If only more jobs would support someone having a doctorate degree. In my field, I'd be overqualified. What do you do when you love going to school, but then that's money you could have used elsewhere. It's hard. All my life, I've gone through school and now not being in school anymore. It sometimes makes me go crazy mentally.
@@Determination212 I totally feel you. I really want to do a PhD and work in a university environment, more specifically the university I attended. I really enjoyed my lectures, interacting with other students and professors, (my uni has students and professors from different countries), listening to different research ideas and of course I would enjoy the energy of students to some extent, sometimes it's a tad bit exhausting. Anyway, I feel like I would not age a day and my brain would be stimulated from my interactions. And imagine lecturing a student from undergraduate to grad school, PhD. My goodness, this would be a dream come true!
@@kap849 What’s your major? Depending, might it make since to go industry for a while and get experience actually doing what you want to teach ? For example, my physics professor worked for IRSO, JAXA, and then NASA for a few years and now he teaches.
A postdoc friend of mine summed it up perfectly: "The best thing about academia is the flexibility and the travel. The worst thing about academia is... the flexibility and the travel."
@@Dakarai_Knight no, it's usually just used for those in academia. I guess if you go into industry you would just use your job title e.g. software developer, since postdoc is basically a job title.
I am a third year PhD student majoring in Neuroscience and Molecular Biology. The main namesis of doing a PhD would be stress and mental health issue. For me, though PhD demands high dedication and persistency, work life balance is the utmost importance for me. The first two years of continuous grinding had affected my mental health poorly. That’s why I’m clocking into times punctually without going back home late, because work will never finish. Health, family and friends will always comes first..this is how I deal with the PhD’s stress...
I realize your comment is 3 years old lol but maybe you'll still answer a quick question. How did you combine the two different fields? Or have you instead done research in each field separately? I'm starting my phd soon and I am equally interested in two topics (humanoid robotics & fusion plasma control). Ideally, I will produce results in each field simultaneously.
Additional pro: autonomy. Your supervisor is your advisor not your boss, at the end of the day you control the direction of your research. This absolutely doesn't happen in traditional jobs.
@@thomasp4902 Sometimes true, although depends on the university system and funding. At my university funding is awarded to the student not the supervisor, although your supervisor could definitely cause trouble for you if they wanted.
@@constancellc Most unis award it to the student not the supervisor, but the uni will stop awarding you the money if the supervisor says you are useless!
"PhDs are hard. Agreed Recently I watch movies/tv shows where some people say they have more than 1 phd, I don't say "man that person is smart". I say "Man, that person's hardworking".
I know right i was so confused when some of these people say they have 3 phds and they are in their early 30s and i would think how did they manage to do it so quick
My suggestion is: if you have a rich family to support you, then academic is a very good choice. If you have to support a family, then it is bad choice.
@@brightsideguy8700 I would say both. It is pretty suffering when wife and kids expect to have a stable life, while husband have to be drifting around the world to find the next postdoc position like a begger.
@@xuhan1981v not necessarily. I know a lot of PhD students who have no kid, husband/wife, and pay for themselves using the funding provided by their program or working a job. Meaning they do a PhD without a rich family supporting them, or without a family of their own to support.
I like how you structured the pros between the cons! It made the video tone a lot more neutral and easier to digest -- videos that throw all the cons at the end make the overall thing sound too negative, and vice-versa with the pros. (needless to say, the content itself was all very helpful too!)
I'm currently doing a physics PhD, finishing my first year... and frankly, I'm continuously considering quitting it for several months now. Basically, all of the cons Simon mentions her kind of coincide in my project, at least it feels that way: I have gradually lost the interest in the research field I'm in, the funding of my supervisor isn't secured (meaning I would possibly work without any guiding throughout my 2nd and 3rd years), when I'm doing experimental work I put in insane working hours (at least that's what I think) and I'm totally torn between performing well in my PhD and providing for a family. So basically worst case. And still, the worst for me are the working hours. It still puzzles me that you put in 50 - 70 hours a week, and instead of denouncing these circumstances, academia has kind of tricked people to say that it is part of the "PhD experience" or (to cite Simon) that "a PhD is hard". Sure a PhD is hard, but it should be hard because it is intelectually demanding, not because you're working yourself to death. But this is just me ranting, because I'm frustrated again :/
Really think about it. Ignoring these feelings and completing my PhD is my biggest regret. Now I'm just a graduate with a degree who's confusee but everyone tells to shut up and deal, should have gotten out earlier if I didn't like it. It's so alienating, I feel like my work is worthless and wont change anything, I'm constantly slaving away alone while years pass, I barely remember the feeling of being outside for relaxing walks, I am always stressed, idk if I'll ever have time to start a family... just really think l through if it's worth finishing.
I'm about halfway through writing my dissertation at the moment. My first year was a whirlwind and it wasn't until about halfway through my second year, nearly the start of my third when i realized I didn't want to be in academia and having a PhD isn't as valuable as experience in the field I work in, but being nearly halfway it seemed like finishing made the most sense because I did have funding to do so. I'll be finishing, and I suppose I'm glad of that, but honestly, I wish I hadn't bothered to do a PhD. To be fair, this knowledge is with the hindsight of the PhD experience, so I couldn't have been so sure back then because I didn't know what would come of these past two years... In any event, if you're in your first year and already doubting it, you need to really consider why you're doing it because it really does take everything you have to write it up and finish at the end when you're depressed and feel like it was a pointless effort with very little pay off. You need to be committed to finish.
I have a similiar situation, where I worked hard for several years to earn the opportunity to carry a PhD and bring my family along. Years do not pass in vain, and I agree with you, your family is the biggest source of motivation, but at the same time your biggest distraction. One financial problem, or a kid getting sick can wreck your schedule for weeks. And we need to be in "the zone" to start producing original knowledge for our thesis. Wish you luck and success, do not despair.
Heinz Heinz in contrast to the other replies here. I’m 1.5 years into my PhD and the second half of my first year was terrible. I didn’t feel like I was getting anywhere and considered quitting for several months. I think definitely have something else lined up if you’re going to leave. But personally I think it gets better. I’m feeling great about it now and everything is going really well - very glad I didn’t drop it. The dean of research at my uni described doing a PhD as riding a roller coaster with a blindfold on. And I can definitely feel that.
Very relatable! In my undergrad I routinely overworked myself and never bothered to attend any social events. Quite frankly, in the end I was plagued with a feeling of isolation and my undergrad ended up being an unexciting experience. Once I got in the PhD program, I was determined to make amends. So I got involved with a martial arts club (always wanted to learn karate!). This has made my university experience not only fun, but it also provides a welcome distraction from all the academic hustle and bustle.
My advisor's boyfriend did a social psych PhD and ended up contracting with the government due to the coding he had to learn for his PhD. They really do open up more doors than you might expect.
As a PhD candidate, I agree with all of the points that you've made in this video! I think it's essential to stress that a PhD at times can be a really lonely place to be as many people around you really just can't comprehend what you spend your time doing. I am lucky that I have an excellent supervisory team, but I'd also stress that you make sure that you can work with any potential supervisor before accepting any PhD it's such a unique and crucial relationship! All of that being said it's an incredible thing to do and if after this video you still want to pursue a PhD then absolutely go for it!
Hi Simon , thank you so much! I am going to start my PhD in Neuroscience this fall 2020. Your video is amazing and truly inspiring! Im sharing this video to my friends! Love from the Philippines
I’m just finishing my PhD in history (submitting this week 🎉) and a lot of these things hold true in the humanities too. For me the biggest thing is the contribution to knowledge - it’s incredible what you achieve by the end of it. 😀 I would say that relationships with supervisors and others tend to be quite different in my discipline: my supervisor was incredibly hands-off in terms of telling me what to do and when. I saw her every 2-3 months, maybe 20 times total over the whole five years (I did mine part time), and it was generally just for a chat about my thinking, where I was at in my intellectual process etc. That suited me because I started as a mature student with 10 years of work experience in my field and was happy to project manage myself but I know it’s not for everyone. Anyway, I’m rambling! I’ve loved watching your PhD videos, even though we’re in such different fields.
Ph. D. in pure math here. Be sure to be affiliated with a decent research team/laboratory in terms of publications quantity and quality, because, if not, you will end unemployed for a long period of time, not even will be accepted in a postdoc position, and you will hate yourself for that happening after all your colossal effort. This is a good advice for all fields but especially for people doing pure math because for such specialties, it is hard to enter the industry with your Ph. D.
Hey I might consider studying pure maths as well. My Father did a Ph. D. in it too. I was just interested in the Topic your Ph. D. was about and your experience with the studies.
Integrative Neuroscience here. Agreed! I'm in a teaching position, but still do research to stay viable. No one warned me about the need to crank out the pubs and know what you are studying in grad school may limit your opportunities in the future if you want to change programs of study.
I am doing my PhD in Plant Ecology, and I must say having supervisors you get along with really makes this degree less daunting. Even though it is extremely stressful and hard trying to complete your PhD during the COVID-19 pandemic. So many plans and deadlines have been shifted which further adds to the anxiety. My PhD is experiment-based which requires me to be at the University. Luckily I am due to submit my thesis next year so hopefully, I will be able to recover the time lost.
