The advance stats are interesting. I agree with Phil, it matters for organization as in team construction or player prospecting. Also could useful for monitoring a player's health or approach. However, i don't use to much advance stats except for WAR and possible milestones. Buttons gets the last word lol.
Something I found interesting; 2004 Topps Traded has the OPS stat on the back. Not sure when they started to include it on Topps cards but it was a lot earlier than I thought.
I’m a sabermetric nerd and like them for research purposes. I tend to use them for more on prospects then already established players. And if the numbers tell me that this prospect is doing something that hasn’t gotten a lot of attention. Then I’ll buy some of their cards. But that’s just what I do. It’s definitely a hit or miss
Cool - that’s great to hear! Do you like the idea of 3 shorter ones (20-25 minutes) instead of 2 longer ones (45 minutes+)? We’d love your feedback. Thanks for watching!
Thank you for pointing out Pujols being shorted on his MVP’s. The problem Pujols had was that he was so good so early, that he got boring. He peaked in his second season and just continued to be consistent until the move to LA. Players like Howard were given MVP’s for their career years, even though they didn’t always beat out Pujols in terms of head to head numbers. The writers like to see something or somebody NEW.
Chris here - I think you’re onto something here. Lots of MVP’s went to guys with better narratives rather than the better seasons. (Rizzuto over Ted Williams?!?!) Plenty of awards could do with a re-vote! Thanks for watching!
@@chrisc4264 Kobe was great no doubt, but which year are you thinking he got robbed? And as far as Jordan, I would argue he fell victim to the “narrative prejudice” earlier in his career AND later. He led the league in win shares FOUR straight seasons in the late 80s winning MVP just once in that stretch as Magic Johnson (my favorite player at the time) took home the other three as the leader of the Showtime Lakers. Also, he should have won it in 93 (led league in WS again) when the media gave it to Charles Barkley, sort of a Career Achievement award combined with Jordan voter fatigue. Ditto to all the above in 1997 when Karl Malone was named MVP.
Love watching you guys, and a topic dear to my heart. There’s a very good reason why Vlad’s launch angle is so low. Same with Soto. This could be changed with some adjustments, which I’d recommend for Vlad, but I’d leave Soto alone and re-address as the years go on. My hope is that the league starts to value, again, batting average, speed, and OBP (especially OBP). I find the game more interesting to both coach and watch when the ball is in play and fielders are having to execute. Just one guys opine. Great job guys! EJ
RsBI I believe 😎. The advanced stats we have are the best ever for trying to predict future performance based on the physics of prior events. The traditional stats are excellent at showing prior true outcomes especially as it related to day to day wins and losses. WAR is the best ever for attempting to calculate overall value over sample size time. What will never be mitigated is the role of random chance which will always be high
A recent sale of a rare Tim Lincecum card had some folks debating his worth in the hobby. Someone threw his career 19.5 WAR out there as an exclamation point, he’s not worth it. Totally missing his white-hot peak, super 4-5 year span (4 top 10 Cy voting) his part in 3 championships, the 2 no hitters he got well after his peak and finally, just the personality and meaning he has to those in the bay area and how he is beloved. Like most things, advanced stats (WAR, wOBA, wRC, Exit Velo, etc) are part of the equation, but certainly not the final answer. Sometimes you have to watch the games and not the change in players' baseball reference pages. (Which, I realize, you all get.)
Chris here - as a collector who followed that Lincecum auction very closely, I completely agree with you. He was a huge star in the game! Cy youngs, 3 rings and probably the most dominant postseason start I’ve ever seen when he absolutely dominated Atlanta with 14 K’s. Hobby live canny be equated with stats like WAR or really any stats. Certain players mean more to fan bases than stats can ever show. Especially when multiple championships are part of the conversation. Ask Yankee fans about rare Bernie Williams cards. I love that Lincecum card, BTW and if you haven’t seen bumgarner’s 2014 Topps Chrome variation, Google it asap and add it to your want lists! Thanks for watching and commenting!
Very well-said. And this particular -- extremely rare -- Timmy card checked the boxes for a lot of collectors besides just Lincecum fans including SSP set collectors, rare card collectors, Giants fans, etc.
