Arnold Palmer at The Masters: Say my name, Ben Hogan
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ก.ย. 2024
- The King, Arnold Palmer, reflects on his frustration with Ben Hogan and proving him wrong at The Masters.
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Spent 15 minutes with him when I was young and in college. Being from western PA. Mr. Palmer was my idol growing up. Many times when you get the opportunity to meet your idol they disappoint but not in Mr. Palmers case. He exceeded all expectations. When he passed away I felt like I had lost a family member. He simply was and will always be the best!!
I tell anyone (whether they want to hear it or not) that in my opinion Arnold Palmer is the best example I can think of a successful American man. Excelled in all aspects. Professional, personal, public. I still miss him.
Funny because I’d say that about Ben Hogan
A true gentleman
Palmer was loved and respected. Hogan, though obviously great, was a snob about the golf swing which is why he was pricky toward Arnold in late 50's, early 60's. Hogan was super respected but never loved like Arnie was.
Palmer was a class act, period! I was a Nicklaus fan growing up when he dominated the game. Palmer came to SE Pennsylvania in months in advance in 1980 to promote a Senior Tour event scheduled for May. It was a grey and drizzly day, and I and a work associate went out at lunch time to the golf course in Malvern to catch a glimpse of him. To my surprise, we caught with Palmer playing with a local sportscaster, no ropes and with the foul weather a sparse crowd. We walked right along within 10-15 feet of Palmer. At 50 years old he could still blister a golf ball. There was Palmer at a par 3 waiting to hit as there was some kind of delay. I caught his eye and made a motion like I was taking a picture, he smiled and waved us over to the other side of the Tee. We had a picture taken with him, still have it today. My impression was like a lot of people say it was as if he was waiting just for us that day, as silly as that sounds that was the feeling I got. He was calm, not in a hurry, appeared glad to see us. I instantly became a huge fan of his that day!
His nickname says it all,
“THE KING”.
We miss everything about you Arnie, your magnetic personality, humility and universal popularity. You were loved by so many fans on and off the golf course, all over the world, it’s not surprising that they were known as “Arnie’s Army”!
RIP LEGEND!
When I was just learning the game and getting half way decent I took some lessons at Bayhill from the late Mr. Dick Tiddy (#2 at Wake Forest behind Arnie and a longtime friend of Mr. Palmer and head of instruction at Bayhill) and when Mr. Tiddy would video me, we'd go up to Arnie's office at Bayhill to review the video (2nd floor just above the clubhouse)...the first time he took me up there I asked is Mr. Palmer there and Mr. Tiddy said I don't know but he may be...I was nervous as a school girl and sure enough we walk in and Mr. Palmer is at his desk and the video machine is right beside his desk...Mr. Palmer actually got up from his desk to shake my hand and ask how the lessons were going...to say it made my day was an understatement. What a true gentleman.
Dick Tiddy would be a great porn name.
The thing is that Arnold was exciting to watch and in many ways was the first modern day showman of golf, whereas Ben Hogan was strictly business. it was the difference between Ben Crenshaw and Tom Kite or Phil the Thrill vs so many other pros just grinding it out for a lower score. Arnie's army was a result of not only his golf game, but his charisma. Arnold Palmer opened the door to the acceptance of charismatic people like Lee Trevino and many others. Yep Arnie was golf's crowd pleaser personality and perhaps Ben resented that just a little bit and might've thought Arnie was all show.....for a while. It takes all kinds of people to contribute to greatness of a game like make golf; and Ben and Arnie were two of many through the ages.
@@dirklerxstpratt2112 That is extremely sophomoric and highly disrespectful. Mr. Tiddy was a great human being and a tremendous swing coach. Really a vile thing to say.
A lesson in not being jealous or feeling inferior. Everyone goes through the same things no matter how big we are.
There will never be another Arnold Palmer no one can fill the void god bless AP forever
Arnold Palmer is so beloved! His class, dignity and warmth touch so many golf fans. Arnie's Army will always be remembered. How the fans loved him. He gave golf a personal touch! He was a legend, ambassador for golf! He is surely missed!
