Unless you give comparative numbers of $/kWh @ temperature T [F/C] compared with a larger insulated hot water tank, you cannot say whether this has any value in terms of $/m3 saved space. Talking about renewable etc. is just a distraction, since hot water tank is the baseline (or in case of cold storage - water ice) . Cold, hard numbers and less spin is needed.
Great comment. Make sure and look at the readily available research and if you do find one that is critical of this technology share it. More videos and more data from leading research universities in north america to come as we explore this and other technology.
We will be covering this on a future episode. Our host Michael has one hooked up with thermal energy meters on the source and load. There is lots of independent research also available from leading universities around the world. Thanks for the great comment
So can I use this for both Potable water and Radiant floor heating with Glycol? Meaning they won’t mix, having two different in put and out put, hence, ports ABCD? I would like to know if I can use this in an RV Camper? Thank you in advance!
That's a fascinating application for this technology, and Michael our host a month ago had a conversation with his colleague about installing it in an RV. The idea of equipping an RV with this unit that includes a built-in 2.8kw element is intriguing. This setup, combined with a small solar PV array on the roof, could effectively charge the unit, providing a substantial amount of stored energy. With approximately 48,000 BTUs of energy storage capacity, this model could efficiently heat the RV or provide domestic hot water. There are smaller units as well that if you hit our host on linkedIn he can help you with. The double pass heat exchanger design of the unit allows it to be used for heating and domestic. The PCM materials are both environmentally friendly and safe for humans. This is an important consideration, especially in a mobile setting like an RV where the risk of damage and leaks might be higher. It's great to see such innovative ideas being explored, and this particular application could revolutionize the way energy is used and stored in mobile homes and RVs. Thank you for sharing this insightful concept - it's an excellent contribution to the ongoing discussion about sustainable and efficient energy solutions!
I have just installed one these, very heavy 178 kg for 210 lt equivalent. So a house job would be hard. Be good if did a clip on how to install. Shame it won't take solar hot water like a cylinder. I am sure its doable.
They are not batteries in the traditional sense. Eutetic Salts in a liquid form in plastic containers. The chemicals are not noxious, like battery chemicals. The manufacturer backs the units with a decent warranty, so service shouldn't be an issue...
Thank you for bringing up your concerns about the Sunamp heat batteries. We understand that issues like this can be concerning, especially when you come across videos that highlight these problems. It's important to note that we, as the creators of this video series, are not directly affiliated with Sunamp. However, we are committed to providing accurate and helpful information. For specific inquiries or concerns about a video its important to note we dont have the whole picture or the whole story, we recommend reaching out directly to Sunamp's customer support or technical team. They are best equipped to address these issues and provide detailed information. If you need assistance in making this connection, our series host is available on LinkedIn and would be more than happy to help facilitate this communication. Ensuring you have the right support and information is important to us.
Thank you for your insightful follow-up. You're correct in pointing out that there is no significant safety concern with the Sunamp heat batteries. This assurance stems from the design and materials used in these units. Sunamp's technology utilizes phase change materials, specifically designed for thermal energy storage. These materials are non-toxic and non-flammable, which inherently makes them safer than many traditional energy storage systems. From talking with their CEO in person he has told us that Sunamp's products undergo rigorous testing and quality assurance processes to ensure they meet high safety standards. This includes addressing any potential for leaks or failures in a way that minimizes risk to users. Whenever you see a user on TH-cam complaining of an equipment issue its important to ask why and understand there could be other underlying issues but we are by no means taking a side. We encourage everyone to reach out to the manufacturer with any questions they may have. It's always refreshing to have knowledgeable viewers like you contributing to the conversation and helping to clarify important points about the technology we discuss. Thanks again for your valuable input!
I reside in the NY area and have a 20 yr old Weil-McLain oil furnace for hot-water and baseboard heating. Is Sunamp running any pilot programs in the NY area?
Thank you for your comment! The unit can be charged using its built-in 2.7 kW element in approximately 5 hours. Opting for off-peak charging can reduce the cost to as low as 2.5 cents per kW in certain regions, compared to on peak costs. The unit can also be thermally charged using an air-to-water system, air to waters can easily achieve an impressive COP of 2. With off-peak rates, this can bring the cost down to just 1.25 cents. PCM batteries offer versatile applications at a fraction of the cost compared to traditional lithium batteries but more important allow us to store BTU instead of watts
I hate to point this out, but with the size of the mechanical room, just put some 1m3 tanks in series and you get the best of all worlds. Thermal stratification, heat exchange, durability. There's a company in California promoting this for load shifting space heating and DHW on variable tariffs and central air hvac. This is just not going to be cheap enough to make any differenc in the big picture.
Our host Michael attempted to move one in his life fire lab by himself. He thought he had the Thermino80 which has a weight of 164lbs. He actually had a 300 which is 496lbs. He was not able to move it... despite all his Crossfit time :)
One of its (very) few disadvantages over an equivalent water-based storage vessel. I wonder if you'll be able to get them delivered empty of PCM in the future and just fill it up from easily portable 10 gallon containers of PCM prior to commissioning or something...? You'd have to heat the PCM first, of course, to melt it...
Based on information provided by Sunamp, the maximum temperature their heat batteries can reach is around 170°F, though this can vary based on the specific Phase Change Material used. With the right design and a mixing valve, it's possible to effectively utilize even higher waste heat temperatures. Definitely reach out to Sunamp the people we have met in their company have been very open to discussion.
I have done here with Germany cost a lot of calculations. Phase change materials are interesting but not real cost effective compared to water. Especially the shown PCM in hand warmers. It will not work in such a system, because if it is triggered it will run until all material is solid. But you can use e.g. paraffine with a phase change temperature about 60°C. But there are issues with the heat exchanger. When it get solid you have a big thermal insulater at the heat exchanger. And for cost reason it will only work for a short term storage e.g. some days. For long therm (one year) you need a huge amount of PCM. I my opinion for a long term heat storage simple water is the best PCM. It is cheap and it has in interesting feature to same the heat exchanger from isolating with the the solid material. Water has its highest density at about 4°C. So every see is freezing from top to buttom. So you can build the heat exchanger at the buttom and the water colder than 4°C will rise to the top. But you need about 115m³ water for thermal equivalent of 1000 liter heating oil. And of course you need additional a heating pump plus some electrical energy to transfer the 4°C water to 40°C water for heating. If you dont like the heat pumpe, you will need e.g. parafine - but you need the double amount of it. So its a big cost issue.
That's not going to work. Heating a tank of water loses heat fast. My HW tank keeps the water hit for around a day. Something like this will retain stored heat for ages. It only gets used when water is heated. If you don't use any hot water, you lose no heat stored.
