CAST vs EXTRUDED ACRYLIC | WHICH IS BETTER?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 11 พ.ค. 2020
- ● LASER MACHINE SETTINGS
Laser specs: 60 watt Epilog Fusion M2 40
Engraving: 60% speed, 40% power
Vector Cutting: 10% speed, 100% power, 2500 frequency (100%)
Engraving time: 5 minutes 40 seconds per material
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Cast Acrylic: www.jpplus.com/clear-cell-cas...
Extruded Acrylic: www.jpplus.com/non-glare-clea...
LED Light Base: www.jpplus.com/acrylic-light-...
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Getting started with acrylic took a lot of trial and error for me. What tips do you have for working with acrylic?
Dont use the same parameters for engraving each type. They may be exactly the same chemically but the different manufacturing processes creates products with different thermal properties/damage thresholds. You are just looking at the superficial property of "whiteness" without questioning or explaing how that whiteness happens. It is 100% possible to achieve the same level of whiteness with extruded acrylic by using different parameters. You are not alone in claiming cast acrylic is best for engraving. All manufactureres and distributors agree. They all use the same engraving parameter standard that you used and conclude what you have elegantly observed and demonstrated. The video I reference below explains the reason for "whiteness" and demonstrates that cast acrylic and extruded acryilc can be engraved equally white. The much lower cost of extruded acrylic will mean more profit for anyone making a business out of LED illuminated signs. see th-cam.com/video/lBkvdKMnBfg/w-d-xo.html
@@SarbarMultimedia I’ll have to look into this. I’ve never been able to get good results running a lot of tests on my machines with extruded but I’ll have to revisit this.
@@MakerExperiment There is no implied criticism of what you have done, you have only demonstrated what many others "know" to be true. However, if you dig into the science a bit deeper ( I have the advantage of a powerful microscope) it becomes clearer where the white comes from and then it is but a small step to achieve the same end result with extruded acrylic. All best wishes for you new journey of discovery. Some more powerful tubes (notably Reci) are great for cutting but have weird low power beam characteristics that may screw your efforts. If you check your beam after mirror1, using very low power (say10%) and you achieve a ring burn rather than a dot, you will be struggling to get the right power to achieve the critical parameters. Typically Reci tubes do not deliver a dot burn until 25 to 30% and that may be too high a power. I am working with a 70/80 watt tube that delivers a dot from about 8% power.
Great video. When I started using my laser, I didn't realize there was a difference in engraving between cast and extruded and just used whatever I could get cheap. I got so frustrated with the results until I found out that cast was so much better for engraving. As for suppliers, I love Delvie's Plastics. They've been great to us and our business.
I did the same thing when I started engraving acrylic. I will have to check out Delvie’s. Thanks for the tip!
OMG, this was so helpful on the differences after engraving. I couldn't figure out why my engravings weren't coming out the way I wanted on this piece of acrylic I had laying around and now I see that it's an extruded piece and that's why.
It makes a huge difference.
So fascinating! I really had no idea about any of this, but wow, the cast makes such a better engrave! Oh and I love the intro clip hahaha
Cast is superior in my mind but it could be due to my application. I actually didn’t know I filmed it when that happened. The whole time afterwards I was thinking, man I wish I got that on camera. Luckily it was still recording.
Wish I looked this video earlier before i bought extruded one, THANK YOU SO MUCH for this video!
basterbeatz you’re welcome.
Extruded is essential if you are drilling for braille beads. For this cast is almost unuseable. The slight variations matter even with surface compensation.
very helpful, enjoy watching your videos
Glad I could help.
Thanks for the informative video!
Jeff Walston I’m glad it was helpful.
great information, thanks a lot
Thanks for watching!
Very technique video n clarification.
