I bought a house which had coal-fired central heating. I bought a heat pump. The payback is that the house isn’t always cold now, and we don’t spend all our time shovelling coal. Sometimes the payback is more than just financial.
I'm 71 and had solar since 2015 then battery next heat pump , had the gas meter removed today i did it because it makes sense and i love the tec and future proofing against price increases. it more money in your pocket now as you yearly wages goes further for you to save or spend on other pleasures
@@thepete129 Yes i have spent all my saving on solar Powerwall and now Air to Air HVAC but im still saving what income i do have , if the Powerwall 2 comes down in price it wont take me long to by another one as my small income goes a long way now .
@@NigelSavagery First off I kind of agree with you, I have sola"4kw"and batteries "10kw"and I am considering an ASHP but I have come across conflicting information about the energy costs of an ASHP and water tank heating. If I "heat" my water tank at night the cost is very small as it's on an octopus night rate of 7.5p per kW so the ASHP will be very efficient at this time BUT my day rate is much much higher so when I need to warm my home in winter I would be technically paying more to run the ASHP than my gas boiler by a few hundred pounds, I don't like the sound of that plus all my showering and washing needs throughout the day is not great. A 180L water tank should be enough but I am not 100% convinced it's the best thing to do at the moment. So I appreciate your comment of being out of pocket as it's justified. Only underfloor heating is possibly viable but again it's not clear cut.
We've had panels for nearly five years connected to a small 3.3 kWh battery. Our heat pump's been in since December 2022. I confess to not having done all the sums on running costs. A larger battery would make sense. The solar currently fills it and heats the water along with cooking. Our oil boiler was in need of replacement so a pump was the way to go. No mains gas. We also get a few bob from exporting surplus electricity.😊 Why all new houses don't have panels is just silly. Keep up the good work. Peter
First of all thanks for all the instructive and entertaining videos you've done over the last few years. Like you, we've gone the whole hog and bought solar panels, batteries and a heat pump. Similar figures to what you've got here. While the solar/batteries aren't the best system ever, they are good enough for our needs. We've got a 7kW Vaillant aroTHERM plus heat pump. When undertaking these calculations, I also include the cost of petrol/diesel and account for 10k per annum mileage, which also makes quite a difference to the calculation, and that's before you factor in no VED (for now), lower servicing costs and so on. While we've only had the heat pump for 6 months, even in the coldest part of winter, our total cost for electricity was £120 and that was to run heat pump, power the house and charge the EV. Compare this to the near £300 per month we were paying previously on DD. Typical usage before the heat pump was 7kWh for normal electric consumption and 11kWh for gas. Overall SCOP on the heat pump (across both heating and DHW) has been 3.4 although hoping to improve that with tweaks once I eventually fit an Open Energy Monitor solution and can see what the system is doing properly. We did get the heat pump once the BUS was increased to £7,500 as it would have been crazy not to. Regardless of your politics and as you mentioned in the video, with parties seemingly committed to punishing fossil fuel usage, it seemed eminently sensible to get a heat pump while a subsidy was on offer.
You've been an EV driver for a few years now. You haven't factored in the fuel savings cost, being able to take advantage of any overnight tarrif. In our case that has been an extra £300 a month. Easily forgotten when you're far into the transtition already!
I'm from Belgium and 15 years ago we went into the rabbit hole of building a house. As I can be quite stingy and don't like to pay for fossile fuel, I certainly didn't want an oil-fire central heating. We went for a passive home to reduce heating costs to the max. As a heatpump for floor heating and hot water would have cost us 20K euro (remember full install of floor heating + heat pump + boiler) I ditched that idea and installed our solar panels, an solar boiler and just 1 pellet stove for roughly the same amount. Out electricity is almost free and cost for heating with the pellets during the winter is very low.
I've had a Growatt Battery system (6.5 KWH) for just over 2 years. It cost £3800 and has already paid back £1000 (2 years in). It charges at 7.5p along with my EV. You're video showing the maths of home storage convinced me to get this. I think it's been a great decision and helps balance the grid. I've just bought 2 solar panels (£65 each) to put on my woodsheds and they are bringing in 2-3 WKH a day, not cost effective but brings a smile to my face knowing that the leccy to run the telly is free.
Canadian here (but originally from England): we installed 10.5 kw of solar panels about 5 years ago. No rebates for us back then, but we haven’t paid for electricity since we installed them (including charging our Tesla). No battery or heat pump for us yet, but we’re gradually ridding ourselves of gas appliances; next ones to go will be our water heater and cook top (hob).
Dependant on what part of Canada you are living (along the border being the most populated) is very much further South than most of England which increases the suns intensity and solar panel output.
@@edc1569 Yep, I live in BC where we have net metering (and time of use was only very recently approved) and our power is very stable, so the value proposition for batteries isn't there for us at the moment. But we'll continue to evaluate it just in case that changes.
I looked at all of this as an investment in the house. Interest rates have been very low and were that way for a long time, so any savings made hardly anything. Investing in Solar first in 2011 and I was lucky to get the FiT payment which paid my expense back in 8 years. It was over 12k at that time for 4kWh of Solar PV. Later in 2020 added extra solar and a Tesla Powerwall. At that time most of our West facing solar was being used up and as we were now at home most of the time, a battery and the extra 4kWh solar on the east facing roof made sense, for that to fill the battery. In 2018 I was paying over £300 per month for electricity, LPG and petrol. These costs have gone up a lot since then, yet I have added an ASHP in Feb 2022 and have had an EV for past 3 years. Now for the whole home it is £90 per month including Home use, cooking, heating and 10,000 miles in my EV. My battery allows me to use 78.5% night rate of 7.5 pence per kWh averaged over the year.
@@SNORKYMEDIAPlus extra 4kw solar Plus cost of EV? This is not a criticism of the member’s post, I am genuinely interested in what his total capital outlay was, for a true assessment of his various upfront costs v savings. I appreciate that he may have bought/leased a comparable ICE vehicle anyway, but not everyone looking to reduce their energy costs is also looking for a new car EV or ICE
Have all 3 over in the East of England. Factoring in the EV pay back for me is 6 ish years. Covered all my roof space with pv, 17.7kw batteries. No more petrol bill and £1500 profit er yesr from solar export. I could factor in a chunk of the car as it was more to buy than the petrol version. So 7.5 years ish. If energy costs keep dropping and export price drops then it will take longer. But didn't do it to pay for itself, trying to be greener. The fact it makes a bit of profit and keeps my electric bill at £1 per month is purely a bonus
I'm getting there albeit slowly. I bought solar panels back in 2015, (Solaredge) 16x 250w on an east west roof. Got my first EV in 2019 and then went for battery storage. Being a DIYer I went with a 5kWh Victron MultiPlus inverter and a Fogstar 15.4kWh LiFePo battery. I now have the ability to add more solar to the Victron Total cost so far; Solar was just over 6k I do get FIT payments of about £700 a year, which means they've just paid for themselves on FIT alone and £4200 for the battery storage. I am going to install heat pumps, which i started 10 years ago, but mine will be air to air, so i can have cooling in the summer, that will just leave a water heating solution to decide (heat-pump or immersion) and then get rid of gas and the associated standing charge.
We have a 4 yr old high efficiency gas combi boiler, so that has stayed, but we have just in Apr 2024 fitted a 6kWp solar with 9.5kW battery system for just under £9,500 We've already seen our electricity daily costs go from +£2.75 to between -£4.00 and -£10.00, an average saving of about £8 a day (say roughly £50 a week for May). With some smart charge and discharge use over the winter months I think we should see annual saving of about £1,800) for the year, plus any 'giveback/bonus sessions Octopus have this winter as an extra bonus. Assuming no significant electric price rises, our Payback should be just over 5 years. That does not stop me wanting a 2nd 9.5 kW battery for additional days energy security, but the economics of it don't stack up for a house that averages 11kWh per day and might only sip 1-2kW from the 2nd.
We have all 3 but I'm in Colorado so the numbers are very different. Solar is excellent, energy costs are way lower and it gets both colder and hotter. Our total yearly energy costs will be around $500.Our payback for the solar and heat pumps is around 8 years. The battery for us is more of a backup-with our current tariff structure, it won't save us a lot of money. The cost was comparable to a whole house generator, a more common choice here. I calculate our house uses 86% less carbon which is a lot.
Once you've gotten the gas all the way out of the house try asking your insurance company if they want to do you a better deal. I know its so common to have gas that gas explosions aren't as such considered an Insurance expense/risk but it might knock 10£ of and all money is good money.
Thanks for the open and transparent explanation of your own install at today’s prices and the savings, etc. As you say, not for everyone. We have the same three, solar panels, heat pump, and then more solar and batteries. The heat pump does cost a lot to run in the winter but the house is comfortable warm all the time and this is balanced by the export income in summer so I hope our annual electricity bill will be around the zero mark. If I were doing again I would (a) have lots of solar panels (as we have), the extra cost of more panels whilst the scaffolding is up is relatively small, (b) have a smaller sized heat pump and increase radiator size further, I think our system is over-sized and so not as efficient as it could be, and (c) have to think long and hard about battery capacity - we probably have too much (14kWh), batteries are still expensive and you don’t need that much capacity to be able to see you through the peak electricity prices even running the heat pump. I was lucky enough to get the RHI grant but only went electric when the previous oil tank needed replacing and this was a better solution
Solar these days is approaching “no brainer” territory. Some panels I’ve seen for £50. In terms of cost per sq metre, it’s approaching fence panel and roof tile costs. Now that doesn’t including mounting costs, but it’s easy to imagine these becoming the ‘Goto’ material of choice for home upgrade projects, without even hooking up the electric cables! But mounting the panels in my experience is about 85% of all the hours anyway. Once mounted, easier to get an electrician to polish off the job.
