Portuguese Army Lugers: From Manuel II to World War Two
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 28 ก.ย. 2024
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Portugal first tested the Luger pistol in 1901, and its commission on self-loading pistols recommended the design for adoption in 1904. No money was available at the time, but a second commission again recommended the Luger in 1907, and it was formally adopted and purchased in 1908. The initial batch was 5,000 pistols chambered for the 7.65mm Parabellum cartridge with 120mm (4.75") barrels and "M2" crests for then-king Manuel II. They were designated m/908, and numbered from 1 to 5000.
These pistol would satisfy Portuguese Army needs until 1935, then the Guarda National Republicana ordered another 564 pistols in the same configuration. These came from Mauser at this point, and had "GNR" crests. These were taken form Mauser commercial production, and have serial numbers between 1900v and 2500v.
The final purchase of Portuguese Army Lugers came in 1943, another 4,578 gun from Mauser. Of course, Germany was deep into the Second World War by this time, and there was no option for Portugal to order its specific configuration. Instead, the Portuguese m/943 pattern was identical to the German standard P08, with the Portuguese guns coming right off the same production line - Waffenamt markings and all. They are numbered between 150m and 5330m.
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As some people already have said, the Portuguese Guarda Nacional Republicana (GNR) is not a militia style organization but the Portuguese gendarmerie, or militarized rural police, like French gendarmerie, Italian carabinieri or Spanish Guardia Civil.
In the years of World War One, the Portuguese military wanted to buy more Parabellum pistols, but as Germany can´t furnish them (because they need them and because Portugal was part of the Allied) finally the Portuguese Army bought a good number of American Savage pistols cal. 7.65mm Browning (32 ACP.)
Hm not exactly "Rural" police, as none of the other organizations named, but otherwise you're 100% right.
@@BernasLL Rural as also acting on unincorporated areas, plus the GNR has the BT or traffic brigade which is a kind of road/highway patrol. Also, the service pistol for the GNR and Police nowadays is the Glock 17 in 9mm.
@@BernasLL yes it is rural
Ian, a small correction. It's written "Guarda Nacional Republicana".
About those order numbers, 564 for GNR and 4578 for the army, we Portuguese are very, very specific with our numbers! Except we're really not...
Absolutely right
More Lugers! Everybody and their mother seemed to have their very own batches...
And yet, now they are very hard to find :(
Luger must of had a great international marketing department
@@christianweibrecht6555 They did. Georg Luger himself. Apparently a very persuasive salesman.
Hey, it was arguably the best semiautomatic in the world in 1900-1910 that was being marketed to an international audience. No one, including Browning, knew the Colt 1911 would set the standard eventually, and that was still mostly a novelty bouncing around the American military. I don't know of anyone who purchased Lugers who would not have kept using them as standard issue for many decades if not for the high production costs and the very limited ability to make them any cheaper. Switzerland and Germany both probably would not have replaced Luger until the 1980s if they could have been made as cheaply as P38s or SiGs.
Hmmm... I'll have to check the family tree. Maybe there's a Gramma Kline Luger out there somewhere.☺️. It'd be interesting and valuable.
The GNR is a national paramilitary police force, similar to the French Gendarmerie. It’s not like the U.S. National Guard. It does have, however, an organizational relationship with the Portuguese department of defense when carrying out its military roles. The GNR monogram has also been applied to other pistols used by the GNR, including Walther P38/P1’s.
I feel for that commission:
“We need a security system that does $x”
3 of us go and spend months selecting one
“Oh, we can’t afford that”
Why didn’t you say that months ago
“We thought we could”
Stop thinking, that’s not your job.
Then they waste more time (and money) repeating the process.
@@Oblithian To arrive to the SAME conclusion 👉
on the description it should be guarda nacional republicana, instead of Garda National Republicana. great video as always
I love my Luger! So nice to always hear what Ian has to say about all the variations!
There's never enough luger content.
there were only 3 sets of Luger tools. Forgotten weapons have a Luger video every 2 weeks.
0:52 as a Portuguese, I can confirm we still have no money
Even funnier due to your name
@@marceloantunes998 😄
How you guys dont have money after stealing the entire gold of my country?
