As a 45 year old single female I understand this album and the relationship drama, depression, situationship, narcissistic games and isolation she felt. Oh this album hit me in more ways than one. A lot of the songs I can relate to my last relationship. I was not expecting to have alll these feelings brought up by this album but it's good to know Taylor has felt the same and gets it.
I'm 51 and I've been married 30 years. I totally identify. I may have married young, but I had time for some intense situationships and I've got a Matty of my own. A lot of people are talking about how she's stuck in high school, but I am identifying with a lot of what she's put in here.
She doesn’t need to choose a mate based on their quality of being a muse. She should choose a mate based on her own happiness. She gave us the manuscript. Literally, from beginning to end. Maybe she’s done with muses. She completed the muse education, she graduated with honors. She may be done, and as a long time swifty, I’m ok with that. I’m happy to listen to anything she puts out in the future, even if it’s not romantically based love/heart break songs. We have the complete collection.
Exactly! She even said in the prologue (which I hope that people read before making comments about the album) that she writes the worst men best. I find it ironic too, they were complaining about misogynistic tropes when it comes to Taylor, when they’re saying things like Travis can’t be a good muse bc he doesn’t have enough depth based on one song. It’s hypocritical.
@@Mrs.Currie The fist time I learnt a porn site had that name, which was by reading of this, I laughed too (and I thought of the Shoah, not current US racial ghettos btw), that name is inherently funny when you first hear it, and I think that's kind of the point of it. Upon learning about it, I'm sure not gonna have a look, so my understanding' going to be limited, but if I learnt something from Cavani's Night Porter, fetishes in enthusiastically consenting settings can have a role in metabolising historical wounds. Not my fetish to draw a flag for, but not mine to judge either.
In Down Bad, she says everything comes out ‘teenage petulance.’ I think the ‘cringe’ lyrics (F-&* it, if I can’t have him) are part of that teenage petulance.
Adding Folklore + Evermore + Midnights, Joe collaborated as a composer on just 6 songs. Taylor doesn't need him for ANYTHING, if you listened to TTPD, and paid attention to the lyrics of So Long London and other songs, she was unhappy in the relationship and feeling neglected in addition to referring to dating as a prison. I don't think Taylor will invite Joe to 5pm tea 🙃
I would say this album converted me. I liked her and enjoyed folklore and lover but this has me obsessed. And now I love Martty too. He’s the ultimate bad boy 😂 I would stay far away but he is charming.
Please don't. There's a reason why she bashes John Mayer- who she compared to cancer. She bashes Healy the harshest, so he must have done something beyond what she's disclosed.
You give Joe a lot of credit. Jack was openly skeptical that Joe ever really helped write those songs. How do we not know that his writing credits were not the “keeping count” Taylor referenced on Midnights? That it wasn’t some sort of breakup negotiation we never knew of?
Yeah, that's funny! I noticed the skepticism in Jack's voice in that clip from her long pond session interview with Jack and Aaron. That really jumped out at me and I wondered too 🤔. Jack is a truth teller and seems too sweet to lie 😂
Way too much credit to Joe. If Joe is such a Grammy winning talent at songwriting talent, where’s the material?! God knows, he’s a horrible actor so why not keep up with the songwriting? 😭
Aaron also said he’s never met William Bowery and has 0 idea of who it is and he produced and worked on majority of Folkmore with Taylor, not to mention joe got added credit for work he didn’t originally do after the album was already out and nominated for AOTY so if it won he could get a Grammy with her
I’m so glad you brought up the whole “how does Travis feel” thing. That was definitely a thought that came to me. Yes, everybody has a past and feelings that they had in other relationships, but these feelings are so heavy and kind of fresh because these relationships are less than a year old.
The Joe widow behavior needs to be stopped in the Taylor swift fandom! If listened to so long London/YLM and still think she still likes Joe in any fashion, don’t think analyzing Taylor lyrics is for you. She compared being with him to jail and a psych ward, and you think she’s gonna be songwriting with him in the future?? 😭 Maybe try Gracie Abrams.
The 1 is definitely about Matty. Even the way the song title is stylized is a nod to “The 1975.” She could have easily called it “The One” but she didn’t. She’s way too smart for that to be a coincidence.
This album is like a social experiment and you can see how people react to real feelings and thougths of sadness and angry of a person who see as a heroine, and i think is an amazing mirror of how we wanna hide or resist our own "bad" sides or fully embraced them.
My boy breaks his favorite toys is one of my favorites. I keep thinking about Toy story 2 and the story of Jesse. Literally it feels like she saw that movie and wrote a song about it.
