I played a charity match against Thommo in England last year. He was still bloody quick and bowling away swingers. After the game he invited me to his table in the drinks tent and allowed me to interview him for my local cricket club video. Never have I met a man who was so charming and kind. He was quite happy to chat for an hour or two whilst we slowly got sozzled under the white of the tent canopy. Lovely memories of a lovely man. Cheers Thommo.
Can you imagine thomson comming in bowling a bouncer, goes over the the top of the batsman keeps climbing over the wicket keepers head and crashing onto the sightboard on the full, thats breathtaking and some heat on that ball, has to be over 165 km Thats what he did on some first class venues
Forget shoab( no disrespect at all) Jeff Thompson was the fastest ive seen. Richie said the only person that was close to him was frank tyson!he saw the west indians in there prime so thats saying something. Jessie cortwright was faster than both of them but was years ago ❤
For me, Dennis Lillee is probably the finest bowler I have seen and I have seen dozens of fast bowlers over the years. His action has an almost effortless to the point of graceful. He was menacing and intimidating when he ran down to bowl. He also suffered back problems, but came back to test cricket ! He had to modify his action and cut down about a yard of pace, this helped him to prolong his career and reach a total of 355 test wickets:
Richard Hadlee has said Dennis Lillee is the greatest. Big, strong, mastery of skills, power to intimidate. 355 wkts in just 70 Tests. 79 wkts in 14 Supertests & 1 World XI match (12/92). The best I've seen.
@@graemealexander9347.... doesn't really matter what he says. It's definitely self-effacing modesty by Hadlee! Lillee was probably a bit of a role model for him. But he probably surpassed his role model... from a pure skill point of view that is. Dennis definitely would've been more intimidating & was undoubtedly quicker.
wish they recorded his speeds in 71-73 before back injury i think you'll find he was bowling up with Thomos speed but the bloody back slowed him down still bowling fast
It was around about that only. During bowling for 5 days in the test match, he was measured at bowler's end with max of 160 (not the 170 he makes up). His bowling does look more effortless (just a jog and wham) and so does Holding's (Boycott said it was so smooth and easy, it seemed scary that he is bowling well within himself and generating pace). sohabh , Lee and Tait's bowling shows much more efforts.
@@kundankanan9074 No not for 5 days...For one spell or for a brief hour or so from memories and he was in 150's regularly he actually bowles terribly in that spell getting smashed by Roy Freedricks...Yes he was not 170 or even 165 but between 1974 to 1976 he was consistently quickest of the alot.. Even after that shoulder he was rapid he bowled a spell to Viv which was like greased lightning in Brisbane 1979, smashed Desmond Haynes in box definately as quick Akhtar's spell at Waca 1999...
English as I am, Thommo and Lillee were as good as it gets and the batsmen facing them had little protection. The " whispering death" was fantastic as well.
I think there's low res footage somewhere on youtube of a highlights vid of the 74/75 test at the SCG where Thommo bowls a bouncer which hits the sightscreen after one bounce. Anyways, he did the same at the WACA and Ian Chappel (not one to ham up such a feat) confirms as much. Someone else in a comments section of some vid on Thommo mentions that Wisden's Book of Records states such a ball (given the distanced travelled off the pitch) would be in the vicinity of 170km/h. Akhtars monster bouncer at the Gabba in 2002 and screamer against Ponting at the WACA in 1999 were about 150km/h. The latter would've fell well short of the sightscreen and the bouncer at the Gabba (after it finally came back to earth) still bounced about 4 times before hitting the sightscreen. Whatever maximum speed Thommo ultimately hit (165km/h?) , he was most certainly a 100mph bowler at full pace.
Thommo in full flight was one of the greatest sights in cricket. I loved watching that action. The run up gave no hint of what was to come. Lillian Thompson. The greatest woman cricketer of all time.
@everkenz004 The speeds at the Perth 75 test were measured by 2 cameras. 1 measuring the speed of the ball at release, and the other measuring the speed of the ball as it passed the batsman. His fastest ball of 99.7mph was a bouncer and passed the batsman as around 130kph - the same as a good length ball from Roberts that left the hand at 150kph. Thommo's 2nd fastest delivery had a hand release speed of 99.1mph and passed the batsman at around 138 kph.
What this proves is that there are a number of bowlers who have been in the 140kph + speeds when the ball reached the batsmen. However there is only one who has been proven to be at 160kph on a regular basis, when the ball has reached the batsmen and that is Thommo
I first recall seeing Jeff Thomson on his Test debut.He seemed off balance, and we found out why when he told Chappelli at end of the Test.He had broken right foot.Next time was early 1974 where in last Shield game of the year at SCG v Qld he bowled like the wind. The keeper Brian Taber in his last game before retiring stood around 30 yards back .He took 7/80odd & got Greg Chappell's attention in his first year as Qld captain.He persuaded Thommo to go north & play for Qld the next year. The rest became history.Thommo scared everyone,even after busting shoulder & into the helmet era.Clive Lloyd & his era will vouch for that.
Thommo only had his speed recorded in a couple of matches through his whole career and managed to clock 160. Ahktar, Lee, Tait were only clocked there once or a few times in their whole careers with almost every ball speed recorded. Maybe Thommo just got lucky that he bowled his fastest ever ball on the day they were recording but I think the chances of that are slim. It would make perfect sense that he was up around 160 regularly. I don't believe any of the 180kph or even the 170kph rumours but there is little doubt in my mind he cracked 165 at least.
You have to remember that when Jeff Thompson was recorded with these amazing top speeds, faster than any other fast bowler, it was after his serious shoulder injury where his shoulder literally tore apart because of his unique sling action. He had to have a sizeable metal plate inserted to keep his shoulder from falling apart while bowling and all his speed tests were done while he had this hindrance . All the great batsmen he faced said that he was easily 10mph slower or maybe a yard and a half slower after this operation and yet he was still he fastest around. It just shows you how fast he was before the operation and before he was recorded. There was no doubt in most batsmen’s minds that he easily reached speeds of +110mph when he was at his peak, before serious injury. He was still bowling at 100mph after this serious operation for goodness sake. No doubt the quickest fast bowler who has ever lived. That is why people used to accuse him of bowling 5 or 6 bouncers an over. He didn’t . They were not bouncers. They were just balls that were slightly short of a length and because of his great speed on hard pitches the deliveries would rear up towards the batsman’s head which made him at times totally unplayable. People who didn’t understand thought they were bouncers and accused him of being unsporting but you listen to the batsmen who faced him during that time and they all will tell you that he gained that height off of almost normal deliveries because of his incredible speed. This happened mainly on hard pitches of course. On softer wickets he would dig in bouncers just like most pace bowlers. Maybe not the best fast bowler who ever lived but certainly the quickest.
@@choppy249 jeff Thomson was injured in 1976. He was clocked at his fastest in 1975. He managed to bowl at 148 kmph in 1979 when he was clocked again using the same high speed cameras. Get ur facts checked.
@@choppy249 Rod Marsh who kept wicket to Thommo always swore his faster deliveries,before his accident,must have been touching near 110 mph.Bumble Lloyd said Thommo bowled faster than anyone else he ever faced.Bumble also said the BEST fast bowler he had ever faced was Dennis Lillee.
@@NishitShuklaEven .Mitch Johnson? What does that prove ? Thomson's action was smooth and fluid and was very economical, energy wise... who says so? R.Benaud, Cricket legend and expert on the subject. 190 caps, Captain 28 and commentator for 42 years in Britain alone... good judge? You more of an expert in these things than him? Were you around seeing Thomson regularly? So experts say it would have been a regular occurrence for Thomson to bowl at the speed they measured... their job, scientists and experts in body mechanics, but you say no? As for speeds, well they as you are probably aware, were measured differently at Thomson's peak/era and there would be a difference in Thomson's favour were he to be timed now.
Lillee still hit 155 kph after a back injury that nearly finished his career. Not as quick as Thommo by his own admission, but up there with the fastest of all time.
Thommo the fastest ever by a mile , easy to work out . Broke more stumps , body bones , skulls and broken fingers than anyone else in history . Left a trail of blood over his career .
