Sounding great, Dave. I've converted my R0, my R6, my ES 335 and CS 61 SG to Four Uncles Bridges now. Aside from installing your PUPS, I feel this is the best tone mod I've made to my guitars. It truly is like a blanket was covering the amp and now it's gone. Unbelievable sustain and guitars stay in tune better. Keep up the good work! Looking forward to your book.
I don't have your stuff, but my ears alone have determined you to be the most knowledgeable PAF and burst specialist in the world. So glad you will be posthumously releasing your data and discoveries. Your a true treasure and i salute you. I have among a handful of Gibson Les Pauls a Chibson and the acoustic projection from the Chibson blows the others out of the water. How is that even possible? Wish I could send it to you for examination. I know, they are a blasphemy but I tried it and can't put it down, my Gibsons are gathering dust since I got it . Of course I changed all pickups and electronics top to bottom. If I can ever afford your stuff I'd love to see what such an acoustically resonant guitar could do souped up with the uncles Bridge your pickups and full recipe of electronics. Thanks my friend, seriously appreciate and respect your work. I salute you !
Thanks for all the time and work invested in this. Thank you also for documenting and preserving your work for the future. I got lucky a year ago and got one of your 2021 61hd sets off reverb and they went into my prized 74 les paul standard. Yes i know it's a pancake model but when I bought it in the 70's it blew away 20 different les pauls of all ages. I have never been privileged enough to play a 50's to early 60's guitar. I did not think I could make it better but your pickups did.
I bought one of those in '70, the LP Deluxe. Frankly it was just an awful guitar, took the minis out and hacked a larger hole for a new Gibson bucker set, and it sounded even worse, but Gibson was using 300K pots which for buckers is just a bad thing. Also bought an SG a year later or earlier and no love for that one either. I guess its the luck of the draw, or maybe they sounded better after years of aging, but anyway thanks for the comment and glad you were able to find a set of mine out there. I've pretty much stopped taking orders anymore, I have too many old orders to fulfill and don't want to add to the pile, so am just selling one off NOS wire sets periodically to stay alive.
@@SDPickups I bought it used in 1977 . It had factory installed t tops. They weren't making les pauls supposedly in 1974 but they did most like mine were tobacco bursts. I was lucky enough to find a store that had over 25 les pauls in stock. I told the salesman I wanted a les paul I did not care about color or model just how it sounded. He plugged me into a 100 watt plexi stack and brought me every one he had and everyone in the store who was putting up with me going at agreed on the 74. I later got a 68 custom in trade for a strat and I hated the custom compared to my standard. I guess I got lucky. Fyi I also upgraded the harness and hardware and also use the jupiter caps. Are you still selling the 4 brothers abr1 bridge and saddles?
It looks like the luthier is almost done refretting my 72 Deluxe. It will be nice to have my Kalimazoo Norlin with mini hums back! No holy grail but I really like it, especially the neck profile.
Nice to see you alive and productive! That classic sounded great with your mods, harness and either set of pickups you demoed. I hope to hear the part 2 with your 57's!
This is a really cool video. Just as you have been lucky to have been able to study them for the past 20 years, I feel very lucky to be living in the same era as you now. May you be well for many years, Mr. Stephens. 🙂
DAVE,,,,,, YOU LOOK GREAT! HEALTHY! SENDING MY 60' PAFS, RIGHTA MONTH BEFORE I SELL EM' SO, YOU HAVE TIME WITH THEM...SOON!....WATCHING NOW! BTW, MINE ARE 6.74 NECK, AND 8.04 BRIDGE, OR VERY CLOSE TO THAT....
Looking forward to doing a video on them. I have a set of early Patents coming this week too, they might be real PAF's because they are gold covers and have philips bobbin mount screws so, highly likely they are PAF's too. Both are dead though, so might not be able to save the wire.
Great work, Dave! I love your "all in" passion and attention to detail for the best tone. The first sound sample sounds fuller and louder to my ears. The notes you played using the bottom E string (E to G to E) was the most revealing tone. To my ears, that one lick had some of the Jimmy Page growl I love. So, I think (and hope) the first set is your pickup, the second set is the PAF. Both sound wonderful!
The first set is mine, second are the '59 PAF's. The first set bridge has a higher wind, so that gives it more warmth than the 7.6K PAF's. Thanks for the comment!
Correct. I'm going to do a part two of this video because people are equating treble and clarity with PAF's, which is true for the most part, but the BB bridge is 8.3K and the PAF bridge is 7.6K, so its a huge difference and not a fair comparison. Higher winds will always sound darker. I forgot I have my 57 replicas that are almost the same winds as the PAFs are, and even though its in my Flying V those sound much closer to the PAF's. Probably should have thought this out a little better but I have to have the PAF's back to the customer on monday.
WAIT NOW THAT I LISTENED TO THE 2ND SAMPLE, YOUR BLACK BEAUTY SET HAS THE HARMONICS.....OVER THE PAF....YOU GOT ME AGAIN! LOL SO, IM GONNA SAY THE 2ND ONES ARE YOURS, AND THERE BETTER THEN THE REAL ONES HAHAHA ITS AMAZING....
But the comparison is between 7.6K PAFS vs. 8.3K BB bridge so low winds will always be more clear and brighter. I knew that comparing the two sets was going to confuse people despite me pointing out the huge difference in amount of wire. So, yes the PAF's are second, but I did try to point out the big difference in clarity between high wind replicas low wind PAF's. I don't make any low wind sets because modern wire can't compete with vintage wire.
Hey Stephen!! How are you? Do you remember me? This is John Lee in Seoul, Korea. You had asked me to find a factory that made wires the old fashion way. a long ago. My friend here wanted me to translate this video and had the opportunity to see you live for the firt time. Glad to see you are doing well and kicking!! ^^
YES, I remember you! HELLO! Yeah, I was never able to get that company to understand me, but I think they had already modernized their factory anyway, so I dont think they were still making that old style wire. I still have alot of the original ten pound spools of their wire. I just found out China is starting to make plain enamel wire, ordered some to test, but doubt its any different than whats made in the USA now. Good to hear from you!