I'm not what they would call a Swiftie, I like some songs and I think she's a great storyteller, but I can rarely tell which album a song is from. That said, this is the album I actually relate to, maybe because my masochist arse tends to exclusively date Matty Healy types. Btw, Healy is not that bad politically, he leans 'dirtbag leftist' (chapo trap house, to be clear) and gets a lot of flack for his stage persona, comments that are misunderstood or not even his own, like the one from that deleted podcast about a fetish porn site. Also, as much as I like the 1975, I wouldn't say he's an A-lister, not even close, and I can see him him 'leaving her safe but stranded' when the world was against her because of him and he himself had his family receive death threats and photoshopped pictures of him ODed at their home address. He didn't want to become Meghan Markle, being 'responsible' for the both of them becoming villains in the eyes of most people and the press. He wasn't strong enough and that's a fault of his, but the situation surely required superhuman kind of strength. Who knows what would have been of them if the parasocial fans hadn't decided that they deserved veto power over Swift's life choices.
Controversial opinion ... Joe hasn't written any songs before and he shows no signs of writing any since. I don't believe he made much of a contribution - I think Taylor threw him a bone to try and keep him on board while she wrote songs about the man she really loved (but in disguise)
Thank you for proving that understanding what Taylor wanted us us to hear, is so supremely fulfilling/devastating but you need to listen to the whole thing, including the summation poem/cliff notes
Me to my toddlers: “Please- it’s Friday evening, all mommy wants to do rn is sit outside in peace, sip some pinot noir and listen to this podcast about Taylor Swift.”
I think you guys are giving Joe way to much credit he didn’t really co-write much of her music. I saw an interview that he did on a British podcast and he was asked about folklore and he said he didn’t really do much but just play the piano and say certain things. This also takes away from Taylor’s own talent by saying that she needed help from “William Bowery”. Red happened before Joe was even a thing a that’s arguably her best and most critically acclaimed album before folklore and evermore even happened.
I love folklore / evermore but they seem to over inflate the depth on those albums. Fans tend to conflate good lyricism with flowery language. Red is still her best lyricism to date. Which is also the last time she worked with Liz rose, who I believed helped Taylor edit herself. A lot of times in songwriting and poetry less is more.
I adore this album already, but I'm also a massive 1975 fan. One thing that has made me uncomfortable with the album is the number of drug references and how Matty is painted in this way, considering the effort he's taken to become sober. Idk if many people will agree with this, but it just feels not quite right, considerinh the struggle
Is he totally sober though?? It seems he's still drinking, smoking mary, and taking pills. Addicts are known liars because they will do anything for the drugs.
I think a lot of drug references are from the past and not from last year ! She always compares the time when "they were just kids" and last year. The only thing she references is smoke which refers to cigarettes.
I think he's still using. Obviously, he's admitted weed and alcohol. But in the smallest man she mentioned he is trying to buy pills from a friend of a friend but they ghosted you. Now YOU KNOW WHAT IT FEELS LIKE...to be ghosted. Because it sounds like he kind of just disappeared like a ghost. And this is AFTER the fact. So, sorry 🤷♀️.
The recap of Taylor and Matty's history was super interesting and helpful for context in understanding her latest album. I do feel like the hosts here were a little disrespectful of her in giving Joe so much credit for her songwriting. I also disagree that the lyrics are clunky (aside from the Charlie Puth one, lol).
I think Matty took himself out because his family was getting death threats, and also to preserve Taylor's career. He has described himself as soft and sensitive, he has teared up over not having someone in his life and spoken about growing up and getting serious about settling down. But the knee jerk reactions of swifties made it impossible. The fans who freaked out and wrote the open letter clearly didn't trust Taylor's choices. It definitely sounds like TTPD was meant to be a different album, and he was probably working on it with her. Alchemy sounds like it was originally about him and lyrics were changed to reflect Travis. It's sad to think of the great music we would have gotten from Swift/Healy collabs.
I believe "The Alchemy" and "So High School" could have also been Matty songs originally that she changed the lyrics to last minute. The songs are simple in nature because she had only been with Travis less than a couple months when she had to hand over all her work to the producers (mid October). It would have been weird for her to write all these sappy love songs about Travis. She either changed existing songs (which is what I believe) or created new songs for Travis because she knew we'd be upset if there was nothing on the album about him. I am confident TS12 will be everything and more for Travis, and will be a radio bop album.
@@finleypawrker8551 I agree there is nothing on SHS that fits with Matty, but I wonder if she originally had the concept of the song as a metaphor for her and Matty being young and immature when they first met (she uses that imagery with them often). But then when things changed she wrote the whole song for Travis. Just speculation
@@lmkk9118 yeah I don’t think so. Matty songs on TTPD have a 1975 sound. So HS sounds like 2000s era romcom which fits the Travis relationship more than the Matty. It’s really the only song that doesn’t fit on TTPD sonically so I don’t think it was ever about Matty bc her love for him was on an artistic level not really on HS crush one. It was prob recorded in 2024 which is why it wasn’t included on the standard edition.
