ONLINE CLASSES: Intro to Celtic Mythology starts 4th January tinyurl.com/ICM25 Rashiecoats starts 15th January tinyurl.com/rashie25 Tales of the Old North starts 29th Jan. PAY-WHAT-YOU-CAN tinyurl.com/TON25 PLEASE support me on Ko-fi! (or take a class). With the political and economic uncertainty at the moment, my teaching income has dropped. Please support me on Ko-fi at: ko-fi.com/krishughes Thanks! You can always find out about upcoming classes at: tinyurl.com/GDclasses
I couldn’t sleep for thinking about this question. Thank you Kriss lol. I reread the 2nd branch of the Mabinogion three or four times. I felt to get to grips with the question I needed to look at both the source text and the structure of Celtic society for Efnysien’s motivation. Both Nysien and Efnysien are Bendigeidfran’s brothers on his mother’s side. This is declared right at the start of the 2nd branch of the Mabinogion. Given the matriarchal inheritance system of the pre Christ Celts this means both were/are in the running for inheritance of Kingship. It also suggests Branwen, daughter of Llŷr is a prize indeed as by marrying Matholwych her children could contend for both Ireland and Briton. Matriarchal inheritance systems are most common in societies where women are free to make their own sexual choices. Archeological and genetic sources suggest Celtic men are more likely to be closely related to their sisters children rather than their own. They are also most likely to commit incest as it means their children are in the running for inheritance via the female line. If Efnysien was a contender for Kingship then jealousy of Bendigeidfran and a desire to rule and/or have his sons inherit via Branwen would seem to be a strong contender for his motivation for this act and answer the first part of the question. But why the horses and those specific injuries? Horses are linked to sovereignty, with fecundity and kingship. If you just wanted to render a horse useless you would simply hamstring it so there is another motivation here, why the lips, ears, eyes and tails? By attacking lips, ears and eyes he renders them imperfect, ugly, and turns them into a semblance of a skull (?links with Mari Lwyd?). Cutting the tail bone (it says he cuts the tails ‘to the back’) is in a way cutting off their sexuality. Horses of both sexes signal sexual readiness and excitement with their tails and require the tail bone to do so. They fly their tails or move them to one side. By cutting to the back he symbolically renders them unable to reproduce. He slights both Matholwych and Bendigeidfran’s claims to kingship by damaging sovereignty symbols. If the horses are imperfect and cannot reproduce neither can they. The desire for power and matriarchal inheritance system also explains why he throws his nephew onto the fire. As his sisters son he is a contender for the kingship of both Ireland & Britain and challenge Efnysien’s own children with Branwen. I felt at this point I’d made a decent stab at answering the question then got embroiled in some more. Did the Celtic worship of the Devine Feminine and Matriarchal inheritance system explain the differences between Celtic early Christianity and the patriarchal Roman version imposed after Whitby? Was it a deliberate attempt to wipe this last vestige of Celtic society and culture away? Was this why Manannan supports women? Was he in fact supporting the Pagan tradition of the Feminine Divine and female inheritance patterns? Enough with the questions I needed to sleep.
@annitelford8437 WOW A+++ answer! So much I never knew! You had me with tears of laughter at points, but mostly in amazement of knowledge and comprehension of the woundings to the horses! Thank you 😎👍
Interesting question! I don't find that we always consider characters motivations in myth because they take on such a larger than life quality, but the consideration encourages you to really humanize them. I don't think it's as simple as Efnysien is just a bad guy. I think he reacted that way partially because he felt some kind of possessiveness of Branwen, and now he's lost his shot with her (that would be very human!). On a deeper level, perhaps he sees the Irish delegation as somehow a more existential threat, with the marriage representing a kind of invasion of one kingdom by another. I'm not sure what horses symbolized for the ancient Welsh people, but I think a lot about horses as a feature of battle. Mutilating the horses becomes an act of warfare in addition to a personal insult. The personal insult is an important aspect too because I feel like in ancient stories, people are always very easily offended by any breach of respect. It always keeps things exciting!