No he wasn’t. He was easily one of the fastest but there have been plenty of others who were every bit as quick. You couldn’t say he was easily the fastest ever, especially when there is so much evidence. I saw Thompson and I saw Brett Lee and I think Lee was consistently quicker. I couldn’t take a bet on who bowled the quicker fast ball though. The modern measuring equipment is also more reliable. Back in those days they were counting film frames to calculate the speed. And on a question of the better bloke, having dealt with both of them, Brett Lee by some margin.
@@thethirdman225 No. Just no. Brett Lee and everyone else is measured at the bowlers end. Jeff Thomson was measured at the batsmens end due to limitations of the radar tech at the time. You all know the ball loses 10% of its speed in the air between ends. Rod Marsh and Ian Chappell both say had he been measured like modern bowlers, there would be 175-180km/h easily for him. Go look at the film frame footage -- just shows you how much quicker JT was frame by frame. End of story and all discussion.
@@ozmunky End of story and all discussion? Are you serious? That what people say when they’re scared. They’ve all been measured and I don’t believe a word of this ‘batsmen’s end, bowlers end’ stuff. Mostly because I believe what a saw with my own eyes. They were all measured the same way. Mostly by counting frames of high speed film.
@@thethirdman225 I was there in 74-75 and witnessed the measurement tech at the time. Sounds like you were not there. For the tech record, the equipment at the time was only capable of measuring speed at the batsmens end. The tech to measure speed at the bowlers end for Brett Lee simply didnt exist. Prove me wrong .....
Unless your built with a supremely athletic body like Jeff Thomson, then Dennis Lillee’s action is the type that almost every other fast bowler would love to have.
Pitch varied from about 7kmph for Anderson, to 15kmph for Bresnan, who bangs the ball in, resulting in more energy being lost once the ball hits the pitch. So, in conclusion, Thompson was one hell of a fast bowler, and to get the speed he achieved, add 10 when compared to current speed guns. This is by no means an exact science, but we can safely assume Thompson was faster than Tait and Aktar, and in my opinion the only bowlers who could ever have rivalled him are Harold Larrewood, and
remember those days they were timed at the batsmen and not at the point of release as it is for lee n akthar. on an avg the ball loses arnd 15kmph thro drag in the air n wicket. so we know now how quick these blokes really were.... amazing stuff!!!!
i remember the 75/76 series when thommo destroyed a batting line up of greenidge, fredricks, richards, lloyd, rowe, kallicharan etc. WI lost the series 5-1 and clive lloyd still says it's fastest bowling he's ever seen
It’s Thomson’s action that was the key, I remember javelin throwers saying that the only cricket action they rated as effective in delivering pure speed was Thomson’s.
Yes - very sideways on, you can see his long arms. And the bowling arm action starts from behind his back, it's a huge arc of circle before the ball leaves his hand. Quite graceful, really. Does anyone else use this action nowadays - or since?
@@lawrence18uk It's no coincidence that both Tait and Malinga could hit high speeds with their sling actions although neither of them had the same grace as Thommo, using more shoulder than he did. It is actually a surprise that more players haven't come through with sling actions but most junior coaches would be pushing for more orthodox bowling actions. I was about 12 when Thommo burst onto the scene and we all tried to copy him in our backyards and driveways, but we would revert back to our "normal" bowling actions when we were playing organised matches. I imagine kids all over the country were doing the same thing at that time and I occasionally wonder if (unlike my mates and I) any continued to copy his action as they progressed through their cricket years. The slingshot rotation and incredible balance he had in his delivery stride really was the key to making his action so successful and fast and I doubt too many people would have the athleticism to match him. It's a real shame there isn't more footage of him at his peak.
@@lawrence18uk Shoaib Akhtar and Shaub Tait had similar actions to Thomson and they both cracked 100 MPH. Mitchell Starc and Brett Lee both cracked a 100 in a test match as well. But the other two were much more consistent with their speeds. Shoaib Akhtar and Shaub Tait operated around the 145 to 150 mark, whilst Mitchell Starc and Brett Lee operated around the 140 to 145 mark.
@mrinstability i heard an interview where thommo reckoned he bowled much faster during an ashes series in england. i think the best judge of thommo were grenadge and haynes who both feared him more than any other bowler. for them, it was his speed but more importantly his hand disappears behind his back during delivery and that made it harder for them to read the ball out of his hand.
@Lats Niebling He was clocked at the University in 1976 way after his back stress fractures...he hit most batsman in the era after Andy Roberts, Sylvester Clarke and Macolm Marshall...
It has been shown that a ball delivered from a fast Bowler slows by more than 20 plus kilometres per hour before reaching the end of the pitch. The figures mentioned here were measured as an average speed over the length of the pitch. By today's measurements these guys were blowing very quickly.
Thomson is regarded by most who count to be as quick as anyone has ever been. The difference in measuring speed is the main issue. In these tests, the speed was calculated at the batsmans crease. Today, with the speed gun, the speed is taken from release by the bowler. A huge diference when taken over 22 yds and a balls rate retarding after bouncing.
Thommo bowled at half pace in this yet still clocked a pretty quick 143 ks an hour. Easily the fastest bowler ever he was just frightening to watch and would have been terrifying to face against.
@hawty0boy Oh yeah, Thommo was the fastest I've ever seen. Probably hit 165kph or maybe 170kph because of that big arc he had in preparation and release. Express pace gave the bowlers better results than it would today, as batsmen were so poorly protected, they often play rash shots in absolute fear.
Don't forget the training regimes and lifestyles of these cricketers in 1979 were way less stringent and infinately less regimental and the usual team bonding session was a BBQ and esky full of grog, no doubt in my mind these blokes were way tougher and way more tenacious than the current crowd and sadly we will never see players with these attributes ever again, long live Thommo and the rest of the players from this unique period in cricket history.
Nothing makes a bowler bowl fastest than having a batsman at the other end, adrenalin flowing, emotions high. This sort of testing might show relative speed amongst bowlers, but unless you get these guys in a serious game situation, the actual speeds will always be lower than what they are capable of. I'm sure Lillee would have bowled a hell of a lot faster than 139kmh had Geoff Boycott been at the other end having just smashed him through the covers for four the previous ball.
speed was measured at the batsman end not like today where speed is measured out of the hand, thomo would have been 170-180+ if measured out of the hand
You really think an athlete in the 70s was almost 10% “better” than ones through the 2000s? I dare you to find a single other example of this in any professional sport (that isn’t horribly PED tainted).
GRAHAM ELY tell me another bowler that had the speed to bounce once on the pitch, go over the keepers head and clear the boundary without a second bounce. Thomson did that at both the SCG and the WACA.
@@Dr_Footbrake Thomson was clocked at 160.45 kph in match conditions during one day's play. As far as I know, this was the only occasion he was timed in match conditions. If - as now happens - every ball he ever bowled was timed, it's reasonable to assume that he would have eclipsed that figure - perhaps quite often. I agree that 170-180 kph is highly implausible, but 165+ is likely.
Gray Shus it’s also reasonable to assume that radar guns in the 70s weren’t terribly accurate, and that it would be going against the trend of every other sport in existence for an athlete in previous generations to be better (in an objective sense) than their modern counterparts. If you can provide examples of other sports (like track and field, swimming etc) where there’s still records from the 70s I’d be more inclined to believe Thomson actually ever bowled a 160kph delivery
@mmotorway I was at the gabba for the first 3 days of the first test of that series. Was only a kid but I'll never forget the first morning when Lillee, Thomson, Gilmore were throwing everything they had at the Windies, and WI batsmen were trying to hit them out of the park. WI were 6-125 at lunch
Anyone who thinks Thommo (and the others) were barely matching lee, akhter, tait, etc, do your research. Thommo's 160kph was the speed of the ball when it reached the stumps having already slowed by about 10%. Lee, etc were 160kph immediately after releasing the ball. That equates to Tommo doing about175kph from the hand or Akhter being down at about 145kph when the ball reaches the batsmen. Also remeber that Thommo, Lillee et al were being measured in a scientifically proven manner.