@@dlarge6502 I think you did not get the point, that I do not store warm water. I will use it in conjunction with a heating pump and let the water in the see at "natural" temperature. It will use the phase change from water to ice.
If I understand the technology correctly, it utilizes PCM that undergoes a phase change at 58°C, making an ASHP unnecessary. I own a heat pump and use it to heat water to 42°C without mixing it with cold water. To address the issue of Legionella, I heat my water cylinder to 65°C once a week. So in terms of energy efficiency I don't see a use case for this device.
Thank you for the insightful comment, and you've made a crucial point about the importance of managing water storage conditions to prevent bacterial growth. Indeed, Legionella bacteria typically pose a risk in water temperatures between 20°C and 45°C. Your practice of heating your water cylinder to 65°C weekly is an effective strategy to mitigate this risk. However, the unique advantage of PCM batteries like this one is that, in addition to its ability to store and release both sensible and latent energy, it doesn't involve storing any water volume. This key feature means that concerns about bacteria, such as Legionella, are not relevant in the same way they are for systems that store water, such as traditional water cylinders. This aspect of PCM technology is similar to tankless water heaters, which also do not hold water and thus reduce the risk of bacterial growth. This makes PCM an innovative and safer option in many applications.
You'll use this device to store heat when it's cheap to acquire. Same with a water cylinder. Your heat pump may not be something you want to run just for hot water when the cost of electricity is through the roof, instead you run it when it's cheap and "time shift" your usage of that heat via this battery. Also your heat pump is next to useless in a power cut. This will give you hot water for days.
In the UK (and Europe - Fischer have apparently done a deal to distribute re-branded Sunamp heat batteries in continental Europe) they currently cost much the same as the equivalent mains pressure (ie stainless steel) hot water storage costs. Given the actual material content (and type) I would expect the cost to eventually fall to significantly below the equivalent water-based system.
A steel tank full of sand is simpler. Or just a large,standard hot water tank coupled to a high efficiency solar hot water collector system. Simpler is better.
Great comment! Thank you for sharing. Our host Michael has worked with Zon Engineering on thermal storage with sand and although a great concept it's not the same as a phase change battery. Sand itself does not hold energy in the same way that a phase change material battery does. A PCM battery stores thermal energy during the process of phase change, when the material changes from solid to liquid or vice versa storing latent and sensible heat . Sand, on the other hand, has a high thermal mass, meaning it can absorb and retain heat well, but it does not undergo a phase change. Sand's ability to store thermal energy is based on its specific heat capacity, not on phase change. PCMs are used in thermal batteries due to their ability to absorb and release large amounts of heat during phase transitions at relatively constant temperatures. Sand can be used in construction and other applications for thermal mass to stabilize indoor temperatures which is what Michael worked on with his friends at Zon
this is true, but with sand it only makes sense when you can heat it up to at least 5-600 degC and discharge it to mix 60degC warm water. for lets say 100degC to store, water would be the better medium.
@@dlarge6502 it doesnt have to stay hot for long. Sand silos heated by solar during the day, would immediately begin contributing heat for power generation after sunset. Most peak power consumption occurs in the hours at or just after sunset. So your point is pretty much irrelevant in real world power demand generation. Besides, sand silos are already being used in at least one cold climate country for heat storage with no issues.
Thank you for your interest in Sunamp heat batteries! For purchasing them in the Netherlands, your best option would be to contact Sunamp directly. They can provide you with the most up-to-date information on local distributors or retailers in the Netherlands. You can reach out to them through their official website or customer service channels. Our host Michael did some looking for us and he believes you can buy it under the brand name NEO in the Netherlands. Maybe connect with him directly on LinkedIn or Instagram and he can help you.
Great question and thanks for commenting. We cant speak to the price because we dont know the price ourselves but keep in mind this is NOT a buffer tank its closest comparison is a high performance indirect. While water is a commonly used medium for thermal energy storage, phase change thermal batteries utilizing phase change materials offer several distinct advantages: Energy Density: One of the primary benefits of PCMs is their high energy storage density. This means that, for the same volume, a phase change thermal battery can store more energy than water. This allows for compact energy storage systems, which is especially beneficial where space is a constraint. Targeted Temperature Range: PCMs can be engineered to have a specific melting/freezing point. This means the energy storage system can be tailored for specific applications where a particular temperature range is desirable. Water, on the other hand, has a fixed phase change temperature at 0°C for freezing and 100°C for boiling (at standard atmospheric pressure). Consistent Temperature Output: During the phase change process (from solid to liquid or vice versa), the temperature of the PCM remains nearly constant. This is a useful feature for applications requiring a consistent temperature output, as opposed to the changing temperatures one might get as water heats up or cools down. Reduced Heat Loss: Due to the latent heat storage mechanism of PCMs, there is reduced convective heat loss during the phase change process. This means that, under similar conditions, a phase change thermal battery retains its stored energy longer than water. Our host Michael uses a water battery not a PCM and it cant store energy for when its needed because of the stand by losses Versatility: There's a wide variety of PCMs available, from organic compounds to inorganic salts, that cater to different thermal properties and price points. This versatility allows designers to choose the best material for their specific needs. Integration with Renewables: Phase change thermal batteries can be efficiently integrated with renewable energy sources. For example, during peak solar hours, excess energy can be stored in PCMs and then released during non-sunny periods, providing a stable and continuous energy supply. In our next episode we are in a home where they have a PCM and are completely off grid and it produces 80% of their hot water and has for 2 1/2 years. We dive into the logged reports during that episode as well as walk the home. While water is abundant, cheap, and has been used for thermal storage for a long time, phase change thermal batteries offer performance characteristics that can make them a better choice for many applications.
Sodium Acetate is the substance used? Once the reaction starts it keeps going. None of the copper pipes are insulated. All this effort, just to replace a very efficient gas boiler. It must take a long time to pay back.
Great comment! Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts. It's important to note that in the specific Sunamp setup you mentioned, the copper pipes are not insulated. While this could impact the efficiency of the system, it's also essential to recognize that this setup is part of a test site. In such environments, extensive instrumentation is common as the gas utility is engaged in continuous experimentation and optimization. This context is crucial because it means the system's design, including aspects like uninsulated pipes, is part of ongoing research and testing rather than a finalized residential installation. ( that is our understanding it is NOT our site we just filmed it ) Regarding the comparison to a very efficient gas boiler, the transition to a system like Sunamp's, while potentially slower in terms of payback, offers several advantages. We are not sure you would ever replace a boiler with this tech but Sunamp can speak to that. We did just see a NYSERDA report that showed using a Sunamp instead of an indirect reduced gas consumption by 50%. Great comment thank you!
Well it's cheaper than a boiler. Will work for anything up to 35 years, has a 10 year warranty. My cheap plastic basic boiler cost me 3 grand and has a 3 year warranty. As far as the heat transfer goes, it's released little by little, not all at once.