At 16:00 Cons: 1. Less income while enrolled in PhD 2. Being tied to your Supervisor 3. PhDs are Hard Work 4. Pigeon-Holed 5. Isolating Pros: 1. Flexibility 2. Ability to travel 3. Improve Skills 4. Contribute to field 5. Uni mk II
I did my PhD in a medical science area and I enjoyed it a lot and thought it was a, if not the, most effective way to learn certain things at a short time considering the time pressure and expectation to make it great. Thanks for sharing your experience.
0:39 REALLY?! Damn, I thought it was the same as in Belgium...Here we get stipends that are actually way above the average people's paygrade... I'm talking nearly 2000 euro net salary! I'm currently doing a PhD in Biomedical Sciences, and with 5 years prior working experience I receive even more... I made a video about it on my channel, so welcome to check that out. Also welcome to ask any questions on doing a PhD in Belgium by the way. Furthermore, great list of pro/con, Simon. I think you covered it fully!
Hey man ! Just came accross your channel. Really good videos, can relate a lot to it. I did a PhD in condensed matter theory in Paris. I think it is worth stressing out more than you get a LOT of different, valuable skills doing a phD. Now I am running a start-up and I think doing a PhD taught me how to run a very difficult project with no clear sight of the near future, yet still be able to make decisions.
I watched this before I applied for a PhD and I know it helped me make a choice which was right for me! I'm now 4 months in, admittedly never expected to start in a pandemic and it's so tough and isolating but I wouldn't do anything else.
Not only meet who you expect to be your supervisor, make sure you would be comfortable working for at least 3 supervisors at the institution. Professors switch schools, funding falls through, you can develop a completely toxic relationship with your adviser. Having a backup is good.
Only in my second year, but an additional pro I'd suggest is the wealth of knowledge you get by pursuing your degree. This is probably something like the intersection of flexibility and transferable skills. Still, so far, learning so much (and mastering a variety of material) in such a small amount of time has been extremely rewarding for me.
My biggest fear would be the lack of commitment. I do like to read and analyze, but once I’m forced to do that (in academic settings), I panic then shutdown. Not to mention the distraction, which is equally frightening. I mean, just holding your cellphone may lead to hours of wasting precious time. The other fear would be the viva/defense. I didn’t do the defense during my MA studies, and we had to submit a project in each course instead. Always dreaded public speaking, I get hyperventilating when I see TH-cam videos of PhD candidates defending their theses. Sigh.
Also you will be defending something you invested your time and energy for approximately 3-4 years and you already would have to give presentations before fellow academics and peers so don't think too much
Think of it as great opportunity to overcome your fear and develop your skills. Learning process is supposed to put us out of our comfort zone. Wish you the best of luck!
I just turned down a PhD position because after meeting with my potential supervisor, and speaking to my previous masters advisor, it wasn't the right fit for me. Right project, but wrong research group/supervisor situation. A recommendation I received from a few professors who helped advise me on the situation was to avoid any PhD arrangement where the supervisor position is shared, especially if there's a geographic distance it can be really challenging. This can at times happen, depending on how the funding works sometimes or if there are two people who work together and are taking on a PhD student together.
Very nice info Simon. Those cons always haunt my planning procedures, i still havent started PhD. But the thrill of leaving behind a Study for future generations - thats a motivation.
You are spot on with everything you said. I would add, as someone who did a lab-based Ph.D., that you can still have a lot of flexibility if you are careful. It meant working at odd times, but I was able to do things like chaperone my youngest son's school field trips, pick him up from school every day (then bring him back to the lab to do homework), etc.
As someone on the home stretch (handing in in April next yr) I can say the biggest challenge is also the biggest pro - developing from a scared new grad who has no idea what they are doing to a confident, almost -standing-on-their-own-feet researcher. In saying that, with only 4 months to go and essentially my whole thesis to write up, I am low key terrified 😅
Hi there ! Thanks for sharing your personal experiences about doing a PhD especially in the U.K. I truly understand you as I've been doing my second year of PhD at one of the UK's universities and all the sudden my supervisors started having problems with me and my given ideas, (it seemed like they weren't satisfied with what they did to me) plus those they've put me in a tremendous financial situation!!! (as an international student I've been told to be a self-funded student) ... anyway since then I have started having some health issues until I've gave up my PhD and left UK and went back home. After couple of months I start applying to North American universities as their conditions for graduate international students are brilliant and most importantly you have more chance to choose your fitted research group and supervisor than in the U.K. . In my opinion, doing a PhD genuinely depends on your ability to do research, the topic you're interested in (you know what you're doing and why) and how to cope with the stress and pressure during your work with groups of UG students, experts and professors in your field of research or in an academic environment. I did have the feeling that I've been left behind the doors because of my nationality and ethnicity out there but thanks God I'll not experience the same feelings again as before. 🙏🏼 Waiting to watch more useful videos of you on TH-cam!!! Cheers xx
@@Manu-jc2sx here in Canada doing a PhD is like doing a master degree but in a long run. For the first year you have to pass required courses (with midterm and finals) and then pass comprehensive exam which for me those ones are way tougher and difficult than what they're expecting from me back in the UK. So in general,a PhD in North America is more theoretically and scientifically stronger (especially in my field antenna/RF and electromagnetics)than in the UK.
Entering the second year of my MSc right now. I love the work I'm doing and my supervisors are great (even if one is always away for conferences) and I can't wait to start applying for and hopefully beginning my PhD in 2020. Just discovered your channel and I look forward to going through your PhD vlogs.
I am a PhD in Germany. To be honest, my money situation is very good ! I think it really depends where you do it and in which city you live ! But in Berlin, I have a rather nice situation :)
Thank you for imparting those words of wisdom, "Modern Times OGs." For example as I stated (above) there is a difference between doing ANY level of education in the U.S. as compared to Europe. Those whom I have spoken to who are PHd/Doctoral students in Europe, tell me that there is a more relaxed approach on how to get things accomplished, and a more dedicated approach when it comes to mentorship.
Great job - I think you hit a lot of the key points. One big con though (although, maybe for some it's a pro) is that you often have little choice over where you live post-PhD if you're staying in academia. Jobs in academia are limited, and so there's limited choice in location. So, if you're a person that is dedicated to living in one particular place, academia can be a challenging career. Academics must be willing to move.
Don't stay in academia. If you want to become a lecturer then go into industry and come back, you'll rise faster that way too. In engineering this is really common, a lot of the most valuable staff only have an MEng.
@@thomasp4902 To be fair, this is more practical in some disciplines that others. Engineering, Economics, Business, probably even literature or history .... there you can develop your CV in ways that are equally appealing to universities compared to staying in academia. In contrast, I'm an ecologist and I'd essentially give up on a tenure track position if I stopped doing research. Having experience as a practitioner doesn't always carry the same weight as a consistent record of academic publications, unfortunately.
@@InvasiveWargaming It's not really worth getting tenure IMO. It's just a long, slow, low paid road to a fairly disappointing destination. Anyone on PhD should get out before their post doc. A masters student in the UK is looking at £70k of debt from 4 years of study which is double the pre-tax salary of a junior lecturer. By the time you get tenure you'll probably be sick of Uni and research anyway.
Cool video. I hope you recover from any stress leftover from the PhD. I am doing a lot of work in coding too here in TCD, Ireland. You sound like a confident friend all of the sudden 😊. Thanks a 1M.
(from the USA, where science PhDs are typically 5-6 years) I've been talking to a lot of my undergraduate professors about getting a PhD. One thing that has really stuck with me is that one of them told me that a PhD will fundamentally change who you are and how you think (or, at least, they believe a PhD done right should have this effect). You need to be ready to lose old friends, especially friends who aren't getting a PhD, too, because (1) you will not have time for them and they might not fully understand why, (2) you will change so much so fast that you might find you no longer click with them. I've also been recommended to go away for a PhD. That is, do NOT get a PhD at a school near your hometown.
The longer I stayed with my PhD, the more I lost friends FROM the PhD programs. They weren't...AWFUL people...but they also weren't good people. Everyone was constantly playing this passive-aggressive game to probe who was the smartest. During social events they always wanted to complain about their research, or their students if they were teaching. And many had undeveloped social skills. The funny part is that I was a lot like them at the start, and the more I spent time with them, the more I realized that this was not the person I wanted to be. Even today, I pick up a subtle superiority complex from many people who have gotten their PhD. It's a very "I'm above that" attitude.
@@logangantner3863 I saw this one comic drawn by some PhD guy where he complained about how dumb undergraduates are... that really pissed me off tbh. One of the worst traits someone can have as a human being is a superiority complex
@@flubadubdubthegreat1272 Oh yeah, comparing undergrads to babies or idiots is standard PhD student affair. If the program requires PhD students to be TAs, this gets intensified even more. When I started teaching for the first time, I realized quickly that I needed to drop my "I'm the smartest" ego and focus on getting everyone to the level they needed to be. But so many of the guys in my position never did this. When we would grade exams together, they couldn't stop talking about how dumb their students are. Like...do they think that attitude isn't going to come through in their teaching?
