I met Chris Athens a while back at Sterling... I sold him my old Doepfer modular synth in exchange for an Akai MPC-4000. Great guy. Very professional and good humored. He let me hear a mix he was doing through a customized $40,000 Dynaudio 5. 1 monitoring setup. I'll keep that memory close. :)
I am! I've been delving much deeper into mastering lately. I finally picked up my Chandler LTD. bus compressor! Lovely. Also upgraded my A/D -D/A to a Prismsound Orpheus and my monitors to Barefoot Micro Mains. Not bad for a bedroom studio, huh? :)
To my understanding, the clients were actually there at Sterling. This was meant as a documented "day in the life." And I know Chris very well. He's done around fifty or sixty records for me. Trust me, Chris certainly would have called the client (or probably emailed them). But again, they were present for the session.
I learned some really important bits here especially the aspect of making sure the mix is balanced and leaves headroom for mastering. I will treat that with great care. Also stereo vs mono is something I will watch for. Fading is something I remember when I was in recording studio my first time, it did make a difference and has an important impact on a song.
This is a good video. It's great to see he loves his work and can go into detail about what songs need and don't need. I just got started with recording my own stuff but had no idea this much work goes into finishing a track.
My apologies, Chris - somehow I missed seeing this comment until now. My original comment was not meant to be a slight. I have utmost respect for the mastering process.
Chris very impressive and clear to understand work. Sometimes simplicity is the only answer and I like the way you describe what you are doing in non technical jargon like a lot on the net today..
These were Demo tracks brought in by the people that did the interview, it was not intended to be a final product... they were brought on so just to illustrate errors people do when sending their tracks to mastering facilities.
When I did mixes, I mixed everything on various sized speakers and headphones. That way, you knew what your final product would sound like on the most expensive sound system or on a "boombox" or on a iPod or laptop computer, because no one speaker has the same frequency response.
It's a good thing to just bump your first raw mix on speakers, stereo systems, in the car and on headphones. You'll hear exactly what's missing in the mix
you CAN undo distortion, if you have a mathematically perfect declipper like I do. =) and you CAN regenerate (not restore) lost/missing dynamics and detail. not using an old-school setup like Sterling and most top guys use tho. great respect for history, but not pushing R&D like some people do. good video tho, thanks for the up.
That's because nowadays what interests most "recording engineers" is volume. They make it as loud as it can be. Noise, LOTS of high-end boost, tons of compression and clipping levels of volume.
After he said the song was distorted and in mono, I thought he was going to say, "And then I get in touch with the mixing engineer to provide a new mix." That's what I would've done.
But the mix being distorted, and in mono, are very likely NOT what the client had intended, so, a simple matter of adjusting as opposed to remixing would fix that.
It doesn't retain the punch fully in stereo. I've been a sound engineer for over 30 years and have often had to mixed in mono as well as the "normal" stereo stereo Also if you know your instrument frequencies and make space for each instrument and voice then the sound localisation is just as good in mono. It is all about giving each track it's own space to breath that means no heavy limiting and comp in the mastering it's a bad engineer who can't give spacial awareness in mono as well as stereo.
Chris Athens is so great! He's an amazing human and was so gracious in agreeing to lend his expertise for the next Audio Pro Bootcamp in Austin TX. We're so thrilled to have him! Find out more at www.audioprobootcamp.com
The only problem im having with this is, he still mastered the distorted track. instead of getting on the phone and being strict about the audio. And forcing the producers/production engineers to lower the volume. he just went on and still mastered the distorted track. unbelievable. - And yet, we are suppose to be guided and directed on how we should do our levels, when even the mastering engineers broke the rules of audio. We will never win this war on Loud Wars. - Keep Distorting People....
Word! Moreover, sometimes you need to reluctantly let some of the things go, unfortunately, because not all speakers will deliver all that richness of detail. Also, I found that on certain devices not only is it about the generic lack of highs and lows but that the exact same sound would seem to actually have an entirely different texture to it. Weird.
Some instruments have huge peaks that only limiters can grab. Quieter tracks may need less dynamics to be audible but still quiet. Rule 3 was basically rule 1 and 2. Don't confuse TH-cam with subjective "rules". Don't trust rules when it comes to production unless you've verified them yourself, and even then, don't play your experience as rules.
