Your speaker reviews are the best on the net. Nobody does a better job at providing a combination of subjective and objective data. Kudos to Chris and the PS team for providing these.
Agreed Erin is top reviewer. I also highly respect Ron at NRD because he has not sold out and proves over and over again, he respects his audience and doesn’t just schill stuff, like 98-99% of other audio focus YT’s. Erin also behaves in this regard, with hubris, respect and USEFUL insights. Thank you Erin!!! 🍻
Thanks Erin for another EPIC review. Your reviews are helping me learn so much about how to tune a speaker. I'm using Xsim and WinISD and developing a speaker from scratch a 88-90db sensitivity high RMS tolerant, but still high SQ and deep bass extension 3way. How all these respected good speakers sound the way they sound is helping me think ALOT about how to pick the right drivers, how to maximise the SQ of them and how to think about box resonance importance. Thankyou again for your informative speaker reviews!
I am not surprised that these sound so great. The Seas Curv Cone mid-woofer is superbly well damped. I have a pair of Seas Idunn two ways that use that driver with Seas' DXT waveguide tweeters in cabinets based on the exact Seas-specified baffle dimensions with double-thick side walls that are beveled at 45 degrees to not interfere with Seas baffle dimensions, which are critical if you want to keep the kits frequency response flat to within 1.5dB. Dispersion is outstanding. Frequency balance changes negligibly whether you're standing or sitting and remains that way even when walking around the room. The DXT tweeter is an aluminum/magnesium dome that doesn't sound hard or shrill, unlike most metal dome drivers. Off-axis response is world class. If you want a speaker that sounds great even when you're dancing around the room, this is it. If you want louder and more dynamic, Seas also has an MTM version they call the Bragi. Madisound supplied my kits and built the crossovers with top shelf parts, which I upgraded with a copper foil inductor on the mid-woofer and a Miflex cap on the tweeter. They make a friend's famous brand's signature 700-series standmounts serious reason to worry. With the kits, upgrades and cost of damping sheets, cabinet materials and Sapele pomelle veneer left over from a prior cabinet project it was hair under under $1200 including sales tax.
I find most, not all, speakers sound best around 15 degrees off axis, as you ended up with. This gives a more open, spacious, and relaxing sound. Thanks for the review.
Happy Thanksgiving & thanks for the review telling us that PS Audio is only human after all and subject to the same physics as the rest of us. I appreciate all that you do Erin in helping stamp out BS in our lifetime! 😉
@@cbrunhaver i think he's not saying about this review but rather in general. the boressen speakers erin reviewed the other day is the definition of BS in this industry.
Another great review. I learn something every time I watch one of your reviews. You keep it simple and easy to understand especially for us old guys. When I flew jets we would say KISS…. Keep it simple stupid. Good job Erin. Keep it up.
So I am going to admit it, I like the Ask Paul videos. I think he does a good service to the community and the fact that he is willing to answer similar questions over and over again is to his credit. Since the Aspen series manage to squeeze in to almost every video and this one in particular, I was very curious about this speaker. Great review, interesting the extremely low sensitivity, overall seems like a good but. Wander if the directivity means that other issues can be EQed easily as well.
I enjoy his Ask Paul series. He is of course promoting his products, and he has specific bias (i.e. cables), but he gives accessible questions. Some day I want Uncle Paul; other days, I choose violence and watch GR Research lol.
Looking at the measurements it appears that the Radiant Acoustics Clarity 6.2 would be the better overall speaker. Now that you have critically listened to both speakers, which would be your preference? Thank you again for such a great review.
Interesting how they are so dynamic with such a low sensitivity. Low level listening with such speakers usually suffers in my experience. I wonder why PS audio left that 600Hz bump, they must know it's there and they spent a lot of time engineering this range of speakers....
I think you're on to something with the 80s music being some of the best in terms of sound engineering. Roxy Music's Avalon is one of my favorite albums in terms of production/mixing.
@@noahbirdrevolution Erin is correct about the quality of professional music production in the 80's. He did allude to the fact in the mid 90's compression and limiters ruined the dynamic range of music all in the name of making recordings louder.
Yep ... there is a reason why my pop music collection ends in 1999. Do a search for the "Dynamic Range Database" ... it lists the DR for thousands of albums and songs ... be prepared to be disappointed when you look up your favourites from 1995 to present.
There is something about the 80s and early 90s that makes stereo separation and imaging so defined. Even the 70s. Most generic music these days sound messy in comparison.
I appreciate all the work you put in to these reviews. I don't know if you have a seperate room for those anechoic measurements but that's really something.
I think all Erin's reviews are for speakers loaned to him by individuals or manufacturers. Best contact the manufacturer of the speaker and request them to send him a pair if you want to see a review.
I tried emailing them. Try your hand, a few 'potential customers' asking for it might encourage them. I wanna see Erin review the MB2 or BB5 main monitors.😊
great review as always! please review the wharfedale diamond 12.4. i know there are a lot of reviews out there but your review is what i want to hear. keep up the great job!
@@Pok-001 I tested at 67 yrs old (2024) and hear to 13k.. I've been into music and an amateur musician most of my life. I figure I should be the poster boy for the audio bandwidth a typical healthy listener my age is capable of hearing..I had no problem hearing full audio bandwidth (20k+) as a youth. Hence, no sure what the future brings, but I'm hopeful for the best. I have friends that weren't so lucky. Everyone's Achille's heal is different I guess.
@ nice!! Glad to hear that. No pun intended. lol I had great hearing too when young. Suspect where we start has an influence on how our ears age. Loud cars, loud concerts and firearms though. Still tested at 45. 14k and had some hearing above 16 through it is little unpleasant that high. Have friends that worked at the mills most their lives. They can barely hear over 10k
@@Pok-001 👍👍Yep, have protect the ears (of any age) from excessive long term SPL's. I even wear good earplugs when I ride my motorcycle..and not because of a loud exhaust; because of wind noise! It's not like headphones, where we "can" just pick up another pair laying around the studio lol I'm just lucky that when I was young and ignorant that I didn't screw up too badly!
Once we understand that music occupies only a portion of the 20 to 20k everyone bandies about, you soon come to realize that as long as you're hearing 8khz you aren't missing anything.
Thank you for another detailed review. Hopefully you can do a comparison between the PS Audio FR5 and Radiant Acoustic Clarity 6.2 soon. These are on my short list.
@@kingtubbyleeperrywhile the radiant speakers appear excellent in all respects, there’s a pretty big difference in horizontal coverage (90 degrees vs 150 degrees) that will yield a pretty different presentation. As far as bass goes, I target a somewhat over damped extended bass shelf woofer alignment with the PS speakers because it makes well with room gain for a flatter in-room response and subjectively slightly tighter/drier sound in the the bass. This is partly a matter of preference. Ideally, you could audition things and see what you like.
@@crazyprayingmantis5596 Yeah, I have considered the EPOS ES-14N as well as the new Arendal 1528 bookshelf or monitors. It's a challenge to figure out without being able to listen to them in advance. In fact, was considering buying both the FR5 and Clarity 6.2, then just return one after listing to them in my own room. I am adverse to doing that with 4 different models.
Erin, once again you have proven yourself as a highly reliable source for us in determining the true quality and value of a speaker. In this Thanksgiving day, on behave of my fellow enthusiasts I say THANK YOU SIR!. I can see Paul at PS audio Cringing over this truly objective unbiased review. The 83 claimed sensitivity and 82 measured is the nail in the coffin or the FR5 as far as I'm concerned. For those of us who often listen above 90 dbs at 10' listening position, a high current amp that delivers at least 500W at an 4ohm load would be required. Those are class D amps or very expensive class AB amps.
I wouldn’t worry about the 1dB sensitivity difference. It’s pretty common for my results to show some difference in this regard. Manufacturers right there sensitivity in different ways. Some choose a single point, some choose the value at one kilohertz, some shoes, a broadband average. And then some, like Klipsch has done, will use “in-room sensitivity” which inflates the value by 6dB+.
for me ? nothing. but i like to listen to paul from ps audio dodge every single question . the man is wise, knows there is no single best way when it comes to sound.
I'm sure the one peak that stands out 600 hz is easily enough EQ. The dip at 1500 hz is right at the crossover, and the directivity changes noticeably at that point, so maybe that's not even successfully eq-able. Having you go through these graphs will pay off by making for a more astute audiophile community. It's amazing watching this channel and your reviews and comparing it to the subjectivists. So great job. I do still listen to those guys because they tend to use contemporary music to audition speakers. As a result, they help me stay contemporary in my musical tastes.
