Thank you so much for the shout out. Sengoku Period certainly would have seen things be a matter of personal taste and wealth. Cloth costs money, so even something as seemingly unimportant as sageo length could be determined by your wealth. It may not have been used as an obvious marker of that, but richer could afford longer sageo. As in the video, standardization probably started in the Edo Period, or possibly under Hideyoshi. Although they were typically more concerned with blade legth so ther emay not have been any government decree about sageo, but rather social conventions, school, and regional preferences, ect... As to when the standard length that often comes with swords today came around, that I am not sure about. It could have been post-WWII when arts like kendo and iaido had to undergo a lot of changes in order to get permission from the occupational forces to be practiced again. Since swords were made to conform to those then perhaps that is why the standard sageo is used in many koryu schools. However, there are koryu schools that have different lengths of sageo, tie them in different ways, and some that do not use them at all. This is one of those topics whose answers might mostly be "it depends."
Top of the morning- oops I’m mean afternoon to you. At least it is in my neck of the woods. I always look forward to seeing your show. Always something to learn. Thanks 🙏
When I was first learning how to tie sayamaki knots, I found that the vast majority were simply for pageantry purpouses, and svery few were for actual combat usage. Essentially, I noticed 3 things about both styles. 1: they try to use bight ( solidly affixed) knots with bends ( loops of cord) through them to act as a marline spike hitch system. 2: they almost always were never easy to tie or be swiftly deployed in times of emergency. 3: both styles of knots used never fully dressed or utilized the full extent of the cords, always having excess shown that could get snagged on their surroundings. As a result, I developed my own style of sayamaki that is both quickly deployed, streamlined, and visually pleasing. I've used it for wraps on hilts, scabbards, cane and staff grips and for carrying litterally over 200 feet of cordage in a very condensed state on many occasions. Why I brought this up? Simple. Samurai and ashigaru would most likely use knots they knew inside and out, and could probibly tie blindfolded, knots that would allow them to keep their gear in easily deployable situations while possibly having built in secondary purpouses. Each of these knots most likely would be useful in their own way, and be unique to the bushi unless it was a technique passed down in a form of familial knowledge ( kinda like how European sailors taught people knotwork, only on a household level).
In the late 90s I was thrilled I could buy swords online. They were utter junk, but my friend & I were bashing them together so it didn't matter. Early 2000s when I started doing my own katana builds it was so I could have a custom 1-of-a-kind colors & designs. At first I was just repairing wraps that had come undone while using junky $20 swords off ebay, then I started buying better carbon steel blades and parts made out of iron and brass and not zinc. When I got more into it and there was more information available online, I went to a lot of work educating myself on how to do everything "correctly," but in studying pics of samurai from different eras, found out there were all sorts of ways the sword cord was attached. I didn't like the neat, perfect knot because they're not very functional. I was constantly picking up my katana when it fell out of my belt & I thought, this _can't_ be how they walked around. It just doesn't work. So I just made my own ways of tying the sageo, for function. I don't practice at a dojo or even leave my own yard with my katana so no one was there to tell me I was right or wrong. My favorite way of tying it is with a few criss-crosses more as a grip than anything, and leave some hanging so I could do loose wraps around my belt, with the ends a bit longer and hanging down. It doesn't fall off but you can get it off quickly if you need to, and had a little bulk to it so that if the sword did fall on the ground it would protect the handle a bit like a bumper. And I like soft round cord over flat, because I saw a lot of that in old pictures.