I first have to put my professional head on and say he suffers from intermittent explosive disorder with a background of narcisstic personality disorder, which would make his actions effectively out of his control without him seeing a good therapist!! Noone likes feeling they have been ignored in situations where they feel they have a right to be included(whether this is true or not). Many a family has had issues by forgetting to ask that one distant relative to the family wedding -although it would normally be getting cut out of a will rather than having property destroyed. Always remember to invite the person who could put a curse on your family! One thing I find interesting is that it is not Bendigedfran's property he destroys -when he was the one who " ought" to have included Efnysien, it is the Irish horses. THis could be because he knew this would bring far more shame on Bendigedfran -a ruler who cannot guarentee a guest's safety would be seen as weak, and hence potentially vulnerable to be overthrown -or at very least not worth doing business with. It could be it felt safer to attack the Irish horses, it could be a sense of not wanting to destroy what could be useful to him in the future. It could be that he was aiming to start a revolution -with the aim of him coming out on top -" look I am better at showing these foerigners who is boss - keep Wales for the Welsh, and Welsh property (including its women) in Welsh hands" Why the horses - maybe as simple as they were what were available and accessible. Men will fight back. Valuables are likely to be kept with the men -who might fight back. Horses however are stabled and hence a vulnerable accesible target. THey are also extremely valuable. I do like Gemma's idea of the horses as symbol of soveriegnty (don't all researchers borrow other people ideas!), but I would see it as a rejection of the right of the Irish king to be a ruler as to me Efnysien seems very xenophobic and it makes sense in my mind that he would want to show his feelings that Matholwch is not worthy to be a ruler and hence not worthy to have Branwens hand in marriage.
Efnysien's motive may stem from personal emotions such as jealousy and rage but I think that's it very interesting that it is the Irish horses he mutilates. Horses are often symbolic of kingship and sovereignty and by his acts Efnysien could be demonstrating a perversity of rightful kingship in comparison to Bran, who in seeking to address this wrong, displays the behaviour of a 'right and proper' king.
We don't have the full back story on Efnysien but this is a setup for a common theme of competition between brothers. This competition is frequently intensified between step and half brothers. Efnysien may harbor resentment that it is Bran who is king and may feel the crown is rightfully his. Add to that the fact that he wasn't included or invited to the wedding and associated feasts and we have a perfect situation for Efnysien to feel justified at acting out. Of course, it could just be that Efnysien is just a jackass.
I think Efnysien's actions towards the horses is an angry, impulsive reaction to learning he did not get a vote in forming an alliance with Ireland. I think he has mistrust towards the Irish and desires power in his home's politics. He attacks the horses because of their value both practically and perhaps symbolically. He is trying to make a huge impact that will tear the alliance in two. I think his acts are gruesomely depicted in detail because the storyteller is laying the foundation for a theme and wants us to remember our disgust at Efnysien's choice of actions. Even though Efnysien is the most reactionary, destructive individual in the second branch, I think hyper-focusing on him as the ultimate villain of the piece blinds us to the characteristics he shares with other characters - mistrust, reactionary behavior, holding onto past grievances, physical violence, etc. No spoilers, but there is more than one way to abuse and disfigure a workhorse.
Evnissyen’s motivations in the Second Branch of The Mabinogion may stem from feelings of exclusion, jealousy, family rivalry, and a rejection of the alliance formed by Branwen’s marriage to Mallolwch. His mutilation of the horses could reflect both personal grievances-being left out of the decision-and symbolic actions tied to his role as an agent of discord. His actions could also reflect a foreshadowing. By sabotaging the alliance through this violent act, Evnissyen sets in motion the tragic events that follow, highlighting the precarious balance of peace. His instinctive rejection of the marriage may represent a deeper, subconscious recognition of its doomed fate, making him a catalyst for the inevitable collapse of unity between Britain and Ireland. Through this, the tale underscores the destructive consequences of unresolved tensions within families and nations. Brightest blessings, James Russell (Eik Hjarta) /|\
All together I don't read Efnysien as an individual particularly by the issue of 'think long, think wrong.' Name aside, he seems to be inclined to create immediate change when he feels like a situation isn't right. I imagine he sees red and wants others to feel his same level of pain when he mutilates the horses and incinerates his nephew Gwern. He concludes his own life rather abruptly via self-sacrificing to end the war. He seems to be a man of extreme passion and impulse. But, what sparked the rage? Perhaps this is a power trip as the younger half-brother who feels he should at least be entitled to be sought for counsel. Perhaps he had some unfortunate obsessions with his half-sister. Perhaps he is a xenophobe. Maybe his anger is connected to the events of a previous lost story. Sadly we won't get much assurances from traditional resources and his headspace seems an uncomfortable place to spend too much time exploring.