Cool tech. I have been hoping for something like this for apartments. How tall would it have to be to store 8 hours of thermal heat for heat/hot water? We have a flat roof apartment building w/o cell towers! Thermal roof base hot water can be used as a source since we are over the treetops.
The Thermino 80i from Sunamp is the one we looked at here and there are many installed but they come in even bigger units ( CentralBankMini for example). This is a compact thermal storage unit, but to provide a precise answer about its capacity to store 8 hours of thermal heat for heating and hot water in an apartment setting, we need specific technical details. You can reach out to our host on linkedIn who is a PCM battery Nerd or go directly to Sunamp for assistance. To calculate the required capacity for 8 hours, you need to know the heat demand of your building. This includes the number of apartments, average hot water usage, and heating requirements. Once you have this data, you can determine how many Thermino 80i units are needed. These units are modular, so you can combine multiple ones to meet your specific needs. For a flat-roof apartment building without obstructions like cell towers, installing these units on the roof is feasible so long as weather conditions permit. The structural integrity of the roof must be considered to ensure it can support the weight of the installed units. Consulting with a Sunamp expert or a thermal systems professional is recommended for precise calculations and implementation guidance. Thanks for your great comment.
@@plumbing-hvacmagazine the thermal units would be located in the basement where the current hot water heaters are and the water comes in I was thinking of the roof for the thermal solar panels to possibly feed these units. Thank you for your comprehensive answer.
Michael certainly loves his coffee :) and we appreciate your comments as we understand that the sight of our host holding a cup of coffee has drawn some attention. Our aim was to create a relaxed and approachable atmosphere while discussing the technology, as we believe this makes the information more accessible and engaging for a broader audience. However, we appreciate your perspective and will certainly take it into consideration for our future content. We're glad to have viewers who are attentive and care about the quality and presentation of our information as much as we do. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts with us!
Our focus is on the technology not so much what Michael is drinking but the coffee cup has come up in just about every meeting and we have all enjoyed a few laughs over it including our host. Thanks for being a good sport and commenting.
We have a 2kw solar system for a 300 sq ft residence. The goal to use on site as much pv power as possible before we give it to the grid. Our passive solar floor will keep the home warm (70's F) on sunny days until midnight even with outside temps in the 30's F. Could we charge the Sunamp from our pv solar to radiantly release heat later in the night? If we don't need the heat, how many days would the Sunamp store the heat?
It's fantastic to see your commitment to maximizing the use of solar energy in your residence. Incorporating a Sunamp heat battery with your 2kW solar system sounds like a smart move. Sunamp's units are specifically designed to store energy from solar PV systems ( as well as air to water, solar thermal, waste heat, the list goees on ), making them a great fit for your setup. When your solar panels are producing excess energy during the day, this can be stored in the Sunamp unit. Then, even after your passive solar floor cools down at night, the Sunamp can kick in, releasing stored heat to maintain a comfortable temperature in your home. In a future episode of our series Michael is going to show off a system that is exactly as you are describing. It is already filmed we are just doing the editing on it. One of the standout features of Sunamp's heat batteries is their ability to hold onto that heat for several days and in some cases much longer. So, on days when you don't need the extra warmth, you won't lose that stored energy. It's just a matter of sizing the Sunamp unit correctly, taking into account your daily energy generation and heating needs. This way, you ensure that you're getting the most out of your solar setup, enhancing your home's energy efficiency and making sure none of that precious solar power goes to waste.
Had my Sunamp 2.5 years, charged with off peak electric, mains pressure hot water, very happy...................NOW! stop the stupid bloody background noise..
Tks for your constructive and respectful feedback. This setup that Bluewater has done is for testing dual source and is not an actual home or real world scenario. Our next episode is in an actual home and you will see it is all insulated.
Wow. Garret, You don't mince your words. These units are tested to specific temps, many cycles and are ready to ship! There is nothing like this elsewhere
@@simonmasters3295 OMG in 1990 I took a 2000L plastic water tank and placed vertical PVC pipes in it with copper coils and Sodium acetate with an on demand solenoid that activated each tube. It was solar heated of course. good old 50 C water came out the other end. Stored it for months.
@@GarretKrampe I appreciate your interest in DIY projects, but it's essential to note that PCM batteries, especially when used for heating and cooling systems, involve complex technology and safety considerations. Manufacturers adhere to rigorous safety and testing standards to ensure these systems are reliable and safe for consumers. Attempting a DIY PCM battery system without the necessary knowledge and experience can be both dangerous and potentially illegal. It's crucial to prioritize safety and follow established guidelines when working with advanced energy storage systems. While sharing plans and knowledge can be valuable, it's important to recognize the limitations of DIY projects in complex areas like this. Manufacturers play a critical role in ensuring products meet safety standards and function reliably. Just as I would advise against attempting dental procedures on your neighbors, I would also strongly discourage you from taking on the responsibility and potential liability of constructing a unique PCM battery for your neighbor. Your comment is a appreciated and valued. Thanks for watching and for sharing.
Thanks for your comment and observation about the coffee cup! We wanted to give the video a relaxed, conversational feel, as if you were walking through the tech with a friend. The setting might seem a bit unconventional, but it was chosen because it is a living lab with a ton of technology being tested in a home. We're always experimenting with different formats to keep our content engaging and informative. Your feedback is valuable to us, and we'll keep it in mind as we plan future videos. Thanks for watching and for taking the time to share your thoughts!
Agree, totally annoying. People don't buy things because it's "carbon neutral". People buy things so they can save money. Anyone that tells you otherwise is a damn liar. I'll still watch this channel, they have great vids, but this environment/carbon neutral BS is fluff. Worried about being "green"? Go vegan - animal ag is responsible for almost HALF of the world's energy consumption.
We appreciate all points of view. Electrification needs to happen in a way that is sustainable economically and as our host Michael often says puts people before profits. All technology has its place. In an upcoming episode we spent time with a gas heat pump manufacturer and hope you enjoy that episode as well.