I wouldn't make that to a track, you do that on a big PA system to put more power and because those bass frequencies are even less effective on big venues, but for a home record it all depends and I'm sure most commercial music has those frequencies present.
If you actually mix it down in mono you lose nothing and there is more punch than if you mix in stereo. What you are on about is mixing down into stereo then exporting as mono, in THAT scenario then it is bloody obvious there will be a difference and losses as you are drastically altering the mix. Try listening to old mono mixes from the 50's and 60's and you will see what I mean. They were mixed down in mono and the sonic clarity and "openness" as you put it is there, is still there.
Nah. You're way off. M/S is where it's at, knucklehead. To which you made no mention. 30yrs? lol I doubt you've spent 30 MINUTES in an actual studio...You clearly have no idea what you're talking about. The fact that you felt the need to spam this comment section with inane, mindless comments says a lot about you.
@OptoDigital I can't disagree with that, but mastering isn't the only application this can be used. Have you thought of this in a broadcast or home-listening context, where there's now 2+ decades of arguably destroyed music that people listen to? Or in mastering where requesting or getting a remix is impossible?
Chris... I'm curious why you didn't just call the label/producer of this song and tell them to send you a new mix where they correct the issue with the shaker? If you were mastering one of my tracks, that's what I would want you to do.
ima hire chris athen do mi nexx killa hiphop beet if he down witit cuz im also looki fo produser finense mi latess mix tape 'Thug Lyfe 2' harcore ol skool rap rymez, mi shit dope fo rea
When he sends the Reference CD back to the artist he will only send the song at a starting point of 2:00 minutes. Not from start to finish. mostly when all the instruments are playing
Hello, I would like to pursue the career in being a master engineer. I was researching further into this topic. I read how it can be a stressful job and I want to make this as easy as possible for me... So, to start, how many years of school would i need, if any at all..?
+Jacob McDonald Mastering music is easy. Being excellent at it and turning it into a career is very hard. If "easy" is your focus you're looking at the wrong industry.
+Jacob McDonald I don't know. 2 or 4 probably. Lots of programs out there. I worked my way up from tape librarian at Sony Studios. Never went to school. The easy part would be school but they could teach you theory and technique. Building a career and being great at the job is a totally different animal. When I was years into my career at Sterling Sound I this slept on the couch more times than I care to remember. I worked more than anybody else I knew. Crazy hours. Everybody's path is different. Maybe I did it the hard way. I don't know...
James G I'd say he thinks it's a tad too loud…. NOT that he " hates the fuck out that shaker"!!! Ease up on the exaggeration, Jimbo. Did you just feel a need to use the word "fuck"??? HAHAHA
~Your problem is that you think sonic placement and stereo placement are the same thing, they aren't. We are talking about sonic placement so stereo or mono doesn't come into it, this just goes to show you know nothing about which you babble.
Steve Smith I'm sure that depends on the relationship with the artists.. I assume a good engineer has a pretty good idea of what their artist likes or wants..
His mastering work on Bestie Boys Solid Gold Hits on Vinyl is terrible. Maybe was the pressing plant but this is one of the worst sounding records I have.
What the REAL problem is, is that you can't stand being proven wrong by someone. You are such a hypocrite because if it annoyed you so much that I dared to reply to a post 5 months old you wouldn't have answered. BUT you did. Someone has to tell you that you were wrong and you were and still are. The fact is that you took time out to answer someone commenting on a 5 month old post who had something pertinent to say about your comment. Like I said if you dsn't like it don't post comments.
They had it right 60 years ago! I have some 50s&60s jazz recorded direct to disc and to tape later pressed in vinyl, that have such superior sound qualty to most of the crap that comes out of a mixing console today, you would not miss the stereo reproduction left in the hands of most so-called recording and mixing engineers today. Music recording and reproduction has been so compromised by the promise of the digital fast buck and that any shmoe in his basement can do it, leaves people clueless!
