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The Father in the Caves' story from Honest Hearts depicts several of the different types of people that survived the early years, including a group of vault dwellers that apparently left their vault within one (maybe two) generation(s). His story is one of my favourites from the games.
So does Carol in Underworld. She talks about the collapse of society and the city on fire. Also the Boylston Club members survived for a week until they decided to "unalive" themselves.
Most of the world population would survive a nuclear war, but not the following nuclear winter which would last for years or even decades. Starvation cause by the nuclear winter will kill far more people than the bombs, and the nuclear fallout and radiation.
And yet, the just as mercenary and ambitious House was actively trying to do the opposite. Imagine if House not only got the platinum chip on time, but early, and could protect more than just Vegas. Even if just a few major cities and military facilities are protected, the US de facto would have won the war.
Didn't confirm that they did. Only that they may have planned to. I don't see vault-tec dropping the bombs with all the unfinished ones still being made.
@@TranscendentalLaw yeh... alot of people are only talking about the show and do not look at the actual lore , yeh vault tec might have some hand in it but there is also alot of nukes that came from china
I was thinking more along the lines that vault tech may have planned a nuclear bomb to go off somewhere, but just enough to scare people, not actually cause the end of the world.
So, by Vault-Tec planned it, I don't think they meant Vault-Tec dropped all the bombs. That would be crazy. There were thousands. What I assume happened was...Vault-Tec dropped the initial bomb on the United States. Just the one. As a way of spreading fear so they could sell more of their vaults. They maybe didn't anticipate that that one nuke would be the catalyst to the end of the world. They dropped one. The US bombard China. China bombards the US. Soon the entire world is on fire. It wouldn't make much business sense for Vault-Tec to intentionally destroy their entire market.
Based on terminal entries in vault 19 that vault was occupied pre-war as a psychiatric hospital. One terminal entry talks about an individual arriving in police custody.
No, it's actually a lot more messed up than that. SPOILERS: The doctor and her security staff were told these were mental patients in police custody. Every last person brought there had a clean psychiatric bill of health, and they wanted to see how much paranoia they could induce without violence or chems. They played low voices in someone's radio, kept the real reactor room hidden so things in the fake reactor room could seem off, even had a red and blue team with separate overseers, but only one of them was the real overseer so the other was driven to paranoia because the real overseer had to constantly hide things from him.
I read somewhere(maybe the fallout bible) that the nukes were 750k, meaning they were small and the nuclear fallout would've been devastating(much like Chernobyl).
@@AuVeI Except Chernobyl is overgrown now too. The real answer is that Fallout isn't beholden to real-world science. It is based entirely off of a combination of 1950's pulp sci-fi and Road Warrior visuals.
@@AuVeI Add in the fact that nuclear power was far more wide spread in the Fallout universe, and so just imagine dropping a nuke on hundreds of thousands of Chernobyls, all over America. The fallout would be MASSIVE.
They would probably be cobalt nukes or “salt bombs” which release extremely high amounts of radiation to prevent anything organic from growing in an area for a very long time
One thing I liked about F4 was it showed the downfall wasn't like flicking a light switch, one second pre-war civilization and the second Fallout/Mad Max. Society and government actually survived for a good long while before succumbing to multiple crises. Kind of like Rome. People think 476, but for the people living then life pretty much continued as normal for a while, hell even the Senate continued to exist and meet. It was a very gradual process that occurred over generations.
@@somedude0921post war in fo4 there was supposed to be a provisional government, but the institute instantly ruined it by killing everyone in charge, even when youre introduced to the institute father tells you about it but in a twisted way
Not just that, but why would Vault-Tech start the Great War before all of their vaults are finished? Vault 114 and 88 was still under construction, so even if they wanted war, they would wait until everything was completely ready.
Not really. Why, vault tech would stop building the vaults at any point? Wouldn't it be a bit sus? So it was worth keep bulding it, even for the glimpse possibility that someone might acuse them off starting the war.
@@komiks42 While that does make sence weren't some vaults kept a secret to some extent. I bring this up because if some were secret, people would be non the wiser if they were or weren't building them. Also the vaults all weren't build in one town. So they probably weren't active in some cities and especially smaller towns. Also if the world was nuked my first priority wouldn't be to wonder if a safety bunker company started the war. If anything I'd blame the government. And by the time people would wonder that the people responsible would probably be dead and not care what some raiders thought of their company's integrity.
@@Nickelbag610 The secret vaults aren't really an issue because, at any given time, they had multiple vaults under construction. They're contradictory in isolation, but it's not a big deal since they aren't actually isolated.
I like to think that dogmeat lauched the nuke, but he set it on a TIMER. And he had time to hide while it was on the timer. That's how he survived. Idk how he traveled that far tho.
I think Dogmeat is a synth. I think that is how Shaun (Institute leader) was able to track the lone wanderer besides synth birds and was maybe sent by Shaun to aid his father/mother. He stated that he watched you even as you exited the vault and you immediately run into Dogmeat shortly after when you reach the first Red Rocket gas station. Dogmeat and Cogsworth do not have companion quests, either. Also, Does the name "Dogmeat" imply anything? Like is Dogmeat a joke name for a Gen3 Synth dog? Also, Dogmeat is all pristine and healthy, but the other dogs of fallout are all mutated. The "wild" dogs running around are mutated Canine Familia (Common house dogs). They are the descendants of people's house pets left to the radiation of the wasteland for the most part, but Dogmeat has no deformities, etc. The other one in New Vegas that belongs to the leader of that gang that follow Elvis is really old and augmented with cybernetic implants. He's the only other German Shepard I remember seeing and even he was part cyborg. Then when you run into him he's immediately friendly to you and doesn't behave like he's afraid of people at all, intimidated, scared, or anything. It's a seemingly wild random dog you run into and in a harsh environment like Fallout with raiders, mutants, giant insects, etc., I find it hard to believe a random dog you encounter would be so friendly and so immediately. Random raiders would had probably shot at Dogmeat, etc. It would be weary of people, I would think. I think that Dogmeat must had been secretly following you and it just isn't scripted in the game. Maybe he was programmed to track you and when you start heading toward the gas station that it goes straight there and waits for you.
It could always be someplace else that got left behind but still had nuclear capabilities. Britain, for example, was allegedly royally screwed after they glassed Israel, but they still might have enough missiles and bombs left over to fool the US.
The invasion Mexico is from the Fallout Bible, so it may not be strictly canon. That said, even it doesn't say the U.S. completely annexed it like Canada. It's possible only more northern and eastern regions were taken.
Depends on your definition of annexed bc in fallout 4 if you listen to the tv you can hear the news broadcaster say that cold winds were coming from Canada, so yes the country did exist although it might've been under u.s control
One thing I've never thought about regarding the war, is the American forces overseas fighting. U.S. probably had soldiers near China when the bombs fell. Makes me wonder, what happened to them? Fallout 2 had the "Shi", Chinese submariners that integrated into San Francisco. Think there's a faction over there with U.S. troops integrating into post-war China?
For those of us not living in the US there are many other things to think about in regard to the Fallout world. For one thing, we never had Cram or Fancy Lad Snack Cakes.
Regarding #4, I've always felt that the real answer to whether the USA, China, corporate interests or another nation started the war is "they all did". Sure, some individual had to have launched the very first bomb on 23/10/77. But decades (if not centuries) of competition over control of resources, mutual escalation, and insatiable desire for more power and more growth by those already powerful and wealthy were the real causes of the war. Someone pushing a button was simply the moment all of that led up to. To give a firm answer on whether that finger belonged to an American general, a Chinese general or a Vault-Tec executive is to miss the point of the game that it could just as easily have been any of them.
I also like to stress that it doesn't matter who started it. The war happened. No one surviving in the world cares. They don't really even care about the words United States of America.
I think that's why we've never found out what the straw that broke the camel's back was. The point is that the whole world was so paranoid that everybody was planning to use their nukes before the other side. It's just as likely to me that the USA was the first to strike and that any evidence to the contrary is simply propaganda. The way I see it, whatever the final straw was is irrelevant because the nukes were already inevitable. If that exact series of events hadn't happened, some other similar thing would have triggered the nukes. I like that we're given hints that it might have been vault-tec or some non-military entity because it shows that the causes of the war are much deeper than simple national politics. I think it's also thematically relevant than nobody who potentially caused the war managed to survive it. Whatever that cause may have been, the choice was always the same -mutual destruction-. I don't think any of the major players were ignorant enough to think they'd survive the war they were all just too proud to back down and locked into their decisions by the power structures they had constructed.
"the real culprit was the friends we made along the way". Lol nah. It definitely isn't that simple. The who and the why are what's interesting. It's not merely a small detail
@@ryleyrains6836 if the themes include "yeah everyone was working towards brinksmanship" I still wanna know who's the madlad who actually launched the first nuke knowing what would happen
#5) This actually explains to me why Vault Tech had so many twisted experiments and more importantly, HOW they expected to learn the results. It really never made sense to me that Vault Tech set all this up ahead of the war to then be unable to make use of the data.
I always figured Vault Tec HQ was watching it all on TV in the head office. Vault. They need some kind of TV to watch and this gives them 1 channel per vault.
The sad thing is, that sometimes unethical experimentation get is own life and the results do not matter in the end. This might be what happened to some degree for some of the experiments. There seem to have been a lot of experiments with very questionable use. Also this is a very good reason why one should not excuse lack of ethics for experiments on the grounds of progress. Once you stop actually taking ethics to account, the goal to learn to tend to disappear to. It just becomes a perverse way to torture people with no value for anyone, except in the sick mind of the one committing the torture. The whole idea that Vault Tec would be behind it all sort of need to hinge on these perverse ideas. While N_orte claims that it makes no sense for them as a business to doom the world. Vault Tec is not just a business. There are people behind the business and if the leadership get the idea that, for example, the world will end soon in nuclear fire or some other collapse, then they may choose to end it on their own terms. Money is nice, but what really matters for people at this level is power. Not money. And often they tend to view the world as a zero-sum game on top of that. Meaning, the only way to gain power is to take it from someone else. Be careful around people like that. They do sometimes climb to the top of the corporate latter, as well as in politics. Though honestly. I do agree with N_orte conclusion. It does not matter how the Great War of Fallout started. And that is why I think the game is littered with contradictory "clues" who done it. And who to say that everyone did not do it at the same time. ;)
The issue is simple... The Humans went into space. We know this from Nuka World and even New Vegas. They had a battle on the moon...see Fallout 4. Who were they fighting we never know. Vault-Tec was building the vaults for a simple reason...they were planning on putting them on other worlds. We know this from Nuka-World. Some of the experiments are some we ourselves would conduct to see how a Human would react in such environments. Vault-Tec never intended to make the experiment last long. Vault-Tec itself was wiped by a direct hit and can be found either in Fallout 1 or 2, I forget the exact game it is in. So it couldn't stop the experiments. Because it couldnt do such the experiments continued on until the Overseers were ordered to stop. They never got that order so...well you know. If you look around Fallout 2, 3 and even 4. You shall note messages about waiting for the order to open the vaults. Since they never came the Overseers continued with them. Vault-Tec never meant for those experiments to last that long.
@@Mega-Brick I don’t feel like we know that yet. In order to determine such a thing you would have to look at each vault which we cannot currently do. And look at the cost/benefit involved. I would say the fact that there are garden of Eden creation kits out there shows that vault tech was not all that bad. And without those vaults city and project purity and maybe even the NCR itself would not exist in the state it does.
Y'know I used to think that, within the context of fallout universe, that becoming a feral ghoul would be the absolute worst fate one could face, but no Mr bradburtons Fate put that to shame. I guess I never thought about it until I heard you actually speak aloud about him being stuck, alone, in his cold dark office for TWO CENTURIES. I mean just imagine being in that situation, even just for the first few days, knowing how very very unlikely it is that anyone will find you, and that you're likely to just languish there... Forever. Then imagine once you've done the first 100 years, all that endless time to think and nothing but more time ahead. And you're only an immortal head, so you don't even have the capacity to unalive yourself, if you so chose. Purely miserable, my god.
At some point though time would be meaningless, if you do the same thing over and over again it feels faster. Would it still be agonizing? Absolutely, but just slightly less then expected
Having no body, the brain would absolutely freak out. Even if you kept a cool composure, your brain would be trying to process the fact that it doesn't have a heart, lungs, stomach, guts, most of its skin and meat, it has no bones below the neck, no nerves. He probably spent many many episodes hyperventilating because he can't feel his lungs filling with air, worse he just feels the sucking of his throat hole against wherever he's sitting, or it jiggling, expanding with each breath. The dust and other detritus that got into there! You take for granted the mindfulness of where your organs are in your body, I feel where every bit of me is from my pancreas to my liver and kidneys, I can almost feel the artery siphoning blood through my liver, the sophisticated track it makes through my body to the organ like rubber spaghetti. You can feel more of yourself than you think if you just focus. Do you know about PHANTOM LIMB syndrome? Imagine the phantom limb syndrome of losing your body. The insanity of waking from a slumber to the feeling of having your body back, only for the grogginess to clear and remembering you have none; the panic, the depression. You wouldn't be much of a sentient being at that point, like I said in the beginning your brain would be freaking out and not able to process what happened to the rest of you. You would lose your mind purely from not having a body, slowly slipping away into your cranial cavity. Your brain literally has no reason or drive to try and interact with the outside world and regresses inwards into a psychotic fantasy.
On the fifth idea, it would not be hard for Vault Tech to get people to volunteer to go into the vault without fallout. The fear that people must have head of the pending war would have had several people willing to go into the vault early just for that peace of mind.
That's even a part of the lore, if I remember right. None of the vaults reached full occupancy because constant drills and false-alarms led people to stop believing them and not leave for the vault, implying that there _were_ drills encouraging people to go to the vault early.
Vault-Tec was going to test people anyways. And when you note some of the experiments they conducted you start to understand why. Look around Nuka World for why they were planning them. It was an event that happened long before that lead to the war and Vault-Tec had to rush some vaults. A few were never fully completed. Because we know that Vault-Tec was hit by a direct missile. You can discover this in Fallout 1 or was it 2. Been a long time. The other parts of the company gave a warning. Because of the secret nature of the mission, the secondary Vault-Tec leaders made a large mistake, without knowing exactly why they were doing these experiments...hint it had to do with Space travel and other planets.
