What It's Like To Grow Up Christian | Ep 6:
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- เผยแพร่เมื่อ 5 ก.พ. 2025
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This series about asking the awkward questions of others that have different experiences to mine... today I joined in with my two friends Lucy and Anna to talk about having a religious background in 2016 :)
Lucy Moon: / meowitslucy
Anna James: / @acaseforbooks
THE REST OF THE SERIES: • Playlist
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INSTAGRAM: / leenanorms
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BOOK DEPOSITORY LINK: bit.ly/1LvCqmh
Who am I watching?
Hi - my name is Leena! I make videos about my life, I review books and talk about ideas I have (or ones I've heard about and have mis-remembered as my own) - expect travel vlogs, poetry, booktube debacle, author interviews and discussion nonsense.
What else do I do?
I'm a Creative Producer of a show called #BookBreak and I'm also taking on freelance projects, for more info email me at leenanorms@gmail.com
Can we send you books for review?
Sure, just send a press release to leenanorms@gmail.com and I'll always take a look at let you know if I'm interested. I don't accept unsolicited books for review or self-published books.
hahaha 6:30 LITERALLY me until I turned like 20. I just figured like, look I get it if you grew up in it but if you are intelligent and venture out into the world you will eventually understand it's silly. I don't remember literally saying this, but I probably also at some point in my youth believed that religion was to blame for most the world's troubles. LOOK AT ME NOW. (for context for anyone reading this comment, I am now a follower of Jesus). Also 7:56 if I ever mention being a christian online 100% chance I get people asking, but do you hate gay people? 12:20 I think a lot go people assume religious identifying people are nonintellectual, because of course, most of what you see in the media is inanity. Enjoyed this. Enjoyed you three.
Just reading through comments and surprised to see you here! :) I would love to see a video more on your upbringing and religious beliefs now as an adult. P. S. We were totally in the cray button music video together haha.
Just to clarify, what exactly does being a follower of Jesus mean to you? I would be interested in having a conversation with you about this topic.
Just watching an ancient video from my feed and looking at an ancient comment section and. Well. Hello, there! Games is so friggin good.
I loved recording this! So lovely to chat about a subject like this.
Please do this again with someone who is still Christian, I feel like it would be fun to see the other side of things. And as a Christian myself I had so many questions about stuff you guys said and also answers to questions that were raised. I thought everything you said was very interesting and well handled, I'd just love to see this discussion continued:)
It's a treat to see you all chatting so readily in the comments about this, you absolute babes XXX
I love these vidoes !
I'm glad you checked yourself about representing white people. I hate when people try to represent an entire race. That's like saying Twilight, represents all books.
The comment you made about the 'rythmn' of Catholicism interesting because it's a very true observation. I'm a Catholic and I do find comfort in the repetitive, structured nature of Catholic worship. When I was struggling to adapt during my first semester of uni attending Catholic mass was a real comfort to me because it was the same as it was at home. That's one of the things I like about it, that it's the same all over the country. I read an interview with Charlie Cox in relation to his part as Matt Murdock in Daredevil, and he was talking about how easy it was to slip into the role of a Catholic character after being raised Catholic because there's a very specific way things are done. He said it's like muscle memory which is a great way to describe Catholicism. You apply the holy water to your forehead as soon as you walk into the church. Before you sit down you genuflect. You do the sign of the cross automatically upon hearing 'amen'. I think Lucy's observation of Catholic church being 'above you' is interesting because I never really thought of it like that. On the other hand, I feel uncomfortable at other churches where I'm expected to engage. I enjoy the anonymity that the Catholic church gives me. You can come and go without any questions asked.
What's interesting about Catholicism is, even if my belief in God changes, I'd find stepping away from the church hard, because it's been such a fundamental part of my upbringing, and I've heard the same from many other Catholics. My parents weren't hardcore, but they took me to church every Sunday and prayed with me and my siblings every night when we were kids.
I think a lot of people find the Catholic church scary and dogmatic, but it's a comforting place to me. Being in a church makes me feel safe, not just the God side of it, but the church as a whole being something so familiar. It's one thing in my life that has stayed constant over the years. I see the flaws in the institution, especially the corruption towards the top, but I know I will always find comfort within the faith.
Katharine Annie i've been reading through all of these comments and this is the one which i identify with the most. thank you for putting into words what i was trying to find to explain catholicism
This is so true for me too! And you’ve put it into words so wonderfully
as someone who grew up/is still growing up in a Christian environment this video was so comforting to watch. I'm definitely in a 'it's complicated' relationship with church and God right now. my experience is probably closest to leena's (this is the first year in four years that I'm not going to soul survivor!) I rarely have these sorts of conversations with people and I think it's so important to talk about! also I enjoyed the relatability :)
NGL I still miss Soul Survivor a lot. Have you tried Greenbelt? It's hald Christian and half secular and I'm gutted to be missing it this year but it's rad. It makes me feel like I can keep my 'cultural' indentity of Christian, but no one hates me for not believing in God - plus they have lots of other religions there too xxx
+justkissmyfrog I've heard of greenbelt but I didn't know it was half secular as well. I will definitely check it out for the future! Thanks xxx
i am the same. i am still living at home at the moment and my parents are very religious. (they're very "since you're living under our roof, you're going to church.") i'm looking forward to moving out next year when i graduate and i just feel like i'm bidding my time until i can make my own decisions about my faith and whether or not i want to stay in church. it's definitely good conversations to have! i don't know many christian people who are having these sorts of thoughts :(
+Caroline Wong I know exactly what you mean, I've still got two years until I can move out and I'm definitely looking forward to making decisions for myself rather than what religion wants me to do!
Someone (maybe my RE teacher?) said religion is less about the service you go to and more about the tea and cake afterwards, and that has always rang true to me. We all want to be part of a community, and religions are some of the oldest clubs in history!
