@Sideshow Bob Ichiro does not at all have the most professional hits. Pete Rose had 301 Minor League hits. Those are professional. The score is Pete 4557, Ichiro 4367. The fact is that's all irrelevant. Ichiro has 3089 Major League hits. You should only be judged vs your own league. We might both have $10 in our pockets but if 5 of yours are Pesos, and 5 of mine are Euros, we really both don't have $10 in our pockets.
Yes, this was very well said. And I'm a big Pete Rose fan. But if he ever bet against the reds? I would have to side with baseball and say keep him out. And it would break my heart.
I'm' 51 and have said this since high school, Pete will be in the hall of fame but wont be until after he dies. Then everyone will have remorse and pity and vote him in. Just watch.
@@jimmccullough5496 neither of which were against the "rules" in 1919 by the way...Rose on the other hand it was clearly against the rules when he did it
Gambling ruins sports. Pete Rose must never be allowed into the MLB HOF. For when that happens you change baseball, and baseball must never be changed. You might as well start using aluminum bats, laser beam strike zones, and have HBP result in an HR. As a young ball player I idolized Pete but he broke my heart. He let baseball down. He let every fan down. He must never be forgotten, but his transgressions must stand as a warning to all who enter the ball park. We will not tolerate gambling by any member of MLB, period.
As soon as Pete took off his cleats for the last time as a player, he should have been in the Hall of Fame the next day. No different than The Great One in Hockey.
Baseball has rules. He was no bigger than the game and I'll even bet (no pun intended) they already knew he had been betting on games so it was just a matter of time before the evidence was good enough to prove it.
@@billymadison8036 How can you guarantee it? Show us proof. Everything he said during the investigation he lied about. Everything he said after the investigation he lied about. He didn't come clean until he thought it was the only way he could get in the Hall of Fame, but in reality he only came clean so he could sell his book (probably to pay off gambling debts). He owed money to bookies during his time he was betting on baseball. The bookies basically owned him at that point. Pete is not a winner. He's a loser just like most gamblers.
Yes Pete Rose was a Great Player. Hell i wore a Philles hat as a kid, and had a Pete Rose Louisville bat too!! But i still Don't believe he should be in the Hall. It's been said that every clubhouse has a sign somewhere stating No Betting on Baseball. He knew, and did it anyway!! Sorry but i also have trou left swallowing 2 things... 1, that he wasn't betting as a player. Mean to tell me he just developed a gambling habit only as a manager?? 2, that he never bet against the Reds, or had some kind of influence on games to win a bet!! Sorry but can't believe these things, if he was desperate for a winning bet, he was strong enough not to bet against them, but not strong enough not to bet them? Cmon Lastly how about the Black Sox!!?? How did baseball treat those fellas?? Think the NFL HOF has it written that only what happens on the field matters, ask LT!! Baseball HOF also has off field transgressions included in decision of eligibility i think i heard said... As far as Bonds and Clemens... a Shame they end up in HOF is how i feel... Bonds doesn't break all time or season HR records without what he did... Just sayin
Pete is better off not being in the Hof..He's much more popular being infamous for not getting in,then he would be famous for getting in the hall..He would just be another legendary Hall of famer if elected..Being ostracized he has become a legend..
Cheddar Cheese I don’t see that. As a native Cincinnatian i think people in that town are just tired of his BS. He’s become infamous and you won’t see him being honored again on the field. The last straw were recent revelations that he had sex with minors as a ball player.
Why is it just assumed that if he was on the HOF ballot he would be voted in? Pete Rose is all about Pete Rose plain and simple. His annual stunt of setting up shop and signing autographs at Cooperstown is a perfect example.
Pete Rose didn't just all of a sudden bet as a manager; he bet as a player. Rose more than likely bet on the Reds to lose at some point. Gamblers get desperate enough to win bets that loyalty to a team takes a backseat.
He was lying about betting for the Reds every game. He let the bookies know to NOT bet on the Reds by not betting on them himself. Here is a summary of the case against Rose, the dude to this day is still lying, just like his book has lies in it. Rose has never come clean. www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2015/03/21/rose-investigator-pete-belong-game/25112355/
Pete is going to be pushing up roses soon. Rose is a rose but not with here rose. Bar Pete from the Hall once for all, and for the love of God, let the man have some peace.
@@joez203 Next you'll say that players should be banned for smoking cigarettes. Or, how's about being an alcoholic? That means remove Mickey Mantle. Did you know that? How's about using amphetamines (i.e. "speed")? That means removing just about every inductee put in who played after 1960 (because they were legal in MLB from 1960 until 2005). Nobody should give a damn about what Pete Rose did (and he swears he didn't, anyway) as far as gambling. You've voting on a player's on-field career, not his private life. Just put a *note beside his plaque.
