using this gear, so look out for a video about that in the near future. Thanks for sticking with me!
You can get a 0.6mm pitch with an 18 tooth spindle pulley, which comes with the imperial change gear set, then the 15/20 gear, and the 40T leadscrew gear. For the future I guess 😁 Nice work.
I just had the privilege of taking this video from 999 to 1K likes. Congrats, and kudos on a job well done (actually, two jobs -- the part, and the video).
I totally agree. However, I had no idea how to machine a press fit when I made this video. Next time I'll make it better. Thanks for the criticism, sincerely. I've learned so much from viewers with more experience than I have, and appreciate suggestions for ways I can improve.
Like your ideas and way you document it, but one thing I want to ask, What kind of turning tools are you using? Selection of good 8x8 tools is not so wide..
My god, this video was so close to be 10/10. But as your choise of glue where the same both of the times I only give it a 9/10. Would have loved to se: Aluminium + hardened steel + brass + acetone + loctite + isopropanol + epoxy or guerilla glue or what ever, all but loctite x2 ;) Love it!
A little of both a think. The arbor was shop made, and has a few drawbacks, which I talk about at the beginning of the gear cutter arbor video. It definitely has a bit of runout. The slitting saw runs out as well though.
Adventures with a Very Small Lathe I’ve never had a slitting saw that didn’t have that problem. I originally assumed this was deliberate in order to facilitate chip clearing.
Yep, exactly. If you watch my recent video about making a tap with this change gear, I go over setting up the gears, including the idler. In this video I was just verifying the pitch, so the handedness wasn't critical.
Great video. Thank you. What was the little spiral bound book with thread sizes please? In my toolmaker days we used the Zeus book. The holy books of the metalworker.
It's an unbranded Chinese import that was sold as a one-off on eBay. I wouldn't honestly recommend it. The blades are difficult to source, as the size is unusual, and using any lubricant causes the blade to come off the wheels. It also has no adjustment to align or straighten the blade.
It's a cheap thread gauge, and the stamps can be hard to read when light is reflecting off the steel. It was definitely the 0.6 though. I just posted a clearer photo on the Community tab of the channel, so take a look there. The toothed section of the 0.6 gauge stops between the digits of the number, but the 0.8 gauge is much longer.
When I saw that black gear, I thought "ugh! plastic... how vulgar"... but seeing the carbide insert struggle and you switch to cubic boron nitride (oooh... that's rather posh) soon shut me up. Clever work using the boring bar to get the hardened stuff out of the way of the drill bit. Euch... that was very scary when the parting off went wrong and it jumped out of the chuck... I have scrapped SO many parts that way... and what with this being made of one-off parts from E. Bay...............
Engineers Black Book is a pocket sized reference containing really useful information to have on hand while working on your lathe. www.engineersblackbook.com/ I'd recommend highly getting a copy. It's the most useful and handy book of its type I know of.
I'm just a lathe player, i know no oil is needed for machining brass, is it true ? And, when machining aluminum, alcool instead of oil would be better, ( paying attention of fire, of course ! ). In any case, very good job, i also use to work on tooth-weels to get pitch not otherwise available on my chinese lathe ! Cheers, Alessandro from Italy.
I'm not expert at all. Many people say that oil is unnecessary for brass, and I believe it's true, but I find it keeps the noise down, so use a little. What kind of alcohol is suitable for Aluminium? Pure ethanol is almost impossible to get in the UK, and methylated alcohol is unpleasant to use due to the bad smell and toxicity.
Sorry for not getting alcool in UK, in Italy you can buy concentrated 95% ( the remaining part is just water ), or even better, used for making spirits at home, but it's highly taxed . . . ( i use with care a bit when doing threadings, you know, aluminum has a very low melting temperature - 650 C° - easily achived inside when threading . . . with alcool all is easier and better finished ). Perhaps not so important for lathing, where metal to be cutted is more exposed to refreshing air . . . Using alcool "methylated" ( as you say ), with "acetone" ( dimethilchetone ) (?) inside, is not a good idea, too much smell, and - as you say - is even toxic . . . I used sometimes, in a well ventilated area . . .