Hi Erin Thank you for another excellent review ! Please can you explain why you don’t recommend crossfiring speaker axes in front of the listener ? I have heard many other reviewers suggesting that we do this for certain benefits . Love learning from you . Thank you for your continued work in the field . The audio world is so much better for it 🙏
In case Erin doesn’t have time, the recommendation varies with the speaker. Some sound fine pointing straight at you; others (like these) are a bit peaky in the treble and thus sound better pointed a bit away from your head. Facing them straight ahead should work in most instances.
Degree of toe-in impacts the listening experience in multiple ways. Not only are you altering the specificity of focus, and frequency response, ... at the listening position. You're also altering the amount of sidewall involvement. This impacts what's oftentimes referred to as Apparent Source Width (ASW) of the soundstage/image. It's worth noting, another element you're balancing is the acoustic components of the baffle, ... ie., diffractive energy that manifests as peaks/dips in freq response. Erin has covered these challenges in previous content.
@ they look like a nice value if your willing to spend a little effort for assembly. $1200 delivered to the states. If I didn’t already have so many speakers…
First off, I hope that you and yours had a great Thanksgiving, Erin! Another awesome review. I didn't think it was possible, but your reviews just keep getting better and better, mate! :) I was interested to hear your impressions and see the data on these, and I'm surprised and impressed by their dynamic capabilities on the low end as well. I also like that these are available in White AND in a Satin finish instead of a high gloss. I'm kind of over high gloss at this point, especially piano black. While it's not really a problem if you have enough power on tap, crikey, that sensitivity is pretty dang low. It's really the only thing I noticed that might be a sticking point for some. It's also good to know that you can tame that main resonance around ~600Hz with EQ, and that they'll take the extra power that's required without a huge hit in the dynamic compression department. Overall it seems like another fairly decent bookshelf/stand-mount option in this price range, especially IF their looks and finish are to your liking. However, the only things that would really be checked off in my list of requirements for a stand-mount are the low end extension and the minimal dynamic compression. And while those two things are fairly difficult to achieve in combination in a bookie/stand-mount size speaker, the majority of other metrics seem somewhat average. I'm sure they sound really good and would make most people perfectly happy, but I also noticed that you didn't give them a big "thumbs up" or an enthusiastic nod of approval. :-P Thanks again and keep on keepin' on!
Thanks for the great review Erin! Would love to see you review something by RBH. Seems like they've been around for a while with a lot of different products over the years but have few reviews.
Been waiting for this one. Very telling and informative!! I’ve been curious about designs that use planar tweeters. But am wondering about dispersion/ coherency in smaller rooms (even with treatment). Sidenote: would love to get your take on Danny Richie’s new NX Bravo with a planar magnetic tweeter if that was ever a possibility.
Just remember that their data capture is much different than mine. For those who are not familiar, Stereophile measurements are not fully ancechoic. It is a mixture of two measurement methods. "quasi-anechoic" above 300Hz. Which means the resolution of their measurements is lower above this and smoothed. Below that, their bass measurements are taken in the nearfield so it makes the bass bumped by about 6dB (when measuring in the nearfield, right at the cone/port there is no baffle step taken into account). So I wouldn't expect much matching below about 1kHz. To be clear: none of what I'm saying above is a "diss" or "shade". It's just simple fact. And explains why you will and should see differences between theirs and mine (and others).
@@ErinsAudioCorner Taking into account their lack of baffle correction, it looks very close to me. Same slightly rising treble, same 650hz hump. Directivity looks about the same too (same pinch-and-flare around the crossover).
You might have to buy direct. They may offer an extended return period if you want to try them. www.psaudio.com/products/aspen-fr5-loudspeaker?variant=48443549384994&country=US¤cy=USD&gc_id=21601370126&h_ad_id=&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADQihQBZTJ6oKHriWR4zofcky8qde&gclid=CjwKCAiAxqC6BhBcEiwAlXp451uM8bCLmHeU4Y7oa-8mwlwFdK-yV62w5AnxK2fdhs6WEH_7uDTU5RoCeyoQAvD_BwE
Just had to check. And yes, PS audio say curv, so I guess SEAS (dust cap in place of the phase plug of the standard offfering). Those SEAS curv drivers must have the smoothest frequency responses I've ever seen. Must be an absolute doddle to work with in a passive XO setting. Can I suggest a bit of a project for the channel. A sensibly indulgent DIY design would be so much fun. Maybe an optional passive or active too. Some really great DSP capable plate amps out there these days.
@@thomaslutro5560 while seas also uses curv as a cone material (with very good performance), the transducers in the PS speakers are proprietary and the woofer is my own design and not made by Seas
PS audio website says " designing woofers, radiators, and tweeters from scratch." I'd be surprised if they actually manufacture in house. I don't think any domes or cones are made in house at SEAS either, so they could be getting them from the same supplier.
@@thomaslutro5560we design all the parts magnet structure, and tool the cones and soft parts with a cone vendor. The cast aluminum frame we use is open tooling (not proprietary). Curv is made by a company called propex furnishing solutions and we get it through one of their distributors through our cone vendor. You’re correct. we don’t glue up any parts in Colorado and these are assembled by a CM for us to our specs.
This is answered already in another comment. Basically, no, it’s a function of getting low bass in a small box and not having a low impedance (5.9 ohm minimum)
The resonance at 650 Hz comes from the passive radiator. That's the problem with PR, they do resonate and there's nothing you can do about it, you can't just burry them with a crossover, they're passive. PR are meant to work with subwoofer drivers not with midwoofers like this one. In a sub you start crossing at 250 max, but usually at 120Hz, so any resonance that could show up in a PR will not be excited by the active driver.
I did a klippel SCN laser scan of the woofer and there is a slight cone edge resonance where the surround is glued (the lip of the woofer is moving in phase quadrature there). Normally, it is lower in amplitude and not particularly audible but there is slight variance on driver manufacturing and I’m sure Erin’s data is correct for that unit. Your statement about the PR (and understanding of the physics) is simply incorrect. Look at the stereophile review of this speaker where the PR output is measured separately. It rolls off cleanly.
@@cbrunhaver Just looked at Stereophile data and they've got some resonance at 330HZ, but not at 650. Maybe it's just QC problem from both the driver's factory and the speaker's factory. Though, this doesn't seem the case, I've seen PR plots and they do resonate like hell if used improperly.
@ that is a cabinet resonance (measured with an accelerometer), not a PR resonance. I believe that the woofer motor wasn’t touching our viscoelastic damping sheet on that unit. It’s something we’re keeping an eye on in production. Still, even that amount of panel resonance is likely inaudible in a small speaker, because of the panel sizes involved.
@@cbrunhaver ok, so you're involved in the production of this speaker. That's nice! I believe the midwoofer driver is made by seas, correct me if I'm wrong! It's a good choice, it will last very long and not be prone to mechanical damages like paper or metal cones! There is something that is bothering me about PR, so the tuned frequency or the intersection with the woofer are in phase with one another, but they get out of phase below and beyond that, isn't that affecting the response and if so, by how much?
@@ilaion11actually, the woofer is an in-house design, as are the drive units on our other speakers. Yes, seas uses this cone material on some of their prestige series with good results.
@@cbrunhaver I challenge everyone to find a pair of speakers for $2600ish that present the music with such ease and reality. Maybe for $10,000 the Magico A1's offer some competition, but under $5000, I have personally found the FR5's to be superb.
these speakers are the flavor of the month ..... every reviewer on TH-cam is talking about them right now ..... I assume that PS audio is offing an extremely good deal on the wholesale level right now to try and grab market share ..... ands since they are made in China I assume the production costs are low
PS Audio sells their speakers direct-to-consumer, not through a retailer who purchases at wholesale and resells at MSRP. Some reviewers get to demo ps audio speakers without purchase, not sure if ps audio offers an 'affiliate' program for reviewers to get a percentage of sale proceeds. Ps Audio does offer a trade-in for equipment that can lower the purchase price by up to $875, which brings the price to consumer down to $2,625.
Love your reviews! I ended up trading out my original KEF LS50’s with the Concerto Metas because of your review. You nailed it! I’ve been curious about this speaker. Very informative. Thank you!
Between the fact that they're two-way passive speakers with a hefty price tag -- there are superb active monitors available from Genelec and Neumann, not to mention Kali Audio's new SM-5, for that kind of $$$$ -- and the low sensitivity, which requires gobs of amp power, these things are a hard pass here.