Hey guys, as Antony mentions feel free to come over and join my official discord if you have not already. You can find a link to it on my channels home page! Additionally, as Antony suggested, please go give SengokuStudies a follow as well! th-cam.com/channels/hR8wq53Yb0c65sy4BGH9Mw.html
Yes, Anthony strikes again.... Me and my friend was talking about this exactly, and bam, you give us the vid. I love the jokes at the beginning.... And yes iv experienced the BKA as well 😂
Makes sense that a nice knot, when you're in your best bub and tucker would be appropriate, as you're probably going to take your sword out of your obi and put it on a stand somewhere or have a picture took, so again a nice knot would look better!? Where as when you're traveling or around town you may secure your sword in your Obi for more practical reasons. Makes sense
wow thinking that sageo card have done the right way of tie it kenjutsu all training in but i do have samurai sword all the knot are right even it display but bokken sword saya i keep that same and that pleather saya made on my own but i got ide of that saya from dude was heavy into samurai life he make saya for his bokken and i like how he was do and ask his and watch some his video
Even in today's modern practice of kenjutsu or iaido, there is no uniformity as to how the sageo is worn. It isn't even consistent within the same school and boils down to who your teacher was. You will see some simply drape the cord over their saya once it is in their obi. Some bring the loose end up and tuck it under the hakama himo on either their right or left side. Some combine by draping it over the saya and then tucking the loose end under the hakama himo (binds the saya in the obi in my opinion). Other schools tie the sageo in a specific manner around the saya what looks like a modified presentation knot. I have never seen a real kenjutsu or iaido practitioner use their katana with the typical presentation knot with the multiple loops you see in all the modern pictures. Tying the sageo to yourself essentially prevents you from removing the saya without doing a complex series of maneuvers that would telegraph your intentions to an opponent. There are techniques where this comes into play in kenjutsu styles, not so much in iaido practice. #224
Thank you for sharing! I wanted to ask if you could make a video more in-depth of the training Spear and how to tie the rope around it and do the knots please! Thank you! :-)
Am I missing something? I was told that the usage for the sageo cord was two fold, one was that is was used to keep the kimono out of the way during combat/practice - ie the sleeves out of the way and secured to the back. The second was to catch opponents arms when unarmed and secure ie tie up prisoners. It's like what you are talking about has no bearing on what I was told! Was what I was told by a master of batto jutsu wrong?
@@AntonyCummins Thank goodness for that! I was really worried that what I heard was wrong. The guy I heard it from is amazing at batto jutsu he practices with students from other disciplines, in particular Kendo to find new ways to beat them especially at the cross guard.
@@AntonyCummins you had a kenneth Williams joke and i got him confused with the actor Nicholas Courtney from the old Dr.Who. Sorry,lol. It was still funny,lol
when i look at the sageo i see a spare lace for wrapping the hilt, and the complex knot is just the blacksmith's limited warranty because its deliberately a pain in the ass to retie. are there examples of the hilt being wrapped in something other than odoshi lace?
i think you might have something there, but it's likely the variety we see in the ways it was worn/carried comes down to utilitarianism. example: in some of the photos one or two of the men are holding cords that are loosely bundled or just hanging. i'd be interested to know what these men exactly did/what their lords had them in charge of. the spare handle cord as you suggest could also be used to tie back your kimono sleeves before battle/duel/etc. and when working with your hands, or in the case of these high ranked gentlemen, i'm curious if any of them were in charge of or part of their lords security/police/guard contingent, in which case they might leave it untied so it can be used in hojojutsu as an entanglement tool for apprehending criminals. and yeah the complicated knot pattern we're all familiar with was likely almost exactly what you said, the scabbard maker tied a decorative presentation knot on it to bind the spare cord to the scabbard in a pretty way. it likely wouldn't be in that knot if it was being used regularly, but if a man who had his weapon displayed and needed to grab it in a pinch, it's still a good knot for keeping the scabbard seated in the obi, the knotwork gives a good surface to grip for the fingers on drawing and fits the hand nice if you have to use the scabbard as a secondary defensive weapon(IE in lieu of a wakizashi). however i doubt it was a limited warrantee situation in like a 1 to 1 comparison, i would imagine most samurai would know some variant of decorative knot either specifically for the sword, or something they would do with other knotwork, like the knotwork on yoroi armor or the knotwork on japanese horse saddles and fittings, etc., etc., so it was more than likely a "let's make make sure this new sword for the master looks extra shiny and glistening and dipped in butter. he might come back again for a naginata for the wife if he likes it!" kinda deal
Big Question: Even if there was no uniformity between Samurai on how tie the Sageo...how did Shinobi disguise their longer Sageo? If a sword cord was ever checked/glanced at intra-province check points was there a way to disguise the unusual extra length? After all the long sageo schtick seem to appear in multiple shinobi sources. If it was so prevalent it must have been something unusual to look out for when trying to detect spies.
