PIMO elder: "I want to exit live on stage"
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 6 ต.ค. 2024
- (Voicemail no. 199) A Jehovah's Witness elder whose faith has long since collapsed seeks feedback on his idea of timing his exit to coincide with a public talk in which he would lay bare the flaws and abuses of the organization before his congregation.
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I have actually seen an elder do this during a Sunday talk. He was always a great speaker and everyone loved his talks. He was always thought as very strong in the so called truth. No one had any clue he was no longer strong. He came on the platform gave a great talk and then just before he finished he went on about why he was struggling with his beliefs and said goodbye. Never saw him or his family again until about 20 years later. I met him again on a Ex JW chat room. His sons are now scientists and happy. It's very brave to do this.
The other elders didn’t try to remove him from the platform? I guess I would just assume they would.
Look forward to hearing his story after he breaks free.
I’m so happy to hear that more and more are waking up and getting ready to leave the organization. I’m happy for this brother to finally be able to live the life he chooses and wants. He doesn’t
have to slave anymore for 9 imperfect men in New York ❤ I hope his wife will join him!!
I wonder how many like him there are.
Probably more than we realize.
Me too because I probably wouldn’t want to date someone who was “all in.”
Lots
They will never let him last 5 minutes into his reasons before "they" escort him off stage. He better talk fast!
😂
Subtlety will be key during the talk. Make it seem like any other public talk for as long as you can. Make sure to use the scriptures to explain your doubts as much as you can. Speak in the third person. "Let's say someone you know and love says or thinks this." In the end reveal that someone is you. Please record and post it.
So sorry for that brother! But he will make it! Great advice Lloyd! Much love to all pimo elders! I truly feel for you💕💖🎈🍾
What a religion. You gotta fear leaving. Sounds like a cult to me. And they always say you’re crazy if you leave.
Professionals that study groups use the BITE model to determine if something is a cult.
Do they control:
BEHAVIOR?
INFORMATION?
THOUGHTS?
EMOTIONS?
It is a cult.
They would turn off the mike and label him apostate
It kinda depends honestly.
That’s so sad.
Technically, being labeled “apostate” is not that simple. He is disassociating. Although it does kinda depend; people will say what they say.
I want to be a fly on the wall when this talk occurs. Seriously though, wishing this gentleman the very best.
Great call and great answer Lloyd. I’ve actually seen something like this on someone’s youtube…the only problem with the talk was that during the last portion of it - someone got wise to it and they muted his mic. Always be ready for that - I think paranoia runs high in JW group lately so expect that to happen. Godspeed! Please let us know how it worked out or have someone record it.
Carefully and respectfully is 100% right - the moment things get heated or crazy they will just think you're come under "Satan's control" and fingers in the ears.
In my case, though a JW for more than 30 yrs but now a bit faded, I never had any desire or inclination or any interest whatsoever in "reaching out" as they say, to a position of MS or Elder. Many do of course like climbing the spiritual corporate ladder. The thing about JWs is that they claim a unity of thought and purpose and say this is a manifestation of christian love. However what they fail to say is that it is the disciplining regime of disfellowshipping and shunning that keeps them "unified"- so it really fear that unites them but they convince themselves that its love. Of course many , many JWs are very genuine and honest loving people and would not behave the way "worldly" people do so that is good in itself. But their love is very contrived and very much conditional. The idea that a JW will completely shun someone they may have known for yrs ( even family) then later if that person "repents" they start talking and socialising with them again, is such a fake way to live and love anyone. Who needs friends like that????
I hope he records this.
Thanks as always Lloyd. I love this guy what an awesome idea and very brave.
So happy to here this is happening , I’m glad that more Elders are waking up, there maybe hope for my “Elder” brother still, I’m working on him .
I think they assume you’ve looked at apostate material. But we left because of what occurs, never knew about apostate material, and I feel there may be a lot of elders who are leaving based on WHAT THEYVE SEEN.
It could just be a simple good bye.
If he's an elder, he would no doubt have the phone numbers of most people in the congregation. I almost think a group text would be better? That way he could articulate what he wants to say without the pressure and nerves of the stage. And no doubt being told to leave or have his mic cut before getting to finish.
I agree. They will cut the mike on anyone who dosent follow the script. Message his friends first, then announce his exit with a because..
Thats a good idea!!!
the thing with a group text. is that it´s always posible to say. that he did´t write it. the thing is that if don right on the stage. he is calm and collected and the congregation leaders are in full panc mode. it migh make more pepole thinking.
He wants to make it epic. I respect that. I did something similar and have not ever regretted it.
You must be mentally suspect,to join in the first place🤤🤤
I wish him the best and I hope he records the TALK
I honestly don't think I'd have the marbles to do it, but THAT would be awesome; and I'd LOVE to hear about it afterwards, if he does do it!