Dude, I mean no disrespect but if you seriously believe that the recording quality of records made 50+years ago have superior sonics to records now you're out of touch. I'm not saying older records sound bad. I enjoy music from all over, but they without a doubt can't hold a candle to what's possible today. Not even close. You might have a preference and that's fine, I can't debate subjectivity. However, I agree wholeheartedly that the vast majority of what passes for modern music is garbage and the bar is nonexistent. I'll take an excellent track recorded with bad quality over a polished turd any day without exception. There's something to be said about the dynamic range of old records... I'm experimenting to find a happy dynamics balance between the different eras.
![“อ.เบียร์ คนตื่นธรรม” มาตามคำเรียกร้อง แหกศาสตร์ฮวงจุ้ย เตือนสติอย่างมงาย | แฉ 7 พ.ย. 67 [1/3]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/5fc4S3xBNfc/mqdefault.jpg)
I met Chris Athens a while back at Sterling... I sold him my old Doepfer modular synth in exchange for an Akai MPC-4000. Great guy. Very professional and good humored. He let me hear a mix he was doing through a customized $40,000 Dynaudio 5. 1 monitoring setup. I'll keep that memory close. :)
Howdy Dominic! Hope you're making good use of that MPC.
I am! I've been delving much deeper into mastering lately. I finally picked up my Chandler LTD. bus compressor! Lovely. Also upgraded my A/D -D/A to a Prismsound Orpheus and my monitors to Barefoot Micro Mains. Not bad for a bedroom studio, huh? :)
Loving this guy's dry humor - at 5:20 "This track is in stereo.... which is a good thing" Almost sneezed my drink
To my understanding, the clients were actually there at Sterling. This was meant as a documented "day in the life." And I know Chris very well. He's done around fifty or sixty records for me. Trust me, Chris certainly would have called the client (or probably emailed them). But again, they were present for the session.
I learned some really important bits here especially the aspect of making sure the mix is balanced and leaves headroom for mastering. I will treat that with great care. Also stereo vs mono is something I will watch for. Fading is something I remember when I was in recording studio my first time, it did make a difference and has an important impact on a song.
This is a good video. It's great to see he loves his work and can go into detail about what songs need and don't need. I just got started with recording my own stuff but had no idea this much work goes into finishing a track.
Hey Bob Sutherby. I was talking to the client. They were in the room. You don't have to call them if they are standing right there.
My apologies, Chris - somehow I missed seeing this comment until now. My original comment was not meant to be a slight. I have utmost respect for the mastering process.
Chris very impressive and clear to understand work. Sometimes simplicity is the only answer and I like the way you describe what you are doing in non technical jargon like a lot on the net today..
I think the cosine fade idea may have just solved all of my fade problems!
Kinda funny that the audio from the videorecording is also massively distorted ...
These were Demo tracks brought in by the people that did the interview, it was not intended to be a final product... they were brought on so just to illustrate errors people do when sending their tracks to mastering facilities.
When I did mixes, I mixed everything on various sized speakers and headphones. That way, you knew what your final product would sound like on the most expensive sound system or on a "boombox" or on a iPod or laptop computer, because no one speaker has the same frequency response.
It's a good thing to just bump your first raw mix on speakers, stereo systems, in the car and on headphones.
You'll hear exactly what's missing in the mix
Wow! Now THIS guy knows what time it is!
i like this video,it gave me some tips.....thank you.
Even worse how did a mix like that reach such a well respected engineer?!
you CAN undo distortion, if you have a mathematically perfect declipper like I do. =) and you CAN regenerate (not restore) lost/missing dynamics and detail. not using an old-school setup like Sterling and most top guys use tho. great respect for history, but not pushing R&D like some people do. good video tho, thanks for the up.
The mains are Dynaudio Acoustics C4's (not to be confused with the consumer Dynaudio C4 model)
That's because nowadays what interests most "recording engineers" is volume. They make it as loud as it can be. Noise, LOTS of high-end boost, tons of compression and clipping levels of volume.
It depends on the song. Consider that the audible range of frequencies we can really hear is within 20Hz to 20kHz.
After he said the song was distorted and in mono, I thought he was going to say, "And then I get in touch with the mixing engineer to provide a new mix." That's what I would've done.
But the mix being distorted, and in mono, are very likely NOT what the client had intended, so, a simple matter of adjusting as opposed to remixing would fix that.
Yeah defo worth running it by the Mixer, just in case.