@@BrantDavidMcLaughlin , well, genius, let me educate you why your "logic" makes no sense on so many levels. First, we are not talking about what the other guys did. We are talking about Rose. Mickey Mantle being a drunk or so and so doing this happened off the field. While I don't condone those things, they have NOTHING to do with the game. It's not baseball's duty to punish Mickey for drinking. Rose's gambling has EVERYTHING to do with the game. Allow gambling in the game and you have no game anymore-guys shaving runs, guys throwing games to get even with bookies, making errors in key situations, players on opposing teams doing each other favors. But according to you, we "shouldn't give a damn about that" right? Finally, if you believe Rose didn't gamble, then there is no hope for you.
He even had a chance at peace before the investigation even started if he just admitted to Ueberroth that what they had already heard was true. Instead he denied it and chose not to want peace.
It's like a great crooked Cop. He was a great Cop, cared about his city. Gave it his all when he was out on the street. But in the end he stole drug money. Lost his job. Still was a great Cop. Made many arrests. But was crooked.
... "And while there will be debate and dissent about this or that or another occurrence on or off the field, and while the game's nobler parts will always be enmeshed in the human frailties of those who, whatever their role, have stewardship of this game, let there be no doubt or dissent about our goals for baseball or our dedication to it. Nor about our vigilance and vigor - and patience - in protecting the game from blemish or stain or disgrace."
I'm always torn when discussing Cooperstown because it's weighing opening the floodgates vs taking a stand. What do I mean by that? Well Bonds, Clemens, guys like that won't get into the Hall because of their (supposed) PED use. But several former players haven't named names but have publicly said several PED users are already in the Hall of Fame, some we'd never even suspect. So, if true, the Hall is already "tainted". This purity we like to decorate it with is simply viewing it thru rose colored glasses. But that brings me around to Pete and his situation. Now I agree with Dan: if Pete bet against the Reds, it's done. Case close. He'll never get in. Same with if he bet as a player and altered his performance for bets. That's worse than PED's in my opinion. But if it's just the betting on his team, is that really the worst thing? There's wife beaters in the Hall. There's domestic abusers. Ty Cobb beat up a handicapped fan. Commissioner Landis fought *against* integration. The list of what Kirby Puckett didn't do would be shorter than what he did. Juan Marichal tried to fucking kill somebody with a bat during a game. Go look up Ed Delahanty and his list of deeds with includes threatening terrified passengers on a train with a straight razor. When a conductor tossed him off, he attempted to cross the International Bridge connecting the states with our neighbors to the north. Either he drunkenly slipped, killed himself, or possibly was murdered in a robbery. All of this is to say: quit trying to protect the purity of Cooperstown because it's not pure. It's a museum.
His hits record will never be broken. No one plays that long anymore. If anything they play less and less. The number of guys who play any length of time keeps going down. Jeter, Pujols and the list continues to shrink. Besides that, guys don't NEED to play that long. All of that said, Pete bet on baseball and then made it worse by lying. He won't get in while he's living. At some point he will eventually get in.
Pete makes way more money by not being in the hall of fame than he would if elected. The situation works very well for him from a monetary perspective.
It does not matter who Rose bet for or against. However, it is very hard to prove the gambling had anything to do with altering any games. I agree with his personality being his downfall, and upon his banishment he didn't fall on the sword in a matter of speaking, however the Commissoner never offered any stipulations for reinstatement. It was very open ended in a matter if speaking where no treatment was offered, no period of suspension contingent on giving up gambling, completing treatment, completing community service on say speeches of him sharing his mistakes and what he regrets, nothing was offered. How can you offer any apology when quite frankly Bud Selig was not going to accept it anyway. Selig essentially took no action on the request for reinstatement and if he did it was after a significant period of time and again with no consideration of stipulations. The only thing I ever heard publicly "do you still gamble?" I guess yes was the response so no reinstatement. What 3rd Grader thought that one up? In addition the Commissioner violated the banishment himself by allowing Rose on the field when it meant making money. Money more times than not destroys integrity. When Rose was under investigation and subsequently banned there was no rule that said banishment meant ineligible for the Hall of Fame. Ironically Rose's case led to that rule. How convenient? Now the drugs and PEDs, scientifically proven based on the added strength, that it gives an unfair advantage. Bonds, Sosa, McGuire, Clemmons, A-Rod, and those are just high profile guys, forget it. Gambling is not cheating during a game, taking drugs is. Drugs in fact are still happening many guys feel the risk of not getting caught is worth it. Integrity? Now one of today's teams developed an elaborate scheme and plan to steal signs in order to cheat and get an unfair advantage. When Rose played an even managed it was still a game to a degree. Now all that is talked about is the millions a player should get without limit. Bryce Harper wanted 450 million. He left his former team and they won the World Series the very next year. Baseball and Money have a HUGE problem that is ego driven to the point that you play or shuffle through the games, don't give a darn who wins, and all the players want is money. Their personal stats does not guarantee team success but certain players want millions and millions more. They want to opt out of contracts so they can always get the going rate in their mind. I say play for a certain amount and if you don't like it do something else or start your own league and pay the Bill's yourself. Unionized or not, find guys that want to play for a reasonable amount that results in prices and costs being reasonable. Everyone wins then. Now only rich spoiled players who still try and cheat win. The game doesn't win, the fans don't win, nobody who still thinks the games matter wins. Rose and the Hall of Fame, it's like memorabilia, on the market it has monetary value but it ultimately is worthless in life. If you can't get any money/value it is worthless. Like the score of the next game, ultimately worthless. Fans don't get a break because their team wins. You put a guy in the Hall of Fame with a plaque he is soon after forgotten about. Rose would be too. If he goes in posthumously it would only be to both create money and drama. Forget it, if am in charge of Rose estate I am telling Baseball to kiss my rear at that point. Guy has been banished for over 30 years now. Where you been baseball? You don't get the hit King after he is deceased whose performance on the field is legit and undeniable. By then you blew it, not Rose anymore.
