I love that the remnants of the light Ungoliant devoured was key in defeating her greatest child Shelob all those years later, as Sam said, it's the same long story indeed
What I love about Tolkiens description of Ungoliant, is that he not merely uses the word Darkness to describe her power, but Unlight. It doesn't merely clash with light it is undoing the light, it's the opposite of light. That makes it even more terrifying
My childish brain just imagined the Balrogs coming to Morgoth's aid, but instead of having their cool flaming swords, they're all armed with comically oversized newspapers and slippers.
I like the fan theory that she had gone to the edge of night, seeking to consume the very stars, and gone into the darkness, becoming one with it, and there met melkor and had her revenge apon him, when he was exiled.
Has someone who have arachnophobia, I'll be honest and say that these creatures scare the living hell out of me but in another I can also find the character fascinating. For me Shelob is one of the most underrated vilain in the LOTR books and movies.
It's important to note that these beings are explicitly not spiders, but take a spider-*like* form. Tolkien describes them with many features that are quite different from actual spiders. Indeed they are the closest that Tolkien comes to traditional science fiction, as his description alludes to an extraterrestrial origin.
I don't think there's anything science-fiction about it. We know all life comes from Eru and the song of the Ainur so she is still part of that same creation. My personal theory is that she and perhaps the other nameless things were created during the discord of Melkor and they began out in the void because they were literally separated from the creation of Arda but were quickly attracted to it from the innate desire to consume or destroy that they got from Melkor's song. As a more wild theory I also believe Tom Bombadil fought against the nameless things, the pure incarnation of the music of the Ainur against the fruits of the discord that Melkor added and it was him who helped to bind many of the nameless things to the deepest roots of the world where they remain as Gandalf described.
@@TheCrazyCanuck420 I always had the thought that Ungoliant was a byproduct of Melkors own darkness, created when he was first breaking away from the Valar. I thought she was an embodiment all his evil but made alive by mistake and she became more powerful after she took the light form the two trees. I could be wrong tho.
@@TheCrazyCanuck420 yeah i’m pretty sure Tolkien never outright confirmed anything. Which has led to so many people questioning the true identities of these beings (especially Tom) and a lot of overthinking too.
Btw it’s pretty sure that ungolianth is not a maia because Tolkien refused in his later writings the concept that maiar have children everywhere in the world (like the boldog or great eagles) which is quite reasonable since something rotten and evil like an orc or spider shouldn’t have godly blood in them. Since she must be something else.
I love that Tolkien never explains exactly what Ungoliant or Shelob are or where they come from. A good storyteller knows that the imagination of the audience is more terrifying than anything they can come up with.
@@hamptonmini4204 lmfao. you thought you ate. he didn't get a view from me. he's done videos like this before. super repetitive and overcooked but yes, please keep eating it up. omnom.
Poor Melkor, he fears Tulkas who's physically stronger than him, failed to get the affection of Varda, he got cocooned by Ungoliant, he got wounded by Fingolfin which he never recovered from, and got incarcerated twice by the Valar. Seems Melkor got an interesting life in Arda.
I think most scary is that she as not actually a spider but intelligent enough to become a spider. As a spider you make many eggs thus creating armies of spiders. She could have been one of strongest if her children were grown up and almost as big as her. Minas tiritch vs 60.000 orcs or minas tirith vs 120.000 shelob size spiders.
There’s something about villains that I love. I love learning anything I can about the Nazgûl & the Witch King. Give me Shelob all day. Even Harry Potter, give me alllll the Bellatrix. Another awesome video Matt!
The description of Shelob is interesting ... it sounds like her legs are attached to her big baggy body, rather than her head/thorax. She isn't just some normal spider, so there's no reason she has to have a conventional spider anatomy.
Totally unrelated, but could another movie WB makes be about Balin's attempt at a Return to Moria? I believe they have most if not all the rights to tell the story in full. I would love Ken Stott as Balin coming back to lead. On topic, Ungoliant is very interesting for me to theorize about.
Not a huge fan of these direct compilations without any edit inside, as in 11:22, you talk about covering Ungoliant in a later video, with a brief summary, while that part was covered the minutes before, making it a bit less enjoyable to listen to
Ungoliant is a reflection of the disharmony created in music by Melkor, a Vala who originally desired to control light and was rejected by Varda, with his corrupting melodies during the performance of the Music of the Ainur. This is the reason for Ungoliant's insatiable hunger for light. This hunger is a parallel theme, both metaphorically and physically, to Melkor's desire to corrupt creation and impose his will. It makes sense to interpret Ungoliant as being born from Melkor's shadow in this context.