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe . . . I tested oil when machining brass . . . You are right, less noise and minor spread of brass chips . . . Thank you very much ! Some years ago, when trying to drill holes trought an inox shelf in hospital, i and one of my colleague put some liquid soap around tip of the drill bit. No any chip escaped, they were taken inside soap. After having bored, we could easily clean with just a piece of paper . . .
Love the manner in which you get fantastic work from your lathe. I have an Emco 3 with a tommy bar 3 jaw chuck, I notice your lathe has a key 3 jaw chuck so the question is how is this attached to the headstck spindle as I would like to change mine. Thanks
The Proxxon heastock spindle is a 40mm cylinder with 2 separate patterns of screw holes tapped into it. A three hole pattern for the 3-jaw chuck, and a 4 hole pattern for the 4-jaw. Proxxon supplies both types of chuck with a 40mm register machined directly into the back, with screw holes through to the front. Proxxon chucks are quite expensive though, so it might be cheaper to buy a chinese chuck and make a backplate to fit your lathe.
I would recommend it a solid little machine for anyone who has very limited space, and wants something reliable. For anyone who has space for a slightly larger machine, I think buying a larger model Chinese machine would probably make more sense, as you can get something much more capable due to its size for the same price.
It's like a computer game where you're trying to find the haunted castle in the forest because you need to learn the language of the wisps because you're trying to get them to give you a flute that the little boy will trade for a magic mean that the wizard said will help you get to the lost kingdom where the first quest gem is rumored to be. But with more gears.
Nicely presented video but it looked like you were running your new gear assembly on a brass arbor, if this is the case I would not expect long life from the combination. With a few exceptions running the same material is not recommended due to galling, A steel arbor would be a better long term solution, should you contemplate making dozens of 0.6mm threads. 🤔
Agreed, I realised my mistake shortly after I completed this project, when I learned a bit more about choosing materials for surfaces moving in contact. Fortunately the only reason I needed this gear was for the tap making project, so I may never need to use it again. If I do find myself needing to, I guess making a steel arbor will be a lot easier than re-making the gear.
Hi, great video. Do You think It's also possible to make for PD 250/e gears for 1,75 or 2 mm pitch thread (M12 and M14), or It's a problem (for example about dimensions of gears)? Thanks :-)
I filmed all of this video in an automatic mode where I controlled the f-stop, and the camera set the ISO and shutter speed dynamically. This mode worked for me at the time, though there are some drawbacks. If I try and reproduce the setup, it looks like for most of the shots the shutter was between 1/50th and 1/100th of a second. This is slower than ideal. What's your reason for asking?
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Well i found it hard seeing if the lathe was going really fast or the footage was speeded up. also i love this channel its great!
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Thanks for the response. That's good to hear that there is at least one good option. I read below that you believe that if one were to have the space than one should take one of the bigger Chinese options, has your opinion changed since then?
My opinion hasn't changed fundamentally, but the reasoning and caveats aren't quite the same. A bigger lathe would allow me to do a lot more, which I would like, but I now understand a lot better the amount of work it would take to bring a low-cost larger lathe up to the same standard. It would almost certainly be months of projects, and there are dozens of examples of other TH-camrs doing this kind of work, along with the problems they found along the way. The Proxxon came out of the box ready to go, and I've never had to do any work on it beyond basic cleaning and lubrication.
As no one has offered an answer, polite is a sintered material which is fairly brittle ,so not good if used in shear as might be the case here if the face gluing fails. Another problem is it is full of oil and loctite need a a good clean surface to react with, although admittedly the porous nature might add a key to offset the dirty surface, but I wouldn't rely on it. Another downside is you are not supposed to machine the running surface as it seals the oil pores turning it into a plain bronze bush.
This video is an experimental change in format. Quite a few people have commented that they would prefer the machining footage without background music. Others have said they enjoy the music. This video has music at the beginning and end only. I recorded another version with full orchestral accompaniment available at the link below. If you prefer videos with music, please watch the alternative version instead, and let me know in the comments which you prefer. I promise to read all feedback, but I'll also pay close attention to how many people watch the alternative version, and whether they watch the whole video.
th-cam.com/video/7Ln4mb8Brdc/w-d-xo.html
I'm late to the party but prefer no music. I prefer hearing the machine and the cutting tool, they tell me about something that can't easily be put into words.