Even if the longer sageo thing for shinobi were real, it would not matter much probably. With no standardization, a longer sageo could simply be explained as personal preference. And there is some idea to suggest that sageao tended to be longer back in the day anyhow than the modern standard. Samurai would use the sageo for a number of things, or least possibly would, so having one long enough to be capable of doing all that would not seem so out of place.
@@AntonyCummins Would a shinobi use their Kaginawa rather than their Sageo for the sword probe or the sword as foot-stool skills? Conversely was the Sageo ever attached to a grappling hook?
@@SengokuStudies plus with hojojutsu being a thing among both certain sword schools and earlier guard/police tactics, the longer sageo likely WAS a personal preference that a checkpoint guard would see as being not too uncommon.
Anthony how do feel about these instagram martial artist spamming the word ninja an actually have the nerve to call themselves ninja i feel they dont kno the weight that title comes with an its hilarious
Even though I've been healing my inner self. I still can't help but think those speaking like they have a sinus infection deserve a flying elbow LoL. 😁
![[Watch Party] RoV Pro League 2024 Winter | ( Bacon Time Vs PSG )](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/zM25REvnJW4/mqdefault.jpg)
Thank you so much for the shout out. Sengoku Period certainly would have seen things be a matter of personal taste and wealth. Cloth costs money, so even something as seemingly unimportant as sageo length could be determined by your wealth. It may not have been used as an obvious marker of that, but richer could afford longer sageo. As in the video, standardization probably started in the Edo Period, or possibly under Hideyoshi. Although they were typically more concerned with blade legth so ther emay not have been any government decree about sageo, but rather social conventions, school, and regional preferences, ect... As to when the standard length that often comes with swords today came around, that I am not sure about. It could have been post-WWII when arts like kendo and iaido had to undergo a lot of changes in order to get permission from the occupational forces to be practiced again. Since swords were made to conform to those then perhaps that is why the standard sageo is used in many koryu schools. However, there are koryu schools that have different lengths of sageo, tie them in different ways, and some that do not use them at all. This is one of those topics whose answers might mostly be "it depends."
No problem Scott I hope people come over and see your work.
That depiction of an arrogant English samurai is now how I will see William Adams. Thank you.
My Iaijutsu instructor just say's "the Samurai just tucked it out the way, or tied it how they liked."
I agree.
Top of the morning- oops I’m mean afternoon to you. At least it is in my neck of the woods. I always look forward to seeing your show. Always something to learn. Thanks 🙏
When I was first learning how to tie sayamaki knots, I found that the vast majority were simply for pageantry purpouses, and svery few were for actual combat usage. Essentially, I noticed 3 things about both styles.
1: they try to use bight ( solidly affixed) knots with bends ( loops of cord) through them to act as a marline spike hitch system.
2: they almost always were never easy to tie or be swiftly deployed in times of emergency.
3: both styles of knots used never fully dressed or utilized the full extent of the cords, always having excess shown that could get snagged on their surroundings.
As a result, I developed my own style of sayamaki that is both quickly deployed, streamlined, and visually pleasing. I've used it for wraps on hilts, scabbards, cane and staff grips and for carrying litterally over 200 feet of cordage in a very condensed state on many occasions. Why I brought this up? Simple. Samurai and ashigaru would most likely use knots they knew inside and out, and could probibly tie blindfolded, knots that would allow them to keep their gear in easily deployable situations while possibly having built in secondary purpouses. Each of these knots most likely would be useful in their own way, and be unique to the bushi unless it was a technique passed down in a form of familial knowledge ( kinda like how European sailors taught people knotwork, only on a household level).