@@Mega-Brick most people wouldn't believe it at any rate, MAD was something most people thought impossible even during the cold war when it was something outright planned by both sides if strikes ever started
realistically it would've happened anyway, we built an entire shelter in NYC that was fully stocked and while not fully staffed was manned, there are some old ones in DC and a few other key locations aswell and paranoid (rightfully) individuals during the cold war era did occasionally start building and living in bunkers in a situation where resources are running out and the only 2 global powers really left on the board are vying for their own survival (literally) fear of nukes would be vastly greater than anything the cold war gave the U.S or the USSR who both prepped extensively for it you could outright tell people this is part experiment and part to keep them safe and given the circumstances you'd still have more than enough volunteers just due to fear of the alternative
PAM starting the war makes most sense to me. It's the closest to reality (in 1983, the US and USSR almost went to war when a Soviet computer misidentified a 'threat' from the US, and went into retaliatory mode, but was overruled by a lieutenant colonel, Stanislav Petrov, who predicted it was a false alarm; he was later proved right as the computer had misidentified thick, reflective clouds as nuclear weapons, his quick thinking and empathy saved up to half the population in both countries). I think PAM is a reference to this computer, but she had no one to overrule her.
Yeah, how do you mistake clouds for ICBMs? The scary thing is in the future there won't be any human thought in the process to step in when the computer goes haywire.
@@Lurch-Bot Frighteningly, it's happening now already, with conventional weapons against innocent Palestinians in Gaza, just AI with little/no oversight bombing to hell fellow human beings. Our laziness, tribalism and lack of empathy leads to monstrosities.
@@idontlikerome2744 I don't think so. He said he was neither rewarded nor punished for his actions (the Soviets didn't want to praise him, as that would show the weakness of their defense, nor discipline him, for that too would attract attention). He retired a year later, in 1984. There was another Russian chap who also prevented nuclear WIII, during the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962, Vasili Arkhipov. He was aboard a diesel-generated submarine that had nuclear warheads on it, as it was patrolling Cuba, in international waters. The Americans were dropping signalling depth charges on it, to try and surface it, despite being in international waters. The boat was deep and had been out of contact with Moscow for days, so the somewhat agitated Captain and Political Officer thought war had already started and they should launch their nukes. But, unusually for Soviet subs carrying nukes at that time, there needed to be 3 people in agreement to launch: the Captain (Savitsky), the Political Officer (Maslennikov) _and_ the Executive Officer (Arkhipov). Arkhipov disagreed with the other two, which developed into an argument. Arkhipov had also, just the year before (1961), been the deputy commander/Executive Officer in a nuclear sub that developed an extreme leak in it's reactor cooling system, which also cut communications to Moscow. The Captain of that sub ordered the 7 engineering crewmen to go in and fix the leak, and they were able to save the boat from nuclear meltdown. But all of the engineering crew, plus their divisional officer, died within a month of radiation and everyone on board suffered radiation poisoning. 15 further crew died within 2 years of the event. So Arkhipov was seen with high regard and his opinion mattered, so he convinced the Captain not to fire the nukes and surface the boat. There was a Soviet inquiry that initially drew heat but as soon as it was discovered the boat was diesel-powered, the crew/officers were exonerated (as diesel generated subs aren't suited for long underwater journeys, they had to surface).
@@Lurch-Bot And yes, but frighteningly, that's already happening with Palestinians being targeted by Israeli/Western (Google etc) AI, to slaughter innocent people en masse, with little/no oversight. 35,000 people already dead from such a device. Horrific.
#4 Honestly, the first theory makes the most sense out of all of them. The US had started invading the Chinese mainland. Launching nukes would be equivalent to flipping a table because they were in check in a high stakes chess match. Dramatic, but potentially reasonable on some crazy level.
fallout 2 actually states this as the reason for China shooting first. In the city of San Francisco we can access what once was the nuclear submarine Shi Huang Ti, it was one of the many carriers that launched nuclear warheads on the coast of California. An entry by the captain of the submarine almost confirms that China shot nukes because they were backed into a corner
Absolutely. This is the same reason America dropping the bomb doesn't make logical sense; sunk cost is irrelevant ( they could reasonably predict the damage from a nuclear exchange being worse, if they even survive). The whole situation doesn't really add up
The war was a stalemate. There was no need to flip the table when most of the pieces were still active. Moreover, historically, nuclear bombs were not used or were not planned to be used out of desperation, but rather proactively for purportedly logical and utilitarian reasons. Both China and America would've known throughout their decade of war how illogical and un-utilitarian mutually assured destruction would be, which is why they both refrained from using nukes for a decade. Some sort of Enclave-corporate deep state motive is still the most convincing answer if we're going by the original planned lore.
@@mapleflag6518 It's possible, but considering we're talking about defending one's home turf at that point in the war, it's probably unlikely the cause for the nukes.
I think I read somewhere that the only reason Mr. House looks so ghoulish and shriveled is because of some sort of power outage at the lucky 38 that left him in a coma for like 60 years while in stasis. Some sort of low power mode left him looking like that. Maybe thats headcannon actually but I know the coma and the outage definitely DID happen in the lore.
House didn't own H&H, his brother did. I can't remember if he sold his stake to his brother or not, but the terminals show his brother slowly losing his mind to the idea House was going to try & take it away...
Recall something like that almost happened during the Cold War, a false alarm was triggered for one of the sides and they almost launched... or something like that.
@@Techhunter_Talon Russian commander refused to fire the missile without confirmation. The radar was off and war was averted because of his gut feeling.
I think the only issue i have with the last one is that Vault Tec has deep connections with The Enclave. And, The Enclave has clear ideological reasons for the things they do, not to make money.
Yeah but that’s the leader ship how many people involved tag do you think honestly know about that connection prewar or post war it is not many. In fact most of the data that was sent to the enclave I’m pretty sure it was done in secret. If I remember correctly.
@@smokedbeefandcheese4144 100% agreed. Openly promoting social experiments on living subjects in a “controlled environment” isn’t going to sit well with anyone. So VT has to pretend that its “just” Project Safehouse, and keep the details under wraps from upper management downwards. The Enclave plays only a minor role in this, when looking in from the outside.
@@lennaertvanmierlo2955 Except it does, because a business being used as a front can have money fed into it to keep it operational until the money doesn't matter anymore (immediately after dropping the bombs). Do you think CIA shell companies operate for profit's sake?
vault tec had no connections to the enclave, it's like saying if the illuminati are indeed real and running the world boeing has connections to them because they're paid to make stuff for the U.S military or multiple uni's and pharma companies have ties to them because various governments pay them for R&D VT is a business that had a job to do and was paid handsomely to do it, very very little indicates they had any real idea what was going on beyond they were told to run experiments for money
About china launching frist, there is a terminal entry in fallout new Vegas at black mountain that says the facility picked up Chinese launches, "china was lighting up" "they really did it" are the only two lines I remember from the entry. Also the shi emperor recorded that launch orders were given by Beijing. Granted it's unclear if those orders were given in response to a nuclear attack from the US. But the captain of the Chinese sub said something along the lines of the leadership having gone mad.
Vaul Tec actually launched first (now cannon), my guess is targeting both countries to entice them both to think it was the other. The US and China were actually working towards a peace talks.
@@saturn12002 oh really? Because Todd Howard has confirmed that that the show IS canon. He seems like a much more reliable source than some rando named saturn12002.
As to your second misconception, the survivalists terminals in honest hearts detail his life immediately after the bombs fall. He was able to hide out in caves and such for years till the radiation died down enough to go outside, he saw new plant life and so forth sprouting up within a few years.
You also reminded me of a place in fallout 4, about a neighbor that spilled the tea about where they were living, to only the neighbor being alive after their place got attacked.
It's also noted in Fallout NV that China started the war. The Watch station atop Black Mountain records the exchange as it happened, recording missle launches from the Chinese mainland as well as Fleet movements. It confirms president Richardsons statements. At least, if I recall.
The only reason I’d say your wrong is that Nevada wasn’t the first strike zone; at the very least New York & LA were hit beforehand making a first strike being documented in black mountain unlikely.
@@iamwords2d200 it is documented in black mountain, same as in fallout 4 in the switchboard. The basic idea is that satellites can see the launches and relayed that info to the US, which responded in kind. Government workers at certain sites could see the information as it came in while the population at large there’s a delay.
But there are also 2 undetonated nukes ( one in megaton) with the vault tech logo. So they clearly made nukes and they fired them on america. Its a shame he didnt not bring these up when denying the claim it could have been them who fired first.
This is the relevant log from Black Mountain: "Log 674 Oh my god. It's actually happening. We have reading across the board of launches happening everywhere. They must've thrown everything they had, and it looks like we didn't hold back either. The computer says we have 2 minutes until the first missile drops." And here's the log from the Switchboard: "DEFCON Status - 2077 281632RJAN77 ANCHORAGE ALL CLEAR *DEFCON 3* 230003ROCT77 COMPACFLT REPORTS 3 USOS OFF CALIF COAST, JCS ADVISE 230337ROCT77 USAF HAS EYES ON SQUADRON OF AIRPLANES (POSS. CHINESE) AT HIGH ALTITUTDE OFF BERING STRAIGHT 230913ROCT77 IONDS REPORTS 4 PROBABLE LAUNCHES *DEFCON 2* 230917ROCT77 NORAD CONFIRMS BIRDS IN AIR *DEFCON 1* 230926ROCT77 AUTHENTICATED ORDER -- RESPONSE SCENARIO MX-CN91 -- REPEAT MX-CN91 230942ROCT77 PENNSYLVANIA, NEW YORK -- CONFIRM STRIKE 230947ROCT77 OFFLINE - OFFLINE - OFFLINE" Neither log proves that either side shot first. The Black Mountain log proves that both sides launched nukes "across the board, everywhere". The Switchboard log proves that unidentified underwater and "possibly Chinese" airborne objects were detected by America in a 9 hour timespan before the nuclear detonations. And here's the relevant excerpt from President Richardson's dialog: "{212}{prs31}{We try to keep ourselves safe and secure from radiation. That's what separates humans - like me - from mutants like you.} //{213}{}{Why do you keep calling me a mutant?} //{214}{}{Enough talk. Time for you to face that great electoral college in the sky.} //{215}{}{I've killed men for less than that. But I'm in a hurry today. Goodbye.} {216}{prs32}{We were winning, too. And then those damn Reds launched everything they had. We barely got our birds up.} //{217}{}{Doesn't seem as though it helped us much.} {218}{prs33}{Well, no it didn't. But at least it knocked the damn Red menace back into the stone age.} //{219}{}{And us with it.} {220}{prs34}{Well, no. No... not quite. You see, we had planned ahead. We were ready. } //{221}{}{What do you mean?} {222}{prs35}{We had a number of sanctuaries that would enable the glorious American civilization to endure. These facilities - the vaults - were part of the great plan.} //{223}{}{Those damn vaults didn't work the way they were supposed to. A lot of people in them died.} {224}{prs36}{Actually, they worked almost exactly the way they were supposed to. You might call it a social experiment on a grand scale. }" Not exactly a reputable source of information for numerous obvious reasons. I would take what he says with a humongous grain of salt, like George W Bush's "Mission Accomplished" speech x100. All that said, I think China shot first because of Tim Cain's recent statement. 😂
Hello! I hope you are well today, and that you are having a good day. Honestly I love learning more about fallout, and I enjoy hearing your voice lending me this information. Yesterday was a rough day so I needed to see this, sorry to ramble but thank you for your time!
@@N_orte well after a family emergency yesterday, it seems it’s going to be alright. Thank you for your concern, I appreciate your kindness as it eases my heart.
@@DancingCrickets04 ACE in the bos bunker in fallout 2 says the following "The suicide rate among true artificial intelligence machines was extremely high. When given full sensory capability the machines became depressed over their inability to go out into the world and experience it. When deprived of full sensory input the machines began to develop severe mental disorders similar to those among humans who are forced to endure sensory deprivation. The few machines that survived these difficulties became incredibly bored and began to create situations in the outside world for their amusement. It is theorized by some that this was the cause of the war that nearly destroyed mankind."
@@DancingCrickets04 Nukapedia does a bad job at explaining fallout and fallout 2 content. However if you wanna check for yourself, get fallout 2 and go to San Francisco, in there upon taking a right turn you will find yourself in something the game calls "The Steel Palace". The steel palace is an area where the remnants of chinese army aboard the Shi Huang Ti live. The Shi Huang Ti was accidentally hit by a Shockwave due to a misfired nuclear torpedo which knocked out most of the ship's systems, once they drifted to the beach they salvaged the submarine into what is known as the Steel Palace. Upon completing their quest line you get access to the "Emperor" which is the mainframe of the ship. It has the ability to predict the future using probabilities just lile PAM. It also has diaries of the original captain who fired the nukes onto the west coast of America. It is a late game area, so i understand if you just use cheats to get there. I recommend F12SE
@@Tatwinus Huh? Doesn't the diary of the leader of the submarine state that he got the order from his seniors? Also the captain thought his sub was the only one equipped with nukes. By the time he had fired he realised there were other submarines that were firing and he felt betrayed
I wouldn't say Vault Tech "planned" the war, but given how many Vaults relied on the war happening and how unfazed they seemed to be when it happened, I'd say they at least anticipated it happening, much like Mr. House.
@@TheNecrokage Correct me if I'm mistaken, but they were only considering it, right? Or has it been fully confirmed that Vault Tec dropped the bombs? I mean, if I'm wrong I'm wrong. The timing does seem weird though. Wouldn't they want all their vaults to be finished before the war? Even Vault 88--the beta vault that was supposed to help other vaults--didn't get finished.
@@zeveria7206some high up employee in vault-tec in one of the games said that they thought they had 22 more hours so when the first bombs dropped vault-tec probably just decided to drop it’s bombs
Definitely seems that the companies started the antagonizing and the Enclave was behind the shadows, we see Coopers wife looking at someone in the shadows.
My theory: vault tec belongs to the enclave. The enclave knew the resources war had depleted the world's resources and would be a matter of time until hunger would kill most people on the planet. So they started a plan, to choose a few humans (themselves, of course) to find another planet with an abundance of resources to colonize. For that, they would need technology they didn't have, so they use the vaults and people inside them as guinea pigs to research that technology. Research about stuff like cryogenic sleep, cure for illness, better fertilizers, better soldiers, etc. Seems like they didn't have enough time to wait for those experiments, probably the collapse of the economy was imminent. So they planned to pause the consumption of resources on earth by killing most people on it. And so, save the few resources left those people would consume otherwise. Finally, they planned to cause the war and wait for the result of the tests on their vaults, while they waited in their main base, the Poseidon Energy oil rig, and prepare themselves to depart earth.