What are the names of these machines you are using? Is it just called Proxxan?
@@Dailymailnewz Proxxon, it is a german tool manufacturer. The lathe is the "Proxxon PD 250/e"
I’m a new machinist as a retirement rehabilitation from a 10 year cancer/transplant battle. I watch a great number of machining videos, and particularly enjoy both your filming with narration style, and most especially your problem solving. You are highly motivational!
Thanks for going with the no music format, get tired of the videos that have it all the way through. It’s nice to hear what’s happening. Thanks again and please keep sharing your videos.👍
I very rarely watch a whole video with background music. I don’t think I’m alone there.
No you're not alone there lol.
Excellent video with good explanation as to and why each move is made. Thanks also for leaving in the little accident so the rest of us don't think such things only happen to them!
Thanks for showing creative ways to just get things done. Looking forward to following the rest of the Boley resurrection.
Good to know you found this solution interesting. I'm really pleased with the result, and looking forward to using it to clean up those threads.
I only just found your channel and I'm loving your work.
I too find myself upgrading my tools, so I can make tools to repair other tools.
Thanks, really glad you have enjoyed watching. Since I started the channel I've become such toolmaking adict. :) I love the feeling of constantly building a more capable set of tools, along with improving the skills that went into making them.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe i own a small lathe myself so I can empathise with your situation.
Its not as nice as your proxon though (chinese mini lathe).
Thanks so much for doing what you do and thanks even more for sharing it with us
How about three tiny countersink screws (inserted longitudinally), to hold the two together?
I avoided that because I was worried about drilling through the case hardened steel of the gear.
It's a pleasure to see how you are solving problems and in the end accomplish what you intended to make.
Everytime watching a video of you I'm learning!
Thanks!!
Ronald Veraart
The Netherlands
I came dangerously close to failing on this project. I was very lucky not to wreck the part when I crashed the parting tool. I'm very happy to know you find my videos educational, but make sure you also learn from real machinists like Abom79 and Keith Fenner. My technique is amateurish, and full of bad habits. ;) Keep watching!
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe I'm late to the party with this comment but I'd add several others to your list - Tom Lipton, for example - and in particular for small and precise stuff Robin Renzetti and Stefan Gotteswinter are unbeatable in my opinion.
@@cooperised Thanks for the suggestion. Tom (oxtoolco), Robin (robrenz), and Stefan are channels I follow religiously, and they have the best material out there, but I don't usually suggest them to beginners wanting to learn the basics. I should also make an addition to my suggested list above. Keith Rucker is really great for patiently stepping through all the details involved in setting up for a machining operation, in a way that I found easy to follow as a complete newbie. Abom is similar, especially with his older videos about larger heavier machining. I didn't know enough to understand what Tom, Robin and Stefan were even talking about until I had a couple of years of hobby work under my belt.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Fair enough! I've been watching them all since I was an armchair machinist, and I guess I learned to comprehend the content gradually, like immersing yourself in a foreign language. For beginners though Quinn Dunki (blondihacks) and This Old Tony have some wonderful content, plus of course the vast back catalogue of Mr. Pete (tubalcain). I'm very much enjoying your content too, having found it only recently, so thanks!
Great job! That green Loctite is some good stuff, we used to use it to hold in bushings that re-lined the bores of hi-pressure hydraulic cylinder blocks of hydrostatic pumps and motors... 3000 psi working pressure was the norm for those units!
Thanks! The Loctite certainly worked well. I was worried it might not be strong enough against the torque needed for thread cutting, and I tried to work out a way to pin the two parts together, but the hardness of the steel made it difficult.
Aoawsl is probably the poshest machinist on YT. A true zen artist. Wish my CNC job was like this...
Love the channel, love your work. I think the proxxon lathes are the most underrated machines around!