@@logangantner3863 "Even today, I pick up a subtle superiority complex from many people who have gotten their PhD. It's a very "I'm above that" attitude." To be fair, with a PhD it is hard NOT to develop a slight "superiority complex" when you realize that most people don't have decent critical thinking, problem solving ability, and communication skills (especially for complex topics). Typically the more educated a person is the easier it is to recognize ignorance, stupidity, and terrible logic. Since PhD's are a minority in the population they constantly encounter people, with these traits, who essentially stopped developing intellectually DURING high school. Sure, some people self study outside of formal education, but for the majority that requires more time and effort than they are willing to spend or able to in their daily lives.
I agree on everything said in this video, I'm now a PhD and I got the same problems as I think for all people during their PhD, doing a PhD is difficult especially mentally, but at the end it is a exceptional experience and may give you many skills for the next steps in life.
Nice video. I am defending my PhD thesis (evolutionary ecology) next month. My experiences are mostly biased toward the 'pros' side. I really enjoyed doing it, had a nice supervisor and although at times it was physically knackering (long days in the field, 7 days a week for weeks on end) as well as intelectually discouraging ("I am not smart enough to pull this particular part off"), I found it, on the whole, a pleasant ride. So yes, I don't think people should let themselves be discouraged by horror stories. The only thing I hated was the feeling I was constantly having from the last months onward that I was getting myself ready for a plunge into a pit, the academic trap. "If I stay in science, where will I need to move next (and what about my social life) and for how long will it last? What comes after that? And if I leave academia, who on earth would want to have me? I'm just an ecologist with some R coding experience; what do I have to bring to the table?" As it turns out, these fears are not totally unrealistic. I found a job in academia, though, that sort of guarantees stability, but the uncertainty was killig me and I know many ex-PhD colleagues (yes, colleagues, as a PhD is a reasonably well-paid job where I'm from) that are struggling with the same issues. My final verdict: I am glad I did a PhD since it was a life goal I had to achieve and it brought me where I wanted (so far). Yet, if anyone asked my advice as to whether or not to do a PhD, I would tell them to seriously consider whether it's something they really want to do. Obviously if you don't care too much about the scientific phylosophy and publishing papers and what not, by all means go for the industry jobs straight away -- this will be a much safer path toward job security! Cheers
@@paulpop3498 Hey, I'm not sure I have any concrete tips. What I can tell you is that I did my master's research project at the same institute and in that way made it easier for myself to get the position eventually. So make sure people know you and your work (a publication also helps). And always keep your eyes open! As for labs to look at: I'm not sure where you're from but in the UK the Edward Grey Inst (Oxford) springs to mind, as well University of Edinburgh or Aberdeen (I'm not from the UK so I don't know them all by heart). Outside UK there's plenty good labs across (western) Europe. As for US: no clue. Good luck!
Thanks! I have started query mails. A few of them have responded but, none positive (eg: retired, no current funding and no current position available). I have published, and in the process publishing more. Will give a look at the Institutes you mentioned.
@@paulpop3498 What may be useful is to approach someone with research ideas and propose to write a grant proposal together. Getting into a lab with your own ideas and a bag of money is usually easier than just asking them to hire you. The obvious downside is, of course, getting the money in the first place!
For me, it was simply an opportunity to do something I love for a few more years and possibly make a career out of it. The fact that I got funding meant that someone was PAYING me to do something I loved. As I live at home I don't have the same financial constraints as many PhD students, but even so when I think about how I would have felt doing some boring job I don't care about, the PhD seemed incredible by comparison. The mental health issues are definitely a big thing. I felt that even through my Masters research. Possibly the most important issue mentioned here. Your mental health will probably suffer at some point during a PhD, and it can be a real struggle to look after yourself. So you have to make sure you have people who care about you to help you keep on track with that and remind you to go outside into the sunshine once in a while :) Also very weird to finally be doing a PhD after watching your videos as an MA student and taking your advice!
I’m currently in my 3rd year of undergrad studying math. I’d love to go into a PhD program after I graduate mostly because of pro #4. It is my dream to contribute something original to human knowledge
This is a great video, I am almost at the end of my MA suppose to have my Thesis but Covid came... man, I am thrilled to take on the challenge of PhD :)
My PhD felt like it embodied the quote "if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you". PhD eroded my mental health in many ways. One point you missed is that you're going to fail, quite a lot. For many doing a PhD like myself, you're a high achiever who has never failed before. Research is risky and a lot of what you try doesn't work out. When you combine having to experience failure for the first time, while being totally isolated (by definition you're doing something no one else has done before, so you quickly reach a point where if you don't know the answer no one does), it can feel incredibly dark. You add stress of being poor and the constant tick of your stipend date running out, I'm honestly surprised I made it through. I grew a lot from the experience, but I don't think it was a healthy way to achieve that growth.
I’m doing my masters in Shakespeare right now and thinking about applying to my PhD next year. Even though your area is worlds away from mine this is super handy and informative !
You have been an inspiration to so many people hoping to go for physics, engineering and computer science. Kudos! The PhD is just the cherry on the top, the sundae that you worked on all this while (being an excellent science communicator) should totally not be overlooked!
I get so much inspiration from your videos. I feel a similar way about my undergraduate experience as you do. I’m currently working on getting into graduate school for physics and looking forward to the “second chance” at university. It’s exciting hearing about how graduate school rewarded you. Hopefully it’s as rewarding for me!
Thank you for this video from somebody that did their undergraduate degree in classical literature and civilisations (stuff about Ancient Greece and Rome etc.) and is half way through their conversion masters to computer science. I am not really sure what I am going to do yet but you have definitely given me more insight into the idea of a phd.
I HAVE to stretch the short-touch of the mental health issues during a PhD. When I tried a PhD the first-time around, I almost committed suicide. It is not something you want. Admittedly yes, I've had bad mental health since I were a young child, and yes I have several mental problems, but to prove you must be weary of this, I went and did it again after 2 years and I got it, with no corrections. You have to be aware that if you don't think about this problem, you probably will get it. You have to focus on living life, and never putting your work over your life.
Yeah, I think self care is extremely important and not many supervisors are able to recognise warning signs, or equipped to deal with them. I got Bell's Palsy twice from stress during my masters. Decided academia was not a viable career choice for me at that time. Managed to graduate, but retired my academic aspirations after my Masters.
Been doing an PhD in biochemistry and decided to master out. Thought this vid would help me feel better about it, but just pointed out how badly I failed. Those dong PhDs in the sciences, I hope you're doing better than I am. I wish you all the best.
Don't feel bad about it. Of course, I assume you will have heard, "Well, it's not for everyone," often enough, so I'll spare you. I will say, however, that a masters is still very, VERY, admirable, I will be happy to make it through my bachelors program, much more so would I be with a masters. (Allow me to be pretentious,) I agree with Aristotle, happiness is the only true end, for which there are many viable means.
Perhaps my experience is different. I am in Grad school now but doing a Masters, I've decided to stop after a Masters due to the exact financial reasons you state. The earning rates between a Masters graduate and a PhD graduate at least here in Canada are not statistically significant (Ref: Stats Can). I am also a mature student (I'm on average 5-10 years older than the average PhD student), so my timelines and objectives are way different than those late 20s early 30s. I just want to graduate, get a job and enjoy life, I'm personally really tired of late nights studying or writing when I know that in the private sector, after 4pm I am free.
Great video, Simon! Watched from start to finish and found it all very insightful and inspiring. Thank you for being honest about the cons. Very valuable to hear. Hoping you do make a video on academic conferences!
cool like do whatever at your own time and I hope you do it well with less supervision cool or checking your progress and not cancelling appointments cool?
Great video, Simon. My viva is going to be next week Friday so I am pretty much at the end of my PhD journey (Uni of Exeter, too!). I agree with all of your pros and cons. I definitely loved the flexibility and now that I decided to leave academia, I am having a hard time finding a position where I can work for something I am passionate about and also have my freedom. Oh yes, and PhDs are definitely pigeon-holed and this makes changing careers even harder, but I know that I have really good transferable skills so I'm going to find my way. :)
I plan on going back for mine. Of course I'm going to take 3-4 year pause, however to expand my experience in the field.. I have a terminal degree in my field, so I can do a lot with a Masters. I'm still under 30, so I believe I have a lot of time to flesh out practice skills and build my portfolio.
curious hearing about simon's experience of experienced vs novice supervisors. my experience was that novice supervisors see "getting their student to the finishing line" as a huge tick on their CV and are therefore very hands-on. experienced supervisors take the view of "hey, i don't need this. graduate, don't graduate - it's all the same to me"
2:02 do what you love without fear of money. When you dive into your passions with your career, money will always find its way to you. Also, comparison is the thief of joy. If you look at your friends in undergrad or somewhere else and compare, you are setting yourself up for emotional hardship. March to the beat of your own drum and never allow discouragement to rule you
I'm defending mine in a month! I agree with most everything you say. If I still feel inspired when its over, I'll make my first video describing my experience doing a PhD at Oregon State University in the USA.