Fallout 76 heavily implies that Vault-tec leadership was a faction withing the enclave that then went rouge from the enclave for whatever reason. Probably the because Greedy powerhungry assholes that would join a shadow government are the kind who would try to form a shadow government within the shadow government. They want Vault 76ers to Control the Nuclear silos in Appalachia for whatever reason. It just so happens that the scorched plauge also needs Nuking back into the caves at the same time.
@@realspartan5206 So why all those places asking "who start the great war, and why?" That theory main point is to explain this. The Enclave start the war, to buy it some time to evacuate the planet.
I dunno about 3, we consider WW2 to include several start and stop periods. Still feels like nuke day is close enough to be part of the resource war (since the govs didn't go to some new war after the bombs).
but most consider the second sino-japanese as a different war to world war 2. people also consider it both part of the war (but only after 39 or 41) and not part of the war (before 39 or 41, or in general). so, by those standards, a war can be considered part of a different, bigger war but also be considered a completely unrelated war, depending on context. so the great war can be considered part of the resources war, but it can be considered it own war because of the damage it caused and because it involves countries and actors that were not involved in the resources war.
@@thisstuffisdumb Most people don't think they are seperate and since Japan/German were allies, they really aren't seperate in a practical sense. That's more an educated person distinction and most people barely remember the brief overview they got in highschool. I do see your point, though I still don't quite agree with all of it. Calling the great war it's own war, is like saying Nagasaki was it's own war. Unless of course the war kept going for everyone but america (at least for a little while.). If we find out the war wasn't over in an hour and any of Europe/Asia/Africa/Australia/SA kept fighting, I can accept them being seperate phases of the same greater conflict. Actually, that's my new head cannon. I like the idea that everyone was pissed off at America for having the last of the resources and everyone took a shot at America, so every other country is only like half as destroyed.
It's a shame that Robert House did not have more time and money, people would emerge from the Vaults to a whole state, maybe most of the country, that had been spared from the bombs.
By the way, I believe there’s another example of someone predicting the Great War, the local government of jamaica town, in the janitors journal entries it talks about how he was promised new air conditioners, piping, etc. but then the next day the council suddenly wanted to build a museum/time capsule in the basement. I believe they constructed it because they knew that the bombs would drop extremely soon
I'd give it anything to see what it would have been like to be on the Strip on the day of the Great War. Seeing all of Mr. Houses automated defenses come online and start firing missiles out of the sky. Saving all of us by saving himself.
Like I've said in the Fallout iceberg video, the whole "P.A.M. causing the Great War" theory really irks me, for a few reasons. Main one is lack of reasons or capability to do so. There is the "human element," but also the factors of smaller groups and greater time-frames leading to inaccuracies. What would cause those more than a nuclear war? Her predictions do take some time, as well - 13.2 hours for one with the Railroad, for instance. Speaking of Railroad, a reason for her joining them is due to their intelligence gathering, which makes destroying her source of all military and civilian intelligence pre-war contradictory. And lying by feeding the U.S. false predictions? She can't even attempt Pavlovian conditioning to the Sole Survivor without verbally stating it. Second reason is putting the blame of such a significant event of the franchise on a single individual; a non-human one, on top of it. The world of Fallout was always one that was the result of humanity's collective actions, the Great War being the culmination of it. P.A.M.'s ultimate failure in stopping the Great War because of that "human element" works perfectly with Fallout. A third, more personal reason is it coming off as, for lacking better words, Brotherhood propaganda. The Brotherhood are capable of reprogramming and keeping her on the Prydwen as extra processing power. This could be seen as a few things - slavery, brainwashing, a mishandling of advanced technology - that are not flattering to the faction. Since the Brotherhood's core beliefs are built upon seeing the worst in everything and everyone, it's easy to see why this theory is so popular. Lastly, it's just very lazy. Depends too much on sci-fi tropes of AI wanting to destroy humanity.
1:53 honestly the fact that Vault Tec not only exists but is highly profitable proofs that everyone knew or at-least suspected it would happen at some point.
Your videos helped me through a naf break up while also informing me on my favorite video game series. Keep pumping out amazing videos for us to enjoy!!
As a supporter of the theory posed in misconception 5, it brings me no small amount of joy to have the question answered and almost all points you mentioned addressed. Almost like someone at Bethesda was listening and taking notes.
I would love to go back in time and play fallout 4 for the first time again. All the lore and new places and new mechanics was freaking astounding! All of it. Reading and figuring out the lore is the best part.
From what I understood at least from a hospital from Fallout 3 is that there was definitely a form of provisional government that was barely holding on right after the bomb fell. But it quickly got overwhelmed and fell apart. The lack of resources and overpopulation.
This video answered some questions I was wondering about. I was thinking about DC having missile defence technology and how only House really prevented his area from being nuked. Fallout is so neat to think about in a dark way
@@moosexd8696 it’s very heavily implied that they either did it directly or ensured that nuclear war would happen. That’s my interpretation of the events. We can disagree.
i think theres a chance that china got wind of vault tecs plans and did a prememptive strike which is why house said he was wrong about the timing by 20 mins
what i think people miss in the fallout games is what the great war refers to it not just the bombs being dropped but the wars leading upto it as during that time almost the entire world was at war if you play as nate he mentions this at one point to a mr gutsy in one of the army base that you can stumble across and he also mentions that he was expecting to be recalled in the near future if the war went on but the bombs went off and well thats where fallout 4 starts
I love pointing out a certain Overseer ruined the plans of her vault, all because she realized the 'Drill' being carried out *hours* before the bombs dropped was the real thing. Considering that the weapons being used took only 45 minutes to reach their targets, as verified by radar stations in the same game, this would require some sort of inside knowledge that the bombs where *scheduled* to drop that day. Thus the residents of Vault 81 was spared being test subjects for all sorts of diseases.... And we have a big arrow pointing to Vault Tec knowing that there was a time table for the war.
@@mapleflag6518or maybe just like barstow. Part of a first-generation supervisor's job was to be in his vault 24/7, which is why he knew ahead of time when it happened and manually turned off the vault's remote alerts, so as not to alert staff.
I would like to clarify a minor point related to the fifth misconception. -The message concerning scouting is in regards to another message stating standard protocol for vault operation. The protocol states when scouting missions should take place. So the message stating that the nuke destroyed the entrance and disabled their scouting capabilities is most likely just a statement regarding their inability to follow procedure.
As someone who lived on the Kenai peninsula I always thought it’s depiction of Anchorage to be hilarious. It’s actually a huge city and gets constant tourism. I mean sure there was the plague, but its almost never brought up in the games. Literally didn’t know about it until a couple years ago and I was a big fallout fan lol
The comparison of Vault-Tec to an insurance agency is really clever! It gets the point across extremely well! I’ve been a part of the fandom for a long time and haven’t heard that one before.
SHOW SPOILERS The fallout show kinda changes everything you said about vault-tec here cus they’re confirmed to be wanting the world to end as well as actively working towards it happening.
Point One : You list people having a "feeling that the end will come soon" when they do not know the day. A lot of the people you said "knew" are just people we would call End of The World Nuts today. One read a call from some as a coded message when it could have been something else. House was planning for the fall of the world even in game it came before his prep was done. He could only save the strip when his aim was to have most of the Mojave to be saved and free from Fallout. If he knew the day it was coming his plans would have been done even if he had to throw a few more Billions at the problem. Believing the End is coming and truly knowing it will come are different thing. So the Great War in Fallout was a Surprise to most of the world there are things that point to that the Enclave knew it was coming. The Enclave controls Vault Tech and other Companies for all their plans to gain the Power of the Government. Now I am not saying the Enclave did the attack but they would have known that a Nuke War was unavoidable while they could slow the war down they could not stop it so they planned ways to keep themselves alive.
I read through these posts and look at all the Armageddon stories and have noticed one area tends to stand out due to its ABSENCE The Fallout lore makes no mention of it. In the real world there is a treaty signed by all governments to keep people away from it Antarctica War has never touched the shores of that frozen land. However, there are military bases in that land mass.
House miscalculated it by a day if I remember correctly (which is why he couldn't get the platinum chip on time) and no his plan was just to save Las Vegas not the entire Mojave, though he didn't completely succeed in that due to him relying on an unstable os, as the updated version on the platinum chip was supposed to be delivered to him a day later, so a few nukes ended up hitting the city. There were others to who believed it was coming like Sinclair (the guy who built the Sierra Madre casino) but he couldn't foresee the experiments Big Mt. people were trying to do there.
@@thelakeman2538 It was more then just a day. He would have needed the time to upload the patch to the bots and make other prep. It was the whole "game area" so maybe not the full desert but Las Vegas and enough area around it to live and expand comfortably.
#5: The problem with that misconception is that, yes, they are a business. But they were also *highly* involved with the US Government. I don't know how to put this concisely because there's many parts flowing into it, but it's less about the money and more about the power. I mean, sure, they can have fuckloads of cash for their vaults, but in the end, if nothing happens, they had a good few years of cash influx and then will crash and burn. Which is probably not a big deal for the higher ups, but hey, more power is more good. *And* they always have to worry about competition or people wisening up or the government going "y'know what, that'll be enough of that" and shut it all down. Especially since they're, in part, prepping to head off into space with those experiments. And once that's done, well... not much use for 'em anymore. Plus it's trickier getting massive quantities of "volunteers" for vault experiments, especially if so much as a *rumour* about their true extend spreads. It's one thing to have a shadowy government agency abduct people, a whole other to have a corporation try to entice you for them. I mean, sure, they can just abduct people large scale for the vault thing, but honestly, it's easier to just have a scare craze to buy into it and then do it when they are happily just going in. And since I kinda veered off, back on track: With the life extension projects, experimentation, FEV and such things, it's far, *far* easier to just wipe the slate clean and have the planet to yourself and rebuild than it'd be to try and win the war with china. And once thusly poised, what was once a corporation becomes a government, with all the goody goody opportunities to go with it. You don't exactly need money when you can just make those poor sods work for you. But if you still want the money as a concept, hey, still easier to do it without the government supervision and just use scrips. Meaning you work for them, get paid in scrip, and buy Vault Tec brand food, live in Vault Tec brand shelters, have Vault Tec brand medcare, and no other option since Vault Tec is *everywhere*. Sorry for the barely cohesive rambling. Hope it was at least somewhat followable. As for Vault 22: I am not sure we can take Vault 22's pre-war sign at face value, since it's outside. Meaning it may as well be publicity. i.e. They say it's "to combat world hunger", but since most Vault projects were, to my knowledge, aimed at going to the stars, it's kind of more likely that they were prepping alternative ways to grow food in space than combating world hunger. Although hunger probably still becomes a problem after the nuclear holocaust, what with nuclear winter and such. Gotta make sure it grows fast and is safe against radioactivity and such.
The thing is that if you're going to use the whole they were in deep with the government then you'll have to look at other companies like nuka cola, mass fusion ect for the same reason
The main fuel for the theory that it was them is that there are 2 dropped (undetonated) nukes in the wastelands with the vaulttech logo on. So they did in fact have nukes and those nukes were 100% surly fired on america. So the only way vault tech didnt attack america is if chinese spies took over a vault tech launch site and fired them. For me the only question is if they started it or not but vault tech did for a fact attack america.
Misconception #5, the idea that Vault-Tec orchestrated the Great War, is interesting. This video goes into good detail explaining the purposes of certain Vault experiments, as immoral as they were. It also raises the point that some experiments were already running, with test subjects, before the nukes dropped. Now, I remember hearing something years ago that was essentially the opposite of Misconception #5. I thought it was part of the canon lore at the time, but now that I can't find it, I assume that it was just a theory. The idea that I remember hearing was that Vault-Tec either didn't believe that the Great War would happen, or at least that it would never be as bad as it turned out to be. They always planned to pull people into the Vaults. For example, they could convince people that they would be better off living underground from now on just in case something happened. The Vault's purpose was always to hide their unethical experiments under the ground. Of course, the Vaults were buried and built sturdily enough to withstand a nuclear apocalypse. However, the theory went as far as claiming that Vault-Tec never believed that the Vaults' resilience against nuclear war would be tested, at least up until the Great War was close to happening. They always intended that the immoral experiments would be running underground, out-of-sight and out-of-mind, while life on the surface continued as normal. They only made the Vaults sturdy enough to withstand a real nuclear war because they needed that as part of their pitch for government funding, as well as their pitch to get test subjects to go inside. Over time, all the Vault experiment data would flow into Vault-Tec. They would use it to continue scientific progress and new product development and sale. Perhaps over time, they would even build new generations of Vaults for even more experiments. Looking back, I think this theory came out of a desire to answer one of the big questions about the Fallout universe. That being: *What is/was the end goal of all of these Vault experiments?*. Sure, the individual Vaults can still advance towards whatever individual goals they had, but what is the endgame of all of the Vault experimentation? Why would they pitch something like Vault 101 as a way to help humanity survive if the Vault was meant to never open, since that would just lead to eventual genetic stagnation and death? Why would they pitch a Vault with an intentionally faulty radiation seal as a way to help humanity survive if everyone was doomed when the seal failed. This theory holds a potential multi-part answer. 1) Vault-Tec intended the Vaults to be underground places for their immoral experiments on their test subjects, while life on the surface continued as normal 2) Vault-Tec would continue to profit as the central command for this research and use the results to come out with new products and potentially new generations of Vaults 3) Vault-Tec built the Vaults with the ability to withstand nuclear war *purely* to get funding for the project and convince their test subjects to go in. 4) However, until the Great War was very close, Vault-Tec didn't actually believe the Great War would happen. 5) The Great War happened, and the old government, as well as Vault-Tec, blew up. 6) Because the Vaults had been built to withstand nuclear war as part of their marketing and funding pitch, they managed to keep large groups of humanity safe after all. 7) The individual Vaults remained indoctrinated to continue their individual experiments, even without Vault-Tec as a central command to profit from them. 8) Since Vault-Tec blew up, the original cumulative end goal of more Vault-Tec research, Vault-Tec products, and Vault-Tec profits is no longer attainable. It's a bit like the original "Cube" movie, where the characters are stuck in a maze full of horrible traps with no defined reason. The idea was that there had been a group that controlled the maze, but they were gone now, so the original purpose was irrelevant. The characters just had to survive as best they could against a killing machine that had no one controlling it anymore. 9) The new end goal is left up to the survivors in the post-war world.