Arnold came up in the same era as Ken Venturi, Jackie Burke Jr. and Gardner Dickinson. All 3 were Hogan disciples. Arnold’s ONLY mentor was his father Deke. Since Arnold wasn’t one of Hogan’s boys Ben resented his independence.
Arnie never lost his simplicity and sincerity towards people. I remember some 25 years ago taking my then 3 year old daughter to the Legends of Golf tournament that was held in Austin, Texas at the time. We were is a small set of bleachers overlooking the driving range tee box while Arnie warmed up. The player's exit from the range was off to one side and then by cart up a hill about 50 yards away. My daughter and I were one of a few people there at the time and I remember him stopping the cart, stepping out and looking for a way down, then seeing no way he shrugged his shoulders as if to say " I wish I could" then smiled, waved and got back into the cart to drive off. I know it wasn't me he was looking to say hi to ... Good man. 😄
i always thought hogan was a little jealous of the notoriety palmer got, since he came along in the early 60's, when golf was just starting to be covered on tv, then signed on with mark mccormack agency, flew around on his private plane, etc. , became beloved with the galleries.
I'm sure there was something to this. Hogan had such a tough upbringing, and had to work like heck to get there. Being a pro wasn't a glamourous occupation back then, and the rivalry between pros and amateurs (the latter being golf club "men of fortune" with the pros being the hard-scrabble types eeking out a living) was intense in the early half of the century and I'm sure there was still lingering emotion around that even by the 50s. Palmer was the kid of a pro, who had an established career. I'm sure Hogan felt that it came too easy to the new generation.
I'm sure both felt that today's golf generation have no idea....
Why would you suggest he was jealous?
@@slapdathughjazz2134 Not sure who you're addressing with your question, but I covered this in my reply above. Good reads (in order to understand the suggestion of jealousy) are:
- "The Greatest Game Ever Played" by Mark Frost, which is actually about the 1913 US Open, but which covers the early rise of professional golf and what a struggle it was, and the tensions between pros and amateurs at the time, the latter being the silver-spoon-in-mouth types, while the pros were hardscrabble. You see the story of Harry Vardon, and how hard he had to work to make it, along with Francis Ouimet (as an amateur) and the likes of Walter Hagen, who also was a rags-to-riches story. They all were really... Gene Sarazen... Byron Nelson. Golf was not an easy profession
- Hogan: An American Life, by James Dodson. You see where Hogan came from, how hard the pro game was (basically, you had to finish in the Top 6 or 8 to be "in the money" in those days, and the money wasn't great unless you were finishing in the top 2), and how long Hogan worked to make it.
I think he probably thought that Palmer became an instant star, with lots of money, without putting in very much struggle. Hogan was on his way out just as Palmer was coming in, so Palmer was standing on the shoulders of giants, so to speak, who had a much tougher road than he did.
I'm not saying that Hogan definitely WAS jealous, only that it wouldn't be surprising if he was... Hogan was surviving for a time by picking oranges from trees that lined fairways... he had to request personal loans from family or friends more than once in order to keep going.
And Palmer and Nicklaus had it tough compared to what it is now
@@derekthompson5731 The '60 US Open comeback at Cherry Hills, was the beginning, and then it just got bigger for him, winning on TV, also at the Masters that year, birdieing the last two holes to win, and following up with the back to back Open Champ wins, perfect time in the TV era.
@@DMR4736 I love golf history, and definitely love Palmer as a part of that history. I was just addressing why there may have been a coolness between the "old guard" who came up in the 30s (Great Depression era) and those that became stars in the post-war TV era, which really got going in the 60s with Palmer as the biggest star.
Those that made it big in the early half of the century had to be "put-yourself-up-by-the-bootstraps" types. Hogan's Dad was a blacksmith... Palmer grew up on a golf course.