Hi folks. One thing with most inserts is that they are made with a small radius on the cutting edge. They were developed for use in really heavy duty lathes designed for ripping stock off very quickly. Commercially these days most items would be brought to final size on some form of grinder - it's faster and cheaper than doing it all on the lathe. High Speed steel tooling can be brought to a very sharp edge. Hardened work pieces are a problem. You could anneal it, turn it to size and then case harden again. Or you can do what was done here ....BobUK.
I am so glad to have found your channel - your work and problem solving is inspirational.
as AvE put it: if you dont have the proper tool you gotta make the proper tool! nicely done!
If I may offer some advice, chamfer your holes before you ream them to avoid having to file the burrs. Adding a chamfer before you tap a hole seems to make starting the tap easier.
Great job and a nice solution to a 2 stage gear combo, lets see how the loctite fares, if it fails you can always peg the gears with small countersunk screws. Cheers Peter
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed the video. I've cut a test thread with no problems so far, so I'm optimistic. With the bushing, the Loctite is holding in three different directions, so I'm hoping it'll hold. If not, I have to work out how to get screws through hardened steel. :)
Adventures with a Very Small Lathe. The steel is case harden isn’t it, well tap the aluminium and grind a dimple through the hardening then drill / countersink. Cheers for Christmas Peter
Thanks for sharing. And Thanks for showing your mistakes like not applying loctite to the entire surface of the bushing so the joint failed on turning and not tightening the 3 jaw enough on the holding ring. Errors are as important as successes while i am learning.
i agree that no music while turing is the right background for a machining video.
the squeal you hear while turning is chatter and will leave marks on the surface. slow down the surface feet per minute to eliminate it if that is possible. I know with a small lathe and limited power that may not be possible.
Good to know! I'm pretty sure I'll keep making at least some mistakes, and I'll make sure I keep including them in the videos. I've now settled on a video style that has no music during the machining, so you can depend on me doing that from now on.
That was very impressive. I would not have thought to bind two gears together with Loctite. That will hold an elephant -- until it gets hot, in which case it will let go. But sitting at the back of the lathe it will not get too hot. Should work. I would not have thought of buying RC parts, either. And I like the Proxxon lathe more and more. It is bigger than my lathe. I also have made careful note of your slit-pipe clamp rings. I love the music, so put me on the love-the-music list.
I thought about using a pin, or retaining screw to hold them really firm, but the hardness of the steel gear made threading seem implausible, and drilling for a taper pin also very tricky, so I figured I would see if the Loctite alone was enough. I love my Proxxon very much, though I do sometimes yearn for something a bit bigger. I think some machinists refer to the holding rings as box chucks, but I wasn't certain enough of the terminology, so settled on the descriptive name.
I offer a helpful tip, use brazed carbide and high speed tool bits ground by you to various configurations for best results in the type of machining you are doing. You will be pleased with the results and the economy.
CPM Rex 76 and Rex 49 are examples of high speed alloys. Momax and Tungalloy are also good.
Hardinge can provide various brazed carbide tools for turning boring and threading.
"T" type cut off blades are also a way to go for manual machining.
These tools mentioned are free cutting compared to carbide inserts and of course much cheaper.
All can be sharpened offhand with the right grinding equipment.
Make an effort to study tool geometry and you will see superior results compared to the expensive inserts.
In my opinion the inserts have their place in CNC machining with programed feeds and speeds.
I enjoyed your video and can tell you are willing to think outside the box.
I speak from 50 years of owning a production machine shop.
JIM
Well done and enough to get my subscription. But I hope you don't mind a few suggestions. I've got a couple of very good and what were costly at the time Emco chucks for my little C5 lathe of the same make. Both those chucks will self center to under a thou at any dimension I've checked them at. However for gear type work such as in this video where parts are removed and replaced many times I'd still chose to use my 4 jaw independent chuck for it's almost zero runout capability. Loctite as good as the product is will still be like most hard holding glues and is shock sensitive. I've seen many instances in the past in an industrial environment where any shock or vibration can cause a loctite glue joint to fail. Possibly your face joined gears will be just fine as they are, but I think I'd still add 2-3 flat headed allen screws with matching counter sinks so there flush fitting around the perimeter to also provide a mechanical lock. When fitting change gears like those used on a lathe for single pointing threads then setting the tooth depth is a bit critical so the teeth can't bottom on the second gear or have too much clearance that increases the backlash. One method of doing so is to use a strip of standard printing paper between both sets of gear teeth to preset that clearance as there set and tightened in position. It works very well and is consistent. Well designed and made gears are meant to slide each tooth past a matching tooth with very little wear and friction. It's for that reason there shaped the way they are so those clearances are far more critical than most seem to think. If the teeth do bottom out then high rates of wear and friction can be expected.