The plants miscommunication is also one that should be brought up as well. Many people forget that FEV was spread into the atmosphere, which caused gouls and super mutants, this also made tons of people infertile which would likely apply to many plant species. The intense heat of the bombs combined with nuclear winters afterwards would also kill much of the plant life, many people forget that the bombs were dropped all over the country, making fallout 76 technically inaccurate, as the bombs would've scorched the area in nuclear fire and left it barren. Lots of life was also lost, with many people who survived as gouls being those who were far enough away to not get killed by the blasts but also protected enough from the rads to not die, as the rads would kill everyone who wasn't turning into a goul
Note to all of you show watchers: a contingency plan is only a contingency plan if the alternative doesn't come to fruition. We know Vault-Tec would have, but we don't know if they did.
The idea of Vault Tech starting the Great War mostly comes from an interview with one of the writers of Fallout 2. He said the original idea was Vault Tech wanted to colonize another planet. The vaults were isolation stress tests so to speak becuz they (Vault Tech) would be traveling thru space for some time and the research was invaluable
I like the Vault -tech route that the show cannonised, of all the possibilities of who launched VT are the ones who actually had everything to gain from it, by using certain vaults to do test good or bad it sends back info to the main VT surviving HQs allowing them to feed the data to the actual vaults letting them mold their version of what humanity should and allowing vt a road to repopulating the world in their eyes by being an seeing overseer to the west.
I’m not convinced by the first assertion. Most, if not all, of these examples seem to come down to a few things: -People who were already inclined to build defensive measures against the possibility of nuclear war. Open war between the two largest superpowers, both of which had ample means and cause to use their nuclear stockpiles, is more than enough to explain this; in the real world Cold War we already took such measures despite no hot war ever occurring. In particular, House and NukaWorld’s CEO seem particularly unconvincing in this regard, seeing as they were both shrewd businessmen with old-school business sensibilities, delusions of grandeur and keen minds, and hence naturally inclined to hedge their bets. -People who would have indeed had early warning - but only on the level of hours, days, or minutes at best because of preexisting early warning infrastructure. It actually takes time to launch ships, load bombers, and prep silos. These would be easily detectable with Fallout technology, as they were also easily detectable to 50s and 60s technology, though submarines would of course be much harder to spot. -People who had an uncanny sense of prescience or foreboding and felt disaster was imminent. This is common in fiction, and also not-unheard of in reality, though often in reference to personal tragedies rather than catastrophe. Are these all indications of awareness of some kind? Obviously so, but no moreso, I’d argue, than an average citizen or serviceperson who knows we’re at war and sees the signs that it could go sharply poor for everyone. But most of them aren’t really an indication of *knowledge* of the when, where and how of the event transpiring. Even the notable exception, the call to the power armor lab, reads to me as a dire response to the sudden revelation that it is, in fact, all over and that they should save as many as possible as quickly as possible. The overwhelming message of 50s propaganda on either side of the wall stated that it could happen at any time and you would have next to no warning. Factually we know that’s not strictly true, but on a functional level, for most people, even at the highest levels, it was or still would be. When people say the Great War was a complete surprise, I think they mean it much more in that sense rather than in the sense that *no one* knew or had slightly earlier warnings. It still struck harder and faster than anyone expected given the, at that point, extremely extended period of exchange-free conventional war that had occurred.
SPOILER WARNING FOR THE FALLOUT SHOW! The show has now tore the Theory of Vault-Tec dropping the first bombs wide open. It's not yet confirmed, but we at least know they had plans to do so. Can't wait for season 2.
More evidence for the point that people knew the bombs were coming are the pulowaski preservation shelters. Not sure if there are any in new Vegas but they exist in fallout 3 (try the mission “Those!”)
The Pulowski shelters don't even work though. They were never meant to; they were commercial competition with Vault-Tec by a cynical company just looking to make a profit.
The weirdest thing to me is that both in the Fandom and atleast partially in universe, the Great War is talked about as though separate and apart from the Sino-American War. The later had been ongoing for a decade at the time the bombs dropped and was still actively raging. Why not simply use the terms interchangeably for the conflict as a whole and call the 23rd Doomsday or some such?
wrong topic to include this but its important: the whole idea of the wasteland creatures being the size that they are (especially the insects), would be physically impossible with just radiation alone. the fact is the bigger the animal (especially insects), the earths atmosphere needs to have a higher oxygen percentage, nuclear war would cause the direct opposite. so for the wasteland to have creatures as big as they are i'd say the nuclear bombs had a more sinister purpose
These are really good, namely starting with those first two misconceptions, because yeah, it wasn't really a surprise, and we know that humanity was back to trying to rebuild almost immediately after. Though #3, the great war, was referring to the whole war, not just the nuke part, as it was a world war, as while China and the USA were the largest powers, they were backed by others, like how the USA annexed Canada and used it as a stanging ground for it's operations. With fallout lore, post WW2, society got very heavy into nucular power, but also still relied heavily on oil as well, as needed the oil to make various plastics as well as for fuel sources. The resource wars started out as a cold war, that then got heated as China and the USA fought over the remaining scraps, backed up by other nations here or there. So it was a war that lasted many years, and in lore we know there was a lot of killing all around, on all sides, that turned it from a cold war, to a real war. There was even fighting on the moon, battles in space, over land, resources, and more, so the "resource war" WAS the great war, as it was a war that effected all of the world, but we don't hear much about who allied with whom. Point 4 is agreeable too, it's hard, if impossible to know who started it, it was just as likely as someone mistaking a cloud formation as incoming missiles that made them launch the nukes. We know Mexico City was hit by a nuke as well, we hear this frima Raul in New Vegas, and we know basically every major city was hit, in the USA and Canada, we are lead to think it was the same with Europe and Asia. For all we know the USA or a fringe group could have tried to blow up a major base in China to get a foothold, which made the Chinese decide to launch their nukes, in defiance, or as a MAD (mutually assured destruction) situation. Or maybe it was the aliens, as we know they have existed all the way back in fallout 1, where you can find a crashed UFO and an alien blaster. That is in part what Mothership Zeta may imply with that audio log, as we know the Aliens seem to be there for resources and/or more as well. But I don't see P.A.M. being the one to do it, at least not majorly, because yes, she can't figure out the human element, she isn't the kind that seems inherently willing to do such a thing even if humans gave her a headache with her calculations. As for the idea the Enclave did it, while they had vested interest in the Vaults, which is why this leads into #5, they had no reason to do it. The reason they took over and started to do the experiments, was to better plan leaving the planet behind and going out into space, to colonize other planets. The experiments were very much MKUltra level stuff, sacrificing and testing on citizens, they planned to make people go into the vaults, and test on them. By making the bombs fall for real, it actually made it near impossible for them to do it, since the plan was to go into space, and colonize, and leave Earth behind. By everything being blown up, communications got cut, and there was no real way to go to space anymore, due to infrastructure being destroyed. In other words, yeah, some of the vaults had things in mind, like a door that doesn't seal properly, but it would be controllable by the shadow government, but were never ACTUALLY meant to house people for long periods of time. That is the experiment went off the rails, they could control it and direct it back to where it needs to be, or get new members to be part of the vaults. And as for the megaton bomb, that wasn't vault-tec, that is a pretty standard military sort of logo, but it's hard to tell if it was American or not, and as there was an air field not that far away, that very well could have been dropped by a US plane to cut weight to try to keep in the air as control was lost due to the EMP effect as that is the kind of bomb dropped from a plane, not launched like from a sub or I.C.B.M. as we are told they had and used, even seeing one used in New Vegas.
I'd argue that Vault Tec does have incentive. They kept having people not show up when alarmed. They were losing the confidence of investors. You lose that, people start getting fired, lawsuits start happening. Ironically, a war would help PRESERVE them.
China starting the great war is canon for me, but as our narrator says "The details are trivial and pointless, the reasons, as always, purely human ones.” As a gag I don't mind red herrings being handed out each game, the Zetas, PAM etc. The only one I wish would fade away is the Vault Tec one, just too silly. They should have a storyline where a Vault-tec CEO has a mental breakdown, trys to buy an A-Bomb from a drug dealer to start the war and the company has to quietly have him committed to a mental asylum
It’s important to note (as I think you do a good job of) that the impacts of the GW were extremely variable based on environment as well. We know the west and Great Plains areas seem to have almost suffered total ecological collapse due to months upon months of irradiated rain, according to several logs but notably the Survivalist. And as you pointed out, Appalachia was far from a priority target but still experienced severe ecological shift.
It always struck me as strange how little progress has been made towards rebuilding civilization on the surface, especially with how many people actually survived the war around the country. Even with the monsters and radiation and such taken into account, there's no way that, two centuries into the apocalypse, nobody would have been doing much to rebuild anywhere except for the NCR and kind of Vegas. Even 200 years in, there's still a relatively huge amount of roads, buildings, and other infrastructure that's remarkably intact and could be used as a base to repair or build off of, but nobody ever does or even seems particularly interested in trying.
the commonwealth and capitol took tons more nuclear strikes so their wastelands are a lot more raider centric than the California/nevada area fallout 1&2 are fantastic about showing how fast people can build
Good insight. I think whilst it's hard to believe Vault-Tec caused the nuclear annihilation itself, I think it's a fair assumption they had a part to play in it. Business for them would improve based on how many vaults were being sold. Fearmongering and fanning the flames would've been an important business strategy for them. You really have to adore the way this in-game universe tries to warn us about our own. I wonder if we'll ever listen.
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I have discord facebook and Twitter can we do the whole prize thing through their Telegram way too sketchy.
love your vids but can you black list the telegram guy?
@@hoi4fan120 yeah that seemed shady af yeah please get rid of them
war thunder is much better despite it have some issues.. like instant fight after spawn.
Raul mentions the hell of surviving right after the bombs dropped. There was definitely still a lot of people alive after the strikes.
The Father in the Caves' story from Honest Hearts depicts several of the different types of people that survived the early years, including a group of vault dwellers that apparently left their vault within one (maybe two) generation(s). His story is one of my favourites from the games.
Almost all ghouls talk about how bad it was right after the bombs drop.
So does Carol in Underworld. She talks about the collapse of society and the city on fire. Also the Boylston Club members survived for a week until they decided to "unalive" themselves.
@@derkylos me too bro, absolutely outstanding story when you piece it all together. Also The Survivalist Rifle is my favourite weapon in the game.
Most of the world population would survive a nuclear war, but not the following nuclear winter which would last for years or even decades. Starvation cause by the nuclear winter will kill far more people than the bombs, and the nuclear fallout and radiation.
"Vault tec didn't start the great war"
Amazon: let me get my beer
And yet, the just as mercenary and ambitious House was actively trying to do the opposite.
Imagine if House not only got the platinum chip on time, but early, and could protect more than just Vegas. Even if just a few major cities and military facilities are protected, the US de facto would have won the war.
Didn't confirm that they did. Only that they may have planned to. I don't see vault-tec dropping the bombs with all the unfinished ones still being made.
@@TranscendentalLaw yeh... alot of people are only talking about the show and do not look at the actual lore , yeh vault tec might have some hand in it but there is also alot of nukes that came from china
I was thinking more along the lines that vault tech may have planned a nuclear bomb to go off somewhere, but just enough to scare people, not actually cause the end of the world.
So, by Vault-Tec planned it, I don't think they meant Vault-Tec dropped all the bombs. That would be crazy. There were thousands.
What I assume happened was...Vault-Tec dropped the initial bomb on the United States. Just the one. As a way of spreading fear so they could sell more of their vaults. They maybe didn't anticipate that that one nuke would be the catalyst to the end of the world. They dropped one. The US bombard China. China bombards the US. Soon the entire world is on fire.
It wouldn't make much business sense for Vault-Tec to intentionally destroy their entire market.
Based on terminal entries in vault 19 that vault was occupied pre-war as a psychiatric hospital. One terminal entry talks about an individual arriving in police custody.
so true. they where bringing people there saying they where mentally ill from the vegas area to vault 19 so was definitly before the great war.
No, it's actually a lot more messed up than that.
SPOILERS:
The doctor and her security staff were told these were mental patients in police custody. Every last person brought there had a clean psychiatric bill of health, and they wanted to see how much paranoia they could induce without violence or chems. They played low voices in someone's radio, kept the real reactor room hidden so things in the fake reactor room could seem off, even had a red and blue team with separate overseers, but only one of them was the real overseer so the other was driven to paranoia because the real overseer had to constantly hide things from him.
I like to imagine that Nukes in Fallout aren’t normal Nukes because if they were then we would see more nature in Fallout games
I read somewhere(maybe the fallout bible) that the nukes were 750k, meaning they were small and the nuclear fallout would've been devastating(much like Chernobyl).
@@AuVeI Except Chernobyl is overgrown now too.
The real answer is that Fallout isn't beholden to real-world science. It is based entirely off of a combination of 1950's pulp sci-fi and Road Warrior visuals.
@@AuVeI Add in the fact that nuclear power was far more wide spread in the Fallout universe, and so just imagine dropping a nuke on hundreds of thousands of Chernobyls, all over America.
The fallout would be MASSIVE.
@@filthycasual8187 There actually is a forest outside Pripyat that was so heavily irradiated that it has never regrown.
They would probably be cobalt nukes or “salt bombs” which release extremely high amounts of radiation to prevent anything organic from growing in an area for a very long time
One thing I liked about F4 was it showed the downfall wasn't like flicking a light switch, one second pre-war civilization and the second Fallout/Mad Max. Society and government actually survived for a good long while before succumbing to multiple crises. Kind of like Rome. People think 476, but for the people living then life pretty much continued as normal for a while, hell even the Senate continued to exist and meet. It was a very gradual process that occurred over generations.
I mean, society and government still kinda exist in F4
@@somedude0921post war in fo4 there was supposed to be a provisional government, but the institute instantly ruined it by killing everyone in charge, even when youre introduced to the institute father tells you about it but in a twisted way
It's like the movie, Threads
One of the most realistic depictions of nuclear war
@@chistinelane A lot of people say that, but science has marched on and the nuclear arsenals have shrunk. Threads is now decidedly unrealistic.
Not just that, but why would Vault-Tech start the Great War before all of their vaults are finished? Vault 114 and 88 was still under construction, so even if they wanted war, they would wait until everything was completely ready.
Not really.
Why, vault tech would stop building the vaults at any point? Wouldn't it be a bit sus? So it was worth keep bulding it, even for the glimpse possibility that someone might acuse them off starting the war.