Take a piece of paper and a pen and then write everything you need to do something about. I mean everything personal, potential, small, big, everything. Aim to write about 200 items, don't try to plan it, just get it out of your head. This will clear out some space in your head to breathe. Then you can start planning these things writing out all the steps you need to take to achieve each thing. Your anxiety likely stems from your braining feeling like you have all these threads you haven't thought about enough. I would suggest reading Getting Things Done, I hate productivity blah blah but seriously the methodology in the book is extremely effective. It helped me out of crying my eyes out every day. lol
Then once you're done, you can go for round 2 - Postdoc! Actually I'm very happy about this, it's like doing a PhD over again except with much less self-doubt and no thesis due. Somehow my health doesn't seem to be doing much better! I took a lot of years, I had a very flexible and busy supervisor (and started on a topic which I think was pretty poor) - I think largely this is a result.
I really appreciate your discussion of mental health elements. I myself am considering a PhD but worried my mental health conditions will boil over too much or too often to succeed in it. My own girlfriend, 3/4 years into her PhD just got diagnosed with her own mental health conditions. However, you paint a much more perceivable angle to think it over as less of a threat. Thanks!
I can only speak from experience but it helps if you are a bit obsessive. You have to live with something specialised for a few years and possibly the rest of your career. It also really helps if you have a stable close relationship
Well done, as a fellow PhD candidate I can say you have succinctly described the experience. We have so much in common. I also developed the same breathing problem during my PhD. The only one I couldn't relate with is travelling. I have never traveled on academic grounds in my PhD, which I'll admit is highly unusual.
Thanks for this video. I have been working for government doing earth science research for six years. I have increasingly realized that to continue progressing and eventually run my own lab, I need a PhD. I do indeed love research science and adding to human knowledge in my field. But unfortunately, I have anxiety issues and I'm daunted by the time commitment, sacrafices, and financial implications of starting grad school. Videos like yours at least help me think things through.
Altho not doing a PhD and didn't even finish my UnderGrad in Pure Maths, I started my own business. After a while, I started having head spins from overthinking, and information overload, analysis, sifting, sorting, etc. And then I would go to work, with my head spinning, and continue with the research while at work, go home with a head spin, and then do my business stuff, and start the "doing part", and the next day, my head is till is spinning. This lasted a whole month. And I have had it several times since, yet not for a whole month. Maybe 1-2 days at a time. I spoke with one of my customers who was doing her PhD and asked her if she ever gets heads spins and she said, yeah often and sometimes will sit in front of the keyboard for 45 minutes with so many ideas and not having written anything. So ppl, solopreneurs go thru very similar things and we work 18 hour days, and for long periods of time, and just like a PhD, can last 2-3-4 years. Sheer persistence and dedication are key. No wonder there are so few "successful" ppl out there.
I have dealt with psychosomatic breathing problems in my undergrad years doing my honors thesis. Now I’ve been getting them back again while applying to grad school. I have an interview at a prestigious university next month for one of their PhD programs and it’s stressing me out.
Kind of shocked at how many people say getting a PhD sucks/is bad for your mental health, etc.. I did my MD and eventually went back and got my PhD....I was always amazed at how many people were so consistently negative during the entire process. It's hard don't get me wrong, but it's not any harder than a demanding full time job (minus the pay I guess). I would actually argue it's a lot easier than a demanding full time job. I feel a lot of my colleagues and people struggle so much is because most have never had a full time work experience prior to getting their PhD. Best advise I heard my advisor tell a student was "no one is making you be here". A PhD should be a fun thing to do because you want to do it. If you don't like it then simply leave if you think that will make you happier.
It's so true that your PhD is tied to the aptitude and attitude of your supervisor. My partner had to switch his PhD supervisor because that person was unavailable for feedback and input all...the...time. As soon as he switched, there was an immediate acceleration and quality improvement in the dissertation project.
I agree so much with the "being tied to your supervisor" con. My supervisor is a nice guy, but we just don't work well together. 90% of the time I think I would work better alone / with other collaborators :/
Btw, the video was great. Very good summary of pros and cons. The only thing bugging me, is that I think my supvisor is a net negative to my project. If I could have all the pros (and cons), but just not be tied to my supervisor, I would be much happier with it
A Ph.D. in psychology in my country requires 60units of coursework, a written comprehensive exam, 700 to 1000 hours of internship, and a dissertation. Some students spend nearly 10years to graduate.
Also a pro: Your PhD project may be for something that doesn't have enough money to be funded as an actual job but is important in helping people. E.g. research about the enviornment, conservation, health, social issues, psychology, forensics, engineering, especially in developing or poorer areas.
Our uni only helps with the cost of going to conferences for full time instructors. No help for MS or PhD students. We couldn’t even afford to go to a conference 10 kms from us because the ticket cost a few hundred bucks.
My eldest is in 2nd year undergrad, experienced her first year experience full of covid/lockdowns/restrictions. She did an unpaid internship with the uni after first year, and got some good calculations for a project in DUNE for her supervisor. This is one of the reasons why she wants to do a phd. She loves the idea of a project and making it her own. It sounds like lots of hours per week, so when she does go into it, I will remember this video and remind her to have a little bit of fun along the way. Whether thats sport, or going out for that pub quiz.
@@mikalbrown3227 Thanks for the info! I have been asked to apply for a full scholarship PhD, but I'm not too into the subject. It'd be awesome to be called Dr. Brian, but not worth the years of stress. Cheers!
Con: back in 1992 through 98 I made about 9k per year as a stipend while living in an expensive area in NY. Was very hard to survive and needed student loans to finish. Sounds like the stipend in the UK is much better. It's hard to spend your youth poor while your friends who didn't go for PhDs are buying cars and houses and so on. But, the payoff is the flexibility and privilege to do really interesting work and to teach at university. It's a huge delay of gratification, but I'm glad I did it.
I’m getting my PhD in clinical psychology and some of these don’t apply. I have flexibility but that HAS to be filled with research/publications, and I have to go into the clinic and see clients.
“Doing PhD is so much fun!” Repeat this line every minute of the day until dissertation is finished.
Hahahahha.. Good one
If only more jobs would support someone having a doctorate degree. In my field, I'd be overqualified. What do you do when you love going to school, but then that's money you could have used elsewhere. It's hard. All my life, I've gone through school and now not being in school anymore. It sometimes makes me go crazy mentally.
That’s a lot of repetitions dude!
@@Determination212 I totally feel you. I really want to do a PhD and work in a university environment, more specifically the university I attended. I really enjoyed my lectures, interacting with other students and professors, (my uni has students and professors from different countries), listening to different research ideas and of course I would enjoy the energy of students to some extent, sometimes it's a tad bit exhausting. Anyway, I feel like I would not age a day and my brain would be stimulated from my interactions. And imagine lecturing a student from undergraduate to grad school, PhD. My goodness, this would be a dream come true!
@@kap849 What’s your major? Depending, might it make since to go industry for a while and get experience actually doing what you want to teach ? For example, my physics professor worked for IRSO, JAXA, and then NASA for a few years and now he teaches.
A postdoc friend of mine summed it up perfectly: "The best thing about academia is the flexibility and the travel. The worst thing about academia is... the flexibility and the travel."
My favorite variation of this: "in academia every day is a Saturday. However, you work Saturdays" xD
Whats a postdoc
@@Anonymous-fh8qw Generic word meaning researcher who has a PhD but isn't a permanent lecturer or professor yet. (Postdoc = postdoctoral researcher).
@@EuskaltelEuskadi would that count for those who go into industry instead of becoming a lecturer/professor at all.
@@Dakarai_Knight no, it's usually just used for those in academia. I guess if you go into industry you would just use your job title e.g. software developer, since postdoc is basically a job title.
I am a third year PhD student majoring in Neuroscience and Molecular Biology. The main namesis of doing a PhD would be stress and mental health issue. For me, though PhD demands high dedication and persistency, work life balance is the utmost importance for me. The first two years of continuous grinding had affected my mental health poorly. That’s why I’m clocking into times punctually without going back home late, because work will never finish. Health, family and friends will always comes first..this is how I deal with the PhD’s stress...
I realize your comment is 3 years old lol but maybe you'll still answer a quick question. How did you combine the two different fields? Or have you instead done research in each field separately? I'm starting my phd soon and I am equally interested in two topics (humanoid robotics & fusion plasma control). Ideally, I will produce results in each field simultaneously.
Additional pro: autonomy. Your supervisor is your advisor not your boss, at the end of the day you control the direction of your research. This absolutely doesn't happen in traditional jobs.
Although again as you said relies on a good supervisor relationship
If you have a University scholarship then your supervisor very much is your boss. They can also drop you from the programme.
@@thomasp4902 Sometimes true, although depends on the university system and funding. At my university funding is awarded to the student not the supervisor, although your supervisor could definitely cause trouble for you if they wanted.
@@constancellc Most unis award it to the student not the supervisor, but the uni will stop awarding you the money if the supervisor says you are useless!
At a job you make money
"PhDs are hard. Agreed
Recently I watch movies/tv shows where some people say they have more than 1 phd, I don't say "man that person is smart". I say "Man, that person's hardworking".
I know right i was so confused when some of these people say they have 3 phds and they are in their early 30s and i would think how did they manage to do it so quick
Both imo
A guy with 7 PhDs being Hulk makes so much sense
My suggestion is: if you have a rich family to support you, then academic is a very good choice. If you have to support a family, then it is bad choice.