Thank you sir
You’re welcome
Thank you so much for creating this video. I had recently gotten a few acrylic shapes custom cut and laser engraved by a small manufacturer and was excited to see the results when they arrived at my door. However, although I am also a small product manufacturer I was so extremely disappointed by the engraving and now I know its because the acrylic that was laser engraved was “extruded.” This video was so highly informational in the differences of type of acrylic and recommend any small business owner even thinking about adding acrylic products to there line should definitely watch this for informational reasons and understanding of the material and quality. Unfortunately, the laser engraved acrylic mirror ornaments I purchased wont be okay for retail quality gifting purposes, and wont be ready for sale for the pandemic holiday 2020...but at least I will be more prepared for next year. Thank you so much for making this awesome content :)
Sarah P I’m glad you found the video helpful. I’m sorry to hear that your items didn’t turn out well.
I am also new to this..
But from what I read... Mirror and Gold flim acrylic are extruded... Most other coloured ones are cast (cast has more colour options)... Engraving & working though is best on cast...
I never knew there was a difference, but cast acrylic seems to be the better option and thanks for actually showing a test of it, really helps to see the difference
Yeah, I had to learn over time. I’m happy I could help others.
Thanks for the info.. very helpful.. gracias
Bairon Moreno you’re welcome.
Great info!
Greg's Garage I’m glad you found it helpful.
Good post I was going to engrave on two pieces to see to compare but this video saved me two test pieces.
Glad I could help.
Johnsons has been my go to supplier so far. Thanks for the great videos!
Chris LaCombe thanks for watching. Feel free to use the promo code at Johnson’s. It’ll save you some money.
Very useful. Thanks. I'm looking to use 26" square sheets that need to be rigid. Can you tell me which is more rigid (for the same thickness, obviously) extruded or cast?
Both are pretty close to the same for me. I think it’ll just depend on your application. I honestly don’t use much other than cast unless cast isn’t available in the color I’m using.
Since extruded has a lower melting point I am having trouble routing a clean edge. Do you have any recomemdations for settings?
Great video! I come from a carpentry background - I wonder if the "grain" of the acrylic affects a sheet's bending/snapping/strength like it does in wood... cool stuff, thanks!
It can to an extent. The different acrylic compositions are vastly different in how they're made.
Great video! A question, is there any difference in rigidity/stiffness between the two in room temperature? I'm thinking of getting some 2mm sheets but still want the best stiffness I can get.
I can’t tell much of one but they may be spec’d differently.
Thanks for sharing - as previously mentioned a strip heater would have given you a perfect bend with no lines, also an oven could be used at 160/165C but you would need a jig or mould as the acrylic will come out very floppy and you will need PPE, particularly heat proof gloves to handle the hot acrylic.
Very interesting designs.
I need to look into getting a strip heater.
Just starting to work with BOSS laser cutter and wanted to know what would be the best engraving setting to engrave mirror from the rear. I've been using 20% or 25% for normal acrylic engraving. Is this particular process different? Thank you for your help. And BTW all the colors you used were fantastic! Keep making your terrific videos!
It’s hard to say with a mirror as I’ve never engraved one myself. I’d check manufacturer websites and see if any of them did a mirror sample or call them and ask. That’s usually a good way to start.
@@MakerExperiment Sorry.I wasn't clear earlier. The mirror I want to engrave is acrylic mirror not glass. So based on your video, what would the optimal settings be for a 100W laser to engrave through the rear layer of the acrylic? And can I engrave TOO deeply? Thanks!
@@ManorRED honestly, you’ll have to figure that out by testing material with that wattage. I don’t have experience with 100W. I don’t remember what I used for settings on that video but I’d start with a small square and try starting with 50% speed and 50% power and then start adjusting. Or you can do the material grid style test that I normally do.
I just placed an order with CeruleanTides. They sell cast acrylic in 12” x 19” sheets which is perfect for most hobby or smaller lasers. Seems to be a small business who sources quality acrylic and cuts it to size. A 1/8” thick 12” x 19” sheet of standard clear cast acrylic is only $5. They use flat-rate shipping, with a minimum $20 cost (box stores up to 3” of material). For example, my order of 22 sheets of clear 1/8” acrylic cost me $130 after shipping 👍🏻
Stephen Trenta thanks for the information.
Hi! Just watched your videos. Well a few of them. I have a quick question. Now that I know about acrylic. What kind of machine do you use? I am looking for a desktop piece. Right now I have a XTool D1 but it does not cut acrylic properly. So, I need to look into a CO2. What machine do you use? and why? Thanks in advance.