My son has just replaced the leaking roofing felt on the pent roof of a garden workshop with 12 second hand panels from Bimble Solar. They're bolted together with a non-setting gasket and clamped down to the shed structure from underneath, total cost including 2.5kW inverter, wiring and fasteners was £950.
Hi, I have been following for a while now you are doing good work. But have you had a blower door test? Are you heating the house and it all going out the "window" What upgrades have you done to your home Your's john
Octopus cosy 6 heat pump being installed here currently 🎉 We have 4kw Solar ,5. Kw battery and charge overnight an EV 1200 miles a month. It’s crazy ,our usage for May was £37 (£15 of which is standing charges ) no hard sell required. Our payback was 4 years but that was £10 years ago and now we are fortunate to be well in the green. Like you our boiler needs replacing so we have been in talks with Octopus about the cosy 6 trial which after the BUS grant will be considerably cheaper than a boiler replacement quote we had.
Intetesting..how have you managed to get a cosy6 installed? Are you an octopus employee? Ive been on their waiting list for one since Greg Jackson presented it way back in september? (Ota) last year. In fact octopus heat pump team contacted me monday to advise that a noise analysis has to be submitted to the council planning dept at a cost of £330 cost...news to me! Did you have to have this for your install? Or is it council specific? I asked when the cosy6 installs are likely to commence, he said it would be in 6 to eight weeks. I saw a mockup of the cosy6 at the everything electric show in harrogate...ut seems that it is niw a mottled grey stone cilour rather than the pink octopus colur displayed at the initial presentation.
Basically, you're getting a $1800 return on $17500 invested, guaranteed every year and likely to increase with time. That's a guaranteed 10% return which matches long-term stock market growth (if your nerves can withstand the fluctuations), it's a return that is likely to increase and it helps the planet. As long as you buy quality equipment with 10+ year warranties, it's a no brainer. Over the past five years, I have basically done the same - my last electricity bill was $35 (about £18) per month - I live in Australia, so the solar works a bit better! 😃
The life of a battery is 10 to 15 years, then you’ve got to buy another one. Same for the hybrid inverter. So you need to make sure you get your moneys worth before having to replace kit. This is never factored into returns calculations. There’s also no guarantees for buying and selling your kwh’s. If everybody has solar panels eventually feed in tariffs will drop during peak sunny days. If everybody is charging their EV at night time it’s only a matter of time for the night tariffs to increase. If everybody has a battery then what effect does that have on pricing? I still want solar panels but my local electricity company has restricted feed in to 25 amps. So I can only put 5.2kw panels on the roof, which caps the amount I can earn from feed in tariff. I can only generate 1100 kWh per year based on PGIS. It still feels like I’m buying forward for electricity. Plus if I buy an electric car its value depreciates so fast, it wipes out savings on fuel via solar. If you want to setup in a cabin off grid setting up an electricity supply has never been easier. On grid I’m not convinced it makes financial sense unless you’re building a new house and you factor it into the build price.
Battery life isn't 10-15 years, it's 15-20+. There is no feed in tariif either so not sure what you mean by that? You can have as many solar panels as you want, it's the inverter that is capped.
Thank you EVM - your videos are a breath of fresh air! In my case, it’s heat pump plus solar with no battery (yet) as I can’t get a time of day tariff. my wife and I have an EV each so generally all spare solar goes into the cars (via the Zappi). Total cost (after grant) was £12.5k. Not including the FiT, our savings are £500 per year on energy bills (which now includes charging 2 EVs), about £150 per year on standing charge saving (having removed gas) and £750 saving on petrol. So about 9 years pay back. Not a stonking financial investment, but equally it’s still paying for itself in the long run so it works for me!
Good overview, I have also approx 6-7yrs pay back on Octopus Intelligent Go, running my 225m2 house continuously at 20-21C year round at say 600pounds per year in the north of Scotland (used to be easily 3500pounds per year). I have a 7kw Vaillant ASHP hybrid system (hot water done by a gas boiler just in case),, 20kW puredriveII's and 14x 425w PV (9xS and 5w). I think the investment is worth it, specially as I almost drive my car for free 🙂. just reading more comments, I haven't included fuel saving costs.....my car is an eHybrid with 540bhp 🙂 running on petrol only would set me back 130 pounds per tank (at say 480miles). Now I probably run 50-60% on electricity around town (solar or at 7p per kW over night charging, not bad I would say)
I guess one problem with replacing your gas boiler with a heatpump when it needs replacing is time. Its a cold January day and the boiler packs up. You call somebody out and they say its not worth repairing. So do you A) bite the bullet and get another gas boiler fitted within a few days. Or B) get a survey for a heat pump and wait 3 to 6 months for somebody to actually fit it. I have just been replacing my radiators to bigger ones as I have been decorating (hate having to paint radiators, they always look rubbish). So I can now run the gas boiler at lower flow rates to save money and hopefully when the day comes I'll be in a better place when its time to move to a heat pump .
I used Solar Together for my Solar and Battery system. They work with local councils and basically organise a buyers club, and Solar installers bid for the total work, passing on some of the discounts from buying hundreds of panels and batteries. I have 8 x 405W panels and 3 x 3kw server rack batteries, connected to a 3kw Solis hybrid inverter. Total cost was £10366 and it will be a year in Aug so will have more info then. The most frustrating time was waiting 3 months for DNO to get paid for export, so the grid had my peak period of solar, which included 30Kwh days, in September! but using the battery allowed me to use more of the solar. Try to time your install so you dont feel the frustration. 8-)
I’m in a new-build (2 years old) that sadly has a gas boiler, so won’t be switching to a heat pump any time soon. But I’ve invested in a cooperative ownership solar park through Ripple (not sure if it’s allowed to mention this) that should provide 100% of current electricity usage. In future it will make sense to balance that with a share in one of their wind farms and time will come when I replace the boiler with a heat pump and batteries.
My solar install was £5000 8 years ago for 4kw (but get the £1000 a year FIT - so a no brainer). But then added £4000 battery £3000 more solar panels. But my DD to Octopus is £20/month for electric on a 5 bed detached house + I run an EV off it - ok, only 5000 miles/year. Even without the FIT I'd be £3000/year electric saving. So I'm in profit for sure with the FIT included.
People look into the payback period because having any of these systems makes no difference to comfort or experience. For most of us it is entirely a financial instrument, so ROI is key. Because ROI is capped at whatever the original cost was, there is no need to bring the electricity and gas usage to zero, just focus on low hanging fruit. Recently was looking into adding more panels and battery and it doesn't make sense as payback on that part would be over 20 years.
This is different for AC or MVHR. While there's saving aspect to them as well they bring some new qualities to live (cooling and fresh air), so not all renewables are about ROI.
I have all of that although generally set up rather earlier. The overall effect was that the kit cost me more but the FIT and RHI returned more. We retired and had a lump sum which would have diminished with inflation so we invested in reduced future bills. The actual trigger however was ecological. Reduced carbon footprint. The savings were a bit of a gamble that paid off. We could only afford the setup because we had the cash, demonstrating that the less well off are at an unfair disadvantage.
I fell in love with the idea of alternative power after watching a lumberjack years ago on TV. Middle of nowhere he diverted a tiny stream to fit a small water wheel, powered his whole workshop for free, put it all back as was when he'd finished 🤯 It's essentially new tech making use of old ideas and natural resources without causing damage, if done properly, what's not to like?
My running cost went up to £700 a month when i had a eco4 grant with solar,heatpump, and wall/floor instullation. when back to LPG which costs me £1400 a year and £900. for electric a year.
We are the general public , employees came before us. We are mid terraced so the pumps going at the end of the garden. Downside is the cosy has to be 1m from the boundary so a little obtrusive. I’m thinking of getting planning permission or waiting for planning rules to change to move it closer to the fence as I believe it can be within 400 mil.
A friend of mine work night and so got a solar and ev, so in the day it setup to just charge the car, so far every morning it full recharged it as doesn’t travel to far. It’s also Nissan leaf so I was thinking with the vehicle to grid system, he could even maybe power small part of the day and cut his power bill even more and cut out the need for battery storage for the house. It likly the cheapest way to being off grid if you can fit you life style around it.
Although the Leaf can theoretically support V2G, it's pretty much impossible to get a V2G charger. House batteries don't need to be anything like as big as car batteries. 5kWh will store enough solar power to get you through the night, and they're under 1k now.
Best not to lump PV+battery with heat pump. The latter (currently) hardly save any money, unless you are comparing inefficient/broken system with a new one. Gas prices need to be above 25% of electricity prices for it to change, and that assumes a good HP installation.
Makes sense when you have older systems that need to be replaced. Or if you have the financial means to upgrade. For my Brother he lives part time on the Gulf Islands and Solar makes sense for him.
You make a fair comment about wages and labour costs of installing the system I'm actually from a town, not too far away from yourself but I bought a house in Manchester and the wages for me are higher here, sure, but equally, the cost of labour is so so much higher than in Yorkshire. It's why when I got my flat roof top insulation done, I got a company outside of the city
By way of comparison and for information to those considering. I've had solar (14 panels) 13.5kW battery (GE AIO) and an EV charger installed 3 weeks ago. The total cost was £13,800 I was quoted £1000 less by another company but i chose a larger established company who i felt more comfortable, with and didnt want any deposit. Im having a heat pump fitted to repkace my gas combi boiler. I am in a new build so the gas boiler is only 6 months old but is still a no brainer to have a heatpump fitted as I have been quoted £628 by British gas...i have two people lined up to buy my gas boiler for £1000! So, as I say a no-brainer for me! I have deferred my hp install ad my preference is for the cosy6 which I am told is 6-8 weeks before installs commence (slthough a poster on here is currently having one installed 🤔). Mainly for the aesthetics but also because I like to embrace new technology.