For as deep as the lore goes, I feel that there are many gaps and unanswered questions within and without Middle-Earth. It makes my world builder heart flutter with joy with what we have, but enrages me that these mysteries will never be solved. Well, not in a way that won't make everyone angry, anyway.
One minor correction, I believe, regarding Nan Dungortheb: In addition to Aredhel and Beren, Haleth also led her people through the "Valley of Dreadful Death," on their journey from Thargelion to settle in the Forest of Brethil.
I don’t like spiders but rarely are they actually scary in real life. They are delicate creatures and create beautiful webs. I feel like Tolkien and Rowling did them dirty.
I had to look up what they call her in Swedish, funny enough Shelob is just called "SheMonster" or Honmonstret. I remember that The Shire was called "Fylke" and hobbiton was called "Hobsala". Lord of the Rings is called "Sagan om Ringen" or "The story of the rings". The fellowship is called "Kamratskapet" or the camaraderie. Treebeard is called "lavskägge" or Mossbeard. The nazgul are called both "Ringvålnader" (ring ghosts) and Mörka ryttare (Dark/black riders). One oddity I didn't know about was that the butterbur family is called " Byttesson", barliman name has been changed to Barliman Smörblomma or butterflower. A really funny one (reading about this stuff right now) is falsely giving Merry the credit for taking down the witchking (häxmästaren) of Angmar, I didn't know that beforehand. Edit: Frodo is called "Ringbäraren" or the "ring bearer"
@@danielreynolds6173 Merry didn't finish him, that's what Eowyn did. He still deserves credit for it, just not for being the one to permanently finish the witchking. Edit: if this was a game, he would get an assist but not the Qill for the witchking.
@@SvengelskaBlondie Naturally, you're right. I just meant he deserves credit, not all the credit. The Witch King was about to deliver the coup de grace to her, if I'm remembering the book correctly. It's been a long time. I wonder what he would have thought if someone had told him that he would be slain by a hobbit and a woman.
wait thats a name i havent herd? Melian, considering how damn cool Ungoliant dark story is hearing Melian just block out ungoliant like that made me check if u had a video on Melian but theres only beren and luthien?
It has always interested me that the Valar seemed to never intend to deal with Ungoliant, and were satisfied with her living space (Provided she never came north). How on Middle-earth could such creatures live in Valinor?
In your earlier Tom Theories video you coveredthe idea that Tom and Ungoliant were the Music & Discord of the Ainur, thats my head canon as far as she is concearned
A detail of this always puzzled me. Ungoliant had the greatest of the Valar at her mercy, and had the power to restrain and kill him, but for the intervention of the Balrogs. Then later, a spell laid by Melian, a Mia, NOT a Vala successfully stops her entry to Doriath? I could never see the logic in this, it seems that a creature that could overcome the greatest of the Valar should be able to laugh and stride right thru an area enchanted by a Mia with no hindrance whatsoever.
This is just a guess, but I think Morgoth was already in the decline of his power when he was confronted by Ungoliant. We also know that Melian was a pretty powerful Maia on her own, possibly on the same level as Sauron, and maybe Ungoliant was injured by the attack of the Balrogs, so it's possible she didn't have the strength at the time to break through the Girdle.
Is there another source that says the Balrogs "fly with winged speed"? In my edition of The Silmarillion, it simply says they arose... (which I interpret as they ascended from the deep vaults in the ruins of Angband.)
Ungoliant really is one of the most fascinating and creepy additions Tolkien ever made to his world. Is Ungoliant a Maiar? Probably not, honestly. Nobody in Arda seems to recognize them or understand. Ungoliant is also more powerful than any Maiar we’ve seen. Its purpose is to consume, consume light specifically. The Maiar were created to help shape the world. Ungoliant’s entire purpose is to consume and darken it. Is Ungoliant a Valar? Absolutely not. That one’s straight forward, but they aren’t, despite having power to rival them. Ungoliant just… is. They just exist. Even though Ungoliant just got some juice and Melkor’s tired, Ungoliant straight up almost kills Melkor. That’s an unbelievable feat, and Ungoliant is never beaten. Just… leaves. Cosmic horror spider that seems to be outside of sentient life on Arda as we know it.
