I know of marriages and breakups that have occurred due to the men not making enough or significantly less than their female counterparts and it’s devastating. There’s abuse, guilt tripping and condescension which leave men depressed and castrated. There is a great need for empathy from women but they are instead taking on the patriarchal, grandiose role mainly occupied by men.
There is a kind of value system underlying Eberstadt's discussions whereby work is considered to be good and to be good for people. But that's not what I see. Most jobs seem to be meaningless or pointless, just invented to waste people's lives. A large number of jobs also seem to be incredibly draining on people. Many of my friends turn to drugs and alcohol to deal with the stress of work. I retired at 38 after inheriting a sizable chunk of change and have no desire to go back. Life is better without work and without the stress and pressures of work. Contrary to Eberstadt's views most of the people I know would agree with me and would quit working if they could figure out how to pay for the basics of a dignified life. A corollary of what I'm saying is that what Eberstadt's empirical data shows may be a good thing and not a bad thing. Ultimately, we should aim for a society where work is optional.
@@cordfortina9073 I too once believed that work was essential or at least I wanted to fulfill the expectations of my father to have a career and be a "success." He placed a high value on this kind of "success." What I learned was that mostly what success bought you was stress and anxiety, and it certainly didn't bring me any respect from society. In fact, I was routinely treated exactly like what I was--a worker in need of money, unable to say 'no' or assert my own values and standards. Traditional American values glorify work, but I learned that the way the system is set up is that workers are treated as desperate people. They are basically treated as if they are in a desperate position willing to put up with anything. If you challenge much at all or complain much at all, you will be screwed. When you don't need the money, this arrangement no longer makes sense.
Who cares what the average income is? Who cares about productivity? Who cares how much wealth the US produces? What matters is wages. Average income is heavily impacted by how much wealth a few billionaires have. I don't care about that. Productivity has, at best, no impact on wages. When people produce more, a few billionaires get richer but it does little to nothing for the middle class and poor. Therefore, what's the problem with a decrease in productivity if we see that going forward? We aren't looking at the "decline of males" we are looking at men not having to work as much, which is a good thing being sold to us as a negative. It is only a negative for a few billionaires. That's the only people that lose by having less supply of labor.
You are right about that to an extent. If you are a young male you should be delighted that you don't have to be a plow horse for the system. All you need is to stay fit and healthy, get a side income and create your own lifestyle outside of this corporate cucking.
Feeling very sad listening to this. Despite the fact I have a maths degree, and a postgraduate qualification in statistics, I was never able to beat the experience trap. Employers always seemed to want people with a few years' experience. I never knew where I was supposed to get the experience from. At one point in my 30s, I had just three months' work in five years. I am 68 next month, never having married, or ever been in a position where I could imagine I might be able to support a family. It's all too late now.
Chicken or the Egg? Late night TV started in the 1960's, then came video, cable, personal computers, internet and androids. Could availability of "The Screen" in the form of non-stop entertainment and virtual worlds have contributed to the rise of the Lotus Eaters?
There are fates worse than (opioid) death. Meritocracy, we are not all equal or the same, in this artificial construct called society some of us lot in life will always be at the bottom of the pile. I know I am better off dying from a overdose rather than working hard to earn my meritocractically (if thats a word?)deserved poverty, low standard of living and social low status that others benefit from, just so I can die in 50 years or so time in an unknown manner and place, rather than tomorrow in a known way, run from death or stop turn and look it in the eye. Life doesn't owe me a (standard)living. I don't owe 'any' job a life just because someone needs to do it.
I think it's awesome! I'm 51 semi retired and hardly working anymore like 3 days a week. I'm not rich I'm single and free!Never going back to the plantation ever again.
This is a great presentation but I would suggest a change to the presentation style: the slides need to be larger - smaller speaker image and smaller advertising.
I know of marriages and breakups that have occurred due to the men not making enough or significantly less than their female counterparts and it’s devastating. There’s abuse, guilt tripping and condescension which leave men depressed and castrated. There is a great need for empathy from women but they are instead taking on the patriarchal, grandiose role mainly occupied by men.