@@viderethevaccinatorfromhol7536why would an audiophile prefer active crossovers over passive crossovers? I use an active crossover, three amps, one for open baffle bass, one for electrostatic mid and ess AMT tweeters. So that is an active system, they are not studio monitors. And in your opinion is a powered sub also not audiophile by definition? Or Martin Logan speakers with active bass? 😂😂😂😂
@@viderethevaccinatorfromhol7536 -- Because there are active speakers that are better in terms of price/performance ratio, AKA "bang for the buck," at every price point. The idea that "audiophile" passive speakers are better at the actual goal of high fidelity audio -- "high fidelity" being another way to say "great faithfulness" -- than active studio monitors is nonsensical folklore. Look up Erin's review of the Kali Audio "2nd Wave" IN-8 -- with an MSRP of only $800/pair -- and then tell me that it makes sense to buy a $3500 pair of passive speakers *and* a suitably high-powered amp instead. Given even a modest subwoofer, those 3-way Kalis will provide every bit as good a listening experience as these lovely -- but madly overpriced -- 2-way passives (and a suitable amp) can deliver for less than half the $$$$. You can even get them in white! 😎 www.bhphotovideo.com/images/images2500x2500/kali_audio_n_8w_v2_8_active_studio_monitor_1724459.jpg
Thanks Erin, great review! Question: is their any point to measuring in-room response? Pretty sure it would only apply to the individuals room in question and therefore useless for others. But for the individuals room, would it be useful in any way?
I used to. I stopped. The variability below the Schroeder frequency is so high that it's misleading. The PIR and the actual measured IRR I've shown to be highly reliable so I didn't see the point in continuing with that, either.
@ 26.5dB My streamer could be the limiting factor. But my point was more in the vein of “I usually don’t run into this problem so you’ll likely need extra power if you’re tapping out your current speakers (assuming average sensitivity)”.
@@ErinsAudioCorner hi erin great review 😁i am room acustic engineer and there is a way to absorb very low frequencies even without excessive thickness (up to a limit of course)I would be more than happy if you consult with me privately on a suitable solution, Your help to the community is not trivial at all!🙏♥🙏
@@ErinsAudioCorner depends how close the speaker is to the wall right? The closer it is, the higher the cancellation frequency. So if you place inches from the wall. 4 inches of absorption should be enough. ✌️
it depends on what is being radiated behind the speaker. Most speakers narrow with increasing frequency. But they do so differently depending on the speaker itself. 😊
Thanks for your great review! I was wondering if you could review one of the new Dali Rubikore series speakers. I know Dali is not that popular in the US but in Europe they're a big player.
Everyone just wants to know if they’re better than xy or z. Including me! Come on Erin… howzabout a leaderboard for kickass small to medium sized soundboxes!
The problem is there is no universal best. There are characteristics such as extension, radiation, placement and positioning and others that drive what may be better for one person than another. Anyone telling you anything otherwise has a superficial understanding of speakers.
@@ErinsAudioCornerthis is why I find your reviews so helpful - you walk through the pros and cons of a speaker design. What I would find helpful is a shortlist of speakers that you think perform well when placed closer to the front wall. I think that's a reality that most of us face - we can't leave our speakers 6 feet out from the wall due to kids/wife/limited space. It seems like the Super Linton is one of your top contenders if the buyer has to have the speaker closer to the wall (?).
No, they are $3500 per pair (not each). We also offer a 25% trade in credit here in the USA which puts them at about $2600 for many people. There’s also a shop pay option to split that into 4 interest free payments. Still, they may not be right for you but I wanted to make sure you were aware about that. As John Darko says, “one man’s floor is another man’s ceiling”. Audiophile speakers are a luxury purchase (like a watch or sports car) and there are literally hundreds of options to fit various styles, budgets and performance levels.
@@cbrunhaver while $2600-$3500 is not cheap for many people, in the world of discerning hifi it is considered very reachable for the masses. when elements are priced over $10,000 then it becomes a hobby for the fewer, but as hobbies go, $3500 is within reach- and some consider it a bargain- for the price.!
Killer review as usual. I love the comment about hearing above 12k. My threshold is about 15 or 15.5k, but I bet my "sensitivity" starts to drop off at a much lower frequency. In that regard the bump in frequency response above 8k or so starts to make sense. I'm male and about 41. Who is the guy in the speaker distance from wall graphic?
Erin is correct there is a fixed relationship between voltage (v), current (i) and power (p). Increasing voltage across the same load will naturally increase both current and power.
@@Audio_Simon its very simplyfied. The majority just used watts and nominal impedance. But of you for instance look at a reflexloaded bass driver, it will have to resonant-peaks (with a dip at the port-tuning freq). If you have a powerfull high-BL driver, those peaks can easily hit 50ohms..Now try pushing specified stated power at that impedance-level and see what happens :p. It would actually be more correct to specify voltage, because it dosent change with impedance.
@@Audio_Simon You can back calculate the voltage easy enough... Volts = the square rood of power multipled by impedance .... E = SqRt (P * R ) So for 50 watts on 8 ohms ... E = SqRt(50 * 8 ) = SqRt(400) == 20 Volts. I agree that since amplifiers are primarily voltage sources with current and power being a result of the load impedance it actually would make more sense to specify the voltage. It's not hard to calculate power from voltage and impedance Power = Volts squared / Impedance .... P= (E x E) / R.
Good horizontal spread, plays to the room not the chair, low distortion, can go close to the wall, good dynamics. These things are playing my song. That low sensitivity is a huge issue though. What’s the point of a bookshelf speaker if you have to throw giant blocks at it?
How loud do you typically listen to music? I am in an apartment and have a 100 watt amp and can play them at quite high level, but it’s a matter of listening distance and taste. If you’re listening at 80 db nominally, you’re only putting maybe 5-10 watts into the speakers except for dynamic peaks. This is similar sensitivity to the BBC ls3/5A but we now have inexpensive 100watt plus solid state amps
Modest sensitivity is simply a by-product of the bottom end extension in a compact platform. Of course higher sensitivity is preferred. However, robustly capable, minimal compression drivers, fed via a low-loss crossover, can be quite an impressive, impactfully satisfying experience.
Well, i think you misunderstand his comment. In Erin’s case, he not adding in a dsp equalizer with additional AD/DA conversation steps, this can obviously hurt performance Erins EQ is built into his DAC/streamer, so there’s little impact to using it, as the DSP is in the digital domain before the DAC
I wonder to what extent the lack of efficiency or sensitivity or steep crossover is affecting the dynamic range. I don't think these speakers will do 110 dB SPL @ 1 meter without a strong possibility of damage. They don't endorse more than 150 watts per channel.
@@shipsahoy1793 good dynamic range was listed as a positive attribute by Erin so I’m not sure what you’re referring to. For what it’s worth, a steep crossover generally helps the dynamic range of a tweeter significantly. Is that what you’re asking? There are very few small bookshelf speakers that do 110 db cleanly. Most don’t do the 102 db test that erin does that cleanly.
@ yes I know, I was trying to understand why this little speaker had the performance that it has at 102 dB, whivh is very good. Erin said they were power hungry with an 82 dB sensitivity, and they're only rated at 150W . When you the math on that, there's limited headroom above that 102 dB.
@@Douglas_Blake I don't know, the man keeps endorsing everybody and often recommends not buying stuff he even sells. Not only that, he continually talks about testing their products and hearing for yourself if they work in your house and system, and returning them if you don't like them, no money lost. Among all the high end audio makers I've heard talk about their products, he and the engineer behind the speakers are some of the few ones that come across as honest and non pretentious. So, when Paul says those are some of the best speakers he's ever heard, it honestly sounds more like any audiophile getting carried away than a salesman trying to convince you you need them.
@@ivanaviNiebla Point taken ... Paul and I have talked in Email off and on over the years. I don't find him to be unfair or devious. But there's no doubting he's a good salesmaker.
Hi Erin I noticed in the background of your videos that your living room wall is brick. That affects the sound quality. I have a brick house. Just my 2 cents
It sounds like they have a "house sound" but it's not a bad house sound or inherently poor measuring. I don't mind a forward mid sound if it's not over the top.
Seems to be a textbook example of a well executed small two-way. When going up against Hoffman's Iron Law, opting for extension and small size, ... then the drive elements better be robustly capable! Mission accomplished Mr B! Both the woofer and planar-magnetic tweeter, seem to possess quite nice compression characteristics and power handling to accompany the modest sensitivity of the overall design. Planar magnetic; 𝘛𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘐𝘴 𝘛𝘩𝘦 𝘞𝘢𝘺 ... signed, Eli (ELI the ICE man)
They aren't....3.5k for a speaker with 83db 6ohm is laughable already . Let alone spending that on a bookshelf. There are tons of competitive floorstander options available. Also keep in mind, planar/ribbon tweeters are super directional. So the toe in differences makes complete sense.