I REALLY THINK THAT IF BONDS’ HAD THIS INFO TRACKED, IT WOULD SHOW HE HAD ONE OF THE SHORTEST SWINGS, FROM WHAT I REMEMBER IT ALWAYS LOOKED LIKE HE WAS SWINGING A 30” BAT (VERY SHORT), IT SEEMED LIKE HE SWUNG A BARREL INSTEAD OF A BAT, BCUZ NEARLY EVERY PITCH SEEMED LIKE HE BARRELED…
Chris here - yes! Very short, very quick swing. I remember he homered off Smoltz in a playoff game and the tv crew slowed it down to see when bonds started swinging and it was insane how long he waited on a 98 MPH inside fastball.
Another great show. Thanks guys. Does anyone else think the triple crown stats should b changed to runs batting avg and hrs instead of rbi or rbis lol. Since runs scored r a much better Stat than rbi
I’ll ask here too since yall just posted. Do you all think Flagship SSP’s from Topps and Topps update in 2022 are good to target for rookies that year? Seems like print runs went up with them
Chris here - based on PSA pop reports, seems like the print runs are similar to 2018 update rookies (Ohtani, Acuna, Soto) and those are doing ok. The images for Julio and Witt are also both really good, so that should definitely keep the cards in the spotlight.
Just like saying RBIs is the grammatically correct way to say it, your SSP example is also because of grammar rules; you use "an" before a vowel sound at the beginning of an acronym like SSP - "ess, ess, pee."
I think more information is always better for the game and for collectors. It does concern me that some people don’t care about batting average at all. A player like Kyle Schwarber is a perfect example. Dude hit like 197 and lead the league in strikeouts last year. That is absolutely terrible, yet some advanced analytics say he was a valuable player.
Chris here - Schwarber is tough to watch sometimes. Over the course of the season, he gets on base at decent clip - .343 last year - but the K’s are awful. So many at bats with runners at third wasted. And he’s streaky too. Makes no sense to hit him leadoff. Seems like a 6 hitter to me.
@@SpitballinCards that’s my thoughts exactly. A lead off guy hitting 200 with a massive amount of strikeouts. I get that he walks a lot. I guess I just yearn for the older days when a 240 hitter was one of the worst starters on a team, not one of the better players. lol
As a person who doesn’t look at advance stats at all not because I’m against them but because idk what they mean 😂 I just don’t want players in the future when they are up for HOF voting to not make it because of woba or whatever Scottie says or because of not enough barrels even if they had 400+ HRs and 3k hits. I do like WAR but I don’t like that different websites say different things I think y’all mentioned it before that I Slavy had 30 WAR on one website and 15 WAR on another so depending on what website a voter uses he won’t make it lol I just collect machado so advance stats doesn’t affect my collecting he’s already the GOAT of 3rd base sorry for the long essay 😂 btw it RBIs!!!
Chris here - I’d hate to think a deserving player would be held out because their WAR was too low. It seems more likely that WAR could help a player who’s been ignored gain momentum - like Rolen. 400 HR and 3,000 hits should be enough for anybody (and yes, I’m thinking of Freddie Freeman specifically!)
RBIs is right. Bully Scott into going back. 😛 Ty is right. You’re not pluralizing “in”. Think of it this way. Saying one RBI is correct. But expanding it and saying one runs batted in with the “s” is not. It would be one run batted in. RBI stands for run batted in and therefore needs the “s” at the end when talking about more than one.
@@SpitballinCards You are correct that you’d say runs batted in. I’m not arguing that. But if you only had one, it’d be a run batted in, not runs. And RBI has to stand for something - either run batted in or runs batted in. And, given that you NEED a shorthand version of a singular run batted in, that has to be what an RBI is. So, if someone has more than one, it then becomes “runs batted in” if you’re saying the complete phrase OR RBIs if you are pluralizing the shorthand. Just like you can have one POW or two POWs. Just like Iraq had one WMD or a bunch of WMDs. (Bad example, since there were no WMDs… but you get my point.)
![โรงเรียนตอนตี 2 โคตรหลอน..!! [โรงเรียนไดเม่]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/2MAEMwqVYh8/mqdefault.jpg)
I just wanna throw it out there that I appreciate Phil’s passion for deep diving into analytics.
Chris here - Phil is always deep diving into something!
Thanks for watching!
Heck yeah, that’s why Phil gets the big bucks! Thanks for watching!