@@finleypawrker8551 agree after first listen I thought So Highschool was a late addition to the album - although I thought that about the songs Robin, Cassandra and thanKyou aIMee that they didn't really fit TTPD - maybe there are more MH songs in the vault (in lowercase) that were swapped out?
@@Infiniteuniverse0000 I meant about the new album not her. I think he really did care. He wrote Caroline and about you about her. Potentially others too...
I have a theory (that is probably completely wrong) that So High School was a peek into what the Travis album is gonna sound like and i gotta say, im so here for it. I love the early 2000s romcom vibes.
Not sure if you guys will touch on this (still listening), but I think TS giving Joe the Track 5 of this album is kinda a snub to Matty (or maybe honoring their 6-year relationship). Because there are super devastating songs about Matty that could’ve been Track 5 instead, but I think Matty didn’t deserve one in TS’s mind. Just my speculation haha!
It’s crazy because I’m not a typical Taylor swift fan, and I just recently started listening to her and I loved the album! But I’m a huge Lana fan and that maybe why I liked the album more than others.
Everyone is forgetting that she literally called this phase as Maniac phase… She longed for Marriage and Children clearly which Joe was not ready for and Then Matty loved bombed her and promised her things… He is not a great person She literally called their affair counterfeit so let’s not Romanticise Toxic relationship too much
Don't know why you think Joe actually helped much on those songs lmao.....she wrote great songs before joe.....when will ppl give her real credit for being a good song writer. SHES A GOOD SONG WRITER. PERIOD. Doesn't need Joe. Doesn't matter if she's with Travis.
I think Joe is the miracle move on drug- he promised to give her what she wanted and she thought that would make her happy. But I think they didn’t have the connection… and he was distant and cool and well “tolerate it”… Joe tolerated her. I picture it like… he is almost more like a distant father figure who puts up with her “nonsense” but is kind of waiting for her to settle down and become something she’s not. And their relationship was dead on the vine for such a long time (been there)
Also, another interesting thought. Last July 2nd (a few weeks after the breakup), I saw the 1975 and on stage Matty referred to Jack Antonoff as his best friend, which I thought was very interesting considering some of what Jack produced and co-wrote.
To me it seems that they circled around each other for years each building a persona of the other, using that persona of each other as muses . But then when it wasn't forbidden and they weren't only meeting in secret locations, in a studio where they were working etc but could spend time normally with each other it wasn't that special anymore. Isn't what people say never meet your heroes? The persona got exposed to reality. Also he love bombed her, they were in the studio together when her relation with Joe was not going well and he read what she was writing. He knew what buttons to push during the love bombing.
I feel more devastated by their break-up now than I ever thought would be possible. I was so hoping her and Joe would one day work things out and get back together once they grow, but now I very insanely hope the same for Taylor and Matty. I don’t think their story is over like Taylor is saying, and I almost have no doubt they will get back together in the future and pull a JLo and Ben. Maybe he’ll grow a pair in the future.
I personally don’t think this will ever happen he ghosted her. Jlo and Ben where still in love with each other I don’t think Matty ever loved Taylor and he’s dating a woman who seems more like his type.
I posted a question on a 1975 youtube thread.... I got an answer that seemed like the person really knew something about what happened. How do I send it to you?
The lyric where you think she can’t say over is really from mattys perspective. Listen to it again. It’s not her that can’t say it’s over. It was matty who couldn’t say it. Matty ghosted her. He never told her it was over. He ghosted. That’s why she doesn’t complete the line. Matty never told her it was over. He just showed he’s the smallest man who ever lived. 😂
From the songs, I think he left town (she thought he was coming back) but then he told her it was over 'for her own good' and then ghosted her after that.
I just can’t understand why she wouldn’t realize the end of this. Did she think it would just be all okay? Even IF everyone got their orders, there were bound to be issues that customers would need services for, from the company. I’m sorry, but that is absolutely unacceptable to be completely radio silent. For her to place all the miscommunication onto her management is even worse. I highly doubt they’d let this continue without telling her about all of the traffic this has been getting. If they did keep her totally blind to it, she needs new management.
She's seeing herself as the albatross (a bird, but metaphorically something which causes you great problems from which you cannot escape). If you study the lyrics, she basically tells him that she's been targeted with fake news too and none of it matters, ignore it. But when he's finally attacked in the media, they "drag him from his bed" she tries to spread her wings like a parachute and protect him. This song is really a masterpiece. I think it can apply to her dating life in general, but especially to Matty since he was attacked so brutally. Lies were spread about him, death threats sent to him and his family and ai generated images of him dead from overdosing sent to his mother. She was trying to protect him and tell him it doesn’t matter. Personally, I love Matty and think he’s misunderstood, please listen to this man speak in interviews, let him speak for himself and stop spreading false information about him.
I really believe that he had good intentions but was driven away by a brutal media and fan fake news assault. All sorts of false accusations were made about him. Death threats were sent to him and his family.
