I wouldn't rely on any no-name framework like "SKIP" just for a bit more comfort. Just learn Kotlin Multiplatform with Compose Multiplatform (for UI) or native UI for each platform.
totally agree the declarative paradigm made it so easy to build Ui on native platforms the main part of developing these apps relies in the logic part which can be hard to duplicate in each platform due to different apis
As much as I like Kotlin (worked in it for 3 years for backend), I prefer Flutter. All the different components are available for both Android and iOS, they are pixel perfect copies. Also I do custom animations when creating new components, not sure how transferrable they are using other frameworks that make use of the underlying components. I enjoyed the video, it was good to see what else is out there.
Flutter still ships faster and all, the tooling beats it, the customer doesn't care as long as it feels fast and snappy. KMP and CMP is still not ready.
@@Ajajdh2 correct, the stuff is luckily open source and drives itself at this point. And yes, Google is still working on Flutter, porting things to newer Android / iOS and adding new features.
PWAs are getting very interesting. Unless you need truly native features, it's a very powerful alternative to a mobile app that doesn't force you to write native code.
Wait, where is flutter inconsistent? Graphically it is consistent and if you need something that is swift or kotlin specific it allows you to write it in that framework. It's also the only option in the video that works for Ios, Android, Win, MacOS, Linux and web. It even allows ffi for C and Rust if you're in to that.
React Native, with Microsoft's "React Native Desktop" project, can also natively target all platforms except Linux. For Linux there are ways to do this already (e.g. NodeGUI and GJS), but Qt and GTK tooling/integration making full use of React Native+Hermes, is lacking (something I'm currently working on actually).
I don't understand why people are hating on flutter, the dev experience is amazing, the resulting apps are fast and stable and look good, it's insanely flexible, it has the benefit of using dart which enables seemless backend development, highly flexible, huge open source package ecosystem available, there so little inconveniences in flutter
On point👌.. made a decision years ago to backoff learning Swift to go with React Native instead (cross-platform). The points you made are accurate and I feel I should've stuck with it. I did go back to it a few weeks back, I must prefer the experience and feel I can create better projects this way. Now that it can work on other platforms too makes things a whole lot more interesting
I remember when I was explaining to non technical person what React Native is. They said: "oh I know now why some apps such work slow". Performance and UX matter guys, user is most important...
I build native android and ios apps. I recently wanted to build cross platform apps and tried flutter and kmp, I chose kmp because flutter is very bad in terms of memory usage and performance.
I think for cross platform app development flutter is best option. In future i want to use either capy (Zig framework) or Xilem (Rust framework) for cross platform app development.
@@_hudeifa23 because it's a native abstraction that doesn't make sense, you have a completely different development experience than with native tools or react native but for no advantages, it's a compromise on everything, also setting it up sucks too
@@yonas6832 When you build app with react native, the components that user's interact with are 100% native on both iOS and Android, although it is not a direct compilation from the code rather a compilation from a bridge between the react native code and the device
Unfortunately both Kotlin and Swift are very complex already and they keep adding features to them. Kotlin is a little better because it uses GC. In Swift you very often should use a specific keyword to help the compiler because of ARC. Which is very confusing and unclear. Kotlin has other weirdness, annotations. Which came from Java and looks like magic which you should add otherwise nothing will work. Very bad framework design.
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I wouldn't rely on any no-name framework like "SKIP" just for a bit more comfort. Just learn Kotlin Multiplatform with Compose Multiplatform (for UI) or native UI for each platform.
totally agree
the declarative paradigm made it so easy to build Ui on native platforms
the main part of developing these apps relies in the logic part which can be hard to duplicate in each platform due to different apis
As much as I like Kotlin (worked in it for 3 years for backend), I prefer Flutter. All the different components are available for both Android and iOS, they are pixel perfect copies. Also I do custom animations when creating new components, not sure how transferrable they are using other frameworks that make use of the underlying components. I enjoyed the video, it was good to see what else is out there.
Flutter still ships faster and all, the tooling beats it, the customer doesn't care as long as it feels fast and snappy. KMP and CMP is still not ready.
isn't flutter being abandoned by google ?
@@captainnoyaux
Just rumors, either way, Flutter doesn't need Google to work.
@@Ajajdh2 Thanks for the reply :)
@@Ajajdh2 correct, the stuff is luckily open source and drives itself at this point. And yes, Google is still working on Flutter, porting things to newer Android / iOS and adding new features.