When selig dies.....pete will go in...but not until that moment. Sucks, cause Ty Cobb was an ardent, open racist and hated by almost everyone and he's in the hall of fame. Pete was an amazing player. He hustled his ass off, even during spring training and all star games (he's still to blame for what happened to Ray Fosse though). But an amazing, dedicated to winning ballplayer. LET PETE IN!!!!
I guarantee that Rule 21 does not say anything about Pete Rose's lifetime banishment being tied to Selig's lifetime. I sure hope it pertains to the lifetime of MLB and the Hall of Fame though. I say he's never getting in and doesn't deserve to be in.
I would agree to put him in the Hall of fame if he went to court plead guilty to degenerate gambling as a professional athlete and serve 12 months state time.He paid for his crime and then it's behind him forever
(Disclosure: Not here to pi$$ you off Big Unit but rather provide my very lengthy ascertainment) Prison sentences do not provide rehabilitation for those that feel they haven't done the crime that fits the time in the first place, and going away in a concrete building for a year rarely equals a favorable public sentiment upon exit. What if he doesn't care and serves a one year jail term? So a year that doesn't involve any of his opponents most likely won't change status quo that hasn't altered in 35 years. Isn't MLB legally considered entertainment like the other major professional sports like the NFL, NBA, and NHL? This question has been a hot topic of late due to very arguable officiating calls that have been magnified into a brand new, highly trafficked genre on TH-cam and other social media platforms (Going as far as to compare the above "real" professional leagues to the "predetermined" WWE. While you can wrangle with the blurred lines of the aforementioned comparisons, one can't argue the entertainment value of Rose's polarizing life story that unfortunately did not include the final resurrection that is a favorable societal par for the course , after his meteoric rise to stardom and major fall into the depths of baseball hell. So, by betting on baseball games he wasn't involved in, did he commit a crime or simply break a rule of an entertainment company? He also bet on his team, essentially betting on himself the case can be made. Are we not told that if you cant bet on yourself, you lose in life? The Cooperstown law says absolutely not. Not right now, that is. He will eventually get his plaque in time, but he could possibly expedite his case and push through the HOF bureaucracy. What might he do to accomplish his goal that doesn't include prison time, you ask? If only he bestowed upon his critics a single heartfelt apology, he might have this day. Action is needed now if Rose wants to die a man knowing he had his day; to be accepted once again by his peers. His morals will forever be examined by pundits from all vessels until one day he is an all but forgotten side note of history in character with controversial figures such as Ty Cobb and "Shoeless" Joe Jackson. In closing, most of his playing career was exemplary BUT for the controversial, albeit entertaining, last few years?! The answer resulting in the final outcome depends on a Pete Rose in the twilight years of life and his ability to at least resemble a sincere, regretful public figure that is believable enough to pass the eye test for the majority. Prison will not change the resentment he faces in opinion. I will digress that only regret and shame inside Rose himself is the true justice that provides his rehabilitation and admittance into the baseball fraternity every player dreams of being initiated into. He needs to act steadfast and have the same determination as a 1970's collision at the plate that decides the pennant......
@@randyjohnson805 Please understand that A) He broke the rules of Major League Baseball, which AREN'T LAWS B) Learn how to spell C) I believe you are the proverbial pot calling the kettle black. Meth kills
no way bud would have done that milwakee offered Pete a boat load of money and he told bud that hell would have to freeze over before he would pay in milwaukee.