I feel like all suggested groups had involvement in setting things up. But since too many groups tried doing the same thing, it happened early.
@@komiks42 While that does make sence weren't some vaults kept a secret to some extent. I bring this up because if some were secret, people would be non the wiser if they were or weren't building them. Also the vaults all weren't build in one town. So they probably weren't active in some cities and especially smaller towns. Also if the world was nuked my first priority wouldn't be to wonder if a safety bunker company started the war. If anything I'd blame the government. And by the time people would wonder that the people responsible would probably be dead and not care what some raiders thought of their company's integrity.
it had nothing to do with vault tech, china, the us or aliens. Moira Brown started the great war as part of her survival guide quest.
@@Nickelbag610 The secret vaults aren't really an issue because, at any given time, they had multiple vaults under construction. They're contradictory in isolation, but it's not a big deal since they aren't actually isolated.
I like to think that dogmeat lauched the nuke, but he set it on a TIMER. And he had time to hide while it was on the timer. That's how he survived. Idk how he traveled that far tho.
Uh, institute teleportation because he's a synth? Duh
I think Dogmeat is a synth. I think that is how Shaun (Institute leader) was able to track the lone wanderer besides synth birds and was maybe sent by Shaun to aid his father/mother. He stated that he watched you even as you exited the vault and you immediately run into Dogmeat shortly after when you reach the first Red Rocket gas station. Dogmeat and Cogsworth do not have companion quests, either. Also, Does the name "Dogmeat" imply anything? Like is Dogmeat a joke name for a Gen3 Synth dog? Also, Dogmeat is all pristine and healthy, but the other dogs of fallout are all mutated. The "wild" dogs running around are mutated Canine Familia (Common house dogs). They are the descendants of people's house pets left to the radiation of the wasteland for the most part, but Dogmeat has no deformities, etc. The other one in New Vegas that belongs to the leader of that gang that follow Elvis is really old and augmented with cybernetic implants. He's the only other German Shepard I remember seeing and even he was part cyborg. Then when you run into him he's immediately friendly to you and doesn't behave like he's afraid of people at all, intimidated, scared, or anything. It's a seemingly wild random dog you run into and in a harsh environment like Fallout with raiders, mutants, giant insects, etc., I find it hard to believe a random dog you encounter would be so friendly and so immediately. Random raiders would had probably shot at Dogmeat, etc. It would be weary of people, I would think. I think that Dogmeat must had been secretly following you and it just isn't scripted in the game. Maybe he was programmed to track you and when you start heading toward the gas station that it goes straight there and waits for you.
He ran, obviously
Fast travel.
lmaooo
In Fallout lore the US annexed Canada and Mexico during the resource wars, so neither country really existed at the time the nukes fell.
It could always be someplace else that got left behind but still had nuclear capabilities. Britain, for example, was allegedly royally screwed after they glassed Israel, but they still might have enough missiles and bombs left over to fool the US.
Hope we see a fallout in any of those countries but of course with like us flags everywhere
Well, as a Canadian, it's nice to hear I died trying to keep the Americans out long before all this mess.
The invasion Mexico is from the Fallout Bible, so it may not be strictly canon. That said, even it doesn't say the U.S. completely annexed it like Canada. It's possible only more northern and eastern regions were taken.
Depends on your definition of annexed bc in fallout 4 if you listen to the tv you can hear the news broadcaster say that cold winds were coming from Canada, so yes the country did exist although it might've been under u.s control
One thing I've never thought about regarding the war, is the American forces overseas fighting. U.S. probably had soldiers near China when the bombs fell. Makes me wonder, what happened to them? Fallout 2 had the "Shi", Chinese submariners that integrated into San Francisco. Think there's a faction over there with U.S. troops integrating into post-war China?
no
Yes
"Near" My brother in Christ, they had already taken the Gobi desert, they were WELL into China.
For those of us not living in the US there are many other things to think about in regard to the Fallout world. For one thing, we never had Cram or Fancy Lad Snack Cakes.
That thought kinda brings to mind Twilight 2000 for me.
Regarding #4, I've always felt that the real answer to whether the USA, China, corporate interests or another nation started the war is "they all did". Sure, some individual had to have launched the very first bomb on 23/10/77. But decades (if not centuries) of competition over control of resources, mutual escalation, and insatiable desire for more power and more growth by those already powerful and wealthy were the real causes of the war. Someone pushing a button was simply the moment all of that led up to. To give a firm answer on whether that finger belonged to an American general, a Chinese general or a Vault-Tec executive is to miss the point of the game that it could just as easily have been any of them.
I also like to stress that it doesn't matter who started it. The war happened. No one surviving in the world cares. They don't really even care about the words United States of America.
I think that's why we've never found out what the straw that broke the camel's back was. The point is that the whole world was so paranoid that everybody was planning to use their nukes before the other side.
It's just as likely to me that the USA was the first to strike and that any evidence to the contrary is simply propaganda.
The way I see it, whatever the final straw was is irrelevant because the nukes were already inevitable. If that exact series of events hadn't happened, some other similar thing would have triggered the nukes.
I like that we're given hints that it might have been vault-tec or some non-military entity because it shows that the causes of the war are much deeper than simple national politics.
I think it's also thematically relevant than nobody who potentially caused the war managed to survive it. Whatever that cause may have been, the choice was always the same -mutual destruction-. I don't think any of the major players were ignorant enough to think they'd survive the war they were all just too proud to back down and locked into their decisions by the power structures they had constructed.
"the real culprit was the friends we made along the way". Lol nah. It definitely isn't that simple. The who and the why are what's interesting. It's not merely a small detail
@@Bran_Flakesx7I disagree, I think that it better suits the themes of fallout to not tell us.
@@ryleyrains6836 if the themes include "yeah everyone was working towards brinksmanship" I still wanna know who's the madlad who actually launched the first nuke knowing what would happen
#5) This actually explains to me why Vault Tech had so many twisted experiments and more importantly, HOW they expected to learn the results. It really never made sense to me that Vault Tech set all this up ahead of the war to then be unable to make use of the data.
I always figured Vault Tec HQ was watching it all on TV in the head office. Vault. They need some kind of TV to watch and this gives them 1 channel per vault.
The sad thing is, that sometimes unethical experimentation get is own life and the results do not matter in the end. This might be what happened to some degree for some of the experiments. There seem to have been a lot of experiments with very questionable use. Also this is a very good reason why one should not excuse lack of ethics for experiments on the grounds of progress. Once you stop actually taking ethics to account, the goal to learn to tend to disappear to. It just becomes a perverse way to torture people with no value for anyone, except in the sick mind of the one committing the torture.
The whole idea that Vault Tec would be behind it all sort of need to hinge on these perverse ideas. While N_orte claims that it makes no sense for them as a business to doom the world. Vault Tec is not just a business. There are people behind the business and if the leadership get the idea that, for example, the world will end soon in nuclear fire or some other collapse, then they may choose to end it on their own terms. Money is nice, but what really matters for people at this level is power. Not money. And often they tend to view the world as a zero-sum game on top of that. Meaning, the only way to gain power is to take it from someone else. Be careful around people like that. They do sometimes climb to the top of the corporate latter, as well as in politics.
Though honestly. I do agree with N_orte conclusion. It does not matter how the Great War of Fallout started. And that is why I think the game is littered with contradictory "clues" who done it. And who to say that everyone did not do it at the same time. ;)
Plus, it actually fits Fallout's darkness for these dark experiments to, in the end, serve no real purpose because its masters are dead.
The issue is simple... The Humans went into space. We know this from Nuka World and even New Vegas. They had a battle on the moon...see Fallout 4. Who were they fighting we never know. Vault-Tec was building the vaults for a simple reason...they were planning on putting them on other worlds. We know this from Nuka-World. Some of the experiments are some we ourselves would conduct to see how a Human would react in such environments. Vault-Tec never intended to make the experiment last long. Vault-Tec itself was wiped by a direct hit and can be found either in Fallout 1 or 2, I forget the exact game it is in. So it couldn't stop the experiments. Because it couldnt do such the experiments continued on until the Overseers were ordered to stop. They never got that order so...well you know. If you look around Fallout 2, 3 and even 4. You shall note messages about waiting for the order to open the vaults. Since they never came the Overseers continued with them. Vault-Tec never meant for those experiments to last that long.
@@Mega-Brick I don’t feel like we know that yet. In order to determine such a thing you would have to look at each vault which we cannot currently do. And look at the cost/benefit involved. I would say the fact that there are garden of Eden creation kits out there shows that vault tech was not all that bad. And without those vaults city and project purity and maybe even the NCR itself would not exist in the state it does.
Y'know I used to think that, within the context of fallout universe, that becoming a feral ghoul would be the absolute worst fate one could face, but no Mr bradburtons Fate put that to shame.
I guess I never thought about it until I heard you actually speak aloud about him being stuck, alone, in his cold dark office for TWO CENTURIES. I mean just imagine being in that situation, even just for the first few days, knowing how very very unlikely it is that anyone will find you, and that you're likely to just languish there... Forever. Then imagine once you've done the first 100 years, all that endless time to think and nothing but more time ahead. And you're only an immortal head, so you don't even have the capacity to unalive yourself, if you so chose.
Purely miserable, my god.
He should have brought some games with him.
At some point though time would be meaningless, if you do the same thing over and over again it feels faster. Would it still be agonizing? Absolutely, but just slightly less then expected
"Eventually Kars stopped thinking"
Having no body, the brain would absolutely freak out. Even if you kept a cool composure, your brain would be trying to process the fact that it doesn't have a heart, lungs, stomach, guts, most of its skin and meat, it has no bones below the neck, no nerves. He probably spent many many episodes hyperventilating because he can't feel his lungs filling with air, worse he just feels the sucking of his throat hole against wherever he's sitting, or it jiggling, expanding with each breath. The dust and other detritus that got into there! You take for granted the mindfulness of where your organs are in your body, I feel where every bit of me is from my pancreas to my liver and kidneys, I can almost feel the artery siphoning blood through my liver, the sophisticated track it makes through my body to the organ like rubber spaghetti. You can feel more of yourself than you think if you just focus. Do you know about PHANTOM LIMB syndrome? Imagine the phantom limb syndrome of losing your body. The insanity of waking from a slumber to the feeling of having your body back, only for the grogginess to clear and remembering you have none; the panic, the depression. You wouldn't be much of a sentient being at that point, like I said in the beginning your brain would be freaking out and not able to process what happened to the rest of you. You would lose your mind purely from not having a body, slowly slipping away into your cranial cavity. Your brain literally has no reason or drive to try and interact with the outside world and regresses inwards into a psychotic fantasy.
@@raiogelato6921 man I wish they kept Hamon for or more story. I find it just as interesting as stands.
You know why I love your videos bud? You actually go into detail and you don't just try and pump out
Thanks, soldier! Ad Victoriam!
@@N_orte Thank you for sharing all the knowledge you have amassed. Ad Victoriam Proctor.
Its unbiased, informative yet speculative. This a good Fallout channel
speaking the truth, his videos are also very enjoyable to watch and keep me watching
“Bud” is cringe bud.
On the fifth idea, it would not be hard for Vault Tech to get people to volunteer to go into the vault without fallout. The fear that people must have head of the pending war would have had several people willing to go into the vault early just for that peace of mind.
That's even a part of the lore, if I remember right. None of the vaults reached full occupancy because constant drills and false-alarms led people to stop believing them and not leave for the vault, implying that there _were_ drills encouraging people to go to the vault early.
Vault-Tec was going to test people anyways. And when you note some of the experiments they conducted you start to understand why. Look around Nuka World for why they were planning them. It was an event that happened long before that lead to the war and Vault-Tec had to rush some vaults. A few were never fully completed. Because we know that Vault-Tec was hit by a direct missile. You can discover this in Fallout 1 or was it 2. Been a long time. The other parts of the company gave a warning. Because of the secret nature of the mission, the secondary Vault-Tec leaders made a large mistake, without knowing exactly why they were doing these experiments...hint it had to do with Space travel and other planets.
@@Mega-Brick most people wouldn't believe it at any rate, MAD was something most people thought impossible even during the cold war when it was something outright planned by both sides if strikes ever started
realistically it would've happened anyway, we built an entire shelter in NYC that was fully stocked and while not fully staffed was manned, there are some old ones in DC and a few other key locations aswell
and paranoid (rightfully) individuals during the cold war era did occasionally start building and living in bunkers
in a situation where resources are running out and the only 2 global powers really left on the board are vying for their own survival (literally) fear of nukes would be vastly greater than anything the cold war gave the U.S or the USSR who both prepped extensively for it
you could outright tell people this is part experiment and part to keep them safe and given the circumstances you'd still have more than enough volunteers just due to fear of the alternative
PAM starting the war makes most sense to me. It's the closest to reality (in 1983, the US and USSR almost went to war when a Soviet computer misidentified a 'threat' from the US, and went into retaliatory mode, but was overruled by a lieutenant colonel, Stanislav Petrov, who predicted it was a false alarm; he was later proved right as the computer had misidentified thick, reflective clouds as nuclear weapons, his quick thinking and empathy saved up to half the population in both countries). I think PAM is a reference to this computer, but she had no one to overrule her.
Yeah, how do you mistake clouds for ICBMs? The scary thing is in the future there won't be any human thought in the process to step in when the computer goes haywire.
@@Lurch-Bot Frighteningly, it's happening now already, with conventional weapons against innocent Palestinians in Gaza, just AI with little/no oversight bombing to hell fellow human beings. Our laziness, tribalism and lack of empathy leads to monstrosities.
Stanislov lost his job for this
@@idontlikerome2744 I don't think so. He said he was neither rewarded nor punished for his actions (the Soviets didn't want to praise him, as that would show the weakness of their defense, nor discipline him, for that too would attract attention). He retired a year later, in 1984.
There was another Russian chap who also prevented nuclear WIII, during the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962, Vasili Arkhipov. He was aboard a diesel-generated submarine that had nuclear warheads on it, as it was patrolling Cuba, in international waters. The Americans were dropping signalling depth charges on it, to try and surface it, despite being in international waters. The boat was deep and had been out of contact with Moscow for days, so the somewhat agitated Captain and Political Officer thought war had already started and they should launch their nukes. But, unusually for Soviet subs carrying nukes at that time, there needed to be 3 people in agreement to launch: the Captain (Savitsky), the Political Officer (Maslennikov) _and_ the Executive Officer (Arkhipov). Arkhipov disagreed with the other two, which developed into an argument.