PWAs are getting very interesting. Unless you need truly native features, it's a very powerful alternative to a mobile app that doesn't force you to write native code.
Wait, where is flutter inconsistent? Graphically it is consistent and if you need something that is swift or kotlin specific it allows you to write it in that framework. It's also the only option in the video that works for Ios, Android, Win, MacOS, Linux and web. It even allows ffi for C and Rust if you're in to that.
rust_core 1.0.0 just made the rust core library available to dart.
Compose Web has all these targets too.
compose > flutter, flutter is just not nice to work with
@@masterflitzerwhy?
React Native, with Microsoft's "React Native Desktop" project, can also natively target all platforms except Linux. For Linux there are ways to do this already (e.g. NodeGUI and GJS), but Qt and GTK tooling/integration making full use of React Native+Hermes, is lacking (something I'm currently working on actually).
I don't understand why people are hating on flutter, the dev experience is amazing, the resulting apps are fast and stable and look good, it's insanely flexible, it has the benefit of using dart which enables seemless backend development, highly flexible, huge open source package ecosystem available, there so little inconveniences in flutter
Thank you for mentioning Kotlin/Compose. I really wanna learn more about it now. Seems to be the most sane option for now
On point👌.. made a decision years ago to backoff learning Swift to go with React Native instead (cross-platform). The points you made are accurate and I feel I should've stuck with it. I did go back to it a few weeks back, I must prefer the experience and feel I can create better projects this way. Now that it can work on other platforms too makes things a whole lot more interesting
I remember when I was explaining to non technical person what React Native is. They said: "oh I know now why some apps such work slow". Performance and UX matter guys, user is most important...
So using native than cross platform?
@@wildanalifr9583 it always depends what you want to make. imo for mvp corss platofrm solutions are not bad, but for serious product I'd use native.
Last time I tried Kotlin native (about a year ago?) there were a lot of limitations and the performance wasn't there yet.
Equating flutter experience to translated app experience is undeserving
Mobile development is getting more and more complicated
how's that? AFAIK you still have old/classic options.
yea no, this isn't webdev, frameworks actually make developing easier.
Mobile is getting simpler, actually. Have you been around to create Android apps before kotlin and jetpack compose??
Fyne can deploy to Web, Desktop, and Mobile. While relying on its own stack.
I build native android and ios apps. I recently wanted to build cross platform apps and tried flutter and kmp, I chose kmp because flutter is very bad in terms of memory usage and performance.
But you in the end you need a mac device to run ios app. In the mac eco system is required for running KMP for ios app.
I think for cross platform app development flutter is best option. In future i want to use either capy (Zig framework) or Xilem (Rust framework) for cross platform app development.
I understand the concerns raised here but have you looked into the latest updates on react native?
this is what I'm talking about, i don't want react native or flutter for cross platform mobile apps
kotlin (or swift, but i don't like xcode) ftw!
why don't you like flutter ?
@@_hudeifa23 because it's a native abstraction that doesn't make sense, you have a completely different development experience than with native tools or react native but for no advantages, it's a compromise on everything, also setting it up sucks too
I was waiting for you to talk about it!
FYI React Native compiles to native as well
...how it's not native code like Rust
@@yonas6832 When you build app with react native, the components that user's interact with are 100% native on both iOS and Android, although it is not a direct compilation from the code rather a compilation from a bridge between the react native code and the device
@@yonas6832 no app on android is native. It's all virtulized like a JVM. He means it's not just a web wrapper, but uses native bindings
Comparing disadvantages of Fluuter with advantages of KMP? Used to do similar thing
I'm still using react native, no cares, everything work well for me❤
i guess native cross-platform and server driver ui cross-platform(React Native) will be the future
but we need paid for license of skip? they not be free like KMM.
Just a personal note: I HATE FLUTTER
🔥🔥
skip is not free. compose is free, haha
You need a mac for swift, so out of the equation already 😂
Python + kivy ?
Unfortunately both Kotlin and Swift are very complex already and they keep adding features to them. Kotlin is a little better because it uses GC. In Swift you very often should use a specific keyword to help the compiler because of ARC. Which is very confusing and unclear. Kotlin has other weirdness, annotations. Which came from Java and looks like magic which you should add otherwise nothing will work. Very bad framework design.
that's why dart is the king, simple and concise, it doesn't have unnecessary featrures