This is a thermal battery for heating your home not for storing electricity. Your comment is spot on that it will not run your lights but it will heat your home. Tks for sharing your thoughts 🙂
@@plumbing-hvacmagazine I was just thinking about a different application for the technology, using it as a thermal battery and generating electricity on demand via a heat differential. Was thinking of a possibly smaller one for a car. Maybe not power the whole car for long distances, but maybe siphon the heat off the engine it the battery pack, or the inside of the car when it's parked in summer, and then use the extra energy for some extra miles, or to save battery power for driving and use this for the internal systems within the car ... 🤔
@@colleenforrest7936 it's a great thought. The smallest unit is about the size of a microwave and they are charged thermally or with 2.7kw of electric energy. In our next episode we will show off a site using this battery off grid to produce 80 percent of their domestic hot water. Thanks for the great comments
thats just sodium acetate trihydrate. nothing new here, i did this 10 years ago. everyone knows pocket warmers. if people just would develope their ideas instead of throwing the first thing out they can build just to make some money, we would had better tech.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! You're right that sodium acetate trihydrate, the material used in pocket warmers, has been known for some time. However, what makes Sunamp's Thermino technology stand out is the way they've innovatively adapted and enhanced this substance for energy storage. Sunamp has developed a unique intellectual property around this technology, optimizing it for higher efficiency, greater energy density, and longer life cycles than traditional applications. Their approach involves sophisticated phase change material formulations, which allows for more effective heat storage and release at desired temperatures. This makes it particularly suitable for domestic and industrial heating systems, offering a more sustainable and efficient solution compared to conventional methods. The development of Sunamp's technology involved extensive research and innovation to overcome various challenges, such as stability, scalability, and integration with existing heating systems. It’s this dedication to refining and developing their idea that sets Sunamp apart in the field of thermal energy storage. Innovation often builds upon existing knowledge, but it's the unique application and continuous improvement of these ideas that drive technological advancement. Sunamp's approach exemplifies how rethinking and developing existing concepts can lead to significant improvements in technology. We appreciate your interest and are always here to discuss more about these exciting developments! We really appreciate your comments and we are looking forward to seeing more PCM technology hit North America!
Please! Stop using "Latent Energy" and say what it is: Latent Heat The heat pump produces heat as a "waste"??m Then 😂"From an Exergy standpoint" wtf is that? I do understand the points about energy density and cost of sunamp versus lithium "...the last furnace you will ever buy?" Is it not you already bought your last furnace? This is clever tech, don't over complicate it. Micro CHP is presumably a generator set with heat recovery.
Thank you for your constructive and insightful comment. The allure of filming without a script is seeing how viewers dissect and understand various terms and statements. You're spot-on regarding "latent energy," but I'm confident the video conveyed its intended message. When it comes to your observation about the term 'eXery', I value your input. To clarify for those who might not be as versed in the concept of exergy as you clearly are, let me use an analogy: It's not about whether a coffee maker can produce hot chocolate. Rather, it's questioning why a coffee maker would consume 10 units of energy to prepare a cup of coffee when another gadget might do the same with just 2 units. It boils down to efficiency. While the coffee maker might be adept at converting energy to heat, it possibly isn't the most exergy-efficient means of brewing that cup. The concept of a micro CHP generating domestic hot water from waste heat through a thermal battery is indeed a forward-thinking application.
@@plumbing-hvacmagazineRewatching. Thanks for your comment. I do like your product, but you are vague on many details specifically the question of raising steam, surely there is no way this device is doing that?
Absolutely, climate change is a crucial issue, and we're on the same page about its importance. We also believe that a wide range of technologies will be pivotal in helping us meet our collective goals of creating a sustainable and cleaner environment for future generations. As we film our videos with HVAC experts and climate change experts it's exciting to see innovations across various sectors, from renewable energy to energy-efficient appliances, all contributing to this vital mission. Together, these technologies not only address immediate environmental challenges but also pave the way for a greener, healthier planet for the generations to come. We have many more cool technologies to show off already shot and being released in the coming weeks.
I'm sorry but what you have is really obsolete. We don't need to storage energy. This is ridicules. No one will use a gas furnace in the future. Electric energy is free.
Thanks for commenting. There is no gas because this product is exactly as you said the future. It is charged with thermal energy from any source including PV, a heat pump or solar thermal. In this example they used waste heat from a generator
If you use your head for a second. I go to work. Nobody home. Sunny day. PV panels on roof, wasted. No, not having a li-ion bomb near my house either. But, put this thing in and I can store the free leccy as heat! Could do that with a water tank, but that is cold within a day. This thing however remains able to heat the HOUSE at NIGHT as well as DHW from the taps. No explosion waiting to happen in the li-ion battery... There isn't one. Hot water for days and all I needed was one sunny day. And if the sun doesn't shine, when the clouds are thick and black, but the wind is blowing, the nuclear plants are humming too and there is loads of electricity and the price plummets, even going NEGATIVE, well I can literally be PAID by the electric company to charge this thing up. Thats better than free mate.
@@dlarge6502 But if I have a device the size of a shoe box that cost about $40.00 to build and that will will pull energy from your surroundings, not heat or cold energy that will power everything electric in your home in fact 3 homes that will last about 35 years then that is better than what you have. It has no moving parts and is all electronic. Can't beat that with a stick.
Unless you give comparative numbers of $/kWh @ temperature T [F/C] compared with a larger insulated hot water tank, you cannot say whether this has any value in terms of $/m3 saved space. Talking about renewable etc. is just a distraction, since hot water tank is the baseline (or in case of cold storage - water ice) . Cold, hard numbers and less spin is needed.
Great comment. Make sure and look at the readily available research and if you do find one that is critical of this technology share it. More videos and more data from leading research universities in north america to come as we explore this and other technology.
I stopped watching this halfway through, the content was good but the annoying music was off putting.
We value your feedback and relayed it to the video editor. This was the first with ambient music, perhaps the last. 😉
never know why anyone needs background muzak on a video. very annoying.
I came here to comment only to complain about the extremely annoying music. Never add music again, please.
Came on to comment on the annoying muzak, to find I wasn't the only one, - thank goodness!
I agree the music sucks
What is the conversion efficiency, both in and out? Is there a decay of energy, and what rate is that at?
We will be covering this on a future episode. Our host Michael has one hooked up with thermal energy meters on the source and load. There is lots of independent research also available from leading universities around the world. Thanks for the great comment
@@plumbing-hvacmagazine Well, thank you for your comprehensive reply. Looking forward to that future episode.
What temperature is required to get the phase change from solid to liquid?
It depends on the model. Sunamp makes PCM at various phase change temperatures. This particular one provides sensible and latent BTUs at 150f
@@plumbing-hvacmagazine than this won'nt be compatble with heat pumps?
there are now some in the market that works with the temp range of 50C
So can I use this for both Potable water and Radiant floor heating with Glycol? Meaning they won’t mix, having two different in put and out put, hence, ports ABCD?
I would like to know if I can use this in an RV Camper? Thank you in advance!
That's a fascinating application for this technology, and Michael our host a month ago had a conversation with his colleague about installing it in an RV. The idea of equipping an RV with this unit that includes a built-in 2.8kw element is intriguing. This setup, combined with a small solar PV array on the roof, could effectively charge the unit, providing a substantial amount of stored energy. With approximately 48,000 BTUs of energy storage capacity, this model could efficiently heat the RV or provide domestic hot water. There are smaller units as well that if you hit our host on linkedIn he can help you with.
