Drawing Comics: Pelikan Ink-What Happened To It?
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 7 ม.ค. 2023
- It's the first Studio Sunday of the new year!
Robyn is back with all the news and gossip!
The PARKER GIRLS: DEAD QUIET trade paperback!
Our first Kickstarter for a sexy art book: AFTER DARK!
C2E2!
Strangers In Paradise New 4-volume Format coming this year!
Hot Seat Q&A:
Are you going to color Strangers In Paradise?
Drawing Comics:
For 30 years I've used Pelikan ink. Then it changed from a dense black ink to a gray wash. Why? I have a rumor of a theory of a guess based on my inquiries at my art local store. Meanwhile I have a global search on for whatever remains of the classic and quickly disappearing vintage ink that is now a precious commodity!
Check out my comics and books at www.AbstractStudioComics.com
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I've read that Stan Sakai of Usagi fame went through a similar experience. He used FW ink until they changed the formula. He learned from insiders that Badger Black Opaque used the old FW formula so he switched, until Badger also changed their formula. Now he uses Platinum Carbon Ink.
Thank you for this info.
Hahahaha it is thank you in Portuguese!! Obrigado Robyn and Terry!! Also I love how Robyn's plan for Terry's retirement is to work more 😂
Edit: damn, the difference between them is huge!! That's crazy
OMG, has it really been 30 yrs since SiP was first released? I feel so old.
Modern inks worth a look:
Blackest Black:
Dr. Ph Martin's Black Star, matte or hicarb, are equally very, very black. One's a little shinier than the other.
Deleter Black #3 and #4 are also both very, very black. #4 is either slightly darker or slightly more matte-- it's so black it's hard to tell, to my eye.
Pretty Damned Good:
Dr. Ph Martin's Bombay Black is... unique. It's very black (I'd say a level or two below Black Star by the same company) but it has an odd sheen to it (I like it a lot-- you might not).
Winsor & Newton 951 Black Indian Ink is also very black, just make sure you get the waterproof one-- has a spider in a top hat on the bottle.
Ultradraw often comes packaged with Rapidograph tech pens. It's a pretty good black and because it's formulated to work in Rapidographs, you can get away with putting it in brush pens and Parallel pens (but it will kill fountain pens like any other India ink).
Not India Ink:
Speedball Super Black Acrylic Ink is something I've been playing with lately. It's better than Speedball Super Black India Ink, but I haven't decided yet if it beats any of the above options for me.
Platinum Carbon Black is my ink of choice for fountain pens, brush pens, Parallel pens or anything I don't want to clog up.
Pelikan was one the best available inks on the argentinian market in the 80's and 90's (along with rotring) and some time ago, let's say 10 years ago, they started sending some product from another factory and it was terrible, mainly water with some carbon residue and mold inside. I just bought a couple of bottles of pelikan ink and it feels like it's back, but with less concentration. I use kuretake and Talens now. The person who sold you the big bottle may have added some water perhaps.
Holy crap. I didn’t realize how watered down the new Pelikan ink is. You can tell the difference on screen.
I hope Rachel comes back in future comics. I am so invested in Rachel Rising.
I think some have already mentioned Platinum Carbon Ink. There is another type of ink that is actually Acrylic Ink. The black is beautifully mat and very black. It lays down exactly like ink but when it is dry it behaves like acrylic and is completely waterproof.
Dr Martins BlackStar ink I’ve heard offers a deep black.
good morning/afternoon/evening mr. Moore, I recommend Talens or Pebeo paint they are as good as Pelikan Classic (if you have no option)
Talens is as good as the old pelikan, and it even smells the same. I haven't tried the pebeo but it looks very rich and dark.
Martin's Black Star Ink is great. I have this other stuff out of Japan but it just has Kanji lettering for the label.....so I don't know what it's called.
I usually ink in microns and pigma brush pens (FB, MB, and BB), but I did get a bottle of ink from a friend a couple years ago. I like using it for things like Ralph Steadman-esque splatter effects. Problem is, it's like the new Pelikan, with dark grayish coverage instead of solid black. I can use the effect in my favor, but solid black splatters look better overall. I can fake it a bit by using the BB pen in just the right way, but actual spattering still looks better.
The bottle I've been using is 6oz. of Sumi Ink.
