Thanks Alfred, because of this video ...I am now the proud owner of a Cincinatti #2 with all the goodies that you showed in the video...love this machine!!! $1500 including freight to my shop...Gracias
Just bought a norton no 2 thought it was a cylindrical grinder as that's how it was marketed. There's not alot on these grinders so it's a super helpful video
A demo on truing and dressing diamond wheels would be appreciated. Very little information available on the subject and even pro machinists seem to struggle.
If have the no.2 workhead setup for 5c collets it can be just as adjustable as the KO Lee and will give I think a better finish circle grinding. Looks like someone has removed the table keys and locks from the head. You can run taper tools more accurately on the no.2 if you also have the blocks for the sine bar attachment. A KO Lee will tilt on the spindle if have a Dakota model. I have one. All my wheels for the KO Lee I have to balance to get a good finish circle grinding. On the no.2 you wouldn't need to do that as it is a much more solid machine. One attachment I have is a Hybco head . You can do a lot of things if you know how to use it. You do need a lot of cams and there not cheep . But you only need to buy them once . Working on my 53rd year in the business and no plans to retire.
Hi, Alfred. Thanks for the video. Just found it (two years later). You brought back some memories. I spent many years operating a Cinci Cutter Grinder in my younger days as well as other grinders. Maybe you could do a video showing the grinding of a high speed roughing shell mill ( I haven't yet checked your channel's video list). I sharpened these monsters (some as big as 4" diammeter) for a lot of years. Subscribed.
I'd like to see a deep dive into wheels. I have a union tool and cutter grinder. Not played with it yet but I'd like to get a better idea of what I'm going to need
Thanks so much Alfred, this didn't help my cause any, now i really want one on the shop. I like the aspect of ball bearing style ways(on the k.o.'s), just wish they were replaceable like my taft peirce surface grinder.
I have a little K.O. Lee grinder and have been enjoying learning to use it. Any thoughts on general safety tips when grinding carbide? Thanks for all your videos!
Hi Alfred, my neighbor has a Cincinnati No. 2 T & C grinder that I'm looking to get and clean up/restore. I got an EX-CELL-O 602 vertical mill from him almost two years ago that I've been restoring. I just ran across your channel and am starting to watch your videos on the T & C grinder. It seems like a really versatile tool, I can see it being used for many purposes. Thanks for the informative videos, I've subscribed and liked a couple so far.
Thanks Alfred, I'm learning a lot. I'm familiar with dressing vitrified wheels, but nobody at work even knows that dressing diamond wheels is possible.
Great overview of the Universal tool & cutter grinder. Do you think this type of grinder is useful for a hobbyist as a general purpose grinder. I am looking at one right now, and my needs are very basic surface grinding of small parts, cylindrical grinding and other types of grinding in the home shop. I was really looking for a small surface grinder, but a friend recommended one of these as they are more flexible. Thanks.
Arnljot Seem in my opinion a KO Lee is the better machine for what you are talking about. It is more similar to a surface grinder and I have often ground cylindrically on them.
Thanks for the Video Alfred Lyon, I have a Surface Grinder and Jig Grinder in my shop and watching this makes me want to add a tool & cutter grinder LOL
Big Chilote absolutely but you will need the right kind of work head if you’re grinding rolled relief or if you’re doing straight facet style relief any work head will work.
I like the Makino C-40 universal tool and cutter grinder. Similar to the Cincinnati #2 but a little easier to work with IMHO. The wheeled angle adjustment on it seems to have a bit more clearance to get tools in close.
Shannon Rollins yes. We have another one called a Kao Ming. The wheel head is actually a multi point swivel which is really fun as it creates “soft axes”.
Hey Alfred, what taper is in your Cincinnati no.2 work heads? From what I've been researching, it looks. Like they came with brown n sharp no 7 or Morse taper no.2, but man that looked like an nmtb 50 tool holder, that thing was huge. The reason I'm asking, is a guy locally scrapped out a no.2, and kept a few things including the work head, and I'm planning on picking it up to use on my surface grinder(work with what ya got lol). But it should be a good addition to my shop anyways.