The double pass heat exchanger design of the unit allows it to be used for heating and domestic. The PCM materials are both environmentally friendly and safe for humans. This is an important consideration, especially in a mobile setting like an RV where the risk of damage and leaks might be higher.
It's great to see such innovative ideas being explored, and this particular application could revolutionize the way energy is used and stored in mobile homes and RVs. Thank you for sharing this insightful concept - it's an excellent contribution to the ongoing discussion about sustainable and efficient energy solutions!
can we combine it by using residential pv pannel and it heat water upto 60 degree c ?
I have just installed one these, very heavy 178 kg for 210 lt equivalent. So a house job would be hard. Be good if did a clip on how to install.
Shame it won't take solar hot water like a cylinder. I am sure its doable.
How are you addressing the failure and leaking of your "batteries". There are videos on YT showing this issue.
They are not batteries in the traditional sense. Eutetic Salts in a liquid form in plastic containers. The chemicals are not noxious, like battery chemicals. The manufacturer backs the units with a decent warranty, so service shouldn't be an issue...
Thank you for bringing up your concerns about the Sunamp heat batteries. We understand that issues like this can be concerning, especially when you come across videos that highlight these problems. It's important to note that we, as the creators of this video series, are not directly affiliated with Sunamp. However, we are committed to providing accurate and helpful information.
For specific inquiries or concerns about a video its important to note we dont have the whole picture or the whole story, we recommend reaching out directly to Sunamp's customer support or technical team. They are best equipped to address these issues and provide detailed information. If you need assistance in making this connection, our series host is available on LinkedIn and would be more than happy to help facilitate this communication. Ensuring you have the right support and information is important to us.
Thank you for your insightful follow-up. You're correct in pointing out that there is no significant safety concern with the Sunamp heat batteries. This assurance stems from the design and materials used in these units. Sunamp's technology utilizes phase change materials, specifically designed for thermal energy storage. These materials are non-toxic and non-flammable, which inherently makes them safer than many traditional energy storage systems.
From talking with their CEO in person he has told us that Sunamp's products undergo rigorous testing and quality assurance processes to ensure they meet high safety standards. This includes addressing any potential for leaks or failures in a way that minimizes risk to users. Whenever you see a user on TH-cam complaining of an equipment issue its important to ask why and understand there could be other underlying issues but we are by no means taking a side. We encourage everyone to reach out to the manufacturer with any questions they may have. It's always refreshing to have knowledgeable viewers like you contributing to the conversation and helping to clarify important points about the technology we discuss. Thanks again for your valuable input!
I reside in the NY area and have a 20 yr old Weil-McLain oil furnace for hot-water and baseboard heating. Is Sunamp running any pilot programs in the NY area?
We are not aware of any but reach out directly to Sunamp. We do know they have stock in New Jersey and likely other regions.
Why do you convert electrical input to heat with a resistive element rather than a heat pump?
Thank you for your comment! The unit can be charged using its built-in 2.7 kW element in approximately 5 hours. Opting for off-peak charging can reduce the cost to as low as 2.5 cents per kW in certain regions, compared to on peak costs.
The unit can also be thermally charged using an air-to-water system, air to waters can easily achieve an impressive COP of 2. With off-peak rates, this can bring the cost down to just 1.25 cents.
PCM batteries offer versatile applications at a fraction of the cost compared to traditional lithium batteries but more important allow us to store BTU instead of watts
Well, if you can't have a heat pump...
I hate to point this out, but with the size of the mechanical room, just put some 1m3 tanks in series and you get the best of all worlds. Thermal stratification, heat exchange, durability. There's a company in California promoting this for load shifting space heating and DHW on variable tariffs and central air hvac. This is just not going to be cheap enough to make any differenc in the big picture.
"Look at all this beautiful copper pipe plumbing," said the plumber. Low volt guys come in and say, "Screw that."
The controls guys really love the sensors which added a lot to the application because of the data they collected. Great comment. :)
We have one, its a nice unit, was a pain to move at something like 250kg
Our host Michael attempted to move one in his life fire lab by himself. He thought he had the Thermino80 which has a weight of 164lbs. He actually had a 300 which is 496lbs. He was not able to move it... despite all his Crossfit time :)
One of its (very) few disadvantages over an equivalent water-based storage vessel. I wonder if you'll be able to get them delivered empty of PCM in the future and just fill it up from easily portable 10 gallon containers of PCM prior to commissioning or something...? You'd have to heat the PCM first, of course, to melt it...
what is the max temp it can produce I'm wondering if you can combine it with a thermal electric generator to produce power TEC
Based on information provided by Sunamp, the maximum temperature their heat batteries can reach is around 170°F, though this can vary based on the specific Phase Change Material used. With the right design and a mixing valve, it's possible to effectively utilize even higher waste heat temperatures. Definitely reach out to Sunamp the people we have met in their company have been very open to discussion.
75C from solar PV.
I have done here with Germany cost a lot of calculations. Phase change materials are interesting but not real cost effective compared to water. Especially the shown PCM in hand warmers. It will not work in such a system, because if it is triggered it will run until all material is solid. But you can use e.g. paraffine with a phase change temperature about 60°C. But there are issues with the heat exchanger. When it get solid you have a big thermal insulater at the heat exchanger. And for cost reason it will only work for a short term storage e.g. some days.
For long therm (one year) you need a huge amount of PCM. I my opinion for a long term heat storage simple water is the best PCM. It is cheap and it has in interesting feature to same the heat exchanger from isolating with the the solid material. Water has its highest density at about 4°C. So every see is freezing from top to buttom. So you can build the heat exchanger at the buttom and the water colder than 4°C will rise to the top. But you need about 115m³ water for thermal equivalent of 1000 liter heating oil. And of course you need additional a heating pump plus some electrical energy to transfer the 4°C water to 40°C water for heating. If you dont like the heat pumpe, you will need e.g. parafine - but you need the double amount of it. So its a big cost issue.
That's not going to work. Heating a tank of water loses heat fast. My HW tank keeps the water hit for around a day. Something like this will retain stored heat for ages. It only gets used when water is heated. If you don't use any hot water, you lose no heat stored.
@@dlarge6502 I think you did not get the point, that I do not store warm water. I will use it in conjunction with a heating pump and let the water in the see at "natural" temperature. It will use the phase change from water to ice.
Nice, always wanted to see the inside of one of these units
Well, it's a good thing that there isn't any GW/CC happening here.
Er... nope! Haven't a clue what you are on about...
excellent
If I understand the technology correctly, it utilizes PCM that undergoes a phase change at 58°C, making an ASHP unnecessary. I own a heat pump and use it to heat water to 42°C without mixing it with cold water. To address the issue of Legionella, I heat my water cylinder to 65°C once a week. So in terms of energy efficiency I don't see a use case for this device.