He does give a rat's ass. He wrote his acceptance speech for his son to read when he's voted in after he dies. He's still not getting in after he dies though.
Pete Rose does NOT deserve to be in the hall of fame. Why? Because he broke the cardinal rule of baseball. There used to be standards in this country. Not anymore. Now we have this attitude of "yeah I know he cheated but reward him anyway." What's the point of HAVING rules if you can break them and get what you want anyway?
@George Kouts Actually there is more than evidence. There is actual PROOF that he bet as a player. Read the Dowd report. They have proof-betting slips in his handwriting, phone records-that he bet on baseball at least since 1984. When he was still a player.
This is a personal issue with Pete Are they so stupid to think theirs nothing players in that gambled in a game they were involved in And did much much worse Show me the managerial errors in situations that were obviously questionable Ask the players that played under Pete They would remember those calls in questions CharlieHustle played the game correctly They don’t dispute that They are pety and can’t see the forest for the trees Obviouly
As manager as laid out by the chief investigator of Rose's case said that he couldn't prove an omission, but Rose did NOT always bet on the Reds, he sent a signal to the bookies by not betting for them when certain pitchers pitched. It is a long read, but Rose is an addictive liar too and has never come clean even in his book. www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2015/03/21/rose-investigator-pete-belong-game/25112355/
PETE ROSE - One of The Greatest & Most "Winningnest," Baseball Players of All Time...He made the worst mistake by knowingly betting on Baseball...which means he will most likely not be allowed into...The Baseball Hall of Fame...Either way...He will always be in The Hall of Fame of Baseball Players & Fans Hearts...And a valuable lesson and inspiration always...
Did what these SOB's that you talk of break a rule that was posted in every clubhouse across the league? Even if the HOF was based on baseball ability only, he still got himself kicked out of baseball so they can't even get him on the ballot to decide if what he did on the field was worthy. It's weird how a lifetime ban works, but then again it's pretty simple too.
LET ME TELL YOU SOMTHING YOU DONT GET IT.They don't understand the big shots never wanted him in NEVER! Listen to this crap do you think it makes sense! How bout the babe ? Pete was and is baseball. This has been a hack job from day 1.
@@roland7584 listen shithead.....no links back then....no media like 2day and people kept their mouths shut unlike yours waiting for a falice to make its way in....Cobb was a mad man Ruth was a drunk....both deserved cooperstown
Still has the record for most hits in a career. No one is even close. Put Pete in.
No one is even close? Hmmm. I thought Ty Cobb was pretty close.
joez203 and he is in the Hall of Fame. And also died before Rose played in the MLB.
@Sideshow Bob Rose also has the record for most Wins... Ichiro couldn't hold his jock strap..
@Sideshow Bob Ichiro does not at all have the most professional hits. Pete Rose had 301 Minor League hits. Those are professional. The score is Pete 4557, Ichiro 4367. The fact is that's all irrelevant. Ichiro has 3089 Major League hits. You should only be judged vs your own league. We might both have $10 in our pockets but if 5 of yours are Pesos, and 5 of mine are Euros, we really both don't have $10 in our pockets.
MLB needs to keep out of the Hall of Fame business. It is a museum fo rthe history of the game of baseball. It is not an extention of MLB.
Very well said Dan !! " Pete's personality got in his way ! ".......
Yes, this was very well said. And I'm a big Pete Rose fan. But if he ever bet against the reds? I would have to side with baseball and say keep him out. And it would break my heart.
I'm' 51 and have said this since high school, Pete will be in the hall of fame but wont be until after he dies. Then everyone will have remorse and pity and vote him in. Just watch.
Charlie hustle !!!!!
When is Shoeless Joe Jackson getting in the Hall?
1) Jackson should be on teh ballot. 2) and he was accused of fixing games not gambling.
@@jimmccullough5496 neither of which were against the "rules" in 1919 by the way...Rose on the other hand it was clearly against the rules when he did it
@@six-manfilms6524 - The Hall of Fame had no such rule in place.The bowed to pressure from MLB and made the rule after the fact.
Exactly
The Commissioner should decide to put his name on the ballot.
They are never going to let him into the HOF while he is still walking this Earth..
They won't let him in when he is buried in the earth either.
Gambling ruins sports. Pete Rose must never be allowed into the MLB HOF. For when that happens you change baseball, and baseball must never be changed. You might as well start using aluminum bats, laser beam strike zones, and have HBP result in an HR. As a young ball player I idolized Pete but he broke my heart. He let baseball down. He let every fan down. He must never be forgotten, but his transgressions must stand as a warning to all who enter the ball park. We will not tolerate gambling by any member of MLB, period.