This resonated so much with me. I took my time this summer holiday to think about religion, growing up christian. Right now I'm doubting a lot and more on the agnostic side. But I always saw doubt as a taboo, and you either believe it all or you don't. So I kind of pushed back thinking about God and religion for a long time. And now I'm looking for a place where I can be involved in religion, without judgment and where my doubts are accepted. I find it's so much easier to find what you dón't believe in anymore, than what you dó believe. But I do have an inner longing to do something with religion, or the spirituality in life. So now I'm reading lots about faith & doubt to help me find where I stand (that's why I think it's so cool you uploaded this video today!).
I also really recognize the duality in your thinking, like you believe both, or can see the world through both glasses: the christian and the atheist view. You know all the perfect christian answers to life, but at the same time they sound like fairytales to yourselves. Perfect ground for a mid-twenties identity crisis (like there's not enough to worry about ;)).
(Sorry for rambly English, just woke up and not a native speaker).
Also, random skill set consists of: knowing the names of the sons of Jacob, knowing the bible books in order, building houses (christian working holiday) and knowing hundreds and hundreds of songs and psalms by heart.
ALSO, I know many people who were jealous of me being in church when I was hospitalized in the past. I would get hundreds of cards from everyone in the church because they would pray for me in the services etc. And I thought it was so weird that the other 'patients' didn't had that kind of community, because it felt so normal for me receiving all these cards from all these people. That feeling of community, like you have one big family you can count on is something I really miss without the church in the individualistic society.
Also, I think a 'What its like to grow up sober' video would be interesting - I didn't drink until I was 21 and people often have some really funny misconceptions about that, or are genuinely interested/can't imagine what that was like!
lol i'm 35 and still have never had more than a few sips of alcohol. I think it tastes gross. people DO think it's really weird. Which is... also weird? Like, do you react this way to people who don't like broccoli? Or eggs? Why is it that because I don't drink alcohol that that's so weird?
As a Muslim I always had really positive experiences with Christians as I had and still have neighbours and friends who are practicing Christians. Also, I was always taught that Christians and Jews where to be respected as they are considered to be fellow 'People of the Book' since in Islam we believe in both the New and Old Testaments.
I agree that growing up religious allows you to be part of a community other than your immediate family. Though for me I think it's been both my religious community and my ethnic community that's given me that.
I grew up a Jehovah's Witness (I'm not one anymore).. a lot of stuff Anna said absolutely resonated with me - the voting thing, or knowing the bible very well and there not being a middle way bc of that... I'm glad you did this episode! I always felt quite lonely in my experience of growing up in religion and now I don't :)
Leena you should try and get someone who is religious and lgbt on Stupid Questions bc that would be really interesting
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yeah! as a christian my sexuality is one of the biggest things that has affected my beliefs
yh!! how about someone who is muslim and lgbt or jewish and lgbt?? christianity is a majority anyway so it would b gr8 to hear more marginalised/nuanced and different voices and perspectives
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I kept pausing the video after you asked the questions just to think and answer them for myself. As a Catholic who is/has always struggled to reconcile many teachings of the church with my own standards, morals, and personal qualities, this video was incredibly reassuring that it's okay to evaluate and reevaluate our beliefs. I feel a bit ridiculous even saying this, but I have this weird toxic idea that, if I stop identifying as Catholic, I will be punished for it. It's so unhealthy and crazy. Many of my beliefs already differ from that of the church anyway, but I still struggle with this strange sense of obligation.... I'm figuring it out. And this video was very helpful and just awesome all around.
This has been such an interesting video Leena! I've definitely noticed this perception of religious upbringing, moving from a secondary school where most people had a relgious background (a real mix of religions), to university where almost none of my friends do and they sneer at religion a bit. I actually get quite angry particularly when my friends say religious education is pointless, and they don't see what an important way it is of understanding people and what being human is.
Personally growing up Quaker, between meeting and camps, gave me so much space for reflection and time to develop my beliefs which I can see my other friends only having the time for once they got to university. I also think having an accepting community outside of school is really important for self-confidence and self-exploration.
A little addition to the Quaker business thing: Quakers don't swear on the Bible because they don't believe in having a double standard of truth. If you swear on the Bible, it implies that you're less likely to be truthful when you're not swearing on the Bible. They built their reputation of trust through business.
I absolutely love the respectful tone of this video x
I think it's so interesting that a lot of people say they drift away from religion because they develop contradictory beliefs like feminism. I recently converted to catholicism which has very strict rules on what women can and can't do and very bad beliefs regarding lgbt issues. Often it can be hard to get on with other catholics because they hold these beliefs but personally as a woman and a lesbian i find it quite easy. I believe in most of the Church's beliefs and the structure of worship and any issues I have I just reconcile with knowing that they're wrong? I know that God wants me to marry and calls women to the priesthood and one day the Church will accept that. I had such a strong calling to catholicism I couldn't let those things stand in the way of my conversion.
Also I feel like me and Lucy's grandma would get on well haha
I connect so much to what Anna was saying about feeling comfortable in groups, I never really felt comfortable anywhere until I joined the catholic society at my university and started going on retreats with nuns and other catholics my age. It was such a good experience to be with people who believe what I do and everyone is so kind all the time. I've always been so shy and becoming catholic has like, brought me out of my shell.
Thank you for this, it was lovely to experience a calm and balanced conversation about religion online.
I probably sit somewhere between Leena and Anna, but I'm still a Christian. I always get very nervous sharing things about my faith on the open Internet (I.e. tumblr and TH-cam rather than Facebook and Instagram) because I'm met with such a variety of people and I know I don't always have an answer etc. So many topics that I'd love to discuss, but I don't want to badger anyone 😶
*and because it's so easy to be misunderstood in a comment!