Hector.
I use a couple that are all made by Epilog. I use a CO2 to cut acrylic. I chose Epilog because I’ve always had a good experience with their people, they build equipment that will last decades, and it’s made to run a business.
Have you ever engraved Lexan type products?You can cold ben that to roughly 120º without fracturing.
I have. The engraving result is poor. I wouldn’t recommend it.
Do fingerprints stick to one more than the other one?
Had a little project today. Didn't even realise there are different types of acrylic. From the engraving though, I think I am having extruded sheet on my hand and they are fingerprint magnets.
Also, do you know if it is possible to reduce the engraving grains by adjusting the speed and power of the run?
BTW, we are taught to use a heated wire for bending a sheet in school. That creates a much cleaner bend and it's way easier.
I’m not sure about the fingerprints. It may be possible to reduce engraving grains by putting the laser out of focus a little which will make the beam wider.
@@MakerExperiment Wow, that's actually brilliant. I will never imagine making it out of focus would be useful someday. I would just assume it is always the best to keep the focus sharp. Thanks for the idea. I shall try it next time!
@cwk0505 let me know if it works.
Hi Maker Experiment.
Your video is very good and illustrative.
One question: How do I get the edges of the acrylic to be transparent after being cut with a laser?
Thanks
Jorge
If you use the right settings it should be fairly transparent. You could try a post treatment like sanding and polishing.
@@MakerExperiment Thanks for the answer!!
@@MakerExperiment Extruded acrylic automatically gives you a beautiful flame-polished edge when laser cutting unlike cast acrylic which has to be hand polished or hand torched. At least that's been my experience. What say you?
@@straight_razor if you find a good quality extruded acrylic I agree. The cast you can get a good edge and a lot of it depends on the end use. Some usages need that flame polished edge and some most people won’t notice enough to care.
I will try to do a cross hatch engraving for extruded as I got this piece from a customer and he didn't know that the piece was extruded, im barely starting so trying to buy big sheet is kind of hard for me at the moment
Best of luck!
Great video! Do you know what PPI/DPI you use when engraving acrylic?
It was 400DPI.
I’m just getting into laser engraving acrylic and I’m not sure what to put under it... I’ve used plywood but found that the smoke from the wood discolored the acrylic. Any suggestions? I use a 20W laser just on small projects/ Etsy products. Thanks!
Luke Wehrli may I ask why you’re putting anything under the acrylic if you’re engraving it?
Maker Experiment what I meant is the surface my laser engraver is set up on is plywood, but that leaves a smoke color on the acrylic even if I keep it well ventilated . Not sure what to do! Thanks!
@@lukewehrli3839 That I am not sure about. I'm sorry I'm not more help.
Maybe try a sheet of steel or other substantial metal? Obviously the less reflective the better... BUT, I’m not an expert so PLEASE try at your own risk and always use eye protection!!! You’ll find most CO2 lasers use a metal “knife bed” or honeycomb sheet under the material (as shown in this video at 5:27). Since you’re using what I presume is an open-frame diode laser, it’s a bit trickier. Maybe even try using masking/painters tape on top of the plywood? I’ve seen people use that to mitigate scorch marks when engraving wood. Not sure if it will help in your case, but that’s a simple and cheap test.
I need a very flat, opaque black acrylic. Which plastic would be the flattest (like glass or granite that is ground to 1/10,000" variance)?
I honestly don’t know if either will be within that kind of tolerance flatness wise. What are you doing that requires that level of tolerance?
@@MakerExperiment sorry, I don’t need them at that tolerance, I was just wondering which one would be the flattest.
@@bgclarinet my guess is extruded due to the process of how it’s made but I could be wrong.
I need to drill a 3/4in. hole in 1/2in. thick cast acrylic. Will a stepper drill bit work? Any tips?
Derek Guay I’d start with a small center mark tool. Then drill a small pilot hole. Then I’d use a stepper drill bit and go slowly. The surface tends to tear out if you don’t use a bit made for acrylic or plastic.
Question.......do you need to polish the edge of the acrylic that you are putting the LED's against?