[[[[[[[ #Wilt has insane records - Led the league in assists??? ]]]]]]]
GODFATHERLO Pete Rose OR fuck off
As soon as Pete took off his cleats for the last time as a player, he should have been in the Hall of Fame the next day. No different than The Great One in Hockey.
Baseball has rules. He was no bigger than the game and I'll even bet (no pun intended) they already knew he had been betting on games so it was just a matter of time before the evidence was good enough to prove it.
@@roland7584He bet on baseball. Who cares. There is no way Pete ever threw a game. I guarantee he bet on himself to win. That's what winners do
@@billymadison8036 How can you guarantee it? Show us proof. Everything he said during the investigation he lied about. Everything he said after the investigation he lied about. He didn't come clean until he thought it was the only way he could get in the Hall of Fame, but in reality he only came clean so he could sell his book (probably to pay off gambling debts). He owed money to bookies during his time he was betting on baseball. The bookies basically owned him at that point. Pete is not a winner. He's a loser just like most gamblers.
Dan the man!!!
Yes Pete Rose was a Great Player. Hell i wore a Philles hat as a kid, and had a Pete Rose Louisville bat too!!
But i still Don't believe he should be in the Hall. It's been said that every clubhouse has a sign somewhere stating No Betting on Baseball. He knew, and did it anyway!!
Sorry but i also have trou left swallowing 2 things...
1, that he wasn't betting as a player. Mean to tell me he just developed a gambling habit only as a manager??
2, that he never bet against the Reds, or had some kind of influence on games to win a bet!! Sorry but can't believe these things, if he was desperate for a winning bet, he was strong enough not to bet against them, but not strong enough not to bet them? Cmon
Lastly how about the Black Sox!!??
How did baseball treat those fellas??
Think the NFL HOF has it written that only what happens on the field matters, ask LT!!
Baseball HOF also has off field transgressions included in decision of eligibility i think i heard said...
As far as Bonds and Clemens... a Shame they end up in HOF is how i feel... Bonds doesn't break all time or season HR records without what he did...
Just sayin
Ok boomers
Baseball has rules, he broke 'em, he's not on the eligibility list, end of story.
Ok boomer...God I can't wait till your generation dies off
Pete is better off not being in the Hof..He's much more popular being infamous for not getting in,then he would be famous for getting in the hall..He would just be another legendary Hall of famer if elected..Being ostracized he has become a legend..
Cheddar Cheese I don’t see that. As a native Cincinnatian i think people in that town are just tired of his BS. He’s become infamous and you won’t see him being honored again on the field. The last straw were recent revelations that he had sex with minors as a ball player.
Why is it just assumed that if he was on the HOF ballot he would be voted in? Pete Rose is all about Pete Rose plain and simple. His annual stunt of setting up shop and signing autographs at Cooperstown is a perfect example.
Pete Rose didn't just all of a sudden bet as a manager; he bet as a player.
Rose more than likely bet on the Reds to lose at some point. Gamblers get desperate enough to win bets that loyalty to a team takes a backseat.
He was lying about betting for the Reds every game. He let the bookies know to NOT bet on the Reds by not betting on them himself. Here is a summary of the case against Rose, the dude to this day is still lying, just like his book has lies in it. Rose has never come clean.
www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2015/03/21/rose-investigator-pete-belong-game/25112355/
One of the greatest hitters the game has ever seen and he didn't need to use steroids to do it... Put him in the Hall damn it!
Right !!!!!
Pete is going to be pushing up roses soon. Rose is a rose but not with here rose. Bar Pete from the Hall once for all, and for the love of God, let the man have some peace.
@@joez203 Next you'll say that players should be banned for smoking cigarettes. Or, how's about being an alcoholic? That means remove Mickey Mantle. Did you know that? How's about using amphetamines (i.e. "speed")? That means removing just about every inductee put in who played after 1960 (because they were legal in MLB from 1960 until 2005). Nobody should give a damn about what Pete Rose did (and he swears he didn't, anyway) as far as gambling. You've voting on a player's on-field career, not his private life. Just put a *note beside his plaque.
By the way, I use the phrase "how's about" as a literary affectation. I know it's not good grammar. You idiot.
@@BrantDavidMcLaughlin , well, genius, let me educate you why your "logic" makes no sense on so many levels. First, we are not talking about what the other guys did. We are talking about Rose. Mickey Mantle being a drunk or so and so doing this happened off the field. While I don't condone those things, they have NOTHING to do with the game. It's not baseball's duty to punish Mickey for drinking. Rose's gambling has EVERYTHING to do with the game. Allow gambling in the game and you have no game anymore-guys shaving runs, guys throwing games to get even with bookies, making errors in key situations, players on opposing teams doing each other favors. But according to you, we "shouldn't give a damn about that" right? Finally, if you believe Rose didn't gamble, then there is no hope for you.