@@youtdemdunno believe me they're happy with you not taking a mix back to them
how do you NOT realize that your track is in mono lmao
It doesn't retain the punch fully in stereo. I've been a sound engineer for over 30 years and have often had to mixed in mono as well as the "normal" stereo stereo Also if you know your instrument frequencies and make space for each instrument and voice then the sound localisation is just as good in mono. It is all about giving each track it's own space to breath that means no heavy limiting and comp in the mastering it's a bad engineer who can't give spacial awareness in mono as well as stereo.
Gold!
Chris Athens is so great! He's an amazing human and was so gracious in agreeing to lend his expertise for the next Audio Pro Bootcamp in Austin TX. We're so thrilled to have him! Find out more at www.audioprobootcamp.com
The only problem im having with this is, he still mastered the distorted track. instead of getting on the phone and being strict about the audio. And forcing the producers/production engineers to lower the volume. he just went on and still mastered the distorted track. unbelievable. - And yet, we are suppose to be guided and directed on how we should do our levels, when even the mastering engineers broke the rules of audio. We will never win this war on Loud Wars. - Keep Distorting People....
Great!!!🙏🔥🔑🔑🔑
Word! Moreover, sometimes you need to reluctantly let some of the things go, unfortunately, because not all speakers will deliver all that richness of detail. Also, I found that on certain devices not only is it about the generic lack of highs and lows but that the exact same sound would seem to actually have an entirely different texture to it. Weird.
Some instruments have huge peaks that only limiters can grab.
Quieter tracks may need less dynamics to be audible but still quiet.
Rule 3 was basically rule 1 and 2.
Don't confuse TH-cam with subjective "rules".
Don't trust rules when it comes to production unless you've verified them yourself, and even then, don't play your experience as rules.
High Frequency Limiter: Maselec MDS-2
That sub that you're hearing in dubstep is around 47hz, so you can still roll off at 32hz or at least at 20hz which isn't even audible.
INSPIRATION IN ITS MOST HIGH
Very true
I wouldn't make that to a track, you do that on a big PA system to put more power and because those bass frequencies are even less effective on big venues, but for a home record it all depends and I'm sure most commercial music has those frequencies present.
If you actually mix it down in mono you lose nothing and there is more punch than if you mix in stereo. What you are on about is mixing down into stereo then exporting as mono, in THAT scenario then it is bloody obvious there will be a difference and losses as you are drastically altering the mix. Try listening to old mono mixes from the 50's and 60's and you will see what I mean. They were mixed down in mono and the sonic clarity and "openness" as you put it is there, is still there.
Nah. You're way off. M/S is where it's at, knucklehead. To which you made no mention. 30yrs? lol I doubt you've spent 30 MINUTES in an actual studio...You clearly have no idea what you're talking about.
The fact that you felt the need to spam this comment section with inane, mindless comments says a lot about you.
lol why would you put the master track out in mono. dafuk
@OptoDigital I can't disagree with that, but mastering isn't the only application this can be used. Have you thought of this in a broadcast or home-listening context, where there's now 2+ decades of arguably destroyed music that people listen to? Or in mastering where requesting or getting a remix is impossible?
I'm confused about the Red Book standard of 2:00. The music on the CD doesn't actually start 2:00 in!
Chris... I'm curious why you didn't just call the label/producer of this song and tell them to send you a new mix where they correct the issue with the shaker? If you were mastering one of my tracks, that's what I would want you to do.
ima hire chris athen do mi nexx killa hiphop beet if he down witit cuz im also looki fo produser finense mi latess mix tape 'Thug Lyfe 2' harcore ol skool rap rymez, mi shit dope fo rea
btw Chris, how to deal with mono mixes ? (except obviously contacting mixer and asking him for revision)
When he sends the Reference CD back to the artist he will only send the song at a starting point of 2:00 minutes. Not from start to finish. mostly when all the instruments are playing
what does mono excatly mean? does it mean that they didn't panned the tracks?
For All The Dogs! :)
whats the fader plug he is using at the end? anyone?
This guy is exactly right in what he is explaining, moogus. Such a ridiculous comment..
Hello, I would like to pursue the career in being a master engineer. I was researching further into this topic. I read how it can be a stressful job and I want to make this as easy as possible for me... So, to start, how many years of school would i need, if any at all..?