I am in the North East of Scotland and I installed a 12.3pKW solar system with 10kw inverter and battery from SolarEdge, cost me £21k then installed a Heat Pump but with the grant and selling my previous system and changed radiators I made £700. In total I am expecting a pay back in ~6years! It's a no brainer!
The after should include lost interest of, say, £500 per year, so the payback is slower. That said we have solar, battery, and Thinsulate 3m window film, but the reason was primarily environmental.
I think it is a bit of a no brainer even though the capital cost has gone up and interest rates (for savings) have risen. Unfortunately the installation costs in older properties is likely to be substantially more when you take into account the need for far better insulation for heat pumps to work effectively and the need for perhaps smaller bore piping and radiator replacement. I also worry that the maintenance costs may be higher and parts of the system - solar panels, inverter etc - may not have as long a life as a conventional gas/oil system.
4 bedroom house with solar panels here. We are around 3.5k a year in leccy and gas. Mind you we run a hottub all year round and have no access to economy tariffs because the smart meter installers never turn up.
I really like what you’ve done. I believe the latest recommendations in the uk are to not put lithium ion batteries inside the house. I’m guessing this will trickle through to cost of house insurance. I also suspect the batteries will require changing after 15 years.
We have a Sunsynk solar and battery system 10k battery 4k solar and 3.6k inverter. Both our cars are electric one own for 2.5 years one just few months zappi charger with an ev tariff our next step is heat pump we are getting quotes etc just waiting to save extra few pennies to get it but I wouldn’t change it for the world love that we are helping environment plus our own pocket at the same time. We also buy environmentally conscious products for the house such as cleaning products and clothes from vinted.
You forgot your petrol savings… and that’s part of the whole electrification deal. When I go heat pump I’ll need to think about additional batteries as well… I can’t imaging GE and a.n.other supplier playing nicely with each other though.
Then he would have to add the cost of the EV replacing the ICE car. Better to leave it as is for this calculation. But you are right, the whole shebang returns a far better ROI than bits here and there.
@@ablacknambercatI'm not sure about having to add the cost of the EV. Maybe add the difference between an EV and an ICE vehicle, but an EV will last way longer with way less expenditure, so just buying the car makes financial sense, the fueling of it is an additional cost/benefit.
@@simonpaine2347 petrol vs electronics more complex - could potentially (and may have actually) subtract ev charging from the household usage. But it’s a major contributor to which tarrif you choose.
@@JohnR31415 I just deducted my previous monthly petrol usage plus a bit for servicing etcétera and then factored that in. I'm comfortable with adding it that way.
As always a most interesting video. We are due to have our solar and battery installed this week, it’s a Give Energy system so hopefully I have the best 😉. The only extra thing I have done is install fire detection in the porch, where our fuse box is and the garage where the bits will live. Reason being someone down the road had a fuse box fire due to there car charger and if it hadn’t been for the Alex lights randomly flashing they would have died in their sleep. We also have a EV and charger which we found out a few weeks ago Pod Point hadn’t contacted National Grid to inform them, we are now waiting to be unlooped by National Grid as our supply goes through our neighbours company connection. As an ex fireman I suggest that people invest in extra fire detection for these systems for safety preferably mains powered.
Presumably the energy costs are based on an EV tarrif so the savings for non EV owners would be much less? We have solar, battery and heat pump. Our biggest savings are from having an EV and therefore access to cheaper electric.
Have a look at 'upsidedownfork's videos - he doesn't have an EV yet (too many kids!) and worked out that solar and a heat pump work out pretty well on some of the other tariffs, without a battery.
I only have a small stable block conversion, I have solar panels and I have had batteries installed, I admit I know absolutely nothing about heat pumps or what their function is, I have well and truly insulated my house, my solar panels are on a feed in tariff, I only have a hot water tank, I don't actually have any heating as such apart from a towel rail as my home remains warm in winter and cool in the summer. That extra £17500 you spent on all of those extras will ADD more than that to the value of your property should you decide to sell up, let alone the savings I've made, you're saving more than me, I'm in an all electric household too As far as electric vehicles go, I can't afford the initial purchase price, I don't have access to off road parking, the infrastructure is nearly non existent in this area and I'm not credit worthy so I can't pay for electricity to run an electric vehicle. Sadly I can't afford or be able to run an electric vehicle I had my installations not just to save money, but I'm around 10 years away from retirement and I'm thinking practically before it's too late, whilst I'm still working, I'm a single person, I don't see a pension covering the rising costs by the time I reach retirement age
I think your solar would cost more than 4k now I paid 3.9k for a 6 panel system on a south facing roof and that was by far the cheapest quote. Quotes Doubled doing it on 2 sides mainly because of scaffolding costs
I should have had a bigger battery / inverter, but I only had a 5. Even so, i pay £1 a month and pocket £100 this year when the spring was bad for solar. That £100 will pay for my ev charging so effectively covers my motoring. I have to have a new oil boiler, and will have air2air heating instead… so I will use maybe a few hundred in electricity instead of oil. But the hardware cost is no different to a replacement boiler. The saving a/c to my neighbours is 1-2 000 a year in electricity costs, so I will return my investment in less than 6 years. Less given the high cost year cost me nothing.
Great content thanks. We have libbi battery 18kW usable, small solar array and viessmann heat pump. We run and electric car which averages 500miles a month and an electric van which covers around 1200mile a month. No gas supply. May electric bill £ 122 including standing charge. Average electric unit cost 8p.
My parents are finally looking at a heat pump system, after many years of my dad point blank refusing the idea. Their big issue was they use bottled gas, and that is now eye wateringly expensive. Just letting them do the research on what grants that are availble to them.
When we installed pv, we did it more as an inflationary hedge, rather than an amazing payback. I expect a payback of 10 to 12 years. We also expect moving to heat pumps and we are starting a business where we are heating another space with heat pumps. Our solar panels main job is to keep us out of the high usage, high cost tiers. We also use it as a hedge against bad decisions on the part of government, and price gouging by corporations.
They are. The question is whether the heat pump is any good. Don’t forget Octopus’ business model is to be the British Gas of the renewable market (stack em high & sell em cheap) they also want to dominate the market. That never bodes well for the customer.
Good video. Another impact is what it does for the house value should you sell in the future. I agree there should be an allowance for maintenance in the figures to.
Just got all this installed in May so no idea what I will save. But so far it’s looking good. Had to get all the radiators and piping replaced so more expensive but in Scotland so got an extra 2500 grant for solar and interest free loan for most of the rest. Had the smart meter replaced as it couldn’t handle exporting plus it was reporting twice as much on the 30 minutes compared to the monthly readings. That and 3 cars means it will take me months to get any reasonable idea of how much I am saving.
This system will work on a new build designed to maximise the savings. But you need a slightly larger property for a plant room to house all the gubbins along with underfloor heating . I've got solid walls i.e no cavity and paid 10K (no grant) for exterior insulation in 2020 new gas boiler was 3K, no hot water tank. boiler in kitchen cabiente no extra space needed.I put 50 % of ground floor on u/floor heating as part of an extension and remoldeling. My energy bills are around 2.2K with gas being 1K. Pay back for my exterior insulation is north of 20 years. My maintenance costs are £60 boiler service fee and warranty is 10 years. With the solar , heat pump and battery systems lies a future maintenance and replacement cost that is unknown so unless you put away a sink fund , then a nasty suprise is not far away. I'm not saying its not the future but retrofitting is not really cost effective for a large portion of the UK's housing stock. I have enjoyed the videos though
You don't need underfloor heating. Makes it more efficient but it's far from a requirement. Solar and batteries have no maintainence at all. Warranty is 25 years+ on Solar and 12 years on battery (lifespan is longer than warranty, expect 15-20 years at least)
Just about to swap my diesel for an EV and have been crunching the numbers on electricity tariffs. My roof is no good for solar and no home battery so for me it's just the EV. Have to say unless you can schedule virtually your entire usage to cheap rate periods EV tariffs are a waste of time in isolation
The best investment in my house was my home battery. I first bought a 10kw but wasn’t enough so went for another 10kw and that seems to have done the trick.
Hi, In 2018 I paid £280,000 for a bungalow reduced from £299,950 and previously advertised at over £300,000. Earlier this year the property next door sold for £415,000 - it historically sells for less than mine. In 2022 I spent £11,225 on a Solar PV system with batteries thus my total expenditure on the property was £291,225 so what is the point of payback calculations per your presentation considering I would more than recover my Solar PV costs when eventually selling my property? Do purchasers of properties which already have Solar PV, battery storage and heat pumps installed separate out the relevant costs to estimate the payback for these components? I do not understand!! Regarding payback, this leaves funds which have not been subjected to income tax, national insurance etc. How does this change payback calculations if at all?🤔🤔🤔
I often hear the “when will this pay for itself “ question about our solar, heat pump, insulation, and EV from people who just spent $20,000 on a kitchen remodel. They have no way of knowing if that kitchen upgrade will ever pay off but they value the results just like we value the results of the solar, heat pump and EV.