Correct, second one is the PAF's. But its a mistake to go by which is more clear, because the PAF's are only 7.6K, the BB bridge is 8.3K, so the PAF's are always going to be brighter and more clear than the 8.3K bridge. I'd have to make a set with both 7.6K replicas, but then thats not true to form, because we're compaing vintage wire with modern wire, and the old wire is always going to have the edge on clarity. I figured someone was going to not quite understand that.
@@SDPickups what if the 8.3 was lower from the strings? The difference in pole/pup heights I’ve tinkered with could get close to bridging the gap between the two. They’re really really close and both sound great. The giveaway for me was a bit of sizzle on the top of the distortion tones, which could be adjusted out with the amp, different tubes heck maybe a cable swap even, but personally I dislike that and so it stands out to my ear. And I’m using AirPods after TH-cam compressed the signal to shit anyway.
Hi Dave! My preference for tone is the Black Beautys , at 33:00 on the test audio. I own a set from you, bought around 2017, unsure of their name or number. Sent to Stockholm, Sweden. Wondering if you keep records of each sale. Hope you see this and remember a set sent to Sweden, as we talked through emails at that time. My name is Roger. Don't remember any paperwork that followed with this set, and interested if you remember this. We spoke thru emails. Hope you see this. Thanks anyway, great pups.
Hi Roger, great to see you again! Yes I do keep records, you bought a set in 2015!!! Seems like yesterday. Unfortunately I didn't write down WHAT you got. Maybe I can find it in old emails. It should be written down on the bottom of your pickups? Thanks for the comments.
Firstly, I was going to comment on your playing chops. Nice! Sorry all I have to offer is a lame 4-letter word. Your playing deserves more dignified compliments. But I think it's more important at the moment to respect your integrity and generosity in your rewinds.
I'm not an outstanding guitar player, I can't copy historic solos except easy stuff. I do know how to show off my work, using great amps and Greenbacks like Clapton used on the Beano album (as confirmed by Mick Grabham who has friends who were THERE. So, yeah I get trolls who hate my playing, LOL. Funny one really nasty guy said I sucked really bad, so I went to his channel and all he badly played was drop tuning heavy metal with horrible tone, LOL. I was never in a band that lasted more than a couple weeks. Singer's ego's broke the bands up every time. The best playing I was able to do was during my attendance at the Duff's Garage blues jams in Portland. The hosts were fantastic recording players, they inspired me to dump all my pedals and play straight thru a good amp. I had a Blues Junior at the time, liked it ok, but listening to them playing vintage Fender amps blew me away and eventually bought a '73 Deluxe Reverb with a blown speaker. Got it cheap, and later also got a Princeton Reverb and Vibroluxe Reverb both from '73 too. Never went back to pedals, though keep all the ones I bought from '70 and onwards. I try them now and then and they just take things away rather than improve anything at all.....
The Belden NOS wire set is $2650, includes matched harness and my best covers and full switch wiring which is where the most capacitance in the harness is. Many Gibsons have the cheap high capacitance wire in their harnesses. If you are subscribed you'll be notified when I have the next set of them ready to sell. Not taking orders for them though. There's a limited amount of that wire left, the price will be raised the closer to the end of it comes along.
Microphonics just come from the covers from there being an air gap between the slugs and top of the cover. If you play really really LOUD, sometimes the coils can vibrate and feed back if they're not wound tight enough. PAF's don't do that because the old wire is stiff and doesn't vibrate.
Well, I'm 73 now, I stay masked because Covid is NOT gone. Am dealing with bad cataracts, I don't ever drive at night and seldom in daytime. Getting old is always full of medical problems. Sucks.
@@SDPickups I remember you mentioned skin issues in the past and I want to say right before Covid hit & the new world order. I'm 61 next month and my Gf of 30+ years is 72...she went to Woodstock.....we are Pennsylvania. You are looking healthy in this video and I hear you on age......I have bumps in the road too.
P90's are pickups I LOVE, but seldom get calls for. Go listen to Michael Bloomfield, his P90 LP sounds nearly identical to his PAF equipped LP. The reason is that all the metal parts are the same parts used in PAF's, except the pole spacing is a tiny bit different. The magnet wire is the same stuff, magnets are the same, except during the Korean War, alinco 3 was used, because Cobalt was a "war mineral," and not available commercially during those years. A3 did NOT get used in PAF's later on. Pole screws the same story. Amount of wire the same amount, 10,000 total winds on PAF and P90's. Go listen to Sean Costello's P90 gold top. I did a video a few short months ago of my replica LP Special with P90's, I dont remember what version P90 those were but they're using all the right stuff etc. I played one of those back in '68 and it blew my socks off, so thats why I had this replica made, also had the baseball neck done same as the vintage one I played. I have some wire I'm using now on the Blind Audio Poll with a prototype bridge, that wire would KILL in a P90 but am too busy to make a set for now. Will sooner than later.....
@@SDPickups Thank you for all that info. I was curious because someone gave me a P90 in 1988 he estimated was from about 1952. I'll skip some rambling to (try to) keep this short(er). 20+ years later I discovered the winding was open. Someone rewound it for me at no charge for the opportunity to observe the winding details. He let me know the bobbin had a problem (the pole screws were loose in the threads and something else).He said the pole spacing was unlike anything he had seen and didn't have one like it. So he finished the rewind and shipped it back to me. I contacted Pete Biltoft and he had me send a photo of it lying next to a steel rule with a fine scale. He said the pole spacing was weird. Also weird was that the cover matches. So I sent it to him this week to figure out what he can identify in person. It may need another bobbin made to match. We'll see. I am still not sure where I would use it but am considering having it rebuilt to whatever period it was from. I recently bought a single P90 late 40's guitar someone had sold the original pickup from and replaced with a Duncan Antiquity. They had sold all the removeable parts and replaced them with aftermarket stuff. Since all that obscenity was already committed, it's no more obscene to consider putting a restored early 50's one on it. The guy who gave it to me decades ago had worked for a museum doing instrument restorations and Gibson allowed him access to the Kalamazoo factory if he ever needed any odd tools. So it's anyone's guess where it came from. He had so much stuff he didn't remember, and he is no longer with us. So all that typing just brings me to the question of whether uneven pole spacing is a clue you recognize...an instrument that had such a phenomenon, or who knows, maybe a very early one? I just read P13's came in two different spacings, for lap steels and regular guitars. But uneven doesn't seem to be a useful feature! Thanks for reading. I'll let you know if there were any other clues inside when I get an assessment.