+Jacob McDonald Mastering music is easy. Being excellent at it and turning it into a career is very hard. If "easy" is your focus you're looking at the wrong industry.
+Chris Athens so how many years of schooling?
+Jacob McDonald I don't know. 2 or 4 probably. Lots of programs out there. I worked my way up from tape librarian at Sony Studios. Never went to school. The easy part would be school but they could teach you theory and technique. Building a career and being great at the job is a totally different animal. When I was years into my career at Sterling Sound I this slept on the couch more times than I care to remember. I worked more than anybody else I knew. Crazy hours. Everybody's path is different. Maybe I did it the hard way. I don't know...
+Chris Athens thank you very much, appreciate the input
All the best on your journey.
well at least they won't have L/R phase issues :-)
bad mon
i was just gonna say - frikkin haha
5 months or five days makes NO difference a comment is put up to be commented on. If you don't like it don't post comments.
the audio in this video wasn't mastered well
My goodness!! Ron Jeremy certainly has been eating well. Such an odd plan B job though
He's also too polite to say "I could eat a burrito and fart a better track than this". Probably not good for business.
he hates the fuck out that shaker don't he lol
James G I'd say he thinks it's a tad too loud…. NOT that he " hates the fuck out that shaker"!!! Ease up on the exaggeration, Jimbo. Did you just feel a need to use the word "fuck"??? HAHAHA
This video needs a mastering... poor quality!
Seen this already.
rule 5: dont follow 'rules' from the internet
I'm not Chris :)
~Your problem is that you think sonic placement and stereo placement are the same thing, they aren't. We are talking about sonic placement so stereo or mono doesn't come into it, this just goes to show you know nothing about which you babble.
Pretty bad to do a fade without contacting the artist
Steve Smith I'm sure that depends on the relationship with the artists.. I assume a good engineer has a pretty good idea of what their artist likes or wants..
You act like he can’t EASILY take it off if he doesn’t like it ....
1:29 hahahaha really? Some folks should not be allowed near a mix console
Mono haha guess he mixed with 1 speaker
Spoken like a true pro
His mastering work on Bestie Boys Solid Gold Hits on Vinyl is terrible. Maybe was the pressing plant but this is one of the worst sounding records I have.
Glad you liked it. I didn't cut the vinyl though.
What the REAL problem is, is that you can't stand being proven wrong by someone. You are such a hypocrite because if it annoyed you so much that I dared to reply to a post 5 months old you wouldn't have answered. BUT you did. Someone has to tell you that you were wrong and you were and still are. The fact is that you took time out to answer someone commenting on a 5 month old post who had something pertinent to say about your comment. Like I said if you dsn't like it don't post comments.
Haw about mastering some REAL music like Jazz & Fusion ?
+Meter Pangs I haw done lots of kinds of music. What kinds of music haw you done?
Sacred art of mastering? hahaha yeah so you can get big bucks! it's not rocket science and is nowhere near the skills needed to mic up and record.
That is funny Steve. Too bad the thousands of people I've worked with didn't check with you first. They could have saved the big bucks.
mono.. lol.. noobs ;) prolly stoned
They had it right 60 years ago! I have some 50s&60s jazz recorded direct to disc and to tape later pressed in vinyl, that have such superior sound qualty to most of the crap that comes out of a mixing console today, you would not miss the stereo reproduction left in the hands of most so-called recording and mixing engineers today. Music recording and reproduction has been so compromised by the promise of the digital fast buck and that any shmoe in his basement can do it, leaves people clueless!
Dude, I mean no disrespect but if you seriously believe that the recording quality of records made 50+years ago have superior sonics to records now you're out of touch. I'm not saying older records sound bad. I enjoy music from all over, but they without a doubt can't hold a candle to what's possible today. Not even close. You might have a preference and that's fine, I can't debate subjectivity. However, I agree wholeheartedly that the vast majority of what passes for modern music is garbage and the bar is nonexistent. I'll take an excellent track recorded with bad quality over a polished turd any day without exception. There's something to be said about the dynamic range of old records... I'm experimenting to find a happy dynamics balance between the different eras.
Mix consoles should be outlawed... period.