Yes! I wish there was a way to have a frank discussion without being downvoted and unfollowed through next Tuesday and beyond. It can be such a charged topic it's hard to even bring it up.
As someone who grew up within a non-religious family and is now herself an agnostic/atheist/liberal non-believer. It's fascinating and awesome to hear a balanced intellectual discussion around the topic of religion. Yay humanity, good chat much love.
8 years late? lol
I am so glad you made this video. I relate to it so much. I grew up an Orthodox Jew and over the past few years have had to really come to terms with the fact that I'm an atheist and have slowly left the community. I related so much to everything you guys said, about the community and experience in youth groups and camp and all the bad and good that comes being raised in a very religious household and community. I really related to what Anna said about when she started having doubts how she couldn't look to the faith to provide answers because she had studied it so well and already knew the answers the religion provided. I had the same thing. I spent all 12 years of school in a religious Jewish schools studying the bible, Jewish law and Jewish philosophy and praying every day. When it came time for me to reckon with the doubts I had been having I couldn't really turn to what I had learned for answers because they didn't satisfy me. I'm in college now and almost all of my friends were raised completely secular and when they find out I come from a religious household and community they're shocked because now I'm so "normal" and liberal.
A lot of my own doubts and issues also come from the gender roles expected in my community and the sometimes archaic views that dont really have a place in the world today in my opinion. Its something I still struggle with because every time I go to my parents house I hear so many things that I don't agree with but you cant really change someones mind when they believe in something so fundamentally.
I still identify as Jewish, a hundred percent because I love a lot of the morals and world views I've learned from my upbringing and its also very important to me to pass on our heritage and customs and history to my kids, when I have them. Even though I'm not religious anymore its so much a part of me because thats how I was raised.
Anyway, I absolutely loved this video, and now that you've done one about Muslims and one about Christians maybe you could do one about Jews.
This was so refreshing to watch! There were so many amazing things about growing up a Christian that I has forgotten about because I've completely turned away from that ideology now. Made me feel so nostalgic and miss all the amazing people I met during my childhood in the church, and all the people that shaped me into the person I am now. Oh man, bringing a tear to my eye. Loved this video!
really enjoyed watching this conversation as a bisexual girl growing up in a extremely religious (pentecostal) home. for several years ive been unsure of what i believe in terms of religion and god and all that. it was very interesting to hear all the different perspectives on this touchy subject. as someone who has and is growing up around so many of the negative outcomes of religion i.e sexism homophobia ect. i often find its hard to hold on to the idea that there are people who are religious and don't fit into that social construct of religious people. anyway i dont know if this made any sense or if there was any point to this comment but i just felt compelled to add to the conversation. ps love your videos :)
Makes sense. Especially in pentecostal and dedicated environments where anything LGBT+ is either not talked about or always discussed negatively it can be hard to figure out your own identity when the message you're receiving is nearly opposite from your personal feelings. Sounds like you're in a better space now, but I'm here if you want to chat.
What a wonderful fascinating conversation! I've always heard Anna mention her religious upbrining but never knew the details so I'm glad to know so much more now. All three of you have given me a lot to think about - thanks!
I'm very late to the party here but I just had some thoughts to add! I grew up Catholic and went to a Catholic primary and secondary school where we prayed everyday and went to mass once a term. While I agree with what Lucy said about Catholicism being very strict, going to a Catholic school meant that everything in the service was being explained to us making mass easier to follow. Even though I am no longer religious I still go to mass on Christmas and Easter (I think my Irish nan would disown me if I didn't 😂) and I find something very comforting and homely about the service. The formality of it is what I enjoy and I like that I could go to a Catholic mass anywhere and still be able to follow and 'join in' with the replies as they are universal really creates a kind of community bond with people you're never met before. Anyway there were just my rambles thoughts on the matter! Great video as always xx
as someone that didn't grow up as religious at all (but attended a very religious anglican school) this was super interesting! i'm usually quite 'eh idc' about religion but it was honestly very refreshing and enlightening to hear the three of you speaking so honestly and eloquently about religion. really enjoyed this :)
This was great. So many things I share with you, but also so many places where I kind of cringe and want to add my experiences - or "insights" - to it. Also, I learnt a lot. This probably give so much insight to people that watch and do not have a Christian upbringing. Many thanks. Really enjoyed it.
This video is shockingly relatable! (Also Anna I loved the interview you did with V E Schwab yesterday, it was such a great event)
I think it's so important to discuss/struggle/wrestle/think about all of this. Thank you for creating a space to be able to do so. I really enjoyed listening. x
Really enjoyed this video Leena! My family aren't religious, but my brothers and I were all christened in our local methodist church where we attended Sunday School for a year or so and we went to a C of E Primary School but other than that, we were never brought up in a church environment, we didn't talk about religion outside of school or socialise with other religious people, but as I've gotten older I've been considering joining the Quakers and Lucy has made me really keen to attend local meetings!
I love this video! I love hearing your thoughts on growing up Christian as I grew up atheist in Norway, there are so many things I just don't understand about growing up religous.
I just have one comment about random skills and growing up in an accepting environment. I have been in guiding/ scouting my whole life and the guide and scout movement is also a place where you get (almost exactly the same) random skills and you are in a thoroughly accepting environment. So while you were talking I was just thinking that if you want that, but not releigion, you should join guides/ scouts :-)
omg i clicked on this vid thinking it was going to be 4 minutes wondering how they could cover this topic in such a short amount of time. so happy to see that i misread and it is actually so much longer. really interesting conversatin to follow as a previous atheist, now agnostic.
As someone who grew up in rural Ireland (heavily catholic) this was a great conversation to hear
I grew up Catholic, to Christian, to Baptist and now I'm in a weird period where I don't fit into any one church. I don't agree with everything that has been preached to me, but I still believe in God. Thanks for the awesome video! I love this series!!!