Kitchen remodel analogy is silly, if your kitchen is knackered you only have one option to replace it, a new kitchen. Whereas if your gas boiler is knackered you have two options, and modern gas boiler or some or all of what you have seen in the video, in which case payback matters and can help you decide. Especially when you aren’t sure how long you are staying in your current home.
@@COSolar6419 like replacing a fully functioning gas boiler with a heat pump etc, both produce heat, both are hidden away and not on show, the only differentiating factor is cost of ownership.
It seems to me that the whole payback time period calculation is mainly carried out by those who have yet to take the plunge. You weigh up what you can afford and how much it's all going to cost and then it makes you feel better if you convince yourself that it will not only save you money but will also end up paying for itself. Once the system is up and running, who cares how much it cost? I'm only interested in how much I'm saving on a daily basis using smart tariffs, solar, battery and (soon to be installed) heat pump. I see it like spending a couple of grand on a nice holiday and then wondering how it's going to pay for itself. You want something and you have the money to pay for it? Enjoy the planning and research and then enjoy the cost savings. Not to mention the feel-good factor of helping the environment.
Couldn't agree more about the "it doesn't make financial sense" brigade. I've abused the environment in my early life and I see this as a kind of payback to the environment. If only we all did whatever we could to leave the planet a better place thsn we found it.
Their domestic grid is fairly green. Their industrial grid isn't, but also you currently can't get around the whole needing coking coal for stainless steel thing We have exported a lot of industry there, and they still emit far fewer emissions per capita than the UK where the industrial revolution began.
I'm a touch wary of heat pumps, mostly due to the refrigerants having a GWP which is potentially higher than methane Though this being said, the refrigerant in there would have to leak before it's an issue, and I'm not sure how long R290 stays in the atmosphere Realistically you could have a GWP of say 1500, and if it dissipates from the atmosphere in just a few days, that's a massive win. I will however end up getting a heat pump regardless, but I'm a touch wary on the GWP thing.
@@NigelSavagery Apparently China just opened a 200,000 acre (80,000 hectare) solar array, the largest in the world. Yeah, they're big on coal, but apparently are doing enough with renewables to cover all household usage (but not industrial usage). Their emissions are enormous, no doubt, compared to the rest of the world, but there's apparently a lot of renewables being installed too. With solar panels so cheap, world-wide more solar is being installed (by dollar value) than any other source. So, despite my scepticism, China might actually transition to renewables.
@@NigelSavagery China is now the worlds biggest energy producer and consumer. Yes the majority of this unfortunately still comes from coal, however that will change in the next year, with wind, solar, hydro and battery storage increasing at the highest rate in any country in the world. In 10 years or less they will be exporting clean energy to their less fortunate neighbours.
@@NigelSavagery Why would China be laughing? Because they sold the products that I'm using to reduce my carbon footprint and make a small payback? Perhaps you should look around your home and check where your TV, and the majority of all of your electro domestic products are made. Your car will have Chinese parts in it. If not from new, then the replacement parts will be. Perhaps they are laughing at you as well? Perhaps they are laughing at all of us? Perhaps we shouldn't worry about what other people think or do?
Being a real estate salesperson in new Zealand i understand people's attitude to "payback". People here move on average every 5-7yrs so a big investment's in infrastructure that you can't really take with you is a factor. A new kitchen is probably more desirable unfortunately than a solar system for adding value to a home for resale - sad but true!. I've gone to a heat pump water system and ducted heating and cooling, I definitely want solar, just because i think it's the right move, rather than payback, especially with 2 EVs not to mention our dumbarse government have started "taxing" EVs with road user charges and removed rebates. Go "green" new Zealand! 😝
I've gone the other way and spent on insulating and Double glazing. For many that will sound strange, but in Australia we live in large energy sieves. By plugging up the holes we can now go through the heating season with a 45% decrease, based on the previous 2 years bills. So I ask is there anything you can do to improve your numbers in this department Andy?
I dont have any of this and intention of getting it any time soon. However if gas was discovered today there is no way something that explodes or could kill you in your sleep would ever be allowed into peoples homes.
Are your saving greater if you factor in recent higher energy costs and the benefits of charging your electric car at home? That is, what were your savings in yr1, yr2, yr3 etc. ?
I don't remember EVM saying how many kW of solar he was getting for his £4,000, or his supplier, but I can't find anyone who'll do a small 4kW system for less than £7000. How is he getting these prices? Ditto £10,200 for 19kW of batteries is incredibly cheap. I've been quotes nearly double that in south Oxfordshire by 3 different firms. The payback period ought to factor in that the solar inverter will need replacing after 10-12 years and the batteries may last no longer than 10 years and will see declining performance. The ASHP also seems super-cheap. Is it a very small pump, because the house is already super-insulated? What is its SAP or heat loss rating? Nice video but there's loads of missing data here I'm afraid.
I’ve installed all that you’ve installed with the exception of the heatpump which was installed by Octopus Energy. Like you I’m not that interested in pay back as like you I feel it’s a nonsense. However I had the money to do all and whilst in the bank it was earning very little. Now I estimate it’s giving me a return of more than 6% that’s taking into account the FIT payment I get which is the lowest amount before it ended. Does my heatpump heat my house? Absolutely, what’s more my wife on blood thinners needs heat so our house is always at 21-22.5°c.
Is the inverter a True Sine wave inverter? "Pure" sine wave is just marketing. But non-sine wave inverters are really risky for appliances that have a motor in it. Can you please confirm this?
Very interesting, thanks for doing this. Did you include the fuel savings from switching from ICE to cheap nighttime or 'free' solar electricity charging EV? Also did u include any savings of selling solar back to grid?
All included in the price. I barely needed any changes, it's a bit of a myth with modern HPs that you need to replace all pipes and rads etc. You don't.
Bit baffled re: the heat pump cost. Ive just been quoted 16.5k, so with the grant (which is higher now) it'll be costing me 9k. This is with heat geek, and includes a few radiators. I've ripped out my gas boiler during a renovation already so pretty much already committed to it but i was pretty shocked at the cost. I was expecting 4-6k.
@@ElectricVehicleMan hmm, my other quote was indeed cheaper (10k total), but they advised a 12kw unit to heat my 3 bed semi. Heat geek advised a 5kw vaillant with radiator upgrades. I'd be paying a fortune in electricity to run an oversized unit. I suspect people having 2-3k installations are not have proper heat loss assessments done and it's luck of the draw as to whether the system works properly or costs them a fortune and/or doesn't heat the house
Funny how we get different deals. I paid £18,500 for 5kwp solar, optimisers, solar edge inverter and Powerwall and gateway last year. But just paid £1560 for heat pump, new tank and 14 new radiators. The only thing I think you have missed is the loss of interest on the money. You would probably would have got circa £1000 a year interest on your “investment”. I bought mine for “geekary” reasons but enjoy the savings. 😂
Ok. But how thermally efficient was your house in the first place? To be fair, it's always the missing: how many kWh of heat does your house need to maintain X temperature over y outside temperature.(Assuming you don't use AC, but you're in Yorkshire so I presume you just open the windows and let that Yorkshire breeze in. Thanks for this.
I bought a house which had coal-fired central heating.
I bought a heat pump.
The payback is that the house isn’t always cold now, and we don’t spend all our time shovelling coal.
Sometimes the payback is more than just financial.
I'm 71 and had solar since 2015 then battery next heat pump , had the gas meter removed today i did it because it makes sense and i love the tec and future proofing against price increases. it more money in your pocket now as you yearly wages goes further for you to save or spend on other pleasures
Exactly , plus not only do we have more free money but we are free with electricity around the house because… well it’s free!
@@thepete129 Yes i have spent all my saving on solar Powerwall and now Air to Air HVAC but im still saving what income i do have , if the Powerwall 2 comes down in price it wont take me long to by another one as my small income goes a long way now .
@@thepete129Free after you've paid off the investment
@@NigelSavagery Why ? im having Air to Air mini split HVAC i only use one room mostly .
@@NigelSavagery First off I kind of agree with you, I have sola"4kw"and batteries "10kw"and I am considering an ASHP but I have come across conflicting information about the energy costs of an ASHP and water tank heating.
If I "heat" my water tank at night the cost is very small as it's on an octopus night rate of 7.5p per kW so the ASHP will be very efficient at this time BUT my day rate is much much higher so when I need to warm my home in winter I would be technically paying more to run the ASHP than my gas boiler by a few hundred pounds, I don't like the sound of that plus all my showering and washing needs throughout the day is not great.
A 180L water tank should be enough but I am not 100% convinced it's the best thing to do at the moment.
So I appreciate your comment of being out of pocket as it's justified.
Only underfloor heating is possibly viable but again it's not clear cut.
My Octopus heatpump has just been fitted….price was £400 after the grant
How?
No gas standing charge
We've had panels for nearly five years connected to a small 3.3 kWh battery. Our heat pump's been in since December 2022.
I confess to not having done all the sums on running costs.
A larger battery would make sense. The solar currently fills it and heats the water
along with cooking.
Our oil boiler was in need of replacement so a pump was the way to go. No mains gas.
We also get a few bob from exporting surplus electricity.😊
Why all new houses don't have panels is just silly.
Keep up the good work.
Peter
First of all thanks for all the instructive and entertaining videos you've done over the last few years.
Like you, we've gone the whole hog and bought solar panels, batteries and a heat pump. Similar figures to what you've got here. While the solar/batteries aren't the best system ever, they are good enough for our needs. We've got a 7kW Vaillant aroTHERM plus heat pump. When undertaking these calculations, I also include the cost of petrol/diesel and account for 10k per annum mileage, which also makes quite a difference to the calculation, and that's before you factor in no VED (for now), lower servicing costs and so on.