Ditto that's my Guy!
Sassy Scotty is back!!
RBIs. Ty for the win! 😄 Great to hear the talk on advanced stats.
Thanks for watching!
The advance stats are interesting. I agree with Phil, it matters for organization as in team construction or player prospecting. Also could useful for monitoring a player's health or approach. However, i don't use to much advance stats except for WAR and possible milestones. Buttons gets the last word lol.
Chris here - haha always let the dogs decide!
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Something I found interesting; 2004 Topps Traded has the OPS stat on the back. Not sure when they started to include it on Topps cards but it was a lot earlier than I thought.
😮 That’s shocking to me! Thanks for commenting!
That does seem early for topps to use the stat!
Thanks for the info!
I’m a sabermetric nerd and like them for research purposes. I tend to use them for more on prospects then already established players.
And if the numbers tell me that this prospect is doing something that hasn’t gotten a lot of attention. Then I’ll buy some of their cards. But that’s just what I do. It’s definitely a hit or miss
What’s your expected whiff rate ?
Thanks for commenting - and love the name!
Chris here - sounds like a great use of the additional information
Really enjoying having several eps a week!!
Cool - that’s great to hear!
Do you like the idea of 3 shorter ones (20-25 minutes) instead of 2 longer ones (45 minutes+)?
We’d love your feedback.
Thanks for watching!
@@SpitballinCardsI absolutely love anything you do haha tbh… but yes if I had to pick I’d say 3 instead of 2 is more exciting for me
And from what I’ve heard about TH-cam, shorter and more frequent videos are better for the algorithm so that’s probably the best to reach more people.
@@bensweetra4871 thanks a lot! Really appreciate the responses
I was very fortunate to train under an MLB scout has been my go to in player evaluation
😮
Chris here - Alan, who was it?
@@SpitballinCards Ben Wiltbank
Fantastic episode. You guys kill it every time.
Thank you!
And thanks for watching!
🍻🍻
Appreciate the support! 👍🏼
Thank you for pointing out Pujols being shorted on his MVP’s. The problem Pujols had was that he was so good so early, that he got boring. He peaked in his second season and just continued to be consistent until the move to LA. Players like Howard were given MVP’s for their career years, even though they didn’t always beat out Pujols in terms of head to head numbers. The writers like to see something or somebody NEW.
Chris here - I think you’re onto something here. Lots of MVP’s went to guys with better narratives rather than the better seasons. (Rizzuto over Ted Williams?!?!)
Plenty of awards could do with a re-vote!
Thanks for watching!
Exactly right. Happens to the greats in every sport - voters just want the shiny new thing. Thanks for watching!
They didn't do it to Jordan in basketball but Kobe sure got shorted at least 1 MVP award.
@@chrisc4264 who won it instead?
@@chrisc4264 Kobe was great no doubt, but which year are you thinking he got robbed? And as far as Jordan, I would argue he fell victim to the “narrative prejudice” earlier in his career AND later. He led the league in win shares FOUR straight seasons in the late 80s winning MVP just once in that stretch as Magic Johnson (my favorite player at the time) took home the other three as the leader of the Showtime Lakers.
Also, he should have won it in 93 (led league in WS again) when the media gave it to Charles Barkley, sort of a Career Achievement award combined with Jordan voter fatigue. Ditto to all the above in 1997 when Karl Malone was named MVP.
Soto certainly is different. Barry Bonds and Ted Williams different.
Chris here - I have to agree. Whoever signs him is going to be building a statue in 20 years.
Totally agree.
Scotty Buttons …when I visit the MLB HOF I stay at the Runs Batted Inn
🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️🤦🏻♂️
😂
Love watching you guys, and a topic dear to my heart. There’s a very good reason why Vlad’s launch angle is so low. Same with Soto. This could be changed with some adjustments, which I’d recommend for Vlad, but I’d leave Soto alone and re-address as the years go on. My hope is that the league starts to value, again, batting average, speed, and OBP (especially OBP). I find the game more interesting to both coach and watch when the ball is in play and fielders are having to execute. Just one guys opine.
Great job guys!
EJ
Thanks for watching and commenting -- wish we could get you in front of Vlad to help out with the launch angle issue!
RsBI I believe 😎.
The advanced stats we have are the best ever for trying to predict future performance based on the physics of prior events.