Yea, its so much about finding the right denomination, one can make you want to throw things and another will fit like a glove. Keep tryin' and good luck
It's amazing to hear such an open conversation and something that rings so true to me. I grew up with a mum who is a Church of England vicar and while I grew up until I was about 11 I went to church regularly and identified as a Christian. However then high school started and I couldn't be bothered going to church on Sunday's and only attended major festivals and the local youth group. In 2014 I went with my youth group and built a house in Mexico, in a similar way to Anna saying she did things that she forgets how impressive they are, I do this for Mexico as almost everyone that went to the Youth Group goes to Mexico and builds a house. Also, big up the bible camps, every year I spent a weekend in the Scottish Borders on zipwires and climbing walls and in a marquee singing hymns. Recently, my mum has moved parishes and the new parish has a fully formed youth church and I went for the first time and they sang new hymns that I had heard at the weekend camps and there was an air of welcoming to it. I am slowly beginning to think about attending church again and am looking to go to the church near me at uni just to see what it is like. If you had said that to me even a year ago I would have doubted you so much.
I loved your comment at 26:40. That's what I always admired in religion. I never felt that I fit into the church scene where I grew up. As I've gotten older, it really seems like such a source of comfort and acceptance that appears really nice. And can have such a good impact of kids.
Beautifully supportive talk which reminds me of my escape some 30 yrs ago from my mom's pentecostal upbringing. At peace with her now, thank God !
leena there were so many moments in this video where I thought, 'you and me are the same' especially at 33.50 when you were like 'I struggle to stop believing in god because I'd miss the people', which I really clicked with. For me at least there's a really strong sense of community with things like greenbelt and bible conferences where everyone there is family, and it makes you think that christianity is everything good in the world, when outside that bubble I'm back to being agnostic and doubtful and all that. I think my favourite thing about christianity are the values of love over anything else, and I'm really glad I was taught the values of forgiveness and the fruits of the spirit and everything, but that's the way I want to live my life regardless of whether I believe in god, you know? but anyway I love the way you think about these things and I could relate to a whole bunch of what you were saying, I wish I could just talk with you for hours about it :p xx
I loved watching this! Christianity/religion is often a topic shied away from (including by me) but it was great to see how readily you discussed your different experiences. I grew up Baptist, with my dad as a minister - I turned out atheist, while my little sister was recently baptised and is going to be a leader at Soul Survivor this summer - and I'm often self-conscious of this and keep my religious background secret for various reasons, but now I think I'd like to have a discussion like yours with my friends because I'm interested in their thoughts etc, so thanks for making this video :)
Really interesting video! Made me think about how I react when I hear someone was raised religiously (hangs head in guilt). Great series the "stupid questions"!
THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THIS VIDEO! I grew up totally atheist and I learned so so much in this video. I really needed this as often people assume that I know stuff related to Christianity, and I usually don't. Now I feel a little more educated.
I knew I recognized Anna's voice from somewhere! didnt realize it was a case for books until I read the description haha
It's so interesting to hear about other people's experiences growing up a Christian. I had never really heard much about the Quakers or Christadelphians before now so thanks for sharing! I grew up with a group of Christian friends and I think the main reason I went to church each week was because I enjoyed spending time with the people there. Like you I feel like I had more than one set of parents and I was brought up by many people. I also went to a festival called Greenbelt for years which I absolutely loved :)
I really enjoyed this I am a Christian and I loved hearing the different stories. this was such a good idea I like how you guys did it. it's so cool to see how I have a different view and a different story from you guys. religion in America is different in general and Californian religious people are very different as well. I have friend who are homosexual and religious and I enjoy my conversations with them about faith.
listening to you guys talk about your camp experience and big group experience makes me thing you should all look at getting involved in guiding and scouting; very useful skills!
this was a great video. thank you for the nuance and balance. and for having this conversation. I was a bit scared clicking on it that you were totally going to bash christians (bad assumption on my part) because a lot of my christian-turned-atheist friends do. and I really started thinking about the community part, I sort of always took it for granted (like the aunts and uncle's comment) but this made me think about community and social structure for atheists in a new way. love these type of vids! also, you are three very pretty and thoughtful women
I loved this! It's so nice to hear a real and objective discussion by feminist woman today that wasn't trying to 'choose a side' or was completely based in in a place of criticism and contempt. I have grown up in an area that is very black and white about beliefs and I still struggle with what it is to be a woman of faith and how can feminism coexist in that world. It feels hard to talk about being a person of faith or just growing up in the church and still be also be considered a person with opinions and thoughtfulness. I really appreciated this.
Would really like to see a video on people who identify as Christians now at an older age.
Oh I definitely have access to a lot of them.
+justkissmyfrog yes agreed !!
I'd love that too!! I see so few people online talking about being religious still as they get older, especially in terms of being religious and a social activist
I absolutely loved this video! I grew up catholic and I'm an atheist now but still really interested in discussion about Christianity - all 3 of you spoke so well, really good content :)
I grew up Catholic and watching this was really interesting. A big part of Catholicism is the routine of it all and that can be quite intimidating if you're not used to it. But since I was raised Catholic, I didn't know any different. I still identify as Catholic, even though I want to explore other branches of Christianity that might suit my beliefs better, so learning about your experiences was really insightful for me. :)
Aah, it's lovely to hear people talking about their complicated relationships with religious traditions, this is such a good series, Leena!
(Also it makes me want to ramble about my Judaism for like 1000 years, as per usual)
This so very interesting !!!! My grammar school is a Quaker school in UK but I’ve never thought of it as being a religious school even though we have a silence in assembly but apart from that it’s a pretty normal school
Oooh, maybe a collab with Rosianna about growing up Catholic? She's in London right now, right?