We shall never know, and what we have in this thread is a lot of patriotic assertions. The current record is Shoaib’s, with Tait and Lee so close behind as to make no difference. These three are the confirmed hundred milers, give or take a millisecond or two. The rest is all loyalistic speculation. Holding was blisteringly fast in his time. So was Thomson. So was Waqar. So was, so was
Later admitted that doing it with high speed film was inaccurate by + - up to 12% because of film speed fluctuations and different bowler release points and heights, even atmospheric ground effect came into it!..Truth is, during that great era of fast bowlers in the 70's up to the 80's..The technology just wasn't up to it..Only the batsmen with trembling knee's knew..And Thommo won by a street as the fastest, and most dangerous of all of them! And when you consider who the others were..Thompson must have been terrifying!
Spot on. Batsmen of the day feared many fast bowlers but, Thommo scared them the most. I take my hat off to the batters, not much protection on. If I were to face Thommo back in his day, I'd want to be wearing an armoured tank.
absolute rubbish,the photosonic high speed cameras are used by the military and NASA for analysing the speed of projectiles and it needs to be accurate,the servo driven motor has an error of only -+ .005%
thommo and lille were close to retirement at that stage. So they would have been a great deal faster in their prime. Shame this wasn't done earlier but at least they'res great footage of their actions. Thanks heaps
@mrinstability i reckon when jeff was fit he bowled like 170 because i tell ya watching his videos of him bowl when he was fit it looked a fuck load faster then 160
@@brucelamberton8819 There's an interesting clip here on YT "Jeff Thomson and Imran Khan on recording bowlers' speed" where those 2 guys and Mark Nicholas talk about (as the title suggests) recording bowling speeds. They make the point that modern recording is taken as the ball leaves the bowlers hand but Nicholas points out that when Thommo was recorded at 160mph, that measurement was taken at the batsmen's end after the ball had hit the pitch (which takes 10-15 mph from the speed according to one of the technicians). It's well worth a look and if they are correct, then Thommo would have been significantly faster than any bowler that has been measured in the modern TV era.
@@Vpmatt Did he face Akhtar or Lee ? Or even Waqar and Bishop ? No right ? When he says 'saw', he really does mean facing or seeing up close. The same way Ricky Ponting said Akhtars spell was the fastest he ever faced...but Ricky never faced Thompson or Bishop or Holding. So in truth there is no person in the history of cricket you has an all round perspective. I find it unlikely an Athelete from the 70's would be able to excel against atheletes from the 2000's when it comes to physical prowess (not skill, as we a) know the batsman of the earlier decades had to be far more skillful)
actually Akhtar bowled the ball in the world cup in South Africa it was shown on TV with the speed camera or what ever they used by it was clocked at 161.4 km/h
Good video👍👍thanks for uploading. Thommo must be really fast going by the batsmen's reactions, height of the balls reached the keeper's gloves and the margin of difference in speeds in comparision to the other elite fast bowlers of his time.
There are several bowlers who did not make test cricket that were very quick as well. I remember a Phil DeFreitas(?) playing club cricket in South Australia in the mid to late 1980's, and while he was there, he also played some indoor cricket. Now, Phil was a fairly quick bowler, and played test cricket for England in the late 80's, early 90's from memory. However, there was also another cricketer, who did play for South Australia, never played test cricket, but, was regarded as the quickest indoor bowler in Australia for about 5 years. Peter Gladigau. He played in a Sheffield Shield game at Adelaide oval, bowled Allan Border, then fronted for an indoor cricket Grand Final at Stepney on the Saturday night, while the Shield game was in progress! There was him, and there was a second indoor cricketer that was in the same ball park as Peter Gladigau. Mr. Gladigau was slightly faster, but, it would be interesting to see if someone can find some footage and see if we can work out some way of doing a comparison.
@@mombaassa So what ??? Viv was in his 40's when he faced Duncan whereas he faced Thomson largely between 1976 to 1983 in span where he avg 66 with the bat probably his best and prime years...Read about Thommo spell to Viv at MCG where he nearly killed Viv in 1976 but he scored a run a ball 100 while opening the innings too... Duncan was fast but over Thommo never !!
@@kunalsingh3121 I never said who was faster. I simply pointed out, that Viv Richards once said, that it (that afternoon against Spencer) was the fastest bowling he had faced. I never said that Richards was right or wrong.
@ihamoitc2005 i disagree with your comment about thommo. it appears to me that his arm bends after he releases the ball....in fact i am certain now that is the case. with his bowling action i can't see how it would be possible to get a 25 degree angle. holding was very very fast....he didn't 'whispering death' as a nickname for nothing lol andy roberts was scarey....just got to look at the replay when he clocked david hookes. they were all great fast bowlers.
Thompson was by far the quickest, he was a speed demon and he never sprinted in at full pelt either, he had this fast jog and wound up his arms and it was like an elastic rubber band being pulled and stretched and then the cannon would be released with extreme pace
@junoon1856 I am not sure that Imran would ever say that Thommo was ever quicker than Holding. Imran has always said that the fastest spell (&bowler) he ever faced was from Holding. His description of the spell was exciting to read. Also that he found it hard to believe that ANYONE has ever been quicker than Holding at his quickest. Do you have that interview when Imran spoke of his speed with the new action etc
I agree. In fact I would not be surprised that they were actually a shade slower. Slower or just as fast - NOT faster. It might be tempting to say thommo & Holding were slight exceptions (freaks so to speak) but than Lille, Imran & Roberts were just a shade slower & THAT adds to confusion..I would say they were just as quick and that is all.Lastly bowling is unique in the sense that your action is something that you develop as you TRY to bowl fast, cant really be coached as much as people think
it was recorded but never put into official records the Q.C.A has it in their records somewhere but C.A doesnt but apparently he did it in perthin the early 80's the ball he apparently bowled was that fast it bounced over Rod Marth's head and hit the sight board at the other end on the full half way up i dont believe it but alot of commentators have said it i dont know its not on TH-cam
@TheFreeForever that is not fair. Lille is regarded as the best even by other bowlers of his time. As far as the Pakistan incident - there is a huge story behind that. He did bowl well on all conditions - West Indies had slow wickets for example...and he bowled just as well in the 2nd season of the Kerry packer which was in the Windies he really was great.
the measurements from the '79 competition have always looks dubious. it is possible they were measuring average speed over the length of the pitch, rather than at release? the ball slows 13-14% between release and the batsman, so average speed would be about 7% less than speed at release
Michael Holding openly says he was the quickest of the West Indies fast bowlers. However, he also says that Thommo was by far the quickest. By a stretch
@@frankcoletta Yes, Richards did say that Thommo was faster than any of the West Indian bowlers. Interestingly however, he did not say that Thompson was the fastest bowler he ever faced. Richards gave that honour to Duncan Spencer.
@@mombaassa Spencer was quick, but Viv was in his 40's and close to retirement when he faced him. Speaking from experience, there's a big difference between what the eyes see at 25 and what they see at 40. 😊
Even though im a kiwi, i grew up in the 80's in Brisbane. I remember seeing Thommo play (and many others) at the Gabba. My overall memory is not just of how fast he was but how aggressive he was. Some will say (and i agree) thats its an essential trate for a good fast bowler. Lillee on the other hand i believe was in a different league. He was a class act through and through. Being a kiwi, of course i rate Hadlee at his peak, but even he said that Lillee was the best in the business.
@vijayp63 You should read about Javagal Srinath. One ball that he bowled during the 1996 tour of South Africa measured 156 km/h (97 mph). He also clocked 154.5 km/h (96.0 mph) at the 1999 World Cup.
@AIMANALI Australians idolised the West Indies in the 70s. Especially us kids. The kids I played with actually had West Indies cricketers as bigger heroes than the Australian ones. Viv Richards and Michael Holding were gods.
Mike Procter, who was once timed in similar fashion and showed speeds of 145+ kmph long after his prime. I must apologise for posting in several sections, as I have reached the limit on my tablet several times over. I do however, leave you with one final piece of information. The thing about fast bowling, sometimes the quickest seeming balls are shown as the slowest, and the slowest seeming balls are shown as fastest. What do you believe in? The human experience , or a measuring machine?
Yes, that is correct. Not out of the hand. Thommo obviously regularly exceeded 100mph undoubtedly. Dennis Lillee was timed after his back injury when he slowed down for more control & the hope of career longevity. In 1972 in England, DK was lightning, according to an email response I received from the photographer Patrick Eager who saw him bowl. DK would've been pressing as well. But DK hand magnificent control & able to put the balls in the right area. 5wkts per Test.