Purely our of curiosity, do you mean that a bad choice for financially surviving it, or bad choice because you won't have the most comfortable life?
@@brightsideguy8700 I would say both. It is pretty suffering when wife and kids expect to have a stable life, while husband have to be drifting around the world to find the next postdoc position like a begger.
@@xuhan1981v Ahh. What about the PhD people who don't have a kid or wife/husband?
BrightSideGuy That is exactly the first situation that I mentioned. You have a family to support you.
@@xuhan1981v not necessarily. I know a lot of PhD students who have no kid, husband/wife, and pay for themselves using the funding provided by their program or working a job.
Meaning they do a PhD without a rich family supporting them, or without a family of their own to support.
I like how you structured the pros between the cons! It made the video tone a lot more neutral and easier to digest -- videos that throw all the cons at the end make the overall thing sound too negative, and vice-versa with the pros.
(needless to say, the content itself was all very helpful too!)
So true. It also reflects how life is. There are ups and downs in everything, including a doctorate.
I'm currently doing a physics PhD, finishing my first year... and frankly, I'm continuously considering quitting it for several months now.
Basically, all of the cons Simon mentions her kind of coincide in my project, at least it feels that way:
I have gradually lost the interest in the research field I'm in, the funding of my supervisor isn't secured (meaning I would possibly work without any guiding throughout my 2nd and 3rd years), when I'm doing experimental work I put in insane working hours (at least that's what I think) and I'm totally torn between performing well in my PhD and providing for a family.
So basically worst case. And still, the worst for me are the working hours.
It still puzzles me that you put in 50 - 70 hours a week, and instead of denouncing these circumstances, academia has kind of tricked people to say that it is part of the "PhD experience" or (to cite Simon) that "a PhD is hard".
Sure a PhD is hard, but it should be hard because it is intelectually demanding, not because you're working yourself to death.
But this is just me ranting, because I'm frustrated again :/
Good god..
I hope you are doing well.
Really think about it. Ignoring these feelings and completing my PhD is my biggest regret. Now I'm just a graduate with a degree who's confusee but everyone tells to shut up and deal, should have gotten out earlier if I didn't like it. It's so alienating, I feel like my work is worthless and wont change anything, I'm constantly slaving away alone while years pass, I barely remember the feeling of being outside for relaxing walks, I am always stressed, idk if I'll ever have time to start a family... just really think l through if it's worth finishing.
I'm about halfway through writing my dissertation at the moment. My first year was a whirlwind and it wasn't until about halfway through my second year, nearly the start of my third when i realized I didn't want to be in academia and having a PhD isn't as valuable as experience in the field I work in, but being nearly halfway it seemed like finishing made the most sense because I did have funding to do so. I'll be finishing, and I suppose I'm glad of that, but honestly, I wish I hadn't bothered to do a PhD. To be fair, this knowledge is with the hindsight of the PhD experience, so I couldn't have been so sure back then because I didn't know what would come of these past two years... In any event, if you're in your first year and already doubting it, you need to really consider why you're doing it because it really does take everything you have to write it up and finish at the end when you're depressed and feel like it was a pointless effort with very little pay off. You need to be committed to finish.
I have a similiar situation, where I worked hard for several years to earn the opportunity to carry a PhD and bring my family along. Years do not pass in vain, and I agree with you, your family is the biggest source of motivation, but at the same time your biggest distraction. One financial problem, or a kid getting sick can wreck your schedule for weeks. And we need to be in "the zone" to start producing original knowledge for our thesis. Wish you luck and success, do not despair.
Heinz Heinz in contrast to the other replies here. I’m 1.5 years into my PhD and the second half of my first year was terrible. I didn’t feel like I was getting anywhere and considered quitting for several months. I think definitely have something else lined up if you’re going to leave. But personally I think it gets better. I’m feeling great about it now and everything is going really well - very glad I didn’t drop it.
The dean of research at my uni described doing a PhD as riding a roller coaster with a blindfold on. And I can definitely feel that.
Very relatable! In my undergrad I routinely overworked myself and never bothered to attend any social events. Quite frankly, in the end I was plagued with a feeling of isolation and my undergrad ended up being an unexciting experience.
Once I got in the PhD program, I was determined to make amends. So I got involved with a martial arts club (always wanted to learn karate!). This has made my university experience not only fun, but it also provides a welcome distraction from all the academic hustle and bustle.
My advisor's boyfriend did a social psych PhD and ended up contracting with the government due to the coding he had to learn for his PhD. They really do open up more doors than you might expect.
'Course the government want social psychologists --- how else are they going to keep us brainwashed into believing we live in a democracy?
@@TheRABIDdude ok then...
TheRABIDdude You just can’t be happy for a person can you
psych PhD = PsyD, or PhD in psychology?
so what got him job is coding, not phd
As a PhD candidate, I agree with all of the points that you've made in this video! I think it's essential to stress that a PhD at times can be a really lonely place to be as many people around you really just can't comprehend what you spend your time doing. I am lucky that I have an excellent supervisory team, but I'd also stress that you make sure that you can work with any potential supervisor before accepting any PhD it's such a unique and crucial relationship! All of that being said it's an incredible thing to do and if after this video you still want to pursue a PhD then absolutely go for it!
Craig B YES🙏🏾
Hi Simon , thank you so much! I am going to start my PhD in Neuroscience this fall 2020. Your video is amazing and truly inspiring! Im sharing this video to my friends! Love from the Philippines
how is it going so far?
Thanks for this video, Simon! It's really good to have someone to talk to you about these things.
I’m just finishing my PhD in history (submitting this week 🎉) and a lot of these things hold true in the humanities too. For me the biggest thing is the contribution to knowledge - it’s incredible what you achieve by the end of it. 😀 I would say that relationships with supervisors and others tend to be quite different in my discipline: my supervisor was incredibly hands-off in terms of telling me what to do and when. I saw her every 2-3 months, maybe 20 times total over the whole five years (I did mine part time), and it was generally just for a chat about my thinking, where I was at in my intellectual process etc. That suited me because I started as a mature student with 10 years of work experience in my field and was happy to project manage myself but I know it’s not for everyone. Anyway, I’m rambling! I’ve loved watching your PhD videos, even though we’re in such different fields.
Congrats on finishing! And thank you for the thoughtful comment
This helped reinforce my drive toward pursuing mine. Working on my master's currently, PhD TBA! :)
Ph. D. in pure math here. Be sure to be affiliated with a decent research team/laboratory in terms of publications quantity and quality, because, if not, you will end unemployed for a long period of time, not even will be accepted in a postdoc position, and you will hate yourself for that happening after all your colossal effort. This is a good advice for all fields but especially for people doing pure math because for such specialties, it is hard to enter the industry with your Ph. D.
Hey I might consider studying pure maths as well. My Father did a Ph. D. in it too. I was just interested in the Topic your Ph. D. was about and your experience with the studies.
why would someone need laboratory for math? Thanks.
@@Hussein_Nur I believe he's talking about a PhD in general
Integrative Neuroscience here. Agreed! I'm in a teaching position, but still do research to stay viable. No one warned me about the need to crank out the pubs and know what you are studying in grad school may limit your opportunities in the future if you want to change programs of study.
UMD and UMBC have cyber security research labs that I am going to try to go for during my Masters in Cyber Security!
I am finishing my MSc Computer Science and looking forward to apply to PhD. Surely, you have been an inspiration Simon! Thank you!
Have you done the PHD?
would love to hear an update
I am doing my PhD in Plant Ecology, and I must say having supervisors you get along with really makes this degree less daunting. Even though it is extremely stressful and hard trying to complete your PhD during the COVID-19 pandemic. So many plans and deadlines have been shifted which further adds to the anxiety. My PhD is experiment-based which requires me to be at the University. Luckily I am due to submit my thesis next year so hopefully, I will be able to recover the time lost.
Wishing you all the best! You've got this!
Good luck
How it is going?
update?
At 16:00
Cons: 1. Less income while enrolled in PhD
2. Being tied to your Supervisor
3. PhDs are Hard Work
4. Pigeon-Holed
5. Isolating
Pros: 1. Flexibility
2. Ability to travel
3. Improve Skills
4. Contribute to field
5. Uni mk II
I did my PhD in a medical science area and I enjoyed it a lot and thought it was a, if not the, most effective way to learn certain things at a short time considering the time pressure and expectation to make it great. Thanks for sharing your experience.
this video was soooooooo needed right now, i am majoring in physics currently at the third year of bachelor
Sourabh Mittal Cheers!
Selma I’m in second year!!Where do you study?
@@nicolarossi8728 at a random university of Albania... nothing interesting actually... :/
@@selma-1998 what program are you following?
@@giovannip8600 3 years bachelor then probably professional master
0:39 REALLY?! Damn, I thought it was the same as in Belgium...Here we get stipends that are actually way above the average people's paygrade... I'm talking nearly 2000 euro net salary! I'm currently doing a PhD in Biomedical Sciences, and with 5 years prior working experience I receive even more... I made a video about it on my channel, so welcome to check that out. Also welcome to ask any questions on doing a PhD in Belgium by the way. Furthermore, great list of pro/con, Simon. I think you covered it fully!
