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Contrary to what is said very dismissively by Starkey here, it's widely believed that Henry VI actually suffered from schizophrenia. Indeed, he seized up for around a year and was completely unresponsive, which is consistent with catatonic schizophrenia. This appears to have been inherited from his mother, Catherine of Valois, who had similar mental health problems and died young. His great grandmother is also said to have had similar problems. Henry VI became detached from reality at various times. At one point, he believed he was made of glass and denied he had a wife or children. Henry's naternal grandfather, Charles VI of France also suffered from mental illness, often becoming agitated and violent.
.. what a Living Treasure you are, David Starkey ... a brilliant star in God's Heaven of Oratory ... clear brilliance so beloved we love to hear ... deep intuitive sociological perception of the truth of the matters of history are thus presented ... we all pause to be seated at the feet of the Master ... so it is now ... & so it will be in Kingdom to come ...there is something eternal here ... at once 'now' & in the Classics Hall of Fame ...
I like Starkey alot but as he gets older he's go some pretty clear biases that he has alot of trouble seperating from history. Like a sports fan goin on about how Thier fav player and team are the best and everyone else is a pleb so nyah.
He is allowed his opinion. Free speech should apply across the board, not just when it's politically correct. I don't find his comments particularly upsetting. Those that lack an education seem to forget that at some point in history most nations and or ethnicity have had good points and bad points. IE nazi Germany had rabbid anti sematism but England had it in1290s
@@CasperScott-qq6ip I'm not really sure that was especially relevant to the point that was made? There's a time and a place for everything. I'm not sure many people go to history lectures to hear someone rant like that. It makes him look histrionic and undermines his credibility. He sometimes gives the impression that he can't seem to see things except through the prism of his own predictions, and that we're all desperate to hear it.
A little surprising that Henry VII took so long to continue work on King's College, given that he wanted Henry VI canonised. Or was he more focused on his own chapel at Westminster Abbey which may have been intended to house Henry's relics?
I love lectures like this. I had no idea England had universities prior to the 15th century. Here in the Philippines, the first graduating class of Santo Tomas University was 1611. I knew France had older institutions, but not England.
Imagine a God that looks down and thinks "This man paid a whole lot of people to pray for him, so I'm going to elevate him from purgatory into heaven much faster".
It seems so ridiculous now, I'll grant you, but it was more complicated than that. Starkey doesnt go into it thouroughly enough to explain the whole idea. It's not so much about paying for the prayers as it is about actively getting rid of wealth. The whole idea is based on Jesus saying it's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven. They also believed that the way out of purgatory was through charitas: the reciprical love between you and humanity. That's where good works and almsgiving come in. You could be a great sinner, but it could be balanced out by your charitas, almost like a Christian version of karma. The money they gave to the chantries didn't exactly "pay for prayers", it actually paid for masses. A large part of the endowment was for the almsgiving as part of the mass. It was supposed to sort of kill two birds with one stone: you got rid of your money, thereby reducing your wealth and making it easier to pass the needle, and through the masses and almsgiving you continued to increase your charitas even after death, thus getting out of purgatory faster. The prayers were seen as proof your fellow men remembered you as a good Christian: more charitas and getting out even faster. They thought the nature of salvation was very transactional. God gave you great earthly material blessings so you could be on the giving side of the equation: "clothe the naked, feed the hungry, shelter the widow and the orphan,"etc. Some were predestined to receive and were therefore poor, and othets to give and therefore rich. The more you attended to this duty, the easier you achieved salvation, but ignoring it meant hell. That's why all seven deadly sins are about taking for yourself. Medieval catholicism really believed in charity and earning your place in heaven. It all got messed up and corrupted in the renaissance with indulgences and paying for pre-forgiveness for sins you might commit. One reason it all seems so ludicrous to us now is because modern England and America were built on Protestant morals,(even as they get less and less religious) so the idea you can earn your way into heaven like that, as opposed to being saved by grace and faith alone, doesn't make sense in our world anymore.
I love this lecture but I think Starkey's a bit hard on Henry VI. Sure his reign resulted in a lot of problems, but it's not all his fault. Kinged at 9 months old, never knowing his father, never growing up in a court with a role model. Then add to that divisions at court amongst his nobles going back to his minority, and mental illness on top of that? I don't think many kings could succeed under those circumstances. One thing we will agree on, and I'm glad he mentioned, was Richard III being the worst. My vote for worst would be Henry VIII, and as an American I'm not too fond of George III myself. Think about it: George III and Henry VI - both insane. Both lost large land holdings of Britain. The similarities are there. The loss of the American colonies, if I were judging from a British point of view, would be much worse than a few counties in France. But that's just my Yankee opinion.