I don't know - I'm inserting speculation with all of this - (because Hogan was a very gracious man who could also be no-nonsense) - but I can imagine he might have felt Palmer hadn't earned it in the same way he and others had... despite the fact that Palmer began winning big in the early 60s
Queen Elizabeth called him Mr. Palmer, our Presidents called ARNIE. In a
Practice round before the 1958 Masters Dow Finsterwald partnered with Arnold
Against Hogan and Jack Burke. Arnold played very badly but Finsterwald
Shot the lights out and they took the money from Hogan-Burke. That led to
Hogans comments in the locker room about Palmer. The relationship was
strained from then on.
Honesty. Not too proud to admit that he was vulnerable, but humble enough to accept it all and use it as motivation. No wonder the man (Mr. Palmer) was a winner and an inspiration. Ben was great, but not so warm.
Ben was a good man too.
Men that grew up in Ben's era (depression) were a little harder around the edges because of such a tough life in their youth. Plain spoken and a real man's man, but that doesn't mean mean they weren't kind.
There is a HUGE difference between nice and kind.
Nice runs away when things get real and kind always stays.
I had the privilege of volunteering to work the Nestle Invitational at Bay Hill in 1990 and 1991. I worked both tournaments Sunday thru Sunday. That was from sun up to past sun down. All the volunteers were treated very nicely, we received our shirts and hats, and if we were working all day, received breakfast and lunch, all of which were free. Additionally, the Bay Hill Club threw a great feast together for the volunteers two weeks after the tournament. Arnold Palmer, although being quite famous and wealthy, was a man of the people. I worked security at the 18th hole, and I watched him stand “in the chute” and sign autographs for up to three hours at a time. Never be another like him.
That is such a great story, Terry. Thanks for sharing, and for watching! -AD
Palmer is the greatest person ever in golf.
One word, CLASS. There will never be another like him!
Arnold and Ken Veturi had a go around at the 1958 Masters about a ruling. Palmer went on to win that Masters, over Venturi, by one shot. Now Ken Venturi was a Hogan disciple, as well as a friend, so the thing with Palmer probably Pissed Hogan off and may be why he always had that particular jab at Arnold.
Ben Hogan had disrespected Arnold before that.
@@blujay2084 Right before the tournament he questioned how Arnold even got into the Masters. Arnie then made him eat his words by winning, further deepening the resentment. The resentment most likely came to a boil at the 1960 US Open, when Ben was closing in on title #5, only to have Arnold blister the course, forcing Ben into the only stupidly bold shot of his career on #17 and going down in flames.
Hogan probably accomplished more in golf than anyone, but in ways he remained the small bitter boy from Texas.
Arnold Palmer,
Classy his whole life!!!
What a gentleman.
Fascinating little thing here about Arnie and Ben. Yes they both made Huge accomplishments in Pro Golf in different ways.. But, No, they did never really get on- with each other, Hogan being more the reserved one... Arnie was a Happy go lucky, people person extrovert, Ben came up thru a hard life, and was a private man, and an introvert. Both men's golf styles of play were Totally different, just as there personalities we so different. Again both made Tremendous impact on Professional golf. Both have die hard friends- who swear they were good men, who'd do anything to help you - just with different approaches. Here's what I think having read alot about both men - Arnie at his peak was a bold player, kind of wild off the tee, with an astonishingly good short game and putter, Arnie could get up and down from anywhere to save Par. Ben hardly ever missed a green in regulation, and among golf historians, Still is considered the most effective ball striker the game has ever seen ( better ball striker than anyone, ever ). As Ben got older and Arnie was the next big Star to come in at the early 60's and be number One, I think Ben resented that he was being knocked off his spot, but a guy who was not a Great ball striker, but who had a great short game that won him tournies........ God Bless 'em both.
That's both sad and unfortunate the way Ben Hogan treated Arnold Palmer. Because I don't think that Hogan could have been anymore gracious with golf fans than Arnold. I saw Arnold one day at Pebble Beach after his round, he went to the driving range. When he was walking off, a huge swarm of people followed him and he continued to sign autographs as I just stood back and watched. And I thought, wow! What a guy to just go with it and not complain or try to avoid everyone but instead try to please everyone of those fans. And that was 40 years ago; remember it like it was yesterday!