Ill categorize this as 'not bad'. Which means they arent great by any means, especially for the money. Compression data looks great though. But that sensitivity... man, you need serious wattage to push this mf, even you capped out with the Purifi. And I thought the LS50 Metas were bad in this aspect.
It sounds like it may be the gain structure of his system as you should be able to drive the speakers past their limits even with the smaller purifi et400 amplifiers (200 watt at 8 ohm) Kal at stereophile was using the same purifi module amps (from another vendor called buckeye) without issue.
@@ErinsAudioCorner they are nice and I think powered speakers with integrated streaming are the future of Hifi. When I heard them, I thought they were a little lacking in clarity. Still the Ref 1 is amazing for a bookshelf.
Toe-in is any direction where the speakers are directed towards listener relative to both speakers pointed straight forward into the listening room. That is the industry standard. Why do you insist on redefining toe-in to your personal taste?
Relax, guy. It’s not “industry standard”. There is no such standard. That’s why I tell you what I’m talking about rather than leaving it up to people to deduce my definition.
@@ErinsAudioCorner It`s the same standard Firestone applies when giving you a wheel alignment. I have noticed in some videos you have described pointing the speakers away or towards the listener without using the word `toe`. But sometimes you slip. Anyway, have a Merry Christmas!
80s recordings, I really got sick of Money for Nothing. But I still like I Don't Care Anymore by Full Colon. Rhythm of the Heat by Pete Gabriel (we're on a first name basis). But really, you should try Into Dust or All Your Sisters by Mazzy Star. Early 90s, man...
Are those speakers worn in? Jay’s audio Lab played sound clips of the same speaker at various break-in hours. I noticed the vocals sounded weird before they wore in. After the moving parts got loose , they opened up and sounded incredible. 😊
@@hiresaudiocosta873 you really are going tu judge how a speaker sounds thru a video that is recorded on an iphone? The difference in placement of the phone, even just by a few millimeters, will make everything sound different.
@@Douglas_BlakeErin answered this on another comment. Main design goals were good deep bass extension, wide directivity, low distortion, good dynamic range.
@@cbrunhaver I can get 3 out of 4 of those with some constrained layer damping, polyfil and a 2 component series crossover in a $100 pair of Dayton B652s ... but they are a bit directional. Yes they're nice speakers but there's nothing there that makes me lust after them.
@@cbrunhaver I do, routinely. More than a dozen pairs in use as we speak. I'm sorry, but the FR5s test out as pretty ordinary speakers with an extraordinary price. Ad-Hominem commentary is not helpful. It's the first sign of someone who cannot defend their claims.
Do you think super lintons sound better than kef r3 meta? Are expensive power supply cables & speaker cables snake oil (GR research guy apparently can tell 8/10 times in a blind test)?
I don’t buy into expensive cables. For the speaker comparison you asked about, there’s really a lot of differences between them. The KEF is more linear, maybe a tad “bright” if pointed at you. The Linton is kind of “warm”. The (regular) Linton needs room off the wall where the KEF doesn’t. The KEF has more uniform dispersion than the Linton. They’re both great but different in a few ways that make the presentation noticeable.
Pure copper is pure copper. Expensive cables are snake oil. Think of your electrical wire running through your house to your electronics. It's copper and not some premium wire. It's a 50 ft run, why would changing the last 3 feet do anything?
Expensive cables are pure 100% Snake Oil. Way back in 1975 Noel Lee demonstrated his "Monster Cables" and started this whole cables thing off like a runaway train. A prominent audio magazine at the time said: _"Noel Lee appears to have found the solution to a problem nobody has."_ Still true today. It's just wire.
Your speaker reviews are the best on the net. Nobody does a better job at providing a combination of subjective and objective data. Kudos to Chris and the PS team for providing these.
Agreed Erin is top reviewer. I also highly respect Ron at NRD because he has not sold out and proves over and over again, he respects his audience and doesn’t just schill stuff, like 98-99% of other audio focus YT’s. Erin also behaves in this regard, with hubris, respect and USEFUL insights. Thank you Erin!!! 🍻
agree she is the best
Did I make a good decision? Rz50 $900 R-700 pair $1600. Will these match up for great sound?
@@soundguy71. No way to tell how they will sound in your room.
@@douggoldberg3598 I concur 100%
Thanks Erin for another EPIC review. Your reviews are helping me learn so much about how to tune a speaker. I'm using Xsim and WinISD and developing a speaker from scratch a 88-90db sensitivity high RMS tolerant, but still high SQ and deep bass extension 3way. How all these respected good speakers sound the way they sound is helping me think ALOT about how to pick the right drivers, how to maximise the SQ of them and how to think about box resonance importance. Thankyou again for your informative speaker reviews!
Nice review, I love seeing the new bust decay data.
I am not surprised that these sound so great. The Seas Curv Cone mid-woofer is superbly well damped. I have a pair of Seas Idunn two ways that use that driver with Seas' DXT waveguide tweeters in cabinets based on the exact Seas-specified baffle dimensions with double-thick side walls that are beveled at 45 degrees to not interfere with Seas baffle dimensions, which are critical if you want to keep the kits frequency response flat to within 1.5dB. Dispersion is outstanding. Frequency balance changes negligibly whether you're standing or sitting and remains that way even when walking around the room. The DXT tweeter is an aluminum/magnesium dome that doesn't sound hard or shrill, unlike most metal dome drivers. Off-axis response is world class. If you want a speaker that sounds great even when you're dancing around the room, this is it. If you want louder and more dynamic, Seas also has an MTM version they call the Bragi. Madisound supplied my kits and built the crossovers with top shelf parts, which I upgraded with a copper foil inductor on the mid-woofer and a Miflex cap on the tweeter. They make a friend's famous brand's signature 700-series standmounts serious reason to worry. With the kits, upgrades and cost of damping sheets, cabinet materials and Sapele pomelle veneer left over from a prior cabinet project it was hair under under $1200 including sales tax.
I find most, not all, speakers sound best around 15 degrees off axis, as you ended up with. This gives a more open, spacious, and relaxing sound. Thanks for the review.
Happy Thanksgiving & thanks for the review telling us that PS Audio is only human after all and subject to the same physics as the rest of us.
I appreciate all that you do Erin in helping stamp out BS in our lifetime! 😉
@@shipsahoy1793 not sure what BS he’s stamping out with the review. Generally, the speakers meet the rated specs quite closely.
@@cbrunhaver i think he's not saying about this review but rather in general. the boressen speakers erin reviewed the other day is the definition of BS in this industry.
@@nabildanial00 erin does a great job
Another great review. I learn something every time I watch one of your reviews. You keep it simple and easy to understand especially for us old guys. When I flew jets we would say KISS…. Keep it simple stupid. Good job Erin. Keep it up.
So I am going to admit it, I like the Ask Paul videos. I think he does a good service to the community and the fact that he is willing to answer similar questions over and over again is to his credit. Since the Aspen series manage to squeeze in to almost every video and this one in particular, I was very curious about this speaker. Great review, interesting the extremely low sensitivity, overall seems like a good but. Wander if the directivity means that other issues can be EQed easily as well.
he is just pushing the company line and pretends to be your uncle, in order to make more money.
@einarbk885 Yeah, but I fall for his uncle routine. Their gear is too expensive for me anyway.
I enjoy his Ask Paul series. He is of course promoting his products, and he has specific bias (i.e. cables), but he gives accessible questions.
Some day I want Uncle Paul; other days, I choose violence and watch GR Research lol.
the amount of power needed aprx to achieve different target loudnesses would be a super great layer to add to these videos 🎉
great work as usual Erin
Looking at the measurements it appears that the Radiant Acoustics Clarity 6.2 would be the better overall speaker. Now that you have critically listened to both speakers, which would be your preference? Thank you again for such a great review.
The Radiant Acoustics Clarity 6.2 seem to be better in every way
Would love to see how the Arendale 1528 bookshelf 8 compares acknowledging they’re a fair bit more money.
This is the best channel to get REAL data and expereinced opinion.
Interesting how they are so dynamic with such a low sensitivity. Low level listening with such speakers usually suffers in my experience. I wonder why PS audio left that 600Hz bump, they must know it's there and they spent a lot of time engineering this range of speakers....
@@mfr58 Interesting, huh? I guess what reviewers say about low sensitivity and dynamics is nonsense! Who da thunk it?