While we've only had the heat pump for 6 months, even in the coldest part of winter, our total cost for electricity was £120 and that was to run heat pump, power the house and charge the EV. Compare this to the near £300 per month we were paying previously on DD. Typical usage before the heat pump was 7kWh for normal electric consumption and 11kWh for gas. Overall SCOP on the heat pump (across both heating and DHW) has been 3.4 although hoping to improve that with tweaks once I eventually fit an Open Energy Monitor solution and can see what the system is doing properly.
We did get the heat pump once the BUS was increased to £7,500 as it would have been crazy not to. Regardless of your politics and as you mentioned in the video, with parties seemingly committed to punishing fossil fuel usage, it seemed eminently sensible to get a heat pump while a subsidy was on offer.
You've been an EV driver for a few years now. You haven't factored in the fuel savings cost, being able to take advantage of any overnight tarrif. In our case that has been an extra £300 a month. Easily forgotten when you're far into the transtition already!
i thought that when he said about savings , i got 5 litres of petrol for my mower and it was over £9 my last ICE did about 30 mpg
@@rodden1953 yes, i was shocked at the price too when i went for a gallon of petrol for my mower😱
Came here to say the same. I also forgot to add the petrol savings in my first calculations!
Huge difference!
Same, servicing and fuel savings are about 5k a year for me
@@David-bl1bt i recon that most ICE cars cant do much more than 30 mpg . a few hours of sun and the Zappi charger is like saving 20 quid .
I'm from Belgium and 15 years ago we went into the rabbit hole of building a house. As I can be quite stingy and don't like to pay for fossile fuel, I certainly didn't want an oil-fire central heating.
We went for a passive home to reduce heating costs to the max. As a heatpump for floor heating and hot water would have cost us 20K euro (remember full install of floor heating + heat pump + boiler) I ditched that idea and installed our solar panels, an solar boiler and just 1 pellet stove for roughly the same amount.
Out electricity is almost free and cost for heating with the pellets during the winter is very low.
Thank you EV Man! Really appreciate your content!
Many thanks! 👍
I've had a Growatt Battery system (6.5 KWH) for just over 2 years. It cost £3800 and has already paid back £1000 (2 years in). It charges at 7.5p along with my EV. You're video showing the maths of home storage convinced me to get this. I think it's been a great decision and helps balance the grid. I've just bought 2 solar panels (£65 each) to put on my woodsheds and they are bringing in 2-3 WKH a day, not cost effective but brings a smile to my face knowing that the leccy to run the telly is free.
lol. Thanks for fixing the £10.2k ;)
Canadian here (but originally from England): we installed 10.5 kw of solar panels about 5 years ago. No rebates for us back then, but we haven’t paid for electricity since we installed them (including charging our Tesla). No battery or heat pump for us yet, but we’re gradually ridding ourselves of gas appliances; next ones to go will be our water heater and cook top (hob).
Dependant on what part of Canada you are living (along the border being the most populated) is very much further South than most of England which increases the suns intensity and solar panel output.
I understand in a lot of Canada you have net metering type arrangements (benefit of hydro) so batteries make little sense?
@@andymacleod2365 Yup, that's true. I live in Kelowna, BC, which is about as far south as Paris. The climate here is one reason why I left England!
@@edc1569 Yep, I live in BC where we have net metering (and time of use was only very recently approved) and our power is very stable, so the value proposition for batteries isn't there for us at the moment. But we'll continue to evaluate it just in case that changes.
What battery are you talking about that is half that price?
Expensive battery ! 5KWhr 48V lithium Iron Phosphate LiFePO4 cells are below GBP 800 each now.
I looked at all of this as an investment in the house. Interest rates have been very low and were that way for a long time, so any savings made hardly anything. Investing in Solar first in 2011 and I was lucky to get the FiT payment which paid my expense back in 8 years. It was over 12k at that time for 4kWh of Solar PV.
Later in 2020 added extra solar and a Tesla Powerwall. At that time most of our West facing solar was being used up and as we were now at home most of the time, a battery and the extra 4kWh solar on the east facing roof made sense, for that to fill the battery.
In 2018 I was paying over £300 per month for electricity, LPG and petrol. These costs have gone up a lot since then, yet I have added an ASHP in Feb 2022 and have had an EV for past 3 years. Now for the whole home it is £90 per month including Home use, cooking, heating and 10,000 miles in my EV. My battery allows me to use 78.5% night rate of 7.5 pence per kWh averaged over the year.
But how much was the ashp and battery?? £20k?
@@SNORKYMEDIAPlus extra 4kw solar Plus cost of EV? This is not a criticism of the member’s post, I am genuinely interested in what his total capital outlay was, for a true assessment of his various upfront costs v savings. I appreciate that he may have bought/leased a comparable ICE vehicle anyway, but not everyone looking to reduce their energy costs is also looking for a new car EV or ICE
Well done! This is exactly the sort of information that is very useful.
Have all 3 over in the East of England. Factoring in the EV pay back for me is 6 ish years. Covered all my roof space with pv, 17.7kw batteries. No more petrol bill and £1500 profit er yesr from solar export. I could factor in a chunk of the car as it was more to buy than the petrol version. So 7.5 years ish. If energy costs keep dropping and export price drops then it will take longer. But didn't do it to pay for itself, trying to be greener. The fact it makes a bit of profit and keeps my electric bill at £1 per month is purely a bonus
I'm getting there albeit slowly. I bought solar panels back in 2015, (Solaredge) 16x 250w on an east west roof. Got my first EV in 2019 and then went for battery storage. Being a DIYer I went with a 5kWh Victron MultiPlus inverter and a Fogstar 15.4kWh LiFePo battery. I now have the ability to add more solar to the Victron
Total cost so far;
Solar was just over 6k I do get FIT payments of about £700 a year, which means they've just paid for themselves on FIT alone
and £4200 for the battery storage.
I am going to install heat pumps, which i started 10 years ago, but mine will be air to air, so i can have cooling in the summer, that will just leave a water heating solution to decide (heat-pump or immersion) and then get rid of gas and the associated standing charge.
We have a 4 yr old high efficiency gas combi boiler, so that has stayed, but we have just in Apr 2024 fitted a 6kWp solar with 9.5kW battery system for just under £9,500
We've already seen our electricity daily costs go from +£2.75 to between -£4.00 and -£10.00, an average saving of about £8 a day (say roughly £50 a week for May).
With some smart charge and discharge use over the winter months I think we should see annual saving of about £1,800) for the year, plus any 'giveback/bonus sessions Octopus have this winter as an extra bonus.
Assuming no significant electric price rises, our Payback should be just over 5 years.
That does not stop me wanting a 2nd 9.5 kW battery for additional days energy security, but the economics of it don't stack up for a house that averages 11kWh per day and might only sip 1-2kW from the 2nd.
We have all 3 but I'm in Colorado so the numbers are very different. Solar is excellent, energy costs are way lower and it gets both colder and hotter. Our total yearly energy costs will be around $500.Our payback for the solar and heat pumps is around 8 years. The battery for us is more of a backup-with our current tariff structure, it won't save us a lot of money. The cost was comparable to a whole house generator, a more common choice here. I calculate our house uses 86% less carbon which is a lot.
What part of Colorado?
@@bearcubdaycare Aurora.
Once you've gotten the gas all the way out of the house try asking your insurance company if they want to do you a better deal. I know its so common to have gas that gas explosions aren't as such considered an Insurance expense/risk but it might knock 10£ of and all money is good money.
The insurance angle on this has defeated me.
Thanks for the open and transparent explanation of your own install at today’s prices and the savings, etc. As you say, not for everyone.
We have the same three, solar panels, heat pump, and then more solar and batteries.
The heat pump does cost a lot to run in the winter but the house is comfortable warm all the time and this is balanced by the export income in summer so I hope our annual electricity bill will be around the zero mark.
If I were doing again I would (a) have lots of solar panels (as we have), the extra cost of more panels whilst the scaffolding is up is relatively small, (b) have a smaller sized heat pump and increase radiator size further, I think our system is over-sized and so not as efficient as it could be, and (c) have to think long and hard about battery capacity - we probably have too much (14kWh), batteries are still expensive and you don’t need that much capacity to be able to see you through the peak electricity prices even running the heat pump.
I was lucky enough to get the RHI grant but only went electric when the previous oil tank needed replacing and this was a better solution
Appreciate the honesty!
Solar these days is approaching “no brainer” territory. Some panels I’ve seen for £50. In terms of cost per sq metre, it’s approaching fence panel and roof tile costs. Now that doesn’t including mounting costs, but it’s easy to imagine these becoming the ‘Goto’ material of choice for home upgrade projects, without even hooking up the electric cables! But mounting the panels in my experience is about 85% of all the hours anyway. Once mounted, easier to get an electrician to polish off the job.
My son has just replaced the leaking roofing felt on the pent roof of a garden workshop with 12 second hand panels from Bimble Solar. They're bolted together with a non-setting gasket and clamped down to the shed structure from underneath, total cost including 2.5kW inverter, wiring and fasteners was £950.
Hi, I have been following for a while now you are doing good work.
But have you had a blower door test? Are you heating the house and it all going out the "window"
What upgrades have you done to your home
Your's john
Octopus cosy 6 heat pump being installed here currently 🎉
We have 4kw Solar ,5. Kw battery and charge overnight an EV 1200 miles a month. It’s crazy ,our usage for May was £37 (£15 of which is standing charges ) no hard sell required. Our payback was 4 years but that was £10 years ago and now we are fortunate to be well in the green.