@@murrayatuptown353 Too bad it was rewound. Guys almost always HAND WIND rewinds, guranteeing it'll never sound right. Hand winding kills off some of the treble response, so a rewound P90 hand wound in neck position will always be muddy. The short pole spacing is from one or two archtop models, I forgot which guitar it was, but its well known and I even have a bobbin off one with short pole spacing. If he unwound it and counted turns he would have seen it was machine wound and every turn is identical. I have a unique P90 from the 1940's, and the bobbins were made of pickguard material with laminated black and white layers. Pretty cool and its super bright and clear as it should be. Rewinding also is sad because vintage magnet wire sounds better than any modern wire does. If you look carefully at the bobbin you'll see a couple round injection mold marks that show the regular spacing which is wider. The short spacing was done by drilling instead of making a separate mold.
@@SDPickups This was identified upon inspection as having standard spacing so somehow a bad camera angle or optical distortion in the photo I sent was misleading. Measurements were made from the photo so the photo was wrong.
@@SDPickups the original winding was open. I had so some run it thru an inspection X-ray machine long ago, but there was nothing visible...too many layers and not enough resolution.
Second one are the PAF's. Most are saying that, but most dont understand that brightness and clarity are LESS in higher wound pickups, so its not a great judgement call just because they are more clear. Both PAF's low wind 7.6K and the BB bridge is 8.3K . I did try hard to point out the BB set is NOT a clone of the Zebra set, I just used them because they WERE a clone of the double white set from a couple years ago, so its just showing the voices of both are very very close. You can watch the original video here th-cam.com/video/r17XQ3Vj02Q/w-d-xo.html
Um no, lol. The Kindle book needs editing and spell checking etc. then has to be formatted for Kindle which I dont know how to do yet. The other PAF White Paper, will only ever be seen because I'll be DEAD ;-) It tells how to make what I make and the entire history of PAF manufacturing and WHY they sound the way they do, as well as all my processes and methods. If I was still alive it would put me out of business :-)
Nobody shared anything with me, sorry. All the knowledge I have came from the pickups themselves, no other source. I did have help from the laboratories in metallurgy and magnet wire labs from the parts I sent to them. They aren't guitar players. The knowledge I have took 20 years of hard ass WORK, and alot of dead ends. My job is not to give away what I learned to lazy people who just won't do any work of their own. Those sources were nice people who did the work for free and were just as interested as I was, so it was their gain of knowledge as well. Most pickup guys don't do anything more than buy commercial parts that are all wrong, throw some wire on them and the customer gets nothing special. They don't really even understand pickup design, the parts they use are offshore designed parts, if you use those parts, everyone who makes them, they all sound the same. I hear that from customers a LOT. Pretty sad....
@@SDPickups Nice wall of words. I didn’t say you should make videos, showing all you learned. You admitted, you had a mentor. Who do you mentor? You should be old enough to understand; when we share knowledge, innovation increases.
@@whyis45stillalive You didn't read what I posted. My MENTORS were the sales manager at MWS magnet wire company and the mentor in the giant steel company, German owned here in the USA. They aren't guitar players. They are experts in manufacturing magnet wire and the steel company man was a senior Ferro-magnetics alloys ENGINEER. He ran my vintage PAF parts thru their big laboratory and helped me that way for 6 years, and gave me quite an education. Those guys are high paid geniuses. Not only that I sent him parts from a 40 year time span of gibson pickups 1937-1977. The MWS labs analyzed piles of vintage magnet wire from PAF's and P90's and Leo Fender era single coils. AGAIN, THEY ARE NOT GUITAR PLAYERS, THEY ARE NOT EXPERTS IN VINTAGE GUITAR PICKUPS. If I shared any of the results of those two laboratories and the documents they sent of the results, you wouldn't have a clue what any of that DATA means. Do you know what concentricity is? No you don't. You wouldnt understand those readings. Thats only one of the many tests on vintage PE wire we did. They don't know anything about tone, they don't even know what the parts are or where that wire came from. I spent two decades making sense of what the lab data sheets meant, and I had to INVENT methods of trying to make modern materials sound like vintage materials. Do you think Coca Cola is going to tell you how they make Coke's flavoring? Do you think Dumble was going to tell everyone how he modified old Fender amps so they cost a fortune to buy? I've had guys try to bribe me and trick me into giving away 20 years of hard ass, gut busting work so everyone can make what I make. NOT GONNA HAPPEN :-) Have I mentored anyone? Yes, but only basic knowledge you can find on youtube. I'm not giving away hard fought knowledge, it would be suicide for my tiny business. Most people who have never been self employed, have zero understanding of what people like me do, working for yourself is SCARY. No retirement, no pension, you live or die by how good you are. Try it, you might like it.
Sorry, the first set is my own PAF replicas. In another blind audio test, 60% thought my replica PAF's were the real ones. Maybe its because they think PAF's are warm sounding pickups, when they are NOT.
Yes its the second one, but don't forget we're comparing low wind 7.6K PAF's to the 8.3K BB replica bridge, so its not quite that simple. As I pointed out the BB set is NOT a replica of the zebra/double black set, so they are completely different that way. The more wire is used the more the treble diminishes. I'm only comparing the two sets to show that despite the large difference in amount of wire, the voices are very similar. I don't have any sets of mine that would be an exact comparison. BUT with the double white set I mentioned, I DID make an exact clone of the double whites using my methods and processes, so you might want to watch that for a head to head comparison: th-cam.com/video/r17XQ3Vj02Q/w-d-xo.html
@@SDPickups Thanks Dave, yeah the G12H has more punch and girth, to my ears a bit more woody, Hendrix and Page and probably Cream are most associated with them but Beano tone is their predecessor speaker before the greenback of course. Have a great day Dave !