He is definitely an unstable individual. I can’t help but wonder if he feels empowered to act out his sadism because he know’s his brother can’t kill him for honour’s sake. It can be quite an enabling situation for someone who acts out like that to have such an honourable family who just has to let them do their sick impulses. I wonder if the counsel was happy to be able to meet without him? Maybe they hoped he wouldn’t return until after the King left? What an absolute terror of an entity. So I guess my answer is rage, jealousy, and also because he knows he can get away with it. He gets away with quite a lot within this tale, and in the end he does one sort of honourable thing, but it really doesn’t make up for what he has done throughout the story. Yeah, I feel like I will stick with: he does it because he knows he won’t face consequences. He can throw a tantrum that endangers all of his people, and possibly he feels that satisfaction in knowing he has that power. (It may not be the power Bran has, but it is still a twisted version of power.)
For me it’s simply an open question: of course Efnysien might have any number of motivations for doing what he did. But I do think his actions probably speak to what was perhaps already the ill-matched nature of their marriage: at least from a “modern” perspective, the lack of concern for consent on the part of the bride-to-be foreshadows trouble from the very start. Then again, one could also wager a reading of the text which says that either to its author or to the culture out of which they were writing (or both), the consent of even male siblings is valued more than that of the bride’s. But at the very least the tale seems to encourage caution in matrimonial affairs, and to stress the importance of the agreeability of all parties in ensuring a successful marriage.
First I should say I am not competing for the free class. But I have thoughts. I am devoted to Bran who I see as a well intentioned good king but who makes a series of mistakes. The first one is to agree with his council to give Branwen to Matholwch. Had he consulted her perhaps she would have said ‘But brother I carry the sovereignty of the Island of the Mighty. The man I marry may believe he can exercise dominion over us’. Evnisien is an unstable sadist who perpetrates a hideous act. But he did perhaps have a righteous grievance - it should have been at Bran and the council. While in what may have been a time of transition it is possible peace inNW Europe was being made by marriages (the peace weaving consorts). But that was not the Welsh way traditionally. The consort of the Sovereignty Lady (she does not *have* to be a goddess) should be tested for moral character, suitability as a king/prince. This is not done for Matholwch. The woman who carries sovereignty should not leave the land but stay on it to bring bounty and protect the people. Her consort should stay with her not take her away. He should bring his skills to TO her land not take hers from it. Though I believe the horse goddess/sovereignty theme is more one of S Wales than N Wales, I believe it would have been known in both. The fact that Efnisien so cruelly and abominably mutilated horses (he did not attack human retainers) is a kind of blasphemy. I believe he was saying in his rage that sovereignty itself had been blasphemed against, mutikated, despoiled. In saying this I have not an iota of sympathy for him. My love for Bran is only saddened by his mistakes which continue with the giving of the cauldron. But this is another subject - not about Evnisien.
I don't normally comment on posts during the challenge, but since you're not a competitor, and since this is such an excellent answer, I would encourage everyone to read and think about it. ☀⭐🌟🌈
ONLINE CLASSES: Intro to Celtic Mythology starts 4th January tinyurl.com/ICM25
Rashiecoats starts 15th January tinyurl.com/rashie25
Tales of the Old North starts 29th Jan. PAY-WHAT-YOU-CAN tinyurl.com/TON25
PLEASE support me on Ko-fi! (or take a class). With the political and economic uncertainty at the moment, my teaching income has dropped. Please support me on Ko-fi at: ko-fi.com/krishughes Thanks!