Like you our boiler needs replacing so we have been in talks with Octopus about the cosy 6 trial which after the BUS grant will be considerably cheaper than a boiler replacement quote we had.
Intetesting..how have you managed to get a cosy6 installed? Are you an octopus employee?
Ive been on their waiting list for one since Greg Jackson presented it way back in september? (Ota) last year.
In fact octopus heat pump team contacted me monday to advise that a noise analysis has to be submitted to the council planning dept at a cost of £330 cost...news to me! Did you have to have this for your install? Or is it council specific?
I asked when the cosy6 installs are likely to commence, he said it would be in 6 to eight weeks.
I saw a mockup of the cosy6 at the everything electric show in harrogate...ut seems that it is niw a mottled grey stone cilour rather than the pink octopus colur displayed at the initial presentation.
Basically, you're getting a $1800 return on $17500 invested, guaranteed every year and likely to increase with time. That's a guaranteed 10% return which matches long-term stock market growth (if your nerves can withstand the fluctuations), it's a return that is likely to increase and it helps the planet. As long as you buy quality equipment with 10+ year warranties, it's a no brainer. Over the past five years, I have basically done the same - my last electricity bill was $35 (about £18) per month - I live in Australia, so the solar works a bit better! 😃
The life of a battery is 10 to 15 years, then you’ve got to buy another one. Same for the hybrid inverter. So you need to make sure you get your moneys worth before having to replace kit. This is never factored into returns calculations. There’s also no guarantees for buying and selling your kwh’s. If everybody has solar panels eventually feed in tariffs will drop during peak sunny days. If everybody is charging their EV at night time it’s only a matter of time for the night tariffs to increase. If everybody has a battery then what effect does that have on pricing? I still want solar panels but my local electricity company has restricted feed in to 25 amps. So I can only put 5.2kw panels on the roof, which caps the amount I can earn from feed in tariff. I can only generate 1100 kWh per year based on PGIS. It still feels like I’m buying forward for electricity. Plus if I buy an electric car its value depreciates so fast, it wipes out savings on fuel via solar. If you want to setup in a cabin off grid setting up an electricity supply has never been easier. On grid I’m not convinced it makes financial sense unless you’re building a new house and you factor it into the build price.
Battery life isn't 10-15 years, it's 15-20+.
There is no feed in tariif either so not sure what you mean by that? You can have as many solar panels as you want, it's the inverter that is capped.
@@sc-lj9cpThe man speaks sense
Thank you EVM - your videos are a breath of fresh air!
In my case, it’s heat pump plus solar with no battery (yet) as I can’t get a time of day tariff. my wife and I have an EV each so generally all spare solar goes into the cars (via the Zappi). Total cost (after grant) was £12.5k. Not including the FiT, our savings are £500 per year on energy bills (which now includes charging 2 EVs), about £150 per year on standing charge saving (having removed gas) and £750 saving on petrol. So about 9 years pay back. Not a stonking financial investment, but equally it’s still paying for itself in the long run so it works for me!
Good overview, I have also approx 6-7yrs pay back on Octopus Intelligent Go, running my 225m2 house continuously at 20-21C year round at say 600pounds per year in the north of Scotland (used to be easily 3500pounds per year). I have a 7kw Vaillant ASHP hybrid system (hot water done by a gas boiler just in case),, 20kW puredriveII's and 14x 425w PV (9xS and 5w). I think the investment is worth it, specially as I almost drive my car for free 🙂. just reading more comments, I haven't included fuel saving costs.....my car is an eHybrid with 540bhp 🙂 running on petrol only would set me back 130 pounds per tank (at say 480miles). Now I probably run 50-60% on electricity around town (solar or at 7p per kW over night charging, not bad I would say)
Rich people have different mindsets well done buddy love your setup.
I guess one problem with replacing your gas boiler with a heatpump when it needs replacing is time.
Its a cold January day and the boiler packs up. You call somebody out and they say its not worth repairing. So do you A) bite the bullet and get another gas boiler fitted within a few days. Or B) get a survey for a heat pump and wait 3 to 6 months for somebody to actually fit it.
I have just been replacing my radiators to bigger ones as I have been decorating (hate having to paint radiators, they always look rubbish). So I can now run the gas boiler at lower flow rates to save money and hopefully when the day comes I'll be in a better place when its time to move to a heat pump .
Yeah could be an issue in January, but normally you get a bit of warning from them that things are going south.
I used Solar Together for my Solar and Battery system. They work with local councils and basically organise a buyers club, and Solar installers bid for the total work, passing on some of the discounts from buying hundreds of panels and batteries. I have 8 x 405W panels and 3 x 3kw server rack batteries, connected to a 3kw Solis hybrid inverter. Total cost was £10366 and it will be a year in Aug so will have more info then.
The most frustrating time was waiting 3 months for DNO to get paid for export, so the grid had my peak period of solar, which included 30Kwh days, in September! but using the battery allowed me to use more of the solar.
Try to time your install so you dont feel the frustration. 8-)
Thank you for standardising your numbers on the whiteboard, it was really bugging me.
I’m in a new-build (2 years old) that sadly has a gas boiler, so won’t be switching to a heat pump any time soon. But I’ve invested in a cooperative ownership solar park through Ripple (not sure if it’s allowed to mention this) that should provide 100% of current electricity usage. In future it will make sense to balance that with a share in one of their wind farms and time will come when I replace the boiler with a heat pump and batteries.
Excellent, even the sun has a reflected sun on it, the future could not be brighter.
My solar install was £5000 8 years ago for 4kw (but get the £1000 a year FIT - so a no brainer). But then added £4000 battery £3000 more solar panels. But my DD to Octopus is £20/month for electric on a 5 bed detached house + I run an EV off it - ok, only 5000 miles/year. Even without the FIT I'd be £3000/year electric saving. So I'm in profit for sure with the FIT included.
People look into the payback period because having any of these systems makes no difference to comfort or experience. For most of us it is entirely a financial instrument, so ROI is key. Because ROI is capped at whatever the original cost was, there is no need to bring the electricity and gas usage to zero, just focus on low hanging fruit. Recently was looking into adding more panels and battery and it doesn't make sense as payback on that part would be over 20 years.
This is different for AC or MVHR. While there's saving aspect to them as well they bring some new qualities to live (cooling and fresh air), so not all renewables are about ROI.
I have all of that although generally set up rather earlier. The overall effect was that the kit cost me more but the FIT and RHI returned more. We retired and had a lump sum which would have diminished with inflation so we invested in reduced future bills. The actual trigger however was ecological. Reduced carbon footprint. The savings were a bit of a gamble that paid off. We could only afford the setup because we had the cash, demonstrating that the less well off are at an unfair disadvantage.
The heating engineers in our area advise against heat pumps because they can’t heat houses in north of Scotland. It’s too cold here.
I fell in love with the idea of alternative power after watching a lumberjack years ago on TV.
Middle of nowhere he diverted a tiny stream to fit a small water wheel, powered his whole workshop for free, put it all back as was when he'd finished 🤯
It's essentially new tech making use of old ideas and natural resources without causing damage, if done properly, what's not to like?
My running cost went up to £700 a month when i had a eco4 grant with solar,heatpump, and wall/floor instullation. when back to LPG which costs me £1400 a year and £900. for electric a year.
We are the general public , employees came before us. We are mid terraced so the pumps going at the end of the garden. Downside is the cosy has to be 1m from the boundary so a little obtrusive. I’m thinking of getting planning permission or waiting for planning rules to change to move it closer to the fence as I believe it can be within 400 mil.
A friend of mine work night and so got a solar and ev, so in the day it setup to just charge the car, so far every morning it full recharged it as doesn’t travel to far. It’s also Nissan leaf so I was thinking with the vehicle to grid system, he could even maybe power small part of the day and cut his power bill even more and cut out the need for battery storage for the house. It likly the cheapest way to being off grid if you can fit you life style around it.
Although the Leaf can theoretically support V2G, it's pretty much impossible to get a V2G charger.
House batteries don't need to be anything like as big as car batteries. 5kWh will store enough solar power to get you through the night, and they're under 1k now.
good video for people wanting to save money in the long run.. well worth it👍
Best not to lump PV+battery with heat pump. The latter (currently) hardly save any money, unless you are comparing inefficient/broken system with a new one. Gas prices need to be above 25% of electricity prices for it to change, and that assumes a good HP installation.
Makes sense when you have older systems that need to be replaced. Or if you have the financial means to upgrade. For my Brother he lives part time on the Gulf Islands and Solar makes sense for him.
You make a fair comment about wages and labour costs of installing the system
I'm actually from a town, not too far away from yourself but I bought a house in Manchester and the wages for me are higher here, sure, but equally, the cost of labour is so so much higher than in Yorkshire.
It's why when I got my flat roof top insulation done, I got a company outside of the city
By way of comparison and for information to those considering.
I've had solar (14 panels) 13.5kW battery (GE AIO) and an EV charger installed 3 weeks ago.
The total cost was £13,800
I was quoted £1000 less by another company but i chose a larger established company who i felt more comfortable, with and didnt want any deposit.
Im having a heat pump fitted to repkace my gas combi boiler. I am in a new build so the gas boiler is only 6 months old but is still a no brainer to have a heatpump fitted as I have been quoted £628 by British gas...i have two people lined up to buy my gas boiler for £1000! So, as I say a no-brainer for me!