Briffault's Law
There is a kind of value system underlying Eberstadt's discussions whereby work is considered to be good and to be good for people. But that's not what I see. Most jobs seem to be meaningless or pointless, just invented to waste people's lives. A large number of jobs also seem to be incredibly draining on people. Many of my friends turn to drugs and alcohol to deal with the stress of work. I retired at 38 after inheriting a sizable chunk of change and have no desire to go back. Life is better without work and without the stress and pressures of work. Contrary to Eberstadt's views most of the people I know would agree with me and would quit working if they could figure out how to pay for the basics of a dignified life. A corollary of what I'm saying is that what Eberstadt's empirical data shows may be a good thing and not a bad thing. Ultimately, we should aim for a society where work is optional.
@@cordfortina9073 I too once believed that work was essential or at least I wanted to fulfill the expectations of my father to have a career and be a "success." He placed a high value on this kind of "success." What I learned was that mostly what success bought you was stress and anxiety, and it certainly didn't bring me any respect from society. In fact, I was routinely treated exactly like what I was--a worker in need of money, unable to say 'no' or assert my own values and standards. Traditional American values glorify work, but I learned that the way the system is set up is that workers are treated as desperate people. They are basically treated as if they are in a desperate position willing to put up with anything. If you challenge much at all or complain much at all, you will be screwed. When you don't need the money, this arrangement no longer makes sense.
Who cares what the average income is? Who cares about productivity? Who cares how much wealth the US produces? What matters is wages. Average income is heavily impacted by how much wealth a few billionaires have. I don't care about that. Productivity has, at best, no impact on wages. When people produce more, a few billionaires get richer but it does little to nothing for the middle class and poor. Therefore, what's the problem with a decrease in productivity if we see that going forward? We aren't looking at the "decline of males" we are looking at men not having to work as much, which is a good thing being sold to us as a negative. It is only a negative for a few billionaires. That's the only people that lose by having less supply of labor.
You are right about that to an extent. If you are a young male you should be delighted that you don't have to be a plow horse for the system. All you need is to stay fit and healthy, get a side income and create your own lifestyle outside of this corporate cucking.
The Juice isn't worth the Squeeze.
When society tells you that you are the root of all evils, why work for it???
Feeling very sad listening to this. Despite the fact I have a maths degree, and a postgraduate qualification in statistics, I was never able to beat the experience trap. Employers always seemed to want people with a few years' experience. I never knew where I was supposed to get the experience from. At one point in my 30s, I had just three months' work in five years. I am 68 next month, never having married, or ever been in a position where I could imagine I might be able to support a family. It's all too late now.
You did a good thing not to contribute to this society
Thank you Acton for posting this interview. I've read NE's book, but still enjoy listening to his perspective delivered so succinctly.
Chicken or the Egg? Late night TV started in the 1960's, then came video, cable, personal computers, internet and androids. Could availability of "The Screen" in the form of non-stop entertainment and virtual worlds have contributed to the rise of the Lotus Eaters?
There are fates worse than (opioid) death. Meritocracy, we are not all equal or the same, in this artificial construct called society some of us lot in life will always be at the bottom of the pile. I know I am better off dying from a overdose rather than working hard to earn my meritocractically (if thats a word?)deserved poverty, low standard of living and social low status that others benefit from, just so I can die in 50 years or so time in an unknown manner and place, rather than tomorrow in a known way, run from death or stop turn and look it in the eye. Life doesn't owe me a (standard)living. I don't owe 'any' job a life just because someone needs to do it.
What about women prime age in work force? Does that balance off the missing men numbers?
This is just a feature of capitalism. Don’t complain about it.
I think it's awesome! I'm 51 semi retired and hardly working anymore like 3 days a week. I'm not rich I'm single and free!Never going back to the plantation ever again.
Old news, we saw the trend in '83. Not your fault. Just learn from the passivity of those now *heralding "the problem".
This is a great presentation but I would suggest a change to the presentation style: the slides need to be larger - smaller speaker image and smaller advertising.
Nick - An excellent if worrying talk. Maybe better with fewer truncated graphs, some of which verged on "gee-whiz".