In the late 90s I was thrilled I could buy swords online. They were utter junk, but my friend & I were bashing them together so it didn't matter. Early 2000s when I started doing my own katana builds it was so I could have a custom 1-of-a-kind colors & designs. At first I was just repairing wraps that had come undone while using junky $20 swords off ebay, then I started buying better carbon steel blades and parts made out of iron and brass and not zinc. When I got more into it and there was more information available online, I went to a lot of work educating myself on how to do everything "correctly," but in studying pics of samurai from different eras, found out there were all sorts of ways the sword cord was attached. I didn't like the neat, perfect knot because they're not very functional. I was constantly picking up my katana when it fell out of my belt & I thought, this _can't_ be how they walked around. It just doesn't work. So I just made my own ways of tying the sageo, for function. I don't practice at a dojo or even leave my own yard with my katana so no one was there to tell me I was right or wrong. My favorite way of tying it is with a few criss-crosses more as a grip than anything, and leave some hanging so I could do loose wraps around my belt, with the ends a bit longer and hanging down. It doesn't fall off but you can get it off quickly if you need to, and had a little bulk to it so that if the sword did fall on the ground it would protect the handle a bit like a bumper. And I like soft round cord over flat, because I saw a lot of that in old pictures.
Hey guys, as Antony mentions feel free to come over and join my official discord if you have not already. You can find a link to it on my channels home page! Additionally, as Antony suggested, please go give SengokuStudies a follow as well! th-cam.com/channels/hR8wq53Yb0c65sy4BGH9Mw.html
I’m trying to pin this but it’s not showing up
Yes, Anthony strikes again.... Me and my friend was talking about this exactly, and bam, you give us the vid.
I love the jokes at the beginning.... And yes iv experienced the BKA as well 😂
Makes sense that a nice knot, when you're in your best bub and tucker would be appropriate, as you're probably going to take your sword out of your obi and put it on a stand somewhere or have a picture took, so again a nice knot would look better!?
Where as when you're traveling or around town you may secure your sword in your Obi for more practical reasons. Makes sense
Hear commenting helps the ol algo, so thanks for all your video's. They are a big help.
Brilliant. Love these videos.
Thank you very much again for the info 👍
Fascinating!! Thank you the info.
Hilarious intro my Man! We have all met those stuffy know-it-all types. Keep em coming!
wow thinking that sageo card have done the right way of tie it kenjutsu all training in but i do have samurai sword all the knot are right even it display but bokken sword saya i keep that same and that pleather saya made on my own but i got ide of that saya from dude was heavy into samurai life he make saya for his bokken and i like how he was do and ask his and watch some his video
Even in today's modern practice of kenjutsu or iaido, there is no uniformity as to how the sageo is worn. It isn't even consistent within the same school and boils down to who your teacher was. You will see some simply drape the cord over their saya once it is in their obi. Some bring the loose end up and tuck it under the hakama himo on either their right or left side. Some combine by draping it over the saya and then tucking the loose end under the hakama himo (binds the saya in the obi in my opinion). Other schools tie the sageo in a specific manner around the saya what looks like a modified presentation knot. I have never seen a real kenjutsu or iaido practitioner use their katana with the typical presentation knot with the multiple loops you see in all the modern pictures. Tying the sageo to yourself essentially prevents you from removing the saya without doing a complex series of maneuvers that would telegraph your intentions to an opponent. There are techniques where this comes into play in kenjutsu styles, not so much in iaido practice.
#224
Glad you liked the video Scott keep up the training
Aslo i was hype when u collabwith storydrive an then the shogunate
2 of my other favorite channels other then u
Me too it was great
Awesome video as always!
I'm here based on a fellow TH-camr recommending you ... and what you say here makes e think I should subscribe. Subscribed.
Thank you for sharing! I wanted to ask if you could make a video more in-depth of the training Spear and how to tie the rope around it and do the knots please! Thank you! :-)
I will have a look
@@AntonyCummins thank you sir I really want to make one of these! :-) when I do I will post a video of to show you :-)
Am I missing something? I was told that the usage for the sageo cord was two fold, one was that is was used to keep the kimono out of the way during combat/practice - ie the sleeves out of the way and secured to the back. The second was to catch opponents arms when unarmed and secure ie tie up prisoners. It's like what you are talking about has no bearing on what I was told! Was what I was told by a master of batto jutsu wrong?