Lee Trevino always tells the story about Arnold staying well after his round was completed to sign autographs. He readily admits "Not me boy!".
I got within 15 feet of Mr. Palmer at Augusta but never got to meet him. I love the man. Rather than get into a big debate I will say this. I spent time with Ken Venturi and Ben Hogan when I was in my late teens. I know of legitimate reasons why Mr. Hogan referred to him as “buddy” to be precise. God rest their souls 🙏
Such a powerhouse swinger. Legend. .
Hogan = Gamesmanship 101.
He mustve been pissed he was immediately the young gun that he got so quickly embraced by the fans....Mr. Aloof was just that.
Johnny Miller always tells the story of how, as a 19 year old Amateur at the 1966 U Open, he approached Hogan in the grill room to tell him how Hogan had always been his idol. Hogan's reply was "Can't you see I'm eating my soup!". Not exactly a people person.
Hogan ended his friendship with Nelson due to jealousy. He couldn't stand it that Nelson could win without having to practice all the time. Probably didn't like the attention Arnold got.
Arnold Palmer was such a great man. Fierce competitor, but a heart of gold.
That room sums up Arnold Palmer. Classic and elegant.
It was his office at Bay Hill.
He was simply a gentleman
For all his talents. Ben Hogan was....not the warmest of men.
Actually & I know I’ll get blasted by the golfing purists for this but Ben Hogan was in fact a dick. He was a very talented man. A guy who suffered from a terrible hook early in his career only to fix it with is now known as “ the move.” A legendary ball striker without a doubt. But his cold demeanor & how he treated some of his fellow tour pros even fans left a lot to be desired. Was I there??? NO but I did read a lot up on this guy enough to know I would not have been a fan. Let’s just say he was no Arnold Palmer.
No wonder many called him “The Wee Iceman” or “The Hawk”.
David Hill
I think his dad taking his own life while Hogan was present in the house when he did, obviously marked and affected his personality. At that point the Hogan’s lived in abstract poverty where young Ben and his brother Royal began working at a very young age. Hogan eventually quit school to help support his family and turned pro at 17 in an attempt to earn a living. It is easy to surmise how his youth could have had this effect however he was more kind than many realized.
@@HILLTOPGOLF Myth Busted. Not in the home at all.
Yeah i get the feeling Ben having personal hardships was resentful of Arnie and how things were for him and was a little bitter towards Arnold and chose to deliberately not use his name to kind of disrespect him in a passive aggressive way. It just makes me not like Ben and think Arnie was a warm, lovable and more happy guy!
Arnie shouldnt feel bad about it but just think that Ben was resentful of him and whatever it was was Hogans problem lashing out at him for whatever reason. People loved Arnie!!!
Hogan was probably bitter and resentful at the young upstart: all muscles and handsome and smiles. I still think Hogan was the greatest golfer who ever played, but he carried a huge chip.
Arnold Palmer was total class and a gentlemen....Ben Hogan very talented but could be a real PRICK sometimes
Nicklaus always said Hogan always treated him well and he got along with him..I don’t think Hogan respected Arnold for his swing or his golf game..probably just thought of him as a basher of the golf ball with a brutal swing and no one is going to take a lesson from him
I wouldn't be a bit surprised if you're 100% correct. There was a guy that shagged balls regularly for Hogan down at Shady Oaks (he wrote a book with little anecdotes), and apparently Hogan wasn't exactly the best teaching pro in the game, at least according to him
Hogan said that if Jack had had ny brains in his head, he would have won the1960 US Open by 5 strokes.
I wonder what Hogan, thought of Trevino's swing when he first saw him?
Hogan was a great golfer. His attitude towards Arnie left a lot to be desired. Blunt, rude, snotty.Treated him shabbily when Arnie was on the RyderCup team.Arnie had much more class, didn't speak ill of Hogan when he could have. Even when Hogan was alive.,
Fuck yeah arnie!!!!! Legend!