@maciedixon3983 Maybe the relationship just didn't live up to the fantasy. Maybe he meant what he said in the beginning, but when he came down from the initial honeymoon phase...found that they just weren't right for one another. Maybe it's not to do with the crazy invasive fans.
This! I wouldn't be surprised if in the future Matty's relationship goes up in smoke and he's right back to messaging Taylor, and she needs to stay far away bc it will be just as toxic the next time around. Travis seems like such a good family man. I think he'd move the world for her if he could. I'm really rooting for them.
Healy also stated that he engages in casual and explicit racism with his friends during conversations. And he proceeded to double down and was unapologetic about his racism. This is why Swift was harshly criticized- bc racism was not a deal breaker for her. She completely misses the mark on why there was outrage over her dating him.
Stop. That is not true, stop spreading misinformation about him. I encourage people to listen to the Zane Lowe interview with him and hear him speak for himself. He is literally a gay rights activist, a women’s rights activist and has dated several black women, he is not racist in any way.
The fans missed the mark and didn't even consider that Swift knew him better than they did. He has been a performance artist, political satirist and provocateur, but Healy is no racist.
Most people - like you- do not get satire in the slightest, do not get performance art.. do not even kinda get anything about MH. His whole body of work shows his anti-racism but people cherry pick and take out of context and claim he’s racist. You can’t see past the nose on your face.
@@ssalas7374Dating Black people does not absolve people from being anti Black. That's like saying men who date women can never be anti women. I literally listened/readHIS INTERVIEWS. He NEVER APOLOGIZED & DOUBLED DOWN. He is utterly clueless. Stop being a racist apologist. Just bc you're okay with giving white men free passes for mocking people's ethnic features doesn't mean it's okay.
End Game and half of Reputation could be about Matty Healy. I always wondered how Joe Alwyn got this big reputation 🥱 I don’t think that song is about Joe
As a 45 year old single female I understand this album and the relationship drama, depression, situationship, narcissistic games and isolation she felt. Oh this album hit me in more ways than one. A lot of the songs I can relate to my last relationship. I was not expecting to have alll these feelings brought up by this album but it's good to know Taylor has felt the same and gets it.
I'm 51 and I've been married 30 years. I totally identify. I may have married young, but I had time for some intense situationships and I've got a Matty of my own. A lot of people are talking about how she's stuck in high school, but I am identifying with a lot of what she's put in here.
In matters of the heart, Taylor Alison Swift is truly someone we can all relate to!
She doesn’t need to choose a mate based on their quality of being a muse. She should choose a mate based on her own happiness. She gave us the manuscript. Literally, from beginning to end. Maybe she’s done with muses. She completed the muse education, she graduated with honors. She may be done, and as a long time swifty, I’m ok with that. I’m happy to listen to anything she puts out in the future, even if it’s not romantically based love/heart break songs. We have the complete collection.
Exactly! She even said in the prologue (which I hope that people read before making comments about the album) that she writes the worst men best. I find it ironic too, they were complaining about misogynistic tropes when it comes to Taylor, when they’re saying things like Travis can’t be a good muse bc he doesn’t have enough depth based on one song. It’s hypocritical.
The thing is Matty Healy never made those comments it was the hosts that made the comment
Yes, thank you. ❤
That he laughed at the comments was seen as him approving of them.
@@Mrs.Currie The fist time I learnt a porn site had that name, which was by reading of this, I laughed too (and I thought of the Shoah, not current US racial ghettos btw), that name is inherently funny when you first hear it, and I think that's kind of the point of it.
Upon learning about it, I'm sure not gonna have a look, so my understanding' going to be limited, but if I learnt something from Cavani's Night Porter, fetishes in enthusiastically consenting settings can have a role in metabolising historical wounds.
Not my fetish to draw a flag for, but not mine to judge either.
In Down Bad, she says everything comes out ‘teenage petulance.’ I think the ‘cringe’ lyrics (F-&* it, if I can’t have him) are part of that teenage petulance.
I mean.. I thought that was obvious. The line comes right after the other- it’s her illustrating the point she made.
Adding Folklore + Evermore + Midnights, Joe collaborated as a composer on just 6 songs. Taylor doesn't need him for ANYTHING, if you listened to TTPD, and paid attention to the lyrics of So Long London and other songs, she was unhappy in the relationship and feeling neglected in addition to referring to dating as a prison.
I don't think Taylor will invite Joe to 5pm tea 🙃
I would say this album converted me. I liked her and enjoyed folklore and lover but this has me obsessed. And now I love Martty too. He’s the ultimate bad boy 😂 I would stay far away but he is charming.
Please don't. There's a reason why she bashes John Mayer- who she compared to cancer. She bashes Healy the harshest, so he must have done something beyond what she's disclosed.