I have deferred my hp install ad my preference is for the cosy6 which I am told is 6-8 weeks before installs commence (slthough a poster on here is currently having one installed 🤔). Mainly for the aesthetics but also because I like to embrace new technology.
I am in the North East of Scotland and I installed a 12.3pKW solar system with 10kw inverter and battery from SolarEdge, cost me £21k then installed a Heat Pump but with the grant and selling my previous system and changed radiators I made £700. In total I am expecting a pay back in ~6years!
It's a no brainer!
The after should include lost interest of, say, £500 per year, so the payback is slower. That said we have solar, battery, and Thinsulate 3m window film, but the reason was primarily environmental.
I think it is a bit of a no brainer even though the capital cost has gone up and interest rates (for savings) have risen. Unfortunately the installation costs in older properties is likely to be substantially more when you take into account the need for far better insulation for heat pumps to work effectively and the need for perhaps smaller bore piping and radiator replacement. I also worry that the maintenance costs may be higher and parts of the system - solar panels, inverter etc - may not have as long a life as a conventional gas/oil system.
4 bedroom house with solar panels here. We are around 3.5k a year in leccy and gas. Mind you we run a hottub all year round and have no access to economy tariffs because the smart meter installers never turn up.
Do you have Octopus Energy ? my experience is that they are prompt to install a smart meter
Lovely orange patch leads 😉
I really like what you’ve done. I believe the latest recommendations in the uk are to not put lithium ion batteries inside the house. I’m guessing this will trickle through to cost of house insurance. I also suspect the batteries will require changing after 15 years.
These aren’t lithium ion.
We have a Sunsynk solar and battery system 10k battery 4k solar and 3.6k inverter. Both our cars are electric one own for 2.5 years one just few months zappi charger with an ev tariff our next step is heat pump we are getting quotes etc just waiting to save extra few pennies to get it but I wouldn’t change it for the world love that we are helping environment plus our own pocket at the same time. We also buy environmentally conscious products for the house such as cleaning products and clothes from vinted.
You forgot your petrol savings… and that’s part of the whole electrification deal.
When I go heat pump I’ll need to think about additional batteries as well… I can’t imaging GE and a.n.other supplier playing nicely with each other though.
Then he would have to add the cost of the EV replacing the ICE car. Better to leave it as is for this calculation. But you are right, the whole shebang returns a far better ROI than bits here and there.
@@ablacknambercatI'm not sure about having to add the cost of the EV. Maybe add the difference between an EV and an ICE vehicle, but an EV will last way longer with way less expenditure, so just buying the car makes financial sense, the fueling of it is an additional cost/benefit.
@@simonpaine2347 petrol vs electronics more complex - could potentially (and may have actually) subtract ev charging from the household usage. But it’s a major contributor to which tarrif you choose.
@@JohnR31415 I just deducted my previous monthly petrol usage plus a bit for servicing etcétera and then factored that in. I'm comfortable with adding it that way.
As always a most interesting video. We are due to have our solar and battery installed this week, it’s a Give Energy system so hopefully I have the best 😉. The only extra thing I have done is install fire detection in the porch, where our fuse box is and the garage where the bits will live. Reason being someone down the road had a fuse box fire due to there car charger and if it hadn’t been for the Alex lights randomly flashing they would have died in their sleep. We also have a EV and charger which we found out a few weeks ago Pod Point hadn’t contacted National Grid to inform them, we are now waiting to be unlooped by National Grid as our supply goes through our neighbours company connection. As an ex fireman I suggest that people invest in extra fire detection for these systems for safety preferably mains powered.
Presumably the energy costs are based on an EV tarrif so the savings for non EV owners would be much less?
We have solar, battery and heat pump. Our biggest savings are from having an EV and therefore access to cheaper electric.
You don't need to have an EV to get an EV tariff, my in-laws have Eon's EV tariff and are about as anti-EV as anyone can be.
Have a look at 'upsidedownfork's videos - he doesn't have an EV yet (too many kids!) and worked out that solar and a heat pump work out pretty well on some of the other tariffs, without a battery.
I only have a small stable block conversion, I have solar panels and I have had batteries installed, I admit I know absolutely nothing about heat pumps or what their function is, I have well and truly insulated my house, my solar panels are on a feed in tariff, I only have a hot water tank, I don't actually have any heating as such apart from a towel rail as my home remains warm in winter and cool in the summer.
That extra £17500 you spent on all of those extras will ADD more than that to the value of your property should you decide to sell up, let alone the savings I've made, you're saving more than me, I'm in an all electric household too
As far as electric vehicles go, I can't afford the initial purchase price, I don't have access to off road parking, the infrastructure is nearly non existent in this area and I'm not credit worthy so I can't pay for electricity to run an electric vehicle. Sadly I can't afford or be able to run an electric vehicle
I had my installations not just to save money, but I'm around 10 years away from retirement and I'm thinking practically before it's too late, whilst I'm still working, I'm a single person, I don't see a pension covering the rising costs by the time I reach retirement age
I think your solar would cost more than 4k now I paid 3.9k for a 6 panel system on a south facing roof and that was by far the cheapest quote. Quotes Doubled doing it on 2 sides mainly because of scaffolding costs
I should have had a bigger battery / inverter, but I only had a 5. Even so, i pay £1 a month and pocket £100 this year when the spring was bad for solar. That £100 will pay for my ev charging so effectively covers my motoring. I have to have a new oil boiler, and will have air2air heating instead… so I will use maybe a few hundred in electricity instead of oil. But the hardware cost is no different to a replacement boiler. The saving a/c to my neighbours is 1-2 000 a year in electricity costs, so I will return my investment in less than 6 years. Less given the high cost year cost me nothing.
Great content thanks. We have libbi battery 18kW usable, small solar array and viessmann heat pump. We run and electric car which averages 500miles a month and an electric van which covers around 1200mile a month. No gas supply. May electric bill £ 122 including standing charge. Average electric unit cost 8p.
@richardcorns8553 I too have a Viessmann ASHP with a similar setup minus the battery. What sort of SCOP are you getting?
@@Sandra-mv7xm Hi, our overall SCOP is 4.6.
@@richardcorns8553Excellent. Same as me, 4.67. Have it a year now but still tweaking to see if I can get further improvements!
@zyks4628 Great! I hope you see further improvements with tweaking, although 4.6 is still very good.
My parents are finally looking at a heat pump system, after many years of my dad point blank refusing the idea.
Their big issue was they use bottled gas, and that is now eye wateringly expensive. Just letting them do the research on what grants that are availble to them.
When we installed pv, we did it more as an inflationary hedge, rather than an amazing payback. I expect a payback of 10 to 12 years. We also expect moving to heat pumps and we are starting a business where we are heating another space with heat pumps. Our solar panels main job is to keep us out of the high usage, high cost tiers.
We also use it as a hedge against bad decisions on the part of government, and price gouging by corporations.
Good video. It would’ve been interesting to incorporate the Expected life span of each Product and do the man maths .
I think Octopus are doing free installs of heatpumps in some cases on 3-4 bed houses - the £7500 grant pays for the heatpump and installation.
They are. The question is whether the heat pump is any good. Don’t forget Octopus’ business model is to be the British Gas of the renewable market (stack em high & sell em cheap) they also want to dominate the market. That never bodes well for the customer.
Good video. Another impact is what it does for the house value should you sell in the future. I agree there should be an allowance for maintenance in the figures to.
Other than the heat pump, there is no maintainence. I didn't include the gas servicing either.
Just got all this installed in May so no idea what I will save. But so far it’s looking good. Had to get all the radiators and piping replaced so more expensive but in Scotland so got an extra 2500 grant for solar and interest free loan for most of the rest. Had the smart meter replaced as it couldn’t handle exporting plus it was reporting twice as much on the 30 minutes compared to the monthly readings. That and 3 cars means it will take me months to get any reasonable idea of how much I am saving.
Love the vid's keep up the great work 😊
£2500 for a gas boiler😮 I don’t know where you got that figure from, they’re a grand!
This system will work on a new build designed to maximise the savings. But you need a slightly larger property for a plant room to house all the gubbins
along with underfloor heating . I've got solid walls i.e no cavity and paid 10K (no grant) for exterior insulation in 2020 new gas boiler was 3K, no hot water tank. boiler in kitchen cabiente no extra space needed.I put 50 % of ground floor on u/floor heating as part of an extension and remoldeling.
My energy bills are around 2.2K with gas being 1K. Pay back for my exterior insulation is north of 20 years.
My maintenance costs are £60 boiler service fee and warranty is 10 years. With the solar , heat pump and battery systems lies a future maintenance and replacement cost that is unknown so unless you put away a sink fund , then a nasty suprise is not far away.
I'm not saying its not the future but retrofitting is not really cost effective for a large portion of the UK's housing stock.
I have enjoyed the videos though
You don't need underfloor heating. Makes it more efficient but it's far from a requirement.
Solar and batteries have no maintainence at all. Warranty is 25 years+ on Solar and 12 years on battery (lifespan is longer than warranty, expect 15-20 years at least)
Just about to swap my diesel for an EV and have been crunching the numbers on electricity tariffs.
My roof is no good for solar and no home battery so for me it's just the EV.
Have to say unless you can schedule virtually your entire usage to cheap rate periods EV tariffs are a waste of time in isolation
@@garethedwards8744 not if the car uses more than the house.
The best investment in my house was my home battery. I first bought a 10kw but wasn’t enough so went for another 10kw and that seems to have done the trick.