@@arfboucher3855 You are mistaken. Beano album WAS GREENBACKS. How do I know? Mick Grabham, the famous Procol Harum guitarist, is a friend, and actually he was responsible for me doing the HD PAF replicas, because I sent him a set that he approved. Had he not approved them, I wouldn't be making what I make now. He has several friends who were at the Beano sessions, who ALL said his amp had the new Greenback speakers in it. He also owns vintage amps with vintage Greenbacks and also has vintage alnico speakers. The Greenbacks were made the year that recording session was done 1965. Not only that but one of those guys said he saw Eric's Vox in the studio as well, and its highly probable that it might have been used on some songs. I have a friend who is an audio engineer in the movie industry, who has been fascinated with that album for years. We collaborated over several years on decoding how it was recorded. I made pickups for the project and he studied what mikes were probably used, and the recording gear (all tube gear). First of all, if you have never heard the Mobile Fidelity 24KT gold CD made straight from the Master tapes, you have not heard the real deal. It was a MONO album. The STEREO album is overly highly processed and bears no resemblance to the real deal, and both Mayall and Eric hated the stereo version. It was revealed a year or two ago that his amp was so loud it was bleeding into bass and drum microphones, so they PUSHED UP AGAINST THE BACK WALL TO KNOCK DOWN THE SOUND. The speakers may have been up against that wall, nobody has ever pointed that out. Also, the plate reverb they used on several songs has a GAIN knob on its own amplifier, and a volume control. And, Eric used his tone control a LOT, not wide open all the time. You add in that it was recorded on TUBE run machines, on TAPE as well. Beano tone is highly misunderstood. His guitar was a LOT brighter than on that album, the engineers dialed back the EQ for the treble. Overall, its an artificial sound. If you go listen to Eric with Mayall's portable on stage tape recorder, you will hear how his guitar actually sounded. The album is "Primal Solos" and also has other players he used. But here is Eric raw and not altered by engineers: th-cam.com/video/fwd5z7WxzfE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=mwvOEPsCvg6hBJAE
@@SDPickups Wow, thanks Dave, your knowledge is a serious resource, obviously I'm a huge fan of this period as I have always considered it to be the true forebear of all rock tone and the main reason for the Les Paul comeback that continues pretty much to today albeit bastardized to a degree in modern times, it must have been amazing to get detailed accounts of the sessions, I would have questioned him about it till his gums bled ! A vox, eh ? I never played a JMI era one to know it's sound imprint now I'm going to be splitting hairs to hear any clues. I had heard Robert Johnson on gold CD and it blew my head apart, brought the sound quality decades into the future, I could hear his real voice and some real sense of his guitar tone. Beano album would be a fidelity ecstasy I'm sure. Hey did he mention any distance micing ? Those greenbacks got the best advertising a new speaker could get ! As always very informative and substantive talking to you Dave. An education in conversation, big thanks for the link I will find it both exciting and greatly informative, is Jack Bruce in this recording? I'm going to lose it hearing it if he is !! Have an great day Dave !
@@arfboucher3855 Eric's main amp for a long time was his Vox AC30, back with the Yardbirds. Mick was NOT at the sessions, he just told me what his friends who were there told him. The info about the amp being turned into the back wall came from one of the engineers in a youtube last year. His guitar was nothing SPECIAL. It was the same thing as all the others were, and in isolated videos it sounds a bit harsh some times. I don't know who played bass, just look it up, am sure its written down somewhere. The BluesBreakers gold CD can be found on Ebay for around $35, but they are getting hard to find and one guy wants $350 for his. Be sure to GET IT, its the real deal, and was not updated or "remastered," either. Enjoy.
@@SDPickups you got me there Dave...excellent !!! That is to my ears a real 50s sound. Good work!!! Love your passion for old technology. Wish you good luck, Cheers!!!
Whats your best guess? I'm going to do a quickie part two, because people are confused thinking that the brighter ones are the PAF's, which is TRUE the BB's are higher winds so of course they are darker. 7.6K versus 8.3K is a big difference. I have my 57's in my flying V and did quick comparisons with those, since they lower winds like the PAF's are so they are much closer in sound.
Sounding great, Dave. I've converted my R0, my R6, my ES 335 and CS 61 SG to Four Uncles Bridges now. Aside from installing your PUPS, I feel this is the best tone mod I've made to my guitars. It truly is like a blanket was covering the amp and now it's gone. Unbelievable sustain and guitars stay in tune better. Keep up the good work! Looking forward to your book.
Thanks for the kind words. Glad I could turn you into a BELIEVER!
I don't have your stuff, but my ears alone have determined you to be the most knowledgeable PAF and burst specialist in the world. So glad you will be posthumously releasing your data and discoveries. Your a true treasure and i salute you. I have among a handful of Gibson Les Pauls a Chibson and the acoustic projection from the Chibson blows the others out of the water. How is that even possible? Wish I could send it to you for examination. I know, they are a blasphemy but I tried it and can't put it down, my Gibsons are gathering dust since I got it . Of course I changed all pickups and electronics top to bottom. If I can ever afford your stuff I'd love to see what such an acoustically resonant guitar could do souped up with the uncles Bridge your pickups and full recipe of electronics. Thanks my friend, seriously appreciate and respect your work. I salute you !
Thanks for all the time and work invested in this. Thank you also for documenting and preserving your work for the future. I got lucky a year ago and got one of your 2021 61hd sets off reverb and they went into my prized 74 les paul standard. Yes i know it's a pancake model but when I bought it in the 70's it blew away 20 different les pauls of all ages. I have never been privileged enough to play a 50's to early 60's guitar. I did not think I could make it better but your pickups did.