You mentioned bronze instead of brass but that you didn't have any. It seems to be known by few with home shops that because of the hardness of most bronze alloys that it's recommended any shaft it's running on be well hardened to prevent the bronze from quickly wearing soft steel shafts even with oil as a lubricant. Bronze is an excellent and hard wearing material, but only when it's used within it's engineered capability's. My guess is the gearing shafts Proxxon made for that lathe would be hardened, but it's worth checking to be sure if you were to use bronze.
Welcome Turning Point, and thanks! I always welcome suggestions, and am continually trying to learn. Thanks for the tip about Emco checks. What is their diameter size? One major challenge of a lathe as small as mine is weight. I've had quite a few problems with a third party 4-jaw causing major chatter problems due to the weight. I recently got a new, lighter weight 4-jaw, but still need to make the backplate.
I like your idea about adding little screws to secure the gear to the pulley. I considered it, but didn't go ahead because the gear material is so hard, and difficult to work with. I had to use CBN to turn it, and it was really difficult to drill. I'll definitely give it a go if I get problems.
Thanks for the tip about using paper for the gear spacing. The gear itself run on a brass bushing, so based on what you are saying, I am guessing bronze would have been a poor choice? It would have been too hard, and caused wear.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLatheWell if? Proxxon hardened the shaft that gear bushing rotates on using bronze would have been fine. I included the information about bronze requiring hardened shafting because many don't know about it. After more than 30 years of studying as much as I could about machining I only learned that myself a couple of years ago. I've got some aluminum bronze scrap plate here that's noticeably harder than the common variety's of mild steel.
My Emco chucks are approximately 3" in diameter and when bought were listed as heavy duty. There likely a bit heavier than what you now own. I get a feeling from watching your videos that you might have a very slight adjustment problem on your spindle bearings. I could also be wrong, but it's easy enough to double check just to be sure. At higher rpms a heavy chuck has a flywheel effect and given the average ratings for between centers weight most lathes are capable of your current chuck weight shouldn't cause any real issues unless Proxxon used narrow and light weight spindle bearings. You might keep an eye on Ebay around your area for a Emco Compact 5 independent 4 jaw chuck. There fairly light weight and of good quality. Emco and Compact 5 accessories do sell for higher prices than most others though. The Compact 5 lathes used pretty much the same system as your Proxxon does by through bolts from the front of the chuck and if you were real lucky might well be the same PCD and bolt sizes. If not a simple adapter wouldn't take long to make.
My apologies for not explaining it clearly; the gears don't run on a steel shaft at all. They run on a brass bushing which fits around a stock bolt. The inner lining of the gear is sintered metal, die cast to the shape of the gear. If I lined the new gear with hard bronze, it would be running against the brass bushing.
I'm guessing the 3" Emco chucks are no longer available new? 3" would be the perfect size, as my stock 3-jaw is 75mm. Most third party chucks are 80mm or larger.
I'm very interested in hearing that the spindle bearings may not be perfect. I've watched a few videos about replacing bearings on a small lathe, but I'm cautious about stripping down my lathe head, as it's not made for easy access. It's certainly something I'll look into further. Would you recommend taper bearings if suitable sizes are available? They seem to be a popular option for small, cheaper lathe upgrades.
Excellent video. I am interested in purchasing this model but it isn't cheap. Could I ask you to give your response to a customer review that seems rather damming of the lathe: ' Cross slide too small to support vertical slide.
3 and 4 chucks held on by 3 and 4 small Allen screws, not easy to find holes for them. No proper face plate. Insufficient motor power, and belt slip a common problem. Tailstock awkward to clamp near to Chuck. Accessories leave a lot to be desired, tray warped, 4 jaw chuck supplied with fixing screws too long. Avoid the tailstock die holder and metric dies, non split dies impossible to use in larger sizes due to grip strength required'.
