damn this is some next level observation. I love my beat in teebird so much and now I understand why. And I also know what to replace it with when it inevitably is lost or gets too beat in. Great content!
So I bagged many teebirds or years, and I just switched to the instinct after the trying the one I got in the last discmania mystery box. The wing and the dome look the exactly the same and fly the same. However I've switched because the instinct held more glide especially in tailwind I still bag the Barela teebird3 because of how overstable it is.
@@clawshooter5867 yeah, that's what I have found with a lot of the Teebird style discs out there... they are great, but it's hard to find one on the overstable side when a Fresh Teebird can fight a pretty good wind!
Curious that you didn't compare the Legacy Rival, which literally uses an old Teebird mold. Would be interested to see the difference with that too. Great shots and great content as always! It's always cool to see videos like this, people really don't do in depth disc comparisons like this and it's really helpful.
Oh yeah, the Rival is straight up a teebird! such a good disc! But yes, it's literally a Teebird, there are a ton of them from a lot of companies out there. unfortunately I sold or lost just about all my Rival's, otherwise I probably would have included them in this video! Same with the Instinct
That’s interesting, never thought of this or noticed it. It’s like an external bead and functions like a traditional bead. There has to be some effect of the air circulation under the rim but it’s probably negligible. It is interesting looking back and realizing just how friggin long my Star Teebird has kept true to flight. I think one factor you missed on why we don’t see this in other discs is the complexity and added costs from having a more complex mold. Not sure if it would be that big of a deal but it seems like it would be harder. Good video
Yeah very true! It probably does increase the cost for the mold... it is interesting because I noticed that the Felon doesn't have that lip either... when the Firebird's lip is pretty big in comparison to the Teebird! I would have thought that because they needed it to be beefy that they would have put that lip on the Felon
Great breakdown! My brand new Lucid Evader is very OS out to 325'. It flies straight for the first 300' and then dumps the last 25'. But it can't handle a headwind like my Lucid Felon. It will be interesting to see how it beats in, but from my experience Lucid plastic takes ages to beat in.
No, I busted out my TL and TL3 to check it out after seeing this. The TL seems like the same curve, but without the bead-y part. The TL3 rim underside is basically convex - it doesn’t curve inward like the Teebird nor does it have that bead, it almost curves outward. The ruin diameter looks the same, maybe the Teebird is bigger - but the concave rim means that the Teebird has less mass on the rim, hence it being a 7 speed while the TL3 is an 8.
The TL and TL3 don't have the lip, but the Teebird3 does just like the Teebird. I think the only difference between the Teebird and Teebird3 is that the 3 is slightly wider in diameter... I think the rims are identical though.. I could be wrong! But the lip is definitely there on the Teebird3
@@ApolloDiscGolf since the only difference of the teebird and teebird3 is diameter do you think one is more torque resistant than the other? For example I like throwing putters over midranges so should I use the smaller diameter one?
@@ForehandDiscReviews in theory I believe a larger diameter is more forgiving and more torque resistant... that is why an Ultimate Disc is so understable, yet still pretty forgiving for bad form relative to how understable it is.
@@facelessce My go to is Shawnee Mission because it's close. But my favorite in the area would have to be Bad Rock Creek in Liberty or Lakeside Hils out at Lake Olathe, both great!
I call it a gurney flap like in car racing. Thunderbird, Firebird, Fd3 etc all have it. I find these molds easies to shot shape and hold lines you like. Other brands like kastaplast etc seem to design just for drag reduction but their discs end up being very finicky. They seem to either want to hyzer out or burn over because they are so sensitive to nose angle.
6:11 Q:"why would they not put that little ledge on the edge?" Answer: Simple, for more distance. (although I doubt you'll get as much distance out of a 0 3 as with the 0 2 discs you're comparing it with).
Forgot the Instinct. I have 2 TeeBird's one is overstable and the other one I can get a little turn out of it. I love that I when I reach for my TeeBird's I have two different discs and I know what I am getting out of both. My go-to fairway is the Instinct/Royal Rage II as that was my first one I got. I have tried the Explorer and Evader and don't like them. Great video!!!
Yeah, the Instinct is one I have yet to try! These are the ones I was familiar with and what I had on hand! But yeah, the Instinct is definitely in this discussion of Teebird Clones!
IME the explorer is a little less stable than the evader, and much less so than the teebird. The discs are simply not consistent enough to reflect their numbers in comparison to one another. Good for people who like throwing different lines with the same mold, not so much for people who just want to own a few discs and expect their plastic to fly consistently if they buy replacements.