Yes!.. Thats definitely what he needs to do at this point..Seriously!..Its truly a scriptual , moral obligation and responsibility, for him to do so, as an elder.. .💯 Revelation Ch. 18:4.
Sounds like a great idea!!
Thanks ❤
What a thoughtful and understanding response Lloyd👏. I hope this gentleman can leave without too much trouble 😮
This voicemail makes me wonder how many of our elders stepped down because they woke up and not the other gossip that was spreading in the congregation
Record the talk!
This is Great. Its so hard all of this and it should not be . What a HOOT and VERY BRAVE. Love it, but Tricky. Great Work Lloyd, all the VERY BEST to Lovely Diana, wrong spelling, and your Sweet Pea Girls. They will be fluent in two Languages by now, happy and free
As soon as it gets clear what his intention is, the other elders will step in to stop his talk. They wont let you continue. I think it is much more effective to write the reasons down and sent the text along with a farewell as a private message to the other congregation members
Nejprve členům sboru a potom starším...😊
I think it's very brave, rather badass, and even kind of sexy what this PIMO Elder wants to do. His congregation and Body of Elders are going to think whatever their going to think and say whatever they're going to say afterwards; not much can be done about that, but at least he could have the chance at being honest with them before any rumors start. Yes, he might be shunned by his Witness family and friends, but if I had to guess, he probably knows that that scenario might come to fruition anyway even if he left the JW Organization quietly. Remember, we are talking here about an institution that technically believes there are no valid reasons for ever leaving the Witness faith at all. At least he'd be showing them that he still values honesty, a trait that I thought Jehovah's Witnesses value, or at least they claim to.
That honesty might contain a painful true that makes them feel uncomfortable but isn't honesty and telling the truth more freeing, even if it sometimes comes at a cost? Sometimes carrying a weight on shoulder gets to be too much. Pretending to be something you're not to please other people is going to probably harm you more in the long run. He can be honest about his apostasy, and still show his congregation that he cares about them as people even if they choose to remain in the faith. He'd at least have the opportunity to do that. Many ex-JWs who walked away while still serving as Elders, understandably, just walk away but probably wish they had the chance to be that open and let their former congregants know they still care about them and that they (in most cases) don't forget about them or stop caring about them even when they leave the Witness community.
Great advice
I really hope we get a follow up call. And hopefully a voice recording of the talk
Yes will be really interested if he calls you , if he could record his talk it would be so cool even if it’s just a voice recording
If his talk about family he can work it to where he ends it with something clever about getting your family out before its too late lol
Personally I would fade .. especially with bub x
Almost impossible to just fade as an Elder.
Thank you
I can’t understand a word he’s saying. 😢
Me too. He is either Irish or Scotish maybe.
In anycase, he should simply leave and be done with it.
Sounds like Irish to me. You can follow along in the transcript in the video description 🤙
Edit: ok the transcript isn't 100% accurate, but it's enough to give you the gist of what he's saying
If you want to leave, just leave and don't bother looking for some grand exit! Just get out. No one is making you stay in. They are not going to listen to you anyway. Their attitude will turn on you in 2 seconds flat and they will forget you by next week. They have no love unless you are in their midst.
Just do it!
Finally, someone saying the awkward part out loud.
If you are an adult then you know what you signed up for when you got baptized as one of Jehovah’s Witnesses. So if you changed your mind that’s on you. You may well have had a ton of very good reasons to do so but as @swhite correctly pointed out, no one is making you stay in.
In the end it’s simply a brutal calculation of what it’s worth to be free of coerced cooperation.
Right?You don't really have to make a grand exit.Just leave that's all
He should do this however he sees fit
I disagree, most wont listen, but a few will. Humans are curious. They will want to know what his reasons were, especially his friends in the hall, and it stops the chance of lies and gossip.
Personally, I think PIMO elder would need to understand his wife’s thoughts on the “truth”… if she feels the same then extracting himself will be much easier…. But so will his final talk. If he chooses to speak up in his final talk, his wife can’t feel blindsided, that will just create an additional issue because she will be walking out of that hall with him.
That’s a great idea
It’s so hard for me right now , so so hard. I wish you could feel how hard it is
Grow up 😊😊
DO NOT, just fade out.
Maybe move and never join any new congregation.
Literal mic drop. Oh, to be a fly on that wall!
i think he should outline his primary 3 reasons for leaving (whatever egregious things they may be in two sentences or less per reason) before he announces as his last act as an elder, that "[his name], myself, is no longer one of jehovah's witnesses." and exit. as yes, the last 5 minutes of the talk.
as for the talk itself, i think it's a bad idea to write an outline that slowly becomes more apostate-like. instead, perhaps finding a talk about loving your brothers as yourself or some such thing... and emphasize his own love for those in the congregation by the time he's ready to speak on his reasons for leaving.
edit: my reasoning behind this is that i agree. shocking people is a one-way ticket to getting them to not believe in you or your message, and label it as the devil messing with god's servants.