He even had a chance at peace before the investigation even started if he just admitted to Ueberroth that what they had already heard was true. Instead he denied it and chose not to want peace.
It's like a great crooked Cop. He was a great Cop, cared about his city. Gave it his all when he was out on the street. But in the end he stole drug money. Lost his job. Still was a great Cop. Made many arrests. But was crooked.
Gretzky should be punted out of the nhl HOF for gambling when he was coaching the Phoenix coyotes...but was insistent “that was my wife Janet...” 🐂💩
tjhman11 only a small segment of ppl follow hockey. No one really cares
mikael feathers that’s true.
... "And while there will be debate and dissent about this or that or another occurrence on or off the field, and while the game's nobler parts will always be enmeshed in the human frailties of those who, whatever their role, have stewardship of this game, let there be no doubt or dissent about our goals for baseball or our dedication to it. Nor about our vigilance and vigor - and patience - in protecting the game from blemish or stain or disgrace."
John Moons what
If pete goes 😧Mays goes😧
Pete Rose would be my choice for the MLB logo.
He blew that chance for you to have that choice once he got himself banned from the game.
I'm always torn when discussing Cooperstown because it's weighing opening the floodgates vs taking a stand. What do I mean by that? Well Bonds, Clemens, guys like that won't get into the Hall because of their (supposed) PED use. But several former players haven't named names but have publicly said several PED users are already in the Hall of Fame, some we'd never even suspect. So, if true, the Hall is already "tainted". This purity we like to decorate it with is simply viewing it thru rose colored glasses. But that brings me around to Pete and his situation. Now I agree with Dan: if Pete bet against the Reds, it's done. Case close. He'll never get in. Same with if he bet as a player and altered his performance for bets. That's worse than PED's in my opinion. But if it's just the betting on his team, is that really the worst thing? There's wife beaters in the Hall. There's domestic abusers. Ty Cobb beat up a handicapped fan. Commissioner Landis fought *against* integration. The list of what Kirby Puckett didn't do would be shorter than what he did. Juan Marichal tried to fucking kill somebody with a bat during a game. Go look up Ed Delahanty and his list of deeds with includes threatening terrified passengers on a train with a straight razor. When a conductor tossed him off, he attempted to cross the International Bridge connecting the states with our neighbors to the north. Either he drunkenly slipped, killed himself, or possibly was murdered in a robbery.
All of this is to say: quit trying to protect the purity of Cooperstown because it's not pure. It's a museum.
His hits record will never be broken. No one plays that long anymore. If anything they play less and less. The number of guys who play any length of time keeps going down. Jeter, Pujols and the list continues to shrink. Besides that, guys don't NEED to play that long. All of that said, Pete bet on baseball and then made it worse by lying. He won't get in while he's living. At some point he will eventually get in.
Barry Bonds....Not A HOF....
Mickey Mantle and Willie Mays were banned from the game for gambling concerns, but were later reinstated. Why not Rose?
He will never be in the Hall. Will he and should he are two different questions.
Inner circle
Raises much bigger questions...are Hall of Fames loosing their allure? Are we starting to not really care about them as much?
they get so political...it ruins it for everyone
Pete makes way more money by not being in the hall of fame than he would if elected. The situation works very well for him from a monetary perspective.