You can always find out about upcoming classes at: tinyurl.com/GDclasses
Wondering if I should address the 'Sunday Sermon' or wait until I've watched the entire video and question first 🤔 😂 back to the video, me thinks 😎👍
I couldn’t sleep for thinking about this question. Thank you Kriss lol. I reread the 2nd branch of the Mabinogion three or four times. I felt to get to grips with the question I needed to look at both the source text and the structure of Celtic society for Efnysien’s motivation.
Both Nysien and Efnysien are Bendigeidfran’s brothers on his mother’s side. This is declared right at the start of the 2nd branch of the Mabinogion. Given the matriarchal inheritance system of the pre Christ Celts this means both were/are in the running for inheritance of Kingship. It also suggests Branwen, daughter of Llŷr is a prize indeed as by marrying Matholwych her children could contend for both Ireland and Briton.
Matriarchal inheritance systems are most common in societies where women are free to make their own sexual choices. Archeological and genetic sources suggest Celtic men are more likely to be closely related to their sisters children rather than their own. They are also most likely to commit incest as it means their children are in the running for inheritance via the female line.
If Efnysien was a contender for Kingship then jealousy of Bendigeidfran and a desire to rule and/or have his sons inherit via Branwen would seem to be a strong contender for his motivation for this act and answer the first part of the question.
But why the horses and those specific injuries? Horses are linked to sovereignty, with fecundity and kingship. If you just wanted to render a horse useless you would simply hamstring it so there is another motivation here, why the lips, ears, eyes and tails? By attacking lips, ears and eyes he renders them imperfect, ugly, and turns them into a semblance of a skull (?links with Mari Lwyd?). Cutting the tail bone (it says he cuts the tails ‘to the back’) is in a way cutting off their sexuality. Horses of both sexes signal sexual readiness and excitement with their tails and require the tail bone to do so. They fly their tails or move them to one side. By cutting to the back he symbolically renders them unable to reproduce. He slights both Matholwych and Bendigeidfran’s claims to kingship by damaging sovereignty symbols. If the horses are imperfect and cannot reproduce neither can they.
The desire for power and matriarchal inheritance system also explains why he throws his nephew onto the fire. As his sisters son he is a contender for the kingship of both Ireland & Britain and challenge Efnysien’s own children with Branwen.
I felt at this point I’d made a decent stab at answering the question then got embroiled in some more. Did the Celtic worship of the Devine Feminine and Matriarchal inheritance system explain the differences between Celtic early Christianity and the patriarchal Roman version imposed after Whitby? Was it a deliberate attempt to wipe this last vestige of Celtic society and culture away? Was this why Manannan supports women? Was he in fact supporting the Pagan tradition of the Feminine Divine and female inheritance patterns? Enough with the questions I needed to sleep.
@annitelford8437
WOW A+++ answer!
So much I never knew! You had me with tears of laughter at points, but mostly in amazement of knowledge and comprehension of the woundings to the horses!
Thank you
😎👍
Oh no -you have just given me another rabbit hole to fall down!
Interesting question! I don't find that we always consider characters motivations in myth because they take on such a larger than life quality, but the consideration encourages you to really humanize them. I don't think it's as simple as Efnysien is just a bad guy. I think he reacted that way partially because he felt some kind of possessiveness of Branwen, and now he's lost his shot with her (that would be very human!). On a deeper level, perhaps he sees the Irish delegation as somehow a more existential threat, with the marriage representing a kind of invasion of one kingdom by another. I'm not sure what horses symbolized for the ancient Welsh people, but I think a lot about horses as a feature of battle. Mutilating the horses becomes an act of warfare in addition to a personal insult. The personal insult is an important aspect too because I feel like in ancient stories, people are always very easily offended by any breach of respect. It always keeps things exciting!