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I really really loved listening to this chat. I was tricked (tricked seems too harsh a word but it's the only one I can think of) into going to a soul survivor summer festival by one of my best friends. I was suffering with mental health issues and dealing with personal things and that kind of environment was what I really needed at the time. I joined a church and got very heavily involved in the worship team, but found church a very difficult environment socially and have drifted away from it. This chat reminded me of the good things about being a Christian but don't think the kind of church I was at fit me well enough. Also QUAKERISM SOUNDS GREAT.
"I'm really comfortable with not knowing" feel that!
awesome chat here- from a Jewish perspective this was really interesting to listen to. love this series Leena! :)
I was totally thinking that! I'm converting to Liberal Judaism now and what to me feels like a mind-blowing faith/ belief in God seems to translate to Christian agnosticism.
I was totally thinking that! I'm converting to Liberal Judaism now and what to me feels like a mind-blowing faith/ belief in God seems to translate to Christian agnosticism.
from a liberal/atheist/ex-Catholic upbringing, I should add.
I grew up in a evangelical church and even though neither of my parents were religious I absolutely believe that I was raised - at least in part - religiously. In fact I was on track to be a minister for the church of England by the time I was 25.
I can completely identify with what you guys are talking about; I had all of my best friends at church, church was a much easier space to navigate than school, it was the 'more fun' option. So when I apostatised or (though I hate the term) 'lost my faith' when I was 19 (I am now 23) I had big hurdles to jump through that I wonder if anyone who is in this sort of boat else also feels?
For me loosing my faith was the result, much like Anna, of accepting and discovering new liberal worldviews. I was studying theology and philosophy at university at the time and discovering feminism and social justice more broadly. I mean sure, there's the book of Esther and there's the courage of Mary to pick out only a few examples, and so I think you can have quite a fruitful feminist interpretation of biblical scripture. But these stories are already predisposed with patriarchy on a ritualistic, biblical and theological level. That is to say - how can we see the courage of Mary as a proponent of women's strength when she is, theologically, violated by a male God, when she is, biblically, approached by a male Angel surrounded by male stories, written by a male writer; and ritualistically when the clergy and the liturgy are already so masculinised that the role of women in these stories has been systematically undervalued. Though I will say that the growth of a female clergy in the CofE has helped with this final problem. Feminist theology and feminist biblical interpretation - though lacking behind it's related disciplines of History and Literature - has seen an impressive rise in scholarship.
I was also studying the philosophical impact of the holocaust and holocaust studies - in writers like Primo Levi and Hannah Adrent - which gave me a new understanding of the depths and banality of evil, which again I couldn't square to a benevolent, omnipotent God. This wasn't anything new by any stretch of the imagination, but for me realising what evil and suffering were or had the potential to be was a powerful blow to my belief in God. In fact I would go so far now as to sometimes identify as an anti-theist as well as an agnostic. I don't just disbelieve in God but find any being with the power to change the world, that could let this world be the way it is, is utterly revolting. (Also fun fact: Philosophically speaking Agnostic is the strongest view on the existence of God - it's not what it tends to be colloquially 'I'm just not sure' but instead 'knowledge of God is unobtainable'. 'a' from the greek meaning nothing or without and 'gnosis' meaning knowledge. Atheism and theism on the other hand inhabit a different epistemological camp. Atheism and theism both believe that knowledge of the existence of God is obtainable, but obviously disagree on the existence of such knowledge.)
As for these feelings I wonder if anyone else shares, I felt a deep sense of shame when I abandoned Christianity. I felt as though I had turned my back on these 'aunts and uncles', 'brothers and sisters' who had invested so much into me. I am absolutely happier not being a christian, but turning my philosophical back to these ideas left me questioning the relationships I had with very close religious friends. Questions that are, though diluted in the time since, still troubling me today.
Thanks for the video and the discussion, it was great.
So, I grew up catholic, and now identify as "?????!?". One thing that you didn't really touch on (so maybe it's an experience that other people never had?) is that weirdly sometimes there's like interdenominational dislike or mistrust between Christian denominations. Even now, when I tell people who are religious that I grew up catholic, you sometimes elicit a reaction of "Oh, hm", and clear discomfort or maybe even repulsion....
I very distinctly remember a youth leader at an interdenominational youth club once telling me and some of my other catholic friends that while she was very strongly Christian, that she hated Catholicism. I think that in hindsight, she was trying to express an opinion that a lot of the negative stuff associated with Christianity can be *especially* associated with Catholicism, but she expressed this poorly and to a room of baffled 15-year-olds.
There's also a sense of camaraderie between people who were raised catholic that we share with each other, but that isn't necessarily shared with others raised in Christian homes. I still feel like part of this might have been related to anti-catholic prejudices even within Christianity-at-large.
It's really hard to describe why different denominations are different. I think this is the part of the group think that's really engrained and hard to shake, in part because it's so hard to put a finger on what the difference is.
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This so much! I grew up Catholic at a Protestant school and sometimes had to put up with weird or downright offensive remarks from students and occasionally teachers about my denomination.
I know this comment is from a while ago but I know exactly what you mean! I grew up as a Catholic and was in a Catholic school until 18 (although my beliefs changed earlier than this), and only since I have gone to university have I noticed this intense dislike of Catholics from not only non-religious people but also other Christian denominations. I had no idea! And it's like I think Anna said in the video - I will criticise my own religion, but once other people start doing so I feel the need to defend it.