Arkhipov had also, just the year before (1961), been the deputy commander/Executive Officer in a nuclear sub that developed an extreme leak in it's reactor cooling system, which also cut communications to Moscow. The Captain of that sub ordered the 7 engineering crewmen to go in and fix the leak, and they were able to save the boat from nuclear meltdown. But all of the engineering crew, plus their divisional officer, died within a month of radiation and everyone on board suffered radiation poisoning. 15 further crew died within 2 years of the event. So Arkhipov was seen with high regard and his opinion mattered, so he convinced the Captain not to fire the nukes and surface the boat. There was a Soviet inquiry that initially drew heat but as soon as it was discovered the boat was diesel-powered, the crew/officers were exonerated (as diesel generated subs aren't suited for long underwater journeys, they had to surface).
@@Lurch-Bot And yes, but frighteningly, that's already happening with Palestinians being targeted by Israeli/Western (Google etc) AI, to slaughter innocent people en masse, with little/no oversight. 35,000 people already dead from such a device. Horrific.
#4 Honestly, the first theory makes the most sense out of all of them. The US had started invading the Chinese mainland. Launching nukes would be equivalent to flipping a table because they were in check in a high stakes chess match. Dramatic, but potentially reasonable on some crazy level.
fallout 2 actually states this as the reason for China shooting first. In the city of San Francisco we can access what once was the nuclear submarine Shi Huang Ti, it was one of the many carriers that launched nuclear warheads on the coast of California. An entry by the captain of the submarine almost confirms that China shot nukes because they were backed into a corner
Absolutely. This is the same reason America dropping the bomb doesn't make logical sense; sunk cost is irrelevant ( they could reasonably predict the damage from a nuclear exchange being worse, if they even survive). The whole situation doesn't really add up
The war was a stalemate. There was no need to flip the table when most of the pieces were still active. Moreover, historically, nuclear bombs were not used or were not planned to be used out of desperation, but rather proactively for purportedly logical and utilitarian reasons. Both China and America would've known throughout their decade of war how illogical and un-utilitarian mutually assured destruction would be, which is why they both refrained from using nukes for a decade.
Some sort of Enclave-corporate deep state motive is still the most convincing answer if we're going by the original planned lore.
@@unifieddynasty It’s possible that China’s people were less supportive of China’s war effort than the American people were of America’s war effort.
@@mapleflag6518 It's possible, but considering we're talking about defending one's home turf at that point in the war, it's probably unlikely the cause for the nukes.
I think I read somewhere that the only reason Mr. House looks so ghoulish and shriveled is because of some sort of power outage at the lucky 38 that left him in a coma for like 60 years while in stasis. Some sort of low power mode left him looking like that. Maybe thats headcannon actually but I know the coma and the outage definitely DID happen in the lore.
That's actually very neat, thanks for sharing
Interesting. Never thought of that.
Always thought it was just because the only thing being properly preserved was the brain, kinda like a glorified Think Tank guy
House didn't own H&H, his brother did. I can't remember if he sold his stake to his brother or not, but the terminals show his brother slowly losing his mind to the idea House was going to try & take it away...
he did end up taking it back
House bought out H&H as a final middle finger to his brother who screwed him out of their father's inheritance.
His brother stole it so he built his own company and eventually bought his lunatic brothers company on top
Robert Started trying to buy the company back and Anthony who was still in charge of it lost his mind at the propect of this.
I always thought no one launched first. It was a false alarm on both sides who then launched believing they were under attack.
Recall something like that almost happened during the Cold War, a false alarm was triggered for one of the sides and they almost launched... or something like that.
@@Techhunter_Talon Russian commander refused to fire the missile without confirmation. The radar was off and war was averted because of his gut feeling.
@@kyleellis1825 there was also a glitch at some point in norads system that almost caused war
@@Techhunter_Talon His name is Stanislov Petrov.
I like this idea
I think the only issue i have with the last one is that Vault Tec has deep connections with The Enclave. And, The Enclave has clear ideological reasons for the things they do, not to make money.
That still doesn’t negate the fact that VT is a business, and depends on monetary gains to continue.
Yeah but that’s the leader ship how many people involved tag do you think honestly know about that connection prewar or post war it is not many. In fact most of the data that was sent to the enclave I’m pretty sure it was done in secret. If I remember correctly.
@@smokedbeefandcheese4144 100% agreed. Openly promoting social experiments on living subjects in a “controlled environment” isn’t going to sit well with anyone. So VT has to pretend that its “just” Project Safehouse, and keep the details under wraps from upper management downwards. The Enclave plays only a minor role in this, when looking in from the outside.
@@lennaertvanmierlo2955 Except it does, because a business being used as a front can have money fed into it to keep it operational until the money doesn't matter anymore (immediately after dropping the bombs). Do you think CIA shell companies operate for profit's sake?
vault tec had no connections to the enclave, it's like saying if the illuminati are indeed real and running the world boeing has connections to them because they're paid to make stuff for the U.S military
or multiple uni's and pharma companies have ties to them because various governments pay them for R&D
VT is a business that had a job to do and was paid handsomely to do it, very very little indicates they had any real idea what was going on beyond they were told to run experiments for money
About china launching frist, there is a terminal entry in fallout new Vegas at black mountain that says the facility picked up Chinese launches, "china was lighting up" "they really did it" are the only two lines I remember from the entry. Also the shi emperor recorded that launch orders were given by Beijing. Granted it's unclear if those orders were given in response to a nuclear attack from the US. But the captain of the Chinese sub said something along the lines of the leadership having gone mad.
I'd go mad too if the US was at the gates of the Forbidden Palace.
@@concept5631I'm all in favor of just nuking China right now. I don't really see a downside to it.
Vaul Tec actually launched first (now cannon), my guess is targeting both countries to entice them both to think it was the other. The US and China were actually working towards a peace talks.
@@dukekessler6292 no it is NOT cannon. The entire show, is nothing more than a mediocre fan fiction.
@@saturn12002 oh really? Because Todd Howard has confirmed that that the show IS canon. He seems like a much more reliable source than some rando named saturn12002.
I thought H+H tools was owned by Robert House's estranged brother, though I could be mistaken. Great video.
It was!
As to your second misconception, the survivalists terminals in honest hearts detail his life immediately after the bombs fall. He was able to hide out in caves and such for years till the radiation died down enough to go outside, he saw new plant life and so forth sprouting up within a few years.
You also reminded me of a place in fallout 4, about a neighbor that spilled the tea about where they were living, to only the neighbor being alive after their place got attacked.
@@MrPenetrosoyeah, one of the spots full of super mutants, right? There’s a distress signal leading there?
It's also noted in Fallout NV that China started the war. The Watch station atop Black Mountain records the exchange as it happened, recording missle launches from the Chinese mainland as well as Fleet movements. It confirms president Richardsons statements. At least, if I recall.
The only reason I’d say your wrong is that Nevada wasn’t the first strike zone; at the very least New York & LA were hit beforehand making a first strike being documented in black mountain unlikely.
@@iamwords2d200 it is documented in black mountain, same as in fallout 4 in the switchboard. The basic idea is that satellites can see the launches and relayed that info to the US, which responded in kind. Government workers at certain sites could see the information as it came in while the population at large there’s a delay.
But there are also 2 undetonated nukes ( one in megaton) with the vault tech logo. So they clearly made nukes and they fired them on america. Its a shame he didnt not bring these up when denying the claim it could have been them who fired first.
@@TheMarcusNyberg that’s just an issue with reusing assets, the designs used for nukes changed in fallout 4
This is the relevant log from Black Mountain:
"Log 674
Oh my god. It's actually happening. We have reading across the board of launches happening everywhere. They must've thrown everything they had, and it looks like we didn't hold back either. The computer says we have 2 minutes until the first missile drops."
And here's the log from the Switchboard:
"DEFCON Status - 2077
281632RJAN77 ANCHORAGE ALL CLEAR *DEFCON 3*
230003ROCT77 COMPACFLT REPORTS 3 USOS OFF CALIF COAST, JCS ADVISE
230337ROCT77 USAF HAS EYES ON SQUADRON OF AIRPLANES (POSS. CHINESE) AT HIGH ALTITUTDE OFF BERING STRAIGHT
230913ROCT77 IONDS REPORTS 4 PROBABLE LAUNCHES *DEFCON 2*
230917ROCT77 NORAD CONFIRMS BIRDS IN AIR *DEFCON 1*
230926ROCT77 AUTHENTICATED ORDER -- RESPONSE SCENARIO MX-CN91 -- REPEAT MX-CN91
230942ROCT77 PENNSYLVANIA, NEW YORK -- CONFIRM STRIKE
230947ROCT77 OFFLINE - OFFLINE - OFFLINE"
Neither log proves that either side shot first. The Black Mountain log proves that both sides launched nukes "across the board, everywhere". The Switchboard log proves that unidentified underwater and "possibly Chinese" airborne objects were detected by America in a 9 hour timespan before the nuclear detonations.
And here's the relevant excerpt from President Richardson's dialog:
"{212}{prs31}{We try to keep ourselves safe and secure from radiation. That's what separates humans - like me - from mutants like you.}
//{213}{}{Why do you keep calling me a mutant?}
//{214}{}{Enough talk. Time for you to face that great electoral college in the sky.}
//{215}{}{I've killed men for less than that. But I'm in a hurry today. Goodbye.}
{216}{prs32}{We were winning, too. And then those damn Reds launched everything they had. We barely got our birds up.}
//{217}{}{Doesn't seem as though it helped us much.}
{218}{prs33}{Well, no it didn't. But at least it knocked the damn Red menace back into the stone age.}
//{219}{}{And us with it.}
{220}{prs34}{Well, no. No... not quite. You see, we had planned ahead. We were ready. }
//{221}{}{What do you mean?}
{222}{prs35}{We had a number of sanctuaries that would enable the glorious American civilization to endure. These facilities - the vaults - were part of the great plan.}
//{223}{}{Those damn vaults didn't work the way they were supposed to. A lot of people in them died.}
{224}{prs36}{Actually, they worked almost exactly the way they were supposed to. You might call it a social experiment on a grand scale. }"
Not exactly a reputable source of information for numerous obvious reasons. I would take what he says with a humongous grain of salt, like George W Bush's "Mission Accomplished" speech x100.
All that said, I think China shot first because of Tim Cain's recent statement. 😂
Hello! I hope you are well today, and that you are having a good day. Honestly I love learning more about fallout, and I enjoy hearing your voice lending me this information. Yesterday was a rough day so I needed to see this, sorry to ramble but thank you for your time!
Thanks Nicholas. Hope today is better :)
@@N_orte well after a family emergency yesterday, it seems it’s going to be alright. Thank you for your concern, I appreciate your kindness as it eases my heart.
Pretty sure its hinted to in several of the games that it was probably a ZAX unit who started the war, not PAM.
yep, fallout 2 has the emperor, aka shi huang ti's mainframe confirm that
Where does it say that? I tried looking it up, but found nothing.
@@DancingCrickets04 ACE in the bos bunker in fallout 2 says the following
"The suicide rate among true artificial intelligence machines was extremely high. When given full sensory capability the machines became depressed over their inability to go out into the world and experience it. When deprived of full sensory input the machines began to develop severe mental disorders similar to those among humans who are forced to endure sensory deprivation. The few machines that survived these difficulties became incredibly bored and began to create situations in the outside world for their amusement. It is theorized by some that this was the cause of the war that nearly destroyed mankind."
@@DancingCrickets04 Nukapedia does a bad job at explaining fallout and fallout 2 content. However if you wanna check for yourself, get fallout 2 and go to San Francisco, in there upon taking a right turn you will find yourself in something the game calls "The Steel Palace". The steel palace is an area where the remnants of chinese army aboard the Shi Huang Ti live. The Shi Huang Ti was accidentally hit by a Shockwave due to a misfired nuclear torpedo which knocked out most of the ship's systems, once they drifted to the beach they salvaged the submarine into what is known as the Steel Palace.
Upon completing their quest line you get access to the "Emperor" which is the mainframe of the ship. It has the ability to predict the future using probabilities just lile PAM. It also has diaries of the original captain who fired the nukes onto the west coast of America.
It is a late game area, so i understand if you just use cheats to get there. I recommend F12SE
@@Tatwinus Huh? Doesn't the diary of the leader of the submarine state that he got the order from his seniors? Also the captain thought his sub was the only one equipped with nukes. By the time he had fired he realised there were other submarines that were firing and he felt betrayed
I wouldn't say Vault Tech "planned" the war, but given how many Vaults relied on the war happening and how unfazed they seemed to be when it happened, I'd say they at least anticipated it happening, much like Mr. House.
Rip.
Watched fallout yet?
@@TheNecrokage Correct me if I'm mistaken, but they were only considering it, right? Or has it been fully confirmed that Vault Tec dropped the bombs? I mean, if I'm wrong I'm wrong. The timing does seem weird though. Wouldn't they want all their vaults to be finished before the war? Even Vault 88--the beta vault that was supposed to help other vaults--didn't get finished.
@zeveria7206 so far they were only considering it in the show. Don't forget in fallout 3, the warhead in megaton has a vault tech logo on it.
@@zeveria7206some high up employee in vault-tec in one of the games said that they thought they had 22 more hours so when the first bombs dropped vault-tec probably just decided to drop it’s bombs
It seems like, after the TV show, misconception 4 and 5 need to be revisited huh...
Definitely seems that the companies started the antagonizing and the Enclave was behind the shadows, we see Coopers wife looking at someone in the shadows.
The show does not say they did it
They don't say they did it outright. They just suggested if no one drops the bombs they would do it themselves.
My theory: vault tec belongs to the enclave. The enclave knew the resources war had depleted the world's resources and would be a matter of time until hunger would kill most people on the planet. So they started a plan, to choose a few humans (themselves, of course) to find another planet with an abundance of resources to colonize. For that, they would need technology they didn't have, so they use the vaults and people inside them as guinea pigs to research that technology. Research about stuff like cryogenic sleep, cure for illness, better fertilizers, better soldiers, etc. Seems like they didn't have enough time to wait for those experiments, probably the collapse of the economy was imminent. So they planned to pause the consumption of resources on earth by killing most people on it. And so, save the few resources left those people would consume otherwise. Finally, they planned to cause the war and wait for the result of the tests on their vaults, while they waited in their main base, the Poseidon Energy oil rig, and prepare themselves to depart earth.