@Abingtoncricket I'm jealous of your experience but, yes, I can believe that about Thommo, he always comes across as a modest, likeable chap. Three Aussies I'd love to meet & shake hands with: Thommo, Shane Warne & Rolf Harris.
I think that was when he had signed a big deal to stay with Queensland, and so he played for Austalia when all the others went to WSC. He then wanted to join Lillee and the others, and was then banned for trying to get out of his Queensland/Australia contract. This may be wrong, i am going to hit the Wikpedia to find out, Thommo rules...
I think they recorded the speed using the high speed camera and the wall they bowl alongside as a guide. Therefore it wouldn't matter if it was a no-ball
Be. This measurement takes into account the ball slowing down in the air. The difference with today's speed guns is that it measures the speed from the hand. The result is that today's speeds are far quicker than what they should be, had the old method been used. I remember watching the SA vs England test series earlier this year, and the commentators were comparing the speeds of the English bowlers from the hand and along the pitch. The difference between the speed from the hand and that of the
Wrong. You're getting confused with 1979 when they used the same high speed cameras to measure delivery speeds of a number of bowlers in a competition. He won it, at 147.9 kph. The 160.45kph speed was measured in a live test match at Perth against the West Indies. I saw him bowl at Lords in 75 and he was certainly fast enough.
I can't vouch for the accuracy of these studies but all the great batsmen always said Thomson, Holding, Roberts were terrifyingly fast. Thommo being the fastest of the lot.
Thompson was easily the quickest bowler who's ever lived- if every single ball of Thompson's career was measured, I wager, without hesitation, that there would have been a couple that hit the 163-164 mark.
Mining Forge Yes, I am old enough to remember Thommo and he was super quick - certainly quicker than Brett Lee. Clive Lloyd and Michael Holding both say he was well over 160kph at his fastest. He wasn't the best bowler by any stretch but prior to his shoulder injury he was still damn good.
There's an interesting article on Espn cricinfo by Christian Ryan about fast bowlers speeds titled the thing about speed guns. It was published 2 days ago. I suggest you take a look. Another very interesting one titled pace race was shown on the site a couple of years back. The art of pace bowling is extremely interesting. The speed of the delivery back then was measured by how quickly the ball travelled down the pitch, ie if the ball took an hour to travel the pitch, how long would the pitch
What makes you think they timed the speed at the batsman's end? They used high speed cameras and all you have to do is watch this video to see that it's the speed out of the bowler's hand they are measuring.
@MrAIMANZUL have not been to find any of that match (I'd love to see it too) but there are some other clips of that series in "West Indies vs Australia 1975-76"
@69Ocker in addition this doesnt make engineering sense as the speed "5 feet" from release would be approx the same as the speed of the hand at release..meaning its easier to measure the hand itself. to be able to measure 5 feet- when the ball can be travelling along different paths relative to horizontal will yield large errors. id be very keen to see the details of these tests you are citing..it just doesnt add up.
@ihamoitc2005 I am not saying that Thomson was chucking intentionally. In fact, it looks very much like the hyper-extension that also afflicts Akhtar. Due to extremely flexible joints, the force of arm movement causes the elbow to stretch backwards unnaturally. Lillee, on the other hand, definitely has a kink starting from when his arm is at the horizontal and all the way through the arc until it reaches it's peak and then straightens through delivery. Intentional? No. But it's there.
@AIMANALI Cool. The fact that the Windies could churn out speedsters almost at will just defies belief. I wish I could see some more like them nowadays :(
I'm sure the batsman facing him noticed. But think how fast he'd have been if he'd used a blue one. On the other hand maybe he caused enough pain with the red one, and blue balls would have just added insult to injury.
@vincerjn And I have a quote from Lillee in one of my books that Thommo was the only bowler he would happily play second fiddle to in his peak. Lillee rated him as the most lethal and unplayable bowler ever. Its a shame there aren't more vids of him tearing into batsmen. Clive Loyd rates him as the fastest ever, I think. I remember so clearly how much damage he did in the 70s, like it was yesterday.
@69Ocker where do you get this stuff from?..im an engineer and work with this sort of thing regularly and am also a cricket fan and i would suggest that you dont have this correct as there are nocitable differences in bowling speeds published these days when comparing a ball that is a yorker or full toss to those of a ball that pitches- suggesting that the measured speed does in fact include the entire length of the pitch..not the first "5 feet"- no one works over "feet" these days..
I tend to trust a wicketkeepers point of view when it comes to speeds of fast bowlers ( and Marsh was adamant Thommo was scary) so for out and out quickest my vote would go to Thommo, though based on the parametres that you put down in your list for quickest in career, then Shoab Aktar would win based on Thommo losing speed after the shoulder injury.
true but u cant compare them as lillee and thompson played in a semi-professional period where tait akhtar and Zahid play in the professional period with complete diffrent trainning regimines diets and fitness testing. Thomo was the first man 2 clock a ball faster than 160km
@aks73 Holding said that Thommo was the quickest he ever saw he never said that Thommo was quicker than him. Infact I had an interview of Holding from 1980 and he said that he himself might be the quickest but he does not consider himself the best bowler
I played a charity match against Thommo in England last year. He was still bloody quick and bowling away swingers. After the game he invited me to his table in the drinks tent and allowed me to interview him for my local cricket club video. Never have I met a man who was so charming and kind. He was quite happy to chat for an hour or two whilst we slowly got sozzled under the white of the tent canopy. Lovely memories of a lovely man. Cheers Thommo.
Can you imagine thomson comming in bowling a bouncer, goes over the the top of the batsman keeps climbing over the wicket keepers head and crashing onto the sightboard on the full, thats breathtaking and some heat on that ball, has to be over 165 km
Thats what he did on some first class venues
Thomo was my favourite bowler. They never had the characters of Australia cricket like they did from the mid 70s to the early 80s.
Forget shoab( no disrespect at all) Jeff Thompson was the fastest ive seen. Richie said the only person that was close to him was frank tyson!he saw the west indians in there prime so thats saying something. Jessie cortwright was faster than both of them but was years ago ❤
For me, Dennis Lillee is probably the finest bowler I have seen and I have seen dozens of fast bowlers over the years. His action has an almost effortless to the point of graceful. He was menacing and intimidating when he ran down to bowl. He also suffered back problems, but came back to test cricket ! He had to modify his action and cut down about a yard of pace, this helped him to prolong his career and reach a total of 355 test wickets:
I always thought Hadlee was a slightly better bowler than Lillee... though not quite as quick.
Richard Hadlee has said Dennis Lillee is the greatest. Big, strong, mastery of skills, power to intimidate. 355 wkts in just 70 Tests. 79 wkts in 14 Supertests & 1 World XI match (12/92). The best I've seen.
@@graemealexander9347.... doesn't really matter what he says.
It's definitely self-effacing modesty by Hadlee!
Lillee was probably a bit of a role model for him.
But he probably surpassed his role model... from a pure skill point of view that is.
Dennis definitely would've been more intimidating & was undoubtedly quicker.
@@shanelawson5072 right.
wish they recorded his speeds in 71-73 before back injury i think you'll find he was bowling up with Thomos speed but the bloody back slowed him down still bowling fast
Jeff Thompson was measured in one test match In his career for a best of 161.
We can only speculate what his fastest ever was!
Well it wouldn’t be anymore than that as it just doesn’t go any faster.
It is probably around that mark
It was around about that only. During bowling for 5 days in the test match, he was measured at bowler's end with max of 160 (not the 170 he makes up). His bowling does look more effortless (just a jog and wham) and so does Holding's (Boycott said it was so smooth and easy, it seemed scary that he is bowling well within himself and generating pace). sohabh , Lee and Tait's bowling shows much more efforts.
@@kundankanan9074 No not for 5 days...For one spell or for a brief hour or so from memories and he was in 150's regularly he actually bowles terribly in that spell getting smashed by Roy Freedricks...Yes he was not 170 or even 165 but between 1974 to 1976 he was consistently quickest of the alot..
Even after that shoulder he was rapid he bowled a spell to Viv which was like greased lightning in Brisbane 1979, smashed Desmond Haynes in box definately as quick Akhtar's spell at Waca 1999...
Thomson
lillee's action... genuine! great to watch
English as I am, Thommo and Lillee were as good as it gets and the batsmen facing them had little protection. The " whispering death" was fantastic as well.