Plastic makes such a huge difference. The dx Teebird I have is the flippiest disc I own. I have an Opto X explorer that is well used and it is just as stable as my newer Felon. The newer plastic from Sweden is also more stable plastic than what had been used even a year ago.
Yeah, the inconsistent discs are such a double edged sword! One one side people love them because it's easier to replace your entire lineup with one "mold" but on the other hand, it's so hard to know what you are getting! Especially when ordering online!
Now I gotta go home and look closer at my Discmania Instinct. I thought it would be a nice backup for when my Explorer gets retired, but now I'm curious about that lip.
I still bag my Teebird, but it's DX and is beat is so much that I can hyzer flip it easily, fairly Flippy now. I kinda throw my Volt more now. Not the same disc, but the Neutron Volt is similar enough for me and I have it dialed in now. Still love my Teebird tho and I can't bring myself take it out of my bag. I really want to replace it with a votum only because the Votum stamps are 🔥🔥🥵🥵
Oh for sure! The Votum stamps are sick!! And they are actually really comfortable in the hand since the rim is rounded off! And super workable. I was surprised!
Honestly, a pretty poor selection of discs for the comparison. The Votum is a 9 speed (8.5 according to TSA), so not sure why this is included. You didn't include other big brands such as Discmania's Instinct, or Discraft's Stalker, which both share the same flight numbers as a Teebird.
Didn't have an Instinct on hand to compare. And I'm not sure what the numbers are for a Votum, but from throwing and holding it, it's basically a less overstable Teebird... And I think the Stalker is closer in comparison to an FD type disc... Discraft doesn't really have any molds truly comparable to the Teebird, they have been unique in that they have gone a completely different route than the traditional route for Fairways with the Pros going for Undertakers paired with Anax's or Vultures to cover their fairway game. Discraft is really good at not just copying the traditional Innova molds and blazing their own path
Love my Teebirds, but my goto turnover disc is a well eat-in Eagle. I can't find a stock disc that has that same flight. Wish I could because it's hard to get a new disc to that level of wear and I keep overtrusting myself and end up losing them.
Paul McBeth mentioned this in Hannah McBeth's recent review of Catrina's Vortex fairway driver with DGA. He called it a nosebead and threw a couple discs as flight examples. Kudos to you on a great video that explains something that most people don't understand about their discs.
Gotcha. Well along the lines of your video, if you have never bagged a DX Eagle (x-mold) for a while, you should. The Eagle X is known for that very noticeable nosebead, so it starts surprisingly stable for a base plastic disc and then the wear pattern over time is fantastic. I don't remember what video it was, but it was Barsby who mentioned that everyone sleeps on DX Eagles because they shut down when they think of base plastic discs but they don't consider that the Eagle was designed for that plastic because it's such an old mold that there were no other plastics at that time. Made me give one a try and I've had a DX Eagle in my bag ever since.
damn this is some next level observation. I love my beat in teebird so much and now I understand why. And I also know what to replace it with when it inevitably is lost or gets too beat in. Great content!
Thank you! Glad you liked it!
You left out the Discmania Instinct. Obviously not "exactly" the same as the Teebird, but has the little bead at the front of the rim.
Yeah, that is one of the Teebird clones I have yet to try! I have some coming in, so I will get to try them soon!
So I bagged many teebirds or years, and I just switched to the instinct after the trying the one I got in the last discmania mystery box.
The wing and the dome look the exactly the same and fly the same. However I've switched because the instinct held more glide especially in tailwind
I still bag the Barela teebird3 because of how overstable it is.
@@clawshooter5867 yeah, that's what I have found with a lot of the Teebird style discs out there... they are great, but it's hard to find one on the overstable side when a Fresh Teebird can fight a pretty good wind!
Rival
@@FearTheWeird300 The Rival is solid! and definitely belongs among the solid Teebird clones!
Please bake more videos like this! Maybe bead vs beadless and their stability, skip, fade, etc
Noted! Thanks for watching! Glad you enjoyed it!
The Teebird is so clutch. Holds the line and gets a long clean break at the end of its flight.
It's so good!
Curious that you didn't compare the Legacy Rival, which literally uses an old Teebird mold. Would be interested to see the difference with that too. Great shots and great content as always! It's always cool to see videos like this, people really don't do in depth disc comparisons like this and it's really helpful.
Oh yeah, the Rival is straight up a teebird! such a good disc! But yes, it's literally a Teebird, there are a ton of them from a lot of companies out there. unfortunately I sold or lost just about all my Rival's, otherwise I probably would have included them in this video! Same with the Instinct
That’s interesting, never thought of this or noticed it. It’s like an external bead and functions like a traditional bead. There has to be some effect of the air circulation under the rim but it’s probably negligible. It is interesting looking back and realizing just how friggin long my Star Teebird has kept true to flight.