I bought one of those in '70, the LP Deluxe. Frankly it was just an awful guitar, took the minis out and hacked a larger hole for a new Gibson bucker set, and it sounded even worse, but Gibson was using 300K pots which for buckers is just a bad thing. Also bought an SG a year later or earlier and no love for that one either. I guess its the luck of the draw, or maybe they sounded better after years of aging, but anyway thanks for the comment and glad you were able to find a set of mine out there. I've pretty much stopped taking orders anymore, I have too many old orders to fulfill and don't want to add to the pile, so am just selling one off NOS wire sets periodically to stay alive.
@@SDPickups I bought it used in 1977 . It had factory installed t tops. They weren't making les pauls supposedly in 1974 but they did most like mine were tobacco bursts. I was lucky enough to find a store that had over 25 les pauls in stock. I told the salesman I wanted a les paul I did not care about color or model just how it sounded. He plugged me into a 100 watt plexi stack and brought me every one he had and everyone in the store who was putting up with me going at agreed on the 74. I later got a 68 custom in trade for a strat and I hated the custom compared to my standard. I guess I got lucky. Fyi I also upgraded the harness and hardware and also use the jupiter caps. Are you still selling the 4 brothers abr1 bridge and saddles?
It looks like the luthier is almost done refretting my 72 Deluxe. It will be nice to have my Kalimazoo Norlin with mini hums back! No holy grail but I really like it, especially the neck profile.
It looks like my 74 Deluxe refret is complete! The luthier actually left me a voice message yesterday. Now he has to get paid!
Nice to see you alive and productive! That classic sounded great with your mods, harness and either set of pickups you demoed. I hope to hear the part 2 with your 57's!
Working on it! Thanks.
Sensational Demo Dave to my ears 27.29 is the PA F
This is a really cool video. Just as you have been lucky to have been able to study them for the past 20 years, I feel very lucky to be living in the same era as you now. May you be well for many years, Mr. Stephens. 🙂
Thanks so much.
DAVE,,,,,, YOU LOOK GREAT! HEALTHY! SENDING MY 60' PAFS, RIGHTA MONTH BEFORE I SELL EM' SO, YOU HAVE TIME WITH THEM...SOON!....WATCHING NOW! BTW, MINE ARE 6.74 NECK, AND 8.04 BRIDGE, OR VERY CLOSE TO THAT....
Looking forward to doing a video on them. I have a set of early Patents coming this week too, they might be real PAF's because they are gold covers and have philips bobbin mount screws so, highly likely they are PAF's too. Both are dead though, so might not be able to save the wire.
I think the first one was the real PAF, but I'm very uncertain about it. Both sound so good!
Great work, Dave! I love your "all in" passion and attention to detail for the best tone. The first sound sample sounds fuller and louder to my ears. The notes you played using the bottom E string (E to G to E) was the most revealing tone. To my ears, that one lick had some of the Jimmy Page growl I love. So, I think (and hope) the first set is your pickup, the second set is the PAF. Both sound wonderful!
The first set is mine, second are the '59 PAF's. The first set bridge has a higher wind, so that gives it more warmth than the 7.6K PAF's. Thanks for the comment!
Glad to hear the JTM45 is still working well. That was a PITA to get it right again!
Pickups sound great as always too!
I'm not sure which is which, but the second sounded better to me, a bit cleaner and more harmonics?
Correct. I'm going to do a part two of this video because people are equating treble and clarity with PAF's, which is true for the most part, but the BB bridge is 8.3K and the PAF bridge is 7.6K, so its a huge difference and not a fair comparison. Higher winds will always sound darker. I forgot I have my 57 replicas that are almost the same winds as the PAFs are, and even though its in my Flying V those sound much closer to the PAF's. Probably should have thought this out a little better but I have to have the PAF's back to the customer on monday.
@@SDPickups understandable, you have a ton to keep track of, look forward to the next one, thanks for the reply, see you soon!
WAIT NOW THAT I LISTENED TO THE 2ND SAMPLE, YOUR BLACK BEAUTY SET HAS THE HARMONICS.....OVER THE PAF....YOU GOT ME AGAIN! LOL SO, IM GONNA SAY THE 2ND ONES ARE YOURS, AND THERE BETTER THEN THE REAL ONES HAHAHA ITS AMAZING....
Amazing, as always. Happy Easter.
2ND ONES SOUND LIKE MY 1960 PAFS.....THE HARMONICS ARE ALL THERE!!
Second one is real paf. Brighter and clearer in my opinion
But the comparison is between 7.6K PAFS vs. 8.3K BB bridge so low winds will always be more clear and brighter. I knew that comparing the two sets was going to confuse people despite me pointing out the huge difference in amount of wire. So, yes the PAF's are second, but I did try to point out the big difference in clarity between high wind replicas low wind PAF's. I don't make any low wind sets because modern wire can't compete with vintage wire.
Hey Stephen!! How are you? Do you remember me? This is John Lee in Seoul, Korea. You had asked me to find a factory that made wires the old fashion way. a long ago. My friend here wanted me to translate this video and had the opportunity to see you live for the firt time. Glad to see you are doing well and kicking!! ^^
YES, I remember you! HELLO! Yeah, I was never able to get that company to understand me, but I think they had already modernized their factory anyway, so I dont think they were still making that old style wire. I still have alot of the original ten pound spools of their wire. I just found out China is starting to make plain enamel wire, ordered some to test, but doubt its any different than whats made in the USA now. Good to hear from you!
Timestamps to compare more easily. 26:56 vs 27:29
Thanks for doing that.
@@SDPickupsYou're welcome! Thank you!
I really like you Sir ! Love passionate people and you are one , greetings from Quebec !
I definitely suffer from that disease, it gets me in trouble sometimes when people don't want to hear the truth about things. :-)
@@SDPickups I really understand what you're saying !
28:20 second one sounds like the PAF to me.