This is more a personal fear of Tolkien than mythos. He neglected other forms of evil from legends and mythologies he inspired like you know *'Snakes'.* Dragons are considered serpentine but was talking about literal snakes. Can be gigantic or hybrid races. Also it's weak to say that *Ungoliant* a Maiar. What if she's a *Valar* that was corrupted by the song made by Melkor that she descended on the Void and into the World when it was made? No one knows who saw her goes out but Eru himself.
If Melkor wasn't counted among the numbers of the Valar in spite of common origin why couldn't another have been so, maybe not even the only one corrupted to his side but they don't play a part for some reason and aren't spoken of. I always felt there was something bigger at play we only get snippets of that allude to it being the case. Perhaps something he wanted unexplained or never got to elaborate on, I would have loved to pick his brain about the idea.
He might have been inspired by old druidic stories who have many stories about spiders. And some horror stories about druids who worshiped spiders and became half spiders or driders. Dungeons and Dragons have used this as inspiration for the dark elves and their goddess
I have two theories about Ungoliant. 1. She being the lost souls of the world before. Fueld by the hatred that they all died. 2. She being the essence of the void itself. Wanting more Nothing and Unlit everywhere.
One thing that always confused me was that ungoliant took her strength from consuming light. Yet shelob, ungoliants spawn, was repelled by the light and loathed it.
I love LotR, BUT the power scales are all over the place man (at least to me)... Ungoliant almost kills Melkor, saved by Balrogs... Ungoliant was literally invisible walking next door to all the powerhouses, walking up to the two trees, BUT can't penetrate a Maia's shield... A single elf (Fingolfin) injuring Melkor while 3 Maiar (excluding the blue wizards) are terrified of Melkor's servant (Sauron)... I love the Elves, but it bothered me as a kid being introduced to lotr and Galadriel always seemed to be more powerful than Gandalf... The way i understood the power scales was, Eru-Valar-Maiar-Elves-Dwarves-Men
I've never seen any reason to think Ungoliant wasn't one of the Ainur; she just chose to take a very different form when she came to Arda. Tolkien never speaks of any other beings created by Ilúvatar prior to the existence of Arda other than the Ainur.
Btw it’s pretty sure that ungolianth is not a maia because Tolkien refused in his later writings the concept that maiar have children everywhere in the world (like the boldog or great eagles) which is quite reasonable since something rotten and evil like an orc or spider shouldn’t have godly blood in them. Since she must be something else.
@ Maybe not directly, but there were a lot of writers working in similar “cosmic horror” veins during the 20s and 30s. Arthur Machen’s The Great God Pan dates, I think, from the 1890s.
The nameless things under the mountains certainly had that vibe as well. I think he may have been playing at something bigger, beings that may have existed in the void before Eru started his whole thing and they were drawn to Arda in it's formation. We only see a small bit of stories and not the whole thing
The Spiders of Mirkwood could speak, but not in Westron. I think their gurgling sounds were understood by Bilbo because he was wearing the One Ring. There was no way spiders were speaking a language that was understood by all in the West. Where would they have learned it?
If Ungoliant took the form of a beautiful giantess while Shelob took the form of a beautiful woman: Melkor: "I'll never give you the silmarils, Ungoliant." -transforms into a woman Ungoliant: "how about now?" Melkor: 😍😍 Third Age: Shelob(singsong): "Ohhh Frodo!!" Frodo: "who's there? By the shire, what's a beautiful maiden like you doing in a cave like this?" Gollum: 🤦
I think in The Making of 'Middle-earth - The Worlds of Tolkien and The Lord of the Rings' it says that Tolkien was a bit arachnophobic at some point but I am not sure.
*The mystery of the Void Horror, Queen Ungoliant’s origin, was as deep as the plain from which she likely emerged, rivaled only by her end. From voice or voices unknown, it is spoken from them that her hunger ravaged her to her own consumption, maddened and numbed by the encapsulation of famine’s mighty agony. If thee trust not the darkly high tales of the great unnaturalness in her utter dread and light-choking disgust, having scarred the most fortunate of mightiest or purest beings, look to the unholy arachnid’s spawn, heir Shelob, Void Princess, most of all, lest you dare take a risk of becoming their foul meal and thusly fuel the broods’ invasions of woods and valleys. A wonder on its own, the lesser spiders today, that their works safeguard Man in their Dominion upon the new world from harm or infestation. Is it amendments through honor, or does great size beckon greater gall?*
I very long time must have passed before the sun was created for her to live in the mountains of terror and went south to disappear before the first age started.