Thank you for the insightful comment, and you've made a crucial point about the importance of managing water storage conditions to prevent bacterial growth. Indeed, Legionella bacteria typically pose a risk in water temperatures between 20°C and 45°C. Your practice of heating your water cylinder to 65°C weekly is an effective strategy to mitigate this risk.
However, the unique advantage of PCM batteries like this one is that, in addition to its ability to store and release both sensible and latent energy, it doesn't involve storing any water volume. This key feature means that concerns about bacteria, such as Legionella, are not relevant in the same way they are for systems that store water, such as traditional water cylinders. This aspect of PCM technology is similar to tankless water heaters, which also do not hold water and thus reduce the risk of bacterial growth. This makes PCM an innovative and safer option in many applications.
No one has ever died from a hot water take via legionella in the UK. Waste energy heating it up really.
You'll use this device to store heat when it's cheap to acquire. Same with a water cylinder. Your heat pump may not be something you want to run just for hot water when the cost of electricity is through the roof, instead you run it when it's cheap and "time shift" your usage of that heat via this battery.
Also your heat pump is next to useless in a power cut. This will give you hot water for days.
@@dlarge6502 yeah, those are good points. Especially when it comes to power cuts
Cost of unit? How many gallons per hour flow? Mentions equivalent of 80gal water heater...
If you reach out to Sunamp directly they can answer these questions for you. Thanks so much for taking the time to comment.
In the UK (and Europe - Fischer have apparently done a deal to distribute re-branded Sunamp heat batteries in continental Europe) they currently cost much the same as the equivalent mains pressure (ie stainless steel) hot water storage costs. Given the actual material content (and type) I would expect the cost to eventually fall to significantly below the equivalent water-based system.
A steel tank full of sand is simpler. Or just a large,standard hot water tank coupled to a high efficiency solar hot water collector system. Simpler is better.
Great comment! Thank you for sharing. Our host Michael has worked with Zon Engineering on thermal storage with sand and although a great concept it's not the same as a phase change battery.
Sand itself does not hold energy in the same way that a phase change material battery does. A PCM battery stores thermal energy during the process of phase change, when the material changes from solid to liquid or vice versa storing latent and sensible heat . Sand, on the other hand, has a high thermal mass, meaning it can absorb and retain heat well, but it does not undergo a phase change. Sand's ability to store thermal energy is based on its specific heat capacity, not on phase change.
PCMs are used in thermal batteries due to their ability to absorb and release large amounts of heat during phase transitions at relatively constant temperatures.
Sand can be used in construction and other applications for thermal mass to stabilize indoor temperatures which is what Michael worked on with his friends at Zon
this is true, but with sand it only makes sense when you can heat it up to at least 5-600 degC and discharge it to mix 60degC warm water. for lets say 100degC to store, water would be the better medium.
@@dominiklackner6334 you nailed why PCM is so innovative. Great comment!
Hot sand cools down when you aren't using it.
This doesn't.
@@dlarge6502 it doesnt have to stay hot for long. Sand silos heated by solar during the day, would immediately begin contributing heat for power generation after sunset. Most peak power consumption occurs in the hours at or just after sunset. So your point is pretty much irrelevant in real world power demand generation. Besides, sand silos are already being used in at least one cold climate country for heat storage with no issues.
Where to buy in Netherlands?
Probably best to contact SunAmp in Scotland, I’d imagine they’d ship to the Netherlands.
Thank you for your interest in Sunamp heat batteries! For purchasing them in the Netherlands, your best option would be to contact Sunamp directly. They can provide you with the most up-to-date information on local distributors or retailers in the Netherlands. You can reach out to them through their official website or customer service channels.
Our host Michael did some looking for us and he believes you can buy it under the brand name NEO in the Netherlands. Maybe connect with him directly on LinkedIn or Instagram and he can help you.
$4,000 to offset the cost of an 80 gallon water tank? Hmmmm
Great question and thanks for commenting. We cant speak to the price because we dont know the price ourselves but keep in mind this is NOT a buffer tank its closest comparison is a high performance indirect.
While water is a commonly used medium for thermal energy storage, phase change thermal batteries utilizing phase change materials offer several distinct advantages:
Energy Density: One of the primary benefits of PCMs is their high energy storage density. This means that, for the same volume, a phase change thermal battery can store more energy than water. This allows for compact energy storage systems, which is especially beneficial where space is a constraint.
Targeted Temperature Range: PCMs can be engineered to have a specific melting/freezing point. This means the energy storage system can be tailored for specific applications where a particular temperature range is desirable. Water, on the other hand, has a fixed phase change temperature at 0°C for freezing and 100°C for boiling (at standard atmospheric pressure).
Consistent Temperature Output: During the phase change process (from solid to liquid or vice versa), the temperature of the PCM remains nearly constant. This is a useful feature for applications requiring a consistent temperature output, as opposed to the changing temperatures one might get as water heats up or cools down.
Reduced Heat Loss: Due to the latent heat storage mechanism of PCMs, there is reduced convective heat loss during the phase change process. This means that, under similar conditions, a phase change thermal battery retains its stored energy longer than water. Our host Michael uses a water battery not a PCM and it cant store energy for when its needed because of the stand by losses
Versatility: There's a wide variety of PCMs available, from organic compounds to inorganic salts, that cater to different thermal properties and price points. This versatility allows designers to choose the best material for their specific needs.
Integration with Renewables: Phase change thermal batteries can be efficiently integrated with renewable energy sources. For example, during peak solar hours, excess energy can be stored in PCMs and then released during non-sunny periods, providing a stable and continuous energy supply. In our next episode we are in a home where they have a PCM and are completely off grid and it produces 80% of their hot water and has for 2 1/2 years. We dive into the logged reports during that episode as well as walk the home.
While water is abundant, cheap, and has been used for thermal storage for a long time, phase change thermal batteries offer performance characteristics that can make them a better choice for many applications.
03:18 made an effort to lift that cover?!
Thanks for commenting. We can seek out an answer for you if there is a particular item of interest
Sodium Acetate is the substance used? Once the reaction starts it keeps going. None of the copper pipes are insulated.
All this effort, just to replace a very efficient gas boiler. It must take a long time to pay back.
Great comment! Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts. It's important to note that in the specific Sunamp setup you mentioned, the copper pipes are not insulated. While this could impact the efficiency of the system, it's also essential to recognize that this setup is part of a test site. In such environments, extensive instrumentation is common as the gas utility is engaged in continuous experimentation and optimization. This context is crucial because it means the system's design, including aspects like uninsulated pipes, is part of ongoing research and testing rather than a finalized residential installation. ( that is our understanding it is NOT our site we just filmed it )
Regarding the comparison to a very efficient gas boiler, the transition to a system like Sunamp's, while potentially slower in terms of payback, offers several advantages. We are not sure you would ever replace a boiler with this tech but Sunamp can speak to that. We did just see a NYSERDA report that showed using a Sunamp instead of an indirect reduced gas consumption by 50%.