Correct, second one is the PAF's. But its a mistake to go by which is more clear, because the PAF's are only 7.6K, the BB bridge is 8.3K, so the PAF's are always going to be brighter and more clear than the 8.3K bridge. I'd have to make a set with both 7.6K replicas, but then thats not true to form, because we're compaing vintage wire with modern wire, and the old wire is always going to have the edge on clarity. I figured someone was going to not quite understand that.
@@SDPickups what if the 8.3 was lower from the strings?
The difference in pole/pup heights I’ve tinkered with could get close to bridging the gap between the two. They’re really really close and both sound great. The giveaway for me was a bit of sizzle on the top of the distortion tones, which could be adjusted out with the amp, different tubes heck maybe a cable swap even, but personally I dislike that and so it stands out to my ear. And I’m using AirPods after TH-cam compressed the signal to shit anyway.
Hi Dave! My preference for tone is the Black Beautys , at 33:00 on the test audio. I own a set from you, bought around 2017, unsure of their name or number. Sent to Stockholm, Sweden. Wondering if you keep records of each sale. Hope you see this and remember a set sent to Sweden, as we talked through emails at that time. My name is Roger. Don't remember any paperwork that followed with this set, and interested if you remember this. We spoke thru emails. Hope you see this. Thanks anyway, great pups.
Hi Roger, great to see you again! Yes I do keep records, you bought a set in 2015!!! Seems like yesterday. Unfortunately I didn't write down WHAT you got. Maybe I can find it in old emails. It should be written down on the bottom of your pickups? Thanks for the comments.
Firstly, I was going to comment on your playing chops. Nice! Sorry all I have to offer is a lame 4-letter word. Your playing deserves more dignified compliments. But I think it's more important at the moment to respect your integrity and generosity in your rewinds.
I'm not an outstanding guitar player, I can't copy historic solos except easy stuff. I do know how to show off my work, using great amps and Greenbacks like Clapton used on the Beano album (as confirmed by Mick Grabham who has friends who were THERE. So, yeah I get trolls who hate my playing, LOL. Funny one really nasty guy said I sucked really bad, so I went to his channel and all he badly played was drop tuning heavy metal with horrible tone, LOL. I was never in a band that lasted more than a couple weeks. Singer's ego's broke the bands up every time. The best playing I was able to do was during my attendance at the Duff's Garage blues jams in Portland. The hosts were fantastic recording players, they inspired me to dump all my pedals and play straight thru a good amp. I had a Blues Junior at the time, liked it ok, but listening to them playing vintage Fender amps blew me away and eventually bought a '73 Deluxe Reverb with a blown speaker. Got it cheap, and later also got a Princeton Reverb and Vibroluxe Reverb both from '73 too. Never went back to pedals, though keep all the ones I bought from '70 and onwards. I try them now and then and they just take things away rather than improve anything at all.....
That vintage beldenwirie set at the end sound just perfect! Good job, and how much? Where can I get a set?
The Belden NOS wire set is $2650, includes matched harness and my best covers and full switch wiring which is where the most capacitance in the harness is. Many Gibsons have the cheap high capacitance wire in their harnesses. If you are subscribed you'll be notified when I have the next set of them ready to sell. Not taking orders for them though. There's a limited amount of that wire left, the price will be raised the closer to the end of it comes along.
The 59s sound more microphonic. It is such a buttery tone. When you tap on them do they sound more microphonic than the BBs?
Microphonics just come from the covers from there being an air gap between the slugs and top of the cover. If you play really really LOUD, sometimes the coils can vibrate and feed back if they're not wound tight enough. PAF's don't do that because the old wire is stiff and doesn't vibrate.
@@SDPickups Thank you!
Glad to see you post...How is your health going Post Covid ?
Well, I'm 73 now, I stay masked because Covid is NOT gone. Am dealing with bad cataracts, I don't ever drive at night and seldom in daytime. Getting old is always full of medical problems. Sucks.
@@SDPickups I remember you mentioned skin issues in the past and I want to say right before Covid hit & the new world order. I'm 61 next month and my Gf of 30+ years is 72...she went to Woodstock.....we are Pennsylvania. You are looking healthy in this video and I hear you on age......I have bumps in the road too.
@@SDPickups I'm going to attempt to email you off site......
@@mikecamps7226 My email address is at the very end of the video and most other videos too.
@@SDPickups coconut water.. make it 3 times a week.
And lemon with cloves..it works for so many people .
👍
Have you done any research on P-90's?
Thanks
P90's are pickups I LOVE, but seldom get calls for. Go listen to Michael Bloomfield, his P90 LP sounds nearly identical to his PAF equipped LP. The reason is that all the metal parts are the same parts used in PAF's, except the pole spacing is a tiny bit different. The magnet wire is the same stuff, magnets are the same, except during the Korean War, alinco 3 was used, because Cobalt was a "war mineral," and not available commercially during those years. A3 did NOT get used in PAF's later on. Pole screws the same story. Amount of wire the same amount, 10,000 total winds on PAF and P90's. Go listen to Sean Costello's P90 gold top. I did a video a few short months ago of my replica LP Special with P90's, I dont remember what version P90 those were but they're using all the right stuff etc. I played one of those back in '68 and it blew my socks off, so thats why I had this replica made, also had the baseball neck done same as the vintage one I played. I have some wire I'm using now on the Blind Audio Poll with a prototype bridge, that wire would KILL in a P90 but am too busy to make a set for now. Will sooner than later.....
@@SDPickups Thank you for all that info. I was curious because someone gave me a P90 in 1988 he estimated was from about 1952. I'll skip some rambling to (try to) keep this short(er).
20+ years later I discovered the winding was open. Someone rewound it for me at no charge for the opportunity to observe the winding details. He let me know the bobbin had a problem (the pole screws were loose in the threads and something else).He said the pole spacing was unlike anything he had seen and didn't have one like it. So he finished the rewind and shipped it back to me.