It sounds like that reviewer bought a bunch of extras that I haven't bought, so I can't speak about their review of the face plate, 4-jaw chuck, tray, and tailstock die holder. Finding the screw holes for the 3-jaw chuck is pretty easy in my experience, so I don't take that complaint especially seriously. The cross slide is small, and probably won't support most third party vertical slides, so that is a relevant criticism if you need that. The criticism of the tailstock is also valid, as the tailstock is by far the weakest part of the lathe.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Thanks thats helpful
3d printers work perfectly in reproducing non-standard gears for the mini-lathe. Yours will be more durable for sure, though! Good job!!
Surface treating the 3D printed gears may improve their wear and damage characteristics: www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1350630719314220
Great job, Well done!!
I can sympathise about projects seeming straightforward at the outset, only to become a full-blown technical challenge.
Looking forward to seeing the next stage of your journey.
regards Colin
I hope over time that I'll gradually get better at understanding how complex projects are from the start. I'm hoping it won't be long before I have the custom tap made using this gear, so look out for a video about that in the near future. Thanks for sticking with me!
You can get a 0.6mm pitch with an 18 tooth spindle pulley, which comes with the imperial change gear set, then the 15/20 gear, and the 40T leadscrew gear. For the future I guess 😁 Nice work.
I just had the privilege of taking this video from 999 to 1K likes. Congrats, and kudos on a job well done (actually, two jobs -- the part, and the video).
Sorry to be critical but this is why lock-tite should never be used in place of a good press fit.
I totally agree. However, I had no idea how to machine a press fit when I made this video. Next time I'll make it better. Thanks for the criticism, sincerely. I've learned so much from viewers with more experience than I have, and appreciate suggestions for ways I can improve.
Like your ideas and way you document it, but one thing I want to ask, What kind of turning tools are you using? Selection of good 8x8 tools is not so wide..
You could use a pressed fit assembly of steel gear on the aluminium spigot and same for the brass bushing, without eny drop of glue.
My god, this video was so close to be 10/10. But as your choise of glue where the same both of the times I only give it a 9/10. Would have loved to se: Aluminium + hardened steel + brass + acetone + loctite + isopropanol + epoxy or guerilla glue or what ever, all but loctite x2 ;) Love it!
without mechanical bond, only loctite? Not even the brass core slightly bigger from the holes, to fitted them brass cold and the gear hot?
Excellent result, Quite a journey to get there!, J.
Thanks Joe!
there seems to be something VERY WRONG with that slitting saw or the arbor (?) - wobbly as hell
A little of both a think. The arbor was shop made, and has a few drawbacks, which I talk about at the beginning of the gear cutter arbor video. It definitely has a bit of runout. The slitting saw runs out as well though.
Adventures with a Very Small Lathe I’ve never had a slitting saw that didn’t have that problem. I originally assumed this was deliberate in order to facilitate chip clearing.
Every video with a slitting saw that I've seen wobbles, mine sure do. Most of mine are European made and fit both of my arbors very well.
Aren't lead screws on lathes left handed? If so you need to put an idler gear in the mix.
Yep, exactly. If you watch my recent video about making a tap with this change gear, I go over setting up the gears, including the idler. In this video I was just verifying the pitch, so the handedness wasn't critical.
Great video. Thank you. What was the little spiral bound book with thread sizes please? In my toolmaker days we used the Zeus book. The holy books of the metalworker.
Great video. Can you tell me the make of your bandsaw? It looks like exactly what I need in my workshop.
It's an unbranded Chinese import that was sold as a one-off on eBay. I wouldn't honestly recommend it. The blades are difficult to source, as the size is unusual, and using any lubricant causes the blade to come off the wheels. It also has no adjustment to align or straighten the blade.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Thanks for the info. Appearances can be deceptive …...
I would recommend a port a band. Building a frame to raise and lower it is do-able, blades are easy to source adjustments are easy to do.