@@cheesewithxbread you're taking someone's love life waaayyyy too seriously.
@@cheesewithxbread make your own mind up about people x
Literally same! I'm OBSESSED with this album❤
Yes, stay far away from Matty!!
You give Joe a lot of credit. Jack was openly skeptical that Joe ever really helped write those songs. How do we not know that his writing credits were not the “keeping count” Taylor referenced on Midnights? That it wasn’t some sort of breakup negotiation we never knew of?
Yeah, that's funny! I noticed the skepticism in Jack's voice in that clip from her long pond session interview with Jack and Aaron. That really jumped out at me and I wondered too 🤔. Jack is a truth teller and seems too sweet to lie 😂
@@spiritranger9202Jack is too messy to lie for Joe not too sweet 😂
Way too much credit to Joe. If Joe is such a Grammy winning talent at songwriting talent, where’s the material?! God knows, he’s a horrible actor so why not keep up with the songwriting? 😭
Aaron also said he’s never met William Bowery and has 0 idea of who it is and he produced and worked on majority of Folkmore with Taylor, not to mention joe got added credit for work he didn’t originally do after the album was already out and nominated for AOTY so if it won he could get a Grammy with her
I don’t believe Joe contributed much to the songs. I think Taylor felt sorry for him and tried to build him up by giving him credit.
I’m so glad you brought up the whole “how does Travis feel” thing. That was definitely a thought that came to me. Yes, everybody has a past and feelings that they had in other relationships, but these feelings are so heavy and kind of fresh because these relationships are less than a year old.
The Joe widow behavior needs to be stopped in the Taylor swift fandom! If listened to so long London/YLM and still think she still likes Joe in any fashion, don’t think analyzing Taylor lyrics is for you. She compared being with him to jail and a psych ward, and you think she’s gonna be songwriting with him in the future?? 😭 Maybe try Gracie Abrams.
There are hints that maroon is also about him
The 1 is definitely about Matty. Even the way the song title is stylized is a nod to “The 1975.” She could have easily called it “The One” but she didn’t. She’s way too smart for that to be a coincidence.
This album is like a social experiment and you can see how people react to real feelings and thougths of sadness and angry of a person who see as a heroine, and i think is an amazing mirror of how we wanna hide or resist our own "bad" sides or fully embraced them.
Well said. This album makes our own reactions the mirrorball of ourselves
Yes, I’ve been thinking it is like a social experiment ❤️
@@camilalucas785 listen to Fleetwood Mac’s Rumor from 1977 and Carly Simon No Secrets.
It really is!!
My boy breaks his favorite toys is one of my favorites. I keep thinking about Toy story 2 and the story of Jesse. Literally it feels like she saw that movie and wrote a song about it.
Me too!! That’s EXACTLY what I imagine !!
I'm not what they would call a Swiftie, I like some songs and I think she's a great storyteller, but I can rarely tell which album a song is from.
That said, this is the album I actually relate to, maybe because my masochist arse tends to exclusively date Matty Healy types.
Btw, Healy is not that bad politically, he leans 'dirtbag leftist' (chapo trap house, to be clear) and gets a lot of flack for his stage persona, comments that are misunderstood or not even his own, like the one from that deleted podcast about a fetish porn site.
Also, as much as I like the 1975, I wouldn't say he's an A-lister, not even close, and I can see him him 'leaving her safe but stranded' when the world was against her because of him and he himself had his family receive death threats and photoshopped pictures of him ODed at their home address.
He didn't want to become Meghan Markle, being 'responsible' for the both of them becoming villains in the eyes of most people and the press. He wasn't strong enough and that's a fault of his, but the situation surely required superhuman kind of strength.
Who knows what would have been of them if the parasocial fans hadn't decided that they deserved veto power over Swift's life choices.
THIS
I agree 💯
Controversial opinion ... Joe hasn't written any songs before and he shows no signs of writing any since. I don't believe he made much of a contribution - I think Taylor threw him a bone to try and keep him on board while she wrote songs about the man she really loved (but in disguise)
Great observation!
Thank you for proving that understanding what Taylor wanted us us to hear, is so supremely fulfilling/devastating but you need to listen to the whole thing, including the summation poem/cliff notes
This album has her best writing yet, cannot relate!!!
Me to my toddlers: “Please- it’s Friday evening, all mommy wants to do rn is sit outside in peace, sip some pinot noir and listen to this podcast about Taylor Swift.”
lolol!!!!
I think you guys are giving Joe way to much credit he didn’t really co-write much of her music. I saw an interview that he did on a British podcast and he was asked about folklore and he said he didn’t really do much but just play the piano and say certain things. This also takes away from Taylor’s own talent by saying that she needed help from “William Bowery”. Red happened before Joe was even a thing a that’s arguably her best and most critically acclaimed album before folklore and evermore even happened.