@@paulojose-1232 We didn't steal shit from you. Brazil was Portugal. And the gold is gone, thanks to the commie socialists.
@@paulojose-1232 tem que haver sempre um zuca a chorar e sem saber da história do próprio país.
The elusive Guns ‘N Roses luger
There is a mistake in the description, it's Guarda Nacional Republicana, not Garda National Republicana
Olha lá o portuga. Os cara precisaram de traduzir a arma pra poderem usar kkkkkkkkkk
@@luanfonseca5179 Mais vale que os zucas, onde qualquer iletrado sabe bem demais como disparar(oxalá que treinassem mais a parte do apontar, ne?)
@@marceloantunes998 é pq a gente é esperto né patrão kkkkkk
That black P08 looks cool
Now I need a portuguese Luger... BTW GNR is not a "national guard", but the "military" Police/Gendarmerie, like Spanish Guardia Civil or the Italian Carabinieri.
6:19 and 8:47 The safety markings seem to be on a different way. As I understand the German marking shows the text when the safety is on but this can be confusing as typically markings are on the position the switch is set.
Obligatory PORTUGAL CARALHOOO!!!!
TSUUUUUUUUUUUU
Ha, the LH armrest of your chair looks like "a kind of" mountingpoint for a shoulderstock on the mid pistol 🤔🧐😁
Somewhat surprised considering the needs of the war Germany would be willing to sell ~4500 Lugers to a non Axis allied county in 1942 . I suppose they felt the cold hard cash they were getting in the deal was more important at the time.
Portugal was selling Volfranium to Germany at the time, so business as usual :D
@@trinas7131 Took me an unusual long time to find that Wolfranium is an obsolete name for Tungsten.
Probably worth more than gold to Germany at the time.
@@wilsonj4705 it definitely was worth more than gold to germany at the time, considering germany was paying gold upfront to portugal for said resources.
Bribe to keep them pro German
Love the Lugars! Thanks for sharing this!
God bless all here.
Cool
The Portuguese actually invented the Luger pistol, the Germans decided to make them out of steel rather than styrofoam.
(Here in Brazil we mock the Portuguese at every opportunity)
its fine the rest of the world mocks brazil so its only fair
@@MrRafagigapr That country that'll be a superpower sooner or later? XD yea mate, pull the next one
@@MrRafagigapr of course they do, we're relevant.
I bet Alec Baldwin wishes the gun he used was made of styrofoam!
@@mikehipperson lol, he probably does.
😀
*mentions Portugal
*gets an automatic thumbs-up from me
#Caralho
Fond memories of my grandfathers gun. Always nice to see my country represented
Thank god for obsessive collectors and FW, as otherwise it would be so much harder to see these kinds of guns together
That's for sure.
Mauser in WWII adopted Henry Ford philosophy, you can have any Luger you want as long as it is a P08.
FYI, the GNR (Guarda Nacional Republicana / Republican National Guard) despite the name is the equivalent to the police, but you had to be in the army to join and they don't do policing duties in metropolitan areas, that job is done by the PSP ( Polícia de Segurança Pública / Public Safety Police).
In the last few years we have seen companies like Colt with the new Python using modern machining to bring back guns that formerly required a great deal of hand fitting and finishing to manufacture. I wonder if technology will ever advance to the point of making guns like the Luger practical in the market place.
I remember when the Ford GT came out in the 2000s - and a few years later a company in Texas made reproduction Me-262 jet fighters. You'd think with 3D printing etc there would be a wave of boutique retro cars, pistols etc. It's a shame the economy tanked a few years later.
@@AshleyPomeroy 3D printers are mostly garbage for doing anything other than prototyping, unless titanium prints magically become viable it’ll stay that way.
Portuguese fan right here
Great work, as always
All the best to everyone
For heaven's sake, these Luger pistols are coming crawling out of all the holes.
Thanks Ian for the story of Luger pistols in Portugal. When will we find a video about Walther P38 in the portuguese service?
Given we waited so long for the portuguese issue of the Luger pistol, and considering the Luger's iconic character, I'd estimate we would have to have some patience to see Ian covering such a common weapon as the P38 and of rather little particularity like the portuguese issue.