Fallout 76 heavily implies that Vault-tec leadership was a faction withing the enclave that then went rouge from the enclave for whatever reason. Probably the because Greedy powerhungry assholes that would join a shadow government are the kind who would try to form a shadow government within the shadow government. They want Vault 76ers to Control the Nuclear silos in Appalachia for whatever reason. It just so happens that the scorched plauge also needs Nuking back into the caves at the same time.
this was already canon
@@Aspenstorpemusic Since when? 🤔
@@ImpChadChan pretty sure since 2 and even 3
@@realspartan5206 So why all those places asking "who start the great war, and why?"
That theory main point is to explain this.
The Enclave start the war, to buy it some time to evacuate the planet.
I dunno about 3, we consider WW2 to include several start and stop periods. Still feels like nuke day is close enough to be part of the resource war (since the govs didn't go to some new war after the bombs).
Agreed, nuke day / "The Great War" is really the crescendo of the Resource Wars, considering they never stopped fighting.
@@1TUFZ71 Which makes the great war the Resource wars. We don't call the Nagasaki/Hiroshima stuff a 1 week "great" war.
and now we got scumbag elite in charge that want nuclear war since they got bunkers paid for by US why dont WE raid OUR OWN FUCING bunkers?!?!
but most consider the second sino-japanese as a different war to world war 2. people also consider it both part of the war (but only after 39 or 41) and not part of the war (before 39 or 41, or in general).
so, by those standards, a war can be considered part of a different, bigger war but also be considered a completely unrelated war, depending on context.
so the great war can be considered part of the resources war, but it can be considered it own war because of the damage it caused and because it involves countries and actors that were not involved in the resources war.
@@thisstuffisdumb Most people don't think they are seperate and since Japan/German were allies, they really aren't seperate in a practical sense. That's more an educated person distinction and most people barely remember the brief overview they got in highschool.
I do see your point, though I still don't quite agree with all of it. Calling the great war it's own war, is like saying Nagasaki was it's own war.
Unless of course the war kept going for everyone but america (at least for a little while.). If we find out the war wasn't over in an hour and any of Europe/Asia/Africa/Australia/SA kept fighting, I can accept them being seperate phases of the same greater conflict.
Actually, that's my new head cannon. I like the idea that everyone was pissed off at America for having the last of the resources and everyone took a shot at America, so every other country is only like half as destroyed.
It's a shame that Robert House did not have more time and money, people would emerge from the Vaults to a whole state, maybe most of the country, that had been spared from the bombs.
And then by ruled a dictatorship of the biggest asshole in the wasteland.
By the way, I believe there’s another example of someone predicting the Great War, the local government of jamaica town, in the janitors journal entries it talks about how he was promised new air conditioners, piping, etc. but then the next day the council suddenly wanted to build a museum/time capsule in the basement. I believe they constructed it because they knew that the bombs would drop extremely soon
I'd give it anything to see what it would have been like to be on the Strip on the day of the Great War. Seeing all of Mr. Houses automated defenses come online and start firing missiles out of the sky. Saving all of us by saving himself.
Like I've said in the Fallout iceberg video, the whole "P.A.M. causing the Great War" theory really irks me, for a few reasons.
Main one is lack of reasons or capability to do so. There is the "human element," but also the factors of smaller groups and greater time-frames leading to inaccuracies. What would cause those more than a nuclear war? Her predictions do take some time, as well - 13.2 hours for one with the Railroad, for instance. Speaking of Railroad, a reason for her joining them is due to their intelligence gathering, which makes destroying her source of all military and civilian intelligence pre-war contradictory. And lying by feeding the U.S. false predictions? She can't even attempt Pavlovian conditioning to the Sole Survivor without verbally stating it.
Second reason is putting the blame of such a significant event of the franchise on a single individual; a non-human one, on top of it. The world of Fallout was always one that was the result of humanity's collective actions, the Great War being the culmination of it. P.A.M.'s ultimate failure in stopping the Great War because of that "human element" works perfectly with Fallout.
A third, more personal reason is it coming off as, for lacking better words, Brotherhood propaganda. The Brotherhood are capable of reprogramming and keeping her on the Prydwen as extra processing power. This could be seen as a few things - slavery, brainwashing, a mishandling of advanced technology - that are not flattering to the faction. Since the Brotherhood's core beliefs are built upon seeing the worst in everything and everyone, it's easy to see why this theory is so popular.
Lastly, it's just very lazy. Depends too much on sci-fi tropes of AI wanting to destroy humanity.
1:53 honestly the fact that Vault Tec not only exists but is highly profitable proofs that everyone knew or at-least suspected it would happen at some point.
Aww it’s October 22nd. I would had loved it if you released it on October 23rd tomorrow to reference the whole thing this video is about.
There are rumors of a trailer for the show tomorrow…so maybe he’s planning to cover the trailer?
There are rumors of a trailer for the show tomorrow…so maybe he’s planning to cover the trailer?
Your videos helped me through a naf break up while also informing me on my favorite video game series. Keep pumping out amazing videos for us to enjoy!!
As a supporter of the theory posed in misconception 5, it brings me no small amount of joy to have the question answered and almost all points you mentioned addressed. Almost like someone at Bethesda was listening and taking notes.
Same. As a filthy pinko commie I love it when corpos are the bad guys so I was always fond of that theory, glad it's canon now
An awesome and fitting video to watch today on October 22nd! Didn't the Mothman also warn people of the bombs in West Virginia as well?
22:26
Looks like the Fallout show broke your theory Vault Tec had no intention of doing it.
I would love to go back in time and play fallout 4 for the first time again. All the lore and new places and new mechanics was freaking astounding! All of it. Reading and figuring out the lore is the best part.
This didn't age well
The show is not canon to the games
@@kathrineici9811 your opinion is invalid by the fact it is. Fact trumps opinion
Everyone forgets that Ug-Qualtoth and its followers also had their hands in the events of both the war, as well as the nukes.
From what I understood at least from a hospital from Fallout 3 is that there was definitely a form of provisional government that was barely holding on right after the bomb fell. But it quickly got overwhelmed and fell apart. The lack of resources and overpopulation.
This video answered some questions I was wondering about. I was thinking about DC having missile defence technology and how only House really prevented his area from being nuked. Fallout is so neat to think about in a dark way
If the show is canon, which the creators say it is, then it was Vault-Tec that nuked the world…directly or by proxy.
even if it wasn’t canon it’s already been heavily implied that vault tec started the great war
The show does not say Vault tec nuked the world. They said they had the ability to do so. We have no clue if they actually did it or not.
@@moosexd8696 it’s very heavily implied that they either did it directly or ensured that nuclear war would happen. That’s my interpretation of the events. We can disagree.
i think theres a chance that china got wind of vault tecs plans and did a prememptive strike which is why house said he was wrong about the timing by 20 mins
@@moosexd8696 he said its a misconception that they did it OR planned it. so he's still wrong
what i think people miss in the fallout games is what the great war refers to it not just the bombs being dropped but the wars leading upto it as during that time almost the entire world was at war if you play as nate he mentions this at one point to a mr gutsy in one of the army base that you can stumble across and he also mentions that he was expecting to be recalled in the near future if the war went on but the bombs went off and well thats where fallout 4 starts
I love pointing out a certain Overseer ruined the plans of her vault, all because she realized the 'Drill' being carried out *hours* before the bombs dropped was the real thing. Considering that the weapons being used took only 45 minutes to reach their targets, as verified by radar stations in the same game, this would require some sort of inside knowledge that the bombs where *scheduled* to drop that day. Thus the residents of Vault 81 was spared being test subjects for all sorts of diseases....
And we have a big arrow pointing to Vault Tec knowing that there was a time table for the war.
Or rather they got info from the Enclave who were notified about the multiple aircraft entering US airspace and they quickly let Vault Tec know.
@@mapleflag6518or maybe just like barstow. Part of a first-generation supervisor's job was to be in his vault 24/7, which is why he knew ahead of time when it happened and manually turned off the vault's remote alerts, so as not to alert staff.
I would like to clarify a minor point related to the fifth misconception.
-The message concerning scouting is in regards to another message stating standard protocol for vault operation. The protocol states when scouting missions should take place. So the message stating that the nuke destroyed the entrance and disabled their scouting capabilities is most likely just a statement regarding their inability to follow procedure.
As someone who lived on the Kenai peninsula I always thought it’s depiction of Anchorage to be hilarious. It’s actually a huge city and gets constant tourism. I mean sure there was the plague, but its almost never brought up in the games. Literally didn’t know about it until a couple years ago and I was a big fallout fan lol
The comparison of Vault-Tec to an insurance agency is really clever! It gets the point across extremely well! I’ve been a part of the fandom for a long time and haven’t heard that one before.
Agreed
SHOW SPOILERS
The fallout show kinda changes everything you said about vault-tec here cus they’re confirmed to be wanting the world to end as well as actively working towards it happening.
I appreciate how quickly this video covered ground, going through all the theories in like 10 minutes for example
Point One : You list people having a "feeling that the end will come soon" when they do not know the day. A lot of the people you said "knew" are just people we would call End of The World Nuts today. One read a call from some as a coded message when it could have been something else. House was planning for the fall of the world even in game it came before his prep was done. He could only save the strip when his aim was to have most of the Mojave to be saved and free from Fallout. If he knew the day it was coming his plans would have been done even if he had to throw a few more Billions at the problem. Believing the End is coming and truly knowing it will come are different thing. So the Great War in Fallout was a Surprise to most of the world there are things that point to that the Enclave knew it was coming. The Enclave controls Vault Tech and other Companies for all their plans to gain the Power of the Government. Now I am not saying the Enclave did the attack but they would have known that a Nuke War was unavoidable while they could slow the war down they could not stop it so they planned ways to keep themselves alive.
I read through these posts and look at all the Armageddon stories and have noticed one area tends to stand out due to its ABSENCE The Fallout lore makes no mention of it. In the real world there is a treaty signed by all governments to keep people away from it
Antarctica
War has never touched the shores of that frozen land. However, there are military bases in that land mass.
House miscalculated it by a day if I remember correctly (which is why he couldn't get the platinum chip on time) and no his plan was just to save Las Vegas not the entire Mojave, though he didn't completely succeed in that due to him relying on an unstable os, as the updated version on the platinum chip was supposed to be delivered to him a day later, so a few nukes ended up hitting the city. There were others to who believed it was coming like Sinclair (the guy who built the Sierra Madre casino) but he couldn't foresee the experiments Big Mt. people were trying to do there.
@@thelakeman2538 It was more then just a day. He would have needed the time to upload the patch to the bots and make other prep. It was the whole "game area" so maybe not the full desert but Las Vegas and enough area around it to live and expand comfortably.
Well now we know it was vault tech
#5: The problem with that misconception is that, yes, they are a business. But they were also *highly* involved with the US Government. I don't know how to put this concisely because there's many parts flowing into it, but it's less about the money and more about the power. I mean, sure, they can have fuckloads of cash for their vaults, but in the end, if nothing happens, they had a good few years of cash influx and then will crash and burn. Which is probably not a big deal for the higher ups, but hey, more power is more good. *And* they always have to worry about competition or people wisening up or the government going "y'know what, that'll be enough of that" and shut it all down. Especially since they're, in part, prepping to head off into space with those experiments. And once that's done, well... not much use for 'em anymore. Plus it's trickier getting massive quantities of "volunteers" for vault experiments, especially if so much as a *rumour* about their true extend spreads. It's one thing to have a shadowy government agency abduct people, a whole other to have a corporation try to entice you for them. I mean, sure, they can just abduct people large scale for the vault thing, but honestly, it's easier to just have a scare craze to buy into it and then do it when they are happily just going in. And since I kinda veered off, back on track: With the life extension projects, experimentation, FEV and such things, it's far, *far* easier to just wipe the slate clean and have the planet to yourself and rebuild than it'd be to try and win the war with china. And once thusly poised, what was once a corporation becomes a government, with all the goody goody opportunities to go with it. You don't exactly need money when you can just make those poor sods work for you. But if you still want the money as a concept, hey, still easier to do it without the government supervision and just use scrips. Meaning you work for them, get paid in scrip, and buy Vault Tec brand food, live in Vault Tec brand shelters, have Vault Tec brand medcare, and no other option since Vault Tec is *everywhere*.
Sorry for the barely cohesive rambling. Hope it was at least somewhat followable.
As for Vault 22: I am not sure we can take Vault 22's pre-war sign at face value, since it's outside. Meaning it may as well be publicity. i.e. They say it's "to combat world hunger", but since most Vault projects were, to my knowledge, aimed at going to the stars, it's kind of more likely that they were prepping alternative ways to grow food in space than combating world hunger. Although hunger probably still becomes a problem after the nuclear holocaust, what with nuclear winter and such. Gotta make sure it grows fast and is safe against radioactivity and such.
gimme a tldr I ain’t reading allat
@@SUPBUG-o7m tldr:Read it
The thing is that if you're going to use the whole they were in deep with the government then you'll have to look at other companies like nuka cola, mass fusion ect for the same reason
The main fuel for the theory that it was them is that there are 2 dropped (undetonated) nukes in the wastelands with the vaulttech logo on. So they did in fact have nukes and those nukes were 100% surly fired on america. So the only way vault tech didnt attack america is if chinese spies took over a vault tech launch site and fired them. For me the only question is if they started it or not but vault tech did for a fact attack america.
Misconception #5, the idea that Vault-Tec orchestrated the Great War, is interesting. This video goes into good detail explaining the purposes of certain Vault experiments, as immoral as they were. It also raises the point that some experiments were already running, with test subjects, before the nukes dropped. Now, I remember hearing something years ago that was essentially the opposite of Misconception #5. I thought it was part of the canon lore at the time, but now that I can't find it, I assume that it was just a theory.
The idea that I remember hearing was that Vault-Tec either didn't believe that the Great War would happen, or at least that it would never be as bad as it turned out to be. They always planned to pull people into the Vaults. For example, they could convince people that they would be better off living underground from now on just in case something happened. The Vault's purpose was always to hide their unethical experiments under the ground. Of course, the Vaults were buried and built sturdily enough to withstand a nuclear apocalypse.