![The Dragons of Middle-earth [COMPILATION]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YSUlfiQVuDg/mqdefault.jpg)
![The Dragons of Middle-earth [COMPILATION]](/img/tr.png)
One is never late to a Nerd of the rings video, nor is he early, he arrives precisely when he means to.
😂👍🏼
😂😂😂
Which is about 4 hours after the video uploads 😅
Make that ten hours after...precisely when he means to
Sounds like me,14 seconds ago
I love that the remnants of the light Ungoliant devoured was key in defeating her greatest child Shelob all those years later, as Sam said, it's the same long story indeed
The light of the Phail was starlight, not light of the trees
@martinsweeney7633 the light was the light of the star of Eärendil, which is a Silmaril, which itself holds the light of the two trees
What I love about Tolkiens description of Ungoliant, is that he not merely uses the word Darkness to describe her power, but Unlight. It doesn't merely clash with light it is undoing the light, it's the opposite of light. That makes it even more terrifying
and she doesnt spread it, she weaves it, step by step
One simply cannot avoid watching another great video from Nerd of the rings!!
I always thought that Aragon would have to have dealt with Shelob at some point , no way he could have such a menace on his doorstep
Aragorn: alright lads we gonna stomp on a spider
My childish brain just imagined the Balrogs coming to Morgoth's aid, but instead of having their cool flaming swords, they're all armed with comically oversized newspapers and slippers.
I like the fan theory that she had gone to the edge of night, seeking to consume the very stars, and gone into the darkness, becoming one with it, and there met melkor and had her revenge apon him, when he was exiled.
Has someone who have arachnophobia, I'll be honest and say that these creatures scare the living hell out of me but in another I can also find the character fascinating. For me Shelob is one of the most underrated vilain in the LOTR books and movies.
It's important to note that these beings are explicitly not spiders, but take a spider-*like* form. Tolkien describes them with many features that are quite different from actual spiders. Indeed they are the closest that Tolkien comes to traditional science fiction, as his description alludes to an extraterrestrial origin.
I don't think there's anything science-fiction about it. We know all life comes from Eru and the song of the Ainur so she is still part of that same creation. My personal theory is that she and perhaps the other nameless things were created during the discord of Melkor and they began out in the void because they were literally separated from the creation of Arda but were quickly attracted to it from the innate desire to consume or destroy that they got from Melkor's song. As a more wild theory I also believe Tom Bombadil fought against the nameless things, the pure incarnation of the music of the Ainur against the fruits of the discord that Melkor added and it was him who helped to bind many of the nameless things to the deepest roots of the world where they remain as Gandalf described.
You know Ungoliant is some SERIOUS darkness when even Melkor himself fears her! Thanks as always Matt! 🖖☺🤘🇨🇦
For sure! She's not your ordinary everyday darkness, she is... advanced darkness
Imagine if Ungoliant took the form of a Beautiful Giantess like how Shelob took the form of a beautiful woman.
@UltimateSpider1385 Ah...that would be Interesting. By the way Spider-Man has been my favourite superhero for the last 45 years 👍
I think Ungoliant is just a different type of being all together. Same with Tom Bombadill. Things within Arda before the Ainur arrived.
Is that up for debate? I thought that is what Ungoliant and Tom are, beings that were part of the world newly created.
@@TheCrazyCanuck420 I always had the thought that Ungoliant was a byproduct of Melkors own darkness, created when he was first breaking away from the Valar. I thought she was an embodiment all his evil but made alive by mistake and she became more powerful after she took the light form the two trees. I could be wrong tho.
@@TheCrazyCanuck420 yeah i’m pretty sure Tolkien never outright confirmed anything. Which has led to so many people questioning the true identities of these beings (especially Tom) and a lot of overthinking too.
Btw it’s pretty sure that ungolianth is not a maia because Tolkien refused in his later writings the concept that maiar have children everywhere in the world (like the boldog or great eagles) which is quite reasonable since something rotten and evil like an orc or spider shouldn’t have godly blood in them. Since she must be something else.