When Lee Trevino was winning Bob Hope was in shock ..... they like the good ol boys
I don't know about that but even if it was true, Bob Hope isn't exactly an expert on the game. He was a great Ambassador for golf but not a professional. I'm sure that the pros watched Trevino stripe it on the center of the club face every time knew he could play. There's a story about Hogan building some irons and wanted someone to test them out. He supposedly said something like "Send them to that Mexican kid in Dallas (Trevino) since he's the only person I know who consistently hits it solid". Granted, that's not very PC but if Hogan thinks you can hit it solid then it's quite the compliment as a golfer.
There's a very ugly side to the game I love
@@dirklerxstpratt2112 Jack Nicklaus "if i had to play like someone else i would play like Lee Trevino" !!
@@thatwilldonicely1314 The only 2 players Jack feared, were Trevino, & Watson
I was a jack guy but the more I learn about Arnold I actually think I would have been in Arnie’s army.
Arnold palmer what a gentleman.
Why is it that when it comes to throwing a baseball 90 mph, there aren't instructors trying to preach their method, yet with golf they can show you how to carry it 300?!
How do you become friends with someone who won't use your name?
very nice way to say the guy was a jerk.
Venturi used to say, everybody watched Hogan on the range, but who did Hogan watch. Also, when Hogan was on the range, he always went to the extreme right to hit. Least distractions possible.
Arnie was quite simply the nicest major sports star in history IMO while Hogan was a miserable sob but a great player. Golf jumped by leaps and bounds because of Arnie and he is largely responsible for the huge money players win today.
I sure Hogan had no respect for palmers swing, I'm not saying he was correct, but I'm sure that was the problem.
It's a shame as I surf the internet so often now I am guided to video's that don't respect my time. For a content provider to divide say a 15-20 min interview into numerous 2-3 min clips is just too greedy. Get your clicks and views w/o being abusive of my time and efforts. It will soon be a commercial interruption for every min of viewing.
Opposites I guess … I have people at my club .. I secretly cringeorfrown everytime I hear them speak 🗣 #thisfakeassn.. or etc etc … sometimes you just don’t click or feel the opposite to others about a certain person !!! Justmyopinion
Hogan was a little man and an a hole. Palmer was clearly the better man
Palmer didn't realize Mr. Hogan was demonstrating "old school" respect. Because Palmer didn't get it Mr. Hogan didn't care about Palmer.
Get over man
#legemdsneverdie
ONE OF THE GRESTEST PEOPLE OF ALL TIME.JUST A LITTLE BELOW JESUS. OBVIOUSLY IM TSLKING ABOUT MR PALMER
@james taylor OH YOUR GREAT HOLINESS OF THE ART OF SPELLING...I AM TRULY SORRY. BUT ILL PROBABLY DO IT AGAIN. SOMETIMES I HIT THE LETTER NEXT TO THE LETTER I WANT, BUT IM NOT STARTING ALL OBER ( SEE ) JUST TO SATISFY A PICKEY PERSON LIKE YOU OR ANYBODY ELSE.
@james taylor THANK YOU DIR. OPPS DID IT AGAIM....
@@erwinmonti5066 the ALL CAPS is a bit of a hint to the kind of person you are... sorry to say
@@blujay2084 IM NOT GOOD AT GUESSING WHAT PEOPLE ARE TRYING TO SAY. SO IF YOU CANT EXPRESS YOURSELF BETTER THAN THAT ITS BEST YOU KEEP YOUR BIG MOUTH SHUT. ARE YOU ILLITERATE OR WHAT...
@@erwinmonti5066 .. Ok, I'll be more clear. People that type all their comments in ALL CAPITAL LETTERS are usually a-holes.
Dear Mr. Hogan: Arnold Palmer won twice as many Masters as you.
@Dennis LOL good one!
@Dennis and if not for the accident may well have won 3 or so more!
Arnold Palmer said it best, Hogan was a great player, but not a great person.
@@chetroberson5760 Not true
Masters was not that important back then. Recent tournament. The most important to the American golfers was always the US Open. (At the very least until 1990s- probably more players nowadays care about the Masters but back then it was different)