Great comment thank you!
Well it's cheaper than a boiler. Will work for anything up to 35 years, has a 10 year warranty. My cheap plastic basic boiler cost me 3 grand and has a 3 year warranty.
As far as the heat transfer goes, it's released little by little, not all at once.
Cool tech. I have been hoping for something like this for apartments. How tall would it have to be to store 8 hours of thermal heat for heat/hot water? We have a flat roof apartment building w/o cell towers! Thermal roof base hot water can be used as a source since we are over the treetops.
The Thermino 80i from Sunamp is the one we looked at here and there are many installed but they come in even bigger units ( CentralBankMini for example). This is a compact thermal storage unit, but to provide a precise answer about its capacity to store 8 hours of thermal heat for heating and hot water in an apartment setting, we need specific technical details. You can reach out to our host on linkedIn who is a PCM battery Nerd or go directly to Sunamp for assistance.
To calculate the required capacity for 8 hours, you need to know the heat demand of your building. This includes the number of apartments, average hot water usage, and heating requirements. Once you have this data, you can determine how many Thermino 80i units are needed. These units are modular, so you can combine multiple ones to meet your specific needs.
For a flat-roof apartment building without obstructions like cell towers, installing these units on the roof is feasible so long as weather conditions permit. The structural integrity of the roof must be considered to ensure it can support the weight of the installed units. Consulting with a Sunamp expert or a thermal systems professional is recommended for precise calculations and implementation guidance. Thanks for your great comment.
@@plumbing-hvacmagazine the thermal units would be located in the basement where the current hot water heaters are and the water comes in I was thinking of the roof for the thermal solar panels to possibly feed these units. Thank you for your comprehensive answer.
Irritating background music :(
Appreciate your construction feedback. The video editor has been told.
holding that coffee cup is a weird look. cool technology otherwise !
Michael certainly loves his coffee :) and we appreciate your comments as we understand that the sight of our host holding a cup of coffee has drawn some attention. Our aim was to create a relaxed and approachable atmosphere while discussing the technology, as we believe this makes the information more accessible and engaging for a broader audience.
However, we appreciate your perspective and will certainly take it into consideration for our future content. We're glad to have viewers who are attentive and care about the quality and presentation of our information as much as we do. Thanks again for sharing your thoughts with us!
Microphone hidden in the cup of coffee?
Our focus is on the technology not so much what Michael is drinking but the coffee cup has come up in just about every meeting and we have all enjoyed a few laughs over it including our host. Thanks for being a good sport and commenting.
😂
Cool looking product, solar thermal panels and this would be awesome.
We agree!
In our newest episode we went to another PCM project and it turns out that Thermal is not the best answer PV is. That episode will be dropping soon.
Can also use PV panels.
We have a 2kw solar system for a 300 sq ft residence. The goal to use on site as much pv power as possible before we give it to the grid. Our passive solar floor will keep the home warm (70's F) on sunny days until midnight even with outside temps in the 30's F. Could we charge the Sunamp from our pv solar to radiantly release heat later in the night? If we don't need the heat, how many days would the Sunamp store the heat?
It's fantastic to see your commitment to maximizing the use of solar energy in your residence. Incorporating a Sunamp heat battery with your 2kW solar system sounds like a smart move. Sunamp's units are specifically designed to store energy from solar PV systems ( as well as air to water, solar thermal, waste heat, the list goees on ), making them a great fit for your setup. When your solar panels are producing excess energy during the day, this can be stored in the Sunamp unit. Then, even after your passive solar floor cools down at night, the Sunamp can kick in, releasing stored heat to maintain a comfortable temperature in your home. In a future episode of our series Michael is going to show off a system that is exactly as you are describing. It is already filmed we are just doing the editing on it.
One of the standout features of Sunamp's heat batteries is their ability to hold onto that heat for several days and in some cases much longer. So, on days when you don't need the extra warmth, you won't lose that stored energy. It's just a matter of sizing the Sunamp unit correctly, taking into account your daily energy generation and heating needs. This way, you ensure that you're getting the most out of your solar setup, enhancing your home's energy efficiency and making sure none of that precious solar power goes to waste.
Energy density. If this isn't explicitly mentioned, it's snakeoil.
YOU'RE WELCOME!
Had my Sunamp 2.5 years, charged with off peak electric, mains pressure hot water, very happy...................NOW! stop the stupid bloody background noise..
Appreciate your constructive and polite feedback on the video editors use of background music. We have already passed it along
Turn up your background music just a bit and I wouldn't be able to hear a word you are saying.
Thanks for taking a moment to provide constructive feedback.
It is a common gripe I have with many youtube videos. Not trying to pick on you.@@plumbing-hvacmagazine
Heat storage and NOT one of the pipes connected are insulated, what a amateurs.
Tks for your constructive and respectful feedback. This setup that Bluewater has done is for testing dual source and is not an actual home or real world scenario. Our next episode is in an actual home and you will see it is all insulated.
A DIY Sodium Acetate system is worth about $50 . stop ripping people off. Publish plans not garbage
Wow. Garret, You don't mince your words.
These units are tested to specific temps, many cycles and are ready to ship! There is nothing like this elsewhere
@@simonmasters3295 OMG in 1990 I took a 2000L plastic water tank and placed vertical PVC pipes in it with copper coils and Sodium acetate with an on demand solenoid that activated each tube. It was solar heated of course. good old 50 C water came out the other end. Stored it for months.
@@GarretKrampe I appreciate your interest in DIY projects, but it's essential to note that PCM batteries, especially when used for heating and cooling systems, involve complex technology and safety considerations. Manufacturers adhere to rigorous safety and testing standards to ensure these systems are reliable and safe for consumers.
Attempting a DIY PCM battery system without the necessary knowledge and experience can be both dangerous and potentially illegal. It's crucial to prioritize safety and follow established guidelines when working with advanced energy storage systems.
While sharing plans and knowledge can be valuable, it's important to recognize the limitations of DIY projects in complex areas like this. Manufacturers play a critical role in ensuring products meet safety standards and function reliably.
Just as I would advise against attempting dental procedures on your neighbors, I would also strongly discourage you from taking on the responsibility and potential liability of constructing a unique PCM battery for your neighbor.
Your comment is a appreciated and valued. Thanks for watching and for sharing.
I'll take a tested, designed and warrantied product over the thing you knocked together with a hammer on a Sunday afternoon after a few beers, thanks.
@@dlarge6502 lol you take your money and throw that away for sure . Good for you man
Why tf is he running around with a cup? Did you film this in hardware store with random people?