I think there's low res footage somewhere on youtube of a highlights vid of the 74/75 test at the SCG where Thommo bowls a bouncer which hits the sightscreen after one bounce. Anyways, he did the same at the WACA and Ian Chappel (not one to ham up such a feat) confirms as much. Someone else in a comments section of some vid on Thommo mentions that Wisden's Book of Records states such a ball (given the distanced travelled off the pitch) would be in the vicinity of 170km/h. Akhtars monster bouncer at the Gabba in 2002 and screamer against Ponting at the WACA in 1999 were about 150km/h. The latter would've fell well short of the sightscreen and the bouncer at the Gabba (after it finally came back to earth) still bounced about 4 times before hitting the sightscreen. Whatever maximum speed Thommo ultimately hit (165km/h?) , he was most certainly a 100mph bowler at full pace.
LordMaisky the bounce was from the uneven pitch pal..
At 89mph, Jofra Archer manage to hit the top of off stump and still clear the boundary. So doesn't mean a thing.
@@gamekid4285 What uneven pitch pal?
@@jugheadsrule This is endless debate about who was fastest ever...But Thomson win it for me..
@@kunalsingh3121 I think you are correct
Thommo in full flight was one of the greatest sights in cricket. I loved watching that action. The run up gave no hint of what was to come.
Lillian Thompson. The greatest woman cricketer of all time.
@everkenz004 The speeds at the Perth 75 test were measured by 2 cameras. 1 measuring the speed of the ball at release, and the other measuring the speed of the ball as it passed the batsman. His fastest ball of 99.7mph was a bouncer and passed the batsman as around 130kph - the same as a good length ball from Roberts that left the hand at 150kph. Thommo's 2nd fastest delivery had a hand release speed of 99.1mph and passed the batsman at around 138 kph.
This was not a very reliable method of measuring. They were counting film frames to do it. Todays measuring equipment is so much more reliable.
"Ashes to Ashes, dust to dust, if Thomson don't get ya, Lillee must..."
Other way around with the names.
Yes and both of them got smashed to nothingness in the subcontinent.
@@Warlock786 Dead Featherbed Wickets!🏏⚰️🕊️
@@jessesands4099 ...but wickets nonetheless
What this proves is that there are a number of bowlers who have been in the 140kph + speeds when the ball reached the batsmen. However there is only one who has been proven to be at 160kph on a regular basis, when the ball has reached the batsmen and that is Thommo
Only when it didn't bounce....
I first recall seeing Jeff Thomson on his Test debut.He seemed off balance, and we found out why when he told Chappelli at end of the Test.He had broken right foot.Next time was early 1974 where in last Shield game of the year at SCG v Qld he bowled like the wind. The keeper Brian Taber in his last game before retiring stood around 30 yards back .He took 7/80odd & got Greg Chappell's attention in his first year as Qld captain.He persuaded Thommo to go north & play for Qld the next year. The rest became history.Thommo scared everyone,even after busting shoulder & into the helmet era.Clive Lloyd & his era will vouch for that.
Thommo only had his speed recorded in a couple of matches through his whole career and managed to clock 160. Ahktar, Lee, Tait were only clocked there once or a few times in their whole careers with almost every ball speed recorded. Maybe Thommo just got lucky that he bowled his fastest ever ball on the day they were recording but I think the chances of that are slim. It would make perfect sense that he was up around 160 regularly. I don't believe any of the 180kph or even the 170kph rumours but there is little doubt in my mind he cracked 165 at least.
certainly faster than 161.3.
You have to remember that when Jeff Thompson was recorded with these amazing top speeds, faster than any other fast bowler, it was after his serious shoulder injury where his shoulder literally tore apart because of his unique sling action. He had to have a sizeable metal plate inserted to keep his shoulder from falling apart while bowling and all his speed tests were done while he had this hindrance . All the great batsmen he faced said that he was easily 10mph slower or maybe a yard and a half slower after this operation and yet he was still he fastest around. It just shows you how fast he was before the operation and before he was recorded. There was no doubt in most batsmen’s minds that he easily reached speeds of +110mph when he was at his peak, before serious injury. He was still bowling at 100mph after this serious operation for goodness sake. No doubt the quickest fast bowler who has ever lived. That is why people used to accuse him of bowling 5 or 6 bouncers an over. He didn’t . They were not bouncers. They were just balls that were slightly short of a length and because of his great speed on hard pitches the deliveries would rear up towards the batsman’s head which made him at times totally unplayable. People who didn’t understand thought they were bouncers and accused him of being unsporting but you listen to the batsmen who faced him during that time and they all will tell you that he gained that height off of almost normal deliveries because of his incredible speed. This happened mainly on hard pitches of course. On softer wickets he would dig in bouncers just like most pace bowlers.
Maybe not the best fast bowler who ever lived but certainly the quickest.
@@choppy249 jeff Thomson was injured in 1976. He was clocked at his fastest in 1975. He managed to bowl at 148 kmph in 1979 when he was clocked again using the same high speed cameras. Get ur facts checked.
@@choppy249 Rod Marsh who kept wicket to Thommo always swore his faster deliveries,before his accident,must have been touching near 110 mph.Bumble Lloyd said Thommo bowled faster than anyone else he ever faced.Bumble also said the BEST fast bowler he had ever faced was Dennis Lillee.
@@NishitShuklaEven .Mitch Johnson? What does that prove ? Thomson's action was smooth and fluid and was very economical, energy wise... who says so? R.Benaud, Cricket legend and expert on the subject. 190 caps, Captain 28 and commentator for 42 years in Britain alone... good judge? You more of an expert in these things than him? Were you around seeing Thomson regularly? So experts say it would have been a regular occurrence for Thomson to bowl at the speed they measured... their job, scientists and experts in body mechanics, but you say no? As for speeds, well they as you are probably aware, were measured differently at Thomson's peak/era and there would be a difference in Thomson's favour were he to be timed now.
Lillee still hit 155 kph after a back injury that nearly finished his career. Not as quick as Thommo by his own admission, but up there with the fastest of all time.
this makes me believe that they were measured at bowler's end, else Denis would have bowled better than 100 miles at bowler's end, which s bullshit.
how good was cricket back in those days? bloody brilliant!
Thommo the fastest ever by a mile , easy to work out . Broke more stumps , body bones , skulls and broken fingers than anyone else in history . Left a trail of blood over his career .
No he wasn’t. He was easily one of the fastest but there have been plenty of others who were every bit as quick. You couldn’t say he was easily the fastest ever, especially when there is so much evidence. I saw Thompson and I saw Brett Lee and I think Lee was consistently quicker. I couldn’t take a bet on who bowled the quicker fast ball though. The modern measuring equipment is also more reliable. Back in those days they were counting film frames to calculate the speed.
And on a question of the better bloke, having dealt with both of them, Brett Lee by some margin.
@@thethirdman225 No. Just no.
Brett Lee and everyone else is measured at the bowlers end.
Jeff Thomson was measured at the batsmens end due to limitations of the radar tech at the time.
You all know the ball loses 10% of its speed in the air between ends.
Rod Marsh and Ian Chappell both say had he been measured like modern bowlers, there would be 175-180km/h easily for him.
Go look at the film frame footage -- just shows you how much quicker JT was frame by frame.
End of story and all discussion.
@@ozmunky End of story and all discussion? Are you serious? That what people say when they’re scared.
They’ve all been measured and I don’t believe a word of this ‘batsmen’s end, bowlers end’ stuff. Mostly because I believe what a saw with my own eyes. They were all measured the same way. Mostly by counting frames of high speed film.
@@thethirdman225 I was there in 74-75 and witnessed the measurement tech at the time. Sounds like you were not there.
For the tech record, the equipment at the time was only capable of measuring speed at the batsmens end.
The tech to measure speed at the bowlers end for Brett Lee simply didnt exist.
Prove me wrong .....
@ You’re the one making the claim so ‘prove me wrong’ doesn’t apply. The onus of proof lies with you.
And I don’t believe you for a minute.
wow what a nice action that Lillee has, almost as if he was floating along the pitch.
I agree. For me only bowler with a better action was West Indies' Michael Holding.