I think one factor you missed on why we don’t see this in other discs is the complexity and added costs from having a more complex mold. Not sure if it would be that big of a deal but it seems like it would be harder. Good video
Yeah very true! It probably does increase the cost for the mold... it is interesting because I noticed that the Felon doesn't have that lip either... when the Firebird's lip is pretty big in comparison to the Teebird! I would have thought that because they needed it to be beefy that they would have put that lip on the Felon
Great breakdown! My brand new Lucid Evader is very OS out to 325'. It flies straight for the first 300' and then dumps the last 25'. But it can't handle a headwind like my Lucid Felon. It will be interesting to see how it beats in, but from my experience Lucid plastic takes ages to beat in.
Yeah, once they come out with Biofuzion Evaders, I bet those will fly off the shelves!
I think another reason why some of those discs don’t have the lip is to add glide
Oh yeah for sure! Speed and glide. The Evader for example just goes!
I have two echostar teebirds and they are amazing. One new and one beat in. Probably my favorite fairway disc.
My go-to Teebird is an older run beat up echo star Teebird, that thing is my baby!
I miss ecostar plastic. It beats in soooo nice.
Does the teebird3 have this same lip/ledge on the disc?
No, I busted out my TL and TL3 to check it out after seeing this. The TL seems like the same curve, but without the bead-y part. The TL3 rim underside is basically convex - it doesn’t curve inward like the Teebird nor does it have that bead, it almost curves outward. The ruin diameter looks the same, maybe the Teebird is bigger - but the concave rim means that the Teebird has less mass on the rim, hence it being a 7 speed while the TL3 is an 8.
rim* not ruin
The TL and TL3 don't have the lip, but the Teebird3 does just like the Teebird. I think the only difference between the Teebird and Teebird3 is that the 3 is slightly wider in diameter... I think the rims are identical though.. I could be wrong! But the lip is definitely there on the Teebird3
@@ApolloDiscGolf since the only difference of the teebird and teebird3 is diameter do you think one is more torque resistant than the other? For example I like throwing putters over midranges so should I use the smaller diameter one?
@@ForehandDiscReviews in theory I believe a larger diameter is more forgiving and more torque resistant... that is why an Ultimate Disc is so understable, yet still pretty forgiving for bad form relative to how understable it is.
Hey man if your ever in Augusta KS hit me up I’d love to play a round with ya. Keep doing what your doing it helps get me through my work days.
Thanks man! And I haven't been out to Augusta before or played any courses out there
It’s a fun course we got some good ones around here. What’s your go to course?
@@facelessce My go to is Shawnee Mission because it's close. But my favorite in the area would have to be Bad Rock Creek in Liberty or Lakeside Hils out at Lake Olathe, both great!
I’ll have to get the guys together and take a trip to those courses I’ve never been.
@@facelessce There are so many good courses around KC... it's underrated for sure!
The Discmania Instinct has the Teebird like edge.
Yeah! it's very rounded, not as aggressive as the Teebirds! The Instinct is great!
I call it a gurney flap like in car racing. Thunderbird, Firebird, Fd3 etc all have it. I find these molds easies to shot shape and hold lines you like.
Other brands like kastaplast etc seem to design just for drag reduction but their discs end up being very finicky. They seem to either want to hyzer out or burn over because they are so sensitive to nose angle.
Yeah, the lip definitely makes it much easier to control!
Most Evaders I’ve thrown are all noticeably more stable than my Explorers. I throw OptoX
really?? I heard OptoX is crazy beefy!
It is
TL3 rips
Such an underrated mold! Not enough people throw those
6:11 Q:"why would they not put that little ledge on the edge?" Answer: Simple, for more distance.
(although I doubt you'll get as much distance out of a 0 3 as with the 0 2 discs you're comparing it with).
Nothing ever kicks my flat top Teebirds out of bag. Closest I found was the Crave/Volt but always go back Bird.
I guess this why my Star Teebird from '08 still doesn't flip and flies perfectly.
The Firebird has the same lip btw.
Forgot the Instinct. I have 2 TeeBird's one is overstable and the other one I can get a little turn out of it. I love that I when I reach for my TeeBird's I have two different discs and I know what I am getting out of both. My go-to fairway is the Instinct/Royal Rage II as that was my first one I got. I have tried the Explorer and Evader and don't like them.
Great video!!!
Yeah, the Instinct is one I have yet to try! These are the ones I was familiar with and what I had on hand! But yeah, the Instinct is definitely in this discussion of Teebird Clones!