There are loads of things it is used for in documents about ten I have found. What you were told is correct
@@AntonyCummins Thank goodness for that! I was really worried that what I heard was wrong. The guy I heard it from is amazing at batto jutsu he practices with students from other disciplines, in particular Kendo to find new ways to beat them especially at the cross guard.
The english samurai at it again ⚡😜🇺🇸
I had to go back to this video for reference. Was that a clip of the Brigadier from Dr.Who? Lol
I’ve not seen that video in so long
@@AntonyCummins you had a kenneth Williams joke and i got him confused with the actor Nicholas Courtney from the old Dr.Who. Sorry,lol. It was still funny,lol
What was its TYPICAL function?
Many functions so no one seems to be main
when i look at the sageo i see a spare lace for wrapping the hilt, and the complex knot is just the blacksmith's limited warranty because its deliberately a pain in the ass to retie.
are there examples of the hilt being wrapped in something other than odoshi lace?
i think you might have something there, but it's likely the variety we see in the ways it was worn/carried comes down to utilitarianism.
example: in some of the photos one or two of the men are holding cords that are loosely bundled or just hanging. i'd be interested to know what these men exactly did/what their lords had them in charge of. the spare handle cord as you suggest could also be used to tie back your kimono sleeves before battle/duel/etc. and when working with your hands, or in the case of these high ranked gentlemen, i'm curious if any of them were in charge of or part of their lords security/police/guard contingent, in which case they might leave it untied so it can be used in hojojutsu as an entanglement tool for apprehending criminals.
and yeah the complicated knot pattern we're all familiar with was likely almost exactly what you said, the scabbard maker tied a decorative presentation knot on it to bind the spare cord to the scabbard in a pretty way. it likely wouldn't be in that knot if it was being used regularly, but if a man who had his weapon displayed and needed to grab it in a pinch, it's still a good knot for keeping the scabbard seated in the obi, the knotwork gives a good surface to grip for the fingers on drawing and fits the hand nice if you have to use the scabbard as a secondary defensive weapon(IE in lieu of a wakizashi).
however i doubt it was a limited warrantee situation in like a 1 to 1 comparison, i would imagine most samurai would know some variant of decorative knot either specifically for the sword, or something they would do with other knotwork, like the knotwork on yoroi armor or the knotwork on japanese horse saddles and fittings, etc., etc., so it was more than likely a "let's make make sure this new sword for the master looks extra shiny and glistening and dipped in butter. he might come back again for a naginata for the wife if he likes it!" kinda deal
@@gourdguru the warranty part was a joke
In one scroll it says use plant vines when cord is worn out
Big Question: Even if there was no uniformity between Samurai on how tie the Sageo...how did Shinobi disguise their longer Sageo? If a sword cord was ever checked/glanced at intra-province check points was there a way to disguise the unusual extra length? After all the long sageo schtick seem to appear in multiple shinobi sources. If it was so prevalent it must have been something unusual to look out for when trying to detect spies.
Even if the longer sageo thing for shinobi were real, it would not matter much probably. With no standardization, a longer sageo could simply be explained as personal preference. And there is some idea to suggest that sageao tended to be longer back in the day anyhow than the modern standard. Samurai would use the sageo for a number of things, or least possibly would, so having one long enough to be capable of doing all that would not seem so out of place.
I agree with Scott above. The lengths all seem to be different and also shinobi use their Kaginawa instead of sageo.
@@AntonyCummins Would a shinobi use their Kaginawa rather than their Sageo for the sword probe or the sword as foot-stool skills? Conversely was the Sageo ever attached to a grappling hook?
@@SengokuStudies plus with hojojutsu being a thing among both certain sword schools and earlier guard/police tactics, the longer sageo likely WAS a personal preference that a checkpoint guard would see as being not too uncommon.
Can I give this video 800 likes? It needs it
Yes please
Anthony how do feel about these instagram martial artist spamming the word ninja an actually have the nerve to call themselves ninja i feel they dont kno the weight that title comes with an its hilarious
They should send traffic my way
@@AntonyCummins i kno right
Even though I've been healing my inner self. I still can't help but think those speaking like they have a sinus infection deserve a flying elbow LoL. 😁