I contacted Pete Biltoft and he had me send a photo of it lying next to a steel rule with a fine scale. He said the pole spacing was weird. Also weird was that the cover matches. So I sent it to him this week to figure out what he can identify in person. It may need another bobbin made to match. We'll see. I am still not sure where I would use it but am considering having it rebuilt to whatever period it was from. I recently bought a single P90 late 40's guitar someone had sold the original pickup from and replaced with a Duncan Antiquity. They had sold all the removeable parts and replaced them with aftermarket stuff. Since all that obscenity was already committed, it's no more obscene to consider putting a restored early 50's one on it.
The guy who gave it to me decades ago had worked for a museum doing instrument restorations and Gibson allowed him access to the Kalamazoo factory if he ever needed any odd tools. So it's anyone's guess where it came from. He had so much stuff he didn't remember, and he is no longer with us.
So all that typing just brings me to the question of whether uneven pole spacing is a clue you recognize...an instrument that had such a phenomenon, or who knows, maybe a very early one?
I just read P13's came in two different spacings, for lap steels and regular guitars. But uneven doesn't seem to be a useful feature!
Thanks for reading. I'll let you know if there were any other clues inside when I get an assessment.
@@murrayatuptown353 Too bad it was rewound. Guys almost always HAND WIND rewinds, guranteeing it'll never sound right. Hand winding kills off some of the treble response, so a rewound P90 hand wound in neck position will always be muddy. The short pole spacing is from one or two archtop models, I forgot which guitar it was, but its well known and I even have a bobbin off one with short pole spacing. If he unwound it and counted turns he would have seen it was machine wound and every turn is identical. I have a unique P90 from the 1940's, and the bobbins were made of pickguard material with laminated black and white layers. Pretty cool and its super bright and clear as it should be. Rewinding also is sad because vintage magnet wire sounds better than any modern wire does. If you look carefully at the bobbin you'll see a couple round injection mold marks that show the regular spacing which is wider. The short spacing was done by drilling instead of making a separate mold.
@@SDPickups This was identified upon inspection as having standard spacing so somehow a bad camera angle or optical distortion in the photo I sent was misleading. Measurements were made from the photo so the photo was wrong.
@@SDPickups the original winding was open. I had so some run it thru an inspection X-ray machine long ago, but there was nothing visible...too many layers and not enough resolution.
Either I missed it somehow…I listened to the end but didn’t see the answer to the original clip question. Which clip was the real PAF???
Second one are the PAF's. Most are saying that, but most dont understand that brightness and clarity are LESS in higher wound pickups, so its not a great judgement call just because they are more clear. Both PAF's low wind 7.6K and the BB bridge is 8.3K . I did try hard to point out the BB set is NOT a clone of the Zebra set, I just used them because they WERE a clone of the double white set from a couple years ago, so its just showing the voices of both are very very close. You can watch the original video here th-cam.com/video/r17XQ3Vj02Q/w-d-xo.html
its nice to see you again! Will you accept pre order of your two books?
Um no, lol. The Kindle book needs editing and spell checking etc. then has to be formatted for Kindle which I dont know how to do yet. The other PAF White Paper, will only ever be seen because I'll be DEAD ;-) It tells how to make what I make and the entire history of PAF manufacturing and WHY they sound the way they do, as well as all my processes and methods. If I was still alive it would put me out of business :-)
@@SDPickups then lets keep you around to sell bridges and the like
Hoarding knowledge, when it was shared with you, tells a lot about what you value.
Nobody shared anything with me, sorry. All the knowledge I have came from the pickups themselves, no other source. I did have help from the laboratories in metallurgy and magnet wire labs from the parts I sent to them. They aren't guitar players. The knowledge I have took 20 years of hard ass WORK, and alot of dead ends. My job is not to give away what I learned to lazy people who just won't do any work of their own. Those sources were nice people who did the work for free and were just as interested as I was, so it was their gain of knowledge as well. Most pickup guys don't do anything more than buy commercial parts that are all wrong, throw some wire on them and the customer gets nothing special. They don't really even understand pickup design, the parts they use are offshore designed parts, if you use those parts, everyone who makes them, they all sound the same. I hear that from customers a LOT. Pretty sad....
@@SDPickups
Nice wall of words. I didn’t say you should make videos, showing all you learned.
You admitted, you had a mentor. Who do you mentor?
You should be old enough to understand; when we share knowledge, innovation increases.
@@whyis45stillalive You didn't read what I posted. My MENTORS were the sales manager at MWS magnet wire company and the mentor in the giant steel company, German owned here in the USA. They aren't guitar players. They are experts in manufacturing magnet wire and the steel company man was a senior Ferro-magnetics alloys ENGINEER. He ran my vintage PAF parts thru their big laboratory and helped me that way for 6 years, and gave me quite an education. Those guys are high paid geniuses. Not only that I sent him parts from a 40 year time span of gibson pickups 1937-1977. The MWS labs analyzed piles of vintage magnet wire from PAF's and P90's and Leo Fender era single coils. AGAIN, THEY ARE NOT GUITAR PLAYERS, THEY ARE NOT EXPERTS IN VINTAGE GUITAR PICKUPS. If I shared any of the results of those two laboratories and the documents they sent of the results, you wouldn't have a clue what any of that DATA means. Do you know what concentricity is? No you don't. You wouldnt understand those readings. Thats only one of the many tests on vintage PE wire we did. They don't know anything about tone, they don't even know what the parts are or where that wire came from. I spent two decades making sense of what the lab data sheets meant, and I had to INVENT methods of trying to make modern materials sound like vintage materials. Do you think Coca Cola is going to tell you how they make Coke's flavoring? Do you think Dumble was going to tell everyone how he modified old Fender amps so they cost a fortune to buy? I've had guys try to bribe me and trick me into giving away 20 years of hard ass, gut busting work so everyone can make what I make. NOT GONNA HAPPEN :-) Have I mentored anyone? Yes, but only basic knowledge you can find on youtube. I'm not giving away hard fought knowledge, it would be suicide for my tiny business. Most people who have never been self employed, have zero understanding of what people like me do, working for yourself is SCARY. No retirement, no pension, you live or die by how good you are. Try it, you might like it.