@@edsattler2626 Melian had children though, so it is not impossible
I love that Tolkien never explains exactly what Ungoliant or Shelob are or where they come from. A good storyteller knows that the imagination of the audience is more terrifying than anything they can come up with.
Truly one of the great eldridge monstrosities.
Your work is brilliant thank you sir
Thanks so much!!
dude it's a mix AI-script and reporting on what's already been written. brilliant is a stretch lol
@arwen2734 why are you here if you're just going to moan? What a sadly little life Jane.
@@arwen2734 Yet you still watched it and got him money through that view. If you don't like it, don't watch it
@@hamptonmini4204 lmfao. you thought you ate. he didn't get a view from me. he's done videos like this before. super repetitive and overcooked but yes, please keep eating it up. omnom.
Matt many thks❤
Happy New Year❤
Always outstanding❤
Headcanon: Morgoth was left with a crippling arachnophobia after his ordeal with Ungoliant. Understandable, if you ask me.
Yeah , Sauron would always needle Morgoth by singing "itsy bitsy spider in the waterspout..."
🤣🤣🤣@@OldManStrong-j5m
When I really think about it, spiders kinda pass as a fantasy monster. Almost fiction.
@@OldManStrong-j5m Sauron was a professional troll
@@EVANSMUSIC19 Especially when they are made bigger than a large dog or into the size of a Mumakill
Alternative Video Title: The Nopes of Middle Earth
Or better still... Oh hell to the no of Middle Earth
@@journeysands2622 The ‘bedtime horrors that appear in your nightmares and you can’t run away from them’
imagine 12:19 imagine walking work one morning and just seeing a truck size spider going on a rode trip down east
Tolkien certainly knew terror. Would have been very interesting to get a horror story by him
Hell yeah. Just the travel through Moria in Fellowship was as good or better than many modern tales
I love this channel
Love to hear it! :)
It’s truly amazing
*Fun fact:* Here in Spain Shelob is called "Ella-Laraña", which would mean "She-Thespider"
She means Ella and lob sounds like cob an old word for spider so it’s a good translation
@@TomThumb151515beat me to it.
Poor Melkor, he fears Tulkas who's physically stronger than him, failed to get the affection of Varda, he got cocooned by Ungoliant, he got wounded by Fingolfin which he never recovered from, and got incarcerated twice by the Valar.
Seems Melkor got an interesting life in Arda.
Then they put him into the outer dark.... bet you ungolient was waiting >:)
I think most scary is that she as not actually a spider but intelligent enough to become a spider. As a spider you make many eggs thus creating armies of spiders. She could have been one of strongest if her children were grown up and almost as big as her. Minas tiritch vs 60.000 orcs or minas tirith vs 120.000 shelob size spiders.
That sounds absolutely horrifying
There’s something about villains that I love. I love learning anything I can about the Nazgûl & the Witch King. Give me Shelob all day. Even Harry Potter, give me alllll the Bellatrix. Another awesome video Matt!
The description of Shelob is interesting ... it sounds like her legs are attached to her big baggy body, rather than her head/thorax. She isn't just some normal spider, so there's no reason she has to have a conventional spider anatomy.
17:35 this would be so cool to see in a movie one day. The battlefields at Erebor and Dale and the destruction of Dol Guldur
love the work 💪
Christopher Lee was a descendent of Charlemange the first!😊
Need you doing audio books. Also what character are you playing in the new movie?
Haha. I'm not in any movies. But I really appreciate your vote of confidence for that and audiobooks!
Your videos are wonderful. Thank you!
So much to know about the middle earth and you are doing great work. The fantasy imagination is way beyond the mind reach of today
Totally unrelated, but could another movie WB makes be about Balin's attempt at a Return to Moria? I believe they have most if not all the rights to tell the story in full. I would love Ken Stott as Balin coming back to lead.
On topic, Ungoliant is very interesting for me to theorize about.
That would be a sad story, at best with a bitter sweet ending. It would take some really great talent to make a good movie out of that.
So a movie where the good guys all die?
@@TheCrazyCanuck420 Yup, pretty much! It has to be to add up nicely to Gandalf's report when the Fellowship visited Balin's tomb.
@ yeah we need one
There's a game called Return To Moria. And it is very true to the source material. Excellent.
Happy new year Matt!
Absolutely excellent. Thank you.
Every Saturday at noon I always have something to look forward to.