The Instinct actually has a slight bead-like thing just like you describe here. Just checked it. It isn’t as pronounced, but it’s undeniably there.
Yeah I really want to try the Instinct!
You know the evader is more stable then the explorer and teebird right
In my experience the Evader is a straighter Teebird... The fresh Teebirds I have are beefy... Unless you get a Lucid-x Evader
Sorry yeah i meant that the evader is like the happy medium between the 2 between explorer and teebird
IME the explorer is a little less stable than the evader, and much less so than the teebird. The discs are simply not consistent enough to reflect their numbers in comparison to one another. Good for people who like throwing different lines with the same mold, not so much for people who just want to own a few discs and expect their plastic to fly consistently if they buy replacements.
Plastic makes such a huge difference. The dx Teebird I have is the flippiest disc I own. I have an Opto X explorer that is well used and it is just as stable as my newer Felon. The newer plastic from Sweden is also more stable plastic than what had been used even a year ago.
Yeah, the inconsistent discs are such a double edged sword! One one side people love them because it's easier to replace your entire lineup with one "mold" but on the other hand, it's so hard to know what you are getting! Especially when ordering online!
Now I gotta go home and look closer at my Discmania Instinct. I thought it would be a nice backup for when my Explorer gets retired, but now I'm curious about that lip.
Great video, but I think doing anything besides forehanding a Buzz is just a little extra
Zarrgoo
All this sounds great, dunno know if it's all 100% true but it does sound great.
Is this for both the teebird3 and the teebird? Or is it only on the normal teebird?
It’s the same thing on the Teebird3!
@@ApolloDiscGolf Thank you:)
I still bag my Teebird, but it's DX and is beat is so much that I can hyzer flip it easily, fairly Flippy now. I kinda throw my Volt more now. Not the same disc, but the Neutron Volt is similar enough for me and I have it dialed in now. Still love my Teebird tho and I can't bring myself take it out of my bag. I really want to replace it with a votum only because the Votum stamps are 🔥🔥🥵🥵
Oh for sure! The Votum stamps are sick!! And they are actually really comfortable in the hand since the rim is rounded off! And super workable. I was surprised!
Honestly, a pretty poor selection of discs for the comparison. The Votum is a 9 speed (8.5 according to TSA), so not sure why this is included. You didn't include other big brands such as Discmania's Instinct, or Discraft's Stalker, which both share the same flight numbers as a Teebird.
Didn't have an Instinct on hand to compare. And I'm not sure what the numbers are for a Votum, but from throwing and holding it, it's basically a less overstable Teebird... And I think the Stalker is closer in comparison to an FD type disc... Discraft doesn't really have any molds truly comparable to the Teebird, they have been unique in that they have gone a completely different route than the traditional route for Fairways with the Pros going for Undertakers paired with Anax's or Vultures to cover their fairway game. Discraft is really good at not just copying the traditional Innova molds and blazing their own path
Love my Teebirds, but my goto turnover disc is a well eat-in Eagle. I can't find a stock disc that has that same flight. Wish I could because it's hard to get a new disc to that level of wear and I keep overtrusting myself and end up losing them.
Yeah, I don't know what I will do whenever I lose all my beat up Teebirds!
My old Teebird is the most stable disc ever. Cant expect anything out of it but straght. Too many trees.
Broken in Teebirds are just so good!
well done sir. my fav disc. have won many rounds with my tee birds
Teebirds are so good!
My evader iv had since they came out is beat in and does flip all the way over
I thought that’s how they would beat in! They are super nice though!
Paul McBeth mentioned this in Hannah McBeth's recent review of Catrina's Vortex fairway driver with DGA. He called it a nosebead and threw a couple discs as flight examples.
Kudos to you on a great video that explains something that most people don't understand about their discs.
Thanks! And yeah, that video actually gave me the idea to explain it in this video! lol
Gotcha. Well along the lines of your video, if you have never bagged a DX Eagle (x-mold) for a while, you should. The Eagle X is known for that very noticeable nosebead, so it starts surprisingly stable for a base plastic disc and then the wear pattern over time is fantastic. I don't remember what video it was, but it was Barsby who mentioned that everyone sleeps on DX Eagles because they shut down when they think of base plastic discs but they don't consider that the Eagle was designed for that plastic because it's such an old mold that there were no other plastics at that time. Made me give one a try and I've had a DX Eagle in my bag ever since.
@@gmcclure Yeah I will have to check out the DX Eagle! I recently picked up an Exodus (which is an Eagle-L Mold I think) and its wonderful!
really interesting. great video.
Thanks!
Great video!!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
I’ve always been interested in the physics of what makes disc under/over stable and makes them change as they beat in