It does not matter who Rose bet for or against. However, it is very hard to prove the gambling had anything to do with altering any games. I agree with his personality being his downfall, and upon his banishment he didn't fall on the sword in a matter of speaking, however the Commissoner never offered any stipulations for reinstatement. It was very open ended in a matter if speaking where no treatment was offered, no period of suspension contingent on giving up gambling, completing treatment, completing community service on say speeches of him sharing his mistakes and what he regrets, nothing was offered. How can you offer any apology when quite frankly Bud Selig was not going to accept it anyway. Selig essentially took no action on the request for reinstatement and if he did it was after a significant period of time and again with no consideration of stipulations. The only thing I ever heard publicly "do you still gamble?" I guess yes was the response so no reinstatement. What 3rd Grader thought that one up? In addition the Commissioner violated the banishment himself by allowing Rose on the field when it meant making money. Money more times than not destroys integrity. When Rose was under investigation and subsequently banned there was no rule that said banishment meant ineligible for the Hall of Fame. Ironically Rose's case led to that rule. How convenient? Now the drugs and PEDs, scientifically proven based on the added strength, that it gives an unfair advantage. Bonds, Sosa, McGuire, Clemmons, A-Rod, and those are just high profile guys, forget it. Gambling is not cheating during a game, taking drugs is. Drugs in fact are still happening many guys feel the risk of not getting caught is worth it. Integrity? Now one of today's teams developed an elaborate scheme and plan to steal signs in order to cheat and get an unfair advantage. When Rose played an even managed it was still a game to a degree. Now all that is talked about is the millions a player should get without limit. Bryce Harper wanted 450 million. He left his former team and they won the World Series the very next year. Baseball and Money have a HUGE problem that is ego driven to the point that you play or shuffle through the games, don't give a darn who wins, and all the players want is money. Their personal stats does not guarantee team success but certain players want millions and millions more. They want to opt out of contracts so they can always get the going rate in their mind. I say play for a certain amount and if you don't like it do something else or start your own league and pay the Bill's yourself. Unionized or not, find guys that want to play for a reasonable amount that results in prices and costs being reasonable. Everyone wins then. Now only rich spoiled players who still try and cheat win. The game doesn't win, the fans don't win, nobody who still thinks the games matter wins. Rose and the Hall of Fame, it's like memorabilia, on the market it has monetary value but it ultimately is worthless in life. If you can't get any money/value it is worthless. Like the score of the next game, ultimately worthless. Fans don't get a break because their team wins. You put a guy in the Hall of Fame with a plaque he is soon after forgotten about. Rose would be too. If he goes in posthumously it would only be to both create money and drama. Forget it, if am in charge of Rose estate I am telling Baseball to kiss my rear at that point. Guy has been banished for over 30 years now. Where you been baseball? You don't get the hit King after he is deceased whose performance on the field is legit and undeniable. By then you blew it, not Rose anymore.
I have that Infamous Billy Ripken card that says Fuck face written by his brother Cal and they didn't catch it until after
When selig dies.....pete will go in...but not until that moment. Sucks, cause Ty Cobb was an ardent, open racist and hated by almost everyone and he's in the hall of fame. Pete was an amazing player. He hustled his ass off, even during spring training and all star games (he's still to blame for what happened to Ray Fosse though). But an amazing, dedicated to winning ballplayer. LET PETE IN!!!!
I guarantee that Rule 21 does not say anything about Pete Rose's lifetime banishment being tied to Selig's lifetime. I sure hope it pertains to the lifetime of MLB and the Hall of Fame though. I say he's never getting in and doesn't deserve to be in.
I would agree to put him in the Hall of fame if he went to court plead guilty to degenerate gambling as a professional athlete and serve 12 months state time.He paid for his crime and then it's behind him forever
(Disclosure: Not here to pi$$ you off Big Unit but rather provide my very lengthy ascertainment) Prison sentences do not provide rehabilitation for those that feel they haven't done the crime that fits the time in the first place, and going away in a concrete building for a year rarely equals a favorable public sentiment upon exit. What if he doesn't care and serves a one year jail term? So a year that doesn't involve any of his opponents most likely won't change status quo that hasn't altered in 35 years. Isn't MLB legally considered entertainment like the other major professional sports like the NFL, NBA, and NHL? This question has been a hot topic of late due to very arguable officiating calls that have been magnified into a brand new, highly trafficked genre on TH-cam and other social media platforms (Going as far as to compare the above "real" professional leagues to the "predetermined" WWE. While you can wrangle with the blurred lines of the aforementioned comparisons, one can't argue the entertainment value of Rose's polarizing life story that unfortunately did not include the final resurrection that is a favorable societal par for the course , after his meteoric rise to stardom and major fall into the depths of baseball hell. So, by betting on baseball games he wasn't involved in, did he commit a crime or simply break a rule of an entertainment company? He also bet on his team, essentially betting on himself the case can be made. Are we not told that if you cant bet on yourself, you lose in life? The Cooperstown law says absolutely not. Not right now, that is. He will eventually get his plaque in time, but he could possibly expedite his case and push through the HOF bureaucracy. What might he do to accomplish his goal that doesn't include prison time, you ask? If only he bestowed upon his critics a single heartfelt apology, he might have this day. Action is needed now if Rose wants to die a man knowing he had his day; to be accepted once again by his peers. His morals will forever be examined by pundits from all vessels until one day he is an all but forgotten side note of history in character with controversial figures such as Ty Cobb and "Shoeless" Joe Jackson. In closing, most of his playing career was exemplary BUT for the controversial, albeit entertaining, last few years?! The answer resulting in the final outcome depends on a Pete Rose in the twilight years of life and his ability to at least resemble a sincere, regretful public figure that is believable enough to pass the eye test for the majority. Prison will not change the resentment he faces in opinion. I will digress that only regret and shame inside Rose himself is the true justice that provides his rehabilitation and admittance into the baseball fraternity every player dreams of being initiated into. He needs to act steadfast and have the same determination as a 1970's collision at the plate that decides the pennant......