It appeared that the thread gauge used at the end is a 0.8 rather than the 0.6 desired. Did I miss something? Very interesting channel, subscribed.
It's a cheap thread gauge, and the stamps can be hard to read when light is reflecting off the steel. It was definitely the 0.6 though. I just posted a clearer photo on the Community tab of the channel, so take a look there. The toothed section of the 0.6 gauge stops between the digits of the number, but the 0.8 gauge is much longer.
Mercy, what dedication. :)
I SOMETIMES CLAMP A CARBIDE ENDMILL IN THE TOOL POST AND JUST USE THE TIP WORKS GREAT....JUST A THOUGHT MY FRIEND...
When I saw that black gear, I thought "ugh! plastic... how vulgar"... but seeing the carbide insert struggle and you switch to cubic boron nitride (oooh... that's rather posh) soon shut me up.
Clever work using the boring bar to get the hardened stuff out of the way of the drill bit.
Euch... that was very scary when the parting off went wrong and it jumped out of the chuck... I have scrapped SO many parts that way... and what with this being made of one-off parts from E. Bay...............
Why do these videos remind me so much of James May?
Where did you source the CBN insert from? If it's not too expensive I'd like to try one too. The ones I'm seeing seem a bit steep...
I got it on eBay for about £20, which is around 25$ US. It's much pricier than carbide, but worth it for special tasks.
Mate, whats a black book?
I just bought my first lathe - Proxxon 150- looking forward learning from you!
Many thanks, great video's!
Engineers Black Book is a pocket sized reference containing really useful information to have on hand while working on your lathe.
www.engineersblackbook.com/
I'd recommend highly getting a copy. It's the most useful and handy book of its type I know of.
Nice Videoi and nice work Alistair. ATB
Thanks Phil, glad you enjoyed it!
Keep lathing with the proxxon and I'll stay subscribe to you.Good job sir.
Thanks, I'll try not to disappoint!
I'm just a lathe player, i know no oil is needed for machining brass, is it true ?
And, when machining aluminum, alcool instead of oil would be better, ( paying attention of fire, of course ! ).
In any case, very good job, i also use to work on tooth-weels to get pitch not otherwise available on my chinese lathe !
Cheers, Alessandro from Italy.
I'm not expert at all. Many people say that oil is unnecessary for brass, and I believe it's true, but I find it keeps the noise down, so use a little. What kind of alcohol is suitable for Aluminium? Pure ethanol is almost impossible to get in the UK, and methylated alcohol is unpleasant to use due to the bad smell and toxicity.
Sorry for not getting alcool in UK, in Italy you can buy concentrated 95% ( the remaining part is just water ), or even better, used for making spirits at home, but it's highly taxed . . . ( i use with care a bit when doing threadings, you know, aluminum has a very low melting temperature - 650 C° - easily achived inside when threading . . . with alcool all is easier and better finished ). Perhaps not so important for lathing, where metal to be cutted is more exposed to refreshing air . . .
Using alcool "methylated" ( as you say ), with "acetone" ( dimethilchetone ) (?) inside, is not a good idea, too much smell, and - as you say - is even toxic . . . I used sometimes, in a well ventilated area . . .
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe . . . I tested oil when machining brass . . . You are right, less noise and minor spread of brass chips . . . Thank you very much !
Some years ago, when trying to drill holes trought an inox shelf in hospital, i and one of my colleague put some liquid soap around tip of the drill bit. No any chip escaped, they were taken inside soap. After having bored, we could easily clean with just a piece of paper . . .
Love the manner in which you get fantastic work from your lathe. I have an Emco 3 with a tommy bar 3 jaw chuck, I notice your lathe has a key 3 jaw chuck so the question is how is this attached to the headstck spindle as I would like to change mine. Thanks
The Proxxon heastock spindle is a 40mm cylinder with 2 separate patterns of screw holes tapped into it. A three hole pattern for the 3-jaw chuck, and a 4 hole pattern for the 4-jaw. Proxxon supplies both types of chuck with a 40mm register machined directly into the back, with screw holes through to the front. Proxxon chucks are quite expensive though, so it might be cheaper to buy a chinese chuck and make a backplate to fit your lathe.
wolud you recommend this lathe for a begginer who wants to bet into latheing?