The traditional stats are excellent at showing prior true outcomes especially as it related to day to day wins and losses.
WAR is the best ever for attempting to calculate overall value over sample size time.
What will never be mitigated is the role of random chance which will always be high
A recent sale of a rare Tim Lincecum card had some folks debating his worth in the hobby. Someone threw his career 19.5 WAR out there as an exclamation point, he’s not worth it. Totally missing his white-hot peak, super 4-5 year span (4 top 10 Cy voting) his part in 3 championships, the 2 no hitters he got well after his peak and finally, just the personality and meaning he has to those in the bay area and how he is beloved. Like most things, advanced stats (WAR, wOBA, wRC, Exit Velo, etc) are part of the equation, but certainly not the final answer. Sometimes you have to watch the games and not the change in players' baseball reference pages. (Which, I realize, you all get.)
Chris here - as a collector who followed that Lincecum auction very closely, I completely agree with you. He was a huge star in the game! Cy youngs, 3 rings and probably the most dominant postseason start I’ve ever seen when he absolutely dominated Atlanta with 14 K’s.
Hobby live canny be equated with stats like WAR or really any stats. Certain players mean more to fan bases than stats can ever show.
Especially when multiple championships are part of the conversation.
Ask Yankee fans about rare Bernie Williams cards.
I love that Lincecum card, BTW and if you haven’t seen bumgarner’s 2014 Topps Chrome variation, Google it asap and add it to your want lists!
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Very well-said. And this particular -- extremely rare -- Timmy card checked the boxes for a lot of collectors besides just Lincecum fans including SSP set collectors, rare card collectors, Giants fans, etc.
Giants Tied it in 9th. Took lead in the 10th. Bailey just added another RBI in 10th
Giants are on fire! And Edwin Diaz suddenly seems very very hittable.
I REALLY THINK THAT IF BONDS’ HAD THIS INFO TRACKED, IT WOULD SHOW HE HAD ONE OF THE SHORTEST SWINGS, FROM WHAT I REMEMBER IT ALWAYS LOOKED LIKE HE WAS SWINGING A 30” BAT (VERY SHORT), IT SEEMED LIKE HE SWUNG A BARREL INSTEAD OF A BAT, BCUZ NEARLY EVERY PITCH SEEMED LIKE HE BARRELED…
Chris here - yes! Very short, very quick swing. I remember he homered off Smoltz in a playoff game and the tv crew slowed it down to see when bonds started swinging and it was insane how long he waited on a 98 MPH inside fastball.
💯
Love the royals hat, Scottie!
Chris here - he’s a Rockies fan, so he’s looking for another franchise to adopt.
Another great show. Thanks guys. Does anyone else think the triple crown stats should b changed to runs batting avg and hrs instead of rbi or rbis lol. Since runs scored r a much better Stat than rbi
OPS, SB, and WAR maybe
Or OPS, OBP, SLG
Or WAR, OBP, SLG
A good question! And thanks for watching!
I’ll ask here too since yall just posted. Do you all think Flagship SSP’s from Topps and Topps update in 2022 are good to target for rookies that year? Seems like print runs went up with them
Chris here - based on PSA pop reports, seems like the print runs are similar to 2018 update rookies (Ohtani, Acuna, Soto) and those are doing ok.
The images for Julio and Witt are also both really good, so that should definitely keep the cards in the spotlight.
It seems weird that they can't go back in time and track bat speed.
I say RBI but I don't think it matters. I also say, "It's an SSP" but that doesn't make sense when you unpack it to "It's an super short print."
Just like saying RBIs is the grammatically correct way to say it, your SSP example is also because of grammar rules; you use "an" before a vowel sound at the beginning of an acronym like SSP - "ess, ess, pee."
Giants 5 runs home in the 10th. F yeah!!
👏👏👏👏👏
I think more information is always better for the game and for collectors. It does concern me that some people don’t care about batting average at all. A player like Kyle Schwarber is a perfect example. Dude hit like 197 and lead the league in strikeouts last year. That is absolutely terrible, yet some advanced analytics say he was a valuable player.
Chris here - Schwarber is tough to watch sometimes. Over the course of the season, he gets on base at decent clip - .343 last year - but the K’s are awful. So many at bats with runners at third wasted. And he’s streaky too.