Hey man ! Just came accross your channel. Really good videos, can relate a lot to it. I did a PhD in condensed matter theory in Paris. I think it is worth stressing out more than you get a LOT of different, valuable skills doing a phD. Now I am running a start-up and I think doing a PhD taught me how to run a very difficult project with no clear sight of the near future, yet still be able to make decisions.
A video on conferences would be super interesting!
See EGU video series in playlist
I watched this before I applied for a PhD and I know it helped me make a choice which was right for me!
I'm now 4 months in, admittedly never expected to start in a pandemic and it's so tough and isolating but I wouldn't do anything else.
3 months into mine and I'm absolutely loving it!
Not only meet who you expect to be your supervisor, make sure you would be comfortable working for at least 3 supervisors at the institution. Professors switch schools, funding falls through, you can develop a completely toxic relationship with your adviser. Having a backup is good.
Only in my second year, but an additional pro I'd suggest is the wealth of knowledge you get by pursuing your degree. This is probably something like the intersection of flexibility and transferable skills. Still, so far, learning so much (and mastering a variety of material) in such a small amount of time has been extremely rewarding for me.
My biggest fear would be the lack of commitment. I do like to read and analyze, but once I’m forced to do that (in academic settings), I panic then shutdown. Not to mention the distraction, which is equally frightening. I mean, just holding your cellphone may lead to hours of wasting precious time. The other fear would be the viva/defense. I didn’t do the defense during my MA studies, and we had to submit a project in each course instead. Always dreaded public speaking, I get hyperventilating when I see TH-cam videos of PhD candidates defending their theses. Sigh.
Viva is just like a long project demo or Q&A with 3 people, so it's not really public at least in the UK. I'm sure you would do fine.
Also you will be defending something you invested your time and energy for approximately 3-4 years and you already would have to give presentations before fellow academics and peers so don't think too much
I also have the public speaking issue
Think of it as great opportunity to overcome your fear and develop your skills. Learning process is supposed to put us out of our comfort zone. Wish you the best of luck!
"OMG!! You need a hug!! *HUGZZ!!*"
I am so happy I found this video (and your channel) 3 years after it's uploaded
I just turned down a PhD position because after meeting with my potential supervisor, and speaking to my previous masters advisor, it wasn't the right fit for me. Right project, but wrong research group/supervisor situation. A recommendation I received from a few professors who helped advise me on the situation was to avoid any PhD arrangement where the supervisor position is shared, especially if there's a geographic distance it can be really challenging. This can at times happen, depending on how the funding works sometimes or if there are two people who work together and are taking on a PhD student together.
Very nice info Simon. Those cons always haunt my planning procedures, i still havent started PhD. But the thrill of leaving behind a Study for future generations - thats a motivation.
You are spot on with everything you said. I would add, as someone who did a lab-based Ph.D., that you can still have a lot of flexibility if you are careful. It meant working at odd times, but I was able to do things like chaperone my youngest son's school field trips, pick him up from school every day (then bring him back to the lab to do homework), etc.
As someone on the home stretch (handing in in April next yr) I can say the biggest challenge is also the biggest pro - developing from a scared new grad who has no idea what they are doing to a confident, almost -standing-on-their-own-feet researcher. In saying that, with only 4 months to go and essentially my whole thesis to write up, I am low key terrified 😅
Hi there !
Thanks for sharing your personal experiences about doing a PhD especially in the U.K. I truly understand you as I've been doing my second year of PhD at one of the UK's universities and all the sudden my supervisors started having problems with me and my given ideas, (it seemed like they weren't satisfied with what they did to me) plus those they've put me in a tremendous financial situation!!! (as an international student I've been told to be a self-funded student) ... anyway since then I have started having some health issues until I've gave up my PhD and left UK and went back home. After couple of months I start applying to North American universities as their conditions for graduate international students are brilliant and most importantly you have more chance to choose your fitted research group and supervisor than in the U.K. . In my opinion, doing a PhD genuinely depends on your ability to do research, the topic you're interested in (you know what you're doing and why) and how to cope with the stress and pressure during your work with groups of UG students, experts and professors in your field of research or in an academic environment. I did have the feeling that I've been left behind the doors because of my nationality and ethnicity out there but thanks God I'll not experience the same feelings again as before.
🙏🏼
Waiting to watch more useful videos of you on TH-cam!!!
Cheers xx
So have you pursued your PhD in the US and completed it?
@@mezbahuddin2751 I'm doing my PhD in Canada! The path that I'm going through here is totally different from what I've been through back in time.
@@christ9781 How do you feel about your current PhD experience? Is it better than the last one?
@@Manu-jc2sx here in Canada doing a PhD is like doing a master degree but in a long run. For the first year you have to pass required courses (with midterm and finals) and then pass comprehensive exam which for me those ones are way tougher and difficult than what they're expecting from me back in the UK.
So in general,a PhD in North America is more theoretically and scientifically stronger (especially in my field antenna/RF and electromagnetics)than in the UK.
Yes, please do a video about conferences! They are currently a huge somewhat scary mystery to me!
He has. See his playlist
Entering the second year of my MSc right now. I love the work I'm doing and my supervisors are great (even if one is always away for conferences) and I can't wait to start applying for and hopefully beginning my PhD in 2020. Just discovered your channel and I look forward to going through your PhD vlogs.
Pro number 4 outweighs everything else on the list. I'm very thrilled to know that finding new things are a common thing in PhD.
Truly enjoyed your video Simon, you got a new subscriber.
I am a PhD in Germany. To be honest, my money situation is very good ! I think it really depends where you do it and in which city you live ! But in Berlin, I have a rather nice situation :)
@Luc Earth Arbeitest du denn nebenbei? Und wenn ja wie viel?
Which school and program?
Yep, europe is much more better
Thank you for imparting those words of wisdom, "Modern Times OGs." For example as I stated (above) there is a difference between doing ANY level of education in the U.S. as compared to Europe. Those whom I have spoken to who are PHd/Doctoral students in Europe, tell me that there is a more relaxed approach on how to get things accomplished, and a more dedicated approach when it comes to mentorship.
Great job - I think you hit a lot of the key points. One big con though (although, maybe for some it's a pro) is that you often have little choice over where you live post-PhD if you're staying in academia. Jobs in academia are limited, and so there's limited choice in location. So, if you're a person that is dedicated to living in one particular place, academia can be a challenging career. Academics must be willing to move.
Don't stay in academia. If you want to become a lecturer then go into industry and come back, you'll rise faster that way too. In engineering this is really common, a lot of the most valuable staff only have an MEng.
@@thomasp4902 To be fair, this is more practical in some disciplines that others. Engineering, Economics, Business, probably even literature or history .... there you can develop your CV in ways that are equally appealing to universities compared to staying in academia. In contrast, I'm an ecologist and I'd essentially give up on a tenure track position if I stopped doing research. Having experience as a practitioner doesn't always carry the same weight as a consistent record of academic publications, unfortunately.
@@InvasiveWargaming It's not really worth getting tenure IMO. It's just a long, slow, low paid road to a fairly disappointing destination. Anyone on PhD should get out before their post doc. A masters student in the UK is looking at £70k of debt from 4 years of study which is double the pre-tax salary of a junior lecturer. By the time you get tenure you'll probably be sick of Uni and research anyway.
Cool video. I hope you recover from any stress leftover from the PhD. I am doing a lot of work in coding too here in TCD, Ireland. You sound like a confident friend all of the sudden 😊. Thanks a 1M.
(from the USA, where science PhDs are typically 5-6 years) I've been talking to a lot of my undergraduate professors about getting a PhD. One thing that has really stuck with me is that one of them told me that a PhD will fundamentally change who you are and how you think (or, at least, they believe a PhD done right should have this effect). You need to be ready to lose old friends, especially friends who aren't getting a PhD, too, because (1) you will not have time for them and they might not fully understand why, (2) you will change so much so fast that you might find you no longer click with them. I've also been recommended to go away for a PhD. That is, do NOT get a PhD at a school near your hometown.
@Luan Santos sometimes it is and not just friends... I broke up a 5 year relationship during my 2nd year
The longer I stayed with my PhD, the more I lost friends FROM the PhD programs. They weren't...AWFUL people...but they also weren't good people. Everyone was constantly playing this passive-aggressive game to probe who was the smartest. During social events they always wanted to complain about their research, or their students if they were teaching. And many had undeveloped social skills.
The funny part is that I was a lot like them at the start, and the more I spent time with them, the more I realized that this was not the person I wanted to be. Even today, I pick up a subtle superiority complex from many people who have gotten their PhD. It's a very "I'm above that" attitude.
@@logangantner3863 I saw this one comic drawn by some PhD guy where he complained about how dumb undergraduates are... that really pissed me off tbh. One of the worst traits someone can have as a human being is a superiority complex
@@flubadubdubthegreat1272 Oh yeah, comparing undergrads to babies or idiots is standard PhD student affair. If the program requires PhD students to be TAs, this gets intensified even more.