I used a KO Lee at one shop where I occasionally ran a gun drilling machine. Used it to touch up the solid carbide drills. It was a cool little machine, but no one there really knew what they were doing (we followed the instructions from the drill company as best we could) I'd love to learn more about this aspect of the trade! Thanks for the video!
i have 5c and 8h collet adaptors for mine. Cincinnati beefier than ko lee. Steel beats aliminum. and yes nut busters getting them on and off the machine :)
Preformed carbide blanks are turned during their “green” state. At that point in the process they are almost like a chalk consistency and most features can be machines into them before hardening/sintering
Konely King not at all. We are a small shop and we do only specials with some of our own catalog items. A good portion of our jobs are one offs and sometimes the older ways are faster. Also, we just bought our first CNC grinder in 2012 so they are still new to us.
Got a question can a Cincinnati number two grind Morris tapers or any other tapers? I know it's not specifically made for this but it seems like with one of those drive systems for cylindrical grinding you could make sure it work of small tapers and stuff like that or just grinding cylinders.?
@@alfredlyon27 thank you for the reply.... i found one of these in sparkling condition for $800!!! the guy said its like brand new condition he is automating his shop and needs the room.... but I think I best get an od grinder or surface grinder
Alfred Lyon x and y move ninety to each other. And I wish I could send a pic. I know another way to achieve the task. But it involves a tracer and a floating table
Mark Spencer haha, yes they do. Your question to me was how can you grind a straight diameter with the table at 30°. The way I explained it is how. I’m sure that I just didn’t explain it clear enough. I can make a quick video soon.
Mark Spencer maybe I misunderstood your question. If you’re asking how to have a straight diameter as well as a 30° angle then you would need to grind the diameter and form the angle at the same time.
Thanks Alfred, because of this video ...I am now the proud owner of a Cincinatti #2 with all the goodies that you showed in the video...love this machine!!!
$1500 including freight to my shop...Gracias
Preston Engebretson awesome 👏 I hope that you enjoy it as much as I do !
Nicely done. Keep up the great work.
Cheers,
Tom
oxtoolco Thank You . One of these days I’ll get a real camera, tripod, and a microphone. 😂
Just bought a norton no 2 thought it was a cylindrical grinder as that's how it was marketed. There's not alot on these grinders so it's a super helpful video
A demo on truing and dressing diamond wheels would be appreciated. Very little information available on the subject and even pro machinists seem to struggle.
Flintstone Engineering great idea! I’ll do that next time. Thank You 🙏🏻
If have the no.2 workhead setup for 5c collets it can be just as adjustable as the KO Lee and will give I think a better finish circle grinding. Looks like someone has removed the table keys and locks from the head. You can run taper tools more accurately on the no.2 if you also have the blocks for the sine bar attachment. A KO Lee will tilt on the spindle if have a Dakota model. I have one. All my wheels for the KO Lee I have to balance to get a good finish circle grinding. On the no.2 you wouldn't need to do that as it is a much more solid machine. One attachment I have is a Hybco head . You can do a lot of things if you know how to use it. You do need a lot of cams and there not cheep . But you only need to buy them once . Working on my 53rd year in the business and no plans to retire.
Hi, Alfred. Thanks for the video. Just found it (two years later). You brought back some memories. I spent many years operating a Cinci Cutter Grinder in my younger days as well as other grinders. Maybe you could do a video showing the grinding of a high speed roughing shell mill ( I haven't yet checked your channel's video list). I sharpened these monsters (some as big as 4" diammeter) for a lot of years. Subscribed.
I'd like to see a deep dive into wheels. I have a union tool and cutter grinder. Not played with it yet but I'd like to get a better idea of what I'm going to need
Thank you, this is very helpful for those of us who have no idea what where doing.
I used to have No 2 clearly much older than yours i wish I had never sold it, now I am looking for another one.