I also know this is an old comment but I also grew up Catholic, but I live in New England, and most people here are Catholics that keep their religion to themselves or irreligious. There for sure are other Christian denominations and other religions here, but just not as many. So it's kind of unique compared to the rest of the nation, but when I started travelling around the rest of the nation and discussing religion with other denominations and I was totally shocked by the anti-catholicism. Never really made sense to me why some Christians are so dead set and against other Christians based on a few differences. Not to mention that fact that the more I talked to them the more I realized that they have no idea what Catholicsm is about and have huge misconceptions about it.
This video was so interesting from the perspective of an American 20 year old girl who was raised Catholic. I always find (in all of your videos not just this one) that there are moments where I think "she's just like me" or I feel like I can relate to you in some way, and other moments where I feel like you are so different from me. I loved the video and honestly I'd love to just sit and talk to you all for hours about just everything.
hahah I wish I could throw a massive hot chocolate sleepover with everyone and talk for hours in to the night :b maybe one day! xxx
+justkissmyfrog that would be so great! If only.
This is AMAZING; Thank you for making this video together!!
This is fantastic, you mentioned that there isn't really much dialogue about religion within everyday uk society, that it's almost taboo, and i think the same goes for Australia. It was really interesting to hear some voices I could really relate to!
It's so interesting to hear different perspectives of Christianity. Stupid Questions with Leena is becoming one of my fave things on TH-cam right now 👐
I have liked all the videos I have seen from this series, but this particular one was great for me to watch right now. The question if and if yes as what to christen my baby has brought up questions in me, that I have ignored for a long time.
I had not thought I would get anything from this video, because I thought, well, I know all about this, don't I. But you three managed to have a really interesting, enriching discussion.
So much of what you said felt very familiar to me. I grew up as a protestant in a very conservative roman catholic small town in Germany. I took part in loads of the 'fun things' like you mention, Leena, but it was always a bit like 'well, I don't have to agree with ALL of it, because I am different, more liberal, and a minority.' Having said that, some of my favourite memories growing up were facilitated by the church (protestant or catholic, a trip to Taize, discussions about 'BIG topics, singing in a choir etc).
I had a similar experience like y'all during uni, where I basically thought atheism is the only thing an educated person can be. And I still have huge issues with organised religion.
I find myself now hungering for belief system, again, but maybe more in terms of a moral code, but also in terms of belonging, and feeling accepted, and cultural identity. Especially as I am an immigrant here in the UK.
As a white middle class westerner practicing Yoga with a lot of other white middle class people, I struggle with the treatment of some of Yoga's elements for various reasons: the issue of cultural appropriation, for instance, but also this 'oh wow, this is the bee's knees'-, when (like you point out, Leena) chanting, meditation and a firm belief in love are deeply rooted within the christian culture, too. (And - as far as I know - Islam, Buddhism, Judaism and others, too). And yet, I see a lot of good ways in which Yoga is practiced here. And I am so glad I found Yoga and get to share it. And it helps me personally, that it is currently so fashionable.
I am still no further in my decision about my child, but this video gave me a good reason to keep on pondering. Thank you to all three of you!
This is a totally fascinating topic because it's a thing I never see talked about on TH-cam! (Not that it's very common to hear about even outside YT as well). Your 'Ned Flanders education' thing is so on point! I feel like the 'New Atheism' in particular really pushes people towards that because people espousing those opinions- at least a vocal minority of them- have very little understanding of the thing they're railing against, i.e. Christianity. But you're right, a lot of people who grow up atheist will never have thought about Christianity (or religion in general), which is IMHO like growing up Conservative and never thinking about voting Labour!
Tl;dr great content keep it up proud of you
Aw thanks dude :) yeah, the age of reason is great, but the age of arrogance not so much ;) XXXX
+justkissmyfrog that bit about people assuming you just haven't thought about it- i sat through so much of that in philosophy of religion classes. And it's like, have you heard of Aquinas, or Augustine? They've been thinking about it pretty much for 2000 years
I'm Catholic and I feel so scared about what people will assume about me. My family was very open about everything and never pressured any hateful beliefs into me. I thought it was really interesting but I would have loved to see a video about a person who actually still practice their faith proudly if you know what I mean.
Also I HATE how people view Christians or Catholics as stupid or anti-intellectuals
I've felt like this for eons, but in the past few years I've started being more willing to talk about my faith and my upbringing and I've been pleasantly surprised by people's curiosity and willingness to have discussions.
This was a really interesting watch. As someone who grew up in a mostly atheist community I can really struggle to understand both the cultural and faith aspects of religion (if that makes sense). I find I really have to fight the impulse to assume that everyone else have a similar background to me or that because I come from a christian country I have an understanding of all aspects of Christianity. A thought provoking video as always. I love this series and can't wait for the next one.
I felt all of this so much. Feeling defensive about a religion that I once believed and kind of don't anymore, trying to define what I believe and finding it super difficult, having to deal with religious bigotry, while also balancing that with an understanding of how hegemonic Christianity has hurt people... It's a mess, and it's great to hear somebody else also articulating it. And OH MY GOD THE DEATH THING. I agree, since I've left the church, death is like... SO MUCH SCARIER. The stakes of life are so much higher. I feel like believing totally in eternal life really took the pressure off of the decisions I made in this life in a way that for me personally was probably much healthier than where I am right now, mentally...
I didn't go to a CofE school at any point in my life, but in Infant school we had to pray every lunch before we ate and then we'd have people come from the church every half-term and sing hymns through my whole primary school life. At the time I enjoyed it, but now looking back it was kind of forced upon but not in a way where we were encouraged to be religious in practice, it was a casual input into our lives
but I've been quite ?????? agnostic I guess in my life. I believe in a higher power because I'm sure that this (this being earth) can't be all there is, but I'm not quite sure what that is
I come from a country where it's 'exotic' to grow up atheist so hearing that in the UK people get weird inappropriate comments when they say they are or used to be religious is fascinating. This is such a great video!