Not a huge fan of these direct compilations without any edit inside, as in 11:22, you talk about covering Ungoliant in a later video, with a brief summary, while that part was covered the minutes before, making it a bit less enjoyable to listen to
agreed. Not sure what the purpose of this.
it literally says compilation
I love your content so much
I actually love spiders, so seeing Shelob and the spiders of Mirkwood are some of my favourite parts of the movies. 😊😁
Another banger!
Kinda fitting as I just read the Shelob's lair chapter in the Two Towers book 😊
Thanks for your Work! Maybe we get new video about the unspoken things below Moria?
Love nerd of the rings channels aswell there so much great Tolkien content going about justnow .another one echno of arda just amazing
Interesting if a little repetitive in places. Frodo and Sam’s encounters with Shelob are some of the best scenes in Peter Jackson’s film. 😁🏴
I like spiders. They don’t like me
-Melkor, somewhere in the First age.
It's 2 am and I was gonna head to bed but a notr video seems much more important than sleep🎉
Ungoliant is a reflection of the disharmony created in music by Melkor, a Vala who originally desired to control light and was rejected by Varda, with his corrupting melodies during the performance of the Music of the Ainur. This is the reason for Ungoliant's insatiable hunger for light. This hunger is a parallel theme, both metaphorically and physically, to Melkor's desire to corrupt creation and impose his will. It makes sense to interpret Ungoliant as being born from Melkor's shadow in this context.
It would be awesome to see the Darklord scream in terror as he would be devoured by a giant spider 😂 Clearly he did not think this through enough.
I love your videos
Love Shelob and the other beautiful spiders of middle earth
A rolled-up newspaper will take care of Ungoliant! No problem!
I must be out of my mind for clicking on this video. Tolkien sure knew how to take arachnophobia to a whole new level.
Bet he found a big hairy one in his bed when he was a little kid!
I love that even Tolkien acknowledged the mysteries of the Void
For as deep as the lore goes, I feel that there are many gaps and unanswered questions within and without Middle-Earth. It makes my world builder heart flutter with joy with what we have, but enrages me that these mysteries will never be solved. Well, not in a way that won't make everyone angry, anyway.
One minor correction, I believe, regarding Nan Dungortheb: In addition to Aredhel and Beren, Haleth also led her people through the "Valley of Dreadful Death," on their journey from Thargelion to settle in the Forest of Brethil.
I don’t like spiders but rarely are they actually scary in real life. They are delicate creatures and create beautiful webs. I feel like Tolkien and Rowling did them dirty.
Hagrid? Is that you? 😂
Happy New Year!
Nice combination of old videos 😜
I have always wondered why the hell Shelob travelled so far away from Ered Gorgoroth towards specifically to Mordor. Why there and not other place
Man the valaraukar are the real bros to melkor
When are you reviewing HOME box set 4 and the collected poems of JRR Tolkien!!!!????
I had to look up what they call her in Swedish, funny enough Shelob is just called "SheMonster" or Honmonstret. I remember that The Shire was called "Fylke" and hobbiton was called "Hobsala". Lord of the Rings is called "Sagan om Ringen" or "The story of the rings". The fellowship is called "Kamratskapet" or the camaraderie. Treebeard is called "lavskägge" or Mossbeard. The nazgul are called both "Ringvålnader" (ring ghosts) and Mörka ryttare (Dark/black riders).
One oddity I didn't know about was that the butterbur family is called " Byttesson", barliman name has been changed to Barliman Smörblomma or butterflower. A really funny one (reading about this stuff right now) is falsely giving Merry the credit for taking down the witchking (häxmästaren) of Angmar, I didn't know that beforehand.
Edit: Frodo is called "Ringbäraren" or the "ring bearer"
Merry deserves credit for the demise of the Witch King, who would have certainly killed Eowyn if not for Merry's uncommon valor!
@@danielreynolds6173 Merry didn't finish him, that's what Eowyn did. He still deserves credit for it, just not for being the one to permanently finish the witchking.
Edit: if this was a game, he would get an assist but not the Qill for the witchking.
@@SvengelskaBlondie Naturally, you're right. I just meant he deserves credit, not all the credit. The Witch King was about to deliver the coup de grace to her, if I'm remembering the book correctly. It's been a long time. I wonder what he would have thought if someone had told him that he would be slain by a hobbit and a woman.
wait thats a name i havent herd? Melian, considering how damn cool Ungoliant dark story is hearing Melian just block out ungoliant like that made me check if u had a video on Melian but theres only beren and luthien?