It definitely was the first one
Sorry, the first set is my own PAF replicas. In another blind audio test, 60% thought my replica PAF's were the real ones. Maybe its because they think PAF's are warm sounding pickups, when they are NOT.
@@SDPickups awesome you make a darn good pickup ... Do you sell them..?
The second clip has “clearer” definition of notes so I’m going to guess it’s the real deal PAF set
Yes its the second one, but don't forget we're comparing low wind 7.6K PAF's to the 8.3K BB replica bridge, so its not quite that simple. As I pointed out the BB set is NOT a replica of the zebra/double black set, so they are completely different that way. The more wire is used the more the treble diminishes. I'm only comparing the two sets to show that despite the large difference in amount of wire, the voices are very similar. I don't have any sets of mine that would be an exact comparison. BUT with the double white set I mentioned, I DID make an exact clone of the double whites using my methods and processes, so you might want to watch that for a head to head comparison: th-cam.com/video/r17XQ3Vj02Q/w-d-xo.html
Hey Dave ! Just a curiosity, are you a G12M or G12H guy or both ?
I didn't realize there was a difference for awhile, but the G12M's are what I'm using. 25 watts.
@@SDPickups Thanks Dave, yeah the G12H has more punch and girth, to my ears a bit more woody, Hendrix and Page and probably Cream are most associated with them but Beano tone is their predecessor speaker before the greenback of course. Have a great day Dave !
@@arfboucher3855 You are mistaken. Beano album WAS GREENBACKS. How do I know? Mick Grabham, the famous Procol Harum guitarist, is a friend, and actually he was responsible for me doing the HD PAF replicas, because I sent him a set that he approved. Had he not approved them, I wouldn't be making what I make now. He has several friends who were at the Beano sessions, who ALL said his amp had the new Greenback speakers in it. He also owns vintage amps with vintage Greenbacks and also has vintage alnico speakers. The Greenbacks were made the year that recording session was done 1965. Not only that but one of those guys said he saw Eric's Vox in the studio as well, and its highly probable that it might have been used on some songs. I have a friend who is an audio engineer in the movie industry, who has been fascinated with that album for years. We collaborated over several years on decoding how it was recorded. I made pickups for the project and he studied what mikes were probably used, and the recording gear (all tube gear). First of all, if you have never heard the Mobile Fidelity 24KT gold CD made straight from the Master tapes, you have not heard the real deal. It was a MONO album. The STEREO album is overly highly processed and bears no resemblance to the real deal, and both Mayall and Eric hated the stereo version. It was revealed a year or two ago that his amp was so loud it was bleeding into bass and drum microphones, so they PUSHED UP AGAINST THE BACK WALL TO KNOCK DOWN THE SOUND. The speakers may have been up against that wall, nobody has ever pointed that out. Also, the plate reverb they used on several songs has a GAIN knob on its own amplifier, and a volume control. And, Eric used his tone control a LOT, not wide open all the time. You add in that it was recorded on TUBE run machines, on TAPE as well. Beano tone is highly misunderstood. His guitar was a LOT brighter than on that album, the engineers dialed back the EQ for the treble. Overall, its an artificial sound. If you go listen to Eric with Mayall's portable on stage tape recorder, you will hear how his guitar actually sounded. The album is "Primal Solos" and also has other players he used. But here is Eric raw and not altered by engineers: th-cam.com/video/fwd5z7WxzfE/w-d-xo.htmlsi=mwvOEPsCvg6hBJAE
@@SDPickups Wow, thanks Dave, your knowledge is a serious resource, obviously I'm a huge fan of this period as I have always considered it to be the true forebear of all rock tone and the main reason for the Les Paul comeback that continues pretty much to today albeit bastardized to a degree in modern times, it must have been amazing to get detailed accounts of the sessions, I would have questioned him about it till his gums bled ! A vox, eh ? I never played a JMI era one to know it's sound imprint now I'm going to be splitting hairs to hear any clues. I had heard Robert Johnson on gold CD and it blew my head apart, brought the sound quality decades into the future, I could hear his real voice and some real sense of his guitar tone. Beano album would be a fidelity ecstasy I'm sure. Hey did he mention any distance micing ? Those greenbacks got the best advertising a new speaker could get ! As always very informative and substantive talking to you Dave. An education in conversation, big thanks for the link I will find it both exciting and greatly informative, is Jack Bruce in this recording? I'm going to lose it hearing it if he is !! Have an great day Dave !
@@arfboucher3855 Eric's main amp for a long time was his Vox AC30, back with the Yardbirds. Mick was NOT at the sessions, he just told me what his friends who were there told him. The info about the amp being turned into the back wall came from one of the engineers in a youtube last year. His guitar was nothing SPECIAL. It was the same thing as all the others were, and in isolated videos it sounds a bit harsh some times. I don't know who played bass, just look it up, am sure its written down somewhere. The BluesBreakers gold CD can be found on Ebay for around $35, but they are getting hard to find and one guy wants $350 for his. Be sure to GET IT, its the real deal, and was not updated or "remastered," either. Enjoy.
1st sample original i think, 2nd replica,
Nope. First ones were the Black Beauty set ;-)
@@SDPickups you got me there Dave...excellent !!! That is to my ears a real 50s sound. Good work!!! Love your passion for old technology. Wish you good luck, Cheers!!!
Did I miss the big reveal of which pickups are which, at the end, or is it not there?
Whats your best guess? I'm going to do a quickie part two, because people are confused thinking that the brighter ones are the PAF's, which is TRUE the BB's are higher winds so of course they are darker. 7.6K versus 8.3K is a big difference. I have my 57's in my flying V and did quick comparisons with those, since they lower winds like the PAF's are so they are much closer in sound.
Can't read your own writing? A doctor, for certain.
Probably age related anymore, will be 75 this coming March, Grim Reaper has my ticket....
@@SDPickups has all of our tickets. Sooner or later..😉😉😉😉😉