Thanks so much Alfred, this didn't help my cause any, now i really want one on the shop.
I like the aspect of ball bearing style ways(on the k.o.'s), just wish they were replaceable like my taft peirce surface grinder.
dj berg the Cincinnati has ball bearings but our KO Lees have flat /triangle groove ways on the X
I have a little K.O. Lee grinder and have been enjoying learning to use it. Any thoughts on general safety tips when grinding carbide? Thanks for all your videos!
Josh Kopel Thank You , that’s a great topic for another video.
Thanks Alfred! Tool and cutter grinding is a definite weak point on TH-cam.
carlquib I will try to get more stuff up soon.
Good stuff Alfred!
ATB, Robin
Bhaya jvab Dena
Hi Alfred, my neighbor has a Cincinnati No. 2 T & C grinder that I'm looking to get and clean up/restore. I got an EX-CELL-O 602 vertical mill from him almost two years ago that I've been restoring. I just ran across your channel and am starting to watch your videos on the T & C grinder. It seems like a really versatile tool, I can see it being used for many purposes. Thanks for the informative videos, I've subscribed and liked a couple so far.
Jim M Thank You . If you have specific questions feel free to ask
I'd love to know how that little diamond dresser works that you showed near the end of the video. Is that for resin bonded diamond wheels?
Pete Brubaker yes, it will work for many diamond bonds. I have been asked to share dressing and truing wheels next. Thank You 🙏🏻
Thanks Alfred, I'm learning a lot. I'm familiar with dressing vitrified wheels, but nobody at work even knows that dressing diamond wheels is possible.
Super cool man, i think Mr. Abom would be proud of your informative attitude. Keep making videos man im subbed in hopes of seeing more!!
Imagine A World I definitely need to make more and especially cutter grinding related. I hope to very soon. Thank You 🙏🏻
Great overview of the Universal tool & cutter grinder. Do you think this type of grinder is useful for a hobbyist as a general purpose grinder. I am looking at one right now, and my needs are very basic surface grinding of small parts, cylindrical grinding and other types of grinding in the home shop. I was really looking for a small surface grinder, but a friend recommended one of these as they are more flexible. Thanks.
Arnljot Seem in my opinion a KO Lee is the better machine for what you are talking about. It is more similar to a surface grinder and I have often ground cylindrically on them.
Weydemann & Hasselkus universal tool grinders are the best manual machines
Thanks for the Video Alfred Lyon, I have a Surface Grinder and Jig Grinder in my shop and watching this makes me want to add a tool & cutter grinder LOL
Eric Richards they are a must have .
Hello Alfred, thank you for sharing.
Is possible to sharpen drill bits with this machine?
Big Chilote absolutely but you will need the right kind of work head if you’re grinding rolled relief or if you’re doing straight facet style relief any work head will work.
I just bought a K.OLee look for me in the future I’ll need help
thanks
A lot of good information hear the kinda of stuff that is overlooked on TH-cam.
Ryan Oros Thank You
Love these videos. Are you using these grinders just for manufacturing or do you also offer a resharpening service as well?
It's also great to see a company utilise traditional grinders as well as the latest CNC Anca's and Haas machines.
Tony Derksen only for manufacturing and re-grinding of our own work. Thank You 🙏🏻
I like the Makino C-40 universal tool and cutter grinder. Similar to the Cincinnati #2 but a little easier to work with IMHO. The wheeled angle adjustment on it seems to have a bit more clearance to get tools in close.
Shannon Rollins yes. We have another one called a Kao Ming. The wheel head is actually a multi point swivel which is really fun as it creates “soft axes”.
I use makino for router bits sharpening ....it’s great but it’s hard to find videos on it...
DAMN, i miss being a finish grinder and working in a machine shop, i preferred the Makino or the J-40 grinders. i used to do chamber reamers :)
Hey Alfred, what taper is in your Cincinnati no.2 work heads? From what I've been researching, it looks. Like they came with brown n sharp no 7 or Morse taper no.2, but man that looked like an nmtb 50 tool holder, that thing was huge.