Spider-Cthulhu ain't no joke.
9:00 funnily enough, some think the "forgotten south" refers to the Dark Land continent, aka Australia because its full of spiders hehe
It has always interested me that the Valar seemed to never intend to deal with Ungoliant, and were satisfied with her living space (Provided she never came north). How on Middle-earth could such creatures live in Valinor?
In your earlier Tom Theories video you coveredthe idea that Tom and Ungoliant were the Music & Discord of the Ainur, thats my head canon as far as she is concearned
You should do a video about what would have happened if Shelob had acquired the ring
I watch all your vids to matt just skick in there
Hi, good video! Say, didn’t Haleth lead her people thru Nan Dungortheb to get to Brethil? That would be another group/person that made it thru..
A detail of this always puzzled me. Ungoliant had the greatest of the Valar at her mercy, and had the power to restrain and kill him, but for the intervention of the Balrogs. Then later, a spell laid by Melian, a Mia, NOT a Vala successfully stops her entry to Doriath? I could never see the logic in this, it seems that a creature that could overcome the greatest of the Valar should be able to laugh and stride right thru an area enchanted by a Mia with no hindrance whatsoever.
This is just a guess, but I think Morgoth was already in the decline of his power when he was confronted by Ungoliant. We also know that Melian was a pretty powerful Maia on her own, possibly on the same level as Sauron, and maybe Ungoliant was injured by the attack of the Balrogs, so it's possible she didn't have the strength at the time to break through the Girdle.
5:42, they have wings! 😂😂
Is there another source that says the Balrogs "fly with winged speed"? In my edition of The Silmarillion, it simply says they arose... (which I interpret as they ascended from the deep vaults in the ruins of Angband.)
Ungoliant really is one of the most fascinating and creepy additions Tolkien ever made to his world.
Is Ungoliant a Maiar? Probably not, honestly. Nobody in Arda seems to recognize them or understand. Ungoliant is also more powerful than any Maiar we’ve seen. Its purpose is to consume, consume light specifically. The Maiar were created to help shape the world. Ungoliant’s entire purpose is to consume and darken it.
Is Ungoliant a Valar? Absolutely not. That one’s straight forward, but they aren’t, despite having power to rival them.
Ungoliant just… is. They just exist. Even though Ungoliant just got some juice and Melkor’s tired, Ungoliant straight up almost kills Melkor. That’s an unbelievable feat, and Ungoliant is never beaten. Just… leaves.
Cosmic horror spider that seems to be outside of sentient life on Arda as we know it.
W vid 🙏
This is more a personal fear of Tolkien than mythos. He neglected other forms of evil from legends and mythologies he inspired like you know *'Snakes'.* Dragons are considered serpentine but was talking about literal snakes. Can be gigantic or hybrid races.
Also it's weak to say that *Ungoliant* a Maiar. What if she's a *Valar* that was corrupted by the song made by Melkor that she descended on the Void and into the World when it was made? No one knows who saw her goes out but Eru himself.
If Melkor wasn't counted among the numbers of the Valar in spite of common origin why couldn't another have been so, maybe not even the only one corrupted to his side but they don't play a part for some reason and aren't spoken of. I always felt there was something bigger at play we only get snippets of that allude to it being the case. Perhaps something he wanted unexplained or never got to elaborate on, I would have loved to pick his brain about the idea.
He might have been inspired by old druidic stories who have many stories about spiders. And some horror stories about druids who worshiped spiders and became half spiders or driders. Dungeons and Dragons have used this as inspiration for the dark elves and their goddess
I wonder if any of the dwarf halls in any of the mountains of the south where over run by spiders.like Moria was with the belrog and orcs
I have two theories about Ungoliant.
1. She being the lost souls of the world before. Fueld by the hatred that they all died.
2. She being the essence of the void itself. Wanting more Nothing and Unlit everywhere.
16:50 got an ad right then😂🎉
And then 2 ads upon clicking on the time code
Didn't Haleth also pass with her people through the Nan Dungortheb when they fled from Ossiriand to Brethil?
Let this be the hour when we watch a nerd of the rings video
One thing that always confused me was that ungoliant took her strength from consuming light. Yet shelob, ungoliants spawn, was repelled by the light and loathed it.