Your “obrigado” is on point.
You two are a hoot, LOL
Also if you people don't belive Pelikan ink is the best, it's even referenced in Belgian comics like Spirou, Gaston Lagaffe, Achille Talon, etc. as «encre de Chine». Those studios swore by it and, I guess, threw it at their editors and publicists, which explains the shortages.
I use Pelikan India ink (in German Pelikan Tusche) rather for writing. Currently there are two Pelikan India Ink. One is the Pelikan Tusche A in the blue and yellow bottle and there exist the Pelikan Scribtol Kunstschrift Tusche and I assune that the Pelikan Scribtol is rather the same formula like the old Pelikan Tusche. So my suggestion is to buy a small test Pelikan Scribtol with just 30 ml. On a Pelikan page it's written "Die Pelikan Tusche Scribtol ist die stabilste Tusche im Sortiment. Sie ist nicht nur lichtbeständig, sondern auch lichtecht. Darüber hinaus ist sie deckend und entspricht der Kategorie dokumentenecht. .." (The Pelikan ink Scribtol is the most stable ink in the range. Not only is it light-resistant, but it is also lightfast. In addition, it is opaque and corresponds to the document-proof category. ..) So my suggestion is to try out the Pelikan Scribtol as best and most resistant Pelikan black India ink (Tusche).
New information: Pelikan Scribtol is not Pelikan 4001 brilliant ink! It's an calligraphic ink and Indian ink (in German Tusche). It is not an fountain pen ink! A describtion can be found here:
www.pelikan.com/int/products/colouring-painting/supplies-accessories/163-drawing-inks/156-scribtol-bottle.html
I hope this information helps you.
I can't find that Pelikan Scribtol ink searching on the internet. Do you think it could be the same as the Pelikan 4001 brilliant black?
I've added a new information about Pelikan Scribtol becaus RicDreamlandAvalon cannot find information about Pelikan Scribtol. I tried to answer directly but somehow I don't see my answer anymore after reloading this page. I hope it helps.
Hi, I'm used Pelikan ink in the past for comics, now I use "Dalbe chinesse ink" and "Windsor and Newton Indian ink" (the spider draw in the bottle, the other is not waterproof) and their quality are very good. Both exist in little bottle and big bottle. In Europe is very easy find both and I'm sure you can purchase in Amazon or Web Art shops.
Looks like I'm late to this feed, but after watching this video, I bought three 1 oz. bottles of "vintage" Pelikan 17. All three were deteriorated (or refilled with something evil). So disappointed. Have you tried anything that comes close?
I’m using deleted Ink number #4 to ink my comic book AntFarm…. I really like it. I guess its big in the Managua world. 🙃
Interesting, I didn't knew those things about the vintage Pelikan Ink and also I find quite curious that there isn't more people talking about this brand on the internet. And yes, I recently bought a small bottle of Pelikan "India ink", basically because it was cheap and when I tried it I noticed that it was not completely black, although in personal it was not such a big problem because I actually remark the lines and in other places I think it can make an interesting gradient like with Wash Ink, but I completely understand your dissatisfaction.
I also know that Pelikan has another more expensive ink, Pelikan 4001 brilliant black, it would be interesting if you tried it.
P.S: Couldn't the new ink be "fixed" by adding carbon or another type of black pigment?
Not to get into the middle of a family argument, but the fact Terry can get ice with his Diet Coke at C2E2 is pretty snazzy. Hopefully he can get Dr. Pepper with ice too!
(That said, looking forward to the new SiP format. Will try and grab those for sure!)
What do you think about Winsor and Newton ink?I use this ink quite often and I can say that it has a fairly deep black color and good hiding power.
I haven't tried it lately. I'm sure I will tho.
How do you do the spacing between panels on paper? Do you measure a cm between each panel? Or do you just eyeball it.
It's ⅛ inch, which is the space between red lines on my C-Thru ruler.
www.amazon.com/Westcott-12-Inch-Beveled-Transparent-B-70/dp/B001THRMGS/ref=pd_day0fbt_sccl_1/134-3152851-0767168?pd_rd_w=2CVhB&content-id=amzn1.sym.c2062204-a945-491b-941c-359f18d6fec5&pf_rd_p=c2062204-a945-491b-941c-359f18d6fec5&pf_rd_r=5JYJ4D63HCT1R9XWC3MT&pd_rd_wg=MmrE3&pd_rd_r=eefb91c1-e6a8-422a-9b02-4c4cbe0b22a8&pd_rd_i=B001THRMGS&psc=1
Could you try and steam out some of the water from the new ink while maintaining fluidity? Or maybe mix the two inks to see if you could maintain the black while adding some volume to the ink so it lasts longer?