I love folklore / evermore but they seem to over inflate the depth on those albums. Fans tend to conflate good lyricism with flowery language.
Red is still her best lyricism to date. Which is also the last time she worked with Liz rose, who I believed helped Taylor edit herself. A lot of times in songwriting and poetry less is more.
I adore this album already, but I'm also a massive 1975 fan. One thing that has made me uncomfortable with the album is the number of drug references and how Matty is painted in this way, considering the effort he's taken to become sober. Idk if many people will agree with this, but it just feels not quite right, considerinh the struggle
Is he totally sober though?? It seems he's still drinking, smoking mary, and taking pills. Addicts are known liars because they will do anything for the drugs.
I think a lot of drug references are from the past and not from last year ! She always compares the time when "they were just kids" and last year. The only thing she references is smoke which refers to cigarettes.
I think he's still using. Obviously, he's admitted weed and alcohol. But in the smallest man she mentioned he is trying to buy pills from a friend of a friend but they ghosted you. Now YOU KNOW WHAT IT FEELS LIKE...to be ghosted. Because it sounds like he kind of just disappeared like a ghost. And this is AFTER the fact. So, sorry 🤷♀️.
@@spiritranger9202 Well..we don't know him. I hope he's okay
@@user-uh4ro4mc3csmallest men mentions drugs
Taylor needs a real man that is successful in his own field so that they can support each, not compete with each other.
I'm now looking back at a lot of songs and wonder if they are about MH! Cruel Summer, Question?...
Clean?
Entire TS Catalogue!! 😅
@@Donna-C "I swirled you into all of my poems"
Gold Rush, Tis the Damn Season, Snow on the Beach, Illicit Affairs, and of course Cardigan. Maybe even Willow
The recap of Taylor and Matty's history was super interesting and helpful for context in understanding her latest album. I do feel like the hosts here were a little disrespectful of her in giving Joe so much credit for her songwriting. I also disagree that the lyrics are clunky (aside from the Charlie Puth one, lol).
I think Matty took himself out because his family was getting death threats, and also to preserve Taylor's career. He has described himself as soft and sensitive, he has teared up over not having someone in his life and spoken about growing up and getting serious about settling down. But the knee jerk reactions of swifties made it impossible. The fans who freaked out and wrote the open letter clearly didn't trust Taylor's choices. It definitely sounds like TTPD was meant to be a different album, and he was probably working on it with her. Alchemy sounds like it was originally about him and lyrics were changed to reflect Travis. It's sad to think of the great music we would have gotten from Swift/Healy collabs.
I'm a new fan because of this album. I'm just learning about easter eggs and back stories! I've been missing out.
same
I remember seeing photo of Matty and her Dad at the Nashville show. My thoughts were her Dad was going to get that relationship over. I wonder ….
The elders convened
This album is definitely for the fans, but for me personally, some songs speak deeply ❤
He didn't say he was watching that porn. It's so important to hear this stuff for yourself
32:13 The kissing is definitely consensual! These people are practically throwing themselves at him! 😂
I believe "The Alchemy" and "So High School" could have also been Matty songs originally that she changed the lyrics to last minute. The songs are simple in nature because she had only been with Travis less than a couple months when she had to hand over all her work to the producers (mid October). It would have been weird for her to write all these sappy love songs about Travis. She either changed existing songs (which is what I believe) or created new songs for Travis because she knew we'd be upset if there was nothing on the album about him. I am confident TS12 will be everything and more for Travis, and will be a radio bop album.
The alchemy was def originally about Matty. So hs is unquestionably about Travis tho
@@finleypawrker8551 I agree there is nothing on SHS that fits with Matty, but I wonder if she originally had the concept of the song as a metaphor for her and Matty being young and immature when they first met (she uses that imagery with them often). But then when things changed she wrote the whole song for Travis. Just speculation
@@lmkk9118 yeah I don’t think so. Matty songs on TTPD have a 1975 sound. So HS sounds like 2000s era romcom which fits the Travis relationship more than the Matty. It’s really the only song that doesn’t fit on TTPD sonically so I don’t think it was ever about Matty bc her love for him was on an artistic level not really on HS crush one. It was prob recorded in 2024 which is why it wasn’t included on the standard edition.
@@finleypawrker8551 agree after first listen I thought So Highschool was a late addition to the album - although I thought that about the songs Robin, Cassandra and thanKyou aIMee that they didn't really fit TTPD - maybe there are more MH songs in the vault (in lowercase) that were swapped out?
@@lmkk9118 Matty loves American Pie .... just saying
Have you seen Matty's reaction to the reporter asking him if he has heard Taylor's diss track?
yes, a set up 💯
I just saw this! It was tame. He seemed to not even care 😂 🤷♀️
@@popapologists unsure...it didn't seem planned. Unless he knew they were going to approach but he didn't know what they were going to ask?