Still, would be fun to watch! 😂
Are there any videos you've made about your opinions on meeting crashing? Im interested in your opinions on the topic
I’m not an expert, but I do remember a meeting got crashed when I was “in” and none of us really “heard” because we were (I was) just excited to watch and see something different was happening instead of the usual me-trying-to-stay-awake. They could’ve come in talking “Veggie Tales” and we would’ve been excited. I thought it was great. But the elders simply went up to them and made them leave then without a word, back to boring monotone and trying to stay awake.
thats a relief - i thought from the title he was gonna top himself on stage
Probably wouldn't be the first.
He can't get 5 min. Perhaps 1 minute and he will be escorted down the stage.
If I had a final talk….if I believed anything
The bible is gods word, it is there to guide us. We know god is the reader of hearts and our hearts are how we will be judged. We know the qualities….and the greatest of these is love….love never fails. People are people, there are good, kind, loving people in all religions. Their example makes them stand out as different to the world because of their deeds. How is god going to save the good hearted people if they are in the wrong religion? That doesn’t sound loving. There is finger pointing at all the other religions…..because no one wants to believe their religion is wrong. We know religion has been the cause of conflict, wars…..the French Huguenots fleeing persecution by going to England in the 1600s…..the Protestant land owners in Ireland persecuting Catholics and taking their land….refusing to help them during the famine. They weren’t even allowed to own a business if they were Catholic….so did the bible say anything about this? Maybe….. Jesus preached about god and love but religion hasn’t shown love…..lots of children can attest to being abused by “good” Christians. My dad could attest to that as a child in a Catholic school. We were warned about false prophets and wolf in sheeps clothing….and also the FEW on the narrow road…..maybe the TRUE Christians are the ones who follow the bible, not religion. Maybe religion is the smokescreen….the wolves….blinding people from the truth which is we don’t need a religion to have a relationship with god….god will judge us, our relationship with him is not determined by meeting attendance and the preaching of gods word is done by our example - how we live, how we treat others. It puts the focus back on making sure we do the best instead of judging or being judged by other humans…..we are all made from the same dirt. Let vid do the judging and let us just follow Jesus example
He did not specify his reasons for exiting.
It’s not that hard to use the scriptures in a talk in such a way as it awakens their mind if they are honest hearted. Otherwise, they will boot you out.
I DO THINK INSTEAD OF WRITING LETTERS..JWs SHOULD RAISE THEIR HANDS AS RO GIVE A COMMENT AND SAY WHY THEY'RE LEAVING
"I want to exit life on stage" No! for the love of Jehovah please dont do it! Lol just kidding around. Love from Canada
After a full watch of the video. Pardon my silliness. I am really invested in this elders story and hope he accomplishes his goal. Also, maybe records the talk for us!
607 vs 587
1914 vs 1934
Hey brothers is there any single? am looking for Man ?
Jesus is a single man
@@b4ph0m3tdk9please dont blaspheme.
I wonder if he s in Ireland. I know many JWs there, for reasons I won't go into (I ve never been a JW by the way)
He sounds like he is under a lot of pressure almost at breaking point
Best of IRISH luck, I could detect an Irish accent, maybe
bro, dont dox
Taylor Lisa Jones Angela Miller Ronald
He sounds like a British elon musk
Good “fantasy” but what if they caught on and muted the mic? I admire him though. ❤
First
That brother needs Nietzsche.
Neitzsche coined one of my favourite quotes: no tree can grow to heaven unless its roots reach down to hell
@@noone3216omg that’s a great quote! I’m going to remember that! Thank you! ❤
@@christinesotelo7655 you're welcome 😊 For accuracy and context, it gets attributed to Jung, but he was paraphrasing Nietzsche. That's why the Jung version says "it is said" - he's referring to when Nietzsche previously discussed it.
@@noone3216 Thank you kindly.
@@christinesotelo7655 yw😘
Just please read Romans 10:9 from the KJV aloud before leaving because people need to hear the simple truth of the gospel. Jesus loves us. Faith in him leads to 1) justification, then 2) sanctification, and finally 3) glorification. He did the work so we don't have to (Ephesians 2).
Preaching on an exjw channel 😂
@@a_net5610 Hey, ya gotta go where the kids are 😉. Many puzzle over the JW Gordian Knot rather than simply cut it as they should or they get mad at God and never heal. Genuine Christianity is extremely simple and powerful but people seeking prestige tend to muck it up.
Are they taking about Presbyterian or J. W. ? I’m in the dark here having stumbled on this on TH-cam. Can you go from being an elder to a younger ? Because then I might join.
I realized it’s about J.W. after I listened further. I’m a P.K. ( ex-Methodist ). But I can’t imagine how much tougher it is for people to leave these more controlling faiths.
@llyod please do a follow up on his call.. 🎉🎉