I think you're on to something with the 80s music being some of the best in terms of sound engineering. Roxy Music's Avalon is one of my favorite albums in terms of production/mixing.
the Sade Adu albuns are also very well produced
@@noahbirdrevolution Erin is correct about the quality of professional music production in the 80's. He did allude to the fact in the mid 90's compression and limiters ruined the dynamic range of music all in the name of making recordings louder.
Yep ... there is a reason why my pop music collection ends in 1999.
Do a search for the "Dynamic Range Database" ... it lists the DR for thousands of albums and songs ... be prepared to be disappointed when you look up your favourites from 1995 to present.
Simpley Red Picture Book
There is something about the 80s and early 90s that makes stereo separation and imaging so defined. Even the 70s. Most generic music these days sound messy in comparison.
I appreciate all the work you put in to these reviews. I don't know if you have a seperate room for those anechoic measurements but that's really something.
I just want to see a PMC Transmission Line speaker review done by Erin❤
so pay him for his time
We pay him by watching his videos idiot
I think all Erin's reviews are for speakers loaned to him by individuals or manufacturers. Best contact the manufacturer of the speaker and request them to send him a pair if you want to see a review.
I tried emailing them. Try your hand, a few 'potential customers' asking for it might encourage them. I wanna see Erin review the MB2 or BB5 main monitors.😊
get some and sent them to him!
great review as always! please review the wharfedale diamond 12.4. i know there are a lot of reviews out there but your review is what i want to hear. keep up the great job!
Hey Erin I am real. I cannot hear above 12 K but I still love listening to good speakers.
Most people in their 40s can’t. Maybe 14k if they are lucky
Many think they hear higher than they can.
@@Pok-001
I tested at 67 yrs old (2024) and hear to 13k.. I've been into music and an amateur musician most of my life. I figure I should be the poster boy for the audio bandwidth a typical healthy listener my age is capable of hearing..I had no problem hearing full audio bandwidth (20k+) as a youth. Hence, no sure what the future brings, but I'm hopeful for the best. I have friends that weren't so lucky. Everyone's Achille's heal is different I guess.
@ nice!! Glad to hear that. No pun intended. lol
I had great hearing too when young. Suspect where we start has an influence on how our ears age.
Loud cars, loud concerts and firearms though.
Still tested at 45. 14k and had some hearing above 16 through it is little unpleasant that high.
Have friends that worked at the mills most their lives. They can barely hear over 10k
@@Pok-001 👍👍Yep, have protect the ears (of any age) from excessive long term SPL's. I even wear good earplugs when I ride my motorcycle..and not because of a loud exhaust; because of
wind noise! It's not like headphones, where we "can" just pick up another pair laying around the studio lol
I'm just lucky that when I was young and ignorant that I didn't screw up too badly!
Once we understand that music occupies only a portion of the 20 to 20k everyone bandies about, you soon come to realize that as long as you're hearing 8khz you aren't missing anything.
Paul from PS audio will be glad to learn that a Wiim can fix his speakers! :)))
lol. I’m sure.
@@ErinsAudioCornerHe will tell you the dpeakers are perfect without EQ.. must be your setip lol
@@ErinsAudioCorner sorry about tye typos you tube sometimes sucks
he thinks power cables matter too, so...
@@graemedavis6013 and they do… in some system.
Thank you for another detailed review. Hopefully you can do a comparison between the PS Audio FR5 and Radiant Acoustic Clarity 6.2 soon. These are on my short list.
No comparison, the radiant is flatter and with less distortion AND more bass.
@@kingtubbyleeperrywhile the radiant speakers appear excellent in all respects, there’s a pretty big difference in horizontal coverage (90 degrees vs 150 degrees) that will yield a pretty different presentation.
As far as bass goes, I target a somewhat over damped extended bass shelf woofer alignment with the PS speakers because it makes well with room gain for a flatter in-room response and subjectively slightly tighter/drier sound in the the bass. This is partly a matter of preference.
Ideally, you could audition things and see what you like.
Put a pair of EPOS speakers on your list, thank me later
@@crazyprayingmantis5596 Yeah, I have considered the EPOS ES-14N as well as the new Arendal 1528 bookshelf or monitors. It's a challenge to figure out without being able to listen to them in advance. In fact, was considering buying both the FR5 and Clarity 6.2, then just return one after listing to them in my own room. I am adverse to doing that with 4 different models.
Erin, once again you have proven yourself as a highly reliable source for us in determining the true quality and value of a speaker. In this Thanksgiving day, on behave of my fellow enthusiasts I say THANK YOU SIR!. I can see Paul at PS audio Cringing over this truly objective unbiased review. The 83 claimed sensitivity and 82 measured is the nail in the coffin or the FR5 as far as I'm concerned. For those of us who often listen above 90 dbs at 10' listening position, a high current amp that delivers at least 500W at an 4ohm load would be required. Those are class D amps or very expensive class AB amps.
If you often listen above 90dB, you are going to cause permanent hearing damage. Any exposure longer than 2-3 hours puts you in the danger zone.
I wouldn’t worry about the 1dB sensitivity difference. It’s pretty common for my results to show some difference in this regard. Manufacturers right there sensitivity in different ways. Some choose a single point, some choose the value at one kilohertz, some shoes, a broadband average. And then some, like Klipsch has done, will use “in-room sensitivity” which inflates the value by 6dB+.
Nemo propaganda
Thank you for the detailed objective information about so many aspects of the speaker.
Glad it was helpful!
How would you compare them to the Radient acoustic you'd just reviewed ?
I plan to do a side by side comparison.
for me ? nothing. but i like to listen to paul from ps audio dodge every single question . the man is wise, knows there is no single best way when it comes to sound.
I'm sure the one peak that stands out 600 hz is easily enough EQ. The dip at 1500 hz is right at the crossover, and the directivity changes noticeably at that point, so maybe that's not even successfully eq-able.
Having you go through these graphs will pay off by making for a more astute audiophile community. It's amazing watching this channel and your reviews and comparing it to the subjectivists. So great job.
I do still listen to those guys because they tend to use contemporary music to audition speakers. As a result, they help me stay contemporary in my musical tastes.
Hi Erin
Thank you for another excellent review !
Please can you explain why you don’t recommend crossfiring speaker axes in front of the listener ? I have heard many other reviewers suggesting that we do this for certain benefits .
Love learning from you . Thank you for your continued work in the field . The audio world is so much better for it 🙏
In case Erin doesn’t have time, the recommendation varies with the speaker. Some sound fine pointing straight at you; others (like these) are a bit peaky in the treble and thus sound better pointed a bit away from your head. Facing them straight ahead should work in most instances.
Degree of toe-in impacts the listening experience in multiple ways.
Not only are you altering the specificity of focus, and frequency response, ... at the listening position. You're also altering the amount of sidewall involvement.
This impacts what's oftentimes referred to as Apparent Source Width (ASW) of the soundstage/image.
It's worth noting, another element you're balancing is the acoustic components of the baffle, ... ie., diffractive energy that manifests as peaks/dips in freq response.
Erin has covered these challenges in previous content.
Erin, great stuff as usual. Are you going to review the English DIY “reference “ speakers you showed recently. They look very nice.
Yes, soon.
@ they look like a nice value if your willing to spend a little effort for assembly. $1200 delivered to the states. If I didn’t already have so many speakers…
They are DIY? I am looking forward to the review.
First off, I hope that you and yours had a great Thanksgiving, Erin!
Another awesome review. I didn't think it was possible, but your reviews just keep getting better and better, mate! :)
I was interested to hear your impressions and see the data on these, and I'm surprised and impressed by their dynamic capabilities on the low end as well.
I also like that these are available in White AND in a Satin finish instead of a high gloss. I'm kind of over high gloss at this point, especially piano black.
While it's not really a problem if you have enough power on tap, crikey, that sensitivity is pretty dang low. It's really the only thing I noticed that might be a sticking point for some.
It's also good to know that you can tame that main resonance around ~600Hz with EQ, and that they'll take the extra power that's required without a huge hit in the dynamic compression department.
Overall it seems like another fairly decent bookshelf/stand-mount option in this price range, especially IF their looks and finish are to your liking.
However, the only things that would really be checked off in my list of requirements for a stand-mount are the low end extension and the minimal dynamic compression. And while those two things are fairly difficult to achieve in combination in a bookie/stand-mount size speaker, the majority of other metrics seem somewhat average.
I'm sure they sound really good and would make most people perfectly happy, but I also noticed that you didn't give them a big "thumbs up" or an enthusiastic nod of approval. :-P
Thanks again and keep on keepin' on!
Happy Thanksgiving, Erin! I hope you and your daughter are doing great.