Textbook action was DKLillie
Unless your built with a supremely athletic body like Jeff Thomson, then Dennis Lillee’s action is the type that almost every other fast bowler would love to have.
Pitch varied from about 7kmph for Anderson, to 15kmph for Bresnan, who bangs the ball in, resulting in more energy being lost once the ball hits the pitch. So, in conclusion, Thompson was one hell of a fast bowler, and to get the speed he achieved, add 10 when compared to current speed guns. This is by no means an exact science, but we can safely assume Thompson was faster than Tait and Aktar, and in my opinion the only bowlers who could ever have rivalled him are Harold Larrewood, and
No even harold larwood fir how many times he hit side screen
3:25 ....i watched that competition on telly back in the day.
As an Englishman I absolutely agree with you. It's a terrible, terrible shame. So sad to watch them get beaten. It just makes me cry.
remember those days they were timed at the batsmen and not at the point of release as it is for lee n akthar. on an avg the ball loses arnd 15kmph thro drag in the air n wicket. so we know now how quick these blokes really were.... amazing stuff!!!!
i remember the 75/76 series when thommo destroyed a batting line up of greenidge, fredricks, richards, lloyd, rowe, kallicharan etc. WI lost the series 5-1 and clive lloyd still says it's fastest bowling he's ever seen
I'd take Clive Lloyd's word for it, over send rate technology back in the day.
It’s Thomson’s action that was the key, I remember javelin throwers saying that the only cricket action they rated as effective in delivering pure speed was Thomson’s.
Yes - very sideways on, you can see his long arms. And the bowling arm action starts from behind his back, it's a huge arc of circle before the ball leaves his hand. Quite graceful, really. Does anyone else use this action nowadays - or since?
@@lawrence18uk It's no coincidence that both Tait and Malinga could hit high speeds with their sling actions although neither of them had the same grace as Thommo, using more shoulder than he did. It is actually a surprise that more players haven't come through with sling actions but most junior coaches would be pushing for more orthodox bowling actions. I was about 12 when Thommo burst onto the scene and we all tried to copy him in our backyards and driveways, but we would revert back to our "normal" bowling actions when we were playing organised matches. I imagine kids all over the country were doing the same thing at that time and I occasionally wonder if (unlike my mates and I) any continued to copy his action as they progressed through their cricket years. The slingshot rotation and incredible balance he had in his delivery stride really was the key to making his action so successful and fast and I doubt too many people would have the athleticism to match him. It's a real shame there isn't more footage of him at his peak.
@@lawrence18uk Shoaib Akhtar and Shaub Tait had similar actions to Thomson and they both cracked 100 MPH. Mitchell Starc and Brett Lee both cracked a 100 in a test match as well. But the other two were much more consistent with their speeds. Shoaib Akhtar and Shaub Tait operated around the 145 to 150 mark, whilst Mitchell Starc and Brett Lee operated around the 140 to 145 mark.
Thommo used to throw the javelin!
@@lawrence18uk Ian Botham used it occasionally when he wanted to bowl a quicker ball.
@mrinstability i heard an interview where thommo reckoned he bowled much faster during an ashes series in england. i think the best judge of thommo were grenadge and haynes who both feared him more than any other bowler. for them, it was his speed but more importantly his hand disappears behind his back during delivery and that made it harder for them to read the ball out of his hand.
Scary to imagine what Lillie’s pace was before his back surgery
Lillee was quick, but not Thommo quick.
@Lats Niebling He was clocked at the University in 1976 way after his back stress fractures...he hit most batsman in the era after Andy Roberts, Sylvester Clarke and Macolm Marshall...
It has been shown that a ball delivered from a fast Bowler slows by more than 20 plus kilometres per hour before reaching the end of the pitch. The figures mentioned here were measured as an average speed over the length of the pitch. By today's measurements these guys were blowing very quickly.
Thomson is regarded by most who count to be as quick as anyone has ever been.
The difference in measuring speed is the main issue. In these tests, the speed was calculated at the batsmans crease. Today, with the speed gun, the speed is taken from release by the bowler. A huge diference when taken over 22 yds and a balls rate retarding after bouncing.
I remember watching these guys in the mid 70's at the WACA and MCG. Lillee wasn't just fast but accurate and able to move the ball in all directions.
Thommo bowled at half pace in this yet still clocked a pretty quick 143 ks an hour. Easily the fastest bowler ever he was just frightening to watch and would have been terrifying to face against.
@hawty0boy Oh yeah, Thommo was the fastest I've ever seen. Probably hit 165kph or maybe 170kph because of that big arc he had in preparation and release. Express pace gave the bowlers better results than it would today, as batsmen were so poorly protected, they often play rash shots in absolute fear.
Don't forget the training regimes and lifestyles of these cricketers in 1979 were way less stringent and infinately less regimental and the usual team bonding session was a BBQ and esky full of grog, no doubt in my mind these blokes were way tougher and way more tenacious than the current crowd and sadly we will never see players with these attributes ever again, long live Thommo and the rest of the players from this unique period in cricket history.
thanks for this superb video. i think WI, Aus, and Pakistan are never short of fast bowlers.
Nothing makes a bowler bowl fastest than having a batsman at the other end, adrenalin flowing, emotions high. This sort of testing might show relative speed amongst bowlers, but unless you get these guys in a serious game situation, the actual speeds will always be lower than what they are capable of. I'm sure Lillee would have bowled a hell of a lot faster than 139kmh had Geoff Boycott been at the other end having just smashed him through the covers for four the previous ball.
speed was measured at the batsman end not like today where speed is measured out of the hand, thomo would have been 170-180+ if measured out of the hand
You really think an athlete in the 70s was almost 10% “better” than ones through the 2000s? I dare you to find a single other example of this in any professional sport (that isn’t horribly PED tainted).
GRAHAM ELY tell me another bowler that had the speed to bounce once on the pitch, go over the keepers head and clear the boundary without a second bounce. Thomson did that at both the SCG and the WACA.
@@Dr_Footbrake Thomson was clocked at 160.45 kph in match conditions during one day's play. As far as I know, this was the only occasion he was timed in match conditions. If - as now happens - every ball he ever bowled was timed, it's reasonable to assume that he would have eclipsed that figure - perhaps quite often. I agree that 170-180 kph is highly implausible, but 165+ is likely.
Gray Shus it’s also reasonable to assume that radar guns in the 70s weren’t terribly accurate, and that it would be going against the trend of every other sport in existence for an athlete in previous generations to be better (in an objective sense) than their modern counterparts. If you can provide examples of other sports (like track and field, swimming etc) where there’s still records from the 70s I’d be more inclined to believe Thomson actually ever bowled a 160kph delivery
Speed was actually measured from the hand, hence the use of the grid behind the bowler
Both are incredible
@mmotorway I was at the gabba for the first 3 days of the first test of that series. Was only a kid but I'll never forget the first morning when Lillee, Thomson, Gilmore were throwing everything they had at the Windies, and WI batsmen were trying to hit them out of the park. WI were 6-125 at lunch
Wow really
This is just amazing, Bloody brilliant bowling!
The 139kph speed this clip refers to was measured in a test match against the West Indies at Perth in December 1975.
Anyone who thinks Thommo (and the others) were barely matching lee, akhter, tait, etc, do your research. Thommo's 160kph was the speed of the ball when it reached the stumps having already slowed by about 10%. Lee, etc were 160kph immediately after releasing the ball. That equates to Tommo doing about175kph from the hand or Akhter being down at about 145kph when the ball reaches the batsmen. Also remeber that Thommo, Lillee et al were being measured in a scientifically proven manner.
Thommo was 160kmph out of hand and high 130s at the batsman.
We shall never know, and what we have in this thread is a lot of patriotic assertions. The current record is Shoaib’s, with Tait and Lee so close behind as to make no difference. These three are the confirmed hundred milers, give or take a millisecond or two. The rest is all loyalistic speculation. Holding was blisteringly fast in his time.
So was Thomson. So was Waqar. So was, so was
Later admitted that doing it with high speed film was inaccurate by + - up to 12% because of film speed fluctuations and different bowler release points and heights, even atmospheric ground effect came into it!..Truth is, during that great era of fast bowlers in the 70's up to the 80's..The technology just wasn't up to it..Only the batsmen with trembling knee's knew..And Thommo won by a street as the fastest, and most dangerous of all of them! And when you consider who the others were..Thompson must have been terrifying!