When I started teaching for the first time, I realized quickly that I needed to drop my "I'm the smartest" ego and focus on getting everyone to the level they needed to be. But so many of the guys in my position never did this. When we would grade exams together, they couldn't stop talking about how dumb their students are. Like...do they think that attitude isn't going to come through in their teaching?
@@logangantner3863 "Even today, I pick up a subtle superiority complex from many people who have gotten their PhD. It's a very "I'm above that" attitude."
To be fair, with a PhD it is hard NOT to develop a slight "superiority complex" when you realize that most people don't have decent critical thinking, problem solving ability, and communication skills (especially for complex topics). Typically the more educated a person is the easier it is to recognize ignorance, stupidity, and terrible logic. Since PhD's are a minority in the population they constantly encounter people, with these traits, who essentially stopped developing intellectually DURING high school. Sure, some people self study outside of formal education, but for the majority that requires more time and effort than they are willing to spend or able to in their daily lives.
Y'all better remember my name, in a few years I will be referred to as Dr. Blixøen-Olsen
@kimi Your loss
@kimi lololol
Cool?
YES DADDY GO FOR IT
Eyy yes same!! Dr Chivers. What field are you in?
Pros and that is the coolest thing :- contributing to human knowledge
I agree on everything said in this video, I'm now a PhD and I got the same problems as I think for all people during their PhD, doing a PhD is difficult especially mentally, but at the end it is a exceptional experience and may give you many skills for the next steps in life.
He went from: “I’ll bring your daughter home by 9pm
To
“She calls me doctor now”
Nice video. I am defending my PhD thesis (evolutionary ecology) next month. My experiences are mostly biased toward the 'pros' side. I really enjoyed doing it, had a nice supervisor and although at times it was physically knackering (long days in the field, 7 days a week for weeks on end) as well as intelectually discouraging ("I am not smart enough to pull this particular part off"), I found it, on the whole, a pleasant ride. So yes, I don't think people should let themselves be discouraged by horror stories.
The only thing I hated was the feeling I was constantly having from the last months onward that I was getting myself ready for a plunge into a pit, the academic trap. "If I stay in science, where will I need to move next (and what about my social life) and for how long will it last? What comes after that? And if I leave academia, who on earth would want to have me? I'm just an ecologist with some R coding experience; what do I have to bring to the table?"
As it turns out, these fears are not totally unrealistic. I found a job in academia, though, that sort of guarantees stability, but the uncertainty was killig me and I know many ex-PhD colleagues (yes, colleagues, as a PhD is a reasonably well-paid job where I'm from) that are struggling with the same issues.
My final verdict: I am glad I did a PhD since it was a life goal I had to achieve and it brought me where I wanted (so far). Yet, if anyone asked my advice as to whether or not to do a PhD, I would tell them to seriously consider whether it's something they really want to do. Obviously if you don't care too much about the scientific phylosophy and publishing papers and what not, by all means go for the industry jobs straight away -- this will be a much safer path toward job security!
Cheers
Trying to find a PhD specializing in Ornithology, under any of the Ecology and Evolution labs. Any tips on finding one?
@@paulpop3498 Hey, I'm not sure I have any concrete tips. What I can tell you is that I did my master's research project at the same institute and in that way made it easier for myself to get the position eventually. So make sure people know you and your work (a publication also helps). And always keep your eyes open! As for labs to look at: I'm not sure where you're from but in the UK the Edward Grey Inst (Oxford) springs to mind, as well University of Edinburgh or Aberdeen (I'm not from the UK so I don't know them all by heart). Outside UK there's plenty good labs across (western) Europe. As for US: no clue.
Good luck!
Thanks! I have started query mails. A few of them have responded but, none positive (eg: retired, no current funding and no current position available). I have published, and in the process publishing more. Will give a look at the Institutes you mentioned.
I am from India. So, it's a bit more difficult for me, applying outside.
@@paulpop3498 What may be useful is to approach someone with research ideas and propose to write a grant proposal together. Getting into a lab with your own ideas and a bag of money is usually easier than just asking them to hire you. The obvious downside is, of course, getting the money in the first place!
For me, it was simply an opportunity to do something I love for a few more years and possibly make a career out of it. The fact that I got funding meant that someone was PAYING me to do something I loved. As I live at home I don't have the same financial constraints as many PhD students, but even so when I think about how I would have felt doing some boring job I don't care about, the PhD seemed incredible by comparison.
The mental health issues are definitely a big thing. I felt that even through my Masters research. Possibly the most important issue mentioned here. Your mental health will probably suffer at some point during a PhD, and it can be a real struggle to look after yourself. So you have to make sure you have people who care about you to help you keep on track with that and remind you to go outside into the sunshine once in a while :)
Also very weird to finally be doing a PhD after watching your videos as an MA student and taking your advice!
Thank you Kanye, very cool
I’m currently in my 3rd year of undergrad studying math. I’d love to go into a PhD program after I graduate mostly because of pro #4. It is my dream to contribute something original to human knowledge
This is a great video, I am almost at the end of my MA suppose to have my Thesis but Covid came... man, I am thrilled to take on the challenge of PhD :)
Wow. I totally relate to this! I have become a hypochondriac towards the end of my PhD. This is such a great video!
Arturo Aguirre I’m agoraphobic at the end stage of my program, lack of support
Man, such a great poster you've got there! Iron within, iron without!
My PhD felt like it embodied the quote "if you gaze into the abyss, the abyss gazes also into you".
PhD eroded my mental health in many ways. One point you missed is that you're going to fail, quite a lot. For many doing a PhD like myself, you're a high achiever who has never failed before. Research is risky and a lot of what you try doesn't work out.
When you combine having to experience failure for the first time, while being totally isolated (by definition you're doing something no one else has done before, so you quickly reach a point where if you don't know the answer no one does), it can feel incredibly dark. You add stress of being poor and the constant tick of your stipend date running out, I'm honestly surprised I made it through.
I grew a lot from the experience, but I don't think it was a healthy way to achieve that growth.
Yes learning that I too can fail hit me like a brick wall haha. I needed that lesson though.
I’m doing my masters in Shakespeare right now and thinking about applying to my PhD next year. Even though your area is worlds away from mine this is super handy and informative !
You have been an inspiration to so many people hoping to go for physics, engineering and computer science. Kudos! The PhD is just the cherry on the top, the sundae that you worked on all this while (being an excellent science communicator) should totally not be overlooked!
I get so much inspiration from your videos. I feel a similar way about my undergraduate experience as you do. I’m currently working on getting into graduate school for physics and looking forward to the “second chance” at university. It’s exciting hearing about how graduate school rewarded you. Hopefully it’s as rewarding for me!
Ha, I love the "To do calculate " shirt in the back. That error in your original draft was hilarious.
Thank you for this video from somebody that did their undergraduate degree in classical literature and civilisations (stuff about Ancient Greece and Rome etc.) and is half way through their conversion masters to computer science. I am not really sure what I am going to do yet but you have definitely given me more insight into the idea of a phd.
I HAVE to stretch the short-touch of the mental health issues during a PhD. When I tried a PhD the first-time around, I almost committed suicide. It is not something you want. Admittedly yes, I've had bad mental health since I were a young child, and yes I have several mental problems, but to prove you must be weary of this, I went and did it again after 2 years and I got it, with no corrections. You have to be aware that if you don't think about this problem, you probably will get it. You have to focus on living life, and never putting your work over your life.
Yeah, I think self care is extremely important and not many supervisors are able to recognise warning signs, or equipped to deal with them. I got Bell's Palsy twice from stress during my masters. Decided academia was not a viable career choice for me at that time. Managed to graduate, but retired my academic aspirations after my Masters.
excellent information. very natural and comprehensive coverage of both sides. thank you.
Been doing an PhD in biochemistry and decided to master out. Thought this vid would help me feel better about it, but just pointed out how badly I failed.
Those dong PhDs in the sciences, I hope you're doing better than I am. I wish you all the best.
Don't feel bad about it. Of course, I assume you will have heard, "Well, it's not for everyone," often enough, so I'll spare you. I will say, however, that a masters is still very, VERY, admirable, I will be happy to make it through my bachelors program, much more so would I be with a masters. (Allow me to be pretentious,) I agree with Aristotle, happiness is the only true end, for which there are many viable means.
Perhaps my experience is different. I am in Grad school now but doing a Masters, I've decided to stop after a Masters due to the exact financial reasons you state. The earning rates between a Masters graduate and a PhD graduate at least here in Canada are not statistically significant (Ref: Stats Can). I am also a mature student (I'm on average 5-10 years older than the average PhD student), so my timelines and objectives are way different than those late 20s early 30s. I just want to graduate, get a job and enjoy life, I'm personally really tired of late nights studying or writing when I know that in the private sector, after 4pm I am free.
I started as a PhD student and then left after 5 semesters with my Master's to go do just that!
Great video, Simon! Watched from start to finish and found it all very insightful and inspiring. Thank you for being honest about the cons. Very valuable to hear. Hoping you do make a video on academic conferences!
I'm currently in 1st year of phd in organic chemistry and the best part is my Supervisor is so cool😋
cool like do whatever at your own time and I hope you do it well with less supervision cool or checking your progress and not cancelling appointments cool?
I'm interested doing a phd in the same field, where are you doing yours?