I would recommend it a solid little machine for anyone who has very limited space, and wants something reliable. For anyone who has space for a slightly larger machine, I think buying a larger model Chinese machine would probably make more sense, as you can get something much more capable due to its size for the same price.
It's like a computer game where you're trying to find the haunted castle in the forest because you need to learn the language of the wisps because you're trying to get them to give you a flute that the little boy will trade for a magic mean that the wizard said will help you get to the lost kingdom where the first quest gem is rumored to be. But with more gears.
Exactly. I think there at least 3 more videos in this sidequest series before I get back to the main plot.
You should consider playing Ultima VII: The Black Gate -- you'd probably love it.
Best. Vacation. Ever.
Christopher, that’s funny! ...and true.
That slotting saw sounds like the computer form Alien.
thanks mister.
nice work! i like the out of the box thinking
Nicely presented video but it looked like you were running your new gear assembly on a brass arbor, if this is the case I would not expect long life from the combination. With a few exceptions running the same material is not recommended due to galling, A steel arbor would be a better long term solution, should you contemplate making dozens of 0.6mm threads. 🤔
Agreed, I realised my mistake shortly after I completed this project, when I learned a bit more about choosing materials for surfaces moving in contact. Fortunately the only reason I needed this gear was for the tap making project, so I may never need to use it again. If I do find myself needing to, I guess making a steel arbor will be a lot easier than re-making the gear.
Hi, great video. Do You think It's also possible to make for PD 250/e gears for 1,75 or 2 mm pitch thread (M12 and M14), or It's a problem (for example about dimensions of gears)? Thanks :-)
Whats the shutter speed on your camera?
I filmed all of this video in an automatic mode where I controlled the f-stop, and the camera set the ISO and shutter speed dynamically. This mode worked for me at the time, though there are some drawbacks. If I try and reproduce the setup, it looks like for most of the shots the shutter was between 1/50th and 1/100th of a second. This is slower than ideal.
What's your reason for asking?
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Well i found it hard seeing if the lathe was going really fast or the footage was speeded up. also i love this channel its great!
How much do you like this little lathe?
I love it, and I appreciate it even more now that I've tried other small lathes for myself.
@@AdventureswithaVerySmallLathe Thanks for the response. That's good to hear that there is at least one good option. I read below that you believe that if one were to have the space than one should take one of the bigger Chinese options, has your opinion changed since then?
My opinion hasn't changed fundamentally, but the reasoning and caveats aren't quite the same. A bigger lathe would allow me to do a lot more, which I would like, but I now understand a lot better the amount of work it would take to bring a low-cost larger lathe up to the same standard. It would almost certainly be months of projects, and there are dozens of examples of other TH-camrs doing this kind of work, along with the problems they found along the way. The Proxxon came out of the box ready to go, and I've never had to do any work on it beyond basic cleaning and lubrication.
How about Oilite instead of brass, for the bushing?
As no one has offered an answer, polite is a sintered material which is fairly brittle ,so not good if used in shear as might be the case here if the face gluing fails. Another problem is it is full of oil and loctite need a a good clean surface to react with, although admittedly the porous nature might add a key to offset the dirty surface, but I wouldn't rely on it. Another downside is you are not supposed to machine the running surface as it seals the oil pores turning it into a plain bronze bush.
I think he is showing us how a lathe (the only tool that can?) reproduce itself, reproducing itself?
Enjoyed the video.. thank you
Hey very well done
Thanks for watching, trefor!
11:38 this looks like a lot to handle for the mini lathe hhee
Yep, this bit was pretty tricky.
Red Lego Spaceman approves!
My vote is no music other than a machine working and possibly the operator chirping...
Video quality exellent
brilliant!
Gutte Arbeit!
I would've drilled and installed two dowel or roll pins to react torque between the two.
No music, please.
Please, please clean up the mess from previous work before starting a new project!!!
sei grande
Please keep the music!
The overconfident blood immunohistochemically thaw because moon partly trade besides a absent study. thankful, rambunctious block
Che palle
Gutte Arbeit!