The reason I'm asking, is a guy locally scrapped out a no.2, and kept a few things including the work head, and I'm planning on picking it up to use on my surface grinder(work with what ya got lol). But it should be a good addition to my shop anyways.
I used a KO Lee at one shop where I occasionally ran a gun drilling machine. Used it to touch up the solid carbide drills. It was a cool little machine, but no one there really knew what they were doing (we followed the instructions from the drill company as best we could) I'd love to learn more about this aspect of the trade! Thanks for the video!
longlivepunk Thank You , great idea !
Here's a video where Peter from Edge Precision covers just that: th-cam.com/video/uOUSJIJwsuY/w-d-xo.html
I am interested, if this machine can be used as surface grinder. If it can be attached magnetic table.
No
i have 5c and 8h collet adaptors for mine. Cincinnati beefier than ko lee. Steel beats aliminum. and yes nut busters getting them on and off the machine :)
Alfred, do you have a harig relief grinding fixture? I’m trying to figure out how to use mine.
wheel head column kinda gutless for heavy stock removal. good all around machine thou
Used Cincinnati and k o Lee grinders , k o Lee workheads were to light for larger cutters
as far as workholding goes. i made 5c and 8h adaptors for work head with drawbars.
Paraga machine hai koi 414 modal
I wont to tools and graider machine
and the wheel spindle column is gutless
How do you put the centres into both ends of the carbide for endmills? Are they ground or cut or moulded in the the blank?
Preformed carbide blanks are turned during their “green” state. At that point in the process they are almost like a chalk consistency and most features can be machines into them before hardening/sintering
Yes, I am now shopping for a Cincinnati #2 and that was indeed very helpful.
Great machine, over 1000lbs, and 3 phase, 220 volt, and you need a fair amount of space on both sides.
I can sell you some state of the art grinders boss!
Do you think one could grind a shaper cutterhead for a wood shaper with one of these?
Yes
cinncinnati #2mt .my baby
Aren't these machines obsolete in your shop with today's CNC?
Konely King not at all. We are a small shop and we do only specials with some of our own catalog items. A good portion of our jobs are one offs and sometimes the older ways are faster. Also, we just bought our first CNC grinder in 2012 so they are still new to us.
Could we make small 1/4" machine reamers on these?
With the right accessories, yes.
Got a question can a Cincinnati number two grind Morris tapers or any other tapers? I know it's not specifically made for this but it seems like with one of those drive systems for cylindrical grinding you could make sure it work of small tapers and stuff like that or just grinding cylinders.?
I don’t think these tables are designed for the type of traversing that works best for cylindrical grinding.
@@alfredlyon27 thank you for the reply.... i found one of these in sparkling condition for $800!!! the guy said its like brand new condition he is automating his shop and needs the room.... but I think I best get an od grinder or surface grinder
@@ClownWhisper if you want to cylindrical grind as well as grind cutters I’d look for a KO Lee .
Thanks!
Daylight In The Swamp you’re welcome
2MT thats my baby :)
Question. How can you Grind a straight diameter and angle off at a 30 degree?
Mark Spencer compound angles. Table swing for reach and compensate for the swing by swinging the workhead parallel to the X axis of the machine.
Alfred Lyon x and y move ninety to each other. And I wish I could send a pic. I know another way to achieve the task. But it involves a tracer and a floating table
Mark Spencer haha, yes they do. Your question to me was how can you grind a straight diameter with the table at 30°. The way I explained it is how. I’m sure that I just didn’t explain it clear enough. I can make a quick video soon.
Mark Spencer maybe I misunderstood your question. If you’re asking how to have a straight diameter as well as a 30° angle then you would need to grind the diameter and form the angle at the same time.
You really need to get a handle on how to use that camera. The way you flail it around is enough to give a person motion sickness.
RDH 693 haha! Absolutely! Sorry about that. I will figure something out. Thank You 🙏🏻