As far as I'm aware, we usually had our weapons made fairly similarly to the original manufacturer's specifications, while sometimes varying mostly in cosmetic ways like mate finish, grip pattern, color, etc. Supporting this is the fact our national arms manufacturer usually bought the tooling for producing our weapons directly from the original manufacturer.
I'd still like to see a video about it, thou. After all, the P38 was my first service pistol.
Got to love the Luger,my dad had one not sure what kind..i think German maybe, it was a great shooter. Another great video Ian ,so very through ..keep it up !
Ian! You are 'The Total Gun Nerd!', and I feel that I speak for most subscribers in this next.....Thank God! 😉😁🖖
I appreciate your curiosity about firearms, and the Ridiculous amount of trivial (yet interesting) information about them that you do. I, personally, enjoy it thoroughly and keep it coming! 👍🤙✌🖖😉
Ian: *mentions Portugal*
Portuguese folk: *P O R T U G A L C A R A L H O*
:) 👍Nice to you portugueses
When I started watching this channel, I thought I knew a lot about guns. Hundreds of videos later, I realize I didn’t know much. I still only probably know about 1% of what Ian knows, but I couldn’t think of a better teacher.
Strictly speaking it is Manuel's Cypher rather than his crest The crest is the element of the achievement of arms which is mounted on the helm
Oh good, it's not just me. :-)
Heraldry: always relevant, even to guns
@@awmperry There is a lot of confusion now about the differences between monograms, cyphers badges, ,logos, trademarks, coats of arms and crests .The British forces I believe have now registered their badges under trade mark legislation!
@@gregordavey1135 Yup. Registration with the College of Arms only does so much, so it makes sense to register them as trademarks as well. The interesting thing is of course that the arms are just the achievement of arms itself, so they would only be able to copyright a particular representation of them, while a trademark gives a bit more leeway.
@@awmperry I wonder what happens to Scots badges etc- the Lord Lyon has many more practical powers.If I remember correctly in Scots armory badges are designed by the heralds and granted by Lyon and form part ofthe achievement
The current general confusion does lead to some interesting conundrums. Artillery pieces in Australian service were like British guns,marked with the Queens cypher displayed within a garter under a 'Queens' crown. Some years back the decision was made to replace this cypher with the Australian Arms (of Sovereignty)- rather changing the tradition..
*Gun Jesus reviewing Luger is just what I wanted.*
Just somebody out there have a book on identifying or decoding the letters on Luger pistols? I'm trying to identify the date of manufacture and where my Luger ended up it has a very early three digit serial number dwm 7.65 and then on the frame it has S S & G P any ideas thank you
DWM "You want a luger, you get a P08, hope you like it."
Me " Heck yeah!!!!!! I'll take whatever you wanna give me!!!!!"
I must say that you forgot to say Portugal Caralho but I think I can forgive you.
What about the Portuguese Navy Lugers P-08.??
No matter how many pistols or revolvers I love, the Luger is still by far one of my all time favorites
Ian loves the little luuuugers
All the lugers of the worrrllddd
Even Lex Luger? o_O
I love Ian. He just comes off so wholesome.
Month of the Bergmann part 2: Month of the Luger!
Ahh yes, the Portuguese Gun-O-War
Which well is deeper? SMLE variants or Lugers?
Will you please do a review and maybe a range test of the as val?
Have to say that matte finish Luger is much better looking than I would have expected. Looks very menacing.
Imagine a matte finish Luger in .45 ACP! That would look like something straight out of a comic book villain scene.
musta been great, getting paid to just shoot guns, talk to arms manufacturers, and presumably dictate reports to a secretary to send back to your command
Now I want a Portuguese army parkarized luger thanks Ian your feeding my addiction
Great video.
Nice piece of portuguese militaria history.
Look in pretty good condition to be that old.
Very nice pistols.
i still cant get over how many sub variations of lugers there are
Somebody still actively knows we have /use mostly Arabic numerals world wide? :: Faints::
I am trying to think of some kind of _"hakaloogie"_ Luger joke, and...I got nuthin'. 😊
{Great video, Ian...👍}
I wonder if Axel Rose has one of these...