@@Infiniteuniverse0000 I meant about the new album not her. I think he really did care. He wrote Caroline and about you about her. Potentially others too...
I needed someone to make this video so badly. thank u
I have a theory (that is probably completely wrong) that So High School was a peek into what the Travis album is gonna sound like and i gotta say, im so here for it. I love the early 2000s romcom vibes.
I really think Paris song and Glitch are about them getting together... they came out after original release....
Ohhhhh damg I think u r right
Not sure if you guys will touch on this (still listening), but I think TS giving Joe the Track 5 of this album is kinda a snub to Matty (or maybe honoring their 6-year relationship). Because there are super devastating songs about Matty that could’ve been Track 5 instead, but I think Matty didn’t deserve one in TS’s mind. Just my speculation haha!
It’s crazy because I’m not a typical Taylor swift fan, and I just recently started listening to her and I loved the album! But I’m a huge Lana fan and that maybe why I liked the album more than others.
Everyone is forgetting that she literally called this phase as Maniac phase… She longed for Marriage and Children clearly which Joe was not ready for and Then Matty loved bombed her and promised her things… He is not a great person She literally called their affair counterfeit so let’s not Romanticise Toxic relationship too much
She actually said a “mutual manic phase”. And she also said that looking back on it now she feels like a lot of the pain was self-inflicted. 🤔
Don't know why you think Joe actually helped much on those songs lmao.....she wrote great songs before joe.....when will ppl give her real credit for being a good song writer. SHES A GOOD SONG WRITER. PERIOD. Doesn't need Joe. Doesn't matter if she's with Travis.
I love these deep dives! So good 😊
The thing that puts me sad is the posibility of cheating .
You dont get why listening to the leaks is wrong??? Really? Why am I not surprised. It is called RESPECT.
Sooo goood!!!! Thank you!!
I think Joe is the miracle move on drug- he promised to give her what she wanted and she thought that would make her happy. But I think they didn’t have the connection… and he was distant and cool and well “tolerate it”… Joe tolerated her. I picture it like… he is almost more like a distant father figure who puts up with her “nonsense” but is kind of waiting for her to settle down and become something she’s not. And their relationship was dead on the vine for such a long time (been there)
Can absolutely see this being the case!
This was really good ladies ❤! Fun to go through with you. I'm a fan of both the 1975 and Taylor so enjoyed 🤗
I totally agree with your summary take of the album!!! The perfect take imo 👌🏼👌🏼👌🏼
Also, another interesting thought. Last July 2nd (a few weeks after the breakup), I saw the 1975 and on stage Matty referred to Jack Antonoff as his best friend, which I thought was very interesting considering some of what Jack produced and co-wrote.
To me it seems that they circled around each other for years each building a persona of the other, using that persona of each other as muses . But then when it wasn't forbidden and they weren't only meeting in secret locations, in a studio where they were working etc but could spend time normally with each other it wasn't that special anymore. Isn't what people say never meet your heroes? The persona got exposed to reality.
Also he love bombed her, they were in the studio together when her relation with Joe was not going well and he read what she was writing. He knew what buttons to push during the love bombing.
I feel more devastated by their break-up now than I ever thought would be possible. I was so hoping her and Joe would one day work things out and get back together once they grow, but now I very insanely hope the same for Taylor and Matty. I don’t think their story is over like Taylor is saying, and I almost have no doubt they will get back together in the future and pull a JLo and Ben. Maybe he’ll grow a pair in the future.
"Maybe he'll grow a pair", as if it's a matter of being afraid. Maybe he just decided it wasn't the right relationship for him?
I personally don’t think this will ever happen he ghosted her. Jlo and Ben where still in love with each other I don’t think Matty ever loved Taylor and he’s dating a woman who seems more like his type.
He wont see forty, unless he makes radical changes. I hope he does, even though I think he sucks
I hope for her sake. It’s Over. That dude will never be ready d and if os. Dump her trav.
Taylor sings he let her for safety reasons...don't you think that took guts and a huge sacrifice to walk away?
I posted a question on a 1975 youtube thread.... I got an answer that seemed like the person really knew something about what happened. How do I send it to you?
Can you share?
The lyric where you think she can’t say over is really from mattys perspective. Listen to it again. It’s not her that can’t say it’s over. It was matty who couldn’t say it. Matty ghosted her. He never told her it was over. He ghosted. That’s why she doesn’t complete the line. Matty never told her it was over. He just showed he’s the smallest man who ever lived. 😂
From the songs, I think he left town (she thought he was coming back) but then he told her it was over 'for her own good' and then ghosted her after that.
No, but she was repeating what he said, but cuts off because she can't repeat what he said.
Phantom - Target version of TTPD
I feel like I earned a master's degree today. I keep gasping and my hubby won't understand, so I'm just texting my daughter while she is at school.