@@heatherh8359 put the pipe down and throw away that blunt.He has to pay for his crimes.He was braking the law
@@randyjohnson805 Please understand that A) He broke the rules of Major League Baseball, which AREN'T LAWS B) Learn how to spell C) I believe you are the proverbial pot calling the kettle black. Meth kills
no way bud would have done that milwakee offered Pete a boat load of money and he told bud that hell would have to freeze over before he would pay in milwaukee.
Pete belongs in the hall of fame,but guess what he don't give a rat's ass ,
He does give a rat's ass. He wrote his acceptance speech for his son to read when he's voted in after he dies. He's still not getting in after he dies though.
Can Managers bet on games now?
Nope.
Pete Rose does NOT deserve to be in the hall of fame. Why? Because he broke the cardinal rule of baseball. There used to be standards in this country. Not anymore. Now we have this attitude of "yeah I know he cheated but reward him anyway." What's the point of HAVING rules if you can break them and get what you want anyway?
@George Kouts Actually there is more than evidence. There is actual PROOF that he bet as a player. Read the Dowd report. They have proof-betting slips in his handwriting, phone records-that he bet on baseball at least since 1984. When he was still a player.
@George Kouts , read the dowd report. The evidence is ironclad. Rose bet on baseball as a player. Many times. There is no question.
@George Kouts my pleasure.
I agree sir. Everyone wants to make decisions based off of making them feel good about themselves and not what is the right thing to do.
@George Kouts you don't need to read the report. Rose has flat out admitted he bet on Baseball, as both a player and a coach.
Anyone who hates homosexuality does not belong in Baseball‘s Hall of Fame and because he is argonaut,I feel keep him out period!!!!!!!
Its irrelevant whether he bet on his team to win or lose. The rules are the same, permanent ban.
This is a personal issue with Pete
Are they so stupid to think theirs nothing players in that gambled in a game they were involved in
And did much much worse
Show me the managerial errors in situations that were obviously questionable
Ask the players that played under Pete
They would remember those calls in questions
CharlieHustle played the game correctly
They don’t dispute that
They are pety and can’t see the forest for the trees
Obviouly
As manager as laid out by the chief investigator of Rose's case said that he couldn't prove an omission, but Rose did NOT always bet on the Reds, he sent a signal to the bookies by not betting for them when certain pitchers pitched. It is a long read, but Rose is an addictive liar too and has never come clean even in his book.
www.cincinnati.com/story/news/2015/03/21/rose-investigator-pete-belong-game/25112355/
PETE ROSE - One of The Greatest & Most "Winningnest," Baseball Players of All Time...He made the worst mistake by knowingly betting on Baseball...which means he will most likely not be allowed into...The Baseball Hall of Fame...Either way...He will always be in The Hall of Fame of Baseball Players & Fans Hearts...And a valuable lesson and inspiration always...
BS
The HOF should be based on baseball ability only. There are a host of SOB's in the baseball HOF that were a lot worse than what Rose did.
Did what these SOB's that you talk of break a rule that was posted in every clubhouse across the league? Even if the HOF was based on baseball ability only, he still got himself kicked out of baseball so they can't even get him on the ballot to decide if what he did on the field was worthy. It's weird how a lifetime ban works, but then again it's pretty simple too.
they hire u for the same reason they fire u
Spot on. Selfish and narcissist
LET ME TELL YOU SOMTHING YOU DONT GET IT.They don't understand the big shots never wanted him in NEVER! Listen to this crap do you think it makes sense! How bout the babe ? Pete was and is baseball. This has been a hack job from day 1.
Pete played his guts out! Go digging and there's issues with alot of Hall of famers. How bout the commissiners let's open that book!
steroids ruined baseball, pete rose only ruined his life. Let him in the Hall
Why does anyone care about this?
but the steroid commissioner Liar bud selig is in?
gimmie a fuckin break
Idgaf what he did....he is Charlie hussle...
the baseball gods are duck heads ....hof.period period...gd U think ty.cobb was perfect.Ruth?
Did Cobb or Ruth bet on baseball? Was there a rule that they broke? Send me the link and I'll agree with you then.
@@roland7584 listen shithead.....no links back then....no media like 2day and people kept their mouths shut unlike yours waiting for a falice to make its way in....Cobb was a mad man Ruth was a drunk....both deserved cooperstown
The Hall of Fame is a sham until Rose is in.
Pete Rose should never be allowed in the Hall of Fame. End of story.
Dan Patrick is a crook too.
burn the hall of fame to the ground
if Pete ain't there it dont count
Bonds and Clemens aren't hall of famers.