I first have to put my professional head on and say he suffers from intermittent explosive disorder with a background of narcisstic personality disorder, which would make his actions effectively out of his control without him seeing a good therapist!! Noone likes feeling they have been ignored in situations where they feel they have a right to be included(whether this is true or not). Many a family has had issues by forgetting to ask that one distant relative to the family wedding -although it would normally be getting cut out of a will rather than having property destroyed. Always remember to invite the person who could put a curse on your family!
One thing I find interesting is that it is not Bendigedfran's property he destroys -when he was the one who " ought" to have included Efnysien, it is the Irish horses. THis could be because he knew this would bring far more shame on Bendigedfran -a ruler who cannot guarentee a guest's safety would be seen as weak, and hence potentially vulnerable to be overthrown -or at very least not worth doing business with. It could be it felt safer to attack the Irish horses, it could be a sense of not wanting to destroy what could be useful to him in the future. It could be that he was aiming to start a revolution -with the aim of him coming out on top -" look I am better at showing these foerigners who is boss - keep Wales for the Welsh, and Welsh property (including its women) in Welsh hands"
Why the horses - maybe as simple as they were what were available and accessible. Men will fight back. Valuables are likely to be kept with the men -who might fight back. Horses however are stabled and hence a vulnerable accesible target. THey are also extremely valuable. I do like Gemma's idea of the horses as symbol of soveriegnty (don't all researchers borrow other people ideas!), but I would see it as a rejection of the right of the Irish king to be a ruler as to me Efnysien seems very xenophobic and it makes sense in my mind that he would want to show his feelings that Matholwch is not worthy to be a ruler and hence not worthy to have Branwens hand in marriage.
@jenniferreid-k1p
Remind me never to sit on a couch in front of you 🤣 you'd have me sectioned within minutes 🤣🤣
@@our-story7721 - You forget -distance medicine is all the rage.... (I am actually an elderly care doc not a pscyh -so you can relax!!!)
Efnysien's motive may stem from personal emotions such as jealousy and rage but I think that's it very interesting that it is the Irish horses he mutilates. Horses are often symbolic of kingship and sovereignty and by his acts Efnysien could be demonstrating a perversity of rightful kingship in comparison to Bran, who in seeking to address this wrong, displays the behaviour of a 'right and proper' king.
We don't have the full back story on Efnysien but this is a setup for a common theme of competition between brothers. This competition is frequently intensified between step and half brothers. Efnysien may harbor resentment that it is Bran who is king and may feel the crown is rightfully his. Add to that the fact that he wasn't included or invited to the wedding and associated feasts and we have a perfect situation for Efnysien to feel justified at acting out. Of course, it could just be that Efnysien is just a jackass.
I think Efnysien's actions towards the horses is an angry, impulsive reaction to learning he did not get a vote in forming an alliance with Ireland. I think he has mistrust towards the Irish and desires power in his home's politics. He attacks the horses because of their value both practically and perhaps symbolically. He is trying to make a huge impact that will tear the alliance in two.
I think his acts are gruesomely depicted in detail because the storyteller is laying the foundation for a theme and wants us to remember our disgust at Efnysien's choice of actions. Even though Efnysien is the most reactionary, destructive individual in the second branch, I think hyper-focusing on him as the ultimate villain of the piece blinds us to the characteristics he shares with other characters - mistrust, reactionary behavior, holding onto past grievances, physical violence, etc. No spoilers, but there is more than one way to abuse and disfigure a workhorse.
Ooo, I jam with this line of thinking!
Evnissyen’s motivations in the Second Branch of The Mabinogion may stem from feelings of exclusion, jealousy, family rivalry, and a rejection of the alliance formed by Branwen’s marriage to Mallolwch. His mutilation of the horses could reflect both personal grievances-being left out of the decision-and symbolic actions tied to his role as an agent of discord.
His actions could also reflect a foreshadowing. By sabotaging the alliance through this violent act, Evnissyen sets in motion the tragic events that follow, highlighting the precarious balance of peace. His instinctive rejection of the marriage may represent a deeper, subconscious recognition of its doomed fate, making him a catalyst for the inevitable collapse of unity between Britain and Ireland. Through this, the tale underscores the destructive consequences of unresolved tensions within families and nations.