However, the theory went as far as claiming that Vault-Tec never believed that the Vaults' resilience against nuclear war would be tested, at least up until the Great War was close to happening. They always intended that the immoral experiments would be running underground, out-of-sight and out-of-mind, while life on the surface continued as normal. They only made the Vaults sturdy enough to withstand a real nuclear war because they needed that as part of their pitch for government funding, as well as their pitch to get test subjects to go inside. Over time, all the Vault experiment data would flow into Vault-Tec. They would use it to continue scientific progress and new product development and sale. Perhaps over time, they would even build new generations of Vaults for even more experiments.
Looking back, I think this theory came out of a desire to answer one of the big questions about the Fallout universe. That being: *What is/was the end goal of all of these Vault experiments?*. Sure, the individual Vaults can still advance towards whatever individual goals they had, but what is the endgame of all of the Vault experimentation? Why would they pitch something like Vault 101 as a way to help humanity survive if the Vault was meant to never open, since that would just lead to eventual genetic stagnation and death? Why would they pitch a Vault with an intentionally faulty radiation seal as a way to help humanity survive if everyone was doomed when the seal failed. This theory holds a potential multi-part answer.
1) Vault-Tec intended the Vaults to be underground places for their immoral experiments on their test subjects, while life on the surface continued as normal
2) Vault-Tec would continue to profit as the central command for this research and use the results to come out with new products and potentially new generations of Vaults
3) Vault-Tec built the Vaults with the ability to withstand nuclear war *purely* to get funding for the project and convince their test subjects to go in.
4) However, until the Great War was very close, Vault-Tec didn't actually believe the Great War would happen.
5) The Great War happened, and the old government, as well as Vault-Tec, blew up.
6) Because the Vaults had been built to withstand nuclear war as part of their marketing and funding pitch, they managed to keep large groups of humanity safe after all.
7) The individual Vaults remained indoctrinated to continue their individual experiments, even without Vault-Tec as a central command to profit from them.
8) Since Vault-Tec blew up, the original cumulative end goal of more Vault-Tec research, Vault-Tec products, and Vault-Tec profits is no longer attainable. It's a bit like the original "Cube" movie, where the characters are stuck in a maze full of horrible traps with no defined reason. The idea was that there had been a group that controlled the maze, but they were gone now, so the original purpose was irrelevant. The characters just had to survive as best they could against a killing machine that had no one controlling it anymore.
9) The new end goal is left up to the survivors in the post-war world.
Watching this a year later after the Fallout TV show sure is... interesting...
The plants miscommunication is also one that should be brought up as well. Many people forget that FEV was spread into the atmosphere, which caused gouls and super mutants, this also made tons of people infertile which would likely apply to many plant species. The intense heat of the bombs combined with nuclear winters afterwards would also kill much of the plant life, many people forget that the bombs were dropped all over the country, making fallout 76 technically inaccurate, as the bombs would've scorched the area in nuclear fire and left it barren. Lots of life was also lost, with many people who survived as gouls being those who were far enough away to not get killed by the blasts but also protected enough from the rads to not die, as the rads would kill everyone who wasn't turning into a goul
if you read through some of the terminals while visiting the Sierra Madre its clear that people knew what was happening
Better documentary than anything on any documentary channel since I was a kid. 20 years. Yes I still get to play games from time to time lol.
I actually used to play world of warships, I can confirm it’s a pretty impressive game.
Well researched, well delivered, and utterly fascinating. The zen voice is a bonus. New subscriber here. :)
Note to all of you show watchers: a contingency plan is only a contingency plan if the alternative doesn't come to fruition. We know Vault-Tec would have, but we don't know if they did.
Your voice sounds like Tina’s from Bob’s Burgers. It’s wonderful to imagine that character discussing Fallout lore lol
The idea of Vault Tech starting the Great War mostly comes from an interview with one of the writers of Fallout 2.
He said the original idea was Vault Tech wanted to colonize another planet. The vaults were isolation stress tests so to speak becuz they (Vault Tech) would be traveling thru space for some time and the research was invaluable
Gonna have to revise #5 now :D Great list though!
Will you be making an updated video on this subject now that the TV show came out?
I like the Vault -tech route that the show cannonised, of all the possibilities of who launched VT are the ones who actually had everything to gain from it, by using certain vaults to do test good or bad it sends back info to the main VT surviving HQs allowing them to feed the data to the actual vaults letting them mold their version of what humanity should and allowing vt a road to repopulating the world in their eyes by being an seeing overseer to the west.
Well thanks to tv show we know vault tec was responsible
It was me, I launched the nukes.
I got 5 caps and a plate for it.
Well that last segment aged poorly
Lol
I’m not convinced by the first assertion. Most, if not all, of these examples seem to come down to a few things:
-People who were already inclined to build defensive measures against the possibility of nuclear war. Open war between the two largest superpowers, both of which had ample means and cause to use their nuclear stockpiles, is more than enough to explain this; in the real world Cold War we already took such measures despite no hot war ever occurring. In particular, House and NukaWorld’s CEO seem particularly unconvincing in this regard, seeing as they were both shrewd businessmen with old-school business sensibilities, delusions of grandeur and keen minds, and hence naturally inclined to hedge their bets.
-People who would have indeed had early warning - but only on the level of hours, days, or minutes at best because of preexisting early warning infrastructure. It actually takes time to launch ships, load bombers, and prep silos. These would be easily detectable with Fallout technology, as they were also easily detectable to 50s and 60s technology, though submarines would of course be much harder to spot.
-People who had an uncanny sense of prescience or foreboding and felt disaster was imminent. This is common in fiction, and also not-unheard of in reality, though often in reference to personal tragedies rather than catastrophe.
Are these all indications of awareness of some kind? Obviously so, but no moreso, I’d argue, than an average citizen or serviceperson who knows we’re at war and sees the signs that it could go sharply poor for everyone. But most of them aren’t really an indication of *knowledge* of the when, where and how of the event transpiring. Even the notable exception, the call to the power armor lab, reads to me as a dire response to the sudden revelation that it is, in fact, all over and that they should save as many as possible as quickly as possible.
The overwhelming message of 50s propaganda on either side of the wall stated that it could happen at any time and you would have next to no warning. Factually we know that’s not strictly true, but on a functional level, for most people, even at the highest levels, it was or still would be. When people say the Great War was a complete surprise, I think they mean it much more in that sense rather than in the sense that *no one* knew or had slightly earlier warnings. It still struck harder and faster than anyone expected given the, at that point, extremely extended period of exchange-free conventional war that had occurred.
N_orte, can I just have like 10 minutes of you voice acting "no ugh.. I cant ugh.." lmao
SPOILER WARNING FOR THE FALLOUT SHOW!
The show has now tore the Theory of Vault-Tec dropping the first bombs wide open. It's not yet confirmed, but we at least know they had plans to do so. Can't wait for season 2.
More evidence for the point that people knew the bombs were coming are the pulowaski preservation shelters. Not sure if there are any in new Vegas but they exist in fallout 3 (try the mission “Those!”)
The Pulowski shelters don't even work though. They were never meant to; they were commercial competition with Vault-Tec by a cynical company just looking to make a profit.
@@filthycasual8187 I know
I never seen those shelters in New Vegas, so... No. There isn't any.
@@CyrusLagom That's not how it works.
@@CyrusLagom Look harder
nice to see you got a sponsor lol, good to see you’re bringing in some caps from this 😀
The weirdest thing to me is that both in the Fandom and atleast partially in universe, the Great War is talked about as though separate and apart from the Sino-American War. The later had been ongoing for a decade at the time the bombs dropped and was still actively raging. Why not simply use the terms interchangeably for the conflict as a whole and call the 23rd Doomsday or some such?
The Great War was a WORLDWIDE nuclear war, while the sino-American war was just between the two superpowers
N_orte: *talking about misconceptions*
Me at 9:48 : YOU CAN REMOVE WORDS FROM THE HACKING GAME?!
Welp. I guess you were wrong about Vault-Tec.
Glad to see you got another sponsor. You deserve it mate
The Vault-Tec related theories did not age well lol
wrong topic to include this but its important:
the whole idea of the wasteland creatures being the size that they are (especially the insects), would be physically impossible with just radiation alone. the fact is the bigger the animal (especially insects), the earths atmosphere needs to have a higher oxygen percentage, nuclear war would cause the direct opposite. so for the wasteland to have creatures as big as they are i'd say the nuclear bombs had a more sinister purpose
What?
You were wrong on vault tech
These are really good, namely starting with those first two misconceptions, because yeah, it wasn't really a surprise, and we know that humanity was back to trying to rebuild almost immediately after.
Though #3, the great war, was referring to the whole war, not just the nuke part, as it was a world war, as while China and the USA were the largest powers, they were backed by others, like how the USA annexed Canada and used it as a stanging ground for it's operations. With fallout lore, post WW2, society got very heavy into nucular power, but also still relied heavily on oil as well, as needed the oil to make various plastics as well as for fuel sources.
The resource wars started out as a cold war, that then got heated as China and the USA fought over the remaining scraps, backed up by other nations here or there. So it was a war that lasted many years, and in lore we know there was a lot of killing all around, on all sides, that turned it from a cold war, to a real war. There was even fighting on the moon, battles in space, over land, resources, and more, so the "resource war" WAS the great war, as it was a war that effected all of the world, but we don't hear much about who allied with whom.
Point 4 is agreeable too, it's hard, if impossible to know who started it, it was just as likely as someone mistaking a cloud formation as incoming missiles that made them launch the nukes. We know Mexico City was hit by a nuke as well, we hear this frima Raul in New Vegas, and we know basically every major city was hit, in the USA and Canada, we are lead to think it was the same with Europe and Asia.
For all we know the USA or a fringe group could have tried to blow up a major base in China to get a foothold, which made the Chinese decide to launch their nukes, in defiance, or as a MAD (mutually assured destruction) situation. Or maybe it was the aliens, as we know they have existed all the way back in fallout 1, where you can find a crashed UFO and an alien blaster. That is in part what Mothership Zeta may imply with that audio log, as we know the Aliens seem to be there for resources and/or more as well. But I don't see P.A.M. being the one to do it, at least not majorly, because yes, she can't figure out the human element, she isn't the kind that seems inherently willing to do such a thing even if humans gave her a headache with her calculations.
As for the idea the Enclave did it, while they had vested interest in the Vaults, which is why this leads into #5, they had no reason to do it. The reason they took over and started to do the experiments, was to better plan leaving the planet behind and going out into space, to colonize other planets. The experiments were very much MKUltra level stuff, sacrificing and testing on citizens, they planned to make people go into the vaults, and test on them. By making the bombs fall for real, it actually made it near impossible for them to do it, since the plan was to go into space, and colonize, and leave Earth behind. By everything being blown up, communications got cut, and there was no real way to go to space anymore, due to infrastructure being destroyed.
In other words, yeah, some of the vaults had things in mind, like a door that doesn't seal properly, but it would be controllable by the shadow government, but were never ACTUALLY meant to house people for long periods of time. That is the experiment went off the rails, they could control it and direct it back to where it needs to be, or get new members to be part of the vaults. And as for the megaton bomb, that wasn't vault-tec, that is a pretty standard military sort of logo, but it's hard to tell if it was American or not, and as there was an air field not that far away, that very well could have been dropped by a US plane to cut weight to try to keep in the air as control was lost due to the EMP effect as that is the kind of bomb dropped from a plane, not launched like from a sub or I.C.B.M. as we are told they had and used, even seeing one used in New Vegas.
I'd argue that Vault Tec does have incentive. They kept having people not show up when alarmed. They were losing the confidence of investors. You lose that, people start getting fired, lawsuits start happening. Ironically, a war would help PRESERVE them.
Love this video how ever I'm still convinced vault tech fired shots first or at the least fired them secondly
China starting the great war is canon for me, but as our narrator says "The details are trivial and pointless, the reasons, as always, purely human ones.”
As a gag I don't mind red herrings being handed out each game, the Zetas, PAM etc. The only one I wish would fade away is the Vault Tec one, just too silly. They should have a storyline where a Vault-tec CEO has a mental breakdown, trys to buy an A-Bomb from a drug dealer to start the war and the company has to quietly have him committed to a mental asylum
"tries to buy an A-Bomb from a drug dealer" is the most asinine thing I have ever read.
@@AnAverageGoblin Excellent! You can sense full esteem I hold for the Vault Tec theory, I was worried I didn't poison the well enough
@@roryscott2941 Whatever dude.
@@roryscott2941actually... I like it, just to further muddy that disgusting theory, a mini hint to its defenders? 🤣
I have a theory. Vault tec did not do anything wrong but were controlled by the enclave
“X launched the nukes”
Damn you, Elon
You've quickly become my favorite fallout youtuber, thank you for doing what you're doing
I think a game where we are in the middle of the war is required.
Wouldn’t be “Fallout” then, would it?
Operation Anchorage exists
Would be neat but I think Operation Anchorage is as close as we'll ever get, barring a mobile game or something
@@1TUFZ71 A mobile game would be killer to explain that part of the lore, but I fear the potential in-game monetization practices…
Operation anchorage
Ah you posted this on the eve of the Great War. Very nice timing indeed.
I love your video's so much thank you for making this content
So… it sounds like Vault Tec has no reason to start the war, but were manipulated by the enclave who could have
It’s important to note (as I think you do a good job of) that the impacts of the GW were extremely variable based on environment as well. We know the west and Great Plains areas seem to have almost suffered total ecological collapse due to months upon months of irradiated rain, according to several logs but notably the Survivalist. And as you pointed out, Appalachia was far from a priority target but still experienced severe ecological shift.
thank you, i never could grasp anything about the great war, and this really helped, thanks
It always struck me as strange how little progress has been made towards rebuilding civilization on the surface, especially with how many people actually survived the war around the country. Even with the monsters and radiation and such taken into account, there's no way that, two centuries into the apocalypse, nobody would have been doing much to rebuild anywhere except for the NCR and kind of Vegas. Even 200 years in, there's still a relatively huge amount of roads, buildings, and other infrastructure that's remarkably intact and could be used as a base to repair or build off of, but nobody ever does or even seems particularly interested in trying.
the commonwealth and capitol took tons more nuclear strikes so their wastelands are a lot more raider centric than the California/nevada area
fallout 1&2 are fantastic about showing how fast people can build
well, see, that's very simple: bethesda don't know what the fuck they're talking about
Good insight.
I think whilst it's hard to believe Vault-Tec caused the nuclear annihilation itself, I think it's a fair assumption they had a part to play in it.
Business for them would improve based on how many vaults were being sold. Fearmongering and fanning the flames would've been an important business strategy for them.
You really have to adore the way this in-game universe tries to warn us about our own. I wonder if we'll ever listen.