@@samb2052 I joined in 1985 and was issued a '68 pattern (have been told it was probably a '72 pattern!?) and an '85 later on (87 I think). The '85 was bloody awful, although not as bad as the trousers with the big elephants ears pockets flapping around.
@@samb2052From what ive seen the actual MTP Para Smock and other pieces of gear is made in China or India, fabric is nice and soft, from what ive had in MTP its not bad but i think it could be improved in fabrics since it doesnt use something like ripstop and i cant tell you how it works in winter or rainy weathers since in my country theres no snow and rains are heavy but most often its hot afterwards.
I bought a smock as a teenager in the '60 from a deposal store in Woking, Surrey. I mostly wore it for fishing. It has the wool collar, four patch pockets with buttons and the beaver tail with pop studs. The camo has a brush stroke look. I'm not sure it's WW2 origin. It might be later than that. What's more, I still have it.
I'd have a look online to compare with Rhodesian brushstroke - although I don't think it's that because they didn't have beaver tails afaik. Or perhaps it's a Belgian Denison, those had small beaver tails. Otherwise I think Portuguese troops in the wars in Angola / Mozambique used brushstroke camo. Whichever it is it's probably worth a fair bit and I am talking hundreds, depending on it's condition.
Get the book "Denison", it calls out many of the errors you have made. Eg Windak was an officers smock. Zero evidence it was an early version. Only Brigadiers & above were seen wearing them. Early camo versions were hand painted but later "1st patterns" were roller printed. And had wool cuffs. And tail did not press stud onto the back. 2nd pattern (buttoned cuff" were only printed. Any with full zips were tailored usually using sleeveless oversmock zippers.
I enjoyed this v. much, thank you. There are so many contested opinions when one takes a 'deep dive' into even relatively modern military kit but this was a nicely balanced overview. My own area of interest is the post-war para smock. My 1970's service coincided with the withdrawal of the Denison and the issue of the DPM. There are some interesting tales about that process. 🙂 Possibly, I might have been one of the 'final few' regular recruits issued a Denison at Depot although I believe that TA units used up the surplus for a few years after 1977. I own several post-war Denisons, including the one I was originally issued with. I swapped out a totally knackered army surplus one for the 'new' DPM when the change occurred and kept my own Denison although wearing them at work was forbidden. Back in those days Denisons were as cheap as chips and worn by just about everyone on building sites!
@@jamesross1799 Wikipedia is unreliable to say the least, it's always worth verifying via other sources too. It can put you on the right tracks and help you go down rabbitholes via links in the text which is great fun, but I use that to find out more from other sources. Knowing other languages too helps as wiki in other countries often has very different entries, they aren't just translated from English.
Good effort. I don't want to disparage you but I'd lose the completely era inappropriate music and try to record the sound with something other than a gramophone.
@@militaryjunk No he wrote ''paratrooper'' in German, but it's one word so only capital on the first letter. In WW2 they were part of the Luftwaffe though and were initially issued something called a Fliegerbluse (flying jacket/shirt) , the same as other Luftwaffe personnel.
@@militaryjunk No. He's trying to teach you how to stop mangling his language, and to pronounce it correctly. This is also possible via google, these days.
I still have my Denison smock as issued to me in the sixties a bit worn but still hanging in there.
nice :)
You repeatedly state that they are not well made, you obviously never had an '85 pattern Para smock issued to you lol. Nice video.
The 85 pattern gear was abysmal. The 50s smocks and the 70s version were great kit. Not sure what the MTP versions were like.
@@samb2052 I joined in 1985 and was issued a '68 pattern (have been told it was probably a '72 pattern!?) and an '85 later on (87 I think). The '85 was bloody awful, although not as bad as the trousers with the big elephants ears pockets flapping around.
@@samb2052From what ive seen the actual MTP Para Smock and other pieces of gear is made in China or India, fabric is nice and soft, from what ive had in MTP its not bad but i think it could be improved in fabrics since it doesnt use something like ripstop and i cant tell you how it works in winter or rainy weathers since in my country theres no snow and rains are heavy but most often its hot afterwards.
yeap :D
I bought a smock as a teenager in the '60 from a deposal store in Woking, Surrey. I mostly wore it for fishing. It has the wool collar, four patch pockets with buttons and the beaver tail with pop studs. The camo has a brush stroke look. I'm not sure it's WW2 origin. It might be later than that. What's more, I still have it.
label not intact?
I've a replica ww2 one I wear for fishing. You certainly made an investment there mate.
@@militaryjunkNo, it tore out years ago.
@@payres48 hello sir can i buy your smock?
I'd have a look online to compare with Rhodesian brushstroke - although I don't think it's that because they didn't have beaver tails afaik. Or perhaps it's a Belgian Denison, those had small beaver tails. Otherwise I think Portuguese troops in the wars in Angola / Mozambique used brushstroke camo. Whichever it is it's probably worth a fair bit and I am talking hundreds, depending on it's condition.
Get the book "Denison", it calls out many of the errors you have made. Eg Windak was an officers smock. Zero evidence it was an early version. Only Brigadiers & above were seen wearing them. Early camo versions were hand painted but later "1st patterns" were roller printed. And had wool cuffs. And tail did not press stud onto the back. 2nd pattern (buttoned cuff" were only printed. Any with full zips were tailored usually using sleeveless oversmock zippers.
thanks
I enjoyed this v. much, thank you. There are so many contested opinions when one takes a 'deep dive' into even relatively modern military kit but this was a nicely balanced overview. My own area of interest is the post-war para smock. My 1970's service coincided with the withdrawal of the Denison and the issue of the DPM. There are some interesting tales about that process. 🙂 Possibly, I might have been one of the 'final few' regular recruits issued a Denison at Depot although I believe that TA units used up the surplus for a few years after 1977. I own several post-war Denisons, including the one I was originally issued with. I swapped out a totally knackered army surplus one for the 'new' DPM when the change occurred and kept my own Denison although wearing them at work was forbidden. Back in those days Denisons were as cheap as chips and worn by just about everyone on building sites!
thanks
A big regret is that i never kept mine, had the 70’s version and the first dpm pattern.
yeap, that's sad.
Winston Churchill was so ahead of things.
yeap
Wikipedia tells me that the camouflage pattern was developed by a Major Denison.
That's an error. No one with the name Denison was involved with the development of the smock. The name is probably a corruption of denim.
That's what I thought too via Wikipedia.
@@militaryjunkwell I live and learn.
@@jamesross1799 Wikipedia is unreliable to say the least, it's always worth verifying via other sources too. It can put you on the right tracks and help you go down rabbitholes via links in the text which is great fun, but I use that to find out more from other sources. Knowing other languages too helps as wiki in other countries often has very different entries, they aren't just translated from English.
@@militaryjunk many things were named after MPs of history could it have been named after a John or a William Denison
Good effort. I don't want to disparage you but I'd lose the completely era inappropriate music and try to record the sound with something other than a gramophone.
thanks for the feedback.
Fall
Schirm
Jäger
den svenska denisonen?
@@militaryjunk No he wrote ''paratrooper'' in German, but it's one word so only capital on the first letter. In WW2 they were part of the Luftwaffe though and were initially issued something called a Fliegerbluse (flying jacket/shirt) , the same as other Luftwaffe personnel.
@@militaryjunk No. He's trying to teach you how to stop mangling his language, and to pronounce it correctly. This is also possible via google, these days.
Jolly good show old chap.
Thanks.
I love the denison smock its icon.
You think that is a badly made garment wow!