Hi, In 2018 I paid £280,000 for a bungalow reduced from £299,950 and previously advertised at over £300,000. Earlier this year the property next door sold for £415,000 - it historically sells for less than mine. In 2022 I spent £11,225 on a Solar PV system with batteries thus my total expenditure on the property was £291,225 so what is the point of payback calculations per your presentation considering I would more than recover my Solar PV costs when eventually selling my property? Do purchasers of properties which already have Solar PV, battery storage and heat pumps installed separate out the relevant costs to estimate the payback for these components? I do not understand!! Regarding payback, this leaves funds which have not been subjected to income tax, national insurance etc. How does this change payback calculations if at all?🤔🤔🤔
I often hear the “when will this pay for itself “ question about our solar, heat pump, insulation, and EV from people who just spent $20,000 on a kitchen remodel. They have no way of knowing if that kitchen upgrade will ever pay off but they value the results just like we value the results of the solar, heat pump and EV.
@@NigelSavagery The heat pump water heater provides hot water using electricity from our solar array.
But you know the day you install your new kitchen that it will never ever pay you back any money.@@NigelSavagery
Kitchen remodel analogy is silly, if your kitchen is knackered you only have one option to replace it, a new kitchen. Whereas if your gas boiler is knackered you have two options, and modern gas boiler or some or all of what you have seen in the video, in which case payback matters and can help you decide. Especially when you aren’t sure how long you are staying in your current home.
@@pppscooby I am not talking about a knackered kitchen. I am talking about a fully functioning kitchen that just isn’t in the latest style.
@@COSolar6419 like replacing a fully functioning gas boiler with a heat pump etc, both produce heat, both are hidden away and not on show, the only differentiating factor is cost of ownership.
It seems to me that the whole payback time period calculation is mainly carried out by those who have yet to take the plunge. You weigh up what you can afford and how much it's all going to cost and then it makes you feel better if you convince yourself that it will not only save you money but will also end up paying for itself.
Once the system is up and running, who cares how much it cost? I'm only interested in how much I'm saving on a daily basis using smart tariffs, solar, battery and (soon to be installed) heat pump. I see it like spending a couple of grand on a nice holiday and then wondering how it's going to pay for itself. You want something and you have the money to pay for it? Enjoy the planning and research and then enjoy the cost savings. Not to mention the feel-good factor of helping the environment.
6:33 any idea how much would be for scaffolding alone? 🤔
(for consideration of having them on ground-fixed-structure instead)
£500-£800 at a guess.
Couldn't agree more about the "it doesn't make financial sense" brigade.
I've abused the environment in my early life and I see this as a kind of payback to the environment. If only we all did whatever we could to leave the planet a better place thsn we found it.
Their domestic grid is fairly green. Their industrial grid isn't, but also you currently can't get around the whole needing coking coal for stainless steel thing
We have exported a lot of industry there, and they still emit far fewer emissions per capita than the UK where the industrial revolution began.
I'm a touch wary of heat pumps, mostly due to the refrigerants having a GWP which is potentially higher than methane
Though this being said, the refrigerant in there would have to leak before it's an issue, and I'm not sure how long R290 stays in the atmosphere
Realistically you could have a GWP of say 1500, and if it dissipates from the atmosphere in just a few days, that's a massive win.
I will however end up getting a heat pump regardless, but I'm a touch wary on the GWP thing.
@@NigelSavagery Apparently China just opened a 200,000 acre (80,000 hectare) solar array, the largest in the world. Yeah, they're big on coal, but apparently are doing enough with renewables to cover all household usage (but not industrial usage). Their emissions are enormous, no doubt, compared to the rest of the world, but there's apparently a lot of renewables being installed too. With solar panels so cheap, world-wide more solar is being installed (by dollar value) than any other source. So, despite my scepticism, China might actually transition to renewables.
@@NigelSavagery China is now the worlds biggest energy producer and consumer. Yes the majority of this unfortunately still comes from coal, however that will change in the next year, with wind, solar, hydro and battery storage increasing at the highest rate in any country in the world. In 10 years or less they will be exporting clean energy to their less fortunate neighbours.
@@NigelSavagery Why would China be laughing? Because they sold the products that I'm using to reduce my carbon footprint and make a small payback?
Perhaps you should look around your home and check where your TV, and the majority of all of your electro domestic products are made. Your car will have Chinese parts in it. If not from new, then the replacement parts will be.
Perhaps they are laughing at you as well? Perhaps they are laughing at all of us? Perhaps we shouldn't worry about what other people think or do?
Being a real estate salesperson in new Zealand i understand people's attitude to "payback". People here move on average every 5-7yrs so a big investment's in infrastructure that you can't really take with you is a factor. A new kitchen is probably more desirable unfortunately than a solar system for adding value to a home for resale - sad but true!. I've gone to a heat pump water system and ducted heating and cooling, I definitely want solar, just because i think it's the right move, rather than payback, especially with 2 EVs not to mention our dumbarse government have started "taxing" EVs with road user charges and removed rebates. Go "green" new Zealand! 😝
I've gone the other way and spent on insulating and Double glazing. For many that will sound strange, but in Australia we live in large energy sieves. By plugging up the holes we can now go through the heating season with a 45% decrease, based on the previous 2 years bills. So I ask is there anything you can do to improve your numbers in this department Andy?
They were done first.
For the heat pump, do you know anything about heat pump convectors and using a water system for cooling?
@@SAStarbucks You’d need an air to air for that, water cooling doesn’t work and would create condensation.
Don’t think I’m gonna go for the heat pump as we don’t have room for a water tank we are looking at the bolt electric boiler
Your house is beautifully finished, who built it?
I dont have any of this and intention of getting it any time soon. However if gas was discovered today there is no way something that explodes or could kill you in your sleep would ever be allowed into peoples homes.
Heatable quoted me £14k for 14 REA panels and a 10.1kw battery. Not sure if that’s good value or not
Are your saving greater if you factor in recent higher energy costs and the benefits of charging your electric car at home? That is, what were your savings in yr1, yr2, yr3 etc. ?
I don't remember EVM saying how many kW of solar he was getting for his £4,000, or his supplier, but I can't find anyone who'll do a small 4kW system for less than £7000. How is he getting these prices?
Ditto £10,200 for 19kW of batteries is incredibly cheap. I've been quotes nearly double that in south Oxfordshire by 3 different firms.
The payback period ought to factor in that the solar inverter will need replacing after 10-12 years and the batteries may last no longer than 10 years and will see declining performance.
The ASHP also seems super-cheap. Is it a very small pump, because the house is already super-insulated? What is its SAP or heat loss rating? Nice video but there's loads of missing data here I'm afraid.
I recently got heat pump quotes from Octopus and Heatable for a 3 bed house and they quoted me £5,500 and £7,500 resp.
but what will happen if eletric goes up as well... ?
I’ve installed all that you’ve installed with the exception of the heatpump which was installed by Octopus Energy. Like you I’m not that interested in pay back as like you I feel it’s a nonsense. However I had the money to do all and whilst in the bank it was earning very little. Now I estimate it’s giving me a return of more than 6% that’s taking into account the FIT payment I get which is the lowest amount before it ended. Does my heatpump heat my house? Absolutely, what’s more my wife on blood thinners needs heat so our house is always at 21-22.5°c.
Is the inverter a True Sine wave inverter? "Pure" sine wave is just marketing. But non-sine wave inverters are really risky for appliances that have a motor in it. Can you please confirm this?
Very interesting, thanks for doing this. Did you include the fuel savings from switching from ICE to cheap nighttime or 'free' solar electricity charging EV?
Also did u include any savings of selling solar back to grid?
What about the changes to plumbing for the larger radiators? plus the radiators themselves and the associated controls? They seem to have been missed?
All included in the price.
I barely needed any changes, it's a bit of a myth with modern HPs that you need to replace all pipes and rads etc. You don't.
Makes perfect sense 😊
Bit baffled re: the heat pump cost. Ive just been quoted 16.5k, so with the grant (which is higher now) it'll be costing me 9k. This is with heat geek, and includes a few radiators. I've ripped out my gas boiler during a renovation already so pretty much already committed to it but i was pretty shocked at the cost. I was expecting 4-6k.
Get more quotes?
@@ElectricVehicleMan hmm, my other quote was indeed cheaper (10k total), but they advised a 12kw unit to heat my 3 bed semi. Heat geek advised a 5kw vaillant with radiator upgrades. I'd be paying a fortune in electricity to run an oversized unit. I suspect people having 2-3k installations are not have proper heat loss assessments done and it's luck of the draw as to whether the system works properly or costs them a fortune and/or doesn't heat the house
You can do this or try to find a bank that gives you 1800 interest on that 17500.
Does that bank make your house go up in value as well?
Funny how we get different deals. I paid £18,500 for 5kwp solar, optimisers, solar edge inverter and Powerwall and gateway last year. But just paid £1560 for heat pump, new tank and 14 new radiators. The only thing I think you have missed is the loss of interest on the money. You would probably would have got circa £1000 a year interest on your “investment”. I bought mine for “geekary” reasons but enjoy the savings. 😂
Don’t forget the cost saving when your gas meter is removed.
My impression is that solar panels and batteries are cheaper now than 2 years ago.
Labour to install them isn’t.
Ok. But how thermally efficient was your house in the first place? To be fair, it's always the missing: how many kWh of heat does your house need to maintain X temperature over y outside temperature.(Assuming you don't use AC, but you're in Yorkshire so I presume you just open the windows and let that Yorkshire breeze in.
Thanks for this.
How much extra insulation have you added ?
To the house, none.
Cheers Andy