When I lived in Winchester we went to Hospital of St. Cross, and the parish of St. Faith's. The first time I was there, when the collection purse came along, I put in at 20-pound note. The old lady next me asked if was going to take change. I of course said no, since the Episcopal church is funded by the parishioners. Then the Master showed me around their water meadows, and I understood.
@@IamDarthMuller What I was referring to was the fact that the church there, as in medieval times, relied on its land holdings for money. This of course was not the American experience. The Hospital of St. Cross was a retirement community of worthy men of limited means. It was founded by Henri of Blois, William the Conquers nephew. He was the Bishop of Winchester. The time was 1100 AD. The head of St. Cross was called the Master. He also ministered to the church there, which was called St. Faith's. To this day, they still rely on massive land holdings to fund their operations. They also hold a fete. This is a fundraising event to raise money for charitable operations. I often ran the coconut shy. Great fun. Hope that helps.
The flagellatory characteristics of Henry VII are not dissimilar to those of the Mayan Rulers who not only scarified themselves in extraordinary rituals but had humble priest-servants to point out the rulers’ precariousness.
A secular scholar, Starkey is limited in perception to the outer trappings of the belief in Purgatory. The Medieval period saw the development of something that already had an organic presence in Hebrew religion and early Catholicism.
Here is something strange. I saw a reconstruction of Henry viii and Richard iii. They look a like. Richard had the reddish hair. I am thnking that Henry's vii son looked like his wife's uncle. That must have freaked him out, since Henry vii killed Richard.
Cambridge University Press, Darwin's theory of evolution, the discovery of the electron, the splitting of the atom to name just a few wonders of learning, thanks to Cambridge University. Thank you Henry VI. Never knew much about him. Thank you David.
Extremely interesting.. the acquired wealth of the Diocese later transfered into the secular municipal corporation via its probate jurisdiction, would be a discussion worth having.. if it does not make you a blackballed dissident.
It's always a delight to listen to Starkey's lectures but the one comment he made on Purgatory really shows he's not a religious scholar (not that he's claimed to be one). I'd just prefer to attribute it to his acerbic humour.
Our college was named after saints like St. Regis. So the college was to ask the saints to pray for the students. Our colleges were founded by Jesuit musdionaries. Even the local state school has an old catholic church which they use as a chapel. It has a patron. I live inwhat was once new Spain and now is the 🇺🇸. I dont think the eastern schools are like this. Schools like Havard and Yale are probably like the English school.
I thought that was in bad taste as well, especially considering historians pretty much agree Henry VI suffered schizophrenia, just like his grandfather.
I thought it was gross too.. Henry vi may well have had autism looking at his relationships and how he interacted with others, he probably had schizophrenia too. Mocking mental illness isnt cool even in a long dead king because many people continue to live with it.
Please join the David Starkey Members' Club via Patreon www.patreon.com/davidstarkeytalks or Subscribestar www.subscribestar.com/david-starkey-talks and submit questions for members Q & A videos. Also visit www.davidstarkey.com to make a donation and visit the channel store shop.davidstarkey.com. Thank you for watching.
Just FYI, no guarantee that the Starkman will answer your question as I found out 😭
Contrary to what is said very dismissively by Starkey here, it's widely believed that Henry VI actually suffered from schizophrenia. Indeed, he seized up for around a year and was completely unresponsive, which is consistent with catatonic schizophrenia. This appears to have been inherited from his mother, Catherine of Valois, who had similar mental health problems and died young. His great grandmother is also said to have had similar problems. Henry VI became detached from reality at various times. At one point, he believed he was made of glass and denied he had a wife or children. Henry's naternal grandfather, Charles VI of France also suffered from mental illness, often becoming agitated and violent.
David Starkey is a legend
@@augustbliss what's yah mean.?
@Dominic Lane, he’s a Rock Star.
David Starkey is a legend are you serious? He’s a homophobic racist piece of shit human being.
It’s incredible how much I learn from every one of Dr. Starkey’s talks. Now I want to see Cambridge and Oxford more than ever.
They're both beautiful cities 🏴
Love David Starkey ! Absolute wealth of knowledge
.. what a Living Treasure you are, David Starkey ... a brilliant star in God's Heaven of Oratory ... clear brilliance so beloved we love to hear ... deep intuitive sociological perception of the truth of the matters of history are thus presented ... we all pause to be seated at the feet of the Master ... so it is now ... & so it will be in Kingdom to come ...there is something eternal here ... at once 'now' & in the Classics Hall of Fame ...