Its funny how people love Lugers, its rather like classic cars that were flawed but people still love them. The Luger is far away from the most reliable of automatic pistols in the 30's and 40's.
Portugal caralho!
Ian you still have a tipo/mistake on the description it's Nacional not National (Guarda Nacional Republicana)
hi, Ian ...!!!
wher are you ...?!?
we are waiting your daily video ... we'll are very worry ... we wait for
so long, greatest gunner kid ... 😉
The AKM and the Luger, probably the two most iconic guns ever made.
What gun did enlisted Portuguese pistol-armed men carry? Or did only officers get to carry pistols and mortar crews etc only got rifles?
Only Officers carried pistols. The enlisted (soldados) used Mauser rifles.
@@fernandesbjp Thank you! 😀👍 A bit different from other armies like the American and Swedish.
@@puppetguy8726 Wen you don't have a lot of money, you have to take choices.
Even the GNR (Guarda Nacional Republicana) a Gendarmerie tipe Police Force, only adopted a pistol (Walther P38 for Guards, Walther PP/PPK for Sargents and Officers) in 1961, until then Guards used the Mauser KAR 98.
I am a Sargent of the GNR and wen I entered service in 2006 we still used the P38 now replaced by the "Portuguese Glock 19" (with manual safety).
Now it would be cool if you did a video about the brazilian contract lugers
Hey Ian do you think you could do a video on the mini or even micro uzi not just the normal one?
The Luger is such a beautiful pistol.
Used to play with one when I was a kid (without bullets...). Sawed off the barrel because I thought it would look cool (and because I'm an idiot). Ah, the memories.
😁 better be careful, sir. Some of the guys here just might take some serious offense at such sacrilege.
When the Luger collecting fraternity find you, they will probably saw off something of yours. 😁
Philistine!
@@mikehipperson 😂😂 and so it begins...
@@Kevin-mx1vi 🤭
I didn't know I needed a parked luger.. until now.
So many Lugers, yet I still can't afford one. If only I had a time machine to go back 70 years.
One of these days...
The Luger is the one firearm I would trade most of my collection for.
Thanks
Manuel? More like Man-not-well.
Why do people put the horrible white paint in to the markings?
To make them more visible. It's usually wax.
I'm a simple man. I see Portugal I say caralho
👍
You're tellling us the marking over the barrel attachment point could have been "MII"?
Ian's português pronunciation is 10 out of 10!!
Nice guns also, never realised that's what the GNR used for decades!
It’s not! This were just for Officers. By this time they used Mausers. In every service. Wen the regular soldiers started using pistols it was the Walter P38.
@@fernandesbjp obrigado pelo esclarecimento, não estava ao corrente :)
@@rotormasher Não mencionei correctamente os soldados, ou as praças como eram conhecidos na época usavam a espingarda Mauser.
Thank you , Ian .
Lugars are neat
Pistole 08 , not Pistole O8! And wasn' t 9mm Parabellum invented, because 7,65 mm Parabellum was too weak in the eyes of german army?
Keep it up
nice
That 2nd gun's safety looks broken...the blade doesn't move as you switch the lever
It deeply upsets me that, in spite of being a subscriber with notifications set to “all” and a patron, I do not receive notifications for your new content on TH-cam. I know this an archetypical issue but, damn if it’s not annoying.
Did I enjoy this video? Trust me Ian, I enjoy every single video you post. Always interesting and you're a good narrator and excellent at explaining. Thank you!
Yay! More lugers!
Someday…someday
Man, I would sell a lot of things for a Luger pistol.
They're just great.
Any updates from Elbonia? 😀
Verry good
Here’s your German Luger …. Hope you like it. Love it !
episode about different luger magazines would be great
Thanks for yet another wonderful video. I really like this one. The first model with the short lived crest is really cool.
Watching this with interest from Madeira
Lots of Lugers recently.
Sorry for the pun. 😛
Luger week is way better than Bergman week.
The roman numeral for 1000 is M.
I like the matte refinish job on the P08.
You and othias have been Lugers