Spot on. Batsmen of the day feared many fast bowlers but, Thommo scared them the most. I take my hat off to the batters, not much protection on. If I were to face Thommo back in his day, I'd want to be wearing an armoured tank.
absolute rubbish,the photosonic high speed cameras are used by the military and NASA for analysing the speed of projectiles and it needs to be accurate,the servo driven motor has an error of only -+ .005%
Be interesting to find what harold Larwoods speed would be ,despite working full time down a coal mine and playing in the 1930s
Would’ve only have needed to be 130kph or so to be pretty terrifying for back in those times.
@@maxxamillion792 especially if he's aiming at you!
thommo and lille were close to retirement at that stage. So they would have been a great deal faster in their prime. Shame this wasn't done earlier but at least they'res great footage of their actions. Thanks heaps
@mrinstability i reckon when jeff was fit he bowled like 170 because i tell ya watching his videos of him
bowl when he was fit it looked a fuck load faster then 160
FYI Rod Marsh once said at his peak he was approaching 180. Not sure if he was that quick but IMO he bowled many at around 170.
@@brucelamberton8819 There's an interesting clip here on YT "Jeff Thomson and Imran Khan on recording bowlers' speed" where those 2 guys and Mark Nicholas talk about (as the title suggests) recording bowling speeds. They make the point that modern recording is taken as the ball leaves the bowlers hand but Nicholas points out that when Thommo was recorded at 160mph, that measurement was taken at the batsmen's end after the ball had hit the pitch (which takes 10-15 mph from the speed according to one of the technicians). It's well worth a look and if they are correct, then Thommo would have been significantly faster than any bowler that has been measured in the modern TV era.
JEFF THOMSON WAS REALLY A FASTEST BOWLER OF ALL TIME. WE SHOULDN'T DOUBT HIS 165+ KPH SPEED....
Why should we not doubt it ?
@@Warlock786 Thompson was at least 2 yards quicker before the collision with Glenn Turner....it is a good conversation point.
@@Warlock786 Because Clive Lloyd said Thommo was the fastest bowler he had ever seen. And Clive Lloyd saw a few fast bowlers in his time ;)
@@Vpmatt Did he face Akhtar or Lee ? Or even Waqar and Bishop ?
No right ?
When he says 'saw', he really does mean facing or seeing up close.
The same way Ricky Ponting said Akhtars spell was the fastest he ever faced...but Ricky never faced Thompson or Bishop or Holding. So in truth there is no person in the history of cricket you has an all round perspective. I find it unlikely an Athelete from the 70's would be able to excel against atheletes from the 2000's when it comes to physical prowess (not skill, as we a) know the batsman of the earlier decades had to be far more skillful)
World fastest bowler of all time is Shoib Akhter. Period
actually Akhtar bowled the ball in the world cup in South Africa it was shown on TV with the speed camera or what ever they used by it was clocked at 161.4 km/h
Lillie and Thommo such a dangerous players in the world
Good video👍👍thanks for uploading. Thommo must be really fast going by the batsmen's reactions, height of the balls reached the keeper's gloves and the margin of difference in speeds in comparision to the other elite fast bowlers of his time.
There are several bowlers who did not make test cricket that were very quick as well. I remember a Phil DeFreitas(?) playing club cricket in South Australia in the mid to late 1980's, and while he was there, he also played some indoor cricket. Now, Phil was a fairly quick bowler, and played test cricket for England in the late 80's, early 90's from memory. However, there was also another cricketer, who did play for South Australia, never played test cricket, but, was regarded as the quickest indoor bowler in Australia for about 5 years. Peter Gladigau. He played in a Sheffield Shield game at Adelaide oval, bowled Allan Border, then fronted for an indoor cricket Grand Final at Stepney on the Saturday night, while the Shield game was in progress! There was him, and there was a second indoor cricketer that was in the same ball park as Peter Gladigau. Mr. Gladigau was slightly faster, but, it would be interesting to see if someone can find some footage and see if we can work out some way of doing a comparison.
Viv Richards said that the fastest bowler he ever faced was Duncan Spencer.
@@mombaassa He always said that is Thommo infact said I never saw anyone quicker than Thommo.
@@kunalsingh3121 Only Spencer managed to hit Richards in the chest... and he did it twice, in their only meeting.
@@mombaassa So what ??? Viv was in his 40's when he faced Duncan whereas he faced Thomson largely between 1976 to 1983 in span where he avg 66 with the bat probably his best and prime years...Read about Thommo spell to Viv at MCG where he nearly killed Viv in 1976 but he scored a run a ball 100 while opening the innings too...
Duncan was fast but over Thommo never !!
@@kunalsingh3121 I never said who was faster. I simply pointed out, that Viv Richards once said, that it (that afternoon against Spencer) was the fastest bowling he had faced. I never said that Richards was right or wrong.
@ihamoitc2005 i disagree with your comment about thommo. it appears to me that his arm bends after he releases the ball....in fact i am certain now that is the case. with his bowling action i can't see how it would be possible to get a 25 degree angle.
holding was very very fast....he didn't 'whispering death' as a nickname for nothing lol
andy roberts was scarey....just got to look at the replay when he clocked david hookes. they were all great fast bowlers.
Thompson was by far the quickest, he was a speed demon and he never sprinted in at full pelt either, he had this fast jog and wound up his arms and it was like an elastic rubber band being pulled and stretched and then the cannon would be released with extreme pace
I agree Clive Lloyd said so and that's enough for me
@junoon1856 I am not sure that Imran would ever say that Thommo was ever quicker than Holding. Imran has always said that the fastest spell (&bowler) he ever faced was from Holding. His description of the spell was exciting to read. Also that he found it hard to believe that ANYONE has ever been quicker than Holding at his quickest.
Do you have that interview when Imran spoke of his speed with the new action etc
BEST CRICKET VIDEO I HAVE EVER SEEN
thompson is the fastest bowler of all time
I would have liked to have known just how fast Curtly Ambrose and Sylvester Clarke were on a fast WACA wicket. They were no slouches either.
@@bonjourr100 Your dedication in replying to a ten year old comment is admirable! Thanks!
I agree. In fact I would not be surprised that they were actually a shade slower. Slower or just as fast - NOT faster. It might be tempting to say thommo & Holding were slight exceptions (freaks so to speak) but than Lille, Imran & Roberts were just a shade slower & THAT adds to confusion..I would say they were just as quick and that is all.Lastly bowling is unique in the sense that your action is something that you develop as you TRY to bowl fast, cant really be coached as much as people think
I used to work with a bloke who reckons he played against Thomson as teenagers. Everyone shat themselves as Thomo cleaned them up.
it was recorded but never put into official records the Q.C.A has it in their records somewhere but C.A doesnt but apparently he did it in perthin the early
80's the ball he apparently bowled was that fast it bounced over Rod Marth's head and hit the sight board at the other end on the full half way up i dont believe it but alot of commentators have said it i dont know its not on TH-cam
@TheFreeForever that is not fair. Lille is regarded as the best even by other bowlers of his time. As far as the Pakistan incident - there is a huge story behind that. He did bowl well on all conditions - West Indies had slow wickets for example...and he bowled just as well in the 2nd season of the Kerry packer which was in the Windies he really was great.
the measurements from the '79 competition have always looks dubious. it is possible they were measuring average speed over the length of the pitch, rather than at release? the ball slows 13-14% between release and the batsman, so average speed would be about 7% less than speed at release
Yes I believe this is average speed that they are displaying.
Dennis Lillee 's action was like a poetry..
Michael Holding openly says he was the quickest of the West Indies fast bowlers. However, he also says that Thommo was by far the quickest. By a stretch
And so do his mates who go by the name of Clive Lloyd and Viv Richards. End of story.
@@frankcoletta Yes, Richards did say that Thommo was faster than any of the West Indian bowlers. Interestingly however, he did not say that Thompson was the fastest bowler he ever faced. Richards gave that honour to Duncan Spencer.
@@mombaassa Spencer was quick, but Viv was in his 40's and close to retirement when he faced him. Speaking from experience, there's a big difference between what the eyes see at 25 and what they see at 40. 😊
Thommo was the fastest but with Dennis the imtimidation factor was amazing some of the batsmen were just plain scared of Lillee.