Makes no sense to hit him leadoff. Seems like a 6 hitter to me.
@@SpitballinCards that’s my thoughts exactly. A lead off guy hitting 200 with a massive amount of strikeouts. I get that he walks a lot. I guess I just yearn for the older days when a 240 hitter was one of the worst starters on a team, not one of the better players. lol
@@ryanra44 even when he walks he kind of clogs the bases ahead of a guy like turner and prevents him from running much at all!
As a person who doesn’t look at advance stats at all not because I’m against them but because idk what they mean 😂 I just don’t want players in the future when they are up for HOF voting to not make it because of woba or whatever Scottie says or because of not enough barrels even if they had 400+ HRs and 3k hits. I do like WAR but I don’t like that different websites say different things I think y’all mentioned it before that I Slavy had 30 WAR on one website and 15 WAR on another so depending on what website a voter uses he won’t make it lol I just collect machado so advance stats doesn’t affect my collecting he’s already the GOAT of 3rd base sorry for the long essay 😂 btw it RBIs!!!
Machado! Let’s go, would love to see him get hot!
Chris here - I’d hate to think a deserving player would be held out because their WAR was too low. It seems more likely that WAR could help a player who’s been ignored gain momentum - like Rolen.
400 HR and 3,000 hits should be enough for anybody (and yes, I’m thinking of Freddie Freeman specifically!)
I'm with T Pott,, what was Barry Bonds bat speed? If Soto is 82 mph, I gotta thinks Bonds was 115 mph. LOL
At minimum!
Off the charts!
Probably somewhere around Mark Bellhorn and Junior Spivey
RBIs is right. Bully Scott into going back. 😛
Ty is right. You’re not pluralizing “in”.
Think of it this way. Saying one RBI is correct. But expanding it and saying one runs batted in with the “s” is not. It would be one run batted in. RBI stands for run batted in and therefore needs the “s” at the end when talking about more than one.
Chris here - I have to disagree here.
You’d say 10 Runs Batted In.
I just see RBI.
No need for a little s
@@SpitballinCards Now pluralize the abbreviation for Super Short Print!
Jeff here: right with you. RBIs all day. A lot of folks call them "ribbies" -- imagine saying that "Soto has 100 ribbie."??
@@SpitballinCards You are correct that you’d say runs batted in. I’m not arguing that. But if you only had one, it’d be a run batted in, not runs. And RBI has to stand for something - either run batted in or runs batted in. And, given that you NEED a shorthand version of a singular run batted in, that has to be what an RBI is. So, if someone has more than one, it then becomes “runs batted in” if you’re saying the complete phrase OR RBIs if you are pluralizing the shorthand. Just like you can have one POW or two POWs. Just like Iraq had one WMD or a bunch of WMDs. (Bad example, since there were no WMDs… but you get my point.)
@@Blabbin_Bout_SlabbinJeff, you are now officially known as the smart one. Spot on.
Yeah a little, they're numbered to /300.... jk
😂😂😂
Well played.
LOLZ
Does Scottie B have a KC hat on????
Chris here - he sure does. As a long suffering Rockies fan, I think he’s shopping for a new franchise to get behind.
Long overdo.
I say RBIs but seems like RBI is probably right 😂
Chris here - this is exactly right.
RBIs
Chris here - Verbally, yes. But in writing???
Basketball is a joke nowadays...lebron would have got his ass kicked in the 80's-90s...jordan is the goat...hands down...
Jordan was another level to be sure. Loved watching him play, even though he always DESTROYED my Bucks.
Chris here - 90’s basketball I remember!
Yes Jordan is the GOAT
It should be RsBI (which is dumb)
1 RBI. 2 RBIs
Chris here - I disagree.
It’s would be 2 Runs Batted In.
2 RBI
No s.
Jeff here: RBIs all day. It's absolutely the grammatically correct way to say it/write it.
@@SpitballinCards Chris, I’m guessing you don’t use the Oxford comma either. 😬
@@paper_and_chrome oh I am a firm believer in the Oxford comma! #grammar
RBIs lol😅
Chris here - the “s” is redundant. Looks weird. Gotta go!
Blabbin "Especially when ur trying to compare players in the Steroid era" (Literally just reviewed a 50+ HR Ortiz season. LOL
🥱
Chris here - drink some coffee and keep going!