Thank you! You too!
How dare you... I can hear up to 12.5K just fine....
Thanks for the great review Erin! Would love to see you review something by RBH. Seems like they've been around for a while with a lot of different products over the years but have few reviews.
@KB-gt2xl
If you want to see a particular speaker reviewed by Erin, contact the manufacturer and request that they send him a pair. ;)
Great review.....thanks Erin.
Thanks for watching!
Been waiting for this one. Very telling and informative!! I’ve been curious about designs that use planar tweeters. But am wondering about dispersion/ coherency in smaller rooms (even with treatment). Sidenote: would love to get your take on Danny Richie’s new NX Bravo with a planar magnetic tweeter if that was ever a possibility.
My listening room is quite small as well at 13x14 ft and my Raidho's ruban twitters work very well!
@ This helps…thank you!
Interested to see how your data correlates with Stereophile.
Just remember that their data capture is much different than mine.
For those who are not familiar, Stereophile measurements are not fully ancechoic. It is a mixture of two measurement methods. "quasi-anechoic" above 300Hz. Which means the resolution of their measurements is lower above this and smoothed. Below that, their bass measurements are taken in the nearfield so it makes the bass bumped by about 6dB (when measuring in the nearfield, right at the cone/port there is no baffle step taken into account). So I wouldn't expect much matching below about 1kHz.
To be clear: none of what I'm saying above is a "diss" or "shade". It's just simple fact. And explains why you will and should see differences between theirs and mine (and others).
@@ErinsAudioCorner Taking into account their lack of baffle correction, it looks very close to me. Same slightly rising treble, same 650hz hump. Directivity looks about the same too (same pinch-and-flare around the crossover).
very curious about this line of PS audio speakers but here in Europe i don´t know where i could listen to them
You might have to buy direct. They may offer an extended return period if you want to try them.
www.psaudio.com/products/aspen-fr5-loudspeaker?variant=48443549384994&country=US¤cy=USD&gc_id=21601370126&h_ad_id=&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAADQihQBZTJ6oKHriWR4zofcky8qde&gclid=CjwKCAiAxqC6BhBcEiwAlXp451uM8bCLmHeU4Y7oa-8mwlwFdK-yV62w5AnxK2fdhs6WEH_7uDTU5RoCeyoQAvD_BwE
At that price, there are many options of excellent speakers in Europe. Many having none of the problems of this one.
@ropeburn6684 I am curious to listen to them, I have magico S3 and not looking into changing them
Just had to check. And yes, PS audio say curv, so I guess SEAS (dust cap in place of the phase plug of the standard offfering). Those SEAS curv drivers must have the smoothest frequency responses I've ever seen. Must be an absolute doddle to work with in a passive XO setting.
Can I suggest a bit of a project for the channel. A sensibly indulgent DIY design would be so much fun. Maybe an optional passive or active too. Some really great DSP capable plate amps out there these days.
@@thomaslutro5560 while seas also uses curv as a cone material (with very good performance), the transducers in the PS speakers are proprietary and the woofer is my own design and not made by Seas
i think those woofers are custom made in-house by PS audio themselves.
PS audio website says " designing woofers, radiators, and tweeters from scratch." I'd be surprised if they actually manufacture in house. I don't think any domes or cones are made in house at SEAS either, so they could be getting them from the same supplier.
@@thomaslutro5560we design all the parts magnet structure, and tool the cones and soft parts with a cone vendor. The cast aluminum frame we use is open tooling (not proprietary).
Curv is made by a company called propex furnishing solutions and we get it through one of their distributors through our cone vendor.
You’re correct. we don’t glue up any parts in Colorado and these are assembled by a CM for us to our specs.
@@cbrunhaver Thanks for clarifying. This seems like a very sensible way of doing things.
Very good and precise review!
"Most people here probably can't hear above 12k." 💔
😂😂
Would you buy these speakers or what for $3900? Was there anything outstanding because I’m seeing a lot of hype?
I think the 6th order L-Riley crossover might be responsible for the low sensitivity. Why such a higher order anyway? Great review as always !
This is answered already in another comment. Basically, no, it’s a function of getting low bass in a small box and not having a low impedance (5.9 ohm minimum)
I am Forrest... Forrest Gump. I thought I heard Bose. You said Bose... I started running nonstop, and didn't look back again...
The resonance at 650 Hz comes from the passive radiator. That's the problem with PR, they do resonate and there's nothing you can do about it, you can't just burry them with a crossover, they're passive. PR are meant to work with subwoofer drivers not with midwoofers like this one. In a sub you start crossing at 250 max, but usually at 120Hz, so any resonance that could show up in a PR will not be excited by the active driver.
I did a klippel SCN laser scan of the woofer and there is a slight cone edge resonance where the surround is glued (the lip of the woofer is moving in phase quadrature there). Normally, it is lower in amplitude and not particularly audible but there is slight variance on driver manufacturing and I’m sure Erin’s data is correct for that unit.
Your statement about the PR (and understanding of the physics) is simply incorrect. Look at the stereophile review of this speaker where the PR output is measured separately. It rolls off cleanly.
@@cbrunhaver Just looked at Stereophile data and they've got some resonance at 330HZ, but not at 650. Maybe it's just QC problem from both the driver's factory and the speaker's factory.
Though, this doesn't seem the case, I've seen PR plots and they do resonate like hell if used improperly.
@ that is a cabinet resonance (measured with an accelerometer), not a PR resonance.
I believe that the woofer motor wasn’t touching our viscoelastic damping sheet on that unit. It’s something we’re keeping an eye on in production. Still, even that amount of panel resonance is likely inaudible in a small speaker, because of the panel sizes involved.
@@cbrunhaver ok, so you're involved in the production of this speaker. That's nice! I believe the midwoofer driver is made by seas, correct me if I'm wrong! It's a good choice, it will last very long and not be prone to mechanical damages like paper or metal cones!
There is something that is bothering me about PR, so the tuned frequency or the intersection with the woofer are in phase with one another, but they get out of phase below and beyond that, isn't that affecting the response and if so, by how much?
@@ilaion11actually, the woofer is an in-house design, as are the drive units on our other speakers. Yes, seas uses this cone material on some of their prestige series with good results.
How do they stack up against other $4000 speakers?
Please remember that they’re $3500 and we have a 25% off trade-in program for them here in the US, so that puts them at ~$2600 for many people.
@@cbrunhaver I challenge everyone to find a pair of speakers for $2600ish that present the music with such ease and reality. Maybe for $10,000 the Magico A1's offer some competition, but under $5000, I have personally found the FR5's to be superb.
these speakers are the flavor of the month ..... every reviewer on TH-cam is talking about them right now ..... I assume that PS audio is offing an extremely good deal on the wholesale level right now to try and grab market share ..... ands since they are made in China I assume the production costs are low
PS Audio sells their speakers direct-to-consumer, not through a retailer who purchases at wholesale and resells at MSRP. Some reviewers get to demo ps audio speakers without purchase, not sure if ps audio offers an 'affiliate' program for reviewers to get a percentage of sale proceeds. Ps Audio does offer a trade-in for equipment that can lower the purchase price by up to $875, which brings the price to consumer down to $2,625.
Love your reviews! I ended up trading out my original KEF LS50’s with the Concerto Metas because of your review. You nailed it!
I’ve been curious about this speaker. Very informative. Thank you!
For the price of that speaker one would expect better..
Between the fact that they're two-way passive speakers with a hefty price tag -- there are superb active monitors available from Genelec and Neumann, not to mention Kali Audio's new SM-5, for that kind of $$$$ -- and the low sensitivity, which requires gobs of amp power, these things are a hard pass here.
@editorjuno why should an audiophile want active speakers? It's something completely different.
I'm sure it's very good... But is it BETTER than Sierra-1V2/Sierra-LX/Sierra-2EXV2 plus a sweet sub? Impossible!
@@viderethevaccinatorfromhol7536why would an audiophile prefer active crossovers over passive crossovers? I use an active crossover, three amps, one for open baffle bass, one for electrostatic mid and ess AMT tweeters. So that is an active system, they are not studio monitors. And in your opinion is a powered sub also not audiophile by definition? Or Martin Logan speakers with active bass? 😂😂😂😂
@@viderethevaccinatorfromhol7536 -- Because there are active speakers that are better in terms of price/performance ratio, AKA "bang for the buck," at every price point. The idea that "audiophile" passive speakers are better at the actual goal of high fidelity audio -- "high fidelity" being another way to say "great faithfulness" -- than active studio monitors is nonsensical folklore. Look up Erin's review of the Kali Audio "2nd Wave" IN-8 -- with an MSRP of only $800/pair -- and then tell me that it makes sense to buy a $3500 pair of passive speakers *and* a suitably high-powered amp instead. Given even a modest subwoofer, those 3-way Kalis will provide every bit as good a listening experience as these lovely -- but madly overpriced -- 2-way passives (and a suitable amp) can deliver for less than half the $$$$. You can even get them in white! 😎
www.bhphotovideo.com/images/images2500x2500/kali_audio_n_8w_v2_8_active_studio_monitor_1724459.jpg
Great review 💯
What do you define as low volume?