No. The laser makes it nice and smooth.
Great video. We're those line to line or some kind of Dithering?
It’s been a while since I did this so I don’t entirely remember. I’m assuming standard dithering.
Which is stiffer/stronger and how does it compare to epoxy? Thanks, I have subscribed.
I haven’t done much strength test to be honest so I’m not sure. My guess is epoxy would be stronger.
@@MakerExperiment I havent seen any test or comparrison, perhaps a good video to do for your channel.
@@Tanko3691 I’ll have to look into that more.
Fantastic video! I now understand that cast typically gives a frosty white engraving where as extruded gives a dingy grey color. How about if I want to engrave a logo on black acrylic and have the colour inside the same as the outside? A kind of indent effect. How can this be achieved?
So you want to engrave but it still be black?
@@MakerExperiment Exactly👍
Perhaps using matte black is the key?
@@renauddavies matte black may get you close. It may be hard to achieve this with a laser without painting it or doing something post engraving.
Interesting video. May I know what is settings you used in engraving clear acrylic? Thanks
It depends on the look you’re going for and if you engrave it with the masking on or off. A good starting point is around 80% speed, 60% power, and 400 dpi.
Im new in this field, just recently bought an 80w chinese co2 laser using corellaser. is the "pixel" matters? Cause there is an input box in th bprogram where you put 1 or 2 pixels. Im starting to watch all your videos. BTW, Im from the Philippines
@@simpatiko2k5 I’m not sure about that software to be honest with you.
Have you tried a heat wire for bending your ACR? they make them just for this application.
I haven’t yet. It’s on my list of things I want to try eventually.
I made a simple brake with three pieces of wood and the top having a 45 degree. I hinged the two together
and fastened down the top where I wanted to bend and used a heat gun to bring to temperature before bending
My company says that cost of extruded is more and we go through alot of trouble to get it. If you say it is cheaper I would like to know where.
Well, keep in mind I made this video 3 years ago and at the time, that was my experience.
If I buy large sheet acrylic, what tool can I use to cut it down to size since it won't fit in a laser? How do I cut it without destroying it?
Something like this may work, but I’ve never tried it. amzn.to/47GLQtG
Places like Home Depot or Lowe’s may have something as well.
@@MakerExperiment I was thinking more like a table saw or circular saw to make straight cuts....
@@johnrichardson1949 you can if you get a plastic cutting blade.
Question. Which acrylic is more scratch resistant?
제임스씨 matte is better than gloss. Other than that, they’re close to the same in my experience.
I am etching colored cast and edge glow and have issues with "fog". Sometimes I can clean up with acetone.
What am I am missing to prevent the edge fog in the cut and sometimes in the etch
Try decreasing your air assist pressure slightly. Sometimes it’s too high and that can cause some of that fog.
thanks will try that nest week. I work in Winston Salem Mixxer; a maker space as I am trying to develop a small
business with the wife. Retired from manufacturing and was always in crafts, with 40 years of leather tooling, aside
from my manufacturing position. We are running a "Rabbit" 80 watt machine
@@johnzill2125 very cool. Best of luck!
@@johnzill2125 the best decision is to use DISH SOAP. Just apply a thin layer of soap on acrylic before engraving or cutting and you will forget about this issue forever)
I even couldn't sleep because didn't know how to deal with this problem, and then found this way
@@projex5894 will give it a try again. The firsts time I used it I failed. maybe used wrong soap
I have used canal and estreet plastics! Both work well but estreet has better prices.
Thanks for the tip!
Does alcohol crack both or just extruded acrylic?
I haven’t tried to be honest.
@@MakerExperiment , just try)
As I can see from my little experience, alcohol cracks extruded acrylic, but cast is more resistant to chemicals. Is that common for every type or depends more on producer?
Most everyone commenting, like you, are interested in engraving and cast is the obvious winner. However, when it comes to laser cutting, for example templates or router bases, the clear winner is extruded acrylic because, unlike cast acrylic, laser cutting extruded acrylic automatically gives you a flame-polished edge. Just curious why you didn't mention this. Have you had a different experience in regards to the cast acrylic not automatically ending up with a flame-polished edge, like extruded acrylic, after laser cutting? God video, thanks!