I love LotR, BUT the power scales are all over the place man (at least to me)... Ungoliant almost kills Melkor, saved by Balrogs... Ungoliant was literally invisible walking next door to all the powerhouses, walking up to the two trees, BUT can't penetrate a Maia's shield... A single elf (Fingolfin) injuring Melkor while 3 Maiar (excluding the blue wizards) are terrified of Melkor's servant (Sauron)...
I love the Elves, but it bothered me as a kid being introduced to lotr and Galadriel always seemed to be more powerful than Gandalf...
The way i understood the power scales was, Eru-Valar-Maiar-Elves-Dwarves-Men
5:40 So… Balrogs do have wings? :P
No definitely not. Not vestigial or functional
I've never seen any reason to think Ungoliant wasn't one of the Ainur; she just chose to take a very different form when she came to Arda. Tolkien never speaks of any other beings created by Ilúvatar prior to the existence of Arda other than the Ainur.
Btw it’s pretty sure that ungolianth is not a maia because Tolkien refused in his later writings the concept that maiar have children everywhere in the world (like the boldog or great eagles) which is quite reasonable since something rotten and evil like an orc or spider shouldn’t have godly blood in them. Since she must be something else.
NOTR, thank you so much, I can finally talk to my dad about Lord of the Rings
Weird, normally your videos are 1080p but YT has the settings go to a maximum of 720p
I think Ungoliant is Tolkien doing a riff on Lovecraft’s Cthulhu Mythos…
Was Tolkein aware of Cthulhu Mythos?
@ Maybe not directly, but there were a lot of writers working in similar “cosmic horror” veins during the 20s and 30s. Arthur Machen’s The Great God Pan dates, I think, from the 1890s.
The nameless things under the mountains certainly had that vibe as well. I think he may have been playing at something bigger, beings that may have existed in the void before Eru started his whole thing and they were drawn to Arda in it's formation. We only see a small bit of stories and not the whole thing
Could just be he was doing his own mythos. I never heard of Lovecraft before the internet.
@@shaunfinnegan6546 Certainly possible.
The Spiders of Mirkwood could speak, but not in Westron. I think their gurgling sounds were understood by Bilbo because he was wearing the One Ring. There was no way spiders were speaking a language that was understood by all in the West. Where would they have learned it?
If Ungoliant took the form of a beautiful giantess while Shelob took the form of a beautiful woman:
Melkor: "I'll never give you the silmarils, Ungoliant."
-transforms into a woman
Ungoliant: "how about now?"
Melkor: 😍😍
Third Age:
Shelob(singsong): "Ohhh Frodo!!"
Frodo: "who's there? By the shire, what's a beautiful maiden like you doing in a cave like this?"
Gollum: 🤦
Ungoliant: Destroys the two trees of valinor, and almost kills melkor
Shelob: Gets killed by a hobbit
I always timm she was one of the nameless things, like come on morgoth, did dug his fort deaper when any mine
I think in The Making of 'Middle-earth - The Worlds of Tolkien and The Lord of the Rings' it says that Tolkien was a bit arachnophobic at some point but I am not sure.
What about Ziggy Stardust and the Spiders from Mars?
"His cat he called her, but she owned him not"
Tolkien, cat person confirmed ^^
It stings! Stings! 🗡️
*The mystery of the Void Horror, Queen Ungoliant’s origin, was as deep as the plain from which she likely emerged, rivaled only by her end. From voice or voices unknown, it is spoken from them that her hunger ravaged her to her own consumption, maddened and numbed by the encapsulation of famine’s mighty agony. If thee trust not the darkly high tales of the great unnaturalness in her utter dread and light-choking disgust, having scarred the most fortunate of mightiest or purest beings, look to the unholy arachnid’s spawn, heir Shelob, Void Princess, most of all, lest you dare take a risk of becoming their foul meal and thusly fuel the broods’ invasions of woods and valleys. A wonder on its own, the lesser spiders today, that their works safeguard Man in their Dominion upon the new world from harm or infestation. Is it amendments through honor, or does great size beckon greater gall?*
Matt, you sound a bit hoarse. Take care of yourself. I pray that you feel better soon.
The spiders of Middle Earth makes the Balrogs of Morgoth look cute and cuddly in comparison.
i feel like ungoliant is the opposite of tom bombadil
I very long time must have passed before the sun was created for her to live in the mountains of terror and went south to disappear before the first age started.