Price makes them special
Thanks for this.
Think the rise in the mid is a plus for most people. Forward female voices and acoustic instruments can make for more engaging presentation.
Thanks Erin, great review! Question: is their any point to measuring in-room response? Pretty sure it would only apply to the individuals room in question and therefore useless for others. But for the individuals room, would it be useful in any way?
I used to. I stopped. The variability below the Schroeder frequency is so high that it's misleading. The PIR and the actual measured IRR I've shown to be highly reliable so I didn't see the point in continuing with that, either.
No disrespect to anyone that owns it. With that price, I will grab a used Kef R5
What exact purify amps are you using?
March Audio P501.
@@ErinsAudioCornerdo you happen to know if your gain switch is set to 21 or 27 db?
@ 26.5dB
My streamer could be the limiting factor. But my point was more in the vein of “I usually don’t run into this problem so you’ll likely need extra power if you’re tapping out your current speakers (assuming average sensitivity)”.
Chris can make a serious nice speaker... Paul is always speaking so highly of him.
Erin, why not get some front wall absorption to help with speaker boundary interference for listening?
Think about how thick it would have to be to “absorb” the frequencies that actually go back there.
@@ErinsAudioCorner hi erin great review 😁i am room acustic engineer and there is a way to absorb very low frequencies even without excessive thickness (up to a limit of course)I would be more than happy if you consult with me privately on a suitable solution, Your help to the community is not trivial at all!🙏♥🙏
@@ErinsAudioCorner depends how close the speaker is to the wall right? The closer it is, the higher the cancellation frequency. So if you place inches from the wall. 4 inches of absorption should be enough. ✌️
it depends on what is being radiated behind the speaker. Most speakers narrow with increasing frequency. But they do so differently depending on the speaker itself. 😊
@@derekr5327
There's no correlation between loudspeaker proximity to the boundary, and the depth of treatment approach.
Is Graham Audio LS5/9, from U.K any good
Thanks for your great review! I was wondering if you could review one of the new Dali Rubikore series speakers. I know Dali is not that popular in the US but in Europe they're a big player.
Everyone just wants to know if they’re better than xy or z.
Including me!
Come on Erin… howzabout a leaderboard for kickass small to medium sized soundboxes!
The problem is there is no universal best. There are characteristics such as extension, radiation, placement and positioning and others that drive what may be better for one person than another. Anyone telling you anything otherwise has a superficial understanding of speakers.
@ Yeah… I know! What I have now sounds incredible - but knowing something else might be lots better can be kinda frustrating at times… ✌️
@@ErinsAudioCornerthis is why I find your reviews so helpful - you walk through the pros and cons of a speaker design. What I would find helpful is a shortlist of speakers that you think perform well when placed closer to the front wall. I think that's a reality that most of us face - we can't leave our speakers 6 feet out from the wall due to kids/wife/limited space. It seems like the Super Linton is one of your top contenders if the buyer has to have the speaker closer to the wall (?).
4K… Thanks. Maybe in another life
Per speaker. Bonkers
No, they are $3500 per pair (not each). We also offer a 25% trade in credit here in the USA which puts them at about $2600 for many people.
There’s also a shop pay option to split that into 4 interest free payments.
Still, they may not be right for you but I wanted to make sure you were aware about that.
As John Darko says, “one man’s floor is another man’s ceiling”. Audiophile speakers are a luxury purchase (like a watch or sports car) and there are literally hundreds of options to fit various styles, budgets and performance levels.
@@cbrunhaver while $2600-$3500 is not cheap for many people, in the world of discerning hifi it is considered very reachable for the masses. when elements are priced over $10,000 then it becomes a hobby for the fewer, but as hobbies go, $3500 is within reach- and some consider it a bargain- for the price.!
Did he answer what makes it special? PS Audio has some of the best marketing and cosmetic design.
Wide radiation, good dynamic range, and low bass extension.
Killer review as usual. I love the comment about hearing above 12k. My threshold is about 15 or 15.5k, but I bet my "sensitivity" starts to drop off at a much lower frequency. In that regard the bump in frequency response above 8k or so starts to make sense. I'm male and about 41.
Who is the guy in the speaker distance from wall graphic?
12:10 You dont need much power, but you need good amount of volts, is another way of putting it :)
P=V^2/R
Erin is correct there is a fixed relationship between voltage (v), current (i) and power (p).
Increasing voltage across the same load will naturally increase both current and power.
I wish it were standard to spec amps not only for watts, but output voltage, too.
@@Audio_Simon its very simplyfied. The majority just used watts and nominal impedance. But of you for instance look at a reflexloaded bass driver, it will have to resonant-peaks (with a dip at the port-tuning freq). If you have a powerfull high-BL driver, those peaks can easily hit 50ohms..Now try pushing specified stated power at that impedance-level and see what happens :p. It would actually be more correct to specify voltage, because it dosent change with impedance.
@@Audio_Simon
You can back calculate the voltage easy enough...
Volts = the square rood of power multipled by impedance .... E = SqRt (P * R )
So for 50 watts on 8 ohms ... E = SqRt(50 * 8 ) = SqRt(400) == 20 Volts.
I agree that since amplifiers are primarily voltage sources with current and power being a result of the load impedance it actually would make more sense to specify the voltage. It's not hard to calculate power from voltage and impedance
Power = Volts squared / Impedance .... P= (E x E) / R.
Good horizontal spread, plays to the room not the chair, low distortion, can go close to the wall, good dynamics. These things are playing my song.
That low sensitivity is a huge issue though. What’s the point of a bookshelf speaker if you have to throw giant blocks at it?
How loud do you typically listen to music? I am in an apartment and have a 100 watt amp and can play them at quite high level, but it’s a matter of listening distance and taste. If you’re listening at 80 db nominally, you’re only putting maybe 5-10 watts into the speakers except for dynamic peaks.
This is similar sensitivity to the BBC ls3/5A but we now have inexpensive 100watt plus solid state amps
Modest sensitivity is simply a by-product of the bottom end extension in a compact platform.
Of course higher sensitivity is preferred.
However, robustly capable, minimal compression drivers, fed via a low-loss crossover, can be quite an impressive, impactfully satisfying experience.
This look similar to the speakers that Parts Express just released recently for about $700/pair.
Paul at PS Audio is not a fan of equalizers. He claims they add audible distortion. Maybe that's because PS Audio doesn't have one to sell.
Well, i think you misunderstand his comment. In Erin’s case, he not adding in a dsp equalizer with additional AD/DA conversation steps, this can obviously hurt performance
Erins EQ is built into his DAC/streamer, so there’s little impact to using it, as the DSP is in the digital domain before the DAC
@@cbrunhaver Thanks Chris.
Bad review! You didn’t even talk about how these speakers were blessed by a Hi-Fi priest which makes them worth their price.
Honestly, I rarely ever watch or read anyone else’s review with a few rare exceptions.
😅
@@ErinsAudioCornerBecause the only person who needs to like the sound of your review is - you.
@@ErinsAudioCorner
They may be talking about Paul or Chris the designer.
Happy Holidays!
I can't wait for companies to start selling Hifi water 😂
I wonder to what extent the lack of efficiency or sensitivity or steep crossover is affecting the dynamic range.
I don't think these speakers will do 110 dB SPL @ 1 meter without a strong possibility of damage. They don't endorse more than 150 watts per channel.
@@shipsahoy1793 good dynamic range was listed as a positive attribute by Erin so I’m not sure what you’re referring to.
For what it’s worth, a steep crossover generally helps the dynamic range of a tweeter significantly. Is that what you’re asking?
There are very few small bookshelf speakers that do 110 db cleanly. Most don’t do the 102 db test that erin does that cleanly.
@ yes I know, I was trying to understand why this little speaker had the performance that it has at 102 dB, whivh is very good. Erin said they were power hungry with an 82 dB sensitivity, and they're only rated at 150W . When you the math on that, there's limited headroom above that 102 dB.
but Paul McGowen said these were some of the best speakers he’s ever heard
AND ... he has an obvious financial interest in saying that.