You are so cool
Good luck with you nothing but the best xxx
Awesome, chemistry is such a fascinating subject. When it gets hard remember your love for chemistry and the reasons you pursued it. Good luck!
Great video, Simon. My viva is going to be next week Friday so I am pretty much at the end of my PhD journey (Uni of Exeter, too!). I agree with all of your pros and cons. I definitely loved the flexibility and now that I decided to leave academia, I am having a hard time finding a position where I can work for something I am passionate about and also have my freedom. Oh yes, and PhDs are definitely pigeon-holed and this makes changing careers even harder, but I know that I have really good transferable skills so I'm going to find my way. :)
Congratulations on your journey! This comment was almost a year ago so I am interested to know how you did in leaving academia.
I plan on going back for mine. Of course I'm going to take 3-4 year pause, however to expand my experience in the field.. I have a terminal degree in my field, so I can do a lot with a Masters. I'm still under 30, so I believe I have a lot of time to flesh out practice skills and build my portfolio.
Phillip Moses what does a terminal degree mean
The best talk on taking PhD . This deserves another doctrate , sir.
curious hearing about simon's experience of experienced vs novice supervisors.
my experience was that novice supervisors see "getting their student to the finishing line" as a huge tick on their CV and are therefore very hands-on.
experienced supervisors take the view of "hey, i don't need this. graduate, don't graduate - it's all the same to me"
2:02 do what you love without fear of money. When you dive into your passions with your career, money will always find its way to you. Also, comparison is the thief of joy. If you look at your friends in undergrad or somewhere else and compare, you are setting yourself up for emotional hardship. March to the beat of your own drum and never allow discouragement to rule you
I'm defending mine in a month! I agree with most everything you say. If I still feel inspired when its over, I'll make my first video describing my experience doing a PhD at Oregon State University in the USA.
Update: I PASSED!!!!
@@corygarms5871Congrats 🎉
love your videos, Simon. This was very helpful for me.
I'm in my first year PhD and I don't seem to handle stressing over everything 😭😭 good job Simon
I'm sure you are doing really well. If you are worried just write an A4 page of all your small and medium achievements :)
@@thomasp4902 that's brilliant, I'll do that thanks 😍
Take a piece of paper and a pen and then write everything you need to do something about. I mean everything personal, potential, small, big, everything. Aim to write about 200 items, don't try to plan it, just get it out of your head. This will clear out some space in your head to breathe.
Then you can start planning these things writing out all the steps you need to take to achieve each thing. Your anxiety likely stems from your braining feeling like you have all these threads you haven't thought about enough.
I would suggest reading Getting Things Done, I hate productivity blah blah but seriously the methodology in the book is extremely effective. It helped me out of crying my eyes out every day. lol
Nour İman Good luck! Wish you nothing but the best!
@@thomasp4902 this has helped me cope with Phd stress
Very well sumarized and you really thougt about many aspects!
Simon! your explanations are great. Cheers from a fellow academic.
Many thanks for your brilliant insights Dr. Simon! Keep slaying 💯💯💯
Then once you're done, you can go for round 2 - Postdoc! Actually I'm very happy about this, it's like doing a PhD over again except with much less self-doubt and no thesis due. Somehow my health doesn't seem to be doing much better! I took a lot of years, I had a very flexible and busy supervisor (and started on a topic which I think was pretty poor) - I think largely this is a result.
I really appreciate your discussion of mental health elements. I myself am considering a PhD but worried my mental health conditions will boil over too much or too often to succeed in it. My own girlfriend, 3/4 years into her PhD just got diagnosed with her own mental health conditions. However, you paint a much more perceivable angle to think it over as less of a threat. Thanks!
I can only speak from experience but it helps if you are a bit obsessive. You have to live with something specialised for a few years and possibly the rest of your career. It also really helps if you have a stable close relationship
Well done, as a fellow PhD candidate I can say you have succinctly described the experience. We have so much in common. I also developed the same breathing problem during my PhD. The only one I couldn't relate with is travelling. I have never traveled on academic grounds in my PhD, which I'll admit is highly unusual.
Thanks for this video. I have been working for government doing earth science research for six years. I have increasingly realized that to continue progressing and eventually run my own lab, I need a PhD. I do indeed love research science and adding to human knowledge in my field. But unfortunately, I have anxiety issues and I'm daunted by the time commitment, sacrafices, and financial implications of starting grad school. Videos like yours at least help me think things through.
Altho not doing a PhD and didn't even finish my UnderGrad in Pure Maths, I started my own business. After a while, I started having head spins from overthinking, and information overload, analysis, sifting, sorting, etc. And then I would go to work, with my head spinning, and continue with the research while at work, go home with a head spin, and then do my business stuff, and start the "doing part", and the next day, my head is till is spinning. This lasted a whole month. And I have had it several times since, yet not for a whole month. Maybe 1-2 days at a time. I spoke with one of my customers who was doing her PhD and asked her if she ever gets heads spins and she said, yeah often and sometimes will sit in front of the keyboard for 45 minutes with so many ideas and not having written anything. So ppl, solopreneurs go thru very similar things and we work 18 hour days, and for long periods of time, and just like a PhD, can last 2-3-4 years. Sheer persistence and dedication are key. No wonder there are so few "successful" ppl out there.
I have dealt with psychosomatic breathing problems in my undergrad years doing my honors thesis. Now I’ve been getting them back again while applying to grad school. I have an interview at a prestigious university next month for one of their PhD programs and it’s stressing me out.
Hi Simon,
would you please make a video about how to overcome mental health problems during PhD? It would be very helpful
cocaine helps
Kind of shocked at how many people say getting a PhD sucks/is bad for your mental health, etc.. I did my MD and eventually went back and got my PhD....I was always amazed at how many people were so consistently negative during the entire process. It's hard don't get me wrong, but it's not any harder than a demanding full time job (minus the pay I guess). I would actually argue it's a lot easier than a demanding full time job. I feel a lot of my colleagues and people struggle so much is because most have never had a full time work experience prior to getting their PhD.
Best advise I heard my advisor tell a student was "no one is making you be here". A PhD should be a fun thing to do because you want to do it. If you don't like it then simply leave if you think that will make you happier.
if you have no time to watch the whole video --> 15:56
It's so true that your PhD is tied to the aptitude and attitude of your supervisor. My partner had to switch his PhD supervisor because that person was unavailable for feedback and input all...the...time. As soon as he switched, there was an immediate acceleration and quality improvement in the dissertation project.
I agree so much with the "being tied to your supervisor" con.
My supervisor is a nice guy, but we just don't work well together. 90% of the time I think I would work better alone / with other collaborators :/
Btw, the video was great. Very good summary of pros and cons. The only thing bugging me, is that I think my supvisor is a net negative to my project. If I could have all the pros (and cons), but just not be tied to my supervisor, I would be much happier with it
Entertaining and informative. Reminded me of doing my own PhD 40 yrs ago.
What was your PhD thesis on?
A Ph.D. in psychology in my country requires 60units of coursework, a written comprehensive exam, 700 to 1000 hours of internship, and a dissertation. Some students spend nearly 10years to graduate.
Good video Simon! Deffo agree with flexibility as a pro and being tied to your supervisor as a pro or con.
I'm in the process of looking for places to do my PhD in history. Luckily it allows me to study/work in most places
Very well presented as always. Great video
Also a pro: Your PhD project may be for something that doesn't have enough money to be funded as an actual job but is important in helping people.
E.g. research about the enviornment, conservation, health, social issues, psychology, forensics, engineering, especially in developing or poorer areas.
Our uni only helps with the cost of going to conferences for full time instructors. No help for MS or PhD students. We couldn’t even afford to go to a conference 10 kms from us because the ticket cost a few hundred bucks.
Yasemin BAHAR couldn’t you have walked
It's great until you get to the dissertation part!
My eldest is in 2nd year undergrad, experienced her first year experience full of covid/lockdowns/restrictions. She did an unpaid internship with the uni after first year, and got some good calculations for a project in DUNE for her supervisor. This is one of the reasons why she wants to do a phd. She loves the idea of a project and making it her own. It sounds like lots of hours per week, so when she does go into it, I will remember this video and remind her to have a little bit of fun along the way. Whether thats sport, or going out for that pub quiz.
I feel like you summed up my Master's program. And if the PhD is more difficult...no thanks. So I'm very appreciative for this video!
Brian Kelly truly depends on where you go and who the advisor is they make or break you
@@mikalbrown3227 Thanks for the info! I have been asked to apply for a full scholarship PhD, but I'm not too into the subject. It'd be awesome to be called Dr. Brian, but not worth the years of stress. Cheers!
Con: back in 1992 through 98 I made about 9k per year as a stipend while living in an expensive area in NY. Was very hard to survive and needed student loans to finish. Sounds like the stipend in the UK is much better. It's hard to spend your youth poor while your friends who didn't go for PhDs are buying cars and houses and so on. But, the payoff is the flexibility and privilege to do really interesting work and to teach at university. It's a huge delay of gratification, but I'm glad I did it.
I’m getting my PhD in clinical psychology and some of these don’t apply. I have flexibility but that HAS to be filled with research/publications, and I have to go into the clinic and see clients.