I feel bad for Henry VI, his dad died when he was young and lived in his dad’s shadow.
Isn’t that just normal life?! 😂
Not in this case, he wasn't Aziz from the corner shop😂
Not to mention his battle with what was likely schizophrenia.
Fascinating. Really enjoyed this talk.
I like Starkey alot but as he gets older he's go some pretty clear biases that he has alot of trouble seperating from history. Like a sports fan goin on about how Thier fav player and team are the best and everyone else is a pleb so nyah.
He is allowed his opinion. Free speech should apply across the board, not just when it's politically correct. I don't find his comments particularly upsetting. Those that lack an education seem to forget that at some point in history most nations and or ethnicity have had good points and bad points. IE nazi Germany had rabbid anti sematism but England had it in1290s
Yes and everything has become 'extra-ordinary'!
@@CasperScott-qq6ip I'm not really sure that was especially relevant to the point that was made? There's a time and a place for everything. I'm not sure many people go to history lectures to hear someone rant like that. It makes him look histrionic and undermines his credibility. He sometimes gives the impression that he can't seem to see things except through the prism of his own predictions, and that we're all desperate to hear it.
A little surprising that Henry VII took so long to continue work on King's College, given that he wanted Henry VI canonised. Or was he more focused on his own chapel at Westminster Abbey which may have been intended to house Henry's relics?
I love lectures like this. I had no idea England had universities prior to the 15th century. Here in the Philippines, the first graduating class of Santo Tomas University was 1611. I knew France had older institutions, but not England.
Imagine a God that looks down and thinks "This man paid a whole lot of people to pray for him, so I'm going to elevate him from purgatory into heaven much faster".
It seems so ridiculous now, I'll grant you, but it was more complicated than that. Starkey doesnt go into it thouroughly enough to explain the whole idea. It's not so much about paying for the prayers as it is about actively getting rid of wealth. The whole idea is based on Jesus saying it's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than a rich man to get into heaven. They also believed that the way out of purgatory was through charitas: the reciprical love between you and humanity. That's where good works and almsgiving come in. You could be a great sinner, but it could be balanced out by your charitas, almost like a Christian version of karma. The money they gave to the chantries didn't exactly "pay for prayers", it actually paid for masses. A large part of the endowment was for the almsgiving as part of the mass. It was supposed to sort of kill two birds with one stone: you got rid of your money, thereby reducing your wealth and making it easier to pass the needle, and through the masses and almsgiving you continued to increase your charitas even after death, thus getting out of purgatory faster. The prayers were seen as proof your fellow men remembered you as a good Christian: more charitas and getting out even faster. They thought the nature of salvation was very transactional. God gave you great earthly material blessings so you could be on the giving side of the equation: "clothe the naked, feed the hungry, shelter the widow and the orphan,"etc. Some were predestined to receive and were therefore poor, and othets to give and therefore rich. The more you attended to this duty, the easier you achieved salvation, but ignoring it meant hell. That's why all seven deadly sins are about taking for yourself. Medieval catholicism really believed in charity and earning your place in heaven. It all got messed up and corrupted in the renaissance with indulgences and paying for pre-forgiveness for sins you might commit. One reason it all seems so ludicrous to us now is because modern England and America were built on Protestant morals,(even as they get less and less religious) so the idea you can earn your way into heaven like that, as opposed to being saved by grace and faith alone, doesn't make sense in our world anymore.
I love this lecture but I think Starkey's a bit hard on Henry VI. Sure his reign resulted in a lot of problems, but it's not all his fault. Kinged at 9 months old, never knowing his father, never growing up in a court with a role model. Then add to that divisions at court amongst his nobles going back to his minority, and mental illness on top of that? I don't think many kings could succeed under those circumstances. One thing we will agree on, and I'm glad he mentioned, was Richard III being the worst. My vote for worst would be Henry VIII, and as an American I'm not too fond of George III myself. Think about it: George III and Henry VI - both insane. Both lost large land holdings of Britain. The similarities are there. The loss of the American colonies, if I were judging from a British point of view, would be much worse than a few counties in France. But that's just my Yankee opinion.
This Yankee has long advocated the US rejoining the UK under the terms under which we left it, a three-cent tax per pound of dry tea.