Brightest blessings,
James Russell (Eik Hjarta) /|\
All together I don't read Efnysien as an individual particularly by the issue of 'think long, think wrong.' Name aside, he seems to be inclined to create immediate change when he feels like a situation isn't right. I imagine he sees red and wants others to feel his same level of pain when he mutilates the horses and incinerates his nephew Gwern. He concludes his own life rather abruptly via self-sacrificing to end the war. He seems to be a man of extreme passion and impulse.
But, what sparked the rage?
Perhaps this is a power trip as the younger half-brother who feels he should at least be entitled to be sought for counsel. Perhaps he had some unfortunate obsessions with his half-sister. Perhaps he is a xenophobe. Maybe his anger is connected to the events of a previous lost story. Sadly we won't get much assurances from traditional resources and his headspace seems an uncomfortable place to spend too much time exploring.
He is definitely an unstable individual. I can’t help but wonder if he feels empowered to act out his sadism because he know’s his brother can’t kill him for honour’s sake. It can be quite an enabling situation for someone who acts out like that to have such an honourable family who just has to let them do their sick impulses. I wonder if the counsel was happy to be able to meet without him? Maybe they hoped he wouldn’t return until after the King left? What an absolute terror of an entity. So I guess my answer is rage, jealousy, and also because he knows he can get away with it. He gets away with quite a lot within this tale, and in the end he does one sort of honourable thing, but it really doesn’t make up for what he has done throughout the story. Yeah, I feel like I will stick with: he does it because he knows he won’t face consequences. He can throw a tantrum that endangers all of his people, and possibly he feels that satisfaction in knowing he has that power. (It may not be the power Bran has, but it is still a twisted version of power.)
For me it’s simply an open question: of course Efnysien might have any number of motivations for doing what he did. But I do think his actions probably speak to what was perhaps already the ill-matched nature of their marriage: at least from a “modern” perspective, the lack of concern for consent on the part of the bride-to-be foreshadows trouble from the very start. Then again, one could also wager a reading of the text which says that either to its author or to the culture out of which they were writing (or both), the consent of even male siblings is valued more than that of the bride’s. But at the very least the tale seems to encourage caution in matrimonial affairs, and to stress the importance of the agreeability of all parties in ensuring a successful marriage.
🌹
It's tragic. The fate of the Children of Llyr.
Not to be confused with the Children of Lir ...
First I should say I am not competing for the free class. But I have thoughts. I am devoted to Bran who I see as a well intentioned good king but who makes a series of mistakes. The first one is to agree with his council to give Branwen to Matholwch. Had he consulted her perhaps she would have said ‘But brother I carry the sovereignty of the Island of the Mighty. The man I marry may believe he can exercise dominion over us’. Evnisien is an unstable sadist who perpetrates a hideous act. But he did perhaps have a righteous grievance - it should have been at Bran and the council. While in what may have been a time of transition it is possible peace inNW Europe was being made by marriages (the peace weaving consorts). But that was not the Welsh way traditionally. The consort of the Sovereignty Lady (she does not *have* to be a goddess) should be tested for moral character, suitability as a king/prince. This is not done for Matholwch. The woman who carries sovereignty should not leave the land but stay on it to bring bounty and protect the people. Her consort should stay with her not take her away. He should bring his skills to TO her land not take hers from it. Though I believe the horse goddess/sovereignty theme is more one of S Wales than N Wales, I believe it would have been known in both. The fact that Efnisien so cruelly and abominably mutilated horses (he did not attack human retainers) is a kind of blasphemy. I believe he was saying in his rage that sovereignty itself had been blasphemed against, mutikated, despoiled. In saying this I have not an iota of sympathy for him. My love for Bran is only saddened by his mistakes which continue with the giving of the cauldron. But this is another subject - not about Evnisien.
I don't normally comment on posts during the challenge, but since you're not a competitor, and since this is such an excellent answer, I would encourage everyone to read and think about it. ☀⭐🌟🌈