Thanks for your comment and observation about the coffee cup! We wanted to give the video a relaxed, conversational feel, as if you were walking through the tech with a friend. The setting might seem a bit unconventional, but it was chosen because it is a living lab with a ton of technology being tested in a home. We're always experimenting with different formats to keep our content engaging and informative. Your feedback is valuable to us, and we'll keep it in mind as we plan future videos. Thanks for watching and for taking the time to share your thoughts!
I was just started to watch this when I heard them say "de-carbonize" The whole world has gone stupid!
I'll watch something else.
Agree, totally annoying. People don't buy things because it's "carbon neutral". People buy things so they can save money. Anyone that tells you otherwise is a damn liar. I'll still watch this channel, they have great vids, but this environment/carbon neutral BS is fluff. Worried about being "green"? Go vegan - animal ag is responsible for almost HALF of the world's energy consumption.
We appreciate all points of view. Electrification needs to happen in a way that is sustainable economically and as our host Michael often says puts people before profits. All technology has its place. In an upcoming episode we spent time with a gas heat pump manufacturer and hope you enjoy that episode as well.
But can it power a car... 🤔
Maybe proof of consept with a lawnmower?
This is a thermal battery for heating your home not for storing electricity. Your comment is spot on that it will not run your lights but it will heat your home. Tks for sharing your thoughts 🙂
@@plumbing-hvacmagazine I was just thinking about a different application for the technology, using it as a thermal battery and generating electricity on demand via a heat differential. Was thinking of a possibly smaller one for a car. Maybe not power the whole car for long distances, but maybe siphon the heat off the engine it the battery pack, or the inside of the car when it's parked in summer, and then use the extra energy for some extra miles, or to save battery power for driving and use this for the internal systems within the car ... 🤔
@@colleenforrest7936 it's a great thought. The smallest unit is about the size of a microwave and they are charged thermally or with 2.7kw of electric energy. In our next episode we will show off a site using this battery off grid to produce 80 percent of their domestic hot water. Thanks for the great comments
thats just sodium acetate trihydrate.
nothing new here, i did this 10 years ago. everyone knows pocket warmers. if people just would develope their ideas instead of throwing the first thing out they can build just to make some money, we would had better tech.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts! You're right that sodium acetate trihydrate, the material used in pocket warmers, has been known for some time. However, what makes Sunamp's Thermino technology stand out is the way they've innovatively adapted and enhanced this substance for energy storage.
Sunamp has developed a unique intellectual property around this technology, optimizing it for higher efficiency, greater energy density, and longer life cycles than traditional applications. Their approach involves sophisticated phase change material formulations, which allows for more effective heat storage and release at desired temperatures. This makes it particularly suitable for domestic and industrial heating systems, offering a more sustainable and efficient solution compared to conventional methods.
The development of Sunamp's technology involved extensive research and innovation to overcome various challenges, such as stability, scalability, and integration with existing heating systems. It’s this dedication to refining and developing their idea that sets Sunamp apart in the field of thermal energy storage.
Innovation often builds upon existing knowledge, but it's the unique application and continuous improvement of these ideas that drive technological advancement. Sunamp's approach exemplifies how rethinking and developing existing concepts can lead to significant improvements in technology. We appreciate your interest and are always here to discuss more about these exciting developments! We really appreciate your comments and we are looking forward to seeing more PCM technology hit North America!
You did this 10 years ago and you didn't capitalize on it.
Shame.
Please! Stop using "Latent Energy" and say what it is: Latent Heat
The heat pump produces heat as a "waste"??m
Then 😂"From an Exergy standpoint" wtf is that?
I do understand the points about energy density and cost of sunamp versus lithium
"...the last furnace you will ever buy?" Is it not you already bought your last furnace? This is clever tech, don't over complicate it. Micro CHP is presumably a generator set with heat recovery.
Thank you for your constructive and insightful comment. The allure of filming without a script is seeing how viewers dissect and understand various terms and statements. You're spot-on regarding "latent energy," but I'm confident the video conveyed its intended message.
When it comes to your observation about the term 'eXery', I value your input. To clarify for those who might not be as versed in the concept of exergy as you clearly are, let me use an analogy: It's not about whether a coffee maker can produce hot chocolate. Rather, it's questioning why a coffee maker would consume 10 units of energy to prepare a cup of coffee when another gadget might do the same with just 2 units. It boils down to efficiency. While the coffee maker might be adept at converting energy to heat, it possibly isn't the most exergy-efficient means of brewing that cup.
The concept of a micro CHP generating domestic hot water from waste heat through a thermal battery is indeed a forward-thinking application.
@@plumbing-hvacmagazineRewatching. Thanks for your comment. I do like your product, but you are vague on many details specifically the question of raising steam, surely there is no way this device is doing that?
@@simonmasters3295 It is not out product. We are just covering it in our on going HVAC series. If you reach out to sunamp they can help more.
lol
ClimateChange 😉
Absolutely, climate change is a crucial issue, and we're on the same page about its importance. We also believe that a wide range of technologies will be pivotal in helping us meet our collective goals of creating a sustainable and cleaner environment for future generations.
As we film our videos with HVAC experts and climate change experts it's exciting to see innovations across various sectors, from renewable energy to energy-efficient appliances, all contributing to this vital mission. Together, these technologies not only address immediate environmental challenges but also pave the way for a greener, healthier planet for the generations to come. We have many more cool technologies to show off already shot and being released in the coming weeks.
Typical - us Scots inventing new tech… again 🤣😂🤣
I'm sorry but what you have is really obsolete. We don't need to storage energy. This is ridicules. No one will use a gas furnace in the future. Electric energy is free.
Thanks for commenting. There is no gas because this product is exactly as you said the future. It is charged with thermal energy from any source including PV, a heat pump or solar thermal. In this example they used waste heat from a generator
If you use your head for a second.
I go to work. Nobody home. Sunny day. PV panels on roof, wasted. No, not having a li-ion bomb near my house either. But, put this thing in and I can store the free leccy as heat! Could do that with a water tank, but that is cold within a day. This thing however remains able to heat the HOUSE at NIGHT as well as DHW from the taps.
No explosion waiting to happen in the li-ion battery... There isn't one.
Hot water for days and all I needed was one sunny day.
And if the sun doesn't shine, when the clouds are thick and black, but the wind is blowing, the nuclear plants are humming too and there is loads of electricity and the price plummets, even going NEGATIVE, well I can literally be PAID by the electric company to charge this thing up. Thats better than free mate.
@@dlarge6502 But if I have a device the size of a shoe box that cost about $40.00 to build and that will will pull energy from your surroundings, not heat or cold energy that will power everything electric in your home in fact 3 homes that will last about 35 years then that is better than what you have. It has no moving parts and is all electronic. Can't beat that with a stick.