I’ve had a mix of both. When I did this video I think I had a bad batch of extruded acrylic because I was getting better results on cast acrylic. That being said, I agree that should have been the case. The supplier at the time also quit making that product so I wonder if that’s why. I plan to do more videos in the future when I have a better extruded product.
Is this diode or co2? I'm trying to just cut acrylic with a diode
This is CO2. I don’t think a diode will cut certain colors and kinds of acrylic.
Simple, direct with crucial information 10/10 ( direct subscribe god job Lord maker) also extra points out, the vids will be much more inviting if you can include a little more smile =)
Thanks for watching.
which one is lexan? is thats completely different?
Lexan is a little bit different than acrylic. It’s typically stronger but won’t engrave very well in my experience.
Hey man, do me a big favor...tell me which of the two is stiffer or harder at room temperature? I need that data...
I don’t have any true data to back it up. Cast is typically the sturdier of the two because of how it’s made in my experience.
@@MakerExperiment Thank you very much, I appreciate your answer. I'm going to ask a manufacturer directly to save time. Cheers
What about Mirror Acrylic?
I made a separate video dedicated to mirror acrylic. If you look through my videos, you should see it.
Patience young Skywalker...
Wich is the difference between MMA and PMMA ?
I’m honestly not that familiar. I don’t have a great answer on this one.
Neither is better. It depends on the Job you are doing. They do look similar, but they do look different. With experience you can easily tell. Also prices do change. Sometimes cast does cost less. Also yes engraving is generally better on cast. But they do make a extruded acrylic that engraves really well. It's a very off material. I use both equally. Also extruded has a lower melting temperature, and will almost always bend quicker.
It does depend on the application and I tend to agree with pretty much everything you’ve said. I’ve never found an extruded acrylic that actually engraves well but that’s great if there is.
@cspace123
Just curious why or no one else isn't mentioning that laser cutting extruded acrylic automatically gives you a beautiful flame-polished edge vs cast acrylic which has to be hand polished or hand flamed with a torch to get the same beautiful edge. Hence, for engraving, cast acrylic is generally better but for cutting shapes, templates and router base plates, where there is no engraving, and a flame-polished edge is preferred, extruded acrylic is much better because it saves the extra step/labor in having to flame or polish the edge by hand. What say you?
Cast is better on CNC machine than Extruded due to temperature melting point. On your video, you used laser engraver. That's fine. True Extruded is cheaper, but not brittle like cast acrylics. But laser cannot profile an acrylics the way CNC milling machine can do..LOL
You’re right. A laser cannot profile, but can a CNC make tight angle cut with no radius? Hahahaha One day I’ll get a CNC. Both machines are awesome.
Bollocks! You can easily distinguish extruded from cast by setting a piece of it on fire. Cast will burn with a crackle and will not drip molten flaming balls, extruded will burn silently and will drip flaming balls.
I mean sure if you want to waste material.
@@MakerExperiment It is not that precious and even less so if there are free cut-offs available. Anyway, I objected to your statement that: "there is no real way to to tell them apart, other than by part number or SKU...". This is a gross omission of essential information in your video.
@@amciaapple1654 Well, I’m not going to tell people to light them on fire and risk them doing something more dangerous. You’re welcome to make your own video.
That's a thin excuse, but even if it is taken at its face value, it doesn't mean that it prevents you from deleting that statement which misleads the watchers of your video that "there is no real way to to tell them apart, other than by part number or SKU...".
@@amciaapple1654 well, I can’t make everyone happy. Feel free to make a better video if you’re not satisfied.
short video is more interesting ...try to make a short video...
kishen kriz I understand. You’re also welcome to make your own.
New subscriber, great video, except, :D... Do you have a video on the laser cut edge difference right off the laser? We currently flame polish saw cut sanded edges, but want to switch to a laser cut that will provide almost the same flame edge finish. Possible?
Extruded acrylic will have a better cut finish in my experience.
@MakerExperiment , Thank you for the reply. I will try the extruded first. Have a safe Memorial Day weekend.
@DecksNJ you too!