I've been thinking quite hard about my own beliefs recently and I can see that I have a long (and cheesy) road to "self discovery" ahead of me. This video really opened me up to the Quaker church and so I really thank you for that! Also, I think that I'd like to see a similar stupid questions about Buddhism (simply because I feel like it would help me work out whether Buddhism is right for me and if so which school). Thanks again for the video, it was absolutely lovely to sit down and watch with a cup of tea xx
I grew up Christian then as teenager stopped believing and identified as atheist. Now I still feel that way but label makes me feel uncomfortable - I like what Anna said about humanism. I wondered if you'd heard of Sunday Assembly? It's a monthly non-religious congregation with singing, a lot of energy but also space to reflect and that sense of community. They hold values about doing good and a sense of wonder that I found really inspiring. I definitely often crave that community and comfort that religion brings and seek other ways but think something like this is a wonderful thing, especially how things are going and how hard it is to live in this world at the moment as you talked about in your latest video. Really enjoy this series and this video was great.
This was such an interesting video; before I was really ignorant about Quakers, however now I'm kind of in love with it. Thank you for making this video!!
What an amazing video! Loved this kind of conversation where no one is right-fighting each other. One of the 'stupid questions' I've gotten, as an identified Agnostic (raised Catholic) dating a Jew is "are you scared dating this person will compromise your faith?" - YUM.... NO! I'm not because that's faith!
This was such a lovely relatable chat for me who also grew up Christian but is now an 'at-peace-with-it-all atheist' lol :)
My parents were very passionate evangelical or Pentecostal Christians (basically believed in being born again as the only 'true' path in life; and a very literal interpretation of the Old & New Testaments & a sincere belief in the existence of hell, witchcraft etc) so it was an.....interesting upbringing haha
It always seems to surprise people when I tell them what I was/wasn't allowed as a kid, big ones being Harry Potter & Halloween - big taboo in our house!
As an adult I basically came to a similar conclusion as Anna, that my strong belief in feminism (and my own bisexuality) is just not compatible with the Bible. That was a few years ago and I'm very happy with where I am now.
But I agree that the most awkward question would surround my parents!! Because unfortunately my mum really isn't accepting of homosexuality, and while *I'm* allowed to feel frustrated about that, I don't want other people to criticise & judge her based solely on that, because I know that she's really a good person in basically every other way. It's hard.
omg this! All of this!
I grew up in a Christian home. I'd say my parents were both good examples, and my mom was definitely a lot more involved in the christian community than many people's parents (to give you an idea, she recently published a book on the changing church) so I was definitely very steeped in it. Despite that, I never got my faith from my parents. I had to figure it out for myself- which i think is SO important for anyone- and much of it came from working at a christian summer camp. There are a lot of things in the church i don't agree with. I think many beliefs are misinterpreted, outdated, and uninformed. But I also realize that people are flawed, and its not the belief in Christians that I follow. It's the belief that there is someone (or something) so much greater than myself, who thought I was worth redemption despite the fact that i can be a sh*tty person. A lot of people think it's far-fetched or too radical, but i dunno i think its cool. I am still very liberal-minded, constantly learning and questioning, and realize that there's a crap ton of things i just don't know. But for now, I'm also ok with that. x
this was so amazing & really insightful! you all expressed so many ideas & feelings of mine :)
One thing you didn't touch on (understandably as it's not part of your experience) that I have struggled with has been the history of colonisation in Christianity. I also grew up (am really still growing up as I'm 17) Christian in the Uniting Church of Australia which is quite open + progressive so that's been really nice. At the moment I'm not entirely sure what I believe but I really struggle to reconcile the damage done to my people with my faith or rather the tradition of my faith (the church) especially as so much of my culture (I'm half Solomon Islander) was killed by evangelicalism. Our traditional ancestor worship is now only practiced by a few men from my village & even the knowledge about the practice of ancestor worship is dying out as if you are Christian you are not allowed to visit the ancestral sites. It just makes me extremely sad that this facet of my culture is dying out. Additionally the horrors of colonisation were largely committed under the name of Christianity & I find it incredibly hard to have faith in something that wrought so much damage.
Anways, this was a really great video & I throughly enjoyed it :)
I really enjoy this series. Leena, I've found you to be one of the few youtubers who I enjoy because you speak what I think. Have you ever had that moment when you think something and someone else says it? Haha It's spooky sometimes.
I wish I was in this conversation. As an Italian born and raised in Rome, from parents who grew up as Catholics but soon found their own spirituality away from Christianity, I've always been quite a rarity among people. I have always kind of a problem with religions. I respect one's own spirituality, but I just have a bad feeling about big communities or establishments. Maybe it is because of where I come from. There's so much I would like to talk about!
Absolutely love this series! Would be cool to see the opinions of someone who grew up as an atheist, but now identifies as part of a religion.
So interesting, thank you!!! Could listen to you guys chat all day :)
This was a beautiful video to stumble upon tonight. Listening to you and your experiences was very calming and interesting. I grew up Christian, but not overly religious. I now consider myself agnostic (I'm happy and content with not knowing, too!). Just this afternoon I thought about religion. As long as it helps and comforts you and at the same time doesn't hurt others, I think religion is wonderful. Also I believe that it is ok to pick ideas and concepts that fit into your own perception of spirituality. Which is why even though I don't actually believe that heaven exists, the idea of my loved ones going to heaven and their souls still being around somehow is comforting me, so I hold on to it a bit.