When I lived in Winchester we went to Hospital of St. Cross, and the parish of St. Faith's. The first time I was there, when the collection purse came along, I put in at 20-pound note. The old lady next me asked if was going to take change. I of course said no, since the Episcopal church is funded by the parishioners. Then the Master showed me around their water meadows, and I understood.
i don’t understand (not trolling)
@@IamDarthMuller What I was referring to was the fact that the church there, as in medieval times, relied on its land holdings for money. This of course was not the American experience. The Hospital of St. Cross was a retirement community of worthy men of limited means. It was founded by Henri of Blois, William the Conquers nephew. He was the Bishop of Winchester. The time was 1100 AD. The head of St. Cross was called the Master. He also ministered to the church there, which was called St. Faith's. To this day, they still rely on massive land holdings to fund their operations. They also hold a fete. This is a fundraising event to raise money for charitable operations. I often ran the coconut shy. Great fun. Hope that helps.
I would really like to know where, and to whom, these lectures are given. I do appreciate that the lecture date is posted.
I think he is speaking to the Worshipful Company of Barbers at Barbers Surgeons Hall in the City of London.
The flagellatory characteristics of Henry VII are not dissimilar to those of the Mayan Rulers who not only scarified themselves in extraordinary rituals but had humble priest-servants to point out the rulers’ precariousness.
A secular scholar, Starkey is limited in perception to the outer trappings of the belief in Purgatory. The Medieval period saw the development of something that already had an organic presence in Hebrew religion and early Catholicism.
Where is purgatory mentioned in Hebrew writings let alone the Bible
Here is something strange. I saw a reconstruction of Henry viii and Richard iii. They look a like. Richard had the reddish hair. I am thnking that Henry's vii son looked like his wife's uncle. That must have freaked him out, since Henry vii killed Richard.
Why can I like this only once?
Cambridge University Press, Darwin's theory of evolution, the discovery of the electron, the splitting of the atom to name just a few wonders of learning, thanks to Cambridge University. Thank you Henry VI. Never knew much about him. Thank you David.
It doesn’t say anywhere in the bible that girls can marry at 12. I believe that was Jewish tradition.
Extremely interesting.. the acquired wealth of the Diocese later transfered into the secular municipal corporation via its probate jurisdiction, would be a discussion worth having.. if it does not make you a blackballed dissident.
Just awesome. Thank you!
Love the Starkey.
Brilliant
Excellent! Brilliant!
That's a really odd-looking podium. When the camera is in close-up on him it looks like he's in a courtroom witness stand made for hand puppets.
So, if Henry VI hadn't performed posthumous miracles, King's College wouldn't have been finished? Not a very Protestant way of looking at it.
What a story! And we are left with England's greatest building.
I didn’t know that Edward III was the first king of York? I thought he was a Plantagenet.
He mispoke; he obviously meant Edward IV.
The Yorkists and Lancastrians were both branches of the Plantagenets.
@@Tawny6702 That’s right, and the first Plantagenet king was Henry II.
It's always a delight to listen to Starkey's lectures but the one comment he made on Purgatory really shows he's not a religious scholar (not that he's claimed to be one). I'd just prefer to attribute it to his acerbic humour.
Can't watch live because I don't have a tv license!!!🇬🇧
why dont you watch it anyway !
Can’t see the big BBC detector van, out on a Saturday evening. Go for it.
Don’t answer the door.😀😀😀
Not having a TV is liberating.
It's not live, it's a premiere
@@RichMitch that counts as live for the purpose of the TV licence. Live in the legislation is defined as watching a programme as it is broadcast.
Our college was named after saints like St. Regis. So the college was to ask the saints to pray for the students. Our colleges were founded by Jesuit musdionaries. Even the local state school has an old catholic church which they use as a chapel. It has a patron. I live inwhat was once new Spain and now is the 🇺🇸. I dont think the eastern schools are like this. Schools like Havard and Yale are probably like the English school.
Awesome
What's with the lectern ? Looks more like a Gent's Toilet
Cubicle ..!
A fantastic talk apart from the Neanderthal joke about autism!
The digs at Islam were pretty cringe
I thought that was in bad taste as well, especially considering historians pretty much agree Henry VI suffered schizophrenia, just like his grandfather.
I took it as a dig at the recent fashion of finding autism everywhere.
@@ralphl7643 Yes it was very much the flippant remark of a Daily Mail reading dinosaur!
I thought it was gross too.. Henry vi may well have had autism looking at his relationships and how he interacted with others, he probably had schizophrenia too. Mocking mental illness isnt cool even in a long dead king because many people continue to live with it.
my lord...
There is a Biblical basis for Purgatory (CCC1030-31) what are you talking about?
Not original scripture.
Not for Anglicans: see 39 Articles number 22 😁
Henry VI was a scholar...
He is so hard to listen to nowadays