And he is not the only one, but that's how this hobby is
@@ivanaviNiebla
Opinions are a lot more credible when you don't make money from them.
@@Douglas_Blake I don't know, the man keeps endorsing everybody and often recommends not buying stuff he even sells.
Not only that, he continually talks about testing their products and hearing for yourself if they work in your house and system, and returning them if you don't like them, no money lost.
Among all the high end audio makers I've heard talk about their products, he and the engineer behind the speakers are some of the few ones that come across as honest and non pretentious. So, when Paul says those are some of the best speakers he's ever heard, it honestly sounds more like any audiophile getting carried away than a salesman trying to convince you you need them.
@@ivanaviNiebla
Point taken ... Paul and I have talked in Email off and on over the years. I don't find him to be unfair or devious. But there's no doubting he's a good salesmaker.
I think there's fault on woofer design the impedance plot explain something unusual in midrange region
Hi Erin I noticed in the background of your videos that your living room wall is brick. That affects the sound quality. I have a brick house. Just my 2 cents
Well, that’s not my living room. It’s my office. But more importantly, it’s not real. It’s just a backdrop. 😂
It sounds like they have a "house sound" but it's not a bad house sound or inherently poor measuring. I don't mind a forward mid sound if it's not over the top.
Ronstadt's Nelson Riddle Orch albums should be a good test for its vocal dynamics performance (not to mention, everything else).
Will never pay that but love your reviews. I could buy my own instruments and make music for that.
Who doesn't want a pair of bookshelf speakers that need 400 watts of power.
16:10 shots fired!
Not like they’re gonna hear it. 😂
Happy Thanksgiving, Erin! 🦃 I'm thankful for your excellent reviews. Stay safe and have a fantastic day!
You're right, the loudness war made music sound like crap... I'm always seeking for high quality recordings, not easy to find...
Seems to be a textbook example of a well executed small two-way.
When going up against Hoffman's Iron Law, opting for extension and small size, ... then the drive elements better be robustly capable!
Mission accomplished Mr B!
Both the woofer and planar-magnetic tweeter, seem to possess quite nice compression characteristics and power handling to accompany the modest sensitivity of the overall design.
Planar magnetic; 𝘛𝘩𝘪𝘴 𝘐𝘴 𝘛𝘩𝘦 𝘞𝘢𝘺
... signed, Eli (ELI the ICE man)
Do they make a matching center speaker?
No. But you could use one of these standing upright if you have the space.
@@ErinsAudioCorner
Yes exactly!
Three identical LCRs across the front.
PS Audio FR5 with planar tweeters and bi-amping capable.
source=Apple Music lossless quality
Happy Thanksgiving Erin!
They aren't....3.5k for a speaker with 83db 6ohm is laughable already . Let alone spending that on a bookshelf. There are tons of competitive floorstander options available.
Also keep in mind, planar/ribbon tweeters are super directional. So the toe in differences makes complete sense.
That PR doesn’t look large enough for that woofer. Don’t they need to be 2x the area for optimal performance?
It’s 2-3X the displacement. The PR has higher excursion than the woofer and so it works well.
@ Ah, forgot about that aspect (as some speakers use identical drivers for PR use).
Thanks.
Ill categorize this as 'not bad'. Which means they arent great by any means, especially for the money. Compression data looks great though. But that sensitivity... man, you need serious wattage to push this mf, even you capped out with the Purifi. And I thought the LS50 Metas were bad in this aspect.
It sounds like it may be the gain structure of his system as you should be able to drive the speakers past their limits even with the smaller purifi et400 amplifiers (200 watt at 8 ohm)
Kal at stereophile was using the same purifi module amps (from another vendor called buckeye) without issue.
Possibly.
@@ErinsAudioCorner not trying to question your review. I thought it was well done, as always.
I didn’t take it that way at all, man. So no worries. 👍
Eh, seems to me the KEF R3 Meta or even Q Concerto Meta are superior.
Have you heard a better bookshelf than the KEF Reference 1 Meta?
Dutch & Dutch 8c is up there, too.
@@ErinsAudioCorner they are nice and I think powered speakers with integrated streaming are the future of Hifi. When I heard them, I thought they were a little lacking in clarity. Still the Ref 1 is amazing for a bookshelf.
BTW, I think the FR20 is the pick of the litter from PS. I’ll have to ask Chris to get you a set for review.
Toe-in is any direction where the speakers are directed towards listener relative to both speakers pointed straight forward into the listening room. That is the industry standard. Why do you insist on redefining toe-in to your personal taste?
Relax, guy. It’s not “industry standard”. There is no such standard. That’s why I tell you what I’m talking about rather than leaving it up to people to deduce my definition.
@@ErinsAudioCorner It`s the same standard Firestone applies when giving you a wheel alignment. I have noticed in some videos you have described pointing the speakers away or towards the listener without using the word `toe`. But sometimes you slip. Anyway, have a Merry Christmas!
Well not horrible but not great either. Maybe take 3000 away from the asking price.
80s recordings, I really got sick of Money for Nothing. But I still like I Don't Care Anymore by Full Colon. Rhythm of the Heat by Pete Gabriel (we're on a first name basis). But really, you should try Into Dust or All Your Sisters by Mazzy Star. Early 90s, man...
Are those speakers worn in?
Jay’s audio Lab played sound clips of the same speaker at various break-in hours. I noticed the vocals sounded weird before they wore in. After the moving parts got loose , they opened up and sounded incredible. 😊
@@hiresaudiocosta873 yes. I have no idea about Jay. Haven’t watched his video.
@@hiresaudiocosta873 you really are going tu judge how a speaker sounds thru a video that is recorded on an iphone? The difference in placement of the phone, even just by a few millimeters, will make everything sound different.
You can’t judge absolute (?) sound through a video, but I do think differences can be heard.
Jay’s review has absolutely zero value in terms of speaker sounding
@@steveh545 question is what differences? From neutral to laid back? From bright to neutral? Or even worse, bright to laid back?
so... in a nutshell... what makes FR5 speakers SO special? 🤷♂
Nothing.
@@Douglas_BlakeErin answered this on another comment. Main design goals were good deep bass extension, wide directivity, low distortion, good dynamic range.
@@cbrunhaver
I can get 3 out of 4 of those with some constrained layer damping, polyfil and a 2 component series crossover in a $100 pair of Dayton B652s ... but they are a bit directional.
Yes they're nice speakers but there's nothing there that makes me lust after them.
@@Douglas_Blake go ahead and build it and send it to erin instead of making 20 negative comments on here. Everyone bow to the armchair expert. 🙄
@@cbrunhaver
I do, routinely. More than a dozen pairs in use as we speak.
I'm sorry, but the FR5s test out as pretty ordinary speakers with an extraordinary price.
Ad-Hominem commentary is not helpful. It's the first sign of someone who cannot defend their claims.
2:30 Well done. Perfect tone. 😂
Aesthetics could be better but I’m sure they sound great.
Do you think super lintons sound better than kef r3 meta? Are expensive power supply cables & speaker cables snake oil (GR research guy apparently can tell 8/10 times in a blind test)?
I don’t buy into expensive cables.
For the speaker comparison you asked about, there’s really a lot of differences between them. The KEF is more linear, maybe a tad “bright” if pointed at you. The Linton is kind of “warm”. The (regular) Linton needs room off the wall where the KEF doesn’t. The KEF has more uniform dispersion than the Linton. They’re both great but different in a few ways that make the presentation noticeable.
Pure copper is pure copper. Expensive cables are snake oil. Think of your electrical wire running through your house to your electronics. It's copper and not some premium wire. It's a 50 ft run, why would changing the last 3 feet do anything?
Expensive cables are pure 100% Snake Oil.
Way back in 1975 Noel Lee demonstrated his "Monster Cables" and started this whole cables thing off like a runaway train. A prominent audio magazine at the time said:
_"Noel Lee appears to have found the solution to a problem nobody has."_
Still true today. It's just wire.
My ears what is 12khz
Time to buy 2 Behringer A800 amps, used in mono bridge mode.
82db Sensitivity? That is Objectively ridiculous. That's almost like saying that the speaker is broken. Totally unacceptable.
almost as special as ascend audio Sierra bookshelf speakers. i say this bc similar in some ways but not as good it looks like.
Development: you should offer help developing speakers. You could listen and measure before mass production.
He does a bit of that.
I imagine Erin would be open to a fat cheque 😅
That is not good performance for the cost.
Right! At those prices for a simple 2 way speaker, I would expect near perfection. The data Erin showed us shows merely average performance.