Even Lillee's run-up, in his prime years, must have been enough to undo a few batsmen. He tore in like a wild animal.
He definitely topped 95 mph at least n 1972 vs England
Even though im a kiwi, i grew up in the 80's in Brisbane. I remember seeing Thommo play (and many others) at the Gabba. My overall memory is not just of how fast he was but how aggressive he was. Some will say (and i agree) thats its an essential trate for a good fast bowler. Lillee on the other hand i believe was in a different league. He was a class act through and through. Being a kiwi, of course i rate Hadlee at his peak, but even he said that Lillee was the best in the business.
@vijayp63 You should read about Javagal Srinath. One ball that he bowled during the 1996 tour of South Africa measured 156 km/h (97 mph). He also clocked 154.5 km/h (96.0 mph) at the 1999 World Cup.
@AIMANALI Australians idolised the West Indies in the 70s. Especially us kids. The kids I played with actually had West Indies cricketers as bigger heroes than the Australian ones. Viv Richards and Michael Holding were gods.
Mike Procter, who was once timed in similar fashion and showed speeds of 145+ kmph long after his prime. I must apologise for posting in several sections, as I have reached the limit on my tablet several times over. I do however, leave you with one final piece of information. The thing about fast bowling, sometimes the quickest seeming balls are shown as the slowest, and the slowest seeming balls are shown as fastest. What do you believe in? The human experience , or a measuring machine?
couldn't agree more
You’re telling me that Thomson was recorded at 160.4 end to end?
Yes, that is correct. Not out of the hand. Thommo obviously regularly exceeded 100mph undoubtedly. Dennis Lillee was timed after his back injury when he slowed down for more control & the hope of career longevity. In 1972 in England, DK was lightning, according to an email response I received from the photographer Patrick Eager who saw him bowl. DK would've been pressing as well. But DK hand magnificent control & able to put the balls in the right area. 5wkts per Test.
@@graemealexander8804 No, it was measured out of the hand, hence the use of the grid behind the bowler
It was a different game before helmets were introduced.
@Abingtoncricket
I'm jealous of your experience but, yes, I can believe that about Thommo, he always comes across as a modest, likeable chap.
Three Aussies I'd love to meet & shake hands with: Thommo, Shane Warne & Rolf Harris.
I think that was when he had signed a big deal to stay with Queensland, and so he played for Austalia when all the others went to WSC. He then wanted to join Lillee and the others, and was then banned for trying to get out of his Queensland/Australia contract. This may be wrong, i am going to hit the Wikpedia to find out, Thommo rules...
I think they recorded the speed using the high speed camera and the wall they bowl alongside as a guide. Therefore it wouldn't matter if it was a no-ball
Be. This measurement takes into account the ball slowing down in the air. The difference with today's speed guns is that it measures the speed from the hand. The result is that today's speeds are far quicker than what they should be, had the old method been used. I remember watching the SA vs England test series earlier this year, and the commentators were comparing the speeds of the English bowlers from the hand and along the pitch. The difference between the speed from the hand and that of the
Wrong. You're getting confused with 1979 when they used the same high speed cameras to measure delivery speeds of a number of bowlers in a competition. He won it, at 147.9 kph. The 160.45kph speed was measured in a live test match at Perth against the West Indies. I saw him bowl at Lords in 75 and he was certainly fast enough.
I can't vouch for the accuracy of these studies but all the great batsmen always said Thomson, Holding, Roberts were terrifyingly fast. Thommo being the fastest of the lot.
Thompson must have been told before that fuller balls record faster speeds. While all others bowled short, Thompson kept bowling full tosses.
Did it say he beat the 100 mph barrier?
Thompson was easily the quickest bowler who's ever lived- if every single ball of Thompson's career was measured, I wager, without hesitation, that there would have been a couple that hit the 163-164 mark.
Mining Forge yes ur right before akhtar thomo was the most fast and furious ever lived and there should be no doubts and arguments on it
Mining Forge Yes, I am old enough to remember Thommo and he was super quick - certainly quicker than Brett Lee. Clive Lloyd and Michael Holding both say he was well over 160kph at his fastest. He wasn't the best bowler by any stretch but prior to his shoulder injury he was still damn good.
Yep... Thomson ... a random ball of 160kmh+....
These days bowlers have EVERY bowl measured.
back in my day the HQ commodore was way faster then the commodores we have today
Good judges have said beore he injured his shoulder, Thommo was over 170 km/h.
@85Aheadstix ...Bro akhtar did 100.2 mph, which is 161.3 kph ...Thommo was definitely quicker than Akhtar but not officially
There's an interesting article on Espn cricinfo by Christian Ryan about fast bowlers speeds titled the thing about speed guns. It was published 2 days ago. I suggest you take a look. Another very interesting one titled pace race was shown on the site a couple of years back. The art of pace bowling is extremely interesting. The speed of the delivery back then was measured by how quickly the ball travelled down the pitch, ie if the ball took an hour to travel the pitch, how long would the pitch
What makes you think they timed the speed at the batsman's end? They used high speed cameras and all you have to do is watch this video to see that it's the speed out of the bowler's hand they are measuring.
@MrAIMANZUL have not been to find any of that match (I'd love to see it too) but there are some other clips of that series in "West Indies vs Australia 1975-76"
@mrinstability ....and people didn't have helmets facing them...insane
@69Ocker in addition this doesnt make engineering sense as the speed "5 feet" from release would be approx the same as the speed of the hand at release..meaning its easier to measure the hand itself. to be able to measure 5 feet- when the ball can be travelling along different paths relative to horizontal will yield large errors. id be very keen to see the details of these tests you are citing..it just doesnt add up.
Surely it could be measured through video footage of Thomson how fast he bowled.
@ihamoitc2005
I am not saying that Thomson was chucking intentionally. In fact, it looks very much like the hyper-extension that also afflicts Akhtar. Due to extremely flexible joints, the force of arm movement causes the elbow to stretch backwards unnaturally.
Lillee, on the other hand, definitely has a kink starting from when his arm is at the horizontal and all the way through the arc until it reaches it's peak and then straightens through delivery. Intentional? No. But it's there.
@AIMANALI Cool. The fact that the Windies could churn out speedsters almost at will just defies belief. I wish I could see some more like them nowadays :(
I'm sure the batsman facing him noticed. But think how fast he'd have been if he'd used a blue one. On the other hand maybe he caused enough pain with the red one, and blue balls would have just added insult to injury.
@vincerjn And I have a quote from Lillee in one of my books that Thommo was the only bowler he would happily play second fiddle to in his peak. Lillee rated him as the most lethal and unplayable bowler ever. Its a shame there aren't more vids of him tearing into batsmen. Clive Loyd rates him as the fastest ever, I think. I remember so clearly how much damage he did in the 70s, like it was yesterday.
@69Ocker where do you get this stuff from?..im an engineer and work with this sort of thing regularly and am also a cricket fan and i would suggest that you dont have this correct as there are nocitable differences in bowling speeds published these days when comparing a ball that is a yorker or full toss to those of a ball that pitches- suggesting that the measured speed does in fact include the entire length of the pitch..not the first "5 feet"- no one works over "feet" these days..
did u watch the video? Michael holding hit 148 kph and andy roberts bowled 150kph
there are so many bowlers who popably bowled 160-70 but didnt get it measured
I tend to trust a wicketkeepers point of view when it comes to speeds of fast bowlers ( and Marsh was adamant Thommo was scary) so for out and out quickest my vote would go to Thommo, though based on the parametres that you put down in your list for quickest in career, then Shoab Aktar would win based on Thommo losing speed after the shoulder injury.
@atuls55 Garth Le Roux, South African fast bowler who played in World Series Cricket.
true but u cant compare them as lillee and thompson played in a semi-professional period where tait akhtar and Zahid play in the professional period with complete diffrent trainning regimines diets and fitness testing. Thomo was the first man 2 clock a ball faster than 160km
they recorded the bowling speed past the stumps..whereas today its measured out of the hand of bowlers
4:24 how awsome was that.
@aks73 Holding said that Thommo was the quickest he ever saw he never said that Thommo was quicker than him. Infact I had an interview of Holding from 1980 and he said that he himself might be the quickest but he does not consider himself the best bowler