The line you referenced was in I can fix him really I can -‘the jokes he told across the bar were revolting and far too loud’
Speak for yourself William Bowery can be long gone, and Travis is definitely interesting as hell
I just can’t understand why she wouldn’t realize the end of this. Did she think it would just be all okay? Even IF everyone got their orders, there were bound to be issues that customers would need services for, from the company. I’m sorry, but that is absolutely unacceptable to be completely radio silent. For her to place all the miscommunication onto her management is even worse. I highly doubt they’d let this continue without telling her about all of the traffic this has been getting. If they did keep her totally blind to it, she needs new management.
Its very sad that you guys stopped trying to find Kate. Since the video was AI and no one still has seen Kate. I think you guys were on to somethintg
I think what he said in the bar was what he said on that podcast. 1:07:03
The Albatross is about Travis. Too many people making projections about her future creativity around Travis.
She's seeing herself as the albatross (a bird, but metaphorically something which causes you great problems from which you cannot escape). If you study the lyrics, she basically tells him that she's been targeted with fake news too and none of it matters, ignore it. But when he's finally attacked in the media, they "drag him from his bed" she tries to spread her wings like a parachute and protect him. This song is really a masterpiece. I think it can apply to her dating life in general, but especially to Matty since he was attacked so brutally. Lies were spread about him, death threats sent to him and his family and ai generated images of him dead from overdosing sent to his mother. She was trying to protect him and tell him it doesn’t matter. Personally, I love Matty and think he’s misunderstood, please listen to this man speak in interviews, let him speak for himself and stop spreading false information about him.
@@ssalas7374 Yes! Couldn't agree more.
@@ssalas7374 Honey. There was literally nothing spread about him. I READ HIS INTERVIEWS. He is not misunderstood, and stop being a racist apologist.
Xanax is blue
Perc 30’s are blue and nicknames the blues which is probably wouldn’t lead him to the heroin
As soon as you said you listened to the leaks, I stopped the video. You disrespected Taylor. I don't care what else you have to say.
😂
Wow harsh lol
😂 19min in and yeah no ...there'll be none of that happening
Booooo to William Bowery apologist
Well this makes me appreciate Travis even more. So glad she’s moved on.
I pray she had. I worry. With a normal person, I wouldn’t be but as much as I love Taylor, I don’t think she knows about actual love
He’s such a gaslighter. That POs
I really believe that he had good intentions but was driven away by a brutal media and fan fake news assault. All sorts of false accusations were made about him. Death threats were sent to him and his family.
@@ssalas7374 nah. I understand people were being crazy but that’s celebrity. It would have blown over. With a little effort.
@maciedixon3983 Maybe the relationship just didn't live up to the fantasy. Maybe he meant what he said in the beginning, but when he came down from the initial honeymoon phase...found that they just weren't right for one another. Maybe it's not to do with the crazy invasive fans.
Im Team Travis, but guys like Matty will keep popping up, esp in the most vulnerable times. Travis, better have her on lock.
If she lets that weasel back in, that’s on her. Goodness
This! I wouldn't be surprised if in the future Matty's relationship goes up in smoke and he's right back to messaging Taylor, and she needs to stay far away bc it will be just as toxic the next time around. Travis seems like such a good family man. I think he'd move the world for her if he could. I'm really rooting for them.
Healy also stated that he engages in casual and explicit racism with his friends during conversations. And he proceeded to double down and was unapologetic about his racism.
This is why Swift was harshly criticized- bc racism was not a deal breaker for her. She completely misses the mark on why there was outrage over her dating him.
Stop. That is not true, stop spreading misinformation about him. I encourage people to listen to the Zane Lowe interview with him and hear him speak for himself. He is literally a gay rights activist, a women’s rights activist and has dated several black women, he is not racist in any way.
The fans missed the mark and didn't even consider that Swift knew him better than they did. He has been a performance artist, political satirist and provocateur, but Healy is no racist.
Most people - like you- do not get satire in the slightest, do not get performance art.. do not even kinda get anything about MH. His whole body of work shows his anti-racism but people cherry pick and take out of context and claim he’s racist. You can’t see past the nose on your face.
@@ssalas7374Dating Black people does not absolve people from being anti Black. That's like saying men who date women can never be anti women.
I literally listened/readHIS INTERVIEWS. He NEVER APOLOGIZED & DOUBLED DOWN. He is utterly clueless.
Stop being a racist apologist. Just bc you're okay with giving white men free passes for mocking people's ethnic features doesn't mean it's okay.
@@ssalas7374So what? How many men have dated women and beat them? Dating someone doesn't mean they are not anti Black or anti women.
I loved the album from the beginning and I’m obsessed with it🖤🤍
End Game and half of Reputation could be about Matty Healy. I always wondered how Joe Alwyn got this big reputation 🥱 I don’t think that song is about Joe
Yea I agree…
Also reputation… look at the album- it’s in lowercase