Somebody else mentioned steaming and cooking but I don’t do chemistry.
You know, Chicago in March, you can just step outside and get all the ice you want haha
good point!
Son of a…just ordered some Pelikan Drawing Ink A. I used to use it in the past - great ink. I just received some Deleter 4 because it was advertised as waterproof and marker proof. Failed. Abject failure. The ink looks good, but forget using watercolor or markers with it. So, back to the old standard…oh hey, I’ll watch a video on it. Son of a….
Well, if it is watery crap, it’ll go back, too. Sigh.
I'm wondering if you have figured out a substitute for your pelikan ink now. Pelikan was sold to some asian conglomerate last year, so I think we all know what that means. If you want to stick with actual india ink (shellack based) maybe the schmincke india ink is worth a go, they use their recipe from 1912. Rohrer&Klinger makes really good inks as well. The sennelier india ink is good too. I thought i'd make some suggestions that arent the usual suspects you see on the internet like speedball or dr.martins
I received many donations of vintage Pelikan ink so I am set for a few more years of inking. When I run out I will have to find a new brand for sure. Thanks for the recommendations!
So no heavy black backgrounds coming in the rest of the series? :)
It's going to be stories about a polar bear in a snowstorm.
Rename this video “The Pelikan Brief.” 😀
😂
well that's not good... does this mean without good ink I won't get the gothic vampire series? Have you looked into what my school uses- Blik Black Cat?
Hey Terry and Robyn,
When you say the story without interruption, does that mean removal of things like Molly & Poo? And are they completely removed? Or just moved to the end of the last book?
You can answer this for the next Studio Sunday if you'd like.
Exactly. The story stays focused on the main sip story, not the tangents like the
Like the Xena parody etc.
@@TerryMooreArt thank you sir!
Speedball Super black. Dr. Ph Martin Black Star, Platinum Carbon black, Noodler's Black. I make pigments for a living, and it's become increasingly difficult to get the usual raw materials to make them. One suppliers titanium dioxide isn't the same as another's, etc. Most likely they changed suppliers too. Also any ink, Especially as old as the ones you're using, Will septate over time so shaking gently is a good idea from time to time. Especially if it has carbon in it. Dye based inks just plan suck. Leaving any ink out in the sunlight is horrible for it and interior lighting is not good either. Store it in a drawer. Please don't 'cook' it either that's just nuts.Noodlers Heart of Darkness is an excellent alternative to India ink, very dark and matte. The dry time/waterproof qualities can be problematic if going over it with wash or watercolor but since you do b&w that may not be an issue. I would recommend getting a small bottle first. Noodler's has a lot of blacks and the creator is very much influenced by vintage pens/inks.
Color solution: hire one of DC or Marvel’s colorists, who work for scooby snacks and a homeless shelter meal.
I've got a 2 oz bottle of Pelikan Brilliant Black 4001, inherited from an aunt of mine, with a white cap, mostly full. It might be adulterated, and I prefer Dr. P. H. Martins. If you'd like to try it, I could send it you.
I don’t know what that is. I use #17 permanent black ink. Yours may be very diff?
Wow that new ink looks horrid compared to the vintage stuff. Hopefully someone sees this and has a spare case sitting around.
Have you tried cooking the new ink down?
Like meth?! No. I want to live! lol
Hope your ink supply needs improve Terry! 😮
Uh Inks have just gone downhill. I just picked a bottle of Sumi Ink to try and it seems ok coverage wise but If I have large black areas anymore I just use FW Black acrylic ink. It's a little pricey compared to india ink but the fact it's acrylic it covers amazingly and dries to a flat black.
I tried that once. using it for hours in an open dish gets to be a maintenance thing.
I always shake my ink bottles.
try a Japan ink brand
Hi! Just filled out the contact form on your website with some possible (UK) eBay links if they are of any interest...
Thank you. I'll check them out!