(English is not my first language so touching on this topic is quite difficult, sorry :D)
Oh man. I live in the US and was raised Catholic and went to a good Catholic school for a few years. When I was 10, my parents divorced with no annulment so the Church I had been going to since basically Kindergarten/before essentially kicked my family out. Then I had an on again off again relationship with Catholicism and Christian churchs that basically accepted everyone I would sometimes go with my mom. Now, at 22, my dad having gone to a Christian church for the last few years which I also enjoy, I consider myself a lapsed Catholic and agnostic. I still believe in God, but like Anna, feel comfortable knowing I can't and won't know everything. When I don't attend, I also miss the singing. It feels like the most powerful part of church and religion and this deeply spiritual part of myself/the community that seems to connect when that happens.
I was actually jealous of the kids I knew that had youth groups and heavily involved religious communities because outside of school, I wasn't involved intensely with people my own age. If my parents had stayed together, I likely would have been more involved and been apart of a youth group.
I'd definitely like to explore possibly attending church as an adult, but currently, am content without it. Plus, you can find Christian songs on Spotify.
What she said about having problems with Christianity but when other people get angsty about it getting all defensive, sums up exactly how I have felt. It's a community that I could never explain, people often only want to understand the negatives.
I wasn't raised a Jehovah's Witness, but spent a lot of time in my grandma's congregation. I definitely relate to being able to talk to different age groups. As an adult I can see that I have a tendency to veer towards people that are either younger or older than me in spaces that are outside education. While I definitely do not agree with the faith in many ways, the sense of community and friendship and trust, like you all mentioned, is beautiful. Great video xx
I also really appreciate growing up with a religious mum and an atheist dad - balanced, like you said. My little sister and me both went to Sunday School, but I don't think our other little sister did - it's like the enthusiasm waned after a certain point. The sister who went to Sunday School with me went through a phase where she really believed and went to Spring Harvest and stuff, but she's agnostic/atheist now, and I ended up Pagan.
I'm actually going to check out the Quaker website now; Lucy sold them really well!
Thanks for making this video! So interesting and refreshing to hear this topic discussed. I'm a Christian and towards the progressive end of the spectrum and am always curious to hear more about others' experiences. I'd be really interested to know what it was that changed your minds about your faith, and that made you identify as atheist instead of simply altering your views within the realm of Christianity!
Love this series, keep it up!
I found this talk pleasant and enjoyable. Not so much for the topic as learning your individual experiences growing up. I think this explains a lot about you Leena, your charisma and confidence to express yourself. Some of us don't get such a positive message whilst growing up, that they are loved by a higher power and deserve to be here. (insert sad violin tune here). For the sake of sharing, I didn't grow up religious but was introduced to "church" through several relationships, where I had to go! I quickly learned that commenting at my g'f - "Jesus Christ! you cut your hair", in front of her parents was not cool. = )
RIP Soul Survivor. It holds a special place in our hearts
Enjoyed this so much, could watch you three ladies talk on any subject!
Love your videos and topics... Watch them fully, from start to end. When's the next banging book club.
This is super awesome, I think it's brilliant to just talk about ourselves and religion, I mean just from this video you can see how different we all are even within the same religion but at the same time have the same questions regarding why we're all here, and it's like that in Islam where it's easy to come to the conclusion that it's all too complicated to even be apart of but it shows how as humans we're all looking for a place to belong or to understand why are all here even if that's through religion, and I think it's important to have discussions where you renew your understanding of the world and the people that live in it.
Brilliant, enlightening and very relatable video. Love you all! More please!
xx
I grew up athiest in a pretty religious area, which landed me in a couple of wierd situations. It was really interesting to see the flipside (kinda) of it. Anyways, keep up the good work!
Thanks for posting - this was a really interesting discussion from a bunch of perspectives you don't often hear.
On the question of labels, I was raised without religion and always considered myself agnostic but was perturbed as the more I engaged in these discussions the more I was told I had to pick a side. I think people spend far too long squabbling in and around labels and denigrating those who accept that they don't have all the answers (agnostics).
I now identify as an agnostic atheist as the more I considered the concepts I realised that they address separate claims; agnosticism concerns knowledge and atheism, belief. I am agnostic in that I do not know if God exists (or not) but do not believe it to be true. Anyway, short version, labels suck.
Good talk. Ta, and that.
Found this super interesting as I too grew up in a christian family and have never heard of these denominations and its made me quite interested in quakerism. I guess my experiences are the most simular to Leena's but kind of different as it wasnt that family based but more about the youth groups
this video has been really refreshing and while I'm a Christian I've not been brought up like any of you but this was still lovely and information to watch. I have found the Bible is hard to understand sometimes but my youth leader is really good at explaining and helping me to get things
although, everything you've said about forgiveness I completely agree with and skills.
also confidence and friendship's. Really I agree with all the good things mentioned but I think it he bad things are very specific to the type of Christianity.
I was raised in a Catholic family/Catholic school scenario (so much so that I didn't know any other faith than Catholicism existed until I was 12), but as my family lost touch with the church when I was a teenager I did too, and I never got confirmed because I felt like I was an atheist at that point in my life. But for the past year and a bit I've been attending my local Quaker meeting, and I've found such a home there, in such a freeing faith, it's lovely.
Anyway, this was really interesting to watch! Glad to know other people have been on crazy faith journeys too x
I love this video it's so unique , my dad is a minister and I found it difficult to move away from it , nice to see three sassy girls i can totally relate to x
This was so interesting and fascinating to watch ! Thank you for sharing your experiences
I'm not a Quaker but went to a Quaker school and we had a silence every morning in assembly! It was a lovely way to start the day. I grew up going to church and Sunday school and did enjoy the sense of community at the time but have distanced myself from it as I've grown older. I don't know what I would categorise myself as anymore haha
oh my gosh Lucy when you said 'just google it' it made me laugh so much because I say that all the time :') people completely forget about google when they ask these questions haha
This was so interesting and insightful! As a Muslim it's so interesting to see similarities and differences- loved this video!
this is really interesting. I grew up Orthodox